Of course we need a federally nationalized health care system. Our manufacturing base has been taxed and regulated into bankruptcy. The country is on the verge of double digit inflation, and many people have lost their life savings or homes in the last round of federal (Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac/ FED) shenanigans. Practically the only businesses that still have any money in them are the hospitals.
What else is there for the politicians to steal from. Of course we need it.
HAHAHA You stupid Union Fucks now you are going to jail. I heard you got charged for beating Kenneth Gladney and the best part is that you provided the evidence against yourselves with this video.
She nevertheless advocated certain instances of coercion, in cases where she considered the parents unfit to decide whether they should bear children: "The undeniably feeble-minded should, indeed, not only be discouraged but prevented from propagating their kind."
Some news stations, such as MSNBC has been quick to imply that their are horrible signs popping up amongst protesters against Obamacare (which they then dubiously then fail to show proof of fact).
In either case, maybe it might be so helpful, if there is a reminder of the many signs and effigy's raised by those who hated Bush which I provide a link to those photo's below compiled by zombietime's blog :
And another point of issue as to why I'm against Obamacare:
Obama has invoked the spectre of Orwellian literature far more than enough. It's like we have a copy of the infamous 2 minutes Hate from 1984. in the book, Emanuel Goldstein face and name was put out as the Enemy of the party, and that any ills of Oceania, was Goldsteins fault. Well in reality, the Liberals still cling to Bush for any issue that happens, 8 months after Obama took office, always Bush and the Rep fault for 1 thing or so
However, the dirty little "secret" is this. And that is that while the Liberals in congress everyday look for their latest trouble to blame on their opponents, the reality is, their still stuck in campaign mode, while they hold a majority in , they could've passed the bill so many times over by now. The problem is, their voters, are no longer just staying quiet and going along, their using their rights to question their reps. and now we see the ugly truth of those like Barney Frank
Great idea liberals, destroy the profits of corporations so more hardworking, taxpaying stockholders can lose their retirement and investments! And that includes unions that have their member's retirement accounts invested in these same "evil" corporations that they're trying to destroy. What nonsense! This isn't healthcare reform the dems are trying to pass, it's social reform to make another generation of the poor and minorities even more enslaved in poverty and dependent on the welfare state.
to put that simply, Liberal social programs idea is to reward someone, no matter whether the person puts real effort into having something, or sits around all day and does nothing, versus someone who goes out, and starts a very successful business (which then turns into the target for left wing attacks for being an "evil big business" for trying to pay off the cost of their product)
Isn't it great to live in America where we have freedom of speech. These 'cherry-picked' clips in this video do not tell the real truth of either side of this issue. SEIU is misleading public opinion. We all, even those who have a different opinion or believe than yours or mine, have the FREEDOM to stand up and speak, even loudly when they think their elected officials are wrong. My hat is off to these 'teabaggers'--God bless them and the United States of America!
haha, Nice propaganda. Universal Health Care good, Protesters bad!!! We get it. As for you fight clip you say its an SEIU member on the ground, other videos on here say the SEIU member is the one who through the punch. idk the truth just wanted to point it out.
Another reason why I'm against Government run healthcare:
If it's so great, why aren't the same Democrat congressional members that are so keen to ram the bill through, not agreeing to the Republican amendment that would force all members of Congress to also have the same Government health care the citizens would have. Why should they then, be allowed to keep their high end health care provided by the U.S. tax payers?
It's specifically in our constitution, that the government can only fund 2 things... guess what, Healthcare ain't one of them. and LLORT why do you even care? you live in canada, it's so great, why aren't you using their system then? why do you have to force your ideals on us? You want to do some good LLORT... how about you go do something useful, like... campaign for doctors without borders or so.
LLORT3... I suggest you read through my Nation's Constitution....
I want you to point out to me, anywhere in it, that states it's the Governments responsibility to pay for Health care... it may be the governments responsibility to pay for health care in your nation of Canada, but not in mine. I should not have to pay, for someone's health care, if their too lazy to get a job. Unable is one thing, lazyness is another.
You know LLORT3.. your a racist your self...because every single time you post and talk about the founding fathers, who were possibly some of the most brilliant men in history. or the GOP it's always "Old White men" or"White racist" with no proof of fact.
I suggest you start reading up on some of the founders' famous quotes. before you open up your idiotic racist mouth again LLORT3
A bunch of colonist, who went against one of the most powerful forces of the time... Fighting for freedom against tyranny and oppressive taxes, having no voice back in Britain... And instead of setting them selves up as a line of nobles and kings, gave ultimate power to the people, and wrote the Constitution and the Bill of Rights, which ultimately, is designed to prevent Government from gaining too much power. That was unheard of in the 1700's.
gamoonbat... your another liberal idiot like LLMORT3, you should join him in liberal loony land ... thus why REPUBLICAN President: Abraham Lincoln and the largely REPUBLICAN congress of 1865-1870 voted in the following amendments
13th: Abolished slavery
14th: Extended Civil Rights and citizenship to those formally denied them.
15th: Prevents any government that is part of the United States from denying a person's right to vote based on "race, color, or previous condition of servitude (slavery)"
studio7manga, you are one glorified leftist idiot. 70% support Obamacare? Who are you fooling? More like 70% support the working class. Instead of writing here, go find a freakin' job and maybe you can get proper insurance. You are a joke.
People who frequent the SEIU website aren't likely to double-check stories, or notice that the supposed SEIU 2000 member at 1:00 in is actually being beaten by a group in SEIU shirts.
They'll just go along like they're told, believing what their masters want them to believe, and go on complicity believing that the government wants the best for them.
Hahaha, it shows the leftists are able to use government property for their get togethers, and right wingers aren't allowed to speak nomatter what. Oh and the right wingers got mad about it. I guess you lefties should just kill them all or detain them or whatever bullshit.
Nope. I just love liberty, and anyone such as yourself who takes their marching orders from someone without thinking for themselves has suspect intelligence.
For example: Your stated Youtube Interests and Hobbies: Bike riding, fishing, guns, and beer. Especially beer.
You would think with those hobbies that you would not be for a political group hell bent on getting rid of guns (evil), beer (bad for health), fishing (cruel to animals), but they do like bikes!
However, it is, what's the word I'm looking for...
Oh, yeah - bullshit.
Someone else already read the bill in its current form, and did a much nicer job of weeding out fact from fiction, so why not have a look for yourself?
Then read the bill (link at the end), and see whose version of what it actually says you accept.
city-data . com / forum / politics-other-controversies / 726716-why-you-should-read-bill-lies . html
Leaving us with roughly zero internal & external investigative organizations and coordination, not to mention a government that has to run things based on income from - what, bake sales?
Why not go for broke? Let's eliminate the police, firefighters, anyone responsible for infrastructure, city planning, etc.
The nation survived for over 150 years without the CIA, FBI or DHS. You could get rid of those services and increase the number of police in the states instead.
As for the IRS. Well let's face it. All that money goes to the Federal Reserve anyway. Let's just eliminate that along with the IRS.
I don't mind the police, firefighters, or city planning. That's all run by the city and accountable to the local citizenry. I don't have to fight with Congress if they do something I don't like.
150 years, yeah... but they sure came in handy during WWII and the Cold War, I'd say. (as the OSS - I know the CIA came after that)
Yeah, they had their share of fuckups, but all in all, I'd rather they were gathering intel than not, you know?
The whole point is to have a federal level investigative body, so that all info across the country gets full coverage. Do you think local police could do as good a job of ferreting out neo-nazis recruiting/joining the military as the FBI could. Doubt it.
The CIA operates well outside the bounds of "intelligence gathering" as we all know. Who's to say it's in our best interests? Hell we even funded Bin Laden when Russia invaded Afghanistan.
Now as for a federal body... I'm not so sure. Your basically duplicating the same services the local police already can do, but much more expensively and less effective.
I mean after all the FBI did miss 9/11 and no one got fired.
Bit, in fairness, who else but bin Laden was crazy enough to take on the Russians and win? :)
Seriously, though, we were pretty much going for whoever we could get to fight the Sovs; if we had just stuck around after it was over, put a little effort into helping rebuild the infrastructure and government and so forth, bL could have been as batshit crazy as he liked, and it wouldn't matter, because the power would have been with the more rational Afghanis.
Yes, but then the military decides to build 4 military bases on holy land in Saudi Arabia and the next thing we know 3,000 people died on 9/11.
Only then did we learn how inept our own foreign policy was. Not to mention some of the ugly truths of some of our federal organizations like the CIA and FBI.
These Senators are not representatives of the people, they are pushers of a Bill that a mojority of the people know will not work. Watch the news and check the blog sites. Most of the people are against this bill however we are not against reform. Why are they pushing the bill as if it is the right thing to do and not listen to the people and say " Yes we need to fix that"????
And it doesn't end there. via the blog moelane . com
"Tim Bishop (D, NY-01) is having something called a health care reform rally on Thursday, at (of all things) SEIUs Hicksville NY offices (1199 Duffy Ave, starts at 1 PM). This is otherwise known as over twenty miles outside the borders of NY-01." So there you have it, the cowards pissed off their citizenry, and now they've gone to hide
Oh the liberal hypocrisy just keeps getting better and better
Democrat Representative Eugene Green (D-Texas) is now making a rule were only members of the 29th district (his district) will be allowed, and they will need Photo ID to be confirmed that they are a 29th district voter.
The hypocrisy of it all.... Rep. Green is AGAINST requiring Photo ID for voter verification in elections to prevent voter fraud!
I hope most of the people who watch this video realize that the last bit of footage is video footage taken from the beating of Kenneth Gladney who is now sueing the SEIU for hat crimes. 6 SEIU representatives arrested. Who are the ones being violent? Just look up the Story.
I don't understand the entire debate. Instead of debating about whether how much gov't health care there should be, etc. shouldn't we first debate whether the gov't can spend any money at all on health care? People keep saying health care is a right. Do they mean it is a right like the right to free speech? I don't either partys position. Can anyone, republican or democrat, point to language in the constitution that justifies this program?
Your parents are already on Medicare, a government run, single payer system, one of the most popular government programs of all time. And you've bought into the propaganda which is only trying to make you fearful.
By the way the end of life consultation was sponsored, among others, by none other than the AARP. Hmm... I wonder why the conservative "commentators" don't mention that... Hmm...
They do mention it. They also mention how the AARP town hall meetings have been going horribly because of it. Also, many doctors won't accept new Medicare or Medicaid patients due to the low payments. "Medicare Advantage," which many seniors enjoy, would be the first insurance to go under the current bill.
Preaching to the choir, here. I was actually speaking in favor of it, not against it. I guess I should have been clear about that - either side could say the same thing.
Actually the conservatives provided ample evidence with every video they themselves post, they act like rabid animals, bring guns to townhall, and threaten others all the time. You need only read the posts in this thread, or watch the video.
Sad. You to a better job of marginalizing yourselves than liberals ever could.
Over 70% of Americans are in favor of reform, don't you read the polls? Never mind don't answer. I suppose you want your health insurance to go up even more under the private system, I know I do, oh boy!
Last time I checked it was the right wingers shooting up the place (countless examples), blowing up government buildings (Mc Veigh), bombing abortion clinics (countless examples), desecrating the constitution (Bush's wiretapping everyone in the country as well as soldiers in Iraq in clear violation of the 4th amendment, as well as countless other violations) and generally trying to deny others their right to be heard (being obnoxious children at the town halls, not allowing others to speak, etc)
Except that a government system doesn't need to make a profit, doesn't need to pay CEO's 100's of millions of dollars, doesn't need to advertise, streamlines paperwork. This leads to a ~3% overhead in Medicare, compared to a ~30% overhead in private insurance. I see which is better. Medicare by the way is one of the most popular government programs of all time.
The private insurance market is why our health care is twice as expensive as any other place in the world & can't cover everyone.
The goverment system doesn't need to make a profit? The average Washington paperpusher makes $100k a year, has federal healthcare, and retires with full benefits.
Secondly, in past administrations Medicare has steadily been taken from (even more under Bush). It's so bad that doctors are beginning to refuse to see medicare patients because they aren't getting paid.
The private insurance doesn't control inflation. Costs are rising because the Federal Reserve prints money out of thin air.
Poor fiscal policy? Clinton raided the Social Security funds to create a goverment "surplus" and that's fine?
The gold standard isn't magic, but it's essential to have some way to keep the goverment from printing money out of thin air which devaules it. Just look to Rome, the Continental Dollar, Germany, or even Zimbabwee for a few examples of what happens when goverment prints money unchecked.
Not to mention the fact the Federal Reserve charges interest on all of that money.
You mentioned Bush, I agreed, I also agree that Clinton was an ass for doing it as well. A shame he was just another center right Dem.
The check is in the hyper inflation that will result if the Fed gets overzealous with printing. This is why we've been able to maintain a moderate but stable rate of inflation (which still happened under the gold standard only at about 1.5%/year instead of the 3% since we went of it) it's all in historic records.
Regardless of their political affliations they are politicians. The plan in itself requires you to trust the goverment not to take out money you put in for your retirement.
There is no check to the Fed's printing. We do not control it. The purchasing power of the dollar has dropped from $1.00 to less than $0.03 in less than a century.
Prices have already risen. As the economy continues to worsen the demand to print more will grow, which will continual to devalue the dollar.
So much for that vigiliance and engagment. I hear social security, medicare, and medicaid will surpass our GDP in 2032. In otherwords we'll have more in entitlements than the nation can produce.
If you don't believe we're on the road to another depression I'm not sure what to say.
Actually, no it's not the GDP it's the federal budget and it's not 2032 either it would be closer to 2055, even by 2100 entitlement spending would be less than 25% of GDP. Get your facts straight.
There is an easy solution to this. Try not to think too hard about what it is.
That, by the way, is one of the most pessimistic estimates. I'm giving the doomsayers a lot of credit on that. More reasonable estimates have it at only 12.5% of GDP or ~65% of current federal revenue.
To me it seems the only practical solution is to move towards public finance of campaigns and disallow all other forms of finance. As much as I hate to have tax money going to some douchebag running for office it's better that they be beholden to the taxpayer rather than some Corporation. So long as they get the proper number of signature on a ballot then they get the money, that way maybe some 3rd party action could be had as well. Who knows though...
Hey, Mike, how many liberal pastors can you name who cheat on their wives, or molest kids, sanction abortion clinic bombing, have protests with "thank god for dead soldiers" signs etc. Your reputation is well deserved.
Unfortunate that a single payer system (like Medicare, one of the most popular government programs of all time) didn't even get debated, but so long as a strong public option and a provision for universal coverage remains in the bill it should be reasonably effective in improving health care quality. As far as reducing costs that will come from collective bargaining power and fiscal discipline, the latter of which will require vigilance.
Good to see the SEIU, about half of whom (1million people) are employed in the health care industry. Golly gee, you'd think they might know something about health care reform.
Cute baseless attacks right wingers. How does it feel to unwittingly be shills for the health insurance industry who basically gets rich from denying sick people coverage and overcharging the rest of us. Way to take the bait. Sad, Pathetic. It's downright unpatriotic how misinformed you guys are right wingers.
Because it was part of Obama's plan to bring part of the Pharma crowd on board, so that they would be fighting with him rather than against him. Simple compromise, whodathunkit...
Those where average Americans, 70-80% of real Americans support reform and don't buy into the crazy conspiracies of the extreme right wing fringe. Death panels? Zero choice? 5 minutes of basic research would tell all but the most insane people that such ideas are pure fabricated propaganda.
So then why then the constant claiming then that people who are against health care, why then do you claim that a clear majority, 51% of Americans, are against health care, and you're telling me their all bought and paid for by some big evil corporation? That is were you logic (or lack there of) fails
Lol, Soros obsession. I guess you guys focus on hims since there are basically just a few billionaires financing most things on the right. Sorry brah, we have actual grassroots on the left.
Geee.. maybe because Bush didn't need to have his hand held by the Teleprompters or DNC every time he went out and spoke, there was only 1 POSSIBLE (not ever 100% confirmed) incident of a Bush Plant, there have been now at least 3 "townhalls" and 1 white house press briefing with Obama Plants.
Except he never wrote his own speeches, but he did use notes *shock*. Never had a townhall without cherry picking supporters, shit all over the constitution (torture, wiretaps, etc) and generally destroyed the economy and the US's standing in the world. But no no, you like him because Limbaugh or similar said he's good. You guys are such hypocrites, totalitarians one moment, paranoid anti-government conspiracy theorists the next. It's really sad to watch.
That' is such bull shit studio, it's not even funny, but what else do you expect from delusional morons who have no other defense than to call avarage americans all sorts of disgusting names, or come up with conspiracies that every single person who's against a plan they support must be in the pocket of some evil corporation...
When will the liberals actually put their brains back in and actually come up with a good idea for once....
Speaking of delusions I suppose you're cowering in fear of the "death panels" & the "commie nazi socialists coming to take away your guns". Speaking of morons, look at yourself, it's pathetic.
As for the point you tried to make, don't make me laugh, understand human psychology and get back to me. It's no fun arguing with the uneducated.
What is an "avarage american"? The ones with the 3rd grade education showing up at townhalls. No wonder you have such a skewed view of the world.
Funny thing is, it's a complete abdication of responsibility to the most idiotic portions of society. I doubt you could even tell me what it was actually about.
Oh, I'll pull the stick out just as soon as you form a rational argument against what you see as evil and cut out the sloganeering and actually think for yourself. I won't hold my breath.
Oh by the way, to answer your question Studio, the "End of life" was a section in the bill that would have seniors, starting at 65, talk to a government doctor for check ups and how to handle any terminal illness and death. The confusion that reins on that was what was fully in it, whether or not it was mandatory, and also the news of a Oregon senior citizen (the state has a state funded health care system) wouldn't pay $4000 for medicine for her cancer, but would pay $100 for assisted suicide
Right I'm sure that's why they called it "death panels" and compared it to Nazi Germany. Tell my Razgriez how does it feel to be associated with duplicitous assholes and the hoards of morons stupid enough to believe them? You must be proud of yourself.
Pretty big claim about Oregon there, go and show me up, produce a link, because I think the reality (if it even exists) is different than what you claim.
Hey asshole - you douchebags had 8 years to get it right and you failed. Why is it you sell out scum bags always cry the most? Go back to you fucking online gaming garbage while the men fix your mess. Fucking idiot.
Ha ha ha.. childish moron... you idiot, democrats have had control congress since '06... so you had 2 years already to "correct" mistakes.... and what did did they do? vote for 2 stimulus that have failed,, a pork laden spending bill. Rammed Cap and tax through the House, which every economist with a brain agrees: will cost even more jobs. and now are hiding from their voters while trying to ram a health care bill through that's awful and take over 1/3 of the economy...
ah but don't worry, you're party is so in touch with the American people.... because every honest citizen loves having their Representative call them "political terrorist", "swastika carriers" and "angry mobs" while at the same time, trying to buy them selves more private jets, after yelling at corporate leaders for owning the same... Oh please keep doing so.. your only going to drive everyone away from your side. Please keep sending the plants out to Democrat/Obama townhalls,
I must admit I enjoy you shit-for-brains penniless GOP supporters when you are in the pissed off minority. You are far less dangerous and much more entertaining. You boobs had 8 years in power and you wrecked the country. Deal with it dip-shit. Remember - you ALWAYS have the option of getting the FUCK out of my country.
I treat the right as they treated me. I didnt leave America because as a Liberal I see my obligation to my country. Right wingers take and take from your society and they cry when the tax bill comes due. You love less government. The nation I want is rare in this world. The nation YOU want is common. Most of Africa for example is a right wing paradise, as are the narco states of Central and South America. It makes sense that you move to Somalia rather than turn the US into New Somalia.
Listen to your self.. your pathetic... You keep on saying how it's right wingers, but blinding your self to your own hypocrisy just proves how foolish you are. Every single welfare program, every Government run system... who in the end flips the bill... every citizen who pays taxes, no matter the reason, sales, property, anything...
But you're so delusional, you hardly even treat the right as they treated you, were as they disagreed with you and let you speak out, you tell them to shut up.
But like I said, I laugh every time I hear the hypocrisy of idiots like you "blame". Always ready to scream and shout at the slightest provocation. But when your guy does the same thing you screamed about, it's a-ok.... Why do you think the Republicans lose congressional control in 06? Since I figure you'll just scream nonsense, I'll answer it for you: It's because the voters got sick and tired of the hypocrisy, so Pelosi and the dems took over and said they would be ethical. but is now corrupt.
I am amazed at the consistency with which right wingers retreat from a fight they know they cant win. They had 8 years at the wheel. Eight years of almost total control of the nation and what do they do? Allow the largest attack against US domestic soil in living memory, declare war on the wrong country, give the rich a $1.3 tax welfare hand out, and slaughter our economy. Why the fuck would anyone bother taking you seriously?
"You mean the same senator who's owned by health insurance?"
you mean like President Obama and his secret meeting with big Pharma? you know, the same meeting he promised he'd allow America to watch? the one that magically happened behind clossed doors and with no cameras? the same style of meeting that Cheney held with Energy corps, and you all SCREAMED about, but are amazingly muted when Obama just did the same thing!
Please don't tell me your one of those "Big Pharma is secretly making us sick" types...
So let's dissect your argument. Because the president isn't perfect we should kill every legislative reform he pushes. Hmm, sorry I'll stick with my logic thanks.
Why not? That's what I keep hearing from people like you, and LLORT, and all the others? your argument boils down to this: It's an "evil" big corporation, so by liberal "logic", they aren't allowed to make a profit. Question what do you need in order to run a business: You need money. to have money, you need to make a profit so you can:
Your statement shows that you don't know much about progressive thought or economics. Allow me to straw man your own position in a similar way, "You know your position basically boils down to 'oh no big evil government gonna eat me!'"
Let me embark on a fools errand and try to educate you on basic economics, profit is what remains after you pay, supplies, employees, etc. All that is called overhead which is subtracted out of gross revenue. You invest profit or give it back to your shareholders.
now let's take what Liberals thinks the world should work and use the healthcare issue for this: Liberalism states, that Everyone should have health care no matter the reason. Whether it's Bob, the guy who can afford health care, but chooses not to have it, Jim who works and pays for health care and lives with in his budget, or Larry, the guy who's form of a job is collecting his welfare check, while paying little to no taxes. while living in a bailed out house he can't afford,
The rest of the developed world has such Liberal healthcare systems, & are economically more competitive that us, largely because they don't have to pay healthcare through companies and those funds can go to more useful means. The cost of healthcare is halved due to natural efficiencies in single payer systems & from the lack of a profit motive. Japan's a perfect example of such a system, as well as much of Europe. But you don't want to hear that do you, Glenn Beck told you and you believe him!
You mean like how Dear leader obama told you your facts? Well unfortunetly.. no... he didn't.
but oh yes the glorious European method.. are we talking say, the Netherlands version, which works extremely well, where 90% of healthcare there is private, and the insurance companies prices are low due to market competition. Or do you mean the U.K. version where if say your Obese, you can't get hip replacement,
oh but let's not forget Oregon which I mentioned, and showed the link of how wonderfully run state run health care is!
You know, the place that'll pay for you to kick your smoking habit, or go to Planned "parenthood" (theirs an oxymoron of a name for an abortion clinic) or your assisted suicide pills, but not Chemotherapy Cancer medicine to stay alive. Which brings me to another liberal hypocrisy point: Liberals LOVE telling you to keep laws off their body, but love putting their laws on yours
I already told you what you would need to actually proof your point, that private insurance wouldn't do the equivalent thing through rescission and that the public option would do something like that. I'll only repeat myself once.
Yes that's why all those countries have better healthcare then us, as ranked by the WHO.
Oh yes rail against more social institutions Raz, so convincing... You're starting to sound like just another butthurt fundie conspiracy nut railing against the modern world.
Question, if those countries are so great Studio.. why haven't you moved to them then? why do you wait for them to show up here in the U.S.? Why do you rail against the insurance companies? Why do you only support a Government take over plan? don't even bother trying to say "Well you can keep your private insurance" because the devil is in the first 20 pages of detail of the health care bill, which states, that should you ever lose your private insurance, you must accept the gov. plan
Because we have democratic institutions that allow the citizens to choose the system they want. Try a less cliche and stupid question next time. Honestly, do you really think that a question like that is intellectually powerful in any way... If yes that's completely sad.
and technically, you're railing against the biggest social institution of all, the majority of citizens who are against Obamacare! 53% now don't want it!
Even if I did misinterpret the Rasmussen Poll (which I didn't) I don't see what's wrong, people like you Studio always give less than truthful "Facts" all the time,
funny thing Studio.. so did I. Remember the case in Oregon? You know the one of the lady denied medication to cure or slow her cancer, which cost 4000, but the state health system says it'll be glad to pay for 100 dollar assisted Suicide pills? The one directly from a Local Oregon news station? hmmm must've been to busy ignoring it and mouthing off like blind fool you are..
"a web-based, not-for-profit, progressive research and information center dedicated to comprehensively monitoring, analyzing, and correcting conservative"(Aka, we don't like what your saying so we're just going to scream your a liar)
Fact number two: From the NYT : Media matters received "more than $2 million in donations from wealthy liberals" and "was developed with help from the newly formed Center for American Progress"
to spell it out for you, Media Matters is a BIASED group, that receives aid from wealthy Liberals, and another Liberal group. which has been documented several times of telling Lies and blatant smear attacks against those the group disagrees with.
actually, there is no reason to even bother giving you one, because your so stuck on stupid, it's not even worth it, because I've given so many reasons and honest concerns (why trust bureaucrats can't even handle 2 Stimulus bills properly, can't handle Cash for Clunkers properly, etc etc) with more money that the U.S. DOES NOT HAVE AND CAN NOT AFFORD. Nor can I trust the fact that it gives 1/6 of the economy over to the Government.
hell It won't matter that I'm honestly telling you right here and now, that yes, there is a need for some form of Reform. , there is more than one solution to reform, and several don't involve a Government take over that would still be very beneficial to the American Citizen. Not to mention the fact that twice, I have listed the information that confirms that the so called 47 Mil uninsured, that the majority can afford it or sign up for gov. progams.
There's no takeover, get your facts straight. You've been wrong about everything else so far. Get educated.
We can certainly afford it, we already spend at least twice as much on our for profit system than any other liberal democracy with their "evil efficient government run universal healthcare systems".
You're quite paranoid by the way.
The rest of your messages was basically impotent rage which I'm not going to respond to.
my God.. I hope you're job doesn't involve being an economic advisory, because frankly you can't seem to understand the idea of a 1 TRILLION+ DOLLAR DEFICIT.
Here let me explain what that means... that means, we've spent 1 Trillion dollars or more, of money the Government DOES NOT HAVE. Government does not produce it's own money, they can only draw money from the Tax payers. So what happens when you don't have the money? Well then the Government has to raise taxes and cut services.
I don't know.. I think most people with common sense would think "Why trust a government that can't handle over 800 Billion dollars correctly. or the cash For clunkers program" as a reasonable concern
Most seem to be concerned also about a white house run by Cronies, (Tom Daschle is found out, that despite dropping out of HHS position due to his tax problem, is still, Lobbying for the Health care industry, to the government, funny thought Obama said no to lobbyist...)
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Coercive unions are criminal, and people that solicit/aid and abet/initiate them should be charged as such.
Morgan Reynolds, Power and Privilege: Labor Unions in America
misesDOTorgFSresourcesFS4962
qwertypoiu4321 1 year ago
hahah that was a funny video they didnt play the full clip of the sceiu attacking that that guy nice bit of propaganda here though
thomas242007 1 year ago 2
Of course we need a federally nationalized health care system. Our manufacturing base has been taxed and regulated into bankruptcy. The country is on the verge of double digit inflation, and many people have lost their life savings or homes in the last round of federal (Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac/ FED) shenanigans. Practically the only businesses that still have any money in them are the hospitals.
What else is there for the politicians to steal from. Of course we need it.
DrCruel 2 years ago
SEIU = gutless crybaby ignorant pussies
xyberfunk 2 years ago
SEIU morons still have this video up? It will look great in court when they send your thugs to prison.
wssaction 2 years ago
HAHAHA You stupid Union Fucks now you are going to jail. I heard you got charged for beating Kenneth Gladney and the best part is that you provided the evidence against yourselves with this video.
Stupid Union fucks go Fuck yourself and Obama.
CoyoteTwelve 2 years ago
They used a clip from when one of their guys attacked a protester and tried to spin it in their favor. LMAO. Sad thing is liberals will buy it.
JVRottweil 2 years ago 3
lol
desmondbeem1988 2 years ago
so that last clip...is that admitting your members assaulted ken gladney?.....
careful...this is the biggest beleivers in self defense on the planet, mob tacktics will backfire...
don't start nothin' there won't be nothin'
jfnowland 2 years ago
Go fuck yourselves SEIU. You are a bunch of Union thug shit eaters who live with their moms.
CoyoteTwelve 2 years ago 6
SEIU - Force of Persuasion turns to Persuasion of Force
guinnessman1970 2 years ago
This Video is Bullshit.
Aeschylus 2 years ago
More on Margaret Sanger:
She nevertheless advocated certain instances of coercion, in cases where she considered the parents unfit to decide whether they should bear children: "The undeniably feeble-minded should, indeed, not only be discouraged but prevented from propagating their kind."
Razgriez1 2 years ago
Another point of liberal hypocrisy,
Some news stations, such as MSNBC has been quick to imply that their are horrible signs popping up amongst protesters against Obamacare (which they then dubiously then fail to show proof of fact).
In either case, maybe it might be so helpful, if there is a reminder of the many signs and effigy's raised by those who hated Bush which I provide a link to those photo's below compiled by zombietime's blog :
zombie time. com /zom blog / ? p = 621
Razgriez1 2 years ago
And another point of issue as to why I'm against Obamacare:
Obama has invoked the spectre of Orwellian literature far more than enough. It's like we have a copy of the infamous 2 minutes Hate from 1984. in the book, Emanuel Goldstein face and name was put out as the Enemy of the party, and that any ills of Oceania, was Goldsteins fault. Well in reality, the Liberals still cling to Bush for any issue that happens, 8 months after Obama took office, always Bush and the Rep fault for 1 thing or so
Razgriez1 2 years ago
However, the dirty little "secret" is this. And that is that while the Liberals in congress everyday look for their latest trouble to blame on their opponents, the reality is, their still stuck in campaign mode, while they hold a majority in , they could've passed the bill so many times over by now. The problem is, their voters, are no longer just staying quiet and going along, their using their rights to question their reps. and now we see the ugly truth of those like Barney Frank
Razgriez1 2 years ago
I'll re-post this, since the first didn't show up: copy and paste this title:
(1 of 3) Exposed: How SEIU's "Corporate Campaign" Used Clinton's Department of Labor
and learn more about how SEIU really operates. I donate my money to their opponents. SEIU can piss off.
ruinedart 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Elston McCowan set the record straight August 13th in an interview on KTRS radio.
gamoonbat 2 years ago
Elston McCowan set the record straight August 13th in an interview on KTRS radio.
gamoonbat 2 years ago
Great idea liberals, destroy the profits of corporations so more hardworking, taxpaying stockholders can lose their retirement and investments! And that includes unions that have their member's retirement accounts invested in these same "evil" corporations that they're trying to destroy. What nonsense! This isn't healthcare reform the dems are trying to pass, it's social reform to make another generation of the poor and minorities even more enslaved in poverty and dependent on the welfare state.
OneVoice8050 2 years ago
to put that simply, Liberal social programs idea is to reward someone, no matter whether the person puts real effort into having something, or sits around all day and does nothing, versus someone who goes out, and starts a very successful business (which then turns into the target for left wing attacks for being an "evil big business" for trying to pay off the cost of their product)
Razgriez1 2 years ago
Isn't it great to live in America where we have freedom of speech. These 'cherry-picked' clips in this video do not tell the real truth of either side of this issue. SEIU is misleading public opinion. We all, even those who have a different opinion or believe than yours or mine, have the FREEDOM to stand up and speak, even loudly when they think their elected officials are wrong. My hat is off to these 'teabaggers'--God bless them and the United States of America!
iheartfreedom2 2 years ago
NO SOCIALEST NOBAMA
MoonPotato 2 years ago
haha, Nice propaganda. Universal Health Care good, Protesters bad!!! We get it. As for you fight clip you say its an SEIU member on the ground, other videos on here say the SEIU member is the one who through the punch. idk the truth just wanted to point it out.
thefunnyman1500 2 years ago
Another reason why I'm against Government run healthcare:
If it's so great, why aren't the same Democrat congressional members that are so keen to ram the bill through, not agreeing to the Republican amendment that would force all members of Congress to also have the same Government health care the citizens would have. Why should they then, be allowed to keep their high end health care provided by the U.S. tax payers?
Razgriez1 2 years ago
Just stopping by to say my daily "Go Fuck Yourself SEIU" So go fuck yourselves you union scumbags
CoyoteTwelve 2 years ago 2
it is a govt's responsibility to provide healthcare for all
LLORT3 2 years ago
No it's not
It's specifically in our constitution, that the government can only fund 2 things... guess what, Healthcare ain't one of them. and LLORT why do you even care? you live in canada, it's so great, why aren't you using their system then? why do you have to force your ideals on us? You want to do some good LLORT... how about you go do something useful, like... campaign for doctors without borders or so.
Razgriez1 2 years ago
LLORT3... I suggest you read through my Nation's Constitution....
I want you to point out to me, anywhere in it, that states it's the Governments responsibility to pay for Health care... it may be the governments responsibility to pay for health care in your nation of Canada, but not in mine. I should not have to pay, for someone's health care, if their too lazy to get a job. Unable is one thing, lazyness is another.
Razgriez1 2 years ago 2
i don't really care about your constitution because a lot of it is outdated
your country is backwards because it relies on old white men's vision of a country that does not have technology
also i think the main reason for opposition to healthcare is white supremacy
LLORT3 2 years ago
You know LLORT3.. your a racist your self...because every single time you post and talk about the founding fathers, who were possibly some of the most brilliant men in history. or the GOP it's always "Old White men" or"White racist" with no proof of fact.
I suggest you start reading up on some of the founders' famous quotes. before you open up your idiotic racist mouth again LLORT3
Razgriez1 2 years ago
i think the old white males who founded the country were not very progressive
they were pro-slavery
i am very cynical when it comes to the history of USA
LLORT3 2 years ago
Great then... then don't move here.... go pester your own government for hand outs
Razgriez1 2 years ago
oh and one other thing LLORT...
A bunch of colonist, who went against one of the most powerful forces of the time... Fighting for freedom against tyranny and oppressive taxes, having no voice back in Britain... And instead of setting them selves up as a line of nobles and kings, gave ultimate power to the people, and wrote the Constitution and the Bill of Rights, which ultimately, is designed to prevent Government from gaining too much power. That was unheard of in the 1700's.
Razgriez1 2 years ago
Exactly what the Tea Party wants to take us back to, what the founding fathers originally intended in terms of voting rights.
gamoonbat 2 years ago
gamoonbat... your another liberal idiot like LLMORT3, you should join him in liberal loony land ... thus why REPUBLICAN President: Abraham Lincoln and the largely REPUBLICAN congress of 1865-1870 voted in the following amendments
13th: Abolished slavery
14th: Extended Civil Rights and citizenship to those formally denied them.
15th: Prevents any government that is part of the United States from denying a person's right to vote based on "race, color, or previous condition of servitude (slavery)"
Razgriez1 2 years ago
true, the teabaggers want to take usa back to the time of slavery and no rights for minorities
LLORT3 2 years ago
You knew where you were then.
Goils were goils and men were men.
gamoonbat 2 years ago
and blacks were slaves :)
LLORT3 2 years ago
studio7manga, you are one glorified leftist idiot. 70% support Obamacare? Who are you fooling? More like 70% support the working class. Instead of writing here, go find a freakin' job and maybe you can get proper insurance. You are a joke.
robday1960 2 years ago
SEIU is infested with scumbags. Continue violating our first amendment rights and we will continue with our second amendment.
robday1960 2 years ago
funny how you use the video of YOUR people attacking a Teabagger and claiming it was them attacking you, nice job
PhauxTheFox 2 years ago 4
Is Ken Gladney a Teabagger or a Teabaggee?
gamoonbat 2 years ago
You are part of Obama's network of Mindless Brownshirts and are nothing more than a bunch of thugs. Shame on you!
NaderRaider 2 years ago
You are wrong. The SEIU were wearing blue shirts and the Teabaggers were wearing brown shirts.
gamoonbat 2 years ago
Hilarious!!
SEIU is promoting this video on their website. Do they think no one will watch it on youtube to see the 2 star rating and negative comments..
Dumbass Union
r32rainman 2 years ago
People who frequent the SEIU website aren't likely to double-check stories, or notice that the supposed SEIU 2000 member at 1:00 in is actually being beaten by a group in SEIU shirts.
They'll just go along like they're told, believing what their masters want them to believe, and go on complicity believing that the government wants the best for them.
AreThereNoMoreNames 2 years ago
Oh and the final video shows a union leftist attacking a "teabagger". Your video is made of pure fail.
spraynpray 2 years ago
Hahaha, it shows the leftists are able to use government property for their get togethers, and right wingers aren't allowed to speak nomatter what. Oh and the right wingers got mad about it. I guess you lefties should just kill them all or detain them or whatever bullshit.
spraynpray 2 years ago
SEIU = Communist Street Thugs!
Live free or die!
Don't Tread On Me!
kepler1000 2 years ago
YOU=Tool of corporate America
socomcorky 2 years ago
Nope. I just love liberty, and anyone such as yourself who takes their marching orders from someone without thinking for themselves has suspect intelligence.
For example: Your stated Youtube Interests and Hobbies: Bike riding, fishing, guns, and beer. Especially beer.
You would think with those hobbies that you would not be for a political group hell bent on getting rid of guns (evil), beer (bad for health), fishing (cruel to animals), but they do like bikes!
Thus...proof
YOU = STUPID
kepler1000 2 years ago
Uh, just so you know, it was a _black_ guy who called the other one a Ni***.
A bit inappropriate, sure, but I don't think one black guy calling another a N**** could really qualify as racism.
Just saying...
nightflyer28 2 years ago
Seriously, have a look. Hold off on the preconceptions, which I know is tough regardless of which side you support.
I think we all want to have the facts on our side, right?
nightflyer28 2 years ago
Have a look at the link I left here re: what's being said about this bill vs actual bill contents. Worth a look.
nightflyer28 2 years ago
cGnS -
I've seen this one floating around everywhere.
However, it is, what's the word I'm looking for...
Oh, yeah - bullshit.
Someone else already read the bill in its current form, and did a much nicer job of weeding out fact from fiction, so why not have a look for yourself?
Then read the bill (link at the end), and see whose version of what it actually says you accept.
city-data . com / forum / politics-other-controversies / 726716-why-you-should-read-bill-lies . html
nightflyer28 2 years ago
"eliminate the CIA, FBI, DHS, and IRS."
And this would accomplish... what?
Leaving us with roughly zero internal & external investigative organizations and coordination, not to mention a government that has to run things based on income from - what, bake sales?
Why not go for broke? Let's eliminate the police, firefighters, anyone responsible for infrastructure, city planning, etc.
After all, they're gov't-run programs, too.
nightflyer28 2 years ago
The nation survived for over 150 years without the CIA, FBI or DHS. You could get rid of those services and increase the number of police in the states instead.
As for the IRS. Well let's face it. All that money goes to the Federal Reserve anyway. Let's just eliminate that along with the IRS.
I don't mind the police, firefighters, or city planning. That's all run by the city and accountable to the local citizenry. I don't have to fight with Congress if they do something I don't like.
Kapan60 2 years ago
150 years, yeah... but they sure came in handy during WWII and the Cold War, I'd say. (as the OSS - I know the CIA came after that)
Yeah, they had their share of fuckups, but all in all, I'd rather they were gathering intel than not, you know?
The whole point is to have a federal level investigative body, so that all info across the country gets full coverage. Do you think local police could do as good a job of ferreting out neo-nazis recruiting/joining the military as the FBI could. Doubt it.
nightflyer28 2 years ago
The CIA operates well outside the bounds of "intelligence gathering" as we all know. Who's to say it's in our best interests? Hell we even funded Bin Laden when Russia invaded Afghanistan.
Now as for a federal body... I'm not so sure. Your basically duplicating the same services the local police already can do, but much more expensively and less effective.
I mean after all the FBI did miss 9/11 and no one got fired.
Kapan60 2 years ago
Like I said, their share of fuckups...
Bit, in fairness, who else but bin Laden was crazy enough to take on the Russians and win? :)
Seriously, though, we were pretty much going for whoever we could get to fight the Sovs; if we had just stuck around after it was over, put a little effort into helping rebuild the infrastructure and government and so forth, bL could have been as batshit crazy as he liked, and it wouldn't matter, because the power would have been with the more rational Afghanis.
nightflyer28 2 years ago
Yes, but then the military decides to build 4 military bases on holy land in Saudi Arabia and the next thing we know 3,000 people died on 9/11.
Only then did we learn how inept our own foreign policy was. Not to mention some of the ugly truths of some of our federal organizations like the CIA and FBI.
Kapan60 2 years ago
I like how you included the SEIU assault of a peaceful protester handing out "Don't Tread on Me" flags.
seraphicendeavor 2 years ago 2
These Senators are not representatives of the people, they are pushers of a Bill that a mojority of the people know will not work. Watch the news and check the blog sites. Most of the people are against this bill however we are not against reform. Why are they pushing the bill as if it is the right thing to do and not listen to the people and say " Yes we need to fix that"????
bulldogrbc1 2 years ago
And it doesn't end there. via the blog moelane . com
"Tim Bishop (D, NY-01) is having something called a health care reform rally on Thursday, at (of all things) SEIUs Hicksville NY offices (1199 Duffy Ave, starts at 1 PM). This is otherwise known as over twenty miles outside the borders of NY-01." So there you have it, the cowards pissed off their citizenry, and now they've gone to hide
Razgriez1 2 years ago
Oh the liberal hypocrisy just keeps getting better and better
Democrat Representative Eugene Green (D-Texas) is now making a rule were only members of the 29th district (his district) will be allowed, and they will need Photo ID to be confirmed that they are a 29th district voter.
The hypocrisy of it all.... Rep. Green is AGAINST requiring Photo ID for voter verification in elections to prevent voter fraud!
Razgriez1 2 years ago
I hope most of the people who watch this video realize that the last bit of footage is video footage taken from the beating of Kenneth Gladney who is now sueing the SEIU for hat crimes. 6 SEIU representatives arrested. Who are the ones being violent? Just look up the Story.
bulldogrbc1 2 years ago
I don't understand the entire debate. Instead of debating about whether how much gov't health care there should be, etc. shouldn't we first debate whether the gov't can spend any money at all on health care? People keep saying health care is a right. Do they mean it is a right like the right to free speech? I don't either partys position. Can anyone, republican or democrat, point to language in the constitution that justifies this program?
Mambu152 2 years ago
Your parents are already on Medicare, a government run, single payer system, one of the most popular government programs of all time. And you've bought into the propaganda which is only trying to make you fearful.
By the way the end of life consultation was sponsored, among others, by none other than the AARP. Hmm... I wonder why the conservative "commentators" don't mention that... Hmm...
studio7manga 2 years ago
They do mention it. They also mention how the AARP town hall meetings have been going horribly because of it. Also, many doctors won't accept new Medicare or Medicaid patients due to the low payments. "Medicare Advantage," which many seniors enjoy, would be the first insurance to go under the current bill.
seraphicendeavor 2 years ago
Payment issues with Medicare and insane conspiracy theories pushed onto gullible people are two different matters.
studio7manga 2 years ago
Preaching to the choir, here. I was actually speaking in favor of it, not against it. I guess I should have been clear about that - either side could say the same thing.
nightflyer28 2 years ago
Actually the conservatives provided ample evidence with every video they themselves post, they act like rabid animals, bring guns to townhall, and threaten others all the time. You need only read the posts in this thread, or watch the video.
Sad. You to a better job of marginalizing yourselves than liberals ever could.
studio7manga 2 years ago
Over 70% of Americans are in favor of reform, don't you read the polls? Never mind don't answer. I suppose you want your health insurance to go up even more under the private system, I know I do, oh boy!
studio7manga 2 years ago
Last time I checked it was the right wingers shooting up the place (countless examples), blowing up government buildings (Mc Veigh), bombing abortion clinics (countless examples), desecrating the constitution (Bush's wiretapping everyone in the country as well as soldiers in Iraq in clear violation of the 4th amendment, as well as countless other violations) and generally trying to deny others their right to be heard (being obnoxious children at the town halls, not allowing others to speak, etc)
studio7manga 2 years ago
Except that a government system doesn't need to make a profit, doesn't need to pay CEO's 100's of millions of dollars, doesn't need to advertise, streamlines paperwork. This leads to a ~3% overhead in Medicare, compared to a ~30% overhead in private insurance. I see which is better. Medicare by the way is one of the most popular government programs of all time.
The private insurance market is why our health care is twice as expensive as any other place in the world & can't cover everyone.
studio7manga 2 years ago
The goverment system doesn't need to make a profit? The average Washington paperpusher makes $100k a year, has federal healthcare, and retires with full benefits.
Secondly, in past administrations Medicare has steadily been taken from (even more under Bush). It's so bad that doctors are beginning to refuse to see medicare patients because they aren't getting paid.
The private insurance doesn't control inflation. Costs are rising because the Federal Reserve prints money out of thin air.
Kapan60 2 years ago
Congratulations, you've conflated profit with paychecks and benefits, way to go Einstein.
So poor fiscal policy of right wing admins is somehow an argument against health care reform? Hmm, not a very rational argument.
Gold isn't magic, and if the US did go back on to that standard there wouldn't be enough liquidity in the market.
studio7manga 2 years ago
Poor fiscal policy? Clinton raided the Social Security funds to create a goverment "surplus" and that's fine?
The gold standard isn't magic, but it's essential to have some way to keep the goverment from printing money out of thin air which devaules it. Just look to Rome, the Continental Dollar, Germany, or even Zimbabwee for a few examples of what happens when goverment prints money unchecked.
Not to mention the fact the Federal Reserve charges interest on all of that money.
Kapan60 2 years ago
You mentioned Bush, I agreed, I also agree that Clinton was an ass for doing it as well. A shame he was just another center right Dem.
The check is in the hyper inflation that will result if the Fed gets overzealous with printing. This is why we've been able to maintain a moderate but stable rate of inflation (which still happened under the gold standard only at about 1.5%/year instead of the 3% since we went of it) it's all in historic records.
studio7manga 2 years ago
Regardless of their political affliations they are politicians. The plan in itself requires you to trust the goverment not to take out money you put in for your retirement.
There is no check to the Fed's printing. We do not control it. The purchasing power of the dollar has dropped from $1.00 to less than $0.03 in less than a century.
Prices have already risen. As the economy continues to worsen the demand to print more will grow, which will continual to devalue the dollar.
Kapan60 2 years ago
The people are sovereign, and no it doesn't require trust, it requires vigilance and engagement in politics, not paranoia and detachment.
Yeah, any day now, Jones & Paul have been telling me the end is nigh for 30 years now...
studio7manga 2 years ago
So much for that vigiliance and engagment. I hear social security, medicare, and medicaid will surpass our GDP in 2032. In otherwords we'll have more in entitlements than the nation can produce.
If you don't believe we're on the road to another depression I'm not sure what to say.
Kapan60 2 years ago
You are being lied to.
socomcorky 2 years ago
Lol, please your not relying on the goverment to tell the truth are you?
Kapan60 2 years ago
You are = you're
I think we need to improve our educational system too!
socomcorky 2 years ago
Actually, no it's not the GDP it's the federal budget and it's not 2032 either it would be closer to 2055, even by 2100 entitlement spending would be less than 25% of GDP. Get your facts straight.
There is an easy solution to this. Try not to think too hard about what it is.
studio7manga 2 years ago
I got it. We'll print more money out of thin air!
Kapan60 2 years ago
Wrong.
studio7manga 2 years ago
That, by the way, is one of the most pessimistic estimates. I'm giving the doomsayers a lot of credit on that. More reasonable estimates have it at only 12.5% of GDP or ~65% of current federal revenue.
studio7manga 2 years ago
How can you even support that with taxes at nearly 30% of income? Not to mention what crap & tax, banker bailouts, etc will do.
Kapan60 2 years ago
Look towards the perverse effect corporate finance of elections has on our democracy, I see an easy solution...
studio7manga 2 years ago
Personally I don't feel corporations should be involved in the election process. I'm not sure why we allow that at all.
I disagreed with a lot of Reagenomics as well.
Kapan60 2 years ago
To me it seems the only practical solution is to move towards public finance of campaigns and disallow all other forms of finance. As much as I hate to have tax money going to some douchebag running for office it's better that they be beholden to the taxpayer rather than some Corporation. So long as they get the proper number of signature on a ballot then they get the money, that way maybe some 3rd party action could be had as well. Who knows though...
studio7manga 2 years ago
Hey, Mike, how many liberal pastors can you name who cheat on their wives, or molest kids, sanction abortion clinic bombing, have protests with "thank god for dead soldiers" signs etc. Your reputation is well deserved.
studio7manga 2 years ago
Unfortunate that a single payer system (like Medicare, one of the most popular government programs of all time) didn't even get debated, but so long as a strong public option and a provision for universal coverage remains in the bill it should be reasonably effective in improving health care quality. As far as reducing costs that will come from collective bargaining power and fiscal discipline, the latter of which will require vigilance.
studio7manga 2 years ago
Good to see the SEIU, about half of whom (1million people) are employed in the health care industry. Golly gee, you'd think they might know something about health care reform.
Cute baseless attacks right wingers. How does it feel to unwittingly be shills for the health insurance industry who basically gets rich from denying sick people coverage and overcharging the rest of us. Way to take the bait. Sad, Pathetic. It's downright unpatriotic how misinformed you guys are right wingers.
studio7manga 2 years ago
Then why have some insurance companies, and the drug industry struck deals with democrats in congress?
Or how about the "average americans" at Obama town halls. let's take the 3 lucky questioners from Obama's july town hall
oh wait, that's right, 2 of the 3, Debbie Smith, and Jeff Rosenbaum, work with HCAN, which lobby's $40mil a year, and is funded by George Soros
how about the SEIU member who's "Question" was "What can I do, as a member of the union, to help you with your reform bill?"
Razgriez1 2 years ago
Because it was part of Obama's plan to bring part of the Pharma crowd on board, so that they would be fighting with him rather than against him. Simple compromise, whodathunkit...
Those where average Americans, 70-80% of real Americans support reform and don't buy into the crazy conspiracies of the extreme right wing fringe. Death panels? Zero choice? 5 minutes of basic research would tell all but the most insane people that such ideas are pure fabricated propaganda.
studio7manga 2 years ago
So then why then the constant claiming then that people who are against health care, why then do you claim that a clear majority, 51% of Americans, are against health care, and you're telling me their all bought and paid for by some big evil corporation? That is were you logic (or lack there of) fails
Razgriez1 2 years ago
Way to make up stuff out of thin air, try again.
studio7manga 2 years ago
Oh wait, how about the March one, that wasn't Astroturfed with DNC plants, right? WRONG! the lucky 5 questioners were:
Linda Bock-card carrying member of the SEIU
Carlos Del Toro-'07 Democrat VA House of delegates candidate who lost, and in 08, wrote an Op-ed supporting Obama
Tom Sawner who's question was: "I was honored to serve on your education platform committee." (very tough question)
Bonnee Breese- AFT union and PA for Obama Facebook member
Sergio Salmeron: DNC employee and blogger
Razgriez1 2 years ago
Lol, Soros obsession. I guess you guys focus on hims since there are basically just a few billionaires financing most things on the right. Sorry brah, we have actual grassroots on the left.
studio7manga 2 years ago
Funny I never heard you crying about Bush's meetings.
studio7manga 2 years ago
Geee.. maybe because Bush didn't need to have his hand held by the Teleprompters or DNC every time he went out and spoke, there was only 1 POSSIBLE (not ever 100% confirmed) incident of a Bush Plant, there have been now at least 3 "townhalls" and 1 white house press briefing with Obama Plants.
Razgriez1 2 years ago
Except he never wrote his own speeches, but he did use notes *shock*. Never had a townhall without cherry picking supporters, shit all over the constitution (torture, wiretaps, etc) and generally destroyed the economy and the US's standing in the world. But no no, you like him because Limbaugh or similar said he's good. You guys are such hypocrites, totalitarians one moment, paranoid anti-government conspiracy theorists the next. It's really sad to watch.
Try thinking for yourself for once.
studio7manga 2 years ago
Thank you studio!
socomcorky 2 years ago
No problem.
studio7manga 2 years ago
This is scary. I never thought people in my country would act like this. I bet somebody in Germany felt like this in 1930.
socomcorky 2 years ago
The same basic forces are at work. Yeah.. Though for different aims. It's basic tribalism, emotion over reason, safety in numbers type bullshit.
studio7manga 2 years ago
That' is such bull shit studio, it's not even funny, but what else do you expect from delusional morons who have no other defense than to call avarage americans all sorts of disgusting names, or come up with conspiracies that every single person who's against a plan they support must be in the pocket of some evil corporation...
When will the liberals actually put their brains back in and actually come up with a good idea for once....
Razgriez1 2 years ago
Speaking of delusions I suppose you're cowering in fear of the "death panels" & the "commie nazi socialists coming to take away your guns". Speaking of morons, look at yourself, it's pathetic.
As for the point you tried to make, don't make me laugh, understand human psychology and get back to me. It's no fun arguing with the uneducated.
What is an "avarage american"? The ones with the 3rd grade education showing up at townhalls. No wonder you have such a skewed view of the world.
Nuance, son.
studio7manga 2 years ago
Funny thing, they removed the "End of life Panels" finally from the bill...
Oh and studio... please pull the snob stick out of your ass...
Razgriez1 2 years ago
Funny thing is, it's a complete abdication of responsibility to the most idiotic portions of society. I doubt you could even tell me what it was actually about.
Oh, I'll pull the stick out just as soon as you form a rational argument against what you see as evil and cut out the sloganeering and actually think for yourself. I won't hold my breath.
Remember thumbs down means your right. Lol.
studio7manga 2 years ago
Right then... you keep thinking that... I don't need to waste my breath then with someone stuck on stupid...
Razgriez1 2 years ago
Oh by the way, to answer your question Studio, the "End of life" was a section in the bill that would have seniors, starting at 65, talk to a government doctor for check ups and how to handle any terminal illness and death. The confusion that reins on that was what was fully in it, whether or not it was mandatory, and also the news of a Oregon senior citizen (the state has a state funded health care system) wouldn't pay $4000 for medicine for her cancer, but would pay $100 for assisted suicide
Razgriez1 2 years ago
Right I'm sure that's why they called it "death panels" and compared it to Nazi Germany. Tell my Razgriez how does it feel to be associated with duplicitous assholes and the hoards of morons stupid enough to believe them? You must be proud of yourself.
Pretty big claim about Oregon there, go and show me up, produce a link, because I think the reality (if it even exists) is different than what you claim.
studio7manga 2 years ago
straight from KATU news in Oregon... katu . com / news / 26119539 . html ? video = YHI&t = a
Yea... must suck when you got ACTUAL FACTS against you asshole....
Razgriez1 2 years ago
Hey asshole - you douchebags had 8 years to get it right and you failed. Why is it you sell out scum bags always cry the most? Go back to you fucking online gaming garbage while the men fix your mess. Fucking idiot.
BlameRepublicans 2 years ago
Ha ha ha.. childish moron... you idiot, democrats have had control congress since '06... so you had 2 years already to "correct" mistakes.... and what did did they do? vote for 2 stimulus that have failed,, a pork laden spending bill. Rammed Cap and tax through the House, which every economist with a brain agrees: will cost even more jobs. and now are hiding from their voters while trying to ram a health care bill through that's awful and take over 1/3 of the economy...
Razgriez1 2 years ago
ah but don't worry, you're party is so in touch with the American people.... because every honest citizen loves having their Representative call them "political terrorist", "swastika carriers" and "angry mobs" while at the same time, trying to buy them selves more private jets, after yelling at corporate leaders for owning the same... Oh please keep doing so.. your only going to drive everyone away from your side. Please keep sending the plants out to Democrat/Obama townhalls,
Razgriez1 2 years ago
I must admit I enjoy you shit-for-brains penniless GOP supporters when you are in the pissed off minority. You are far less dangerous and much more entertaining. You boobs had 8 years in power and you wrecked the country. Deal with it dip-shit. Remember - you ALWAYS have the option of getting the FUCK out of my country.
BlameRepublicans 2 years ago
I so love the hypocrisy of the left, they get all bitchy when their in the wrong
Now: "oh why don't you leave!"
then: "Whaaah I'm going move to a more liberal country because Bush won! (Why didn't you?)
Now: "you crazy right wingers should just shut up and get out of the way, you angry mobs"
then: "Dissent is patriotic, Bush HITLER, hey let's silence conservative speakers"
Now: "Hey it's perfectly ok that Obama is having secret meetings with big Pharma
then: "AHH SECRET CHENEY AND ENERGY MEETING
Razgriez1 2 years ago
I treat the right as they treated me. I didnt leave America because as a Liberal I see my obligation to my country. Right wingers take and take from your society and they cry when the tax bill comes due. You love less government. The nation I want is rare in this world. The nation YOU want is common. Most of Africa for example is a right wing paradise, as are the narco states of Central and South America. It makes sense that you move to Somalia rather than turn the US into New Somalia.
BlameRepublicans 2 years ago
Listen to your self.. your pathetic... You keep on saying how it's right wingers, but blinding your self to your own hypocrisy just proves how foolish you are. Every single welfare program, every Government run system... who in the end flips the bill... every citizen who pays taxes, no matter the reason, sales, property, anything...
But you're so delusional, you hardly even treat the right as they treated you, were as they disagreed with you and let you speak out, you tell them to shut up.
Razgriez1 2 years ago
But like I said, I laugh every time I hear the hypocrisy of idiots like you "blame". Always ready to scream and shout at the slightest provocation. But when your guy does the same thing you screamed about, it's a-ok.... Why do you think the Republicans lose congressional control in 06? Since I figure you'll just scream nonsense, I'll answer it for you: It's because the voters got sick and tired of the hypocrisy, so Pelosi and the dems took over and said they would be ethical. but is now corrupt.
Razgriez1 2 years ago
I am amazed at the consistency with which right wingers retreat from a fight they know they cant win. They had 8 years at the wheel. Eight years of almost total control of the nation and what do they do? Allow the largest attack against US domestic soil in living memory, declare war on the wrong country, give the rich a $1.3 tax welfare hand out, and slaughter our economy. Why the fuck would anyone bother taking you seriously?
BlameRepublicans 2 years ago
Way to go, now all you have to do is show that the public option would do the same thing. Good luck.
studio7manga 2 years ago
You mean the same public option that Senator Kent Conrad (D-ND) says is dead?
Razgriez1 2 years ago
You mean the same senator who's owned by health insurance?
The House progressive caucus has already stated many times it won't vote for anything that doesn't have it. The bill is going nowhere without them.
studio7manga 2 years ago
"You mean the same senator who's owned by health insurance?"
you mean like President Obama and his secret meeting with big Pharma? you know, the same meeting he promised he'd allow America to watch? the one that magically happened behind clossed doors and with no cameras? the same style of meeting that Cheney held with Energy corps, and you all SCREAMED about, but are amazingly muted when Obama just did the same thing!
Razgriez1 2 years ago
Please don't tell me your one of those "Big Pharma is secretly making us sick" types...
So let's dissect your argument. Because the president isn't perfect we should kill every legislative reform he pushes. Hmm, sorry I'll stick with my logic thanks.
studio7manga 2 years ago
Why not? That's what I keep hearing from people like you, and LLORT, and all the others? your argument boils down to this: It's an "evil" big corporation, so by liberal "logic", they aren't allowed to make a profit. Question what do you need in order to run a business: You need money. to have money, you need to make a profit so you can:
-pay for supplies
-pay your employees and your self
-pay for taxes/electricity,/rent/water/ etc etc
-have funds ready for slow business
Razgriez1 2 years ago
Your statement shows that you don't know much about progressive thought or economics. Allow me to straw man your own position in a similar way, "You know your position basically boils down to 'oh no big evil government gonna eat me!'"
Let me embark on a fools errand and try to educate you on basic economics, profit is what remains after you pay, supplies, employees, etc. All that is called overhead which is subtracted out of gross revenue. You invest profit or give it back to your shareholders.
studio7manga 2 years ago
now let's take what Liberals thinks the world should work and use the healthcare issue for this: Liberalism states, that Everyone should have health care no matter the reason. Whether it's Bob, the guy who can afford health care, but chooses not to have it, Jim who works and pays for health care and lives with in his budget, or Larry, the guy who's form of a job is collecting his welfare check, while paying little to no taxes. while living in a bailed out house he can't afford,
Razgriez1 2 years ago
The rest of the developed world has such Liberal healthcare systems, & are economically more competitive that us, largely because they don't have to pay healthcare through companies and those funds can go to more useful means. The cost of healthcare is halved due to natural efficiencies in single payer systems & from the lack of a profit motive. Japan's a perfect example of such a system, as well as much of Europe. But you don't want to hear that do you, Glenn Beck told you and you believe him!
studio7manga 2 years ago
You mean like how Dear leader obama told you your facts? Well unfortunetly.. no... he didn't.
but oh yes the glorious European method.. are we talking say, the Netherlands version, which works extremely well, where 90% of healthcare there is private, and the insurance companies prices are low due to market competition. Or do you mean the U.K. version where if say your Obese, you can't get hip replacement,
Razgriez1 2 years ago
oh but let's not forget Oregon which I mentioned, and showed the link of how wonderfully run state run health care is!
You know, the place that'll pay for you to kick your smoking habit, or go to Planned "parenthood" (theirs an oxymoron of a name for an abortion clinic) or your assisted suicide pills, but not Chemotherapy Cancer medicine to stay alive. Which brings me to another liberal hypocrisy point: Liberals LOVE telling you to keep laws off their body, but love putting their laws on yours
Razgriez1 2 years ago
I already told you what you would need to actually proof your point, that private insurance wouldn't do the equivalent thing through rescission and that the public option would do something like that. I'll only repeat myself once.
Yes that's why all those countries have better healthcare then us, as ranked by the WHO.
Oh yes rail against more social institutions Raz, so convincing... You're starting to sound like just another butthurt fundie conspiracy nut railing against the modern world.
studio7manga 2 years ago
Question, if those countries are so great Studio.. why haven't you moved to them then? why do you wait for them to show up here in the U.S.? Why do you rail against the insurance companies? Why do you only support a Government take over plan? don't even bother trying to say "Well you can keep your private insurance" because the devil is in the first 20 pages of detail of the health care bill, which states, that should you ever lose your private insurance, you must accept the gov. plan
Razgriez1 2 years ago
Because we have democratic institutions that allow the citizens to choose the system they want. Try a less cliche and stupid question next time. Honestly, do you really think that a question like that is intellectually powerful in any way... If yes that's completely sad.
studio7manga 2 years ago
and technically, you're railing against the biggest social institution of all, the majority of citizens who are against Obamacare! 53% now don't want it!
Razgriez1 2 years ago
Most people want the public option, and you're misinterpreting data, but you do that all the time so I'm not surprised at all....
fivethirtyeight. com /2009/06/public-support-for-public-option . html
studio7manga 2 years ago
It's pretty damn hard to misinterpret Rasmussen, dumb ass...
Razgriez1 2 years ago
Yet you have, congratulations. 10 bucks goes to you if you can actually figure out how, protip: we've already been over this before.
studio7manga 2 years ago
Even if I did misinterpret the Rasmussen Poll (which I didn't) I don't see what's wrong, people like you Studio always give less than truthful "Facts" all the time,
Razgriez1 2 years ago
I'm the one providing links here.
studio7manga 2 years ago
funny thing Studio.. so did I. Remember the case in Oregon? You know the one of the lady denied medication to cure or slow her cancer, which cost 4000, but the state health system says it'll be glad to pay for 100 dollar assisted Suicide pills? The one directly from a Local Oregon news station? hmmm must've been to busy ignoring it and mouthing off like blind fool you are..
Razgriez1 2 years ago
And what did I said you'd have to do to make your point on the current healthcare bill? Go back and read.
studio7manga 2 years ago
you mean this link:
rasmussen reports. com / public_ content/ politics/ current_ events/ health care/ august_ 2009/ 54_ say_ passing_ no_healthcare_ reform_ better _than _passing _congressional _plan
yea.... I just wanted to see how smug you were going to get before I decided to make you look like an idiot
Razgriez1 2 years ago
Lol, no seriously lol. I've been talking to dime a dozen right wingers all day about this one. What a yawn inducing set of data. Wanna know why?
I wonder how many people are against it based on misinformation...
/watch?v=zWGz7QoKIek
studio7manga 2 years ago
Oh wow... from Media matters, one of the most Liberal "Fact" "checkers" (yea right), who have lied so many times in the past, it's not even funny...
Razgriez1 2 years ago
before you even bother replying Studio
Quote fromMedia Matter's :
"a web-based, not-for-profit, progressive research and information center dedicated to comprehensively monitoring, analyzing, and correcting conservative"(Aka, we don't like what your saying so we're just going to scream your a liar)
Fact number two: From the NYT : Media matters received "more than $2 million in donations from wealthy liberals" and "was developed with help from the newly formed Center for American Progress"
Razgriez1 2 years ago
to spell it out for you, Media Matters is a BIASED group, that receives aid from wealthy Liberals, and another Liberal group. which has been documented several times of telling Lies and blatant smear attacks against those the group disagrees with.
Razgriez1 2 years ago
Kikikikik! Razgriez didn't realize that it was a NBC News poll! Kikikikik!
In case you were wondering, yes I'm even more smug now.
And you still haven't made your case about the public option. You're welcome to try though, I've laid out everything you need to do to convince me.
studio7manga 2 years ago
Your also a stupid little child with the way your acting.
Razgriez1 2 years ago
actually, there is no reason to even bother giving you one, because your so stuck on stupid, it's not even worth it, because I've given so many reasons and honest concerns (why trust bureaucrats can't even handle 2 Stimulus bills properly, can't handle Cash for Clunkers properly, etc etc) with more money that the U.S. DOES NOT HAVE AND CAN NOT AFFORD. Nor can I trust the fact that it gives 1/6 of the economy over to the Government.
Razgriez1 2 years ago
hell It won't matter that I'm honestly telling you right here and now, that yes, there is a need for some form of Reform. , there is more than one solution to reform, and several don't involve a Government take over that would still be very beneficial to the American Citizen. Not to mention the fact that twice, I have listed the information that confirms that the so called 47 Mil uninsured, that the majority can afford it or sign up for gov. progams.
Razgriez1 2 years ago
There's no takeover, get your facts straight. You've been wrong about everything else so far. Get educated.
We can certainly afford it, we already spend at least twice as much on our for profit system than any other liberal democracy with their "evil efficient government run universal healthcare systems".
You're quite paranoid by the way.
The rest of your messages was basically impotent rage which I'm not going to respond to.
studio7manga 2 years ago
my God.. I hope you're job doesn't involve being an economic advisory, because frankly you can't seem to understand the idea of a 1 TRILLION+ DOLLAR DEFICIT.
Here let me explain what that means... that means, we've spent 1 Trillion dollars or more, of money the Government DOES NOT HAVE. Government does not produce it's own money, they can only draw money from the Tax payers. So what happens when you don't have the money? Well then the Government has to raise taxes and cut services.
Razgriez1 2 years ago
Very good, you understand economics on a very basic level. *clap* *clap* *clap*
studio7manga 2 years ago
And you are so wrong studio, I can't do anything but laugh at how pathetic you are.
Razgriez1 2 years ago
Yet you can't offer any decent arguments.
studio7manga 2 years ago
I don't know.. I think most people with common sense would think "Why trust a government that can't handle over 800 Billion dollars correctly. or the cash For clunkers program" as a reasonable concern
Most seem to be concerned also about a white house run by Cronies, (Tom Daschle is found out, that despite dropping out of HHS position due to his tax problem, is still, Lobbying for the Health care industry, to the government, funny thought Obama said no to lobbyist...)
Razgriez1 2 years ago
Do you enjoy simply regurgitating right wing talking points?
studio7manga 2 years ago