It was a great day today...The child molester Warren Jeffs is found guilty of two counts of sexual assault on a child...How's that for one of your prophet's...
@bazzerpeck25 Not only the date but the accusers are the perps. It wasn't Arkies, it wasn't Indians and it wasn't Muslims in 2001. The accuser is a liar. That sounds like something I read in the Bible, Satan is the accuser. A lying false accuser. Thus Mormonism, Joe and Brigham Young are Satan's handiwork.
The gov was on a roll...Not only did he authorize the murder and coverup of the children, women and men of the Baker-Fancher wagon train in 1857, the very next year, the he authorized the taking up of arms agains the US gov...Not only was he a false prophet but his book he followed was and still is false...Alma 7:10 states Jesus was born in Jerusalem...Luke 2:4-7 states Jesus was born in Bethlehem...Not a hard one to figure out there...
@1kinnyg... I agree 1kinnyg. The gov took up arms against the US Army because he was guilty of killing all those Arkansas children, their mama's, their daddy's, their brothers, and their sisters. He tried to hide it all but the truth always comes out. He didn't want to be exposed as the false prophet he really was. Numbers 32:23 says "and be sure your sin will find you out".
This movie is very 1-sided and gives nowhere near all of the information and is 100% twisted. 1st, Brigham did not instigate it. He sent a message to the saints to not attack. The message didn't arrive until 2 days after the massacre. The reason the saints attacked is because people on the train were involved in BRUTAL murders of other saints in Missouri including the murder of the prophet Joseph Smith.
Not only did the governor authorize the murder of 37 children, he was a flat out bigot... He is credited with having been responsible for revoking the priesthood and temple blessings from black members...In 1863, Young said, "Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be so"...
Not only was the Governor a lier, but so was the book he taught from, the same book that misleads millions today...They have Jesus being born in Jerusalem (Alma 7:9-10)...However, the WORD clearly says Jesus was born in Bethlehem (Luke 2:1-7)...Why is this important? Bethlehem is the City of David...I'm always weary about those that conceal the truth...You have been warned about adding and detracting from the Bible...
Read Brigham Youngs violent and racist teachings in the journal of discources. Just a little sample:
"Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be so." (Journal of Discourses, vol. 10, p. 110).
Mormons sure do have a lot of secrets:: Secret Marriage ceremonies, secret polygamy, secret oaths, secret mass murders and kidnappings of 17 children, But if you can control of the information flow and keep blaming the innocent, all contribute to keeping secrets successfully. Congratulations to Mormonism for concealing the truth
@TheLycantis Yes, I'll look up that mountain medders thing. I didn't know the church excommunicated the governor, that's one I wasn't aware of. 9 were excommunicated? What were their names? I thought Dame was the leading authority, not the guy executed. And how many were put away for life??
@TheLycantis Haight was excommunicated. Dame and Higbee weren't. It's possible Lee wasn't either but it was just "said" he was. Regardless, those four were the ranking perps.It was they that stood in the 3-4 prayer circles, each facing a cardinal point while the other 50 formed a circle around the 4. Each Left arm over the next shoulder and the right arm 90 degrees up at the elbow. This made it easier for Mormon god to influence the next decision all of which led to the mass ritual murder of MMM
@TheLycantis Oh my, getting a little snitty, there, aren't we? Actions of one group=55 Mormons under the endowment ceremony oaths, their "Prayer circles to Mormon god", plus G.A. Smith, numerous folks up north, as Huntington's diary tells us. Then all those wives and children who Had to keep they're mouths shut or "Have their tails cut off below the ears" to use B. Young's phrase. Gemmel says he was in the office when Hamblin and GASmith arrived and BYoung said "I'd would kill them...".
@TheLycantis Well, interesting but you didn't answer one of my questions. And I wasn't aware the Indians ""were all trying to make amends...." I never read that the wagon train hated Indians but I did read of the accusations, like poisoning Indians and cattle, made by the Mormons.
@TheLycantis Oh,you saying the Indians panicked or the Mormons became frightened and panicked? Next, the lie you refer to, is that the lie that "the Indians forced the Mormons to participate in the Murders, and thus the Indians were the Perps" ? Or The silly rumor that the Mormons were the instigators w/ Higbee, Haight, Dame, Lee, being the high ranking players and guys like Klingensmith, McFarland, Stewart were mass murdering maniacs that day. And please look at my other questions from above
@TheLycantis "The Indians only attacked because they were under the impression they would be killed along with the mormons that participated," Hello?. Are you saying the Mormons and Indians attacked a SECOND time after they realized the innocent probably knew it was Mormons attacking them? But the immigrants were convinced by Mormons that it was the Indians. How did the Mormons do that? I have a hunch the Mormons, JD Lee, etc, convincingly said Indians did it.and the innocents believed JDL,etc
@TheLycantis "everyone was convinced indians were bad guys. " Is true. That's what made it so convenient for the Mormons to blame a Mormon ritualistic murder on Indians. And why the Mormons could convince the Innocents it was Indians. (It was 55 painted Mormons and some Indians under direction of Lee) And it helps explain how Mormons could convince the Public it was Indians. But the Mormons Lied. It was 55 Mormons under the oaths of the Mormon Endowment Ceremony. Now we approach the ugly truth
@TheLycantis Yes, Ritualistic because the 55 Mormons under the Endowment oaths gathered in prayer circles as described earlier. Prayed to Mormon god and got it. I'm not here for the Jesuits and Jews and Muslims, This is here about Mormonism's claims and the truth of the matter. Soon I'll be posting Mormon History of the Church versions, Whitney, J.F. Smith, etc. I have all the church Histories. And More. You should check out your adversaries more closely. Tah Tah, and Ciao.
@IExposeMormonism Who said you were an adversary? You're an ignorant bigot and I pity you. If you are wrong in the end, will you be ready to hear the truth?
@TheLycantis I'm not ignorant nor a bigot. I research things very carefully over a long time. 4 years on the MMM and I'm not stopping. I have your histories, multiple BofM, D&C, The Abe Pap, BofC, Adam-God, Nauvoo Endowment Companies, a Documentary History, Sacred Loneliness and many others. At some 350 original publications (most posted) I will take your truth and feed it back to you with it's true flavor. Reading the MMM will do that to you.I was left aghast and the more I read the less I like
@TheLycantis And issues of murdering children and kidnapping them, blaming the Indians for that, billing the USA Gov't for their upkeep and padding that bill. Nor the gross insults hurled against them by Brigham Young and John D Lee and such. How would you like to be kidnapped by your parents murderers and raised by them? and then insulted. But such is the fruit that falls from the tree of Mormonism. This took many more than the 55 murderers. Storing and auctioning the loot in the tithing house
huh?! d0nt judge yet the Mormon Church if u d0nt kn0w what behinds all of this faith... and besides arguing regarding religion is n0t a go0d idea... :D
"It is better that a man should perish than that a nation should dwindle and perish in unbelief." 1 Nephi 4:13 Book of Mormon . It's ok to kill in the name of God.
People of any Christian faith need to realize that Jesus didn't save people by violence, rudeness, damnation, or a foul mouth. He showed love to all people! Why is that so hard for us? People in all religions have killed in the name of God in history; no one is without sin. Let's remember that the very last scripture in the Bible says anyone who adds or detracts from the scriptures will come under God's judgement. The book of Mormon adds to the scriptures. The only book we need is the Bible.
none off you have a fucking clue about this event. hollywood take a little crumb and turn it into a fuckin feeding frenzy. what do the mormons do thats wrong. they were funny clothes shit look at the catholic church and the pope he looks like a four skin wearing a kkk outfit. what they dont drink or smoke shit look at the mooslams& hindis they don't eat meat . king richard the lion heart rape half the fuckin world and he belonged to a religion . fuck up and stop trashing the mormons.
none off you have a fucking clue about this event. hollywood take a little crumb and turn it into a fuckin feeding frenzy. what do the mormons do thats wrong. they were funny clothes shit look at the catholic church and the pope he looks like a four skin wearing a kkk outfit. what they dont drink or smoke shit look at the mooslams& hindis they don't eat meat . king richard the lion heart rape half the fuckin world and he belonged to a religion . fuck up and stop trashing the mormons.
I did some research and tried to figure out who could kill 37 children in cold blood...I discovered these people and those that follow Gov Young to this day, follow a book that says Jesus was born in Jerusalem (Alma 7:9-10) when my bible clearly says Jesus was born in Bethlehem (Luke 2:1-7)...My bible also warns in Galatians 1:8 that their angel was cursed...So it doesn't take long to see through all their lies...Bottom line is you got 37 children who were butchered and cry out "remember me"...
@pontehyper29 check out this book then by Ann Eliza Young (1876). Wife No. 19, or the story of a life in bondage. Being a complete exposé of Mormonism, and revealing the sorrows, sacrifices and sufferings of women in polygamy. Hartford, Connecticut: Dustin, Oilman & Co..
@arkansasresident Have you ever actually been to a Mormon church or read the Book of Mormon? As a Christian, I sincerely hope that you don't run off on tangents and believe everything every rumor on the internet or in a book tells you. It gives Christians a bad name and makes us look fault-finding and ignorant. Some of the best people I know, here in Nashville, TN, are Mormons. They have been the most compasionate, giving, and charitable people I have ever met.
@pontehyper29 I'm sure they are compasionate, giving, and charitable people...You suggested someone read it to me and i suggested two books you should read and a tv show you should watch...As far as attending their church, I could never attend a church that follows a book that says Jesus was born in Jerusalem (Alma 7:9-10) when my bible clearly says Jesus was born in Bethlehem (Luke 2:1-7)...
@pontehyper29 I'm sure they are compasionate, giving, charitable people....You suggested someone read it to me and I suggested two books you should check out and a new tv show....As far attending their church, I could never attend a church at follow a book that says Jesus was born in Jerusalem (Alma 7:9-10) when my bible clearly says Jesus was born in Bethlehem (Luke 2:1-7)...
@pontehyper29 Oh, i almost forgot, check out the autobiography by Elissa Wall "Stolen Innocence": My Story of Growing Up in a Polygamous Sect, Becoming a Teenage Bride, and Breaking Free of Warren Jeffs
Fact is, whatever flaws are in the movie only go to benefit Mormonism:: It doesn't show how JD Lee entered with a white flag And making Freemason Signs of Security. Nor how Mormons blamed it on Indians. Nor how Mormons Kidnapped Children. Nor how the cause was Joe Smith and Parley Pratt, in a Fevered Mormon's Brain. Nor how Mormons falsely accused the innocent of crimes. So, the movie is a whitewash! But it does show us the violence in Mormonism and it only gets worse the more you know
"inspired" be actual events. Not accurate to actual events. Fascinating how things can be distorted. This depicts Mormons to be evil people, i find that to be extremely inaccurate and judgmental. Makes one wonder if it being rated R prevents mormons from setting the record straight considering they choose not to watch R rated films due to it's inappropriate content. Sure sounds like the values of monsters to me... ridiculous.
The production quality is high, except for the corny flashback sequences. Major flaws are the obligatory character instantly shedding his faith to declare the Mormon leaders tyrants, and forced Romeo & Juliette plot.
To see them calling on their followers to be "like Mohamed" and hearing John Voight quoting scripture, promising to name his planet after his wife- is well worth it.
"The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man. All who do so are abomination unto the Lord thy God."
Its not about the money. Its about letting people know what happened. I even post it on my wall on facebook so that everyone knows. Church people are always trying to blame it on the Native American Indians. They are even trying to take their culture away, but they haven't. And they will not.
"What a strange, confused, unpleasant movie this is." -Roger Ebert
"A venomous religious tract printed on celluloid." - Colin Cover, Minneapolis Star
"Disturbingly awful." Jack Matthews, New York Daily News
"Why does this film even exist? " -Kyle Smith, New York Post
To all you "ex-Mormons" that juggalocode wants to see this movie, go ahead and watch this anti-Mormon fodder so you can keep feeding your self-pitying delusions that the church is wrong.
the only reason it wasn't shown international because it was a movie about the American Past, was meant as another way for Americans to view the Mountain Meadows Massacre.
That movie is a flop and never been released on cinema in the UK (where I live). Must be a lousy plot and poor acting. I prefer to real facts and books. Yes it did happen, but nothing like the movie.
On September 11, 2007 Henry B. Eyring read an official statement saying: "A separate expression of regret is owed the Paiute people who have unjustly borne for too long the principal blame for what occurred during the massacre. Although the extent of their involvement is disputed, it is believed they would not have participated without the direction and stimulus provided by local church leaders and members."
that's admitting a little responsibility. at least in english...
This movie gave me an enirely different perspective on mormonism. Religion shouldn't be forced upon anyone. It is free will to believe whatever one wants to believe. Beliefs shouldn't be solicited at one's door. I apologize and don't mean to offend anyone, but that just sounds like a cult to me. Im just saying.
Where does it say we cant smoke cigarettes? (think about why I said that)
Start with Jeremiah 13:23 I suppose. Then ask yourself what this means for those who are born into a sin nature (meaning everyone). Then I would say to look what paul says in Romans 7:18. And if youre a christian, then thank God for Ephesians 1:11. And then by that, you will know what he means in Romans 9:21. I recommend you read the before and after verses on all these as well. God Bless!
I disagree. Brigham Young was a control freak - he ran everything and everyone. He ordered the massacre, and it could not have happened without his express order.
I was Born and Raised VERY LDS (Mormon) was Super conservative till about 37, Now VERY anti Religious and Somewhat Anti Mormon, HOWEVER, Fair is Fair and a movie made about an event that happened so long ago with NO way of knowing who truly ordered it or exactly what was said by whom yet portrayed in this film as if they found some script of what was actually said and exactly how it was said and by whom is Stupid and Asinine.
no one admitted anything. did you watch any of the press releases? nothing. sorry charlie. time to concentrate on something more important in life. ps the movie actually was a box office failure and lost 8 million. It also got a rare 1 star and was bashed by rotten tomatoes (the movie critics) as being bigotted against Mormons. Have a great day.
How about when people make a movie about us and bashing us, they make it RIGHT. Brigham Young had NOTHING to do with it. The Church did NOT support the killing of anyone. Get the facts straight.
I believe everything that comes from Hollywood it must be true.
This was timed to be released at Mitt Romney's candidacy announcement. I find it interesting that they do not base this on verifiable facts especially the implication that Brigham Young was behind it. They should make a movie about the martyrdom of Joseph Smith, "Extermination Order" (legalized murder of church members) by Governor Boggs of Missouri and the Hahn's Mill Massacre. So much more truth, action & drama.
I can only suppose from your reference to "joey" you meant Joseph Smith Jr. Well every fact surrounding his death fits every definition of a martyr that I have seen throughout history.
Simply because he tried to defend himself makes it no less so. By that reasoning you would claim anyone who has a urge for self-preservation or a desire to protect themselves (and those around them) does not "deserve" Martyrdom status. I simply mentioned that "Facts versus Hollywood" do actually matter.
joey means Joseph Smith Jr..yes u got one thing right.
you know it was wrong for people to kill him..BUT there are facts about joey that arnt all pretty. i wish mormons would stick their heads out of the sand and realize the factual history about this man and then u will realize that he is NOT who he says he his.
If you mean no offense then I wouldn't start your reply with "u got one thing right" sounds sort of negative to me. And you you know this how were you actually there? Can you give me absolute concrete evidence of any of the hearsay that I am aware exists. If not I suggest not believing everything you read or hear either. I believe all of us should gather as much information as possible from all sources and then we must each decide for ourselves and Jesus Christ is the only absolute Judge.
Simply by saying something does not make it so. All I can say is that each individual must find their own path. I wish you all the best in yours. Yes I have done nearly half a century worth of personal/historical/educational research and I know the gospel of Jesus Christ was restored and the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints is something that gives me a moral compass and my life would be nothing without it. Thanks for your comments and God bless you this new year!
After reading the 1857(Journal of Discourses, Vol. 4, pages 53-54)by Brigham Young as you see the post of it here it shows he was responsible for the Mountain Meadows Massacre he preached to kill a man and shed his blood that its ok if its for sins that Jesus Christ him self cant save a man from THE END
"There are sins that men commit for which they cannot receive forgiveness in this world, or in that which is to come, and if they had their eyes open to see their true condition, they would be perfectly willing to have their blood spilt upon the ground, that the smoke thereof might ascend to heaven as an offering for their sins; and the smoking incense would atone for their sins, whereas, if such is not the case, they will stick to them and remain upon them in the spirit world. 1857 JD V.4 53-54
I know,when you hear my brethren telling about cutting people off from the earth,that you consider it is strong doctrine;but it is to save them,not to destroy them.... ...I know that there are transgressors,who,if they knew themselves,and the only condition upon which they can obtain forgiveness, would beg of their brethren to shed their blood,that the smoke thereof might ascend to God as an offering...(1857 by Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 4, pages 53-54)
I have had men come to me and offer their lives to atone for their sins...
"It is true that the blood of the Son of God was shed for sins through the fall and those committed by men, yet men can commit sins which it can never remit.... There are sins that can be atoned for by an offering upon an altar, as in ancient days;and there are sins that the blood of a lamb, or a calf, or of turtle dove, cannot remit,but they must be atoned for by the blood of the man."1857 Journal of Discourses V.4 53-54
paola...overall, I liked it. It could have happened to any group of people, Mormon or not. It's true, when safety is at risk, you do anything to protect. It's so sad,though, that innocent men, women and children had to die like that.
"The film's other attempts to demonize Mormonism (really, what else can you call this?) are equally as unsubtle...Ultimately, it's a toss-up as to whether September Dawn is more offensive as history, as allegory or simply as lousy self-important filmmaking. It hardly matters since on all three levels the movie smells of herring." - Ken Hanke
"demonize" a very appropriate word to decribe Mormonism. The fishy smell is Mormon murder and death from 1830 onwards.murders performed in an mormon ritual in a mormon building under mormon inspiration under mormon orders brought about by mormon theology and freesonic values/oathes. You heartily extend Polygamy to yourselves, but when a man defends his family against your values you murder everything from that State!? mormonism is blood sacrifice and murder for gain and insult
hypno: murders performed in an mormon ritual in a mormon building under mormon inspiration under mormon orders
All false statements
hypno: When a man defends his family against your values you murder everything from that State!?
No, a paranoid group of mormons killed a group of pioneers who were rumored to have taken part in killing Mormons. It was terrible and wrong. In general Mormons (aside from this one incident) have been on the peaceful side. Blaming the religion doesn't fit.
@ancientastronomer Mormons still have not yet figured out how to be more secretive than God Eternal Father. Even though they have tried they have been feeble by comparison. lol
I just rented this movie. I thought it was worth seeing. It's a form of brainwashing, just like with Islamic people who hate us. The moron Mormons hated the gentiles. Just like with Hitler who also preached his lies and every SOB that comes around that thinks of himself as GOD. It's funny how history repeats itself. I wonder who's next. Who will brainwash people in our country and lead us to our deaths like lambs to the slaughter. That's a scary thought. Wake up America! Sure hope I'm wrong.
Have you checked out the "EndGame" videos I have placed in my favories list? I had no idea this was going on. That's why I made the comment about the "brainwashing"... I think that we have a lot to worry about and we do need to pray for world peace.
I just rented this movie. I thought it was worth seeing. It's a form of brainwashing, just like with Islamic people who hate us. The moron Mormons hated the gentiles. Just like with Hitler who also preached his lies and every SOB that comes around that thinks of himself as GOD. It's funny how history repeats itself. I wonder who's next. Who will brainwash people in our country and lead us to our deaths like lambs to the slaughter. That's a scary thought. Wake up America! Sure hope I'm wrong.
It is still questionable that he ordered the attack... but he did view the Arkansas people (after an LDS missionary was murded their) and the Missouri people as "cursed beyond all redemtion" and "only their own blood spilt can save them now." He also taught his followers to avenge the death of the Joseph Smith when ever an oppurtunity allowed. Based on these facts, I am favor the Brigham order the attack.
Most members do not know (and choose not to know) how many of the ugliest details in this film are not meant to be over the top... but accurate. The LDS Church "sanitizes" its history to make men like Joseph Smith and Brigham Young look like good, God fearing men. Of course it would be hard for the missionaries to sell a religion if they showed them as fanatic cult leaders.... so they "glorify" and "cleanse" history a little (more like a lot) bit.
I was a member of the Church at one time. If they revealed the true history of Morminism to its members... it would be an epidemic collapse of faith all together. So, they twist history, change stories, and cover up parts of it until an event, like "September Dawn", forces them to come forward. What is sadder is a lot of this bad stuff is in the Churches history archieves.
Aarm: If they revealed the true history of Morminism to its members... they twist history, change stories, and cover up parts What is sadder is a lot of this bad stuff is in the Churches history archieves.
Not just in Church history archives, but in books written by Mormons, Church History courses. It's almost like there is no cover up at all because you can read all about the Mountain Massacre tragedy from Mormon sources as well.
This is so much crap! BY was not some crazy fanatic, It was not a conspiracy of mormons come on, its the NWO we shiuld fight not some misguided movie about a man that fought against tyranny and unjust government, you may call me crazy but I like Brigham Young, plus the massacre was done by Lee and his men for which he was excommunicated for, so sure BY did know about it, but Lee was punished for his actions.
I agree with the last thing said. This movie was made to portray what has had happened 150 years ago. The mormons did massacre a wagon train of people. Now the church is trying to cover up things and defend themselves which is ridiculous. The religion is fine if you want to follow, just the church has a sketchy situation going on. Good movie though, i loved it, saw it in a private screening.
"...disturbingly awful..."September Dawn," written by an evangelical Christian, may be the worst historical drama ever made...it trivializes one of America's ugliest and least understood events." - Jack Matthews, New York Daily News (24 August 2007)
Finally this skeleton is revealed. The Book of Mormon is fiction and not even very good fiction at that. It is not just another denomination. I have always been impressed with Mormon families but the whole church needs to reject the lie that was planted by the church founder. They don't need the lie to keep their faith.
"'September Dawn' not worth seeing...the director gives a rather one-sided perspective on a highly debated issue. It's hard not to notice director Christopher Cain's bias towards the Mormon treatment of "gentiles"...This is my biggest problem with the film...Instead of keeping the film close to history, Cain bases his tale on a QUESTIONABLE 27-page confession, and subsequently portrays the Mormons as animals and zealots...." - Norris Ortolano, The Advocate (25 August 2007).
I just rented this movie. I thought it was worth seeing. It's a form of brainwashing, just like with Islamic people who hate us. The moron Mormons hated the gentiles. Just like with Hitler who also preached his lies and every SOB that comes around that thinks of himself as GOD. It's funny how history repeats itself. I wonder who's next. Who will brainwash people in our country and lead us to our deaths like lambs to the slaughter. That's a scary thought. Wake up America! Sure hope I'm wrong.
I just rented this movie. I thought it was worth seeing. It's a form of brainwashing, just like with Islamic people who hate us. The moron Mormons hated the gentiles. Just like with Hitler who also preached his lies and every SOB that comes around that thinks of himself as GOD. It's funny how history repeats itself. I wonder who's next. Who will brainwash people in our country and lead us to our deaths like lambs to the slaughter. That's a scary thought. Wake up America! Sure hope I'm wrong.
Mormons or no Mormons, this movie looks awesome!!!!
1. I know Mormons, I like Mormons, they always seem to be "happy".
2. This movie is more about how a religon can be "hijacked" and used to exert violence onto others. In current day, this is what has happened to Islam!
The Mormons were at war. An extermination order of the Mormons had been given. Mormon woman and children were murdered in cold blood at Hans Mill. The Army was sent to control or kill the Mormons. Gunmen were sent to kill Church leaders of the Church -- fleeing the Mormon posse, they joined a Wagon Train. The posse caught up, the men opened fire on the posse. It is unfortunate and sad woman and children were involved. War is dreadful. Innosent people die. Look at Iraq.
you have no idea what you are talking about, the people were settlere from arkansas headed to california, they were not gunmen sent after Mormons, read your history before you post ignorant or deceptive statements.
US government wrote an extermintion order and started the war against Mormons. I guess the US government thought the Mormons where pacifist Quakers. US government found out the hard way that Mormons defend themselves like the Jews.
i wish they would have just told the story by the *facts* and not throw in extra characters and turning it into some romantic tragedy. the whole episode was tragic enough.
This is all propaganda against Mitt Romney - I love the haters that persecute the truth! There is no difference today than when Jesus was on earth and many people persecuted Him as well. All to make some money these days?! Brigham Young is painted in an incorrect manner and it's obvious!
Actually, if you read any of the articles interviewing the director, he never heard of Mitt Romney 2 years ago when they started filming. Yeah, no difference today...BTW, what kind of car did Jesus drive? You knew Brigham Young? What was he like? Did he have any good looking wives?
socal3377 - In your other comments listed on the other SEPTEMBER DAWN trailer you said" That Mormons defend themselves just like the Jews" How can you find a kinship with Jews then tear them down is this comment. Your about as consistant as Joseph Smith.
In addition, did I say I was try to find kinship wih Jews in general. No, I just stated the fact that Mormons and Jews defend themselves. Also, there are several orthodox Jewish groups that denounce secular Jewish Hollywood immorality and also Zionism.
If you look at the video on YouTube, "Mountain Meadows Massacre News" you will see (8) Professional Historians of which (3) Agree that Brigham Young Initiated the Massacre, (1) said he condoned it, and all (8) agreed that he covered it up. Just a question about Gene Sessions...Is he a member of the church? I will bet he is...
It was 103 people, the camp had 120 people in it but 17 of them were under the age of 7 and were not killed. It is a horrible attrocity. The movie, however, misrepresents Brigham Young's role on this. Brigham Young did not find out about it until after it had occured. And the only evidence that says this isn't true has been proven a forgery.
"Shining New Light on the Mountain Meadows Massacre
by Gene Sessions" is a great one to two page read I hope everyone will read before they draw any premature conclusions about Brigham Young, or the events that took place. Gene A. Sessions (Ph.D., Florida State University) is Professor of History, and a Mountain Meadows scholar. He is a member of the Mountain Meadows Associtaion, and has written numerous books.
"Mormons went from being "vilified" to being "venerated," and their combination of family orientation, clean-cut optimism, honesty and pleasant aggressiveness seems increasingly in demand."
"The FBI and cia, drawn by a seemingly incorruptible rectitude, have instituted Mormon-recruitment plans."
"although the Mormon faith remains unique, the land in which it was born has come to accept--no, to lionize--its adherents as paragons of the national spirit."
YOU are the one "feverishly active", socal. What is it to you if we prove it a fraud--or not? Your testimony must really be weak if you are here instead of doing your home teaching (you only have 10 days left to get it done). It is YOU who can't seem to leave US alone. Ya gotta come here to boost your LDS self esteem, eh?
Wow!! And what a marvelous work and a wonder you performed here today. Oh! And thanks for the help in assisting us in our battle to show the non's out there what a Mormon cultist is like. High fives to ya, socal!
Mormons/Morons=same thing.
Everclearish 3 months ago
It was a great day today...The child molester Warren Jeffs is found guilty of two counts of sexual assault on a child...How's that for one of your prophet's...
1kinnyg 5 months ago
september 11 ???? ...... WHAT!!!! ?????
bazzerpeck25 6 months ago
@bazzerpeck25 Not only the date but the accusers are the perps. It wasn't Arkies, it wasn't Indians and it wasn't Muslims in 2001. The accuser is a liar. That sounds like something I read in the Bible, Satan is the accuser. A lying false accuser. Thus Mormonism, Joe and Brigham Young are Satan's handiwork.
IExposeMormonism 5 months ago
The gov was on a roll...Not only did he authorize the murder and coverup of the children, women and men of the Baker-Fancher wagon train in 1857, the very next year, the he authorized the taking up of arms agains the US gov...Not only was he a false prophet but his book he followed was and still is false...Alma 7:10 states Jesus was born in Jerusalem...Luke 2:4-7 states Jesus was born in Bethlehem...Not a hard one to figure out there...
1kinnyg 7 months ago
@1kinnyg... I agree 1kinnyg. The gov took up arms against the US Army because he was guilty of killing all those Arkansas children, their mama's, their daddy's, their brothers, and their sisters. He tried to hide it all but the truth always comes out. He didn't want to be exposed as the false prophet he really was. Numbers 32:23 says "and be sure your sin will find you out".
arkansasresident 7 months ago
This movie is so far off I'm not even going to say it's based on a true story because the true story of the massacre is not found in this movie.
majinish 9 months ago
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This movie is very 1-sided and gives nowhere near all of the information and is 100% twisted. 1st, Brigham did not instigate it. He sent a message to the saints to not attack. The message didn't arrive until 2 days after the massacre. The reason the saints attacked is because people on the train were involved in BRUTAL murders of other saints in Missouri including the murder of the prophet Joseph Smith.
majinish 9 months ago
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TheLycantis 9 months ago
Not only did the governor authorize the murder of 37 children, he was a flat out bigot... He is credited with having been responsible for revoking the priesthood and temple blessings from black members...In 1863, Young said, "Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be so"...
1kinnyg 10 months ago 6
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TheLycantis 9 months ago
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TheLycantis 9 months ago
Terence Stamp plays such a great villain, good choice for him to play Breedem young.
teddereem 10 months ago
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Not only was the Governor a lier, but so was the book he taught from, the same book that misleads millions today...They have Jesus being born in Jerusalem (Alma 7:9-10)...However, the WORD clearly says Jesus was born in Bethlehem (Luke 2:1-7)...Why is this important? Bethlehem is the City of David...I'm always weary about those that conceal the truth...You have been warned about adding and detracting from the Bible...
arkansasresident 10 months ago
Read Brigham Youngs violent and racist teachings in the journal of discources. Just a little sample:
"Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be so." (Journal of Discourses, vol. 10, p. 110).
drinkswithnedkelly 10 months ago
Most awesome movie...I'm glad it was produced to tell the truth about how the governor and former Methodist ordered the murder of 32 children...
arkansasresident 11 months ago
Mormons sure do have a lot of secrets:: Secret Marriage ceremonies, secret polygamy, secret oaths, secret mass murders and kidnappings of 17 children, But if you can control of the information flow and keep blaming the innocent, all contribute to keeping secrets successfully. Congratulations to Mormonism for concealing the truth
IExposeMormonism 1 year ago
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TheLycantis 9 months ago
@TheLycantis Yes, I'll look up that mountain medders thing. I didn't know the church excommunicated the governor, that's one I wasn't aware of. 9 were excommunicated? What were their names? I thought Dame was the leading authority, not the guy executed. And how many were put away for life??
IExposeMormonism 9 months ago
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TheLycantis 9 months ago
@TheLycantis Haight was excommunicated. Dame and Higbee weren't. It's possible Lee wasn't either but it was just "said" he was. Regardless, those four were the ranking perps.It was they that stood in the 3-4 prayer circles, each facing a cardinal point while the other 50 formed a circle around the 4. Each Left arm over the next shoulder and the right arm 90 degrees up at the elbow. This made it easier for Mormon god to influence the next decision all of which led to the mass ritual murder of MMM
IExposeMormonism 9 months ago
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TheLycantis 9 months ago
@TheLycantis Oh my, getting a little snitty, there, aren't we? Actions of one group=55 Mormons under the endowment ceremony oaths, their "Prayer circles to Mormon god", plus G.A. Smith, numerous folks up north, as Huntington's diary tells us. Then all those wives and children who Had to keep they're mouths shut or "Have their tails cut off below the ears" to use B. Young's phrase. Gemmel says he was in the office when Hamblin and GASmith arrived and BYoung said "I'd would kill them...".
IExposeMormonism 9 months ago 2
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TheLycantis 9 months ago
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TheLycantis 9 months ago
@TheLycantis Well, interesting but you didn't answer one of my questions. And I wasn't aware the Indians ""were all trying to make amends...." I never read that the wagon train hated Indians but I did read of the accusations, like poisoning Indians and cattle, made by the Mormons.
IExposeMormonism 9 months ago
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TheLycantis 9 months ago
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TheLycantis 9 months ago
@TheLycantis Oh,you saying the Indians panicked or the Mormons became frightened and panicked? Next, the lie you refer to, is that the lie that "the Indians forced the Mormons to participate in the Murders, and thus the Indians were the Perps" ? Or The silly rumor that the Mormons were the instigators w/ Higbee, Haight, Dame, Lee, being the high ranking players and guys like Klingensmith, McFarland, Stewart were mass murdering maniacs that day. And please look at my other questions from above
IExposeMormonism 9 months ago
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TheLycantis 9 months ago
@TheLycantis "The Indians only attacked because they were under the impression they would be killed along with the mormons that participated," Hello?. Are you saying the Mormons and Indians attacked a SECOND time after they realized the innocent probably knew it was Mormons attacking them? But the immigrants were convinced by Mormons that it was the Indians. How did the Mormons do that? I have a hunch the Mormons, JD Lee, etc, convincingly said Indians did it.and the innocents believed JDL,etc
IExposeMormonism 9 months ago
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TheLycantis 9 months ago
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TheLycantis 9 months ago
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TheLycantis 9 months ago
@TheLycantis "everyone was convinced indians were bad guys. " Is true. That's what made it so convenient for the Mormons to blame a Mormon ritualistic murder on Indians. And why the Mormons could convince the Innocents it was Indians. (It was 55 painted Mormons and some Indians under direction of Lee) And it helps explain how Mormons could convince the Public it was Indians. But the Mormons Lied. It was 55 Mormons under the oaths of the Mormon Endowment Ceremony. Now we approach the ugly truth
IExposeMormonism 9 months ago
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TheLycantis 9 months ago
@TheLycantis Yes, Ritualistic because the 55 Mormons under the Endowment oaths gathered in prayer circles as described earlier. Prayed to Mormon god and got it. I'm not here for the Jesuits and Jews and Muslims, This is here about Mormonism's claims and the truth of the matter. Soon I'll be posting Mormon History of the Church versions, Whitney, J.F. Smith, etc. I have all the church Histories. And More. You should check out your adversaries more closely. Tah Tah, and Ciao.
IExposeMormonism 9 months ago
@IExposeMormonism Who said you were an adversary? You're an ignorant bigot and I pity you. If you are wrong in the end, will you be ready to hear the truth?
TheLycantis 9 months ago
@TheLycantis I'm not ignorant nor a bigot. I research things very carefully over a long time. 4 years on the MMM and I'm not stopping. I have your histories, multiple BofM, D&C, The Abe Pap, BofC, Adam-God, Nauvoo Endowment Companies, a Documentary History, Sacred Loneliness and many others. At some 350 original publications (most posted) I will take your truth and feed it back to you with it's true flavor. Reading the MMM will do that to you.I was left aghast and the more I read the less I like
IExposeMormonism 9 months ago 2
@TheLycantis And issues of murdering children and kidnapping them, blaming the Indians for that, billing the USA Gov't for their upkeep and padding that bill. Nor the gross insults hurled against them by Brigham Young and John D Lee and such. How would you like to be kidnapped by your parents murderers and raised by them? and then insulted. But such is the fruit that falls from the tree of Mormonism. This took many more than the 55 murderers. Storing and auctioning the loot in the tithing house
IExposeMormonism 9 months ago 3
huh?! d0nt judge yet the Mormon Church if u d0nt kn0w what behinds all of this faith... and besides arguing regarding religion is n0t a go0d idea... :D
amade0estuita 1 year ago
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"It is better that a man should perish than that a nation should dwindle and perish in unbelief." 1 Nephi 4:13 Book of Mormon . It's ok to kill in the name of God.
kramd1 1 year ago
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TheLycantis 9 months ago
People of any Christian faith need to realize that Jesus didn't save people by violence, rudeness, damnation, or a foul mouth. He showed love to all people! Why is that so hard for us? People in all religions have killed in the name of God in history; no one is without sin. Let's remember that the very last scripture in the Bible says anyone who adds or detracts from the scriptures will come under God's judgement. The book of Mormon adds to the scriptures. The only book we need is the Bible.
tvmesing47 1 year ago
aliens did it
JUKIO01 1 year ago
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none off you have a fucking clue about this event. hollywood take a little crumb and turn it into a fuckin feeding frenzy. what do the mormons do thats wrong. they were funny clothes shit look at the catholic church and the pope he looks like a four skin wearing a kkk outfit. what they dont drink or smoke shit look at the mooslams& hindis they don't eat meat . king richard the lion heart rape half the fuckin world and he belonged to a religion . fuck up and stop trashing the mormons.
05reuben 1 year ago
none off you have a fucking clue about this event. hollywood take a little crumb and turn it into a fuckin feeding frenzy. what do the mormons do thats wrong. they were funny clothes shit look at the catholic church and the pope he looks like a four skin wearing a kkk outfit. what they dont drink or smoke shit look at the mooslams& hindis they don't eat meat . king richard the lion heart rape half the fuckin world and he belonged to a religion . fuck up and stop trashing the mormons.
05reuben 1 year ago
nutjobs that would do the same thing to pass prop 8 if no one was watching.
Sakamachi25 1 year ago
I did some research and tried to figure out who could kill 37 children in cold blood...I discovered these people and those that follow Gov Young to this day, follow a book that says Jesus was born in Jerusalem (Alma 7:9-10) when my bible clearly says Jesus was born in Bethlehem (Luke 2:1-7)...My bible also warns in Galatians 1:8 that their angel was cursed...So it doesn't take long to see through all their lies...Bottom line is you got 37 children who were butchered and cry out "remember me"...
arkansasresident 1 year ago
@arkansasresident try having someone that reads explain it to you.
pontehyper29 1 year ago
@pontehyper29 probably someone from utah...
arkansasresident 1 year ago
@arkansasresident yeah Great Answer! actually no. i'm in Nashville, Tennessee.and work for Lifeway Christian Stores but thanks for tryin.
pontehyper29 1 year ago
Hey there is also a new tv show on TLC called "Sister Wives", who are under police investigation in Utah for a possible charge of felony bigamy
arkansasresident 1 year ago
@arkansasresident Is it really that hard for you to understand that these people are NOT Mormons?
pontehyper29 1 year ago
@pontehyper29 check out this book then by Ann Eliza Young (1876). Wife No. 19, or the story of a life in bondage. Being a complete exposé of Mormonism, and revealing the sorrows, sacrifices and sufferings of women in polygamy. Hartford, Connecticut: Dustin, Oilman & Co..
arkansasresident 1 year ago
@arkansasresident Have you ever actually been to a Mormon church or read the Book of Mormon? As a Christian, I sincerely hope that you don't run off on tangents and believe everything every rumor on the internet or in a book tells you. It gives Christians a bad name and makes us look fault-finding and ignorant. Some of the best people I know, here in Nashville, TN, are Mormons. They have been the most compasionate, giving, and charitable people I have ever met.
pontehyper29 1 year ago
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@pontehyper29 I'm sure they are compasionate, giving, and charitable people...You suggested someone read it to me and i suggested two books you should read and a tv show you should watch...As far as attending their church, I could never attend a church that follows a book that says Jesus was born in Jerusalem (Alma 7:9-10) when my bible clearly says Jesus was born in Bethlehem (Luke 2:1-7)...
arkansasresident 1 year ago
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@pontehyper29 I'm sure they are compasionate, giving, charitable people....You suggested someone read it to me and I suggested two books you should check out and a new tv show....As far attending their church, I could never attend a church at follow a book that says Jesus was born in Jerusalem (Alma 7:9-10) when my bible clearly says Jesus was born in Bethlehem (Luke 2:1-7)...
arkansasresident 1 year ago
@pontehyper29 Oh, i almost forgot, check out the autobiography by Elissa Wall "Stolen Innocence": My Story of Growing Up in a Polygamous Sect, Becoming a Teenage Bride, and Breaking Free of Warren Jeffs
arkansasresident 1 year ago
@arkansasresident Again, how do you not understand that these polygamists are NOT Mormons?
pontehyper29 1 year ago
Fact is, whatever flaws are in the movie only go to benefit Mormonism:: It doesn't show how JD Lee entered with a white flag And making Freemason Signs of Security. Nor how Mormons blamed it on Indians. Nor how Mormons Kidnapped Children. Nor how the cause was Joe Smith and Parley Pratt, in a Fevered Mormon's Brain. Nor how Mormons falsely accused the innocent of crimes. So, the movie is a whitewash! But it does show us the violence in Mormonism and it only gets worse the more you know
IExposeMormonism 1 year ago
More untruths and garbage that I will not be part of. What a waste of resources and money.
jlberenyi 1 year ago
"inspired" be actual events. Not accurate to actual events. Fascinating how things can be distorted. This depicts Mormons to be evil people, i find that to be extremely inaccurate and judgmental. Makes one wonder if it being rated R prevents mormons from setting the record straight considering they choose not to watch R rated films due to it's inappropriate content. Sure sounds like the values of monsters to me... ridiculous.
Val1991 2 years ago
So...is this movie good? I bought it last week, but haven't watched it. I love historical movies! xD
afauaticas3 2 years ago
The production quality is high, except for the corny flashback sequences. Major flaws are the obligatory character instantly shedding his faith to declare the Mormon leaders tyrants, and forced Romeo & Juliette plot.
To see them calling on their followers to be "like Mohamed" and hearing John Voight quoting scripture, promising to name his planet after his wife- is well worth it.
"The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man. All who do so are abomination unto the Lord thy God."
Turtleproof 2 years ago
fuckin mormons. lol i watched it and it was pretty good. they should have hung bringham youngs ass.
killahoe62 2 years ago
Its not about the money. Its about letting people know what happened. I even post it on my wall on facebook so that everyone knows. Church people are always trying to blame it on the Native American Indians. They are even trying to take their culture away, but they haven't. And they will not.
memoredwash 2 years ago 9
This should tell you all you need to know. Budget: $11,000,000, U.S. Gross: $1,066,555, Net loss: $9,933,445
Nobody cared to see it because it's trash! I hope nobody wastes their time seeing this movie with an obvious anti-mormon agenda.
bejensen76 2 years ago
Just bought it, just viewed it, just filed it....... in the trash can.
lunchmeat400 2 years ago
"What a strange, confused, unpleasant movie this is." -Roger Ebert
"A venomous religious tract printed on celluloid." - Colin Cover, Minneapolis Star
"Disturbingly awful." Jack Matthews, New York Daily News
"Why does this film even exist? " -Kyle Smith, New York Post
To all you "ex-Mormons" that juggalocode wants to see this movie, go ahead and watch this anti-Mormon fodder so you can keep feeding your self-pitying delusions that the church is wrong.
kipdynamite77 2 years ago
Mormons, Muslims, what's the difference, same thing, hahahahahahahha
MrFortnerJoe 2 years ago
yes they are all the same thing praying to god when its actually aliens from outer space. we are all children of mother earth.
memoredwash 2 years ago
Now this looks interesting!!
Suggested to all Ex-mormons!!
JuggalocodeChile1988 2 years ago
the only reason it wasn't shown international because it was a movie about the American Past, was meant as another way for Americans to view the Mountain Meadows Massacre.
smileymiley2576 2 years ago
That movie is a flop and never been released on cinema in the UK (where I live). Must be a lousy plot and poor acting. I prefer to real facts and books. Yes it did happen, but nothing like the movie.
WayneTheWriter 2 years ago
On September 11, 2007 Henry B. Eyring read an official statement saying: "A separate expression of regret is owed the Paiute people who have unjustly borne for too long the principal blame for what occurred during the massacre. Although the extent of their involvement is disputed, it is believed they would not have participated without the direction and stimulus provided by local church leaders and members."
that's admitting a little responsibility. at least in english...
POLYMORPHLEGION 2 years ago
*masonic
POLYMORPHLEGION 2 years ago
on sept. 11th??? another masoni/illuminati mass sacrifice/ritual disguised as attrocity???
POLYMORPHLEGION 2 years ago
This movie gave me an enirely different perspective on mormonism. Religion shouldn't be forced upon anyone. It is free will to believe whatever one wants to believe. Beliefs shouldn't be solicited at one's door. I apologize and don't mean to offend anyone, but that just sounds like a cult to me. Im just saying.
adrianadoak42 2 years ago
Where does the bible say we have free will? name just one scripture...
jgm1234567 2 years ago
Where does it say that we don't free will?
adrianadoak42 2 years ago
Where does it say we cant smoke cigarettes? (think about why I said that)
Start with Jeremiah 13:23 I suppose. Then ask yourself what this means for those who are born into a sin nature (meaning everyone). Then I would say to look what paul says in Romans 7:18. And if youre a christian, then thank God for Ephesians 1:11. And then by that, you will know what he means in Romans 9:21. I recommend you read the before and after verses on all these as well. God Bless!
jgm1234567 2 years ago
I disagree. Brigham Young was a control freak - he ran everything and everyone. He ordered the massacre, and it could not have happened without his express order.
ThePeterlockhart 2 years ago
I was Born and Raised VERY LDS (Mormon) was Super conservative till about 37, Now VERY anti Religious and Somewhat Anti Mormon, HOWEVER, Fair is Fair and a movie made about an event that happened so long ago with NO way of knowing who truly ordered it or exactly what was said by whom yet portrayed in this film as if they found some script of what was actually said and exactly how it was said and by whom is Stupid and Asinine.
raftnkayak 2 years ago
This looks like a really awsome film. I bet it will send shockwaves through the Mormon church.
plitterplatter 2 years ago
yeah well it didn't.
pontehyper29 2 years ago
at least it forced them to admit to it!!!
POLYMORPHLEGION 2 years ago
no one admitted anything. did you watch any of the press releases? nothing. sorry charlie. time to concentrate on something more important in life. ps the movie actually was a box office failure and lost 8 million. It also got a rare 1 star and was bashed by rotten tomatoes (the movie critics) as being bigotted against Mormons. Have a great day.
pontehyper29 2 years ago
It's been a while since the movie came out and didn't work out too good. Things get kinda late over there, huh? haha
dkanrjskgo 2 years ago
How about when people make a movie about us and bashing us, they make it RIGHT. Brigham Young had NOTHING to do with it. The Church did NOT support the killing of anyone. Get the facts straight.
StarWarzFreak92 3 years ago
the mormons believe in Jehovah?
someonecool22 3 years ago
I believe everything that comes from Hollywood it must be true.
AequitasVeritas7777 3 years ago
How can a murderer be a prophet. That dude reminds me of Osama Bin Laden, I didn't like mormons now I really, really dislike them!
trevinboy 3 years ago
I believe everything that comes from Hollywood it must be true.
This was timed to be released at Mitt Romney's candidacy announcement. I find it interesting that they do not base this on verifiable facts especially the implication that Brigham Young was behind it. They should make a movie about the martyrdom of Joseph Smith, "Extermination Order" (legalized murder of church members) by Governor Boggs of Missouri and the Hahn's Mill Massacre. So much more truth, action & drama.
AequitasVeritas7777 3 years ago
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prprrrrrrthhhh joey was not a martyr..martyrs dont shoot back.
keep believing keep believing
cezza57 3 years ago
I can only suppose from your reference to "joey" you meant Joseph Smith Jr. Well every fact surrounding his death fits every definition of a martyr that I have seen throughout history.
Simply because he tried to defend himself makes it no less so. By that reasoning you would claim anyone who has a urge for self-preservation or a desire to protect themselves (and those around them) does not "deserve" Martyrdom status. I simply mentioned that "Facts versus Hollywood" do actually matter.
AequitasVeritas7777 3 years ago
joey means Joseph Smith Jr..yes u got one thing right.
you know it was wrong for people to kill him..BUT there are facts about joey that arnt all pretty. i wish mormons would stick their heads out of the sand and realize the factual history about this man and then u will realize that he is NOT who he says he his.
(i mean no offence)
cezza57 3 years ago
If you mean no offense then I wouldn't start your reply with "u got one thing right" sounds sort of negative to me. And you you know this how were you actually there? Can you give me absolute concrete evidence of any of the hearsay that I am aware exists. If not I suggest not believing everything you read or hear either. I believe all of us should gather as much information as possible from all sources and then we must each decide for ourselves and Jesus Christ is the only absolute Judge.
AequitasVeritas7777 3 years ago
this is is typical mormon reply.
i have done ALOT of research into mormonism and there is overwelming facts and evidence that puts holes in your religion thus making it false.
the reasons your still a mormon is:
1)you have not done research into the history, theology and teachings of mormonism.
2)leaders in the church lie or hide the truth.
3)your blinded and dont want to believe otherwise
..even by comparing the bible to the BOM you can see
mmmmmm
cezza57 3 years ago
Simply by saying something does not make it so. All I can say is that each individual must find their own path. I wish you all the best in yours. Yes I have done nearly half a century worth of personal/historical/educational research and I know the gospel of Jesus Christ was restored and the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints is something that gives me a moral compass and my life would be nothing without it. Thanks for your comments and God bless you this new year!
AequitasVeritas7777 3 years ago
peace to you :)
cezza57 3 years ago
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After reading the 1857(Journal of Discourses, Vol. 4, pages 53-54)by Brigham Young as you see the post of it here it shows he was responsible for the Mountain Meadows Massacre he preached to kill a man and shed his blood that its ok if its for sins that Jesus Christ him self cant save a man from THE END
Ilegalplayer 3 years ago
"There are sins that men commit for which they cannot receive forgiveness in this world, or in that which is to come, and if they had their eyes open to see their true condition, they would be perfectly willing to have their blood spilt upon the ground, that the smoke thereof might ascend to heaven as an offering for their sins; and the smoking incense would atone for their sins, whereas, if such is not the case, they will stick to them and remain upon them in the spirit world. 1857 JD V.4 53-54
Ilegalplayer 3 years ago
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I know,when you hear my brethren telling about cutting people off from the earth,that you consider it is strong doctrine;but it is to save them,not to destroy them.... ...I know that there are transgressors,who,if they knew themselves,and the only condition upon which they can obtain forgiveness, would beg of their brethren to shed their blood,that the smoke thereof might ascend to God as an offering...(1857 by Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 4, pages 53-54)
Ilegalplayer 3 years ago
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I have had men come to me and offer their lives to atone for their sins...
"It is true that the blood of the Son of God was shed for sins through the fall and those committed by men, yet men can commit sins which it can never remit.... There are sins that can be atoned for by an offering upon an altar, as in ancient days;and there are sins that the blood of a lamb, or a calf, or of turtle dove, cannot remit,but they must be atoned for by the blood of the man."1857 Journal of Discourses V.4 53-54
Ilegalplayer 3 years ago
paola...overall, I liked it. It could have happened to any group of people, Mormon or not. It's true, when safety is at risk, you do anything to protect. It's so sad,though, that innocent men, women and children had to die like that.
lubinum 3 years ago
ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh i wanna see that movie!
paolarivera97 3 years ago
saying that Brigam young was was good until now is stupid he was a prophet of god
straan12 3 years ago
"The film's other attempts to demonize Mormonism (really, what else can you call this?) are equally as unsubtle...Ultimately, it's a toss-up as to whether September Dawn is more offensive as history, as allegory or simply as lousy self-important filmmaking. It hardly matters since on all three levels the movie smells of herring." - Ken Hanke
smpf38 3 years ago
"demonize" a very appropriate word to decribe Mormonism. The fishy smell is Mormon murder and death from 1830 onwards.murders performed in an mormon ritual in a mormon building under mormon inspiration under mormon orders brought about by mormon theology and freesonic values/oathes. You heartily extend Polygamy to yourselves, but when a man defends his family against your values you murder everything from that State!? mormonism is blood sacrifice and murder for gain and insult
hypnotstcollector 3 years ago
hypno: murders performed in an mormon ritual in a mormon building under mormon inspiration under mormon orders
All false statements
hypno: When a man defends his family against your values you murder everything from that State!?
No, a paranoid group of mormons killed a group of pioneers who were rumored to have taken part in killing Mormons. It was terrible and wrong. In general Mormons (aside from this one incident) have been on the peaceful side. Blaming the religion doesn't fit.
smpf38 3 years ago
You are right.
lubinum 3 years ago
@hypnotstcollector Mormonism is simply a Satanic Cult. Just like Catholicism,
Jehova's Witnesses, Bhuddism, Islam, Hinduism, Etc.
I've ALWAYS found it humorous that the Mormon Rituals are SECRET, and
NO-ONE is allowed inside their (Temples) UNLESS they CONVERT to
Mormonism? I Gotta wonder what Jesus thinks about that? Would Jesus
prevent a person from entering HIS Temple unless they first converted to
Judism? Would Jesus have or perform "Secret Rituals?". The entire concept
makes me ill
ancientastronomer 1 year ago
@ancientastronomer Mormons still have not yet figured out how to be more secretive than God Eternal Father. Even though they have tried they have been feeble by comparison. lol
NEBULON68 1 year ago
I just rented this movie. I thought it was worth seeing. It's a form of brainwashing, just like with Islamic people who hate us. The moron Mormons hated the gentiles. Just like with Hitler who also preached his lies and every SOB that comes around that thinks of himself as GOD. It's funny how history repeats itself. I wonder who's next. Who will brainwash people in our country and lead us to our deaths like lambs to the slaughter. That's a scary thought. Wake up America! Sure hope I'm wrong.
lubinum 3 years ago 3
$10 bucks you aren't.
MomoTheStrange 3 years ago
Have you checked out the "EndGame" videos I have placed in my favories list? I had no idea this was going on. That's why I made the comment about the "brainwashing"... I think that we have a lot to worry about and we do need to pray for world peace.
lubinum 3 years ago
Don't worry, you ARE wrong:
"...the movie leaves no doubt at all — using fierce quotations by Young, but using those words wildly out of context..." - Michael Medved, USA Today
smpf38 3 years ago
I just rented this movie. I thought it was worth seeing. It's a form of brainwashing, just like with Islamic people who hate us. The moron Mormons hated the gentiles. Just like with Hitler who also preached his lies and every SOB that comes around that thinks of himself as GOD. It's funny how history repeats itself. I wonder who's next. Who will brainwash people in our country and lead us to our deaths like lambs to the slaughter. That's a scary thought. Wake up America! Sure hope I'm wrong.
lubinum 3 years ago
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rustymente 4 years ago
It is still questionable that he ordered the attack... but he did view the Arkansas people (after an LDS missionary was murded their) and the Missouri people as "cursed beyond all redemtion" and "only their own blood spilt can save them now." He also taught his followers to avenge the death of the Joseph Smith when ever an oppurtunity allowed. Based on these facts, I am favor the Brigham order the attack.
AarmOZ 4 years ago
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rustymente 4 years ago
Very emotional and touching movie!
rustymente 4 years ago
I agree with that point. The education system sucks, and brainwashing is common in the us
lstrikealpha 4 years ago
Most members do not know (and choose not to know) how many of the ugliest details in this film are not meant to be over the top... but accurate. The LDS Church "sanitizes" its history to make men like Joseph Smith and Brigham Young look like good, God fearing men. Of course it would be hard for the missionaries to sell a religion if they showed them as fanatic cult leaders.... so they "glorify" and "cleanse" history a little (more like a lot) bit.
AarmOZ 4 years ago
Why wont the LDS church even admit that this happend? Because Mormons think they are the true church and are above everyone else.
ldreese33 4 years ago
I was a member of the Church at one time. If they revealed the true history of Morminism to its members... it would be an epidemic collapse of faith all together. So, they twist history, change stories, and cover up parts of it until an event, like "September Dawn", forces them to come forward. What is sadder is a lot of this bad stuff is in the Churches history archieves.
AarmOZ 4 years ago
Aarm: If they revealed the true history of Morminism to its members... they twist history, change stories, and cover up parts What is sadder is a lot of this bad stuff is in the Churches history archieves.
Not just in Church history archives, but in books written by Mormons, Church History courses. It's almost like there is no cover up at all because you can read all about the Mountain Massacre tragedy from Mormon sources as well.
smpf38 3 years ago
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rustymente 4 years ago
This is so much crap! BY was not some crazy fanatic, It was not a conspiracy of mormons come on, its the NWO we shiuld fight not some misguided movie about a man that fought against tyranny and unjust government, you may call me crazy but I like Brigham Young, plus the massacre was done by Lee and his men for which he was excommunicated for, so sure BY did know about it, but Lee was punished for his actions.
mormonpatriot 4 years ago
Yes, talk about the NWO... That is something we definitely need to worry about.
lubinum 3 years ago
You should read the book by Steven E. Farley on the Mormon Mountain Meadows Massacre. He answers a lot of questions in his book.
19Steve47 4 years ago
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rustymente 4 years ago
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rustymente 4 years ago
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rustymente 4 years ago
Gee, I guess you can know them by their works.
rustymente 4 years ago
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rustymente 4 years ago
You should read the book by Steven E. Farley on the Mormon Mountain Meadows Massacre. He answers a lot of questions in his book.
19Steve47 4 years ago 2
I agree with the last thing said. This movie was made to portray what has had happened 150 years ago. The mormons did massacre a wagon train of people. Now the church is trying to cover up things and defend themselves which is ridiculous. The religion is fine if you want to follow, just the church has a sketchy situation going on. Good movie though, i loved it, saw it in a private screening.
Bratatat69 4 years ago
"...disturbingly awful..."September Dawn," written by an evangelical Christian, may be the worst historical drama ever made...it trivializes one of America's ugliest and least understood events." - Jack Matthews, New York Daily News (24 August 2007)
smpf38 4 years ago
Finally this skeleton is revealed. The Book of Mormon is fiction and not even very good fiction at that. It is not just another denomination. I have always been impressed with Mormon families but the whole church needs to reject the lie that was planted by the church founder. They don't need the lie to keep their faith.
Ma3lst0rm 4 years ago
"'September Dawn' not worth seeing...the director gives a rather one-sided perspective on a highly debated issue. It's hard not to notice director Christopher Cain's bias towards the Mormon treatment of "gentiles"...This is my biggest problem with the film...Instead of keeping the film close to history, Cain bases his tale on a QUESTIONABLE 27-page confession, and subsequently portrays the Mormons as animals and zealots...." - Norris Ortolano, The Advocate (25 August 2007).
smpf38 4 years ago
I just rented this movie. I thought it was worth seeing. It's a form of brainwashing, just like with Islamic people who hate us. The moron Mormons hated the gentiles. Just like with Hitler who also preached his lies and every SOB that comes around that thinks of himself as GOD. It's funny how history repeats itself. I wonder who's next. Who will brainwash people in our country and lead us to our deaths like lambs to the slaughter. That's a scary thought. Wake up America! Sure hope I'm wrong.
lubinum 3 years ago
I just rented this movie. I thought it was worth seeing. It's a form of brainwashing, just like with Islamic people who hate us. The moron Mormons hated the gentiles. Just like with Hitler who also preached his lies and every SOB that comes around that thinks of himself as GOD. It's funny how history repeats itself. I wonder who's next. Who will brainwash people in our country and lead us to our deaths like lambs to the slaughter. That's a scary thought. Wake up America! Sure hope I'm wrong.
lubinum 3 years ago
Mormons or no Mormons, this movie looks awesome!!!!
1. I know Mormons, I like Mormons, they always seem to be "happy".
2. This movie is more about how a religon can be "hijacked" and used to exert violence onto others. In current day, this is what has happened to Islam!
3. This movie still looks awesome!
4. Voight rocks!
5. Bye.
Slatch35 4 years ago
The Mormons were at war. An extermination order of the Mormons had been given. Mormon woman and children were murdered in cold blood at Hans Mill. The Army was sent to control or kill the Mormons. Gunmen were sent to kill Church leaders of the Church -- fleeing the Mormon posse, they joined a Wagon Train. The posse caught up, the men opened fire on the posse. It is unfortunate and sad woman and children were involved. War is dreadful. Innosent people die. Look at Iraq.
krazEkid 4 years ago
you have no idea what you are talking about, the people were settlere from arkansas headed to california, they were not gunmen sent after Mormons, read your history before you post ignorant or deceptive statements.
TRUUUTHZ 4 years ago
Please... Mormons are not all bad. You should not judge!
Dolly1973 4 years ago
US government wrote an extermintion order and started the war against Mormons. I guess the US government thought the Mormons where pacifist Quakers. US government found out the hard way that Mormons defend themselves like the Jews.
socal3377 4 years ago
where, pray tell, is this order you speak of?
links?
Phreek666 4 years ago
i wish they would have just told the story by the *facts* and not throw in extra characters and turning it into some romantic tragedy. the whole episode was tragic enough.
rtstrong 4 years ago
You should read the book by Steven E. Farley on the Mormon Mountain Meadows Massacre. He answers a lot of questions in his book.
19Steve47 4 years ago
This is all propaganda against Mitt Romney - I love the haters that persecute the truth! There is no difference today than when Jesus was on earth and many people persecuted Him as well. All to make some money these days?! Brigham Young is painted in an incorrect manner and it's obvious!
beau4307 4 years ago
Actually, if you read any of the articles interviewing the director, he never heard of Mitt Romney 2 years ago when they started filming. Yeah, no difference today...BTW, what kind of car did Jesus drive? You knew Brigham Young? What was he like? Did he have any good looking wives?
greymatter711 4 years ago
Ofcoarse the hollywood Jew director said that! One Jew interviewing another Jew.
socal3377 4 years ago
socal3377 - In your other comments listed on the other SEPTEMBER DAWN trailer you said" That Mormons defend themselves just like the Jews" How can you find a kinship with Jews then tear them down is this comment. Your about as consistant as Joseph Smith.
johnnyfever68 4 years ago
There are secular Jews and religious Jews. Since Jews don't excommunicate they are called Jews. Hollywood is run by secular Jews. Do you deny this?
socal3377 4 years ago
In addition, did I say I was try to find kinship wih Jews in general. No, I just stated the fact that Mormons and Jews defend themselves. Also, there are several orthodox Jewish groups that denounce secular Jewish Hollywood immorality and also Zionism.
socal3377 4 years ago
antisemitic much?
Phreek666 4 years ago
I LOVE it. The Mormon cult and its members are gonna HATE this. LOL!
ilgbf 4 years ago
its about time that Brigham Young was played for the tyranical villain he really was! POS!
chimyron 4 years ago
If you look at the video on YouTube, "Mountain Meadows Massacre News" you will see (8) Professional Historians of which (3) Agree that Brigham Young Initiated the Massacre, (1) said he condoned it, and all (8) agreed that he covered it up. Just a question about Gene Sessions...Is he a member of the church? I will bet he is...
greymatter711 4 years ago
It was 103 people, the camp had 120 people in it but 17 of them were under the age of 7 and were not killed. It is a horrible attrocity. The movie, however, misrepresents Brigham Young's role on this. Brigham Young did not find out about it until after it had occured. And the only evidence that says this isn't true has been proven a forgery.
deepthroat30 4 years ago
hmmm all under the age of 7. That makes since you do not get baptized untill you are 8. So it kind of looks bad for the mormons.
Dolly1973 4 years ago
"Shining New Light on the Mountain Meadows Massacre
by Gene Sessions" is a great one to two page read I hope everyone will read before they draw any premature conclusions about Brigham Young, or the events that took place. Gene A. Sessions (Ph.D., Florida State University) is Professor of History, and a Mountain Meadows scholar. He is a member of the Mountain Meadows Associtaion, and has written numerous books.
spenceeng 4 years ago
Can't wait to see it
gdz4321 5 years ago
9-11
socal3377 5 years ago
TIME MAGAZINE
AUGUST 4, 1997 VOL. 150 NO. 5
"Mormons went from being "vilified" to being "venerated," and their combination of family orientation, clean-cut optimism, honesty and pleasant aggressiveness seems increasingly in demand."
"The FBI and cia, drawn by a seemingly incorruptible rectitude, have instituted Mormon-recruitment plans."
socal3377 5 years ago
If the LDS church is a cult as anti-Mormons claim, why does the US government recruit so many Mormons into the FBI and CIA?
socal3377 5 years ago
TIME MAGAZINE
AUGUST 4, 1997 VOL. 150 NO. 5
"although the Mormon faith remains unique, the land in which it was born has come to accept--no, to lionize--its adherents as paragons of the national spirit."
socal3377 5 years ago
What a coward this poster is, he censors video responses. This is the only way he can preserve is one-side lies.
socal3377 5 years ago
YOU are the one "feverishly active", socal. What is it to you if we prove it a fraud--or not? Your testimony must really be weak if you are here instead of doing your home teaching (you only have 10 days left to get it done). It is YOU who can't seem to leave US alone. Ya gotta come here to boost your LDS self esteem, eh?
DangMe2L 5 years ago
What that, you can dish it out but can't take it. I love to do battle with you small minded idiots.
socal3377 5 years ago
Wow!! And what a marvelous work and a wonder you performed here today. Oh! And thanks for the help in assisting us in our battle to show the non's out there what a Mormon cultist is like. High fives to ya, socal!
DangMe2L 5 years ago