AXIS for Bohlen-Pierce Scale (Part 9)

[Voitcu]

Wait a minute, the idea of a scale is to fit between Octaves, right? Then if 12 tones = 100 cents each = 1,200 cents per octave. How can 13 tones = 146 cents each? If your dividing the octave by more numbers than there would have to be less cents per tone, not more. We've already established that an octave = 1,200 cents, so how then can a 13 note scale = 146 cents each = 1,898 total per octave. So wouldn't it have to be more like 92.3? Am I nuts?

[creamyfilling102]

@Voitcu the bohlen pierce scale doesn't use octaves. it uses 13 steps in between a frequency ratio of 3:1 (tritave). our normal octave has 12 steps between a frequency ratio of 2:1... it doesn't have overlaping octaves where a Low C and High C sound like the same note.  a 3:1 frequency ratio is like going from Middle C up 19 semitones to a High G. you're using 13 steps to span 19 traditional semitones on the western scale. 19/13=1.46 ...thus the gap between each note is bigger

[Smorphine]

Ok, here's the video I was looking for. Regarding "Magic Max Microtuner", "it is compatible with synthesizers and samplers supporting the MIDI Tuning Standard and other formats". Can you explain this? I thought MIDI was a 12T "technology". How is it possible to get MIDI into microtonality? Thanks!

[miselaineeous]

@Smorphine - MIDI note numbers range from 0 to 127. Middle C is MIDI note number 60, and since most keyboards only span 88 keys or less, some of the lower and higher note numbers go unused. As you play up a keyboard, the pitch gets modulated, meaning the pitch changes, normally a half step, per key. But the synthesizer itself does this pitch-modulating, not MIDI itself. Most synths default to modulate 100 cents (a half step) per key (MIDI note number), but this value can sometimes be changed!

[Smorphine]

@miselaineeous Thanks. I understand that MIDI's values can be changed (for instance, with Magic Max Tuner. Do you know any other software to do this?), but I dont' still understand how the synth itself does the pitch modulating not using MIDI, it must receive a MIDI signat to get triggered, innit? :) Thanks in advance again.

[MackTuesday]

Er, I don't mean to be a party pooper or anything. I do think this BP stuff is interesting.

[MackTuesday]

The 7/5 harmonic ratio sounds bad to me. It's very close to the 12-tet tritone.

[AGAG789]

Great video! and btw I have a Kawai k5000s too :)

[miselaineeous]

Awesome. I wish the K5000 could be microtuned. I may sell it, just because it can't be, and that makes it all but useless for me.. it's so sad. It has a really amazing sound.

[AGAG789]

yes, since it's old it has some of those flaws but it's unmatchable when it comes to synthesizing, maybe you should keep it to add some effects to your compositions since it can make some beautiful atonal sounds and noises. Besides it's somehow rare and it may come in handy :)

[miselaineeous]

Ya.. I've made it a habbit to never sell my gear. You're right..

[coastotoast]

Nope: it retunes the built-in QuickTime internal GM synth as far as I know. But it has several tuning file export options, plus the handy sysex "one touch" send window that would be used with synths supporting MTS messages (something that manufacturers normally don't implement unfortunately).

[miselaineeous]

I answered bitbutter, but sometimes my comments don't stick! I come back later and they're gone...

So, I would have assumed the same - that it sends pitch bend data for each note, but it really changes the slope of the keyboard? (now much each semitone modulates the pitch)

It allows you to use the IAC driver, meaning trigger other software, but I haven't been able to get this to work, and can't really imagine how that WOULD work actually.

[coastotoast]

Max Magic Microtuner does not use the pitch bend trick, it has some hi-end options like the MIDI MTS dump (both SEND and RECEIVE, so it can be used as a complete test platform for synth manufacturers willing to implement MTS). The paradox is no manufacturer has properly implemented the MTS dump messages yet (lazy people!), so the practical use of this option is rather limited. By the way, it is a perfect companion program for Max/MSP users as it "compiles" Max tuning objects automatically.

[bitbutter]

re. max magic microtuner: i'm a bit confused aobut how it gets the GM synth to play the correct pitches for the BP scale. Does it do that by sending a midi note plus the necessary pitch bend data to 'nudge' it by the correct amount?

sorry if this is a dumb Q