If someone says faggot in whatever context that isn't "You are gay and that's bad", then if someone is offended by it it is entirely their fault for being offended. And "Growing a thicker skin" is far better than saying people can't say certain things because feelings get hurt. Again, you aren't entitled to always be fucking comfortable socially.
@TheHeroinWolf I never said people *can't* say things, but there are consequences for saying certain words. It's up to you if you want to say them. Just like I don't call sandles "thongs" because people will get the wrong idea.
@TheHeroinWolf Also, basically what you've said here is that there is no such thing as verbal gay bullying unless it DIRECTLY says that being gay is bad. All the namecalling in the world is fine until they suggest that being gay is bad. Yeah right. Sorry, but you're living in a different world. Words have meanings and consequences. Live with them.
@TheHeroinWolf ? So you're one of the people who think the answer is for gay youth to have thicker skin, not for bullies who supposedly aren't really bullies to stop using anti-gay language?
@TheHeroinWolf That's basically saying that people shouldn't have to be responsible for what they say. Your argument suggests that when something is offensive, it's not the fault of the person who said it, it's the fault of the people who found it offensive. It's absurd.
@TheHeroinWolf My last comment that has "It's absurd" in it was to your comment "Something being offensive is completely independent of the person saying the thing deemed offensive."
Not sure how fagot\\faggot evolved from meaning "a bundle of anything," to it current derogatory use today, but here is how it's correctly used in a sentence: "Men hold themselves cheap and vile; and yet a man is a fagot of thunderbolts. All the elements pour through his system: he is the flood of the flood, and fire of the fire; he feels the antipodes and the pole, as drops of his blood: they are the extension of his personality." - Raplph Waldo Emerson.
Even though I commented on your video about the word "faggot" that I use the word quite frequently, I can say for sure that I would never call someone I didn't know a faggot, atleast not in their face. I might call a friend of mine that, but if that friend told me not to then I would stop. I understand your worry for young closet gay people though. I think it's important to remember that those who call someone they don't know such a word are often more insecure themselves.
@TheHeroinWolf My point is--what if someone, as a joke, was calling someone a faggot or one of the other phrases, and it ended up that the person being jokefully ranked on was actually gay? Jokes aren't as funny when you're the brunt of it.
Those kind of "jokes", no matter what the intent, display homosexuality in a negative light no matter how you try to cut it. If you're not gay, you don't really feel it.
@TheHeroinWolf And I'm not saying that I'm personally offended, this isn't about ME being offended, this is about gay people, mostly young gay people, who are still in the closet or are trying to come out of the closet.
When there's this constant joking and putting down gay people, no matter what the intent, it rubs off on people.
@DesBlackmore-I don't think they are using that word out of some malicious intent.
I never said using such words always has malicious intent, but again why use the word in that situation when one of those friends could possibly be gay, and find the term offensive? In that situation it's use would show a lack of sensitively, or at best the person using the word could be ignorant, and not realize that some find the word offensive.
You're absolutely right. Why would someone want to use a like "faggot", "nigger", or "cunt" when they know people are going to be offended. I've heard people even use the "no one has the right not to be offended" argument in that context. While that's strictly true, we ordinarily use that argument referring to an attack on what people believe, not an attack on who they are.
My point is it's easy enough to avoid using words that you know are going to offend someone. The only reasons I can imagine for not avoiding them is ignorance, insensitivity, or intent to offended.
I've got to agree with TheHeroinWolf on this one. I've said it all. I've heard it all. Suicidal Tendencies once sang, "Can you say "feel like shit"?
Yea maybe sometimes I do feel like shit
I ain't happy 'bout it, but I'd rather feel like shit than be full of shit!
And if I offended you, oh I'm sorry...
But maybe you need to be offended
But here's my apology and one more thing...fuck you!"
You Can't Bring Me Down
I appreciate your valor, kizzume but things will NEVER change...
PampersPete 3 months ago
@Kizzume
And frankly I find your position offensive, if that makes sense.
TheHeroinWolf 3 months ago
@TheHeroinWolf Ditto. I find the mindset that thinks people shouldn't be responsible for what they say to be offensive.
kizzume 3 months ago
@Kizzume
Yes.
TheHeroinWolf 3 months ago
@TheHeroinWolf Well, at least you're consistent. I couldn't disagree more with your position.
kizzume 3 months ago
@Kizzume
No, I'm saying it isn't gay bullying just because someone hears the word faggot.
TheHeroinWolf 3 months ago
@TheHeroinWolf Do you think black people should think nothing of it when they hear the word "nigger" from someone who clearly isn't black?
kizzume 3 months ago
@Kizzume
If someone says faggot in whatever context that isn't "You are gay and that's bad", then if someone is offended by it it is entirely their fault for being offended. And "Growing a thicker skin" is far better than saying people can't say certain things because feelings get hurt. Again, you aren't entitled to always be fucking comfortable socially.
TheHeroinWolf 3 months ago
@TheHeroinWolf I never said people *can't* say things, but there are consequences for saying certain words. It's up to you if you want to say them. Just like I don't call sandles "thongs" because people will get the wrong idea.
kizzume 3 months ago
@TheHeroinWolf Also, basically what you've said here is that there is no such thing as verbal gay bullying unless it DIRECTLY says that being gay is bad. All the namecalling in the world is fine until they suggest that being gay is bad. Yeah right. Sorry, but you're living in a different world. Words have meanings and consequences. Live with them.
kizzume 3 months ago
@Kizzume
Suicide is a choice. The words only have the power that you give it, unless the person has a fist or something.
TheHeroinWolf 3 months ago
@TheHeroinWolf ? So you're one of the people who think the answer is for gay youth to have thicker skin, not for bullies who supposedly aren't really bullies to stop using anti-gay language?
kizzume 3 months ago
@Kizzume Besides my point, of course. No one is entitled to being constantly comfortable socially.
TheHeroinWolf 3 months ago
@TheHeroinWolf Tell that to the kids who committed suicide....
Words have power.
kizzume 3 months ago
@Kizzume
Something being offensive is completely independent of the person saying the thing deemed offensive.
TheHeroinWolf 3 months ago
@TheHeroinWolf That's basically saying that people shouldn't have to be responsible for what they say. Your argument suggests that when something is offensive, it's not the fault of the person who said it, it's the fault of the people who found it offensive. It's absurd.
kizzume 3 months ago
@TheHeroinWolf My last comment that has "It's absurd" in it was to your comment "Something being offensive is completely independent of the person saying the thing deemed offensive."
kizzume 3 months ago
Not sure how fagot\\faggot evolved from meaning "a bundle of anything," to it current derogatory use today, but here is how it's correctly used in a sentence: "Men hold themselves cheap and vile; and yet a man is a fagot of thunderbolts. All the elements pour through his system: he is the flood of the flood, and fire of the fire; he feels the antipodes and the pole, as drops of his blood: they are the extension of his personality." - Raplph Waldo Emerson.
l0g1cb0mb 3 months ago
Even though I commented on your video about the word "faggot" that I use the word quite frequently, I can say for sure that I would never call someone I didn't know a faggot, atleast not in their face. I might call a friend of mine that, but if that friend told me not to then I would stop. I understand your worry for young closet gay people though. I think it's important to remember that those who call someone they don't know such a word are often more insecure themselves.
EndParenthesis 3 months ago
Intent, intent, intent.
TheHeroinWolf 3 months ago
@TheHeroinWolf My point is--what if someone, as a joke, was calling someone a faggot or one of the other phrases, and it ended up that the person being jokefully ranked on was actually gay? Jokes aren't as funny when you're the brunt of it.
Those kind of "jokes", no matter what the intent, display homosexuality in a negative light no matter how you try to cut it. If you're not gay, you don't really feel it.
kizzume 3 months ago
@TheHeroinWolf And I'm not saying that I'm personally offended, this isn't about ME being offended, this is about gay people, mostly young gay people, who are still in the closet or are trying to come out of the closet.
When there's this constant joking and putting down gay people, no matter what the intent, it rubs off on people.
kizzume 3 months ago
@DesBlackmore-I don't think they are using that word out of some malicious intent.
I never said using such words always has malicious intent, but again why use the word in that situation when one of those friends could possibly be gay, and find the term offensive? In that situation it's use would show a lack of sensitively, or at best the person using the word could be ignorant, and not realize that some find the word offensive.
TheNakedAtheist 3 months ago
Comment removed
TheNakedAtheist 3 months ago
You're absolutely right. Why would someone want to use a like "faggot", "nigger", or "cunt" when they know people are going to be offended. I've heard people even use the "no one has the right not to be offended" argument in that context. While that's strictly true, we ordinarily use that argument referring to an attack on what people believe, not an attack on who they are.
TheNakedAtheist 3 months ago
Continued...
My point is it's easy enough to avoid using words that you know are going to offend someone. The only reasons I can imagine for not avoiding them is ignorance, insensitivity, or intent to offended.
TheNakedAtheist 3 months ago