Practice 4.13.2009 18 Ft Jumps Steddum and Colwick

[hawthornechemical]

double leg.....is ridiculous stuff

[punkxcore93]

chris needs the next pole after his second jump.

[astevens213]

is the lead leg drop occurring due him blocking out his bottom arm?

[zfx0726]

careful joebro, thought you were going powerplant on us for a sec haha. anyway, does Steddum's knee drop have to do with what he's doing with his right (bottom) arm right after takeoff?

[christian530]

Interesting convo guys!

Here's a few more thoughts. Its quite common for ex gymnasts to vault double legged as it is a movement similar to movements on rings or high bar . Mr Colwick doesn't drop his right knee! he never lifts it in the first place. Petrov has never coached anyone to double leg swing and hooker only started to double leg swing when he left mark and went to Parnov. Great vaulting though guys!!

[discgolfer550]

Joebro i see you everywere on here. I don't know if bubka 421 is who i think it is but if it is you shouldn't be arguing with him, rather you should be listening to him. These guys are coached by david butler who is one of the smartest coaches in the US right now. They don't need any tips im sure. Hope I didn't sound like a jerk, just saying..... 2 of the best vaulters in the world right now have a low lead knee and one might break the WR in the near future... Lukeyenko and Hooker.

[joebro391]

Colwick follows a different model, than steddum. For Colwick, how grew up with his model, this is the most effiecient way, FOR HIM, and being a former gymnast, it works for him, very well. But Steddum (i unfortunately must assume) follows the Petrov Model, and if he is trying to swing to inversion (much more efficient than tucking), than the dropping of the drive-knee is hurting that, severly. But, it all depends on what his INTENT is

[joebro391]

Also, since the Olmypics, Hooker has/has been trying to remove his left knee-drop. And even he said he's "cleaned up" his technique, with parnov's help, of course (=

[discgolfer550]

I see no evidence of that at all.

[gochu8989]

I was wondering if Chris is intentionally dropping his drive knee right after take off. And if so can you explain why its helpful? oh and GREAT VAULTS!!! Colwick's vaults are unorthodox but astonishing!!!

[Bubka421]

It is more a natural reaction to the way he takes off. Not viewed as positive or negative, other parts of the vault are far more important and crucial than artificially holding a knee up. Yes Colwick is amazing......

[joebro391]

ah, well to comment on this post AND your recent comment, on my own: you're right, driving the lead knee up, ARTIFICIALLY, does nothing, at all. However, if the vaulter is to 'throw' the knee, up, it adds the the jump of the ground and can allow for a better take-off and higher bend, on the pole. Think about the way a high jumper or long jumper, take off! They drive their knee, HARD, for extra lift, off of the ground

[Bubka421]

1. Sorry, but the argument doesn't hold. Explaining Colwick as simply a freak is a very weak argument. Colwick = No knee yet he still has high takeoff, swings to inversion better than anyone right now...Explain? 2. Steddum drives his knee at takeoff, it lowers afterward for different reason's you have not noticed or learned about yet... Lastly, what you see may not always be what happens, knee lift is a result of the force placed into the ground, more a reaction than action. Not thrown up.

[joebro391]

Colwick follows a different model, than steddum. For Colwick, he grew up with his model, this is the most effiecient way, FOR HIM, and being a former gymnast, it works for him, very well. But Steddum (i unfortunately must assume) follows the Petrov Model, and if he is trying to swing to inversion (much more efficient than tucking), than the dropping of the drive-knee is hurting that, severly. Are you gonna argue that he's double-pumping the pole, like Stevenson does??

[Bubka421]

1. They both train under the Petrov model. Just because you can't do it perfectly doesn't mean you don't attempt it. 2. They are both former gymnast. 3. Petrov does not view dropping the lead knee as an issue. 4. The real question you can not seem to answer is what is causing the knee to drop? This issue is what actually slows the swing, knee drop is a result/reaction. 5. Steddum grip=4.55, clear 5.50 = 1.15m push. How severe is that?

[joebro391]

ah, but you admit that it's a fault! And of course you attempt it! you attempt it, and try as hard as you can, do 'prefect' it, and make it as efficient as possible. So what do you think is causing the lead-knee drop?? (ordinarilly, i'd just say lack of hip-flexer-muscles) And a 1.15 meter push is pretty sick haha

[Bubka421]

Not a hip flexor problem, but at least you are thinking (Guys who can run fast enough to jump 18+ seldom have weak hip flexors, in fact they must be quite strong to run that fast). Keep thinking you might learn something new.... And no I did not admit the knee drop to be a fault, it is actually a correction because of some other fault which you have yet to guess.

[joebro391]

well what do you feel is causing the right knee to drop? you insist that there's a cause, but you say it's not a fault. that, to me, doesn't make any sense. If it's not from weak hip-flexers, the only think i can think of, is that he's taking off under, but that doesn't look like it's the case. My logic is, why does he drop it (if doing so, intentionally), if he's just gonna bring it up, later. Please answer all those questions, to the best of your ability

[Mallo81805]

He might drop his knee because that is what just feels comfortable for him. Since it does delay your swing he might do it because it ends up getting him deeper into the pit because there is more of a delay at the bottom when he is still moving forward. It all has to do with personal preference and what works for you, although I'm really not sure how Colwick's back is not fractured yet with how his takeoff is.

[joebro391]

Colwick's back is incredably strong, due to years of high-bar training. I really hope i see him vault, in person, one day

[tbenjaminkx42]

what do u mean double pump

[joebro391]

if steddum stopped dropping his drive-knee, he'd be able to swing, straight to inversion

[Bubka421]

Not true.....

[joebro391]

see, colwic is a freak (in a good way), and can do the whole double-leg swing thing (i'm guessing he was a gymnast that did a lot of work, on the highbar???) but for steddum, who i assume, goes with that swing-to-inversion, technique, dropping the lead knee (although some coaches would say it "double-loads" the pole), it just slows down the swing and makes it hard to invert. it's all about weighing the pros and cons, maybe it just works better for HIM {shrugs} we're all different, afterall

[Bubka421]

The ability to swing to inversion has almost nothing to do with knee drive.

[tbenjaminkx42]

this guy isnt gonna agree with you one bit lol

[PVderscheid]

Dont over analyze man... just vault! who cares what it looks like. If it gets you over huge bars then its working. Just because the Petrov model worked for bubka doesnt mean it will work for everyone. I see a lot waste their entire vaulting career trying copy what bubka did. Look at the top professionals these days... a lot of tuck shooters double leg swingers and vaulters who take off under.

[joebro391]

@PVderscheid that just sounded really ignorant. I'm a little guy. I'm slow, weak and short. I need every technical advantage I can get to be the best pole vaulter that I can be. My technique is the reason why I can get on poles, 45lbs over my weight. -6P

[PVderscheid]

I think you are overanalyzing things way to much. I mean i see you all over youtube commenting on pole vault videos saying how "if they just did this", "if they only did this", "they would be amazing". Which is great really it shows how much passion you have for your sport. but there comes a time man when you have to stop thinking and just fricken vault! Am I all knowing in the pole vault? no, but i can tell you that last year at this time, my freshman year of college........

[PVderscheid]

I was vaulting on a 14'6'' 180, (i am 6'3'' 185lbs). i was analyzing evey piece of my vault. Finally my coach told me " SHUT THE F*** UP AND VAULT". that is the single most important piece of advice anyone has ever given me. Now I am currently on a 5 meter 200lbs. I mean you can call me ignorant all you want but it works for me. Ever since i stoped trying to be like bubka I've been doing 200% better. just find what works for you, not what works for bubka.

[joebro391]

@PVderscheid I understand where you're coming from. And I admit, I know vaulters that I know vaulters that seriously just try to analyze every aspect of the vault and think they'll vault 6m one day. I'm not that guy. I watch and analyze all of these videos (in addition to the 18+ workouts/week I do to get stronger) because I enjoy it and I want people improve, in case they are unaware of their faults. I'll let you know when I reach my ceiling. -6P

[TexasForever33]

@joebro391 45lbs...bullshit

[joebro391]

@TexasForever33 how so? i'm 130lbs and I can easily get on a 14' 175 from 7 lefts (though i prefer a 15' 160). -6P

[TexasForever33]

@joebro391 Oh i thought you were talking about a 15' 175, that would be impressive.

[joebro391]

@TexasForever33 i mean, it wouldn't be that unrealistic. I got on a 15' 160 from 6 lefts, this past saturday. From 8 lefts, a 15' 175 seems...possible. -6P