Cool...Thanks guys. I am building one at home and not using the inferior hub system you guys are using that limits the speed of the pitch response. I understand you have to use the cheap rotor vanes because of the weight issue and trying to change pitch with the underpowered system you have. My design is going to be open source to the public.
This is available as TRW-17 bass reproducer on Eminent Technology's website.. I can not actually comment on this system, but I own Bruce Thigpen's LFT-8B speakers and they are "off-the-chart" awesome in their reproduction of highest fidelity at a reasonable cost. The are relatively inexpensive, but they demand high-quality high-power amplification which raises the gross cost. The TRW-17, on the other hand, is esoteric and is priced accordingly. Bruce Thigpen!
so we cant hear it on our pc speaker? thats so random. why not upload a picture of lady gaga and tell us we cant see her (non existant) penis cos our resolution doesnt go high enough. lol :)
@woodrat2296 yes, more baby boomer 'idiots' to fool> Get em while they're still alive! another point is, even with 60 year old woofers it's enough to drive any neighbour insane with anger. So where can you play with these? Fort Knox? aside from that..fun factor is alive in your creation..good job.
There's no way in hell you're getting 120dB SPL at 1hz. 120dB at 20hz, sure, I'll buy it. Also, why assume most people listen to audio with "laptop speakers?" Not everyone is ignorant of sound engineering.
They should put these in movie theaters, concerts, and stadiums. Wonder if it can reproduce the subsonics accurately and stay durable cause that thing looks like it can really give itself a beating. The fan blades I mean.
@athews1976 valid concern. So far for me it has held together without a problem. And my kid and his friends have 'tested' out it's power handling capability plenty.
@betaomega04 the TRW is typically installed at a room to room boundary... i.e. it needs signifcant volume behind it to produce good bass in front of it. Like an attic space for example could be the back volume.
@tzotzo Thanks....would a system benefit by having more than one TRW? Whats the most that you would use in say a 40x30x12' room with a decent-sized attic?
@betaomega04 my room actually has two, side by side, because my back volume wasn't big enough to fully exploit one TRW. My room is 20x30x12' ... or so. Your room is pretty big. With a decent size attic, you can probably get away with one unit, but two would definitely scare the pants off everyone.
The human ear range according to studies can go down to 15 hertz. However the rotary sub woofer is nothing new. It's been around for a long time and there have been recorded results that it can actually make you heart skip beats and stop it momentarily dependent on the power it's being driven by. There's been a lot of research on it's effect on humans and animals.
@13johan37 turns out there are many movies... not all action movies but many... some mystery/drama use it for scary effects. Just watched Thor Blu Ray and it had tons of low infra bass.
Its called LFE, that a movie gimmick its not even that low as you might think. Purely a expansion effect one a seperate steered out LF channel.
I wonder really...i used to play for years with BARCO beamers, and setup's as B&w and ELAC.in combination with REL subs *volt and peerless woofers* the do not even extend to a insane low frequency. Because it is hardly needed, heck i even produced low out of a pair of MG1 Magnepans Planars no not sublow but low enough to make you go :O
it may be great to make a speaker made like this but for the electric bass frequences. If someone does that then it may have a previously unheard power and fidelty;-)
Neat concept, sounds like it'll take off, for rich people .. although if someone's gonna sped 26k on one of those, I gotta ask, why? You can't hear it, you'll still need a few powered subwoofers like Krell Masters. So, what's the listening pleasure from a Rotary Subwoofer?
@Adzerk a few Krell Masters still won't give you enough energy below 20Hz. You just can't move enough air back and forth with a cone for you ears and body to sense. Your ears can actually hear below 20Hz, with enough amplitude. It's not tonal in nature. But your body definitely sense changes in pressure at those frequencies. The TRWs add a cool and unique depth to movies and music that have sub 20Hz content unfiltered.
@TheElectronicaman I don't think BluRay necessarily encodes low freq any better than did previous DVD standard audio codecs. I have tried one or two comparisons, e.g. Master and Commander and didn't see a huge difference in low bass, but the mid and top range seemed punchier and more clear. But that could have been how they mixed , eq'd and encoded from the source material.
No system in the world can push a 16hz (church organ) wave into your to insignificant living room.
I used to drive a 2 pairs of tc sounds 500l matrix woofers, in combination with the *arnie nudell not the crpa the make now * infinity rs kappa 9. I can tell you a rel looks like a pussy compared to such setting. Driven by 2 mono blocks vincent sp911 100w class a blocks. So no need to call me noob then either..
That's very common misconception that this has anything to do with a small room size. The sound with frequency below the first room resonance just propagating differently: there are no wave effects, but there is a change of pressure we hear. This low frequency area just free of room resonances, so there is no nulls and poles. You can achieve pressure changes in the listening position at least theoretically
Its simple really, the lowest instrument on earth is 16hz (church organ) i AGREE you can apply pressure, like a a couple of rel stentors (10hz) would be able too. The problem is your room is never long enough to give you such pressure. The only way you can make that "fan" work is preparing a SEPERATE room that is used as a compression chamber with one output *much like the bassreflex * system. Then your have to overcome the little problem called music limitations on HZ recordwise.
Seen the fact you home in audio, i will give you a idea if what i used as a homeset,
Infinity kappa 9.1Rs (not the series 2 crap, the real nudells 0.8ohm in extended)
driven by a Mcintosh pre and amplifier , to witch on the highs mids i used Jadis tubes.
That all played through a heavly modified shangling tube cd player. I later on used a Tc sounds 15 inch in 500liter matrix build sub active, i found its incredible hard to get my low regions under control.
Seen the fact you home in audio, i will give you a idea if what i used as a home set,
Infinity kappa 9.1Rs (not the series 2 crap, the real Nudells 0.8ohm in extended)
driven by a Mcintosh pre and amplifier , to witch on the highs mids i used Jadis tubes.
That all played through a heavly modified shangling tube cd player. I later on used a Tc sounds 15 inch in 500liter matrix build sub active, i found its incredible hard to get my low regions under control.
The typical install: in a wall between a separate room or a closet.
One can pump air in or out of a room regardless of its size, it is even easier to do with a smaller room to achieve thae same pressure delta, and this is what this device is doing. BTW, closed ear headphones are tiny rooms arround ears capable of producing 20Hz sound.
There are also things like car and plane crashes (on Bluray at least), and Gregg Bailey's subcontrabass clarinet :)
The typical install: in a wall between a separate room or a closet.
One can pump air in or out of a room regardless of its size, it is even easier to do with a smaller room to achieve thae same pressure delta, and this is what this device is doing. BTW, closed ear headphones are tiny rooms arround ears capable of producing 20Hz sound.
There are also things like car and plane crashes (on Bluray at least), and Gregg Bailey's subcontrabass clarinet :)
I know that headsets can go to 20hz.. but no matter how far you want to discuss this . Humans , cannot HEAR below 20hz, and even most cannot HEAR 20hz to begin with. You do not FEEL with a headset barely hear 20. Most frequencies that we consider bass is 30 to 50hz. Most MUSIC is happening in the midrange area.
The bs story btw of the krells, you do not need much power to drive a cone, yes to reach 20hz or so you need a BIG cone that needs power, but no need for 5k on amps
@Secondlifecreator yes humans can most certainly hear below 20Hz and we did tests in my room where people could 'hear' down to 8Hz. It is not a tonal sensation in the brain, but more like pressure waves you feel in your throat and ear.
MY friend, as much as i admire your skills, HUMANS, cannot HEAR below 20hz ;) This is no rocket science it is a a FACT, were not build to do so period.
Quote " Inaudible sound waves can be detected (felt) by humans through physical body vibration in the range of 4 to 16 Hz* that is not hearing its FEELING. 12 Hz under ideal laboratory conditions, to 20,000 Hz and that is in case of kids. Adults hearing is way worse with the years that pass.
@tzotzo -unless you have insane hear which less than 1/100,000,000 people have. You cannot hear below 20Hz of sound, not because it too quite, because you ear drums don't pick it up. Now dogs on the other hand can hear 10Hz ish to about 30,000Hz (or 30KHz). :D
BHere you got the problem solved, the fan blows AIR , a cone needs more MASS to do the same thing. You cannot pumps a 20hz tone out of a (15" cone) and expect it to pressurize the room, your in.. the cannot pump it out there with the proper amplitude
Try a klipsh la scala, the need just a few WATT to drive a 15" inch folded broadband woofer. Its all about SPL. and 100 watt is ALLOT OF POWER, ppl do not understand that, you barely use so much power for real measure it when playing loud
I'm sick of internet show-offs that know nothing and simply say others are wrong without justification when they have been painted into a corner. It's like arguing religion. Nobody ever prevails because the nuts have permanently absorbed the "marketing" gospel and are not smart enough to wring it out on being educated. They clearly don't even seek the education. No longer interested in this rally so shall not return here. Enjoy your rattle machine. Bye.
Very smart. Not! Pink, white or polka dot, I doubt anybody could calibrate a cheap condenser microphone to work accurately in the infrasonic range where it was not designed to operate. Look at the correct types of sensors and microphones such as capillary pressure meters used to scientifically monitor infrasonics of volcanoes, earthquakes, thunder storms, elephants etc. and you might stop gloating over this ill conceived and dangerous windmill. A condenser microphone from the vendor! Ha!
@oggieoggiedoggie a mic made up by the vendor, using an inexpensive but relatively flat response condenser mic. Now you're going to ask next how we calibrated the signal chain. I'll give you a hint. It starts with a color.
I guess you want to sell the things, so quote a THD for a finite inaudible range which night impress some people. Who knows how you even measured that? My guess is that just the idling noise alone would approach an ordinary overall program sound level and then the blade distortions and rattle on heavy bass content would generate harmonics that swamp the midrange. Not for me thanks.
@oggieoggiedoggie you guess wrong, twice. First, I was the customer, not the vendor. Second, the idling noise alone does barely break into the ambient noise level of the room, and this is a quiet room with IAC 300lb sound doors and suspended walls. We measured the THD with a calibrated mic, calibrated sound card, and an sw audio spectrum analyzer. Want to keep guessing wrong... ?
How long is the travel path from "woofer" till the actually hotspot ?
I did experiment with Berhingers in the past to measure with pink noise and shit. IMHO , i did not like what it did with my setup back then (living room of 12mtr long)
Sound is pretty subjective...some swear on transistor amps, while i love the *distorted* warm sound of tube amps. E.g: Technically the tubes operate in much wider frequency field, but transistors are more clear due to there limited range
So doesn't the motor and wind turbulence noise destroy the S/N ratio? Looks like a dumb idea sto me. For 7-20 Hz I just use a bass shaker. Much cheaper and more effective without stuffing your S/N.
@oggieoggiedoggie both bearing noise and turbulence decrease SNR. However, there is a fiber batting plenum between the fans and the room that soaks up most of that. If I recall, we measured THD at around a max of 5% for 120dB like levels at various frequencies below 20Hz. Bass shakers were annoying to me and my family. Could be fun for a little while but we figured they would annoy the piss out of us eventually and we'd just turn them off.
The reason you lose your hearing from loud sounds is that the little hairs on your ear drums that move when sound waves enter your ear get damaged by quick, sharp, high frequency sounds. Low freq waves are so long that they don't move these hairs as quickly as high, fast freqs. So you don't get much damage from bass. Speaking of bass, I just filmed a new Mothers Finest video. It's on my page now.
@waynestrain no its the hairs inside your cochlea, not your ear drum, your ear drum doesn't hear at all it just transfers vibrations, the actual hearing organ is the cochlea.
@ixyzyxi couple of comments. First, good question... I don't know. I have asked this question to experts and the answers have been vague. Secondly, for sure it can make you queasy or seasick... but then you get used to it.
The wierd thing that has happened to me, is I have become sensitive to low freq noise... I hear or feel almost everything down there and it's become an interesting experience.
nope. if you can't hear it, it can't do damage. The sound we hear comes from the vibration of various parts of the ear (most notably the ear drum), if we can't hear the sound it means nothing is vibrating which means it also can't do any damage. however, if you're feeling sea sick from sounds that you can't hear that means its affecting your inner ear functions... I have no idea what the effects of low frequency sound waves are on inner ear functions, probably something to avoid
@commetsmasher I would disagree with you there. While there are frequencies our nervous system does not pick up, the ear drum itself may still experience them. If they are loud enough, they may fracture the ear drum, even though they aren't heard.
@tzotzo You'll kill your hearing from high freqs a long time before low freqs do their damage over long periods of exposure. I used to compete in SPL competitions, plan to again soon (12 12inch subs in a 83 Toyota Corolla Sedan, back seat area holds all 12). The pressure your making here is not much at all, myth busters attempted a car engine powered sub but their design was flawed imo (subs firing upwards produce less dB compared to a wall firing forward).Fibrglass in a sub enclosure is a nono
Have you tested the actual SPL? I know my car can do 147dB@42Hz, the 120dB in the description strikes me as awfully quiet, even if it can go low more easily than a linear sub
@cncgeneral yes we have achieved up to 130dB between 5-10 Hz. But that caused the walls to vibrate and groan uncomfortably... the difference between 42Hz and 10Hz reproduction is significant. And also understand the volume we are pressuring is far larger than your car... the room is 10x20x30 feet. You have a small car cabin.
@cncgeneral yes and no.... some movie post sound guys have not filtered out any sub 20Hz, even down to 1-3Hz.... other good action video has either filtered it out or not captured it in the first place in the sound effect. Don't know which really.
@MultiMinecraft123 it's both actually... you need a 'fan' to push enough air to make the low frequencies noticeable.... any woofer can do 10Hz, but to displace enough air is a WHOLE NOTHER matter.... that's what this baby does.
@64meatpuppets yup, you got it... also note the angle can go from 0 (blades are flat, no air is moving) to positive pitch and negative pitch... recall you need to move air back and forth to create 'sound'... just air one way doesn't recreate the sound we need.
@tzotzo How will this work with blu ray on war of the worlds 2005 in DTS HD Master Audio is the bass much smoother and clearer and more pronounced than the dvd soundtrack
That thing is too noisy! I dont want to hear my music with a turbine sound.. And it shakes like it needs bracing. Ultra low frequencies should not have ANY lnoises other than the frequency itself...EPIC FAIL. But it does work though..
Notice how much "free-air" space is required for this to work well. I think that's the only real drawback--that and you need two power sources : one for fan motor and one for blade/swashplate motor (voice coil?) This is something that's meant to be felt rather than heard. Ought to really "improve" your Home Entertainment System. .....Check out Eminent Technology.
@Chris17psi yes there is a significant amount of back volume required. There seems to be no way to reduce this and still have good output on the room side. I have basically a small office and bathroom used for this backvolume. The two power sources are not really an issue, but yes you do need 240 I think for the motor and for the voice coil (yes it's a voice coil from a regular heavy duty conventional sub) you just need the regular LFE/sub channel amp output.
Would like to see, hear and feel that groundbreaking sub-sonic woofer (sub-sub woofer?). Mr. Thigpin engineered Infinity's incredible air bearing turntable years ago so I am sure he knows a thing or two about moving air. I see in the liner notes that two of those devices were used during Telarc's Soundstream recording of C Carpenter's state-of-the-art virtual pipe organ. Now that's real bottom end. Revolutionary!
@vlinderbom2 0Hz on a conventional sub means the cone moves inwards or outwards and stays there. 0Hz on a rotary sub means the blades are held at a constant pitch, continuously pushing air into or pulling air out of the room at a rate proportional to the amplitude of the input signal. A conventional sub would need infinite excursion to do this.
If I'm not mistaken, the youtube encoding uses MP3 which filters out everything below 20hz. Then again, soundcards usually don't go that low either. I really doubt anyone has heard much in this video.
I checked it with Audacity an there are no strong frequenzys below 15Hz but when I tested an other video, called I love bass, or the like :-) I could find a strong vibration as low as 7Hz in the recorded audio track, which must be far below all capabilitys of conventional speakers, but it indicates,that Youtube can go that deep. Also i made speaker tests with sounds generated at my computer an my Soundcard does play sounds al low as 1Hz, i saw my speakers membrane move.
please make a video explaining how this works because all i see is a fan thats blowing air into a door thats been boarded off with ply wood and a hole in it
@tzotzo yeah I know, i was just giving you hard time. i know it takes an extreme amount of energy to reach a 190db level. it looks like a fan, so I looked at my fan and thought, why not ha ha ha
@JDTVEXTREMEVIDEOS that's funny... I actually googled for a Lasko fan sub thinking somebody had cloned this tech and maybe you were just measuring wrong. You got me.
@BassBoosterX lol... what did you expect playing it thru your PC speakers... take the line out from your sound card and put it into your audio system with a subwoofer and then write us back.
Considering it is rotary any changes in frequency would require the sub to play any frequencies in between right? So if you are playing a 8hz and then a 30hz tone is played it will play all frequencies from 8 to 30 as it spins up to the speed for 30hz. Also how is amplitude controlled?
@Riot454di you would need to set it up so only signal <20hz would get it it. after that it would work just like a normal sub. from what i am reading about these, you can make one from a normal sub because it uses a voice coil.
@Riot454di good question.... for sound effects in movies, the distortion falls way off in amplitude as you get above 20 Hz, so I don't detect any. We have measured THD and it's like in the 1-2% range if I am not mistaken, for high amplitude events.
it's not the RPM that we were worried about... it was the deflection of the pitch by the voice coil... which is fully intended. Just that we didn't know how robust the fan assy was. However, we've been abusing the final installed product for two years with no problems whatsoever...
you can hear it with a good set of headphones
gardnerbm 6 days ago
Cool...Thanks guys. I am building one at home and not using the inferior hub system you guys are using that limits the speed of the pitch response. I understand you have to use the cheap rotor vanes because of the weight issue and trying to change pitch with the underpowered system you have. My design is going to be open source to the public.
burlbark 1 week ago
@burlbark yeah we bought the rotor vanes at KMart at their annual rotor vane bluelight special. They are made of plastic and duct tape.
tzotzo 6 days ago
This is available as TRW-17 bass reproducer on Eminent Technology's website.. I can not actually comment on this system, but I own Bruce Thigpen's LFT-8B speakers and they are "off-the-chart" awesome in their reproduction of highest fidelity at a reasonable cost. The are relatively inexpensive, but they demand high-quality high-power amplification which raises the gross cost. The TRW-17, on the other hand, is esoteric and is priced accordingly. Bruce Thigpen!
AudioFileZ 1 week ago
so we cant hear it on our pc speaker? thats so random. why not upload a picture of lady gaga and tell us we cant see her (non existant) penis cos our resolution doesnt go high enough. lol :)
Kaz302755 1 week ago in playlist General weirdness
For media content with a 20htz filter (which almost EVERYTHING has) this thing would still rock the party in the 20-50 htz range.
stevenmcnair1897 2 weeks ago
Ooooh, I used to get the same effect when I put clipped a playing card onto the spokes of my bicycle. What a joke.
woodrat2296 2 weeks ago
@woodrat2296 yes, more baby boomer 'idiots' to fool> Get em while they're still alive! another point is, even with 60 year old woofers it's enough to drive any neighbour insane with anger. So where can you play with these? Fort Knox? aside from that..fun factor is alive in your creation..good job.
oatstao 2 weeks ago
Does..Does it function as an actual subwuffer, or is it a really cool 'scary machine'?
MrMeat42 2 weeks ago
I offer 100 dollars for this contraption. Any more is a waste of money.
tomgreene121 2 weeks ago
There's no way in hell you're getting 120dB SPL at 1hz. 120dB at 20hz, sure, I'll buy it. Also, why assume most people listen to audio with "laptop speakers?" Not everyone is ignorant of sound engineering.
Username93611 3 weeks ago
Looks like a fan inside of a box, just sayin
jackhammer8981 3 weeks ago
@jackhammer8981 and a helicopter looks like a fan on top of a box...
tzotzo 3 weeks ago
the engine makes all that whistle?
I thought ServoDrive are better
dallatorretdu 3 weeks ago
@dallatorretdu not even close in performance, but in what they are trying to achieve, fairly similar yes
tzotzo 3 weeks ago
so 25 thousand for this?
moviepreviews21 4 weeks ago
@moviepreviews21 discount if you buy two at a time
tzotzo 3 weeks ago 9
@tzotzo hah then how much for 2
moviepreviews21 3 weeks ago
@moviepreviews21 25 thousand pennies
JonTheChron 2 days ago
@JonTheChron no like 2.5 million pennies.
moviepreviews21 2 days ago
how does this speaker work?
FishBowl911 1 month ago
They should put these in movie theaters, concerts, and stadiums. Wonder if it can reproduce the subsonics accurately and stay durable cause that thing looks like it can really give itself a beating. The fan blades I mean.
athews1976 1 month ago
@athews1976 valid concern. So far for me it has held together without a problem. And my kid and his friends have 'tested' out it's power handling capability plenty.
tzotzo 3 weeks ago
@tzotzo Your kid is so lucky........... haha.
ccraig412 2 weeks ago
@tzotzo how would the rotary woofer work for video games specifically fps shooters and action games?
TheElectronicaman 2 weeks ago
@TheElectronicaman if you want real effects, sign up for the army. go feel the real effects of 'shooting' somebody. if it turns ya on so much kid.
oatstao 2 weeks ago
@oatstao NO Thanks.
TheElectronicaman 2 weeks ago
is that a telemecanique inverter ?
crisssspy 1 month ago
So where do I buy one?
brendanvista 1 month ago
one more one more xD
MrSomeone4321 1 month ago
so much more impressive than every car subwoofer video on youtube
sinborn41214 2 months ago
Just curious, how important is the placement of the TRW, being that the frequencies are so low? Does it need to be in the same room or in the attic?
betaomega04 2 months ago
@betaomega04 the TRW is typically installed at a room to room boundary... i.e. it needs signifcant volume behind it to produce good bass in front of it. Like an attic space for example could be the back volume.
tzotzo 2 months ago in playlist More videos from tzotzo
@tzotzo Thanks....would a system benefit by having more than one TRW? Whats the most that you would use in say a 40x30x12' room with a decent-sized attic?
betaomega04 2 months ago
@betaomega04 my room actually has two, side by side, because my back volume wasn't big enough to fully exploit one TRW. My room is 20x30x12' ... or so. Your room is pretty big. With a decent size attic, you can probably get away with one unit, but two would definitely scare the pants off everyone.
tzotzo 2 months ago
The human ear range according to studies can go down to 15 hertz. However the rotary sub woofer is nothing new. It's been around for a long time and there have been recorded results that it can actually make you heart skip beats and stop it momentarily dependent on the power it's being driven by. There's been a lot of research on it's effect on humans and animals.
goodole1usa 2 months ago
eminent-tech(dot)com/graphics/woofercomparison.jpg
6I803398874989 3 months ago
what's the point of anything below 20hz? anyone enlighten me?
LightRoll 3 months ago
what music/movies do you play that has frequencies @ 20hz and below?
13johan37 3 months ago 2
@13johan37 turns out there are many movies... not all action movies but many... some mystery/drama use it for scary effects. Just watched Thor Blu Ray and it had tons of low infra bass.
tzotzo 3 months ago 4
@tzotzo
Its called LFE, that a movie gimmick its not even that low as you might think. Purely a expansion effect one a seperate steered out LF channel.
I wonder really...i used to play for years with BARCO beamers, and setup's as B&w and ELAC.in combination with REL subs *volt and peerless woofers* the do not even extend to a insane low frequency. Because it is hardly needed, heck i even produced low out of a pair of MG1 Magnepans Planars no not sublow but low enough to make you go :O
Secondlifecreator 3 months ago
I pooped myself...
transformaconband 3 months ago
nintendo rumble pack?
markyschlitz 3 months ago
[not a troll comment] with my MDR-XB500 i can ''hear'' (feel) down to 4Hz ! That's amazing
raph882 3 months ago
so low i cant hear it
gadgetmanjay 3 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
since im an audiophile and you like subwoofer vids etc sub to my channel and watch my vids
EASTYJAZ34 3 months ago
it may be great to make a speaker made like this but for the electric bass frequences. If someone does that then it may have a previously unheard power and fidelty;-)
ranmadog 3 months ago
A subwoofer for Giraffes?
thetwinkleturnip 4 months ago
Excuse me sir, but I supposed you will be paying for my ears to be repaired?
MrJtrombley 4 months ago
What if there is more than one frequency playing, or white noise, or a different waveform?
neutron7 4 months ago
wut is it a fan
TwistTiltz 4 months ago
cool. i've never seen anything like that before? what does it look like from the other side?
Scoffman5150 4 months ago
Neat concept, sounds like it'll take off, for rich people .. although if someone's gonna sped 26k on one of those, I gotta ask, why? You can't hear it, you'll still need a few powered subwoofers like Krell Masters. So, what's the listening pleasure from a Rotary Subwoofer?
Adzerk 6 months ago 3
@Adzerk a few Krell Masters still won't give you enough energy below 20Hz. You just can't move enough air back and forth with a cone for you ears and body to sense. Your ears can actually hear below 20Hz, with enough amplitude. It's not tonal in nature. But your body definitely sense changes in pressure at those frequencies. The TRWs add a cool and unique depth to movies and music that have sub 20Hz content unfiltered.
tzotzo 6 months ago 11
@tzotzo how does the rotary woofer perform on blu-ray movies ,does the bass sound super clear with no distortion? Does it sound better?
TheElectronicaman 6 months ago
@TheElectronicaman I don't think BluRay necessarily encodes low freq any better than did previous DVD standard audio codecs. I have tried one or two comparisons, e.g. Master and Commander and didn't see a huge difference in low bass, but the mid and top range seemed punchier and more clear. But that could have been how they mixed , eq'd and encoded from the source material.
tzotzo 6 months ago
@tzotzo does the rotary woofer sound better with lossless blu-ray movie soundtracks?
TheElectronicaman 6 months ago
@tzotzo
Feeling is not hearing...
No system in the world can push a 16hz (church organ) wave into your to insignificant living room.
I used to drive a 2 pairs of tc sounds 500l matrix woofers, in combination with the *arnie nudell not the crpa the make now * infinity rs kappa 9. I can tell you a rel looks like a pussy compared to such setting. Driven by 2 mono blocks vincent sp911 100w class a blocks. So no need to call me noob then either..
This fan..its bullocks and useless.
Secondlifecreator 6 months ago
@Secondlifecreator
That's very common misconception that this has anything to do with a small room size. The sound with frequency below the first room resonance just propagating differently: there are no wave effects, but there is a change of pressure we hear. This low frequency area just free of room resonances, so there is no nulls and poles. You can achieve pressure changes in the listening position at least theoretically
vstolbovoy 6 months ago
@vstolbovoy can the rotary woofer be installed in texas?
TheElectronicaman 5 months ago
@TheElectronicaman I think the subwoofer would work regardless of geographical location.
NolanRossTheBoss 3 months ago
@vstolbovoy
Its simple really, the lowest instrument on earth is 16hz (church organ) i AGREE you can apply pressure, like a a couple of rel stentors (10hz) would be able too. The problem is your room is never long enough to give you such pressure. The only way you can make that "fan" work is preparing a SEPERATE room that is used as a compression chamber with one output *much like the bassreflex * system. Then your have to overcome the little problem called music limitations on HZ recordwise.
Secondlifecreator 4 months ago
@Secondlifecreator
Seen the fact you home in audio, i will give you a idea if what i used as a homeset,
Infinity kappa 9.1Rs (not the series 2 crap, the real nudells 0.8ohm in extended)
driven by a Mcintosh pre and amplifier , to witch on the highs mids i used Jadis tubes.
That all played through a heavly modified shangling tube cd player. I later on used a Tc sounds 15 inch in 500liter matrix build sub active, i found its incredible hard to get my low regions under control.
Secondlifecreator 4 months ago
@Secondlifecreator
Seen the fact you home in audio, i will give you a idea if what i used as a home set,
Infinity kappa 9.1Rs (not the series 2 crap, the real Nudells 0.8ohm in extended)
driven by a Mcintosh pre and amplifier , to witch on the highs mids i used Jadis tubes.
That all played through a heavly modified shangling tube cd player. I later on used a Tc sounds 15 inch in 500liter matrix build sub active, i found its incredible hard to get my low regions under control.
Secondlifecreator 4 months ago
@Secondlifecreator
The typical install: in a wall between a separate room or a closet.
One can pump air in or out of a room regardless of its size, it is even easier to do with a smaller room to achieve thae same pressure delta, and this is what this device is doing. BTW, closed ear headphones are tiny rooms arround ears capable of producing 20Hz sound.
There are also things like car and plane crashes (on Bluray at least), and Gregg Bailey's subcontrabass clarinet :)
vstolbovoy 3 months ago
@Secondlifecreator
The typical install: in a wall between a separate room or a closet.
One can pump air in or out of a room regardless of its size, it is even easier to do with a smaller room to achieve thae same pressure delta, and this is what this device is doing. BTW, closed ear headphones are tiny rooms arround ears capable of producing 20Hz sound.
There are also things like car and plane crashes (on Bluray at least), and Gregg Bailey's subcontrabass clarinet :)
vstolbovoy 3 months ago
@vstolbovoy
I know that headsets can go to 20hz.. but no matter how far you want to discuss this . Humans , cannot HEAR below 20hz, and even most cannot HEAR 20hz to begin with. You do not FEEL with a headset barely hear 20. Most frequencies that we consider bass is 30 to 50hz. Most MUSIC is happening in the midrange area.
The bs story btw of the krells, you do not need much power to drive a cone, yes to reach 20hz or so you need a BIG cone that needs power, but no need for 5k on amps
Secondlifecreator 3 months ago
@Secondlifecreator yes humans can most certainly hear below 20Hz and we did tests in my room where people could 'hear' down to 8Hz. It is not a tonal sensation in the brain, but more like pressure waves you feel in your throat and ear.
tzotzo 3 months ago
@tzotzo
MY friend, as much as i admire your skills, HUMANS, cannot HEAR below 20hz ;) This is no rocket science it is a a FACT, were not build to do so period.
Quote " Inaudible sound waves can be detected (felt) by humans through physical body vibration in the range of 4 to 16 Hz* that is not hearing its FEELING. 12 Hz under ideal laboratory conditions, to 20,000 Hz and that is in case of kids. Adults hearing is way worse with the years that pass.
You talk about feeling, thats not hearing
Secondlifecreator 3 months ago
@vstolbovoy
Then your using that room to build compression (that is what a bass reflex does, i would build in such a way a transmission line but thats me.
Secondlifecreator 3 months ago
@tzotzo how do i hear the sub 30hz (20-30hz) content the movies, and not just the 30-40hz booms?
TheElectronicaman 5 months ago
@tzotzo -unless you have insane hear which less than 1/100,000,000 people have. You cannot hear below 20Hz of sound, not because it too quite, because you ear drums don't pick it up. Now dogs on the other hand can hear 10Hz ish to about 30,000Hz (or 30KHz). :D
roflcopter3354 5 months ago
meant hearing and it's and your... lol sounded foreign
roflcopter3354 5 months ago
@tzotzo
BHere you got the problem solved, the fan blows AIR , a cone needs more MASS to do the same thing. You cannot pumps a 20hz tone out of a (15" cone) and expect it to pressurize the room, your in.. the cannot pump it out there with the proper amplitude
Try a klipsh la scala, the need just a few WATT to drive a 15" inch folded broadband woofer. Its all about SPL. and 100 watt is ALLOT OF POWER, ppl do not understand that, you barely use so much power for real measure it when playing loud
Secondlifecreator 3 months ago
I'm sick of internet show-offs that know nothing and simply say others are wrong without justification when they have been painted into a corner. It's like arguing religion. Nobody ever prevails because the nuts have permanently absorbed the "marketing" gospel and are not smart enough to wring it out on being educated. They clearly don't even seek the education. No longer interested in this rally so shall not return here. Enjoy your rattle machine. Bye.
oggieoggiedoggie 6 months ago
@oggieoggiedoggie
Well there is one difference, with religion...here simple facts and fiction conserning this vid.
IT is cool do not get me wrong (old) concept the fan woofers. But in a normal home its totally not useable.
Secondlifecreator 6 months ago
Very smart. Not! Pink, white or polka dot, I doubt anybody could calibrate a cheap condenser microphone to work accurately in the infrasonic range where it was not designed to operate. Look at the correct types of sensors and microphones such as capillary pressure meters used to scientifically monitor infrasonics of volcanoes, earthquakes, thunder storms, elephants etc. and you might stop gloating over this ill conceived and dangerous windmill. A condenser microphone from the vendor! Ha!
oggieoggiedoggie 6 months ago
@oggieoggiedoggie Check around a bit and you'll find out, again, that you've guessed wrong.
tzotzo 6 months ago
@tzotzo does the rotary woofer enhance video games like Resistance 1 and 2 and call of duty or battlefield ?
TheElectronicaman 5 months ago
@tzotzo can the rotary woofer be installed in texas.
TheElectronicaman 5 months ago
OK I won't guess, but ask: What kind of microphone did you use?
oggieoggiedoggie 6 months ago
@oggieoggiedoggie a mic made up by the vendor, using an inexpensive but relatively flat response condenser mic. Now you're going to ask next how we calibrated the signal chain. I'll give you a hint. It starts with a color.
tzotzo 6 months ago
I guess you want to sell the things, so quote a THD for a finite inaudible range which night impress some people. Who knows how you even measured that? My guess is that just the idling noise alone would approach an ordinary overall program sound level and then the blade distortions and rattle on heavy bass content would generate harmonics that swamp the midrange. Not for me thanks.
oggieoggiedoggie 6 months ago
@oggieoggiedoggie you guess wrong, twice. First, I was the customer, not the vendor. Second, the idling noise alone does barely break into the ambient noise level of the room, and this is a quiet room with IAC 300lb sound doors and suspended walls. We measured the THD with a calibrated mic, calibrated sound card, and an sw audio spectrum analyzer. Want to keep guessing wrong... ?
tzotzo 6 months ago
@tzotzo Tell me....
How long is the travel path from "woofer" till the actually hotspot ?
I did experiment with Berhingers in the past to measure with pink noise and shit. IMHO , i did not like what it did with my setup back then (living room of 12mtr long)
Sound is pretty subjective...some swear on transistor amps, while i love the *distorted* warm sound of tube amps. E.g: Technically the tubes operate in much wider frequency field, but transistors are more clear due to there limited range
Secondlifecreator 6 months ago
but can you feel the bass?
FuntossisBACK 6 months ago
So doesn't the motor and wind turbulence noise destroy the S/N ratio? Looks like a dumb idea sto me. For 7-20 Hz I just use a bass shaker. Much cheaper and more effective without stuffing your S/N.
oggieoggiedoggie 6 months ago
@oggieoggiedoggie both bearing noise and turbulence decrease SNR. However, there is a fiber batting plenum between the fans and the room that soaks up most of that. If I recall, we measured THD at around a max of 5% for 120dB like levels at various frequencies below 20Hz. Bass shakers were annoying to me and my family. Could be fun for a little while but we figured they would annoy the piss out of us eventually and we'd just turn them off.
tzotzo 6 months ago
im pretty sure you cant hear 0 hz... or 10
ultum4tegunz 6 months ago
humans ears can't listen below 20hz.
but good for bats and owls
nikelike2008 7 months ago
Were do u get 1
FastDJMobile 7 months ago
Udamasta - Idaho. I stand corrected. But other than that, I think that's the way things work.
waynestrain 7 months ago
i totaly dont want 1
richmcbell 7 months ago
The reason you lose your hearing from loud sounds is that the little hairs on your ear drums that move when sound waves enter your ear get damaged by quick, sharp, high frequency sounds. Low freq waves are so long that they don't move these hairs as quickly as high, fast freqs. So you don't get much damage from bass. Speaking of bass, I just filmed a new Mothers Finest video. It's on my page now.
waynestrain 7 months ago
@waynestrain no its the hairs inside your cochlea, not your ear drum, your ear drum doesn't hear at all it just transfers vibrations, the actual hearing organ is the cochlea.
Udamasta 7 months ago
I wonder if you get deaf from hearing 120 db at 10 hz.. Since you can't hear the tone..
ixyzyxi 7 months ago
@ixyzyxi couple of comments. First, good question... I don't know. I have asked this question to experts and the answers have been vague. Secondly, for sure it can make you queasy or seasick... but then you get used to it.
The wierd thing that has happened to me, is I have become sensitive to low freq noise... I hear or feel almost everything down there and it's become an interesting experience.
tzotzo 7 months ago 9
@tzotzo @ixyzyxi
nope. if you can't hear it, it can't do damage. The sound we hear comes from the vibration of various parts of the ear (most notably the ear drum), if we can't hear the sound it means nothing is vibrating which means it also can't do any damage. however, if you're feeling sea sick from sounds that you can't hear that means its affecting your inner ear functions... I have no idea what the effects of low frequency sound waves are on inner ear functions, probably something to avoid
commetsmasher 7 months ago
@commetsmasher I would disagree with you there. While there are frequencies our nervous system does not pick up, the ear drum itself may still experience them. If they are loud enough, they may fracture the ear drum, even though they aren't heard.
thirdrider 6 months ago
@tzotzo You'll kill your hearing from high freqs a long time before low freqs do their damage over long periods of exposure. I used to compete in SPL competitions, plan to again soon (12 12inch subs in a 83 Toyota Corolla Sedan, back seat area holds all 12). The pressure your making here is not much at all, myth busters attempted a car engine powered sub but their design was flawed imo (subs firing upwards produce less dB compared to a wall firing forward).Fibrglass in a sub enclosure is a nono
1NutWhoreBitOffMyNut 6 months ago
i bet only like 5% of the bass is actually audible
chrispwnslife 7 months ago
@chrispwnslife 120 dB! (loud!)
OrganNLou 7 months ago
we cant hear it til it hits like 20Hz right?
kolby4078 7 months ago
Fail?
BBAJameS 7 months ago
thats a fan. not a subwoofer.
xXspartan125Xx 8 months ago
@xXspartan125Xx u idiot
RichardWenborn 7 months ago
sounds and looks like a normal fan then someones sticks something in it
mrsupervidrater 8 months ago
My only problemwith this sub is the $21,950-$25,950 price tag T_T
wildsurfer48 8 months ago
Do the blades osicilate between positive and negative pitch to create the sound?
Kai2477 8 months ago
@Kai2477 yes exactly, and the fan rotates at constant speed. Pitch is the only variable.
tzotzo 8 months ago 3
Have you tested the actual SPL? I know my car can do 147dB@42Hz, the 120dB in the description strikes me as awfully quiet, even if it can go low more easily than a linear sub
cncgeneral 8 months ago
@cncgeneral yes we have achieved up to 130dB between 5-10 Hz. But that caused the walls to vibrate and groan uncomfortably... the difference between 42Hz and 10Hz reproduction is significant. And also understand the volume we are pressuring is far larger than your car... the room is 10x20x30 feet. You have a small car cabin.
tzotzo 8 months ago
@tzotzo Fair enough :) Well I'm going to a car show next weekend so I'll be able to experience some 130dB+ 10Hz notes :D
Is it actually that useful for movies and things? I would have thought the proper lows'd be edited out.
cncgeneral 8 months ago
@cncgeneral yes and no.... some movie post sound guys have not filtered out any sub 20Hz, even down to 1-3Hz.... other good action video has either filtered it out or not captured it in the first place in the sound effect. Don't know which really.
tzotzo 8 months ago
what the fuck is that a fan or a sub
MultiMinecraft123 8 months ago
@MultiMinecraft123 it's both actually... you need a 'fan' to push enough air to make the low frequencies noticeable.... any woofer can do 10Hz, but to displace enough air is a WHOLE NOTHER matter.... that's what this baby does.
tzotzo 8 months ago
I still don't understand how these work... so like a fan turns its blades at different angles to make bass?
64meatpuppets 8 months ago
@64meatpuppets yup, you got it... also note the angle can go from 0 (blades are flat, no air is moving) to positive pitch and negative pitch... recall you need to move air back and forth to create 'sound'... just air one way doesn't recreate the sound we need.
tzotzo 8 months ago
@tzotzo thanks you make much more sense than wikipedia
64meatpuppets 8 months ago
@tzotzo How will this work with blu ray on war of the worlds 2005 in DTS HD Master Audio is the bass much smoother and clearer and more pronounced than the dvd soundtrack
TheElectronicaman 8 months ago
@TheElectronicaman good question... I can try it. The DVD bass was reasonably good... would be interesting to compare it to DTS HD.
tzotzo 8 months ago
@tzotzo What the main frequency in war of the worlds when the street begins to rumble
TheElectronicaman 8 months ago
@tzotzo let me know when u find out please
hmuvee 7 months ago
How sad.
northstar1950 9 months ago
laundry service
COOUUSIIN 9 months ago
world's loudest...FAN!
thankyou, thankyou....
remyronko 9 months ago
Wow, look at the quality of the video... Quite impressive, I mean it is 5 years old...
TheNewFormula 9 months ago
idont get it haha wheres the sub??
rafael29921 9 months ago
@rafael29921 thats the sub XD
KJDJBeatsProductions 8 months ago
@KJDJBeatsProductions does it even have bass??
rafael29921 8 months ago
@rafael29921 i dont know i dont have on of them but its reallly cool i think XD
KJDJBeatsProductions 8 months ago
@KJDJBeatsProductions Ohh! hAhA it would be cool !!!...
rafael29921 8 months ago
one more ahhahaahah
thestr247 9 months ago
wtf why arent there more of these?
stepin2liquid1 9 months ago
lØl_ÄñY_gÙÿs_want_tò_chãt_wÍth_mè
LoveioClarisaa444 10 months ago
At 0:31 -no more
pranshavs 10 months ago
That thing is too noisy! I dont want to hear my music with a turbine sound.. And it shakes like it needs bracing. Ultra low frequencies should not have ANY lnoises other than the frequency itself...EPIC FAIL. But it does work though..
Bassotronics 10 months ago
mine can get to 1 Hz... if i move it with my hands :)
SWATPhantom 10 months ago
onw M0:00RE
SirDagger133 10 months ago
one M00:0RE !!!
SirDagger133 10 months ago
@SirDagger133 fail
RichardWenborn 7 months ago
@RichardWenborn I think the third time will be "one M0:00RE"
SirDagger133 7 months ago
What does "one more-one more mean?" Wish there had been some explanation.
corp55555 10 months ago
@corp55555 Its when you click on the 0:00 the video will repeat ONE MORE time... ;)
Bassotronics 10 months ago
Notice how much "free-air" space is required for this to work well. I think that's the only real drawback--that and you need two power sources : one for fan motor and one for blade/swashplate motor (voice coil?) This is something that's meant to be felt rather than heard. Ought to really "improve" your Home Entertainment System. .....Check out Eminent Technology.
Chris17psi 10 months ago
@Chris17psi yes there is a significant amount of back volume required. There seems to be no way to reduce this and still have good output on the room side. I have basically a small office and bathroom used for this backvolume. The two power sources are not really an issue, but yes you do need 240 I think for the motor and for the voice coil (yes it's a voice coil from a regular heavy duty conventional sub) you just need the regular LFE/sub channel amp output.
tzotzo 10 months ago
Would like to see, hear and feel that groundbreaking sub-sonic woofer (sub-sub woofer?). Mr. Thigpin engineered Infinity's incredible air bearing turntable years ago so I am sure he knows a thing or two about moving air. I see in the liner notes that two of those devices were used during Telarc's Soundstream recording of C Carpenter's state-of-the-art virtual pipe organ. Now that's real bottom end. Revolutionary!
Darno369 10 months ago
Any sub woofer (including the blown ones) can do 0 hz
kolton5543 10 months ago
my subwoofer does 0Hz even when its turend off :p
vlinderbom2 10 months ago 157
@vlinderbom2 not like this sub does... this does 0 Hz WITH a DC component lol.
tzotzo 9 months ago 31
@vlinderbom2 0Hz on a conventional sub means the cone moves inwards or outwards and stays there. 0Hz on a rotary sub means the blades are held at a constant pitch, continuously pushing air into or pulling air out of the room at a rate proportional to the amplitude of the input signal. A conventional sub would need infinite excursion to do this.
DussoJanladde 9 months ago
@vlinderbom2 Yes but not at 120dB!
OrganNLou 7 months ago
If I'm not mistaken, the youtube encoding uses MP3 which filters out everything below 20hz. Then again, soundcards usually don't go that low either. I really doubt anyone has heard much in this video.
jordanwaeles 10 months ago
@jordanwaeles
I checked it with Audacity an there are no strong frequenzys below 15Hz but when I tested an other video, called I love bass, or the like :-) I could find a strong vibration as low as 7Hz in the recorded audio track, which must be far below all capabilitys of conventional speakers, but it indicates,that Youtube can go that deep. Also i made speaker tests with sounds generated at my computer an my Soundcard does play sounds al low as 1Hz, i saw my speakers membrane move.
CaptainNorris 10 months ago
/watch?v=-3ChXSUgmrs
cjack118 10 months ago
I can hear this bass with headphones Sony mdr-xb500. (3-28000 hz)
DaveK183 11 months ago
@DaveK183 same
THEFATHEADEDFREAK 10 months ago
My speakers: 25 to 18000 Hz.
jjovereats 11 months ago
@jjovereats And my speakers 20 to 20000 Hz :-)
DaveK183 11 months ago
@jjovereats congratulations
SuperHotLarry 10 months ago
please make a video explaining how this works because all i see is a fan thats blowing air into a door thats been boarded off with ply wood and a hole in it
masongalbraith 11 months ago
Lasko subwoofer, comes in the form of a box fan. mine hits 190db on high
JDTVEXTREMEVIDEOS 11 months ago
@JDTVEXTREMEVIDEOS at what frequency? with how many watts input? and how did you measure it... do you have any idea how much energy is 190dB?
tzotzo 11 months ago
@tzotzo yeah I know, i was just giving you hard time. i know it takes an extreme amount of energy to reach a 190db level. it looks like a fan, so I looked at my fan and thought, why not ha ha ha
JDTVEXTREMEVIDEOS 11 months ago
@JDTVEXTREMEVIDEOS that's funny... I actually googled for a Lasko fan sub thinking somebody had cloned this tech and maybe you were just measuring wrong. You got me.
tzotzo 11 months ago 5
@tzotzo ha ha ha thats hilarious
JDTVEXTREMEVIDEOS 11 months ago
@tzotzo the acoustic energy of 190dB is not much but you need a lot of electric energy because speakers have a poor efficiency
BoxenRobl 11 months ago
wtf is this? I looked for a subwoofer explosion, and i found this junk? Somekinda air conditioner?!
BassBoosterX 11 months ago
@BassBoosterX lol... what did you expect playing it thru your PC speakers... take the line out from your sound card and put it into your audio system with a subwoofer and then write us back.
tzotzo 11 months ago
You got your safety glasses on?
cpearless 11 months ago
Considering it is rotary any changes in frequency would require the sub to play any frequencies in between right? So if you are playing a 8hz and then a 30hz tone is played it will play all frequencies from 8 to 30 as it spins up to the speed for 30hz. Also how is amplitude controlled?
Riot454di 1 year ago
Ok but can it keep up with fast paced music or is it more for movie explosions?Also how noticeable is the distortion?
Riot454di 1 year ago
@Riot454di you would need to set it up so only signal <20hz would get it it. after that it would work just like a normal sub. from what i am reading about these, you can make one from a normal sub because it uses a voice coil.
shimrra 1 year ago
@Riot454di good question.... for sound effects in movies, the distortion falls way off in amplitude as you get above 20 Hz, so I don't detect any. We have measured THD and it's like in the 1-2% range if I am not mistaken, for high amplitude events.
tzotzo 11 months ago
it's not the RPM that we were worried about... it was the deflection of the pitch by the voice coil... which is fully intended. Just that we didn't know how robust the fan assy was. However, we've been abusing the final installed product for two years with no problems whatsoever...
tzotzo 1 year ago
it did look like any more rpm and it would come apart and kill somebody
kawasakikillerr 1 year ago