A response to the Dec 2008 Greek Riots *extended version*

[MrOzzy214]

Why put Pakistan and the Congo in to this? Those are issues in Pakistan and Congo what does it have to do with Greece? I am not from those countries although i am offended that you would use them as some sought of scape goat to the Riots in Greece. Greece has issue at the moment. Those issues have esculated to protests and violence! Of course Greece is an overwhelmingly beautiful place -yet i think people know that already. This was a useless video!

[Dr3aM3r87]

you know...oscar wild said once.."America is the only country that went from barbarism to decadence without civilization in between." .....but of course he is just another Euro-punk for you huh TrueMercun?????..........

[TrueMercun]

hahahhahahahahhahahhahhaha....­....

Na 'se kala!

[TrueMercun]

You useless, insolent, Euro-punk losers are perfect personifications of anarchy & decay, laziness & lawlessness, delusions & paranoia—you're hopelessly blinded, impotent pawns of the apparatchik machine! This is fact, not opinion!

Glad to have emigrated from that miserable shit-hole to the U.S.A. You deserve your circumstances, malakes. You sow what you reap. Living well in the U.S. is my best revenge against the lot of you pathetic losers! Now go waste your sad existence sta klabakia. ;-D

[Dr3aM3r87]

hahahhahahahahhahahhahhaha....­....as i said.....sleep well..........i not even gonna try to awaken you...i wish you well and to continue living as happy as you discribe....goodbye my friend... kala na pernas!

[TrueMercun]

As a Greek-American myself I know that today's Greece is rife with lawlessness, drug addiction, fraud and utter corruption in just about every facet of life—with Athens being the hotbed! This is fact not opinion! Today's Greek youth are an angry expression of anarchy and decay, laziness, lawlessness and ALITIA—communists through and through. Sadly, the future of the country looks bleak indeed. Whenever I visit family there, I want to kiss the ground upon returning to the U.S.

[xtikiarispoly]

you d better stay in the U.S Gay-American...

[TrueMercun]

Absolutely, I will stay in the U.S. Best advice you will ever offer. But you didn't need to tell me that; I already know it. ;D

[candypop57]

@xtikiarispoly YOU ARE SO GAY... HOW MANY BOYFRIENS YOU HAVE???? FAG LMAO...

[NoneAndAll]

I'm not Greek and never been to Greece, but when I saw pictures of NeoNazis (Golden Dawn) being told by Greek police to stab youth in the streets of Thessaloniki, and corporate media has not a clue of why universities are off-limits to police, Why should Greeks stand for more normality? Don't watch the news, they only want to see an obedient society and they are keeping the reality from people.

[PlanetAntiope]

How exactly did you see in a picture someone telling to somebody else to do something? How do you recognise someone who belongs to the "golden dawn"? You've never even been in Greece as you say! How do you know what REALLY happens here?

[NoneAndAll]

Okay, so Yahoo! News had pictures of them, calling them "far right supporters". They have knives and clubs. People on Athens.indymedia are saying the same thing. Students from Patras report the same thing.

How do you know what IS HAPPENING there?

[PlanetAntiope]

Because I happen to know some people who WERE THERE (and they have nothing to do with Golden Dawn) and say very different things. The people of Patras, about 3.000 of them, defended successfully themselves from the vandalism and the stealing of the so called "anarchists".

[NoneAndAll]

Unless you've ever seen Greek anarchists behind barricades yourself, how do you know they're REALLY there?

[PlanetAntiope]

Even if there were a dozen of "far right supporters" between them, that means nothing. Also, you can be sure that in such "happenings" many people from both sides carry knifes and clubs and even worse. Stupidity has to do more with DNA and less with ideologies.

[NoneAndAll]

Look for "Hrisi Avgi"

OccupiedLondon(dot)org

Athens.indymedia(dot)org

Thessaloniki.indymedia(dot)org

Anarchiststrategy(dot)blogspot

[PlanetAntiope]

The question was rhetorical. I told you, I live in Greece. Anyway, what I say is that what you accept to be the trouth is also twisted, and that photos can be explained in many ways.

[NoneAndAll]

Yes they can. But in times like this, it is evident that the government will coordinate itself with "fascist" elements in order to push the left away. These are the same people who kidnap migrants, which is another thing the left is angry about. How can you stand to see police work with fascists?

If anything police in other countries - I live in the US (how many kids die from police?) - will think twice before killing an innocent person.

[PlanetAntiope]

When I asked the google searching machine for "U.S. killed by police" (Athens excluded) I had 251.000 results! It doesn't seem that such incidents are a Greek privilege. You take for granted that "fascists cooperate with the government and kidnap migrants". Why?

[NoneAndAll]

Migrant kidnappings and torture - read it on Kathimerini and HumanRightsWatch. Sorry you didn't know about that.

Of course more innocent people are killed by US police than in Greece. We also have more money for police and prisons than anywhere. We have no riots because Americans are fat lazy bastards. Greece is leading the way. You should be proud of the young people and the strikers who are drawing the line.

[PlanetAntiope]

Can't find anything, will you give me, please, the date of the article? It could be possible, since as we say here "in the flurry, the wolf is glad", and at this moment migrants enter in Greece in unbelievable numbers, from all directions, so it is impossible even to count them - anyway, I am curious about the evidence of this article.

[NoneAndAll]

On humanrighswatch (dot)org look up "Stuck in a Revolving Door" Nov. 26th 2008.

[NoneAndAll]

If what I accept to be the truth is twisted, how can you be so sure of your truth? I want to know why you think people in Greece are rising up.

[PlanetAntiope]

If they were really angry about the death of the child, I do not thinκ that they did any good to him by bringing some hundreds of shop-owners to the edge of destruction, and sending some thousands of shop employees to the Fund of Unemployment. I am not persuaded.

[PlanetAntiope]

If the rioters were angry with capitalism, then they were not familiar with the map of Athens, since they didn't touch anything in any rich area, also most of the enterprises that were burned-pillaged-destroyed where of medium and small size. So it doesn't seem to be for this reason.

[NoneAndAll]

Look at uprisings historically. During the LA riots in the '90s the rioting happened in the poor and black areas. The riots did not spread to white areas, like you would think. Yeah that doesn't make much sense. But it makes sense that they looted from businesses because they had been robbed their whole lives from 'the system'.

[PlanetAntiope]

Since the Greek government is democratically elected, if the MAJORITY were so angry, they would have the opportunity to get ride of this government at the next elections, which are not that far, anyway. So it doesn't seem to be for this reason.

[NoneAndAll]

Anarchists, elections? haha, okay, anarchism is about direct democracy, and about consensus. It doesn't matter that the left is a majority, the point of disruption is not to elect a "leader" it's about teaching a lesson to those who want power over others. Athenian democracy killed Socrates, remember?

[PlanetAntiope]

Socrates accepted what the majority wanted, although he had the opportunity to avoid the konium (and although he probably disagreed with their point of view). How could you have "direct democracy" in any place with more than 100 people? I have read some Kropotkin, I am sure that the burning of Athens was not included in his theories. I hate the 500 characters limit.

[NoneAndAll]

Kropotkin wanted the tsars to be assassinated, actually.

& the trial of Socrates shows that democracy is a flawed institution, because its a tyranny of the majority among other things.

A direct democracy can work with autonomy, and nobody is forced to participate. But you want to participate because decisions others make affect you. Your students are smart and they want something better than "liberal democracy" with all its corrupted institutions.

[NoneAndAll]

"When a revolutionary situation arises in a country, before the spirit of revolt is sufficiently awakened in the masses to express itself in violent demonstrations in the streets or by rebellions and uprisings, it is through action that minorities succeed in awakening that feeling of independence and that spirit of audacity without which no revolution can come to a head."

- Kropotkin, "The Spirit of Revolt"

[popded]

Δεν υπάρχει ειρήνη χωρίς δικαιοσύνη-No peace without justice...The cold-blooded murder of a child by a cop was the last straw not only for the ever-increasing police violence and repression but also for all the scandals, looting of public funds by the 2 major parties, the bosses, the church & the bankers, for the poverty, unemployment & exploitation of young people. Prayers & hope will get us nowhere...ONE SOLUTION-REVOLUTION!

[NoneAndAll]

Release Greek political prisoners! Free Exarcheia! Stop those looting the employees insurance funds, & those kidnapping migrants. We Are Winning

[ArcadianSpirit]

Thank you :)

[venzetti8]

As long as humans walk the Earth, there will never be peace.

[ZAZAZAZATE]

je préfère la révolte