Added: 4 years ago
From: cropperb
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  • blaming the victim

  • you are amusing - you sound totally insane - you have zero sense of responsibility or accountability lol man do you need to be schooled lol

  • What hope do they have after fixing the house in the ghetto...their children may still get shot.

  • Your video is great, I really liked it; you have a clearminded view of what poverty is.

    Nevertheless, it seems to me that your speech is mainly based on the reality of developed countries. Do you think that poor people are to blame in those countries where interventionist governments, conflicts, devaluations of the currency, etc. keep stifling any effort to earn a living in a decent way? Don't you believe there is another kind of poverty and that it is caused by unchecked states? Thank you!!

  • In the lower class their values and norms are different from the middle class. Middle class values are based around material security. Lower class values are based around human relationships. They are focused more on survival rather than taking care of things. Trust me, all the people who say he's full of shit have NEVER been around poor people. So shut up! I've been poor and you HAVE to act that way beecause that's how things are done.

  • I have worked with poor people for well over a decade. I think that we have to stress that there are exceptions to every rule. The best way I've heard to explain this phenomenon is "external and internal locus of control". I believe that people stay poor who have an external locus of control, which means that they are only motivated by gratifying the needs of the moment. People with internal locus of control are able to see consequences and delay gratification, which gets them ahead.

  • the 74 people who disliked this video are Marxists.

  • @MrGentlemanly either that or 'intelligent'.

  • @MrGentlemanly either that or intelligent.

  • @MrGentlemanly OR didn't appreciate the unnecessary racism at the end of the vid.

  • Thumbs down just for the title.

    HORSESHIT!

  • Despicable, hateful pack of lies. Poverty is NOT chosen, it the result of a system of inequality, lack of opportunity. NOBODY chooses to be poor. Poverty IS the result of choice, SOCIETAL choices that allow millions to suffer without hope, while a few hoard massive amounts of wealth. We can do better, but people like you stand in the way, supporting a system that causes poverty. We can eradicate poverty from the globe, and CHOOSE not to...an immoral choice without conscience.

  • Better continue your education. You make horrible over generalizations bordering on racist ideology. There is a bigger picture you are terribly missing. There are a lot of good comments below that begin to paint this bigger picture for you. You should open your mind, and listen.

  • LOL! A guy lecturing people...meanwhile he might be MORE ignorant about society than any dunce who comes across his video...these arguments wouldn't pass muster at a kindergarten debate meet!!! Sounds like he beats off to Ayn Rand!!!

  • Thank you. Good one.

  • Fucking poor people and their ugly government domiciles.

  • crooper is totally right being poor is your choice not anybody rlses

  • wow. So if everyone in poverty all of a sudden was ambitious enough, everyone could eventually escape poverty? (keep in mind poverty/poor is a relative term, no?) That's comeplete bullshit. sure some individuals could become successful and escape their lower class status, but what matters is not the specific individuals situation, but the bigger picture. As long as there is rich there will be poor. The problem is class.

  • You should see a doctor about that copy of atlas shrugged that's jammed in your rectum.

  • You need a couple social economics classes. People don't choose to be poor that's a pretty ridiculous thing to think, the reason this whole "phenomenon" happens is because they don't have the money to buy properly built homes the situation is then further worsened by the fact that they can't afford to keep their homes in perfect condition, because of that people who can afford it move away until only people who can't are left and thus you have your average city where poor and rich are divided.

  • Amen!

  • If poverty is a lyfe-style choice than being rich is also e life-style choice I presume. Strange that so few people choose to be rich and so many choose to be poor.

  • What's strange about it? Few people are willing to work long hours and save. Few people are willing to study and learn for years during and after high school. Those willing to study and learn and work and save made that lifestyle choice. Those who chose instead to drop out, work the minimum and party and spend make their lifestyle choice.

  • You have a point. Although not everybody has the same aptitude for study and work.

  • That's true, but some people who aren't very bright still get rich by hard work and saving. If you took all the poor people and made them rich, a few years later nearly all would be poor again. That's clear from studying lottery winners. Most are broke within 5 years of winning millions. The same happens to many sports figures making millions after retirement. They choose to waste it. You can't fix that, only they can.

  • Well said, cropperb, poor people aren't willing to spend as much money on rennovating their homes.

  • I agree with little fascist cropperb that many poor people should take more responsibility for their lives and will benefit from it, but to say that ALL poor people are ignorant fools and somehow "genetically challenged" or whatever is just a racist and frankly ignorant thing to say.

    Poor cropperb don't know what he's talking about.

  • People tend to appreciate things more when they pay for it. Pride of Ownership is what we call it. We shouldn't have to raise taxes to take care of people who can choose to work more until they can get a better job. We do have to stop being so blinded and realize that it is a choice. Once you become a adult you have the chance to change your life for the good or for bad.

  • Well said!

  • Whatever be the power of the means of production which are employed, competition seeks to rob capital of the golden fruits of this power by reducing the price of commodities to the cost of production; in the same measure in which production is cheapened - i.e., in the same measure in which more can be produced with the same amount of labour it compels by a law which is irresistible a still greater cheapening of production, the sale of ever greater masses of product for smaller prices.

  • Thus the capitalist will have gained nothing more by his efforts than the obligation to furnish a greater product in the same labour-time; in a word, more difficult conditions for the profitable employment of his capital.

  • While competition, therefore, constantly pursues him with its law of the cost of production and turns against himself every weapon that he forges against his rivals, the capitalist continually seeks to get the best of competition by restlessly introducing further subdivision of labour and new machines, which, though more expensive, enable him to produce more cheaply, instead of waiting until the new machines shall have been rendered obsolete by competition.

  • If we now conceive this feverish agitation as it operates in the market of the whole world, we shall be in a position to comprehend how the growth, accumulation, and concentration of capital bring in their train an ever more detailed subdivision of labour, an ever greater improvement of old machines, and a constant application of new machine a process which goes on uninterruptedly, with feverish haste, and upon an ever more gigantic scale.

  • But what effect do these conditions, which are inseparable from the growth of productive capital, have upon the determination of wages?

  • The greater division of labour enables one labourer to accomplish the work of five, 10, or 20 labourers; it therefore increases competition among the labourers fivefold, tenfold, or twentyfold. The labourers compete not only by selling themselves one cheaper than the other, but also by one doing the work of five, 10, or 20; and they are forced to compete in this manner by the division of labour, which is introduced and steadily improved by capital.

  • Furthermore, to the same degree in which the division of labour increases, is the labour simplified. The special skill of the labourer becomes worthless. He becomes transformed into a simple monotonous force of production, with neither physical nor mental elasticity. His work becomes accessible to all; therefore competitors press upon him from all sides.

  • Moreover, it must be remembered that the more simple, the more easily learned the work is, so much the less is its cost to production, the expense of its acquisition, and so much the lower must the wages sink for, like the price of any other commodity, they are determined by the cost of production. Therefore, in the same manner in which labour becomes more unsatisfactory, more repulsive, do competition increase and wages decrease.

  • The labourer seeks to maintain the total of his wages for a given time by performing more labour, either by working a great number of hours, or by accomplishing more in the same number of hours. Thus, urged on by want, he himself multiplies the disastrous effects of division of labour.

  • The result is: the more he works, the less wages he receives. And for this simple reason: the more he works, the more he competes against his fellow workmen, the more he compels them to compete against him, and to offer themselves on the same wretched conditions as he does; so that, in the last analysis, he competes against himself as a member of the working class.

  • Comment removed

  • Cropper, this video makes me want to rape you in the face with a diamond plated, golden cock of vengeance.

  • When you give someone something for free you give them one less reason to take care of that particular something. Case in point if you did not spend your hard- earned money on say, a car then would you really feel the need to spend extra time and money to take excellent care of it?

  • Idiotic yuppie snob. What makes you think you have insight into other people's choices and motivations? "Well, those people are poor. I am not. They must be doing something wrong, that or they are just lazy." Try switching places with a hard-working person who has to bust their ass day and night just to break even. You wouldn't survive a day. I'd bet money that you are one of those trust-fund kiddies. Did mommy and daddy hand everything to you on a silver platter your whole life? Fuck you douche

  • You're a fool. First of all, cropper isn't wealthy himself, and neither am I. I completely agree with this video, people aren't poor by accident. I could have been wealthier if I took school seriously, I don't seek to vote for government to pass laws which will require other people to pay me something I didn't earn. To do that would be to hurt the very thing which makes productivity possible, and therefore my own livelihood.

  • @Ieatbabies8 I do agree with him. My husband grew up in a poor neighbor hood, with a single mom and abusive step dads. He grew up, joined the Military, and is now a UH-60 pilot. My father owns realestate properties, and i will tell you that renters ruin everything they put their hands on! Anyone can move up if they want you just need to make good choices.

  • Right...

    My mother and father work their asses off and are on call night and day. We live in a two bedroom apartment in a slowly decaying neighborhood and yet, even after them working their ass off, sometimes relinquishing sleep, we still have trouble paying our bills.

    Tell me, do you just argue against the imagined poor people in your mind? You have no idea what the hell you're talking about.

    Go fuck yourself.

  • ZeppelinRocker

    If you don't mind me asking, what do your parents do for a living, how much they earn and how long have they been in their current job?

  • Absolutely correct! Good job!

  • This is hilariously clueless.

  • So hilariously clueless you were unable to post a decent rebuttal. I understand.

  • "Poor people, you put them in a house,and they abuse it"????? Oh sure, I guess the subtraction of critically needed government money from subsidized housing to things like war and bailouts for banks has nothing to do with this right??? Poor people are just inherently lazy...who love living in misery and blah blah blah. I love your right wing idealism. I bet you never even stepped foot in a "ghetto" before. Damn racist, try getting your head out of the books and actually meet the subjects.

  • "Oh sure, I guess the subtraction of critically needed government money from subsidized housing to things like war and bailouts for banks has nothing to do with this right???"

    It would be polite, before shooting your mouth off, to know what his actual position was on these subjects. I doubt he favours bailouts, and he's specifically denounced racism and racists, so there goes your attempt at stereotyping.

    The solution to poverty comes from the use of our brains, not our "environment".

  • Just because someone denounces racism doesn't mean that they are incapable of expressing overtly racist ideas. The theory that poor people contain some sort of inherent propensity for sloth and neglect is one contrived by very powerful people from the past specifically to justify their own neglect in meeting the needs of ordinary citizens. And of course all of you adhere to it because the rulers tell you so. Have any of you ever stepped foot in a economically degraded community before?

  • "The theory that poor people contain some sort of inherent propensity for sloth and neglect is one contrived by very powerful people from the past specifically to justify their own neglect in meeting the needs of ordinary citizens"

    No one has a duty to meet such needs. We don't now.

    "And of course all of you adhere to it because the rulers tell you so."

    No we don't.

  • "Have any of you ever stepped foot in a economically degraded community before?"

    Set foot in one?! Ha! I'm related to and live amongst the "economically degraded". Cropper's evaluation, nine times out of ten, is right.

    "Just because someone denounces racism doesn't mean that they are incapable of expressing overtly racist ideas."

    What racist ideas?

  • The elephant in the room here is race. It has to be mentioned here that the Africans who live in public housing evolutionarily never had a reason to build or maintain anything beyond a short period like Ice-age Europeans. They are simply not wired to feel the need to maintain things for a long period of time. The African environment didn't require this.

  • There are all varieties of obstacles in the way of people moving upward in society, and even if a person breaks their backs working all their life it is rare that they get much, higher, and not everyone is perfect not everyone can be a workhorse for a small modest house and neat yard, this video takes a very narrow point of view, go live in the slum for ten years, and see how you feel, pretty soon youll start feeling pretty crazy, anyways there are dishonest people throughout all classes.

  • what do poor people have to look forward to but work and exploitation pressure and bullying from not just upper classes but from within.Hire people to fix the houses, The poor create jobs for other people..people build houses, people move in and use stuff, it breaks, then you hire someone to come fix it, hire people to clean houses and yards for poor people? Those poor people have no reason to keep up any appearances, they could care less about the yard if they have been beaten.

  • Some poor people want to succeed in life but there are barriers keeping them from doing so like the cost to attend university. I do agree with bits and pieces... poor people should respect their property and work full time... if they can. Some jobs only offer part time employment. However, I think povery is both indivdual and social. It is a matter of choice but it's a matter of society as well. Poverty is complicated.

  • And try and find me one out of college, or who has ever been in poverty?

  • Objectivists are idiots.

  • Eh. You oversimplify it.

    Btw, that is 105%.

  • who the fuck gives a shit about houses falling apart?

  • You would if you had one that was falling apart.

  • WHAT A JERK TO ONE DAY HE WILL FALL

  • He already has fallen... I really don't want to go into detail because it is so sad - but check his recent videos...

  • It is so completely amusing reading the comments posted by those who somehow find the topic of this video offensive: "too gay; didn't watch", "stfu n00b", "fuck you", "Ayn Rand was a stupid, homely cunt", and so on.

    Americans need to stop treating poverty as a metaphysically determined fact of reality--it is not (contra Marx) some inherent package-deal that comes with capitalism. Man is a volitional being; there are an innumerable number of ways he can seek to succeed in the market.

  • Cropper, i am black and have seen the slums. You are absolutely right. The truth is bitter but thanks for been brutally honest. If everyone was being honest instead of being a demagogue, the slums would be depopulated in no time.

  • Ayn Rand was a stupid, homely cunt.

  • Where are the lulz?

  • fuck you

  • I'm surprised this guy only has one chin. Not so surprised he's white.

  • too gay; didn't watch

  • Hah, someone who was given everything in life now stands in judgment over all the untermenchen who haven't received God's blessings! You would be funny if you weren't so pathetic. As if you are contributing to humanity by making Youtube videos. Loser.

  • There is no God showering some people with blessings and not giving them to others. If there were such a God, he'd be a bastard for doing so. Jerk.

  • stfu n00b

  • Check out a book by Henry George called Progress & Poverty. It will answer many of these questions intelligently, but won't indulge in self serving accusations of laziness.

  • 3 - Most children are brought up not knowing how life is on the outside of their "slums" and don't know how to act other than how they've seen ppl around them act. It is also very hard and takes ALOT of hard work and dedication to get out of the "ghetto". This is why poverty is such a viscous cycle.

  • 4 - The solution to these problems would be to STOP throwing money at them and create social programs and educational programs so they can learn to make their own money, do something positive witht heir lives, and help contribute as much as they take from the country.

  • I do not want to be rich at all. I just want to be able to live and save some money. I have a bacholor's in communications. I make only 16,000 a year. I am very respectful and intelligent. I am stuck in the between area where I can't get a job at wal-mart due to overqualfiction and I can't get a job with my degree because of no work experience in my feild. I am self employed but it is very expensive to do this.

    This is such a gross missinturptation of people living in poverty.

  • you really are full of shit. astounding!

  • If you aren't going to engage the ideas he presents, and then specifically address the reasons you think they are wrong, then DON'T post on here.  Nobody wants to hear your worthless 2 cents on the subject.

  • "Yes, I'm poor by choice. I could work two jobs, but I spend a lot of time reading. And doing these "educational" videos. Most weeks I don't even work 40 hours at my wage job"

    That's what I do. I don't buy anything really. My parents bought me so much crap, junk food I didn't need, eh. People should me more thrifty. The internet is fun. I'm certain pverty is a life style choice.

  • Great point. You really decide what standard of living you're going to have in this country. It's pretty simple.

  • This is THE dumbest shit I've ever heard. Thanks for the laughs. You should interview some poor people and put their responses on your account. Then I would value your opinion even one iota. :-)

  • I'm poor.

  • Is that by choice ?

  • Yes, I'm poor by choice. I could work two jobs, but I spend a lot of time reading. And doing these "educational" videos. Most weeks I don't even work 40 hours at my wage job.

  • @cropperb And yet you can afford to go to university. I am sure that is what I would considerer poor. While I would agree that the government should not be buying houses for everyone. I think your idealism is laudable. People are partly due to their decisions, partly due to their parents, partly to do with their family history, genetics, class of upbringing, etc.

    Also, i do not understand why you felt the need to mention the ethnicity of every "lazy" person in the slum. Give your head a shake.

  • there should be an intelligence test to post on youtube, you clearly would fail

  • The one who produces the pencil...

    There is a certain limit to what people will pay for a pencil. And in order to raise the profit a capitalist has to lower the wage of a worker. The worker can't do anything about it and has to obey. That is why exploitation is always part of capitalism.

  • Huh? I buy a whole bunch of pencils from a pencil producer--giving him business and therefore money--and I'm exploiting him? The producer raises his profit levels by selling more pencils (what a concept). My pencil purchase may create more jobs at the pencil factory to fulfil my order, or it may enable the company to raise wages. Workers get a job, the producer profits, and I get cheap pencils. Everyone wins.

  • Interesting. What makes you say that a pencil has a fixed price? Why don't the 'evil capitalist exploiters' just charge a billion dollars for every pencil?

    You seem to accept the economic reality on the one hand, that the prices of pencils are set by supply and demand, not by greedy capitalists. But on the other hand, you're unwilling to accept that the price of labour is set by supply and demand. Not by greedy capitalists.

  • but this is exactly the way it works. The reason for this is, that if the producers (who are of course not literally the producers btw.) don't make profit they can lower the wages of workers in order to keep the business running. That form of transition however is not possible for the worker. He is the last one in this chain so he has to bear it all. He is in no position to bargain, because he can be easily replaced by everyone else.

  • As long as there is enough poverty there is always someone who is willing to work for a lower price than you so it spirals downward. It's an inflation of the price of work. Good for economy but bad for the poor people and in the last consequence bad for everyone but that they cannot see.

  • On top of that the capitalists lower the wages even when they are making profit in order to make more profit. That is how pure uncontrolled capitalism works. You yourself want to make profit and do everything in order to achieve this. If you had no laws to stop people from taking slaves, in capitalism they would do it. (As you can see in your own history.)

  • Yes. In real capitalism, everyone will try to charge as much as they can, and pay as little as they can.

    But, it's not just business. I don't even have to know you to tell you that you demand the highest wages you can get away with, and you shop around for the best pay. Likewise, you pay as little as you can get away with, and you shop around for the best price.

  • The greedy business man has as much right to complain about your profit hungry nature, as you do to complain about his.

    Do you see any business owners whining and moaning that 'Greedy customers won't pay fifty dollars for a gallon of milk! Government! You need to put a 'minimum charge' on milk to protect us!' I sure do! All the time! :) Their argument is identical to yours.

    Wages are determined by the market wage for your skills and experience. Period.

  • Yes, Wages are determined by the market, but skill is only accessable through a certain amount of wealth wich can on the other only be achieved through higher paiment, at least in this system. You see it's a vicious circle that's causing the social mobility to be non existant.

    On top of that the wages can be and are dropped by producing more unemployed people that can exert pressure on the still working people.

  • Of course you can say it's the market principle: less demand causes the wages to crumble.

    But those are people and not commodities and that's why I am telling you that this whole principle is rotten to the core.

  • Everyone is getting richer every decade. What "vicious circle" are you talking about?

    How much did a personal computer cost 50 years ago? Not available!

    How much was a cell phone 50 years ago? Not available!

    How much was laser eye surgery? Not available!

    And so on. Everyone is better off because of capitalism.

  • You have obviously no structural consciousness.

    I find it especially funny how you make a difference between white people and polish. You still have a racecentered outdated point of view instead of structural objectivity. I am from germany and minimum wages are one of the few things that keep our poverty-statistics from rising.

  • I thank for adding thoughtful comments to this page...i respect your thoughts

  • Yup, disabled veterans denied the gov't benefits they paid for with their blood just deserve to be poor. Fuck 'em, all they did was defend this country.

  • Quite a solid rebuttal

  • .....must go somewhere to pay the lowest possible wage...but that's a design of capitalism...you don't have to be greedy or evil it's just capitalism at work

  • Idiot

  • What is this guy espousing besides unsubstantiated assumptions and generalized indictments of poor citizens in America? Raising the minimum wage could be "detrimental" under a system which is constructed to make profits....to make profits you MUST exploit workers....you must pay workers little as possible...

    so yes you're right business "to make a profit" they

  • You don't need to exploit anyone to make profits. Profits are just another form of wage. If I import pencils for 5 cents apiece and sell them for 7 cents apiece, I've made 2 cents a pencil in profit. Who gets exploited?

  • It's cute how anyone who doesn't agree with your claims is sheep.

  • Funny how class and intellect do not intersect. Your mind and views are driven by someone else. Being a puppet is easier than being realistic.

  • Ship Africans back to Africa.

  • If I were a native American I would respond : "and ship the white man back to Europe".

  • I would be interested to know how "it's a fact" that minimum wages improve local economies and yet "in reality are counterproductive". Minimum wage laws are ridiculous, simply ridiculous. Think about it. A minimum wage LAW. It sounds like something a child would come up with. "I know, why don't we just grow our economy by legislation!"

  • You do realize that low-skill workers in some jobs would be paid very little without the assistance of a minimum wage? As the economy expands, they need more money, and if the minimum wage is still the same after 10 years, and the employer won't raise their pay beyond that, something's gotta give. The point of a minimum wage isn't to "grow our economy." Who told you that? it's to protect low skill workers from being screwed over.

  • If an employee produces less value than he recieves in pay, then either the business he works for will go under, or the wages he collects will have to decrease. This is not 'screwing over' the employee. Is it 'screwing over' against your employer when you realize you're underpaid and go to find another job?

  • What IS 'screwing over' is when your pay cut is forbidden by law, and even though you would willingly work for a lower wage, the government forbids you by force. If I went to apply for a job and I was told 'Sorry the government won't let us hire you.' That's when I'll feel screwed over.

  • I agree with you, Jocke1776. The original poster accuses minimum wage supporters/dissenters of oversimplifying, then he comits the cardinal oversimplification of economics, and claims that the economy can be 'helped' or 'harmed'. The economy is more complex than that. You can hurt some things and help others, with the same act.

  • Good topic, Mr Cropper. I think the effects of the minimum wage are far more complex than liberals and conservatives want to admit. Increased minimum wage does improve local economies, that's a fact, but it also encourages businesses to export jobs. So in reality, the minimum wage may be counterproductive. But I see your libertarian point.

  • I can vouch for you on your experience with fast food. I used to work in that industry myself, and I found many of my co-workers to be incredibly irresponsible and lazy. This amazed me given that some of them were in their 30s and 40s for it seemed to be they would have known better.

  • Raising the minimum wage is detrimental to the least fortunate (the handicapped, etc).

    Their labor simply won't be worth $7 per hour or whatever, and they just won't get hired.

    'Healing Our World', by Mary Ruwart, discusses this at length. It's a great book.

  • I am in poverty. So I know how hard it is to get out of it.

    Minimum wage laws should be abolished. Its none of the government's frickin business what I'm willing to work for or pay. In Germany there is actually a labor black market where you can bid to perform jobs for less than the state min wage. Its illegal, but people are willing to risk it to get work.

  • Government's action to artificially increase the price of labor always leads to unemployment. Price floors always cause surpluses in any good or service, including labor. That is why it should be abolished. Instead, employers should be free to pay workers based on their productivity.

  • What are your thoughts on raising the minimum wage? I saw an episode of 30 days where Morgan did his best to work 2 minimum wage jobs with the help of his wife and they still were barely able to get by. Imagine if they had kids! Getting out of poverty is probably harder than your making it out to be.

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