Great song. I for one am glad that we still have freedom of speech to sing songs like these and to discuss these issues on a forum like this. My hope is that we all will appreciate this freedom and pick our words in a way that shows it.
I want this song to be play in-front every crowd if Ron Paul Elect, because he is the one that can the save the world and stop the ongoing Pointless War in Arab World.
I love this song. It speaks the truth. People we are in America...we dont believe in budda allah abraham WE Americans believe in God. Im glad they drew that line in the sand like they spoke in their CD booklet.
@tower915 But why do you believe in one god more than another? It's just the oppression of your parents as captive, innocent children. Everybody starts Atheist. No one is going to start worshipping a god unless someone else forces them.
@lulle103 .... Yeah you are right in there.......God does not sleep. He is the only consolation we have because we know that he sees everything in us....
@Cjjharney ... thanks for loving a song such as this. music indeed is the language of the soul.. There are feelings unspoken but can be seen in music....
@Cjjharney Thats not what God wanted. He said to put love first, above all things. Only in loving each other as we love God could we hope to please Him.
You all worship a book that advocates slavery, murder genicide and misogyny all while telling us how much love it brings. It is an ancient book written by goat herders who thought the earth was flat. If you believe anything in that book to be true, you need to really get a grip on reality. Read your book before you actually try to preach it. It also tells you that you should not be praying in public (Matthew 6:5), so quit being fckn hypocrites. Get back in your closet and pray.
I think that everyone should decide if they believe in God or not. I for one do not want to die and burn forever in the lake of fire. To each his own.
@tarrahp2 Ever eaten meat on a Sunday? Or thought your neighbors wife was pretty hot? Had sex without the intent of procreation? Or any of thousands of other ridiculous "rules" handed down by your supposed magic invisible space ghost? If so, sorry buddy, your already f-ed in the a.
@tarrahp2 I specifically do not follow Christianity because I don't want the Lord Porky Pig, true Creator of the universe on Apr. 12, 1937 (together with our false memories of an earlier time) to plant his Cloven Hoof of Retribution and send me to the Bad Place for putting my trust in the Temple Whipper. You see? Who decides? EVERY religion creates a nonsense-story and a sense of journalistic urgency when gradual, non-theistic change, evolution and continental drift are the actual rules.
@Dracopol I can see where your coming from bro. But if you don't like God or our beliefs then dont watch and damn videos where believers will be on and comment on. Thank YOu.
@mvpro100 Oh, there is no safe space for your DBS's any more (Delusional Belief-Systems). It will happen that an Atheist association links to your video and says hey lookkit this! It's not going to be a 50-50 debate. Everywhere the information power of the Internet touches, religion is going to lose and disappear. Your children are going to have wireless Internet miniaturized in their CIRCULATORY SYSTEM. They will be informed, and so they won't be religious.
@tarrahp2 Lake of what-what? How does that square with the fact we've radared the whole Earth's core and we know what's under our feet, and there's no place for lakes of fire at any temperature where people can survive for any meaningful suffering... Honestly, dude, get a science education.
@OldWesternFan No, all that stuff I listen to is always very tongue in cheek, with incredible amounts of musicality and originality. This is purely message driven, with the aim to give control of the country back into the hands of a religious cult, and just the fact that people support this makes me physically ill. Death Metal is all in good fun, but this trash is what is truly dangerous.
This song is fucking disgusting, and thats coming from a guy who listens to music about mutilating still borns. If you believe in god, you're fucking retarded.
@soccerking4497 I apologize, really, but I had just read an article about the Westboro and was pretty fired up. I didn't mean it as a personal attack against anyone, but after moving from free thinking northern California to small town Texas where even mentioning being an Atheist can be dangerous, and even cost me a job, the whole idea of all these Christians spouting on about acceptance and understanding, and then going on about putting the Government in gods hands is just a horrifying prospect
"I have sworn upon the alter of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man." - Thomas Jefferson. In other words, let people make their own decisions.
@OldWesternFan You should look look up the full context of the Jefferson quote. He was speaking out against the clergy, whom he said were afraid he would use his powers in opposition to their schemes! But they deliberately butchered his lines on the Jefferson Monument so as not to offend the devout tourists who view it.
"As the government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion,..." --Article 11 of the Treaty of Tripoli, 1797, signed between the Bey of Tripoli (a Muslim ruler) and the Government of the United States.
@malbuff That there has always been separation of church and state in the United States, and that the government has never considered itself a Christian government or "under God".
@Dracopol Just because a country's government was not founded upon a certain religion does not mean the country itself was not influenced by it. To say that Biblical, Christian values served no purpose at this time is completely wrong. While the Founding Fathers were against forming a theocracy at the NATIONAL level, they DID NOT believe in a complete separation of church and state at ALL levels of government. It was left up to the individual states to decide.
@18chigirl What is the EVIDENCE they did not believe in a complete and total separation of church and state? Christian values have contributed extremely negatively to the U.S.A. To use a relevant example, it completely outlawed female orgasm until Kinsey did his surveys to reveal to a shocked American public that they existed.
@18chigirl Haha, nice try. Of course it's not in the Constitution, but it's in the First Amendment. The government can't make a law establishing religion. The Supreme Court made a series of rulings about its application to states since 1847.
@Dracopol Haha what? Obviously the Establishment Clause prohibits the government from establishing a national religion, but nowhere does it state that religion was to be entirely separate from state and local governments. How could there have been? The Founding Fathers endorsed freedom OF religion, not freedom FROM religion. There's a difference, and while the difference may be subtle to some, it does exist.
@18chigirl We should have freedom FROM religion, in the Soviet style. That fosters explosive progress and explains why a country that started an agrarian society could pwn the United States and become first with a satellite and a man in space.
@Dracopol Ahhh, ..."in the Soviet style?" You're kidding right? I guess I should have known, most communists think alike. There was no freedom from religion in the Soviet Union because the Soviets promoted atheism. And that is the same thing as promoting any singular religion, except now YOU agree with it. The fact of the matter is, the United States has (and I pray to GOD will continue to be) a religious nation. To say that history hasn't been shaped by religion is just wrong
Everyone who doesn't believe in this song or God should look up Brad Stine here on YouTube. Watch the video titled "good news". Or watch all of his videos :).
In which god do we still trust? I've always liked Thor and Odin. Powerful and wise, but not perfect. I know some still trust in Shiva and Vishnu, but because my culture has not exposed me to them, they can't possibly exist. Those really old Egyptian gods were wild, especially when it came to sexuality. No wonder Christianity borrowed heavily from those writings. I'm not so sure about Allah. Why would a god who needed a book written about himself approach an illiterate to get the job done?
@ChipArgyle It was good enough for Isis / She will save us in a crisis / And she's never raised her prices / So it's good enough for me! ("Gimme That REAL Old Time Religion")
@rangerstar I would like to see you question those top ranked well respected scientist. But wait you know it all right? And they knew nothing right? You keep your beliefs thats your right as an american.
@rangerstar some of your famous scientist who believe in god: Nichola Copernicus,Sir Francis Bacon,Johannes Kepler,Galileo Galilei,Isaac Newton,Albert Einstein and many more. How about you educating yourself
@Ce1ticwarri0r Funny how the scientists you mentioned are all way before modern science. BTW- Copernicus and Galileo were persecuted by YOUR church and threatened with excommunication because they went against church belief that the Earth was the center of the universe. That is what your church does when people go against theyir beliefs. The only reason they were Christian was because they would have been burned at the stake if they didnt said they didnt believe.
@Ce1ticwarri0r Funny how almost all the people you named are from before modern science. Galileo and Copernicus were persecuted and threatened with death and excommunication from your church because they said that the Earth was not the center of the universe and it revolved around the sun. A fact (like evolution) that your ignorant church would not accept. The only reason they would be considered Christian is because your church had a funny way of burning people at the stake who didnt believe.
@Ce1ticwarri0r Oh, now, wait a minute! Albert Einstein did not believe in a God like you do. In fact he was an ex-Jew, trying to RUN AWAY from this other guy and his soldiers, the SS, who all had "God With Us" on their belt-buckles but had a completely different idea of God, one that encouraged them to KILL ALL JEWS. None of these scientists did anything because of religious faith. In fact, Galileo had to OPPOSE religious faith to get the truth out, that the Earth goes around the Sun.
@Dracopol Finally someone who actually knows some fckn history. Well done Drac. At least were not all delusional idiots. i love how people claim galileo and copernicus to be xtian..like they had a fckn choice. A flaming hot poker down the throat will make anyone a christian i guess.
@rangerstar01 - Snotty little insulter. ALL who disagree w/thee are "delusional idiots". Pathetic. Actually, Drac is incomplete, at the very nicest. All people need to do online is make a claim & no support. OY. The "under God" is from Lincoln- that's where the added phrase to our Pledge came from. Many founders, etc., would disagree with Drac on his SPECIFIC claim.
The First Amendment was created to forbid state churches & limitations on freedom OF religion- my posts use reason & document it
@harry4health The words "under God" were only added to the Pledge of Allegiance in 1954! I saw a Porky Pig cartoon, "Old Glory" which was full of patriotic crap but, being 1939, they did NOT have "under God" in the pledge when they showed Porky reading it from a book. Do the generations become MORE religiously pious over time, so they add God? I doubt it; you can't match the religiosity of your ancestors. I'm insulting you there; look up the nuances of the word "religiosity".
@Dracopol - I specified "under God" was ADDED. I know in 1950s, too. U didn't address- it's source is Abe Lincoln. U added nothing new. I know Porky cartoon- I have it.
Being patriotic isn't crap. U can always move to S Korea.
Wondering about time/becoming more pious is irrelevant. UR insult is not surprising & childish. I doubt U really have enough knowledge to say who is more pious. I could care less about word "religiosity". Depth of spiritual devotion go beyond UR shallow slam. Irrelevant.
@harry4health But there is no spirit. Who's the bigger fool, the one who convinced you there were "spiritual" things, or you for believing it with no proof? Only scientists can characterize and prove invisible things, not the religionists. There is only matter, and man's ability to deal with it. Even his emotions are material.
@harry4health Under god was added to our money and pledge in the 50's because people tought that it would keep communism out of the country. It had nothing to do with the founding fathers or constitution. realistically, it is against the constitution, which is why the pledge was banned in schools. not because people didnt want kids pledging to their country, but because they should not be forced to pledge anything to a god they may or may not believe in.
@harry4health And BTW- there is not one peice of evidence that Jesus ever existed. You take it as fact, but it is not. NOTHING outside of the bible shows any evidence at all of jesus existing. I am not saying that "A" jesus didnt exist, but for someone who claimed to be the son of god, it is fairly peculiar that NOT ONE person in that time ever mentioned it in any contemporary literature. And the people who wrote the NT wrote it many deacdes after jesus supposedy died, and none ever met him
@harry4health by the way "w/Thee" do you think that jesus and your bible folk actually talked like that? Do you also think that Jesus was a white, blue eyed blonde guy that you see in all the pictures? Ha! i bet. Wow. Cant imagine why the church would completely make up an image of jesus to look just like all of the eastern european white people they were trying to convert. thats a Shocker! Just imagine a white blue eyed jesus walking around Palistine saying "where art thou". Genius.
@rangerstar01 I feel really sorry for you.There is only one God and He's the One that diamond rio is singing about in that song.And what are you talking about? the only ppl killing ppl is the ones who hate Jesus Christ! Again I feel terribly sorry for u and may God,the Father of Abraham.Isaac,Moses, have mercy on you!!!
@becky5492 We don't really want the "mercy" that Jesus showed, whipping people (John 2:15), merchants who were SUPPOSED to be right there (Deut. 14:24-27). Jesus whipped men women and children, Moses killed a man, sheesh, it's a veritable Rogue's Gallery in the Judaeo-Jewish religion! Best to be Atheist, because take away their bluster and arrogance and threats, they never PROVED there was any God in the first place. Therefore we must admit NO God, no spirits and no souls!
@Dracopol - Ah, Jesus in TEMPLE w/money changers is not Deut 14 w/agricultural TITHE, not sacrifices & they took part of TITHE to eat in SANCTUARY., so U misapply Deut. Also, it doesn't say he whipped anyone-never mind kids! Looking at all accounts of 2 cleansing of TEMPLE, they were overcharging- "merchandize", "robbers". His aim was "robbers", not kiddies.
YOUNG Moses killed a man because he saw him BEATING an Egyptian slave
@harry4health Nothing justifies violence. You can't just arbitrarily say Canaanites, or merchants, or a slave-driver or anyone are "evil" and justify attacking them and killing them. That is Old Testament thinking, and it makes Jesus, and Moses, absolutely unsuitable role-models for anyone to follow. It is much better to be Atheist; you know and accept you will have tempers and shortcomings and there is no source of "supernatural" strength that will stop you if it didn't stop Jesus or Moses!
@Dracopol - UR persistent mocking & ridiculing others/belief in God shows UR infantile mentality & immaturity. Typical for atheist proselytizers of Militant Atheism of Dawkins, et al.
U don't know whether some are best w/religious beliefs. UR a hollow, mocking, condescending, ridiculing, empty, holier-than-thou atheist with JUST as much of a 'fundamentalist' mindset against religion & God as atheists point to others as having.
@harry4health It's not a matter of being EMOTIVE, it's a matter of being FACTUAL. As adults, we are called to live FACTUALLY. Technological progress is not built on falsehoods but on what is most correct, what explains the most facts and can be used to get to more facts. No one in charge of our governments, business, corporations, is going to pay your emotional outbursts any credence. Why should I? We must accept the FACT there is no God or spirits.
@harry4health Moses and Jesus are still criminals with indelible criminal records in our terms. They are NOT role-models, so you should therefore wean yourself from religion. You have made extremely emotive attacks against me, but it's because you are IDENTIFYING too much with the toxic drug you have taken. If you distance yourself from religion, you won't feel personal damage from the shrapnel when it implodes...
@Dracopol:AGAIN-Jesus in TEMPLE w/money changers is not Deut 14's agricultural TITHE, it's not sacrifices. They took part of TITHE to EAT in SANCTUARY
It doesn't say Jesus whipped anyone-esp. kids! Looking at all accounts of temple cleansing, they were overcharging- "merchandize", "robbers". His aim was clearing temple of "robbers", not whipping kiddies. No record of whipping PEOPLE
UR EMPTY & DISTORT NT when some intellectual integrity & careful reading would show what was & was NOT
@Dracopol - U wouldn't know. Where's UR objective standard of moral right & wrong? Please DO tell. U have none, so U can't say if violence is never "justifie[d]".
Also, me thinks Hitler wiping out millions "justified" "violence" against the Nazis.
Talk about DBS ("Delusional-Belief System"). U a pacifist?
U IGNORED my reply to U, in typical, illogical, intellectually-dwarfed atheist fashion, distorted Bible. Funny how atheists feel they have the intellectual upper edge, but bomb
@harry4health Atheists have the highest moral standard because it is based on factuality, not invisible spirits floating around, ever-powerful but also ever-invisible. Really, this is simple stuff covered already in the "myths against Atheism" section of atheism dot about dot com. Can Atheists be moral? Sure. The person you want to kill today may yet do you a service tomorrow. So it is wrong to kill a human resource. No God is needed to conclude that!
@Dracopol - What nonsense. U R so shallow & clueless. Believers accept they have short tempers, etc. They just don't have UR non-standard of just accepting they do & just let them go into full gear. U don't beleive in self-control, etc? R U amoral by admission?
Atheists like U would screw a society.
Yeah, the crowds rampaging in a mall, stepping over people, fighting, stabbing over a sneaker- yup! They aren't pesky believers who use self-control!
@harry4health Your emotional attacks and your refusal to provide any sort of proof of invisible spirits does not weigh very well in my accepting your point of view? Why should I? Nobody adopts religion willingly as an adult any more, now that we are free. It's only captive children caught in an abusive system from birth these days. And once again you still have a view of Atheists as amoral animals. Emotions are NOT a valid way of making decisions, and neither is theism.
@harry4health Atheists have the highest moral standard because they have factuality, not belief in invisible things that motivate them without a sign ever given from these beings. The one in the driver's seat is actually your theistic "pastor" (making you a sheep?), who can be more evil than you! Remember that even the atomic bomb must be laid at the feet of the religious, since the born-again generals felt they were bombing Japanese pagans, and a chaplain BLESSED the Enola Gay.
the actual facts are that although Jesus , as a person may have existed, there is no evidence at all that he made any miracles at all. There are many historians who lived during that time, and not once was JC ever mentioned. Suck it up. you got sucked into an ancient story. I am sorry you fell for it, but grow up. Miracles don't happen. Although we would all like to think they do. They dont. Live your life as you should. Like it is the ony one you have.
@rangerstar haha. Southern hick? Wow real original my family didnt come hear from irland and germany and fight in all these wars for what they believed in for some stupid ass dip shit like you to say our beliefs are wrong religon has been around alot fucking longer then science fiction bit that why this country is great you have the freedom to beleive what you want
@ rangerstar you need to stop being so absent minded you show that you know the bible quite well. Hopefully you dont pray for anything including when time ever get the roughest and stop using our churches for marraige isnt that being a hypocryt. Keep up the good work though he who denies thy father will not have his fill of the tree of life I know he who does believe will. And people like you will just be WORM FOOD!
Religon has been in this country since our founding fathers even our first president.If you rangerstar want religon out of this country how about you and your followers of ignorants leave this country wouldnt miss you there is more religous people in this country then measley scientist.Religon doesnt hide the truth your science hides everything and only gives you alittle bit to know,in secure facilities maybe what there hiding is nothing because they have nothing they just want you to think that
@Ce1ticwarri0r I will be honest here. I have no idea what you just said. Um, good work. you are definitely makeing the cause for the uneducated southern hick christian go far. Well done. How about this. You try and read about law and the constitution and realise that I am the one person actually defending it. unless you want people laying down mats and praying to allah in your schools. Yeah, I dont want that shit either. But the way you are going, that is what you will get.
@1timby whats funny science says for something to be real the 5 sensorys have to be used but that I wonder if scientist even have brains? You cant see, feel, smell, hear or taste there brain so how do we know it real or if they have one and if it even there
@1timby good point the other point rangerstar01 forgets is science is like a religon or otherwise they wouldnt get so pissed off when there faith in science is being tested
@rangerstar01 im starting to enjoy these debates but moving on yes I am a believer of christ and yes I have learnd science but I dont believe in the big bang theory or evolution, yes men have created medicine with the plants and minerals from this earth and technology is expanding however the further science comes the more it proves biblical history science just doesnt want to admit it
@Ce1ticwarri0r So then maybe you can explain how Noah took a kangaroo from Australia onto the Ark without any evidence the animal was carried to or from that place? The Ark, according to the silly Bible story, landed on a mountain nowhere near Australia, with only the number of species an ignorant desert people THOUGHT there might be in the world, not the millions we actually know of now.
@Dracopol So maybe you could regale us with how the universe created itself Mr Wizard. Tells us how matter came into being from nothingness? Maybe how life started. We all could use a big laugh.
@1timby But science HAS explained it. It might even have filtered down to the science-classes you cut. Equal particles of matter and antimatter can pop out of nothingness spontaneously and at random. No physical laws are broken since they still add up to zero. They USUALLY re-form immediately, but not necessarily when physical laws are different. Isn't it odd how half our universe is matter, and half anti-matter...Meanwhile, religion has arm-waving "magic" as its explanation.
@Dracopol So which part of THEORY don't you understand? So where's your proof that matter popped out of nothingness to create anything? Science tries to fill huge gaps with this untried unproven fluff. Then you call Christians gullible? So Mr Wizard show us this anti-mater, dark mater, quantum filaments etc you speak of. You can't because it's an observation by someone that could just as possible be found wrong tomorrow. But hey some egg head said so. So a duffus like you can argue.
@1timby "Duffus"? It's so easy to find your silly messages in the huge page; I just word-search for the misspellings. Theory has a different meaning in science than for the layman, so stop your Creationist-style whining that "it's just a theory". We are further ahead in understanding material and social things with science than with religion. Religion never EXPLAINED anything, just bullied people's minds (mainly while young) to believe.
@Dracopol I try not to use big words as you already have trouble with the simple ones. Theory are just theories. DUFFUS. I'm in the scientific realm and have been for 30+ years. So stop you unproven unrealistic whining that science has the answers and realize you don't even understand either side of the argument. You're the one that started the attach. So maybe you need to drop back and take a long look in the mirror. See who's bulling whom.
@Ce1ticwarri0r Science and theology have often been seen as against one another. I firmly believe the two are inextricably linked and remind folks many of the greatest scientists in history have been Christians.
@magoodfellow Science is the antithesis of theology. Theology deals with "faith" (belief without evidence). Science does not deal in anything without evidence and testable hypothesis. We know that silly stories (Noah, jonah) and miracles of the Bible or the Koran never happen. Those who claim they did, are denying fact and accepting myths that contradict what we already know about physics, biology, geology,cosmology and evolution. You cant just say "I believe" so it is true in science.
@rangerstar01 What about dark mater. What about the number of dimensions to make Higgs theory work. They are no more than theories. So believe in hypothesizes and theories. Science can't prove anything. Why can't miracles happen? Just because you don't believe doesn't make it so. You have faith in things. You have faith the sun will rise tomorrow without proof. You make plans for the future without proof you will be alive. That my friend is faith in action. Science hasn't disproved God.
@1timby Name one miracle that has ever happened. Miracles dont happen because they go against natural laws. Lets look at your bible. The first to write about Jesus was John. He never knew of any miracles. Then Mark- Also, wrote of none of the miracles attributed to jesus. Matt writes about a few miracles, and then Luke and John get all miracle crazy. Whats more likely, that John and Mark (the first writers) didn't know of the miracles, or that the others made them up to jazz up the story?
@rangerstar01 Feeding the 5000. Turning water to wine. Raising himself from the dead, healing the sick/blind/afflicted. I don't get your point about the different books. If I ask 5 individuals at a crime scene I'm going to get 5 different versions of what happened. Does that make what the people saw any different or wrong. NO. Same for the gospels. Different writers for different audiences. So what's your point.
@1timby None of the writers of the canonical gospels ever met jesus. they were written many decades after his death and nobody knows who wrote them. Mark (40 years after JC death) mentions no miracles, not even virgin birth. Matt and Luke wrote their book directly from what mark wrote, only they added some miracles. John wrote about 70 years after jesus died. The whole idea of christianity was based on Pauls writings and Paul admits he never met jesus in person and mentions no miracles.
@rangerstar01 And you know this how? Where you there? What's your proof the gospels where written by anyone other that the orig authors. Mat has many mentions of Christ's healing of the sick (all miracles). What proof do you have that the other Gospels where plagiarized? Paul did in fact see Christ as he was struck blind on the road to Damascus. Believe as you wish, however, your opinion are just that OPINION. Anyone who is really wanting to disprove the bible has tried and failed. Even you.
@1timby You need to read a bit. It is widely accepted by almost all biblical historians that the writers of the gospels where not the actual desciples. It is not even a question anymore. As for plagiarism, yes it is also an accepted fact that Matt and Lukes writers took their stories from Mark: Of Mark's 666 verses, some 600 of them appear in Matt, and 300 in Luke. he was absolutely the source for both. Unless you just want to ignore the evidence, which you certainly have a proclivity to do.
@rangerstar01 None of the biblical historians I seen. There is a reason that the gospels are similar as they came from the group. If you were to provide me with the evidence other than hear-say. I would be glad to entertain your opinions. Remember these are distinct books and not a culmination of tales to compose a book. Each of these gospels were intended to reach different audiences.
@1timby Yep, because they were told to different people, that completely excuses the fact that they all completely contradict each other. Makes sense. Really. i dont care if you want to ignore the fact that you believe ancient fairy tales. My 4 year old believes in the tooth fairy. Thats fine. Just dont bring it into big boy world. We adults like to live in reality. BTW- everything about the bible is "hear-say". there is no evidence that your JC ever exhisted, except "hear-say".
@rangerstar01 I'm not ignoring anything. They don't contradict each other. You may want to believe that. Again that's your prerogative. The timelines match the narrative matches and the facts match.
As for whether Jesus existed, you may want to read up on your history. There are accounts from rulers and governor of the times that collaborate the existence of Jesus. Again you can believe as you wish.
@rangerstar01 It's nice you 4 year old believes in the tooth fairy. However, that's not relevant to the conversation. I could go on quoting facts but you're not going to believe anything that I provide. You obviously are looking for an argument and guess what. Not going to happen. Don't believe. When you die, and you most certainly will, we'll see. I'm willing to wager that I'm right. I have nothing to loose. Can't say the same for you.
@1timby Yep. Ignore it all you want. but now I bet you are going to look into it. and then you are going to realise that everything you have ever believed is absolute nonsense. see, i have studied your silly bible. I know everything about it. So, instead of reading bout it, and actually listening to biblical scholars (most of which are christians) you can keep denying facts. because that is what you do. Deny fact. You got sucked into a ancient scam. sorry. I know it sucks. but deal with it.
@rangerstar01 I realize you might have read the bible but it's obvious you never understood it. I feel sorry for you that you took the time to read something and didn't get anything out of what you read or studied. You obviously missed the good parts trying to find something to hate. Christianity is about love and helping other. You have taken things and turned them into something they aren't. As I stated it works for me. In the end we'll both know how was right.
@1timby And BTW- I was kind of a christian when i read the bible. I believed in all this stuff. I wasn't looking for things to hate. I decided that i believed, so i should probably read the book. The book is what made me an atheist. It is complete nonsense and anyone who can read that and still believe it is true is either a child, intelectually slow or delusional/brainwashed. It is possible that there is a god (doubtful), but it is damn sure not the one in that book.
@rangerstar01 Kind of a Christian. Is that like being kinda pregnant or kinda dead? That's the problem, it's an all or nothing deal. Reading your bible; attending church, etc doesn't make one a Christian. Think of it this way. God is way above us, so for me to state that I can understand God then He wouldn't be much of a God. It takes Faith and a continual striving to be like Jesus. Not out of fear or expectation of reward but because of love.
@1timby And yes, I do hate xtianity. I hate all religions. They all teach intolerence and that ignorance is a virtue. Instead of trying to figure out how the world works, you just say "godidit" and you dont have to think anymore. If we all did like you do we would still think the earth was flat and epileptics were "possesed". You make a stament that I think i know everything. You couldnt be more wrong. You are the arrogant one who thinks you know all."godidit" is your answer to everything.
@rangerstar01 It's OK to hate religion. God does too. It teaches intolerance, hate, greed, etc. Christianity isn't a religion. I thought that I had already explained the difference. So science has it all worked out. Interesting. Last time I checked that had more questions than answers. No facts just theories. So it's OK for you to believe in someones wild theory? How is that any different that believing in something not evident and using faith? So you talk in circles. What do you really believe?
@1timby "God hates religion" And you know this how? Are you saying that you know gods thoughts? Does he speak to you? Read the definition of religion. Dont try to distance yourself from it. You guys are tryingto get all tricky because more than ever people are turning away from religion because we have access to more information and we no longer have to look to superstition for answers. That and pedephile clergy and scumbag evangelists, you are losing your sheep in vast numbers. Halleluja.
@rangerstar01 Ttry reading the bible. I've stated already what Christ said about religion. And what information do you have that gives you the true meaning of life. Last time I checked, science can't provide anything other that theories and hypothesizes utilizing a very limited tool set as well as limited knowledge. You may believe theories if you wish. Don't try to pass them off as facts. Dark matter, Higgs theories of 10 dimensions, universe just happened, etc. Failure of Newtonian physics.
@1timby I have said this before. Just because something is called a "theory" does not mean it is not fact. Gravitational theory, Germ theory, Theory of relativity. All theories. Guess what. They are also facts (unless you dont believe in gravity). Of course science has more questions than answers, that is part of it. You are the one who thinks you have all the answers. but I bet we will get a lot more answers investigating and coming up with theories than by saying "GODIDIT".
@rangerstar01 Well Mr Wizard maybe you should look up the def of Theory. Gravitation Theory doesn't work at the sub-atomic level. Try reading Higgs theories. Newtonian Physics fails at the sub-atomic level. Relativity is just that and disproves Newtonian Physics. Science is so fallible. Now your putting words in my mouth. Especially since I stated I don't know. I do know that science is a fallible and at least admits it. However, you deam to know everything.
@1timby Tadah! Magic! Godidit! ou believe a book of fairy tales that my son wouldnt even believe. I am assuming you are an adult. So bravo. If i took the biblical stories such as Noah or Jonah and inserted jack and the beanstalk, it would be impossible to tell which was supposed to be real and which was a fairy tale. How can you possibly talk about Higgs theory and physics and freely admit that you believe those childish stories as real. How can your brain reconcile that with common logic?
@rangerstar01 Tadah it just happened. So believe what science says. How's that any different. Oh since you are a theologian and a doctorate in physics as well as biology you know. Wow. I'm sorry that I questioned you. I thought my many years in the science field prepared me to at least have some reasonable questions. However, I should have googled you instead. You have the vast store of all knowledge. I suppose that came in handy when you created the universe and all life.
@rangerstar01 Well Mr Wizard I can talk of science as I've spent my career in the scientific realm. I happen to know that science knows very little (real facts) about how things happened. As I stated just theories. I forgot theories are really facts is hiding. With your PHD in Theology and the varied sciences I thought you would have gleaned that by now. I would have thought that you understood that Faith is the evidence of things unseen or understood. Science calls them Theories. You knew that.
@Dracopol Good one. You should be a stand up comedian is say Cuba, Russia, or maybe one of the better Mideastern nations such as Iran. I'm sure they would appreciate your humor there. Maybe a remedial reading course would be better. Then you could at least understand the passages of which you base your comments.
@1timby They will appreciate the humour EVERYWHERE! An adult never exposed to the story before would laugh at the story of an all-powerful, perfect God creating an imperfect universe with sin, the solution to it somehow NOT being direct action but cutting off a body-part, calling it his son, and sending this son down to go apeshit on merchants and get nailed by the Romans on sticks of wood somehow makes the universe all better, although VISUALLY nothing changed in society. Funny!
@Dracopol I know many folk that would laugh at what science calls factual theories. What you spout is the same. Your thoughts and opinions are just that. They have nothing behind them other than what you state. Maybe a trip down history lane will provide you with a hint of what Christianity has done for man kind. Of course that would take some honest effort in which you are incapable to perform.
@1timby I'm not taking a trip down YOUR biased museum of how great Christianity is. There is even Christianity in the Hiroshima Bomb, since born-again generals forced the scientists to make it, and an Army chaplain blessed the Enola Gay with its payload of death for 250,000 people. They were PEOPLE, not "godless Japanese heathens" like the born-again Christian generals thought. I bet you are using selective accounting, and not counting the negative aspects of Christianity like that.
@Dracopol And you don't trip down your real of unreality. Was there any morality in the murdering of millions by Stalin, Pol Pot, Castro, etc. Hmm. You have a selective memory. Man did that not Christians.
@1timby Christianity is about Jesus whipping people to get his way. (John 2:15) Nothing more. It's the usual Old Testament story of Middle Eastern tribes portraying their neighbours as absolute evil, to justify overruning them and killing them utterly. Not a role-model for a modern, progressive civilization. Even "adultery" does not mean what you think it is, but more like adulterating wine with foreign substances i.e. interracial marriages that the prophet Nehemiah condemned.
@Dracopol Some more of your opinions. Obviously you don't have a grasp of Christianity or anything else. So an uneducated person offering their opinion about things they don't understand or know if off little use other than to do what you seem to do best. Argue. Something it's better to keep your opinions to your self as you have proven to everyone how little you know about the subject.
@1timby It's not a matter of ignorance of a bullshit doctrine. The Scientologists crow the same line when challenged about THEIR bizarre beliefs. YOU have a belief that you can do SOME SHIT to get Eternal Life, even though your brain is not built to handle the memories and would fill up like a 128 MB memory-card in a camera taken to a vacation in Cancún. You also believe violence against "evil" people (defined by you) is justified. Lucy, you've got a lot of 'splaining to do!
@Dracopol Agin yu voice your opinions without factual backup. You provide nothing but attitude and loathing for something you don't know anything about. Sounds to me like a spoiled 2 year old that can get their way. They don't want to be held accountable for their actions. They don't want to be told by mom and dad what to do. So they go about life thinking what they have to say has any relevance to reality other than their own. How pitiful you are.
@1timby What evidence or proof have you EVER given for your invisible God? You are living in a robotic mode, controlled by witch-doctors who happened to discover psychological manipulation techniques before actual psychologists, bound by ethics, did. You are under MIND CONTROL. That's what religion is, and it's time to break your conditioning because it does you harm.
@Dracopol Well creation of the universe. I would think that should be enough for someone as egotistical as you. Wow and God couldn't create a man. Opps already said and did that. Man's ethics, no thanks. We've already seen prime examples of man's ethics. History if full of those examples. As far as harm, again you no so very little that it's like a one cell amoeba trying to convince a person that they are the center of the universe.
@1timby But we KNOW what happens when YOU die. Your friends will witness it. All thought will stop, brain-tissue dying in 10 minutes from lack of oxygen, never to be reconstituted again, like a computer program in RAM when you pull the plug. Then the bacteria, held back by your life-processes, will attack your body tissues with a vengeance once you die, converting it to carbon dioxide which will be dispersed throughout the world's atmosphere, never to be reconstituted.
@Dracopol So Mr Wizard you've been there and done that. Wow. I have to tip my hat and congregate you on the test. So which hospital or facility did you performs these test. I would love to read the findings. Hopeful you understand that I'm being factitious. Science doesn't understand what all happens after death and unless I'm mistaken no one has gone for a few weeks and came back to verify your findings. Obviously you can't validate your opinion. So it's totally worthless.
@1timby What?! An idiot like you takes a cock-and-bull story that a guy killed by the Romans for a whipping offense is somehow the saviour of all mankind, that his dead corpse when nailed to wood somehow emanated mysterious rays that suddenly improved everyone's lot in life, and you say *I* can't validate MY opinion? You'd better start presenting some POSITIVE PROOF IN FAVOUR of what you're saying. Extraordinary claims require EXTRAORDINARY, whale-like amounts of proof.
@Dracopol Let me see, the universe made itself. Oh no it was the big bang that did it. No it was dark mater. Well science doesn't really know so they have to make up something to fill the gap. So that the ignorant, like you, can boast they know everything even without facts. So bather on about your ignorance. Trolls are like that.
@1timby You can expect refinements of knowledge as we go along. And the commenter did not SAY dark matter made the universe. How many times has religion changed its mind? Ra made the universe, oh no it was Odin, oh no it was Jesus Christ the three-in-one head with God! The way to go about determining it is to provide evidence and proof, and see what theory best fits the facts! No appeals to authority or moldy sheepskins written by shepherds...
@Dracopol Religion may have changed it's mind. Again you know little of what you speak. Big difference in religion and a faith. Christianity has only one God. There is no Odin, Zeus, etc. However, science has a flavor of the month when it comes to creation and evolution. You don't even have that much. Of course there's that nice find a few years back concerning the missing link. Pig bones and other animals. Again you're clueless.
@Dracopol con't try looking out side sometime and get out from under the bridge. Trolls do have eyes don't they. Look at the stars and the universe. Even someone as stupid as you can understand that the universe couldn't make it self.Well maybe not. So what claims have you provided that makes your opinions worth anything? None. Just ignorant blatherings from a no think-um.
@Dracopol Good one. Did the universe make itself. Did life start because it was struck by lightning? Those are the questions you need to ask yourself. Wow and science has all the answers. If not at least they can go to you since you seem to contain all the knowledge of the universe. A veritable legend in your own mind. I just wish I knew half as much as you thought you did.
@1timby And no, science cannot disprove god, but it can explain things you attribute to god naturally (xtians used attribute thunder to god being angry, science explained that). I really dont care what you believe. The whole point is that I, as well as millions of others DO NOT believe. Therefore, OUR government cannot endorse a religion or it would be favoring some citizens over others. It is against the constitution. My taxes should not pay for it. Pray all you want in private.
@rangerstar01 So you don't care what I believe. Then why all the fuss? There are Millions that do believe. That's not the point. See even if no one else believed as I do, I would still believe. Science gives people the delusion that it's theories are facts. You should do some research into what you believe. Scientists state they don't know but have theories. Theories are not facts. Our government can't establish a religion it doesn't preclude that it's constituency can't worship as they want.
@rangerstar01 So how are you paying for religion? The only things I see are a bunch of folks costing everyone tons to remove religious Icon from every where (10 commandments, crosses). Your tax dollars are going for this. If you're so upset at folks spending on things then maybe you should get your buddies together and quit bringing up frivolous lawsuit to remove religions item from the US. That would be a good place to start. I have the same rights as you. I can pray and worship anywhere.
@1timby What dont you get about this? The point of this song is that Christianity and god should be more entrenched in our government and country. Everything Government does is paid by tax dollars. therefore, NO! nobody is trying to stop you from worshipping anything. Pray all you want. We just dont want tax dollars paying for it. I think you are confused. Nobody cares if you pray. It is absolutely your right. Just do it outside of school and government and we dont have a problem.
@rangerstar01 What part are you not getting. The government isn't paying Christians anything. Which part of the government is getting these funds subsidizing Christians? Don't say that there aren't groups trying to stop me from worshiping. Try looking at the varied articles concerning the suits about removing the ten commandment and crosses. This is costing everyone. As for government prayer, you need to bone up on your history. For decades our elected officials opened the day with prayer.
@1timby When did I ever say that governement was paying christians? Please: Tell me one time where ANYONE is trying to stop you from worshiping. ONE! NOBODY CARES IF YOU BELIEVE IN GOD! WE DONT CARE! PRAY ALL YOU WANT! HOW COULD ANYONE TELL YOU THAT YOU CANT PRAY? (NO, you cannot pray in school or government- that is completely different. but I dont think you can grasp that).
@rangerstar01 So you're saying that Christians are being singled out for their beliefs? And you call me gullible. You can google and see that it's happening all over the US and the world. I can grasp that you believe that the statement separation of church and state means what you think it means but it doesn't. However, I'm not going to argue with you as can believe what you will.
@rangerstar01 What you should be mad at it the other issues in the government and not Christianity. Children can't pray before a school game; can't mention their beliefs at commencements. Yet there are religions that are allowed to do what they want when they want and no one is clamoring for them to stop. Seems funny to me. Everyone except Christians have rights.
@1timby OK, the 10 commandments. We shouldnt remove these from courthouses? So, are you saying that we should use this as a guideline for American justice? Should we punish people for "not honoring thy father"? What if he is a child molester? Should we charge people for working on the sabbath? Maybe we should start charging people with coveting their neighbers stuff? Yeah, there is no reason for the 10 commandments on our courthouses, because the 10 commandments are NONSENSE! GROW UP!
@rangerstar01 These are laws in which God used to show man they couldn't measure up. That's why the need for Christ. The 10 commandments were to show man that man's morality wasn't enough that there was a higher standard. Yes they make a good guide line for man. Of course man wants his own form of morality. It's OK to lie cheat and steal if the ends justify the means. You can try and pick apart my faith. However, it works for me. Your prerogative not to believe.
@rangerstar01 What's wrong with me praying in school or reading a bible? Nothing other than there are folks that can't stand for Christians to observer their beliefs. What is wrong with me wearing a cross yet there are those that take offense. If I were Muslim you wouldn't be raising any of these concerns.
@1timby "what is wrong with you praying in school or reading the bible"? OK, nothing! Knock yourself out. read your bible all you want, pray all you want! Proselytise all you want! But it cannot be led by the school or government! As for you wearing a cross? I COULD GIVE NOTHING LESS THAN A FUCK if you wear a cross. I DON'T CARE! AND YES, to be honest, I HATE ISLAM more that your silly religion. because you people (although your bible tells you to) dont kill people for your beliefs!
@rangerstar01 You may not care. However the time will come in the near future when I will be punished for just the things you say are OK. Canada has already written legislation to curtail the freedoms of Christians. There are already nations that in prison and kill Christians. This country will not be far off. I'm sure that will suit your needs.
@1timby HAHA! OK, Im sure they will. Keep trying to be tobe the persecuted christian. i am sure it is really hard. Good luck with your punishments. just realise that there are a lotof people who dont believe in your silly superstitions, so keep them to yourself. And yea! I would love it if our country would stop listening to that garbage. Hell is an ancient idea to keep people in line, i am glad ou are following suit. good work, I am glad you consider yourself a SHEEP.
@rangerstar01 Just stating facts, which you're happy to ignore. I don't have any punishments to worry about. Remember I believe, you don't. The worst that can happen is I'm wrong and when I die I go into oblivion. Just because you don't believe doesn't mean there aren't Millions that do. As for keeping my silly superstitions to myself, well that ain't going to happen. You're just going to have to get over it. I would rather be a sheep than a goat. I'm sure you can get that out of the bible.
@1timby Oh, and by the way. Since you are "just stating facts". Feel free to show me ONE! fact that your god exists. JUST ONE! Oh, btw- feel free to ignore the millions who died in the japanse tsunsami's. Oh, and also, ignore all the people who died in 9-11, oh, wait, lets not forget all the people who died in the sri lanka'n tsunamis. I guess god just hated those people. But, maybe your kind thoughtful god just wanted to teach them all a lesson>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
@rangerstar01 Show me one fact that states he doesn't. Since we are being factual, the knowledge man knows about the universe would fit on the edge of a quantum filament. Yet you assume that since the knowledge you seek isn't there it doesn't exist. How arrogant. I don't claim to know everything (like you do). I have to go by faith as I wasn't there when the universe came into being or when man took his first steps. Neither were you or your friends. Don't believe your prerogative.
@rangerstar01 I'm not forgetting those that have dies because of holocausts or those that we killed by men like you that thought their idea of morality was the right one. God didn't cause these things. As I stated you can believe as you wish. However, your opinions are just that YOURS. They don't preclude that mine are incorrect. You're free to exercise them.
@1timby "men like me"? thats the thing you dont get. I have my own morality, i dont need to get it from an ancient fictional book. I am a good person because I want to be a good person. "men like me" dont have to kill people because their invisible friend tells them they have to. Your bible and the koran tell you that you have to kill people who dont believe. I have no reason to hate anyone. Your religion is silly superstition, but i dont hate anyone for it(except those who kill for it).
@rangerstar01 That's right your have you own morality. You may feel it's OK to steal from folks,lie , cheat others. That's why the God is so stringent on the law to show us we can't do it by works. As I've stated, many bad folks thought they were good. I have yet to meet a person that didn't feel they were good. Even though they may fool around on their wives. Cheat on their taxes. Steal from work. However, you do hate Christianity and utilize your misconceptions to bolster that hate.
@1timby Yep, good thing no xtians ever cheat or steal. This is why people cant stand you overly xtian people. You think you own morality.I have just as good of a moral as anyone. Who the hell are you to tell me that you have better morals because you read a silly old book? Your god came up with his top 10 rules and instead of adding rape, incest and childmolesting, he went with 5 rules about how to worship him and stupid crap like working on Sunday, honoring your parents and coveting stuff.
@rangerstar01 I never said that Christians were perfect. Neither does the bible. As usual you look for things that allows you to hate. Yes it really bad to love your neighbor; help others in need, and to love and not hate people like you. Keep telling yourself that all you need is your morality. I never said that I have better morals than you. My morals come from God and it's to him that I will be judged. As for you opinions, well they are just that Opinions. Your prerogative to believe or not.
@1timby Sure, science can't prove everything. But so far, religions haven't proven ANYTHING. You're still at square one, and with religion alone you'd only have pre-used bits of fur to wipe your bum with. A 2-ply tissue is a scientific concept.
@Dracopol What ever. As has been stated in many of my replies to those non believers. DON'T BELIEVE. It's not a difficult concept. I'm not forcing anyone to believe. However, you and yours are very adamant that I don't have the rights to my beliefs. That science has all the answers and that anyone that doesn't agree with your opinions is delusional or worse.
@Dracopol Any honest scientist will state they don't know. Yet you stipulate that you have answers to all things. So that either makes you a liar or delusional. So what part of society do you fit? I would rather be a cog that someone like you feels is faulty than to be someone that is a square block saying they are round; That's only good to tear others down that don't believe as you do. You have nothing to back up your statements other than to be a legend in your own mind.
Great song. I for one am glad that we still have freedom of speech to sing songs like these and to discuss these issues on a forum like this. My hope is that we all will appreciate this freedom and pick our words in a way that shows it.
cmplctn 3 weeks ago 5
I want this song to be play in-front every crowd if Ron Paul Elect, because he is the one that can the save the world and stop the ongoing Pointless War in Arab World.
Angsc09 4 weeks ago
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Angsc09 4 weeks ago
Get the illegals out of our country
STARPOWER1724 4 weeks ago 3
I love this song. It speaks the truth. People we are in America...we dont believe in budda allah abraham WE Americans believe in God. Im glad they drew that line in the sand like they spoke in their CD booklet.
tower915 1 month ago
@tower915 But why do you believe in one god more than another? It's just the oppression of your parents as captive, innocent children. Everybody starts Atheist. No one is going to start worshipping a god unless someone else forces them.
Dracopol 1 month ago
God bless America! <3 +
Musiclover311 1 month ago
@Musiclover311 Was God behind America when it lost the Vietnam War?
Dracopol 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
I love this song.
Sassyladyme 1 month ago
This is a beautiful song! God Bless You!
shyanndreamcatcher 2 months ago
In everything we do let us put God on top.. that would help us through
Cjjharney 2 months ago 9
@Cjjharney Lord Jebus will keep us safe!
lulle103 2 months ago
@lulle103 .... Yeah you are right in there.......God does not sleep. He is the only consolation we have because we know that he sees everything in us....
Cjjharney 2 months ago
@Cjjharney ... thanks for loving a song such as this. music indeed is the language of the soul.. There are feelings unspoken but can be seen in music....
Cjjharney 1 month ago
@Cjjharney Thats not what God wanted. He said to put love first, above all things. Only in loving each other as we love God could we hope to please Him.
GDuff123 1 month ago
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rangerstar01 2 months ago
You all worship a book that advocates slavery, murder genicide and misogyny all while telling us how much love it brings. It is an ancient book written by goat herders who thought the earth was flat. If you believe anything in that book to be true, you need to really get a grip on reality. Read your book before you actually try to preach it. It also tells you that you should not be praying in public (Matthew 6:5), so quit being fckn hypocrites. Get back in your closet and pray.
rangerstar01 2 months ago
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rangerstar01 2 months ago
This stinks
madamewoselle 2 months ago
I think that everyone should decide if they believe in God or not. I for one do not want to die and burn forever in the lake of fire. To each his own.
tarrahp2 2 months ago
@tarrahp2 Ever eaten meat on a Sunday? Or thought your neighbors wife was pretty hot? Had sex without the intent of procreation? Or any of thousands of other ridiculous "rules" handed down by your supposed magic invisible space ghost? If so, sorry buddy, your already f-ed in the a.
6maniac6metal6 2 months ago
@tarrahp2 I specifically do not follow Christianity because I don't want the Lord Porky Pig, true Creator of the universe on Apr. 12, 1937 (together with our false memories of an earlier time) to plant his Cloven Hoof of Retribution and send me to the Bad Place for putting my trust in the Temple Whipper. You see? Who decides? EVERY religion creates a nonsense-story and a sense of journalistic urgency when gradual, non-theistic change, evolution and continental drift are the actual rules.
Dracopol 2 months ago
...I put my trust in Porky. Praise the Lard!
Dracopol 2 months ago
@Dracopol I can see where your coming from bro. But if you don't like God or our beliefs then dont watch and damn videos where believers will be on and comment on. Thank YOu.
mvpro100 2 months ago
@mvpro100 Oh, there is no safe space for your DBS's any more (Delusional Belief-Systems). It will happen that an Atheist association links to your video and says hey lookkit this! It's not going to be a 50-50 debate. Everywhere the information power of the Internet touches, religion is going to lose and disappear. Your children are going to have wireless Internet miniaturized in their CIRCULATORY SYSTEM. They will be informed, and so they won't be religious.
Dracopol 2 months ago
@tarrahp2 Lake of what-what? How does that square with the fact we've radared the whole Earth's core and we know what's under our feet, and there's no place for lakes of fire at any temperature where people can survive for any meaningful suffering... Honestly, dude, get a science education.
Dracopol 1 month ago
@6maniac6metal6 No, I think its you that's disgusting. And whoever makes "music" like that is too.
OldWesternFan 2 months ago
@OldWesternFan No, all that stuff I listen to is always very tongue in cheek, with incredible amounts of musicality and originality. This is purely message driven, with the aim to give control of the country back into the hands of a religious cult, and just the fact that people support this makes me physically ill. Death Metal is all in good fun, but this trash is what is truly dangerous.
6maniac6metal6 2 months ago
This song is fucking disgusting, and thats coming from a guy who listens to music about mutilating still borns. If you believe in god, you're fucking retarded.
6maniac6metal6 2 months ago
@6maniac6metal6 uncalled for. I have never wronged you, yet you feel the need to insult me.
soccerking4497 2 months ago
@soccerking4497 I apologize, really, but I had just read an article about the Westboro and was pretty fired up. I didn't mean it as a personal attack against anyone, but after moving from free thinking northern California to small town Texas where even mentioning being an Atheist can be dangerous, and even cost me a job, the whole idea of all these Christians spouting on about acceptance and understanding, and then going on about putting the Government in gods hands is just a horrifying prospect
6maniac6metal6 2 months ago
"I have sworn upon the alter of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man." - Thomas Jefferson. In other words, let people make their own decisions.
OldWesternFan 2 months ago
@OldWesternFan You should look look up the full context of the Jefferson quote. He was speaking out against the clergy, whom he said were afraid he would use his powers in opposition to their schemes! But they deliberately butchered his lines on the Jefferson Monument so as not to offend the devout tourists who view it.
Dracopol 2 months ago
"As the government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion,..." --Article 11 of the Treaty of Tripoli, 1797, signed between the Bey of Tripoli (a Muslim ruler) and the Government of the United States.
Dracopol 2 months ago
@Dracopol Your point?
malbuff 2 months ago
@malbuff That there has always been separation of church and state in the United States, and that the government has never considered itself a Christian government or "under God".
Dracopol 2 months ago
@Dracopol Just because a country's government was not founded upon a certain religion does not mean the country itself was not influenced by it. To say that Biblical, Christian values served no purpose at this time is completely wrong. While the Founding Fathers were against forming a theocracy at the NATIONAL level, they DID NOT believe in a complete separation of church and state at ALL levels of government. It was left up to the individual states to decide.
18chigirl 1 month ago
@18chigirl What is the EVIDENCE they did not believe in a complete and total separation of church and state? Christian values have contributed extremely negatively to the U.S.A. To use a relevant example, it completely outlawed female orgasm until Kinsey did his surveys to reveal to a shocked American public that they existed.
Dracopol 1 month ago
@Dracopol My evidence? NOWHERE in the Constitution will you find the phrase "separation of church and state." Now, where is your EVIDENCE?
18chigirl 1 month ago
@18chigirl Haha, nice try. Of course it's not in the Constitution, but it's in the First Amendment. The government can't make a law establishing religion. The Supreme Court made a series of rulings about its application to states since 1847.
Dracopol 1 month ago
@Dracopol Haha what? Obviously the Establishment Clause prohibits the government from establishing a national religion, but nowhere does it state that religion was to be entirely separate from state and local governments. How could there have been? The Founding Fathers endorsed freedom OF religion, not freedom FROM religion. There's a difference, and while the difference may be subtle to some, it does exist.
18chigirl 1 month ago
@18chigirl We should have freedom FROM religion, in the Soviet style. That fosters explosive progress and explains why a country that started an agrarian society could pwn the United States and become first with a satellite and a man in space.
Dracopol 1 month ago
@Dracopol Ahhh, ..."in the Soviet style?" You're kidding right? I guess I should have known, most communists think alike. There was no freedom from religion in the Soviet Union because the Soviets promoted atheism. And that is the same thing as promoting any singular religion, except now YOU agree with it. The fact of the matter is, the United States has (and I pray to GOD will continue to be) a religious nation. To say that history hasn't been shaped by religion is just wrong
18chigirl 1 month ago
Everyone who doesn't believe in this song or God should look up Brad Stine here on YouTube. Watch the video titled "good news". Or watch all of his videos :).
OldWesternFan 2 months ago
Ah, these are not "Myths" no wonder you don't know what your talking about. hahahahahah...
JJOYIA 2 months ago
Barf. Horrible. And not very American. Thank God this country saves me from people like this imposing their myths on me.
groovy65baby 2 months ago
Barf.
groovy65baby 2 months ago
In which god do we still trust? I've always liked Thor and Odin. Powerful and wise, but not perfect. I know some still trust in Shiva and Vishnu, but because my culture has not exposed me to them, they can't possibly exist. Those really old Egyptian gods were wild, especially when it came to sexuality. No wonder Christianity borrowed heavily from those writings. I'm not so sure about Allah. Why would a god who needed a book written about himself approach an illiterate to get the job done?
ChipArgyle 3 months ago
@ChipArgyle It was good enough for Isis / She will save us in a crisis / And she's never raised her prices / So it's good enough for me! ("Gimme That REAL Old Time Religion")
Dracopol 1 month ago
Very cool. Still one of the greatest bands out there.
bigshowmusic 3 months ago
@rangerstar I would like to see you question those top ranked well respected scientist. But wait you know it all right? And they knew nothing right? You keep your beliefs thats your right as an american.
Ce1ticwarri0r 3 months ago
@rangerstar some of your famous scientist who believe in god: Nichola Copernicus,Sir Francis Bacon,Johannes Kepler,Galileo Galilei,Isaac Newton,Albert Einstein and many more. How about you educating yourself
Ce1ticwarri0r 3 months ago
@Ce1ticwarri0r Funny how the scientists you mentioned are all way before modern science. BTW- Copernicus and Galileo were persecuted by YOUR church and threatened with excommunication because they went against church belief that the Earth was the center of the universe. That is what your church does when people go against theyir beliefs. The only reason they were Christian was because they would have been burned at the stake if they didnt said they didnt believe.
rangerstar01 3 months ago
@Ce1ticwarri0r Funny how almost all the people you named are from before modern science. Galileo and Copernicus were persecuted and threatened with death and excommunication from your church because they said that the Earth was not the center of the universe and it revolved around the sun. A fact (like evolution) that your ignorant church would not accept. The only reason they would be considered Christian is because your church had a funny way of burning people at the stake who didnt believe.
rangerstar01 3 months ago
@Ce1ticwarri0r Oh, now, wait a minute! Albert Einstein did not believe in a God like you do. In fact he was an ex-Jew, trying to RUN AWAY from this other guy and his soldiers, the SS, who all had "God With Us" on their belt-buckles but had a completely different idea of God, one that encouraged them to KILL ALL JEWS. None of these scientists did anything because of religious faith. In fact, Galileo had to OPPOSE religious faith to get the truth out, that the Earth goes around the Sun.
Dracopol 2 months ago
@Dracopol Finally someone who actually knows some fckn history. Well done Drac. At least were not all delusional idiots. i love how people claim galileo and copernicus to be xtian..like they had a fckn choice. A flaming hot poker down the throat will make anyone a christian i guess.
rangerstar01 2 months ago
@rangerstar01 - Snotty little insulter. ALL who disagree w/thee are "delusional idiots". Pathetic. Actually, Drac is incomplete, at the very nicest. All people need to do online is make a claim & no support. OY. The "under God" is from Lincoln- that's where the added phrase to our Pledge came from. Many founders, etc., would disagree with Drac on his SPECIFIC claim.
The First Amendment was created to forbid state churches & limitations on freedom OF religion- my posts use reason & document it
harry4health 2 months ago
@harry4health The words "under God" were only added to the Pledge of Allegiance in 1954! I saw a Porky Pig cartoon, "Old Glory" which was full of patriotic crap but, being 1939, they did NOT have "under God" in the pledge when they showed Porky reading it from a book. Do the generations become MORE religiously pious over time, so they add God? I doubt it; you can't match the religiosity of your ancestors. I'm insulting you there; look up the nuances of the word "religiosity".
Dracopol 2 months ago
@Dracopol - I specified "under God" was ADDED. I know in 1950s, too. U didn't address- it's source is Abe Lincoln. U added nothing new. I know Porky cartoon- I have it.
Being patriotic isn't crap. U can always move to S Korea.
Wondering about time/becoming more pious is irrelevant. UR insult is not surprising & childish. I doubt U really have enough knowledge to say who is more pious. I could care less about word "religiosity". Depth of spiritual devotion go beyond UR shallow slam. Irrelevant.
harry4health 2 months ago
@harry4health But there is no spirit. Who's the bigger fool, the one who convinced you there were "spiritual" things, or you for believing it with no proof? Only scientists can characterize and prove invisible things, not the religionists. There is only matter, and man's ability to deal with it. Even his emotions are material.
Dracopol 2 months ago
@harry4health Under god was added to our money and pledge in the 50's because people tought that it would keep communism out of the country. It had nothing to do with the founding fathers or constitution. realistically, it is against the constitution, which is why the pledge was banned in schools. not because people didnt want kids pledging to their country, but because they should not be forced to pledge anything to a god they may or may not believe in.
rangerstar01 2 months ago
@harry4health And BTW- there is not one peice of evidence that Jesus ever existed. You take it as fact, but it is not. NOTHING outside of the bible shows any evidence at all of jesus existing. I am not saying that "A" jesus didnt exist, but for someone who claimed to be the son of god, it is fairly peculiar that NOT ONE person in that time ever mentioned it in any contemporary literature. And the people who wrote the NT wrote it many deacdes after jesus supposedy died, and none ever met him
rangerstar01 2 months ago
@harry4health by the way "w/Thee" do you think that jesus and your bible folk actually talked like that? Do you also think that Jesus was a white, blue eyed blonde guy that you see in all the pictures? Ha! i bet. Wow. Cant imagine why the church would completely make up an image of jesus to look just like all of the eastern european white people they were trying to convert. thats a Shocker! Just imagine a white blue eyed jesus walking around Palistine saying "where art thou". Genius.
rangerstar01 2 months ago
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rangerstar01 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 I feel really sorry for you.There is only one God and He's the One that diamond rio is singing about in that song.And what are you talking about? the only ppl killing ppl is the ones who hate Jesus Christ! Again I feel terribly sorry for u and may God,the Father of Abraham.Isaac,Moses, have mercy on you!!!
becky5492 3 months ago
@becky5492 We don't really want the "mercy" that Jesus showed, whipping people (John 2:15), merchants who were SUPPOSED to be right there (Deut. 14:24-27). Jesus whipped men women and children, Moses killed a man, sheesh, it's a veritable Rogue's Gallery in the Judaeo-Jewish religion! Best to be Atheist, because take away their bluster and arrogance and threats, they never PROVED there was any God in the first place. Therefore we must admit NO God, no spirits and no souls!
Dracopol 2 months ago
@Dracopol - Ah, Jesus in TEMPLE w/money changers is not Deut 14 w/agricultural TITHE, not sacrifices & they took part of TITHE to eat in SANCTUARY., so U misapply Deut. Also, it doesn't say he whipped anyone-never mind kids! Looking at all accounts of 2 cleansing of TEMPLE, they were overcharging- "merchandize", "robbers". His aim was "robbers", not kiddies.
YOUNG Moses killed a man because he saw him BEATING an Egyptian slave
Did he MEAN to kill?
"Rouge's Gallery" is sloppy & irresponsible.
harry4health 2 months ago
@harry4health Nothing justifies violence. You can't just arbitrarily say Canaanites, or merchants, or a slave-driver or anyone are "evil" and justify attacking them and killing them. That is Old Testament thinking, and it makes Jesus, and Moses, absolutely unsuitable role-models for anyone to follow. It is much better to be Atheist; you know and accept you will have tempers and shortcomings and there is no source of "supernatural" strength that will stop you if it didn't stop Jesus or Moses!
Dracopol 2 months ago
@Dracopol - UR persistent mocking & ridiculing others/belief in God shows UR infantile mentality & immaturity. Typical for atheist proselytizers of Militant Atheism of Dawkins, et al.
U don't know whether some are best w/religious beliefs. UR a hollow, mocking, condescending, ridiculing, empty, holier-than-thou atheist with JUST as much of a 'fundamentalist' mindset against religion & God as atheists point to others as having.
harry4health 1 month ago
@harry4health It's not a matter of being EMOTIVE, it's a matter of being FACTUAL. As adults, we are called to live FACTUALLY. Technological progress is not built on falsehoods but on what is most correct, what explains the most facts and can be used to get to more facts. No one in charge of our governments, business, corporations, is going to pay your emotional outbursts any credence. Why should I? We must accept the FACT there is no God or spirits.
Dracopol 1 month ago
@Dracopol - YOUNG Moses killed a man because he saw him BEATING an Egyptian slave. There's NO hint he MEANT to kill him.
Did he MEAN to kill?
U continuing to use this shows your illogical blindness is emotional, not intellectual.
There's no INTENT to MURDER there. He was DEFENDING someone BEING MURDERED.
BUT- thou KNOWEST "NOTHING justifies violence".
Maybe Moses should try to Tickle Tactic?
HITLER & NAZIS would MELT under the Tickle Tactic!
What a naive, dangerous flower child...
harry4health 1 month ago
@harry4health Moses and Jesus are still criminals with indelible criminal records in our terms. They are NOT role-models, so you should therefore wean yourself from religion. You have made extremely emotive attacks against me, but it's because you are IDENTIFYING too much with the toxic drug you have taken. If you distance yourself from religion, you won't feel personal damage from the shrapnel when it implodes...
Dracopol 1 month ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@Dracopol:AGAIN-Jesus in TEMPLE w/money changers is not Deut 14's agricultural TITHE, it's not sacrifices. They took part of TITHE to EAT in SANCTUARY
It doesn't say Jesus whipped anyone-esp. kids! Looking at all accounts of temple cleansing, they were overcharging- "merchandize", "robbers". His aim was clearing temple of "robbers", not whipping kiddies. No record of whipping PEOPLE
UR EMPTY & DISTORT NT when some intellectual integrity & careful reading would show what was & was NOT
harry4health 1 month ago
@Dracopol - U wouldn't know. Where's UR objective standard of moral right & wrong? Please DO tell. U have none, so U can't say if violence is never "justifie[d]".
Also, me thinks Hitler wiping out millions "justified" "violence" against the Nazis.
Talk about DBS ("Delusional-Belief System"). U a pacifist?
U IGNORED my reply to U, in typical, illogical, intellectually-dwarfed atheist fashion, distorted Bible. Funny how atheists feel they have the intellectual upper edge, but bomb
harry4health 1 month ago
@harry4health Atheists have the highest moral standard because it is based on factuality, not invisible spirits floating around, ever-powerful but also ever-invisible. Really, this is simple stuff covered already in the "myths against Atheism" section of atheism dot about dot com. Can Atheists be moral? Sure. The person you want to kill today may yet do you a service tomorrow. So it is wrong to kill a human resource. No God is needed to conclude that!
Dracopol 1 month ago
@Dracopol - What nonsense. U R so shallow & clueless. Believers accept they have short tempers, etc. They just don't have UR non-standard of just accepting they do & just let them go into full gear. U don't beleive in self-control, etc? R U amoral by admission?
Atheists like U would screw a society.
Yeah, the crowds rampaging in a mall, stepping over people, fighting, stabbing over a sneaker- yup! They aren't pesky believers who use self-control!
WHAT a WONDERFUL way to go!
OH BOY!
harry4health 1 month ago
@harry4health Your emotional attacks and your refusal to provide any sort of proof of invisible spirits does not weigh very well in my accepting your point of view? Why should I? Nobody adopts religion willingly as an adult any more, now that we are free. It's only captive children caught in an abusive system from birth these days. And once again you still have a view of Atheists as amoral animals. Emotions are NOT a valid way of making decisions, and neither is theism.
Dracopol 1 month ago
@harry4health Atheists have the highest moral standard because they have factuality, not belief in invisible things that motivate them without a sign ever given from these beings. The one in the driver's seat is actually your theistic "pastor" (making you a sheep?), who can be more evil than you! Remember that even the atomic bomb must be laid at the feet of the religious, since the born-again generals felt they were bombing Japanese pagans, and a chaplain BLESSED the Enola Gay.
Dracopol 1 month ago
the actual facts are that although Jesus , as a person may have existed, there is no evidence at all that he made any miracles at all. There are many historians who lived during that time, and not once was JC ever mentioned. Suck it up. you got sucked into an ancient story. I am sorry you fell for it, but grow up. Miracles don't happen. Although we would all like to think they do. They dont. Live your life as you should. Like it is the ony one you have.
rangerstar01 3 months ago
@rangerstar haha. Southern hick? Wow real original my family didnt come hear from irland and germany and fight in all these wars for what they believed in for some stupid ass dip shit like you to say our beliefs are wrong religon has been around alot fucking longer then science fiction bit that why this country is great you have the freedom to beleive what you want
Ce1ticwarri0r 3 months ago
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rangerstar01 3 months ago
@ rangerstar you need to stop being so absent minded you show that you know the bible quite well. Hopefully you dont pray for anything including when time ever get the roughest and stop using our churches for marraige isnt that being a hypocryt. Keep up the good work though he who denies thy father will not have his fill of the tree of life I know he who does believe will. And people like you will just be WORM FOOD!
Ce1ticwarri0r 3 months ago
Religon has been in this country since our founding fathers even our first president.If you rangerstar want religon out of this country how about you and your followers of ignorants leave this country wouldnt miss you there is more religous people in this country then measley scientist.Religon doesnt hide the truth your science hides everything and only gives you alittle bit to know,in secure facilities maybe what there hiding is nothing because they have nothing they just want you to think that
Ce1ticwarri0r 3 months ago
@Ce1ticwarri0r I will be honest here. I have no idea what you just said. Um, good work. you are definitely makeing the cause for the uneducated southern hick christian go far. Well done. How about this. You try and read about law and the constitution and realise that I am the one person actually defending it. unless you want people laying down mats and praying to allah in your schools. Yeah, I dont want that shit either. But the way you are going, that is what you will get.
rangerstar01 3 months ago
@1timby whats funny science says for something to be real the 5 sensorys have to be used but that I wonder if scientist even have brains? You cant see, feel, smell, hear or taste there brain so how do we know it real or if they have one and if it even there
Ce1ticwarri0r 3 months ago
@1timby good point the other point rangerstar01 forgets is science is like a religon or otherwise they wouldnt get so pissed off when there faith in science is being tested
Ce1ticwarri0r 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 im starting to enjoy these debates but moving on yes I am a believer of christ and yes I have learnd science but I dont believe in the big bang theory or evolution, yes men have created medicine with the plants and minerals from this earth and technology is expanding however the further science comes the more it proves biblical history science just doesnt want to admit it
Ce1ticwarri0r 3 months ago
@Ce1ticwarri0r So then maybe you can explain how Noah took a kangaroo from Australia onto the Ark without any evidence the animal was carried to or from that place? The Ark, according to the silly Bible story, landed on a mountain nowhere near Australia, with only the number of species an ignorant desert people THOUGHT there might be in the world, not the millions we actually know of now.
Dracopol 1 month ago
@Dracopol So maybe you could regale us with how the universe created itself Mr Wizard. Tells us how matter came into being from nothingness? Maybe how life started. We all could use a big laugh.
1timby 1 month ago
@1timby But science HAS explained it. It might even have filtered down to the science-classes you cut. Equal particles of matter and antimatter can pop out of nothingness spontaneously and at random. No physical laws are broken since they still add up to zero. They USUALLY re-form immediately, but not necessarily when physical laws are different. Isn't it odd how half our universe is matter, and half anti-matter...Meanwhile, religion has arm-waving "magic" as its explanation.
Dracopol 1 month ago
@Dracopol So which part of THEORY don't you understand? So where's your proof that matter popped out of nothingness to create anything? Science tries to fill huge gaps with this untried unproven fluff. Then you call Christians gullible? So Mr Wizard show us this anti-mater, dark mater, quantum filaments etc you speak of. You can't because it's an observation by someone that could just as possible be found wrong tomorrow. But hey some egg head said so. So a duffus like you can argue.
1timby 1 month ago
@1timby "Duffus"? It's so easy to find your silly messages in the huge page; I just word-search for the misspellings. Theory has a different meaning in science than for the layman, so stop your Creationist-style whining that "it's just a theory". We are further ahead in understanding material and social things with science than with religion. Religion never EXPLAINED anything, just bullied people's minds (mainly while young) to believe.
Dracopol 1 month ago
@Dracopol I try not to use big words as you already have trouble with the simple ones. Theory are just theories. DUFFUS. I'm in the scientific realm and have been for 30+ years. So stop you unproven unrealistic whining that science has the answers and realize you don't even understand either side of the argument. You're the one that started the attach. So maybe you need to drop back and take a long look in the mirror. See who's bulling whom.
1timby 1 month ago
@Ce1ticwarri0r Science and theology have often been seen as against one another. I firmly believe the two are inextricably linked and remind folks many of the greatest scientists in history have been Christians.
magoodfellow 3 months ago
@magoodfellow Science is the antithesis of theology. Theology deals with "faith" (belief without evidence). Science does not deal in anything without evidence and testable hypothesis. We know that silly stories (Noah, jonah) and miracles of the Bible or the Koran never happen. Those who claim they did, are denying fact and accepting myths that contradict what we already know about physics, biology, geology,cosmology and evolution. You cant just say "I believe" so it is true in science.
rangerstar01 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 What about dark mater. What about the number of dimensions to make Higgs theory work. They are no more than theories. So believe in hypothesizes and theories. Science can't prove anything. Why can't miracles happen? Just because you don't believe doesn't make it so. You have faith in things. You have faith the sun will rise tomorrow without proof. You make plans for the future without proof you will be alive. That my friend is faith in action. Science hasn't disproved God.
1timby 3 months ago
@1timby Name one miracle that has ever happened. Miracles dont happen because they go against natural laws. Lets look at your bible. The first to write about Jesus was John. He never knew of any miracles. Then Mark- Also, wrote of none of the miracles attributed to jesus. Matt writes about a few miracles, and then Luke and John get all miracle crazy. Whats more likely, that John and Mark (the first writers) didn't know of the miracles, or that the others made them up to jazz up the story?
rangerstar01 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 Feeding the 5000. Turning water to wine. Raising himself from the dead, healing the sick/blind/afflicted. I don't get your point about the different books. If I ask 5 individuals at a crime scene I'm going to get 5 different versions of what happened. Does that make what the people saw any different or wrong. NO. Same for the gospels. Different writers for different audiences. So what's your point.
1timby 3 months ago
@1timby None of the writers of the canonical gospels ever met jesus. they were written many decades after his death and nobody knows who wrote them. Mark (40 years after JC death) mentions no miracles, not even virgin birth. Matt and Luke wrote their book directly from what mark wrote, only they added some miracles. John wrote about 70 years after jesus died. The whole idea of christianity was based on Pauls writings and Paul admits he never met jesus in person and mentions no miracles.
rangerstar01 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 And you know this how? Where you there? What's your proof the gospels where written by anyone other that the orig authors. Mat has many mentions of Christ's healing of the sick (all miracles). What proof do you have that the other Gospels where plagiarized? Paul did in fact see Christ as he was struck blind on the road to Damascus. Believe as you wish, however, your opinion are just that OPINION. Anyone who is really wanting to disprove the bible has tried and failed. Even you.
1timby 3 months ago
@1timby You need to read a bit. It is widely accepted by almost all biblical historians that the writers of the gospels where not the actual desciples. It is not even a question anymore. As for plagiarism, yes it is also an accepted fact that Matt and Lukes writers took their stories from Mark: Of Mark's 666 verses, some 600 of them appear in Matt, and 300 in Luke. he was absolutely the source for both. Unless you just want to ignore the evidence, which you certainly have a proclivity to do.
rangerstar01 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 None of the biblical historians I seen. There is a reason that the gospels are similar as they came from the group. If you were to provide me with the evidence other than hear-say. I would be glad to entertain your opinions. Remember these are distinct books and not a culmination of tales to compose a book. Each of these gospels were intended to reach different audiences.
1timby 3 months ago
@1timby Yep, because they were told to different people, that completely excuses the fact that they all completely contradict each other. Makes sense. Really. i dont care if you want to ignore the fact that you believe ancient fairy tales. My 4 year old believes in the tooth fairy. Thats fine. Just dont bring it into big boy world. We adults like to live in reality. BTW- everything about the bible is "hear-say". there is no evidence that your JC ever exhisted, except "hear-say".
rangerstar01 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 I'm not ignoring anything. They don't contradict each other. You may want to believe that. Again that's your prerogative. The timelines match the narrative matches and the facts match.
As for whether Jesus existed, you may want to read up on your history. There are accounts from rulers and governor of the times that collaborate the existence of Jesus. Again you can believe as you wish.
1timby 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 It's nice you 4 year old believes in the tooth fairy. However, that's not relevant to the conversation. I could go on quoting facts but you're not going to believe anything that I provide. You obviously are looking for an argument and guess what. Not going to happen. Don't believe. When you die, and you most certainly will, we'll see. I'm willing to wager that I'm right. I have nothing to loose. Can't say the same for you.
Have a nice life......
1timby 3 months ago
@1timby Yep. Ignore it all you want. but now I bet you are going to look into it. and then you are going to realise that everything you have ever believed is absolute nonsense. see, i have studied your silly bible. I know everything about it. So, instead of reading bout it, and actually listening to biblical scholars (most of which are christians) you can keep denying facts. because that is what you do. Deny fact. You got sucked into a ancient scam. sorry. I know it sucks. but deal with it.
rangerstar01 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 I realize you might have read the bible but it's obvious you never understood it. I feel sorry for you that you took the time to read something and didn't get anything out of what you read or studied. You obviously missed the good parts trying to find something to hate. Christianity is about love and helping other. You have taken things and turned them into something they aren't. As I stated it works for me. In the end we'll both know how was right.
1timby 3 months ago
@1timby And BTW- I was kind of a christian when i read the bible. I believed in all this stuff. I wasn't looking for things to hate. I decided that i believed, so i should probably read the book. The book is what made me an atheist. It is complete nonsense and anyone who can read that and still believe it is true is either a child, intelectually slow or delusional/brainwashed. It is possible that there is a god (doubtful), but it is damn sure not the one in that book.
rangerstar01 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 Kind of a Christian. Is that like being kinda pregnant or kinda dead? That's the problem, it's an all or nothing deal. Reading your bible; attending church, etc doesn't make one a Christian. Think of it this way. God is way above us, so for me to state that I can understand God then He wouldn't be much of a God. It takes Faith and a continual striving to be like Jesus. Not out of fear or expectation of reward but because of love.
1timby 3 months ago
@1timby And yes, I do hate xtianity. I hate all religions. They all teach intolerence and that ignorance is a virtue. Instead of trying to figure out how the world works, you just say "godidit" and you dont have to think anymore. If we all did like you do we would still think the earth was flat and epileptics were "possesed". You make a stament that I think i know everything. You couldnt be more wrong. You are the arrogant one who thinks you know all."godidit" is your answer to everything.
rangerstar01 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 It's OK to hate religion. God does too. It teaches intolerance, hate, greed, etc. Christianity isn't a religion. I thought that I had already explained the difference. So science has it all worked out. Interesting. Last time I checked that had more questions than answers. No facts just theories. So it's OK for you to believe in someones wild theory? How is that any different that believing in something not evident and using faith? So you talk in circles. What do you really believe?
1timby 3 months ago
@1timby "God hates religion" And you know this how? Are you saying that you know gods thoughts? Does he speak to you? Read the definition of religion. Dont try to distance yourself from it. You guys are tryingto get all tricky because more than ever people are turning away from religion because we have access to more information and we no longer have to look to superstition for answers. That and pedephile clergy and scumbag evangelists, you are losing your sheep in vast numbers. Halleluja.
rangerstar01 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 Ttry reading the bible. I've stated already what Christ said about religion. And what information do you have that gives you the true meaning of life. Last time I checked, science can't provide anything other that theories and hypothesizes utilizing a very limited tool set as well as limited knowledge. You may believe theories if you wish. Don't try to pass them off as facts. Dark matter, Higgs theories of 10 dimensions, universe just happened, etc. Failure of Newtonian physics.
1timby 3 months ago
@1timby I have said this before. Just because something is called a "theory" does not mean it is not fact. Gravitational theory, Germ theory, Theory of relativity. All theories. Guess what. They are also facts (unless you dont believe in gravity). Of course science has more questions than answers, that is part of it. You are the one who thinks you have all the answers. but I bet we will get a lot more answers investigating and coming up with theories than by saying "GODIDIT".
rangerstar01 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 Well Mr Wizard maybe you should look up the def of Theory. Gravitation Theory doesn't work at the sub-atomic level. Try reading Higgs theories. Newtonian Physics fails at the sub-atomic level. Relativity is just that and disproves Newtonian Physics. Science is so fallible. Now your putting words in my mouth. Especially since I stated I don't know. I do know that science is a fallible and at least admits it. However, you deam to know everything.
1timby 3 months ago
@1timby Tadah! Magic! Godidit! ou believe a book of fairy tales that my son wouldnt even believe. I am assuming you are an adult. So bravo. If i took the biblical stories such as Noah or Jonah and inserted jack and the beanstalk, it would be impossible to tell which was supposed to be real and which was a fairy tale. How can you possibly talk about Higgs theory and physics and freely admit that you believe those childish stories as real. How can your brain reconcile that with common logic?
rangerstar01 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 Tadah it just happened. So believe what science says. How's that any different. Oh since you are a theologian and a doctorate in physics as well as biology you know. Wow. I'm sorry that I questioned you. I thought my many years in the science field prepared me to at least have some reasonable questions. However, I should have googled you instead. You have the vast store of all knowledge. I suppose that came in handy when you created the universe and all life.
1timby 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 Well Mr Wizard I can talk of science as I've spent my career in the scientific realm. I happen to know that science knows very little (real facts) about how things happened. As I stated just theories. I forgot theories are really facts is hiding. With your PHD in Theology and the varied sciences I thought you would have gleaned that by now. I would have thought that you understood that Faith is the evidence of things unseen or understood. Science calls them Theories. You knew that.
1timby 3 months ago
@1timby ...it takes Faith, AND a good strengthening of your whip-hand and the ability to tie knots! (John 2:15).
Dracopol 1 month ago
@Dracopol Good one. You should be a stand up comedian is say Cuba, Russia, or maybe one of the better Mideastern nations such as Iran. I'm sure they would appreciate your humor there. Maybe a remedial reading course would be better. Then you could at least understand the passages of which you base your comments.
1timby 1 month ago
@1timby They will appreciate the humour EVERYWHERE! An adult never exposed to the story before would laugh at the story of an all-powerful, perfect God creating an imperfect universe with sin, the solution to it somehow NOT being direct action but cutting off a body-part, calling it his son, and sending this son down to go apeshit on merchants and get nailed by the Romans on sticks of wood somehow makes the universe all better, although VISUALLY nothing changed in society. Funny!
Dracopol 1 month ago
@Dracopol I know many folk that would laugh at what science calls factual theories. What you spout is the same. Your thoughts and opinions are just that. They have nothing behind them other than what you state. Maybe a trip down history lane will provide you with a hint of what Christianity has done for man kind. Of course that would take some honest effort in which you are incapable to perform.
1timby 1 month ago
@1timby I'm not taking a trip down YOUR biased museum of how great Christianity is. There is even Christianity in the Hiroshima Bomb, since born-again generals forced the scientists to make it, and an Army chaplain blessed the Enola Gay with its payload of death for 250,000 people. They were PEOPLE, not "godless Japanese heathens" like the born-again Christian generals thought. I bet you are using selective accounting, and not counting the negative aspects of Christianity like that.
Dracopol 1 month ago
@Dracopol And you don't trip down your real of unreality. Was there any morality in the murdering of millions by Stalin, Pol Pot, Castro, etc. Hmm. You have a selective memory. Man did that not Christians.
1timby 1 month ago
@1timby Christianity is about Jesus whipping people to get his way. (John 2:15) Nothing more. It's the usual Old Testament story of Middle Eastern tribes portraying their neighbours as absolute evil, to justify overruning them and killing them utterly. Not a role-model for a modern, progressive civilization. Even "adultery" does not mean what you think it is, but more like adulterating wine with foreign substances i.e. interracial marriages that the prophet Nehemiah condemned.
Dracopol 1 month ago
@Dracopol Some more of your opinions. Obviously you don't have a grasp of Christianity or anything else. So an uneducated person offering their opinion about things they don't understand or know if off little use other than to do what you seem to do best. Argue. Something it's better to keep your opinions to your self as you have proven to everyone how little you know about the subject.
1timby 1 month ago
@1timby It's not a matter of ignorance of a bullshit doctrine. The Scientologists crow the same line when challenged about THEIR bizarre beliefs. YOU have a belief that you can do SOME SHIT to get Eternal Life, even though your brain is not built to handle the memories and would fill up like a 128 MB memory-card in a camera taken to a vacation in Cancún. You also believe violence against "evil" people (defined by you) is justified. Lucy, you've got a lot of 'splaining to do!
Dracopol 1 month ago
@Dracopol Agin yu voice your opinions without factual backup. You provide nothing but attitude and loathing for something you don't know anything about. Sounds to me like a spoiled 2 year old that can get their way. They don't want to be held accountable for their actions. They don't want to be told by mom and dad what to do. So they go about life thinking what they have to say has any relevance to reality other than their own. How pitiful you are.
1timby 1 month ago
@1timby What evidence or proof have you EVER given for your invisible God? You are living in a robotic mode, controlled by witch-doctors who happened to discover psychological manipulation techniques before actual psychologists, bound by ethics, did. You are under MIND CONTROL. That's what religion is, and it's time to break your conditioning because it does you harm.
Dracopol 1 month ago
@Dracopol Well creation of the universe. I would think that should be enough for someone as egotistical as you. Wow and God couldn't create a man. Opps already said and did that. Man's ethics, no thanks. We've already seen prime examples of man's ethics. History if full of those examples. As far as harm, again you no so very little that it's like a one cell amoeba trying to convince a person that they are the center of the universe.
1timby 1 month ago
@1timby But we KNOW what happens when YOU die. Your friends will witness it. All thought will stop, brain-tissue dying in 10 minutes from lack of oxygen, never to be reconstituted again, like a computer program in RAM when you pull the plug. Then the bacteria, held back by your life-processes, will attack your body tissues with a vengeance once you die, converting it to carbon dioxide which will be dispersed throughout the world's atmosphere, never to be reconstituted.
Dracopol 1 month ago
@Dracopol So Mr Wizard you've been there and done that. Wow. I have to tip my hat and congregate you on the test. So which hospital or facility did you performs these test. I would love to read the findings. Hopeful you understand that I'm being factitious. Science doesn't understand what all happens after death and unless I'm mistaken no one has gone for a few weeks and came back to verify your findings. Obviously you can't validate your opinion. So it's totally worthless.
1timby 1 month ago
@1timby What?! An idiot like you takes a cock-and-bull story that a guy killed by the Romans for a whipping offense is somehow the saviour of all mankind, that his dead corpse when nailed to wood somehow emanated mysterious rays that suddenly improved everyone's lot in life, and you say *I* can't validate MY opinion? You'd better start presenting some POSITIVE PROOF IN FAVOUR of what you're saying. Extraordinary claims require EXTRAORDINARY, whale-like amounts of proof.
Dracopol 1 month ago
@Dracopol Let me see, the universe made itself. Oh no it was the big bang that did it. No it was dark mater. Well science doesn't really know so they have to make up something to fill the gap. So that the ignorant, like you, can boast they know everything even without facts. So bather on about your ignorance. Trolls are like that.
1timby 1 month ago
@1timby You can expect refinements of knowledge as we go along. And the commenter did not SAY dark matter made the universe. How many times has religion changed its mind? Ra made the universe, oh no it was Odin, oh no it was Jesus Christ the three-in-one head with God! The way to go about determining it is to provide evidence and proof, and see what theory best fits the facts! No appeals to authority or moldy sheepskins written by shepherds...
Dracopol 1 month ago
@Dracopol Religion may have changed it's mind. Again you know little of what you speak. Big difference in religion and a faith. Christianity has only one God. There is no Odin, Zeus, etc. However, science has a flavor of the month when it comes to creation and evolution. You don't even have that much. Of course there's that nice find a few years back concerning the missing link. Pig bones and other animals. Again you're clueless.
1timby 1 month ago
@Dracopol con't try looking out side sometime and get out from under the bridge. Trolls do have eyes don't they. Look at the stars and the universe. Even someone as stupid as you can understand that the universe couldn't make it self.Well maybe not. So what claims have you provided that makes your opinions worth anything? None. Just ignorant blatherings from a no think-um.
1timby 1 month ago
@1timby Did God make himself? You set inconsistent rules for cause and effect, all in the service of your invisible God.
Dracopol 1 month ago
@Dracopol Good one. Did the universe make itself. Did life start because it was struck by lightning? Those are the questions you need to ask yourself. Wow and science has all the answers. If not at least they can go to you since you seem to contain all the knowledge of the universe. A veritable legend in your own mind. I just wish I knew half as much as you thought you did.
1timby 1 month ago
@1timby And no, science cannot disprove god, but it can explain things you attribute to god naturally (xtians used attribute thunder to god being angry, science explained that). I really dont care what you believe. The whole point is that I, as well as millions of others DO NOT believe. Therefore, OUR government cannot endorse a religion or it would be favoring some citizens over others. It is against the constitution. My taxes should not pay for it. Pray all you want in private.
rangerstar01 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 So you don't care what I believe. Then why all the fuss? There are Millions that do believe. That's not the point. See even if no one else believed as I do, I would still believe. Science gives people the delusion that it's theories are facts. You should do some research into what you believe. Scientists state they don't know but have theories. Theories are not facts. Our government can't establish a religion it doesn't preclude that it's constituency can't worship as they want.
1timby 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 So how are you paying for religion? The only things I see are a bunch of folks costing everyone tons to remove religious Icon from every where (10 commandments, crosses). Your tax dollars are going for this. If you're so upset at folks spending on things then maybe you should get your buddies together and quit bringing up frivolous lawsuit to remove religions item from the US. That would be a good place to start. I have the same rights as you. I can pray and worship anywhere.
1timby 3 months ago
@1timby What dont you get about this? The point of this song is that Christianity and god should be more entrenched in our government and country. Everything Government does is paid by tax dollars. therefore, NO! nobody is trying to stop you from worshipping anything. Pray all you want. We just dont want tax dollars paying for it. I think you are confused. Nobody cares if you pray. It is absolutely your right. Just do it outside of school and government and we dont have a problem.
rangerstar01 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 What part are you not getting. The government isn't paying Christians anything. Which part of the government is getting these funds subsidizing Christians? Don't say that there aren't groups trying to stop me from worshiping. Try looking at the varied articles concerning the suits about removing the ten commandment and crosses. This is costing everyone. As for government prayer, you need to bone up on your history. For decades our elected officials opened the day with prayer.
1timby 3 months ago
@1timby When did I ever say that governement was paying christians? Please: Tell me one time where ANYONE is trying to stop you from worshiping. ONE! NOBODY CARES IF YOU BELIEVE IN GOD! WE DONT CARE! PRAY ALL YOU WANT! HOW COULD ANYONE TELL YOU THAT YOU CANT PRAY? (NO, you cannot pray in school or government- that is completely different. but I dont think you can grasp that).
rangerstar01 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 So you're saying that Christians are being singled out for their beliefs? And you call me gullible. You can google and see that it's happening all over the US and the world. I can grasp that you believe that the statement separation of church and state means what you think it means but it doesn't. However, I'm not going to argue with you as can believe what you will.
1timby 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 What you should be mad at it the other issues in the government and not Christianity. Children can't pray before a school game; can't mention their beliefs at commencements. Yet there are religions that are allowed to do what they want when they want and no one is clamoring for them to stop. Seems funny to me. Everyone except Christians have rights.
1timby 3 months ago
@1timby OK, the 10 commandments. We shouldnt remove these from courthouses? So, are you saying that we should use this as a guideline for American justice? Should we punish people for "not honoring thy father"? What if he is a child molester? Should we charge people for working on the sabbath? Maybe we should start charging people with coveting their neighbers stuff? Yeah, there is no reason for the 10 commandments on our courthouses, because the 10 commandments are NONSENSE! GROW UP!
rangerstar01 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 These are laws in which God used to show man they couldn't measure up. That's why the need for Christ. The 10 commandments were to show man that man's morality wasn't enough that there was a higher standard. Yes they make a good guide line for man. Of course man wants his own form of morality. It's OK to lie cheat and steal if the ends justify the means. You can try and pick apart my faith. However, it works for me. Your prerogative not to believe.
1timby 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 What's wrong with me praying in school or reading a bible? Nothing other than there are folks that can't stand for Christians to observer their beliefs. What is wrong with me wearing a cross yet there are those that take offense. If I were Muslim you wouldn't be raising any of these concerns.
1timby 3 months ago
@1timby "what is wrong with you praying in school or reading the bible"? OK, nothing! Knock yourself out. read your bible all you want, pray all you want! Proselytise all you want! But it cannot be led by the school or government! As for you wearing a cross? I COULD GIVE NOTHING LESS THAN A FUCK if you wear a cross. I DON'T CARE! AND YES, to be honest, I HATE ISLAM more that your silly religion. because you people (although your bible tells you to) dont kill people for your beliefs!
rangerstar01 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 You may not care. However the time will come in the near future when I will be punished for just the things you say are OK. Canada has already written legislation to curtail the freedoms of Christians. There are already nations that in prison and kill Christians. This country will not be far off. I'm sure that will suit your needs.
1timby 3 months ago
@1timby HAHA! OK, Im sure they will. Keep trying to be tobe the persecuted christian. i am sure it is really hard. Good luck with your punishments. just realise that there are a lotof people who dont believe in your silly superstitions, so keep them to yourself. And yea! I would love it if our country would stop listening to that garbage. Hell is an ancient idea to keep people in line, i am glad ou are following suit. good work, I am glad you consider yourself a SHEEP.
rangerstar01 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 Just stating facts, which you're happy to ignore. I don't have any punishments to worry about. Remember I believe, you don't. The worst that can happen is I'm wrong and when I die I go into oblivion. Just because you don't believe doesn't mean there aren't Millions that do. As for keeping my silly superstitions to myself, well that ain't going to happen. You're just going to have to get over it. I would rather be a sheep than a goat. I'm sure you can get that out of the bible.
1timby 3 months ago
@1timby Oh, and by the way. Since you are "just stating facts". Feel free to show me ONE! fact that your god exists. JUST ONE! Oh, btw- feel free to ignore the millions who died in the japanse tsunsami's. Oh, and also, ignore all the people who died in 9-11, oh, wait, lets not forget all the people who died in the sri lanka'n tsunamis. I guess god just hated those people. But, maybe your kind thoughtful god just wanted to teach them all a lesson>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
rangerstar01 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 Show me one fact that states he doesn't. Since we are being factual, the knowledge man knows about the universe would fit on the edge of a quantum filament. Yet you assume that since the knowledge you seek isn't there it doesn't exist. How arrogant. I don't claim to know everything (like you do). I have to go by faith as I wasn't there when the universe came into being or when man took his first steps. Neither were you or your friends. Don't believe your prerogative.
1timby 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 I'm not forgetting those that have dies because of holocausts or those that we killed by men like you that thought their idea of morality was the right one. God didn't cause these things. As I stated you can believe as you wish. However, your opinions are just that YOURS. They don't preclude that mine are incorrect. You're free to exercise them.
1timby 3 months ago
@1timby "men like me"? thats the thing you dont get. I have my own morality, i dont need to get it from an ancient fictional book. I am a good person because I want to be a good person. "men like me" dont have to kill people because their invisible friend tells them they have to. Your bible and the koran tell you that you have to kill people who dont believe. I have no reason to hate anyone. Your religion is silly superstition, but i dont hate anyone for it(except those who kill for it).
rangerstar01 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 That's right your have you own morality. You may feel it's OK to steal from folks,lie , cheat others. That's why the God is so stringent on the law to show us we can't do it by works. As I've stated, many bad folks thought they were good. I have yet to meet a person that didn't feel they were good. Even though they may fool around on their wives. Cheat on their taxes. Steal from work. However, you do hate Christianity and utilize your misconceptions to bolster that hate.
1timby 3 months ago
@1timby Yep, good thing no xtians ever cheat or steal. This is why people cant stand you overly xtian people. You think you own morality.I have just as good of a moral as anyone. Who the hell are you to tell me that you have better morals because you read a silly old book? Your god came up with his top 10 rules and instead of adding rape, incest and childmolesting, he went with 5 rules about how to worship him and stupid crap like working on Sunday, honoring your parents and coveting stuff.
rangerstar01 3 months ago
@rangerstar01 I never said that Christians were perfect. Neither does the bible. As usual you look for things that allows you to hate. Yes it really bad to love your neighbor; help others in need, and to love and not hate people like you. Keep telling yourself that all you need is your morality. I never said that I have better morals than you. My morals come from God and it's to him that I will be judged. As for you opinions, well they are just that Opinions. Your prerogative to believe or not.
1timby 3 months ago
@1timby Sure, science can't prove everything. But so far, religions haven't proven ANYTHING. You're still at square one, and with religion alone you'd only have pre-used bits of fur to wipe your bum with. A 2-ply tissue is a scientific concept.
Dracopol 1 month ago
@Dracopol What ever. As has been stated in many of my replies to those non believers. DON'T BELIEVE. It's not a difficult concept. I'm not forcing anyone to believe. However, you and yours are very adamant that I don't have the rights to my beliefs. That science has all the answers and that anyone that doesn't agree with your opinions is delusional or worse.
1timby 1 month ago
@1timby You don't really have any rights to ignorance. In an interdependent society, you become a faulty cog.
Dracopol 1 month ago
@Dracopol Any honest scientist will state they don't know. Yet you stipulate that you have answers to all things. So that either makes you a liar or delusional. So what part of society do you fit? I would rather be a cog that someone like you feels is faulty than to be someone that is a square block saying they are round; That's only good to tear others down that don't believe as you do. You have nothing to back up your statements other than to be a legend in your own mind.
1timby 1 month ago