1080 poison - Otira forest and birds

[1buzzi]

Why do trees matter so much to you people rather than the health of animals, fish, birds and people? You are quite happy to poison the whole of NZ just to save a few trees or to destroy something because it's not a "native".

[TrakaBat]

We are not poisoning the whole of NZ. We are protecting the health of forests to help sustain habitat for fish and birds. Zero people have been harmed by aerial 1080 operations in 50-years. It would be irresponsible not to control possums in places like Otira.

[ruby6300]

@TrakaBat new zealand has one of the highest rates of cancers and tumas in the world wonder why !!

some of us 93percent of west coasters dont want 1080 but that is no matter take no notice of the people why cant we have a poisn free planet

[TrakaBat]

Ruby the cancer rate in NZ is below the Netherlands, Italy, Hungary, Luxembourg, Slovakia, Ireland and the Czech Republic, it is only fractionally higher than the United States. It is really sad when people wrongly make claims like this. Did someone else mislead you or are you the person who originated this cruel and heartless hoax?

[dodlord]

@ruby6300

Cancers in all countries have increased. Don't blame it on 1080. There is more poisons in over-the-counter chemicals you buy than what is in 1080.

What do you think you're doing when you wash anything down your drain.

You have no idea what's in half the shit, and I don't think you ever will.

I suggest you even go and look what's sprayed onto your food, so you can get your nice delicious large fruit and vegetables.

Keep your unsubstantiated comments to yourself.

[TrakaBat]

@dodlord

Well said

[ruby6300]

@1buzzi well said 1buzzi traka a bat is paid by doc[public relations lol] so as long as he gets paid he dont care what he poisons well others care about the earth

[slooob23]

@1buzzi

There is a problem with radical environmentalists or "preservationists" and some of their attitudes, but you have to realise that most of us "people" are not radicals.

I could equally ask why many hunters, 4WDrivers, miners etc don't care enough about the natural bush and the natural heritage of THEIR country, and lets be honest, many of them don't.

Perhaps their needs to be some review on poisoning Deer etc , but we must still control the pests that are wrecking our native wildlife.

[waiotahi52]

Now let me get this right. DOC has, according to you, a type of 1080 bait or system that does not affect Kea. OK so far.

There is also a $1/4 million effort to find a deterrent for Kea so they won't eat the bait. If DOC already has a fail safe system why not give the money to Haiti or something usefull?

[TrakaBat]

@waiotahi52 the 250K figure is yours not mine, but, I don't have any issue with a parallel research project. It makes sense to approach a problem from two or more angles.

[waiotahi52]

Seems silly to constantly re invent the wheel so to speak, or if it aint broke don't fix it. However the real problem remains that DOC is spreading a poison that no one has any idea of its long term effects.Experts have, in my lifetime told me that,

DDT, Asbestos, Thalidomide, cigarettes,245t, Dioxin, depleted uranium ammunition, Agents Orange (1&2) purple pink and white, nuclear power waste, paraquat, fluoride, Prozac, alcohol and Sodium monofluoroacetate are all safe.

I hope you are right

[TrakaBat]

@waiotahi52 - 50-years and no environmental long-term effects. 1080 occurs naturally, it's biodegradable.

[waiotahi52]

So does arsenic and radiation but not in these concentrations. That really is a dumb argument

[TrakaBat]

@waiotahi52 - actually it is a very sound argument.

[waiotahi52]

W1080 is water soluble, like salt sugar or Asprin. it does not 'break down' in water. May I suggest you put a teaspoon full in a jar full of water, put the lid on it and open it in 2 yrs time. If you are brave enough to drink it I may change my mind. It is broken down when in contact with soil. Only then. So if it is constantly being washed into lakes and ponds it remains in the water.The long term effects are unknown. Big amounts of radiation kill you, small amounts give you cancer.

[TrakaBat]

@waiotahi52 in the real world 1080 dilutes and breaks down. It's biodegradable.

[waiotahi52]

Hawdon Valley,

Arthurs Pass National

Park

1080 cereal pellets applied

aerially 1 August 2009 to 31

October 2009 (DOC,

The trials of the repellent must have worked really well. And quickly.

None of the radio tracked birds died simply means what it says.

Still doesn't make sense.

$1/4 million to find a repellent when obviously, as you point out, there is one??

[TrakaBat]

No repellant involved in those DOC operations, just a different bait type to what had been used by the AHB at Fox. The repellet work is money well spent.

[waiotahi52]

Obviously only DOC NZ data is acceptable in this debate. Of 17 NZ Kea they radio tagged at the Franz and Fox glacier region, to find out if they survived an aerial 1080 drop, 7 were found dead. That works out at 41 per 100.Then The D.O.C tells us that there is minor impact by 1080 on anything that they are not targeting, fish, birds, insects, bats rats ferrets and the sacred NZ cat etc. I suggest they stop putting radio thingies on birds, or stop lying,they can't have it both ways.

[TrakaBat]

Your maths does not account for two additional surveys that have since been undertaken, both with zero kea deaths. On YouTube search for (Kea Research). Also your extrapolation isn't scientific. The Grafs did a similar extrapolation and were wrong. YouTube search for (Grafs Wrong).

[westcoastpighunt]

100% right no matter what TrakaBat says

[waiotahi52]

7% of 17 is about 41.116470588%. DoC supplied the figures not me.If it was not 'scientific' why waste the time and money? 'DOC fitted radio transmitters to 10 Kea in Arawhata Valley, two in the Hohonu Range. As i said before, by some miracle bordering on Divine intervention none were killed.None with transmitters anyway.The same system was used, not a modified bait to protect Kea.Given the overall figure its 24%. Plus 40% for possum damage nothing adds up to me?64% dead in 1 year. Yeah right

[TrakaBat]

Since that was done there have been zero% problems in two trials using the new kea bait specification.

[waiotahi52]

Has there been another 1080 drop in these areas since August 2009. The first of the bird repellent trials kicked off at Franklin Zoo in Tuakau in the first week of August 2009

.How do you arrive at your conclusion of zero problems?

[TrakaBat]

There have been two operations using specification baits for kea habitat. One in Mt Arthur, and the other in the Hawdon Valley. There were zero losses in radio tracked kea at those locations. That was achieved with a change to the type of bait used, however, research on repellents also continues as does the work looking at nesting success and failure.

[waiotahi52]

'as far as the Kea Conservation Trust is concerned, two trials (and I am assuming you are meaning the two 1080 drops in monitored Kea areas utilising RS5 baits versus the Wanganui 7's previously used) are not a large enough sample size to state with confidence that there is no impact on Kea (particularly as environmental factors impacting on exposure are highly variable)' These are the people DOC is working with to develop a deterrent, which is not available yet.

[TrakaBat]

As I said there have been zero% problems in two trials using the new kea bait specification.

[westcoastpighunt]

save the trees dude. NOT

[slooob23]

Yeah save the pigs not all that native plant crap!, save the pigs ban 1080 now!!

[slooob23]

For all the dim bulbs out there, I was being sarcastic.

[westcoastpighunt]

u not funny

[waiotahi52]

The surveys done elsewhere simply meant that no Kea with radio transmitters died.And you want me to believe that by some miracle, bordering on Divine intervention none were killed at the West Coas, in Arawhata Valleyor the Hohonu Ranges when a death rate of 41% happened at the Glaciers.

These are DOC figures not mine It might be the truth but I don.t believe it.

Even taken overall its 10%, or so(Thats 10 in every hundred) that is not none

[TrakaBat]

Another way to look at the data is that DOC identified a problem and looked at why. The problem was traced to a combination of particular bait type used in conjunction with pre-feeding. Kea experts then redefined the specification in kea habitat. Since that was done there have been zero% problems in two trials using the new kea specification.

[Happyhellybell]

Another point to think about with this clip is the environmental factors involved in these two areas. You look for example at the area covered in Rata. The soil will be good, there are large canopy and emergent trees. As far as resources it is a rich environment. Then the other area its mainly scrub, the soil on slips is bedrock, Scientifically a bad place for large trees! Its undeniable! Go and study it. I have and there is no comparison! Its like growing in soil versus rock! Rata wouldnt grow

[slooob23]

Your ignorance is astounding, the two areas mentioned are geologically almost identical, and if you understood the life cycle of Southern Rata you would know that landslides and rocky areas are prime Rata country.

The only reason that the Otira valley is still alive is because of possum control and the fact that Red necks don't like climbing hills for Rata firewood!!

[Happyhellybell]

Once again, you've outdone yourself! Another fine example of how DoC obviously know nothing! I am a trained horticulturist and from what you've shown here, DoC obviously know nothing about trees! Fuschia is deciduous and spends half the year looking dead! The sheer number of possums you'd need to kill off these trees would be astounding! Trees are designed to be eaten and survive! If the dead Rata comment were true, why would DoC Not trap possums and save the Ratas! You let them die! Epic Fail

[tutekelahore]

1080 is killing New Zealand wildlife, DOC tells lies !

[TrakaBat]

Typical unsubstantiated and meaningless anti-1080 PR slogan, tutekelahore, got anything factual to contribute?

[TrakaBat]

Let's see those old paintings and photos of Newton CK, imageandlikeness. The dead trees are in an area that wasn't possum controlled starting back in the 1960s next to an adjacent area that was. The difference is stunning. It's not the only comparison area we have. Incidentally, what agenda are you talking about?

[TrakaBat]

Just to be clear, the dead trees in the video are rata killed by possums. The location is around Newton CK, East of Hokitika. The scrub visible under the dead rata skeletons are unpalatable plants, including a heap of pepperwood. Nothing eats pepperwood, including deer. The main point is possums have dealt to all of the rata and kamahi trees which at that altitude should be the forest canopy.

[boday07]

Awesome! People just have to look at the big picture.....1080 is good!

[confliictdoublei]

i love how u describe the rata trees at 10 sec.top notch

[kiwisaver2008]

Wow. what a great way to SHOW why pest control is so very necessary in NZ. well done.