It's not your content, it's your insufferable, condescending and abusive tone -- all of you, as a group, the moment you feel threatened. Read the post again that I reacted to. Where do you come off sing the word "Idiot"?
I would have to agree that evangelical atheism would be as tiring as its evangelical religious counterpart, especially because boxing with a bowl of half-set pudding is so messy and inconclusive.
"I suggest you try explaining what is hypocritical about being a christian and not believing humans were magically created in their present form but instead believing thet genesis is just a fable and that god created humans through evolution."
As I said two months ago, God and Evolution contradict.
This is the kind of ignorant rhetoric we are getting used to in popular culture now. One of the world's leading evolutionary biologists is a comitted Christian. There is no 'a priori' contradiction between creation and evolution, and this is not 'ad hoc' either, for centuries before Darwin there were serious Christian thinkers (Augustine, Aquinas, etc) who didn't read Genesis literally (its obviously mythological). Creationism is a *modern* phenomenon, pls remember that!
People believed that Gods (whichever one) created the universe for thousands of years. And Darwin's theory had an enormous negative reception by the church when it came out (took until the 1950s for the Catholic Church to accept it)
Sure you can be a christian who accepts evolution, that's a perfectly valid position. But don't try and shrug off the ignorance of other Christians as a recent phenomenon because small-minded Christianity has existed for a long time.
@TheJulsisCool You claim that Darwin's theory had an "enormous negative reception by the church when it came out" but scholarly books have been written on this subject showing that the church's reaction was mixed, as it was initally in the scientific community as well.
I said that *Creationsm* is a modern phenomena, which it is. A McGrath has pointed out that had Darwinism been discovered at the time of the Greek & Latin Fathers (centuries ago) there would have been no controversy.
@TheJulsisCool It is important to point out what *creation* actually means to people who have been trained in serious philosophical theology. Firstly, it doesn't mean a rival explanation to scientific explanation; so, in other words, *creation* has nothing to do with the god-of-the-gaps, which is idolatry. Secondly, *creation* means the radical causing of existence of whatever exists; in other words, it answers why there is something rather than nothing, so it is not physics but metaphysics.
@TheJulsisCool I was merely clarifying what traditional Christianity has meant by *creation*. Thomas Aquinas (medieval) held to the sophisticated, non-idolatrous version of *creation*, so it is by no means an 'ad hoc' response to Darwin, etc. *Creationism*, I repeat, is a modern phenomena mainly invented in the U.S by Fundamentalists at Princeton.
I suggest you try explaining what is hypocritical about being a christian and not believing humans were magically created in their present form but instead believing thet genesis is just a fable and that god created humans through evolution.
@nakedapedude It is a reference to a Dara O'Briain joke in which he tells people who have ridiculous views to get in a sack with all the other idiots. You're as stupid as the people who believe genesis is fact. Actually, you're more stupid as you've actually gone to the effort of studying christianity, and still believe in it.
@CssFrozen Please, refrain from insults. Everyone is entitled to there belief, if certain people wish to believe christianity than thats fine and if other people don't thats equally fine. I'm going to stop this before it spins out of control, no more debates on religion please, or if they must be done, don't call anyone an idiot or an infidel, etc.
@Hadraedan96 their* belief. then* that's fine. Everyone is entitled to their own belief, sure, but; if people can not back up their belief with anything more than hearsay, faith and you're not good enough - fueled arguments, why should they be respected? But wait, why am I telling you this? You're clearly too set on being a mediator, or maybe it's just the fence you're sitting on starting to hurt.
@nakedapedude Do you really think that an intelligent and loving God will design evolution, even though he is aware beforehand that 98% of the species he will create will not even survive? If so, then you would have to concede that God is imperfect and even superfluous. In my opinion, there is no God. Please stop trying to squeeze this old myth in our contemporary science, since you're afraid that your imaginary friend might turn out to be imaginary!
I was adressing ThnkHppyThghts who claimed that christians who believe evolution are hypocritical, I asked him to explain why he thinks they are hypocrites, he could not. I am an atheist.
@HoodedThis look you can have your own opinion on whether there is a god or not but remember as an atheist you are in a lose/lose situation regarding the afterlife but if you are a religious person then you are atleast in a win/lose situation for the afterlife. So even by that logic you are an idiot. Then there is the theory of first principle that you have yet to find out.
"...but remember as an atheist you are in a lose/lose situation regarding the afterlife but if you are a religious person then you are atleast in a win/lose situation for the afterlife. So even by that logic you are an idiot."
This is Pascal's wager, and it has been debunked long ago. I'm not going to waste my time rebutting dead arguments.
@HoodedThis why is this arguement debunked? another thing is evangelical atheism is dysfunctional because not only are you condemning yourself to hell but you are trying to drag others down with you because you don't approach religion with an open mind.
Pascal's Wager has been debunked by two different ways. The theistic approach claims that the wager is a business deal that tries to deceive God. Meaning, the Judeo-Christian God values genuine belief, and not you staying on the safe side by believing in Him. The wager, by definition, is a bet. It doesn't really reflect the love and passion you should have for God. {Continued}
The second approach claims that the wager makes two silly assumptions: God is the Judeo-Christian God, and He wants you to believe in him. What if God valued skepticism over dogmatism? What if it was a God that didn't really care whether you worshiped him or not? The Wager commits the "Either Or" logical fallacy: either there is an afterlife with a Judeo-Christian God, or there isn't. It leaves out trillions of other possibilities.
@nathanwatson0 See, this is where you lose not only the argument but also the audience,which is worse really. Proselytizing with a bit of class is a dead art -- you just can't refrain from calling a nonbeliever an eejit. If this were the sine qua non truth of the universe, the way you put it over would gag a starving maggot to puking.
@manthasagittarius1 You haven't won the arguement, i just haven't been on my email in ages. I still believe its a bit foolish to cast aside any idea that there might be a god seeing as there are so many possiblities. I know perfectly well that i might be wrong, however i believe what i do because i've had religious experiences and i love god. there is still no point to evangelical atheism.
@Hadraedan96 Because being a Christian, you should believe in the Bible's teachings. It's impossible to believe in both scripture and evolution as they contradict each other. The Christian belief involves the Adam & Eve origin story which directly contradicts evolution. One disproves the other, you can't believe in evolution and the Bible at the same time. I'm not trying to start an argument but there are some serious holes in that statement. It's like an atheist saying they believe in God.
I think the millions of christians around the world who believe in evolution would argue with you on that point but that's not really the issue, the issue is YOU DON'T GET TO DECIDE WHO AND WHO IS NOT A CHRISTIAN.
@nakedapedude I never said I could decide who is and who isn't a christian. I'm saying it's contradictory to claim you're a christian and at the same time believe in evolution which argues against creationism. I was under the impression that in christians had to believe in the Bible. But I could be wrong?
Christians don't have to "believe in the bible", what does that even mean? There is a story in the bible about god creating man and animals and plants etc in their present forms, from nothing, you don't have to believe that it literally happened that way, it's just a story as most reasonable, rational christians understand.
@nakedapedude I was under the impression that being a true christian means following christ in everything. He believed in all the scriptures before his human birth and all those after him were mostly about him. He quoted many passages from the Hebrew Scriptures too, surely that means christians should accept the entire Bible? It's a bit hypocritical to be able to cherry-pick out the parts you want and dismiss the others as 'stories'.
@ThnkHppyThghts Most christians tend to have different interpretations of the Bible, but I totally agree with you. It takes the whole point out of faith if you can pick and choose the parts that you like and ignore the ones you don't like. If there are parts that you don't believe in, doesn't that mean you're not believing in the word of God, going against the point of your religion? I'm so glad I'm an atheist :)
@mychemfreak246 Lol ikr? Science is safer and clearer to go by in my opinion. It just annoys me when I meet the occasional religion-driven nut who rant on about how atheists will go to hell because they don't believe in god, but then they say they believe in stuff that contradict stuff they claim they go by and I'm just thinking 'wtf?'. If I'm going to hell, this guy is following close behind me then XD
My point is that there is no rule list for being a christian, it's the christian themself that gets to decide what they call themselves. If someone wants to call themselves a christian, then they are a christian. Other christians may disagree that they are a "true christian" but it doesn't matter.
@nakedapedude That may be so, but like I've said a few times now but you seem to be deliberately ignoring it, there are big hypocritical holes in the original statement that they made which neither they nor you have exactly supported, but instead just went off topic. But I see I'm never gonna get anywhere with this conversation so I'll be the mature one and end it now. Good day to you.
@nakedapedude And like I've already explained, I'm not attacking their faith, I'm just pointing out the problem with that statement. I couldn't care less about religion as an atheist, so please think before you cut into finished debates with unrelated comments. Thank you.
@Hadraedan96 I suppose the most you could say is you accept Theistic evolution, but that's a really debatable theory. But hey, that's just my opinion. I'm an atheist so makes no difference to me lol :D
You guys below me... get in the sack!
Jems17 15 hours ago
It's not your content, it's your insufferable, condescending and abusive tone -- all of you, as a group, the moment you feel threatened. Read the post again that I reacted to. Where do you come off sing the word "Idiot"?
I would have to agree that evangelical atheism would be as tiring as its evangelical religious counterpart, especially because boxing with a bowl of half-set pudding is so messy and inconclusive.
manthasagittarius1 2 days ago
This has been flagged as spam show
If I had one pound for every pixel of this video had, i would be a poor bastard. LOL
ULFQAK 1 week ago
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ULFQAK 1 week ago
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"I suggest you try explaining what is hypocritical about being a christian and not believing humans were magically created in their present form but instead believing thet genesis is just a fable and that god created humans through evolution."
As I said two months ago, God and Evolution contradict.
HoodedThis 1 month ago
This is the kind of ignorant rhetoric we are getting used to in popular culture now. One of the world's leading evolutionary biologists is a comitted Christian. There is no 'a priori' contradiction between creation and evolution, and this is not 'ad hoc' either, for centuries before Darwin there were serious Christian thinkers (Augustine, Aquinas, etc) who didn't read Genesis literally (its obviously mythological). Creationism is a *modern* phenomenon, pls remember that!
bayreuth79 1 month ago
@bayreuth79
People believed that Gods (whichever one) created the universe for thousands of years. And Darwin's theory had an enormous negative reception by the church when it came out (took until the 1950s for the Catholic Church to accept it)
Sure you can be a christian who accepts evolution, that's a perfectly valid position. But don't try and shrug off the ignorance of other Christians as a recent phenomenon because small-minded Christianity has existed for a long time.
TheJulsisCool 1 month ago
@TheJulsisCool You claim that Darwin's theory had an "enormous negative reception by the church when it came out" but scholarly books have been written on this subject showing that the church's reaction was mixed, as it was initally in the scientific community as well.
I said that *Creationsm* is a modern phenomena, which it is. A McGrath has pointed out that had Darwinism been discovered at the time of the Greek & Latin Fathers (centuries ago) there would have been no controversy.
bayreuth79 1 month ago
@TheJulsisCool It is important to point out what *creation* actually means to people who have been trained in serious philosophical theology. Firstly, it doesn't mean a rival explanation to scientific explanation; so, in other words, *creation* has nothing to do with the god-of-the-gaps, which is idolatry. Secondly, *creation* means the radical causing of existence of whatever exists; in other words, it answers why there is something rather than nothing, so it is not physics but metaphysics.
bayreuth79 1 month ago
@bayreuth79 You were clearly talking about creationism as a literal interpretation of the bible in your original post, which I responded to.
I have no problem with that idea of creation, although I personally reject it.
The problem lies when some idiots try to wring out some arbitrary moral code out of he haphazard chance that the universe was specifically created.
TheJulsisCool 1 month ago
@TheJulsisCool I was merely clarifying what traditional Christianity has meant by *creation*. Thomas Aquinas (medieval) held to the sophisticated, non-idolatrous version of *creation*, so it is by no means an 'ad hoc' response to Darwin, etc. *Creationism*, I repeat, is a modern phenomena mainly invented in the U.S by Fundamentalists at Princeton.
bayreuth79 1 month ago
lol. I just hope people who doubt evolution don't think, after hearing this, that that's how evolution works. But yes, a funny explanation :)
MikeoWar 3 months ago
@MikeoWar Most of them think evoloution works like in Poke'mon.....at level 36 you evolve from a Monkey to a DarwinZard & learn flamethrower
this is probably an improvement
ThePariahLivesOn 1 month ago
Comment removed
MikeoWar 3 months ago
I live in Alabama. Please come speak to us
TheFrankHedden 3 months ago 10
I suggest you try explaining what is hypocritical about being a christian and not believing humans were magically created in their present form but instead believing thet genesis is just a fable and that god created humans through evolution.
nakedapedude 3 months ago
@nakedapedude Get in the fucking sack.
codeyday 3 months ago 2
@codeyday
wtf does that mean?
nakedapedude 3 months ago
@nakedapedude It is a reference to a Dara O'Briain joke in which he tells people who have ridiculous views to get in a sack with all the other idiots. You're as stupid as the people who believe genesis is fact. Actually, you're more stupid as you've actually gone to the effort of studying christianity, and still believe in it.
CssFrozen 3 months ago
@CssFrozen Please, refrain from insults. Everyone is entitled to there belief, if certain people wish to believe christianity than thats fine and if other people don't thats equally fine. I'm going to stop this before it spins out of control, no more debates on religion please, or if they must be done, don't call anyone an idiot or an infidel, etc.
Hadraedan96 3 months ago
@Hadraedan96 their* belief. then* that's fine. Everyone is entitled to their own belief, sure, but; if people can not back up their belief with anything more than hearsay, faith and you're not good enough - fueled arguments, why should they be respected? But wait, why am I telling you this? You're clearly too set on being a mediator, or maybe it's just the fence you're sitting on starting to hurt.
CssFrozen 3 months ago
@CssFrozen
I'm not a fucking christian you moron, pay attention or don't get involved.
nakedapedude 3 months ago
@nakedapedude god bless you
CssFrozen 3 months ago 2
@nakedapedude Do you really think that an intelligent and loving God will design evolution, even though he is aware beforehand that 98% of the species he will create will not even survive? If so, then you would have to concede that God is imperfect and even superfluous. In my opinion, there is no God. Please stop trying to squeeze this old myth in our contemporary science, since you're afraid that your imaginary friend might turn out to be imaginary!
HoodedThis 3 months ago 3
@HoodedThis
Pay attention or don't get involved, I'm an atheist.
nakedapedude 3 months ago
@nakedapedude I did pay attention, and I was still confused about your opinion. Can you please state it again in clearer terms?
HoodedThis 3 months ago
@HoodedThis
I was adressing ThnkHppyThghts who claimed that christians who believe evolution are hypocritical, I asked him to explain why he thinks they are hypocrites, he could not. I am an atheist.
nakedapedude 3 months ago
@nakedapedude @HoodedThis Really lads one month later? Can't you agree to disagree?
richay1 1 month ago
@HoodedThis
You're obviously a bit simple, what part of "I'm an atheist" do you not understand?
nakedapedude 1 month ago
@nakedapedude "I'm". You're obviously schizophrenic, if not intentionally hypocritical.
HoodedThis 1 month ago
@HoodedThis look you can have your own opinion on whether there is a god or not but remember as an atheist you are in a lose/lose situation regarding the afterlife but if you are a religious person then you are atleast in a win/lose situation for the afterlife. So even by that logic you are an idiot. Then there is the theory of first principle that you have yet to find out.
nathanwatson0 1 week ago
@nathanwatson0
"...but remember as an atheist you are in a lose/lose situation regarding the afterlife but if you are a religious person then you are atleast in a win/lose situation for the afterlife. So even by that logic you are an idiot."
This is Pascal's wager, and it has been debunked long ago. I'm not going to waste my time rebutting dead arguments.
HoodedThis 1 week ago
@HoodedThis why is this arguement debunked? another thing is evangelical atheism is dysfunctional because not only are you condemning yourself to hell but you are trying to drag others down with you because you don't approach religion with an open mind.
nathanwatson0 1 week ago
@nathanwatson0
Pascal's Wager has been debunked by two different ways. The theistic approach claims that the wager is a business deal that tries to deceive God. Meaning, the Judeo-Christian God values genuine belief, and not you staying on the safe side by believing in Him. The wager, by definition, is a bet. It doesn't really reflect the love and passion you should have for God. {Continued}
HoodedThis 1 week ago
@nathanwatson0
The second approach claims that the wager makes two silly assumptions: God is the Judeo-Christian God, and He wants you to believe in him. What if God valued skepticism over dogmatism? What if it was a God that didn't really care whether you worshiped him or not? The Wager commits the "Either Or" logical fallacy: either there is an afterlife with a Judeo-Christian God, or there isn't. It leaves out trillions of other possibilities.
HoodedThis 1 week ago
@nathanwatson0 See, this is where you lose not only the argument but also the audience,which is worse really. Proselytizing with a bit of class is a dead art -- you just can't refrain from calling a nonbeliever an eejit. If this were the sine qua non truth of the universe, the way you put it over would gag a starving maggot to puking.
manthasagittarius1 3 days ago
@manthasagittarius1 You haven't won the arguement, i just haven't been on my email in ages. I still believe its a bit foolish to cast aside any idea that there might be a god seeing as there are so many possiblities. I know perfectly well that i might be wrong, however i believe what i do because i've had religious experiences and i love god. there is still no point to evangelical atheism.
nathanwatson0 2 days ago
im a christian who studies biology at university who believes in evolution!
smilekatysmile 4 months ago
@smilekatysmile No one really gives a fuck man.
uFEARChuckNorris 4 months ago
@smilekatysmile Well then you're a very bad christian aren't you? XD
ThnkHppyThghts 4 months ago
@ThnkHppyThghts How? Just because you're christian doesn't mean you believe in creationism. I'm a christian and I believe in evolution.
Hadraedan96 3 months ago
@Hadraedan96 Because being a Christian, you should believe in the Bible's teachings. It's impossible to believe in both scripture and evolution as they contradict each other. The Christian belief involves the Adam & Eve origin story which directly contradicts evolution. One disproves the other, you can't believe in evolution and the Bible at the same time. I'm not trying to start an argument but there are some serious holes in that statement. It's like an atheist saying they believe in God.
ThnkHppyThghts 3 months ago
@ThnkHppyThghts
I think the millions of christians around the world who believe in evolution would argue with you on that point but that's not really the issue, the issue is YOU DON'T GET TO DECIDE WHO AND WHO IS NOT A CHRISTIAN.
nakedapedude 3 months ago
@nakedapedude I never said I could decide who is and who isn't a christian. I'm saying it's contradictory to claim you're a christian and at the same time believe in evolution which argues against creationism. I was under the impression that in christians had to believe in the Bible. But I could be wrong?
ThnkHppyThghts 3 months ago
@ThnkHppyThghts
Christians don't have to "believe in the bible", what does that even mean? There is a story in the bible about god creating man and animals and plants etc in their present forms, from nothing, you don't have to believe that it literally happened that way, it's just a story as most reasonable, rational christians understand.
nakedapedude 3 months ago
@nakedapedude I was under the impression that being a true christian means following christ in everything. He believed in all the scriptures before his human birth and all those after him were mostly about him. He quoted many passages from the Hebrew Scriptures too, surely that means christians should accept the entire Bible? It's a bit hypocritical to be able to cherry-pick out the parts you want and dismiss the others as 'stories'.
ThnkHppyThghts 3 months ago
@ThnkHppyThghts Most christians tend to have different interpretations of the Bible, but I totally agree with you. It takes the whole point out of faith if you can pick and choose the parts that you like and ignore the ones you don't like. If there are parts that you don't believe in, doesn't that mean you're not believing in the word of God, going against the point of your religion? I'm so glad I'm an atheist :)
mychemfreak246 3 months ago
@mychemfreak246 Lol ikr? Science is safer and clearer to go by in my opinion. It just annoys me when I meet the occasional religion-driven nut who rant on about how atheists will go to hell because they don't believe in god, but then they say they believe in stuff that contradict stuff they claim they go by and I'm just thinking 'wtf?'. If I'm going to hell, this guy is following close behind me then XD
ThnkHppyThghts 3 months ago
@ThnkHppyThghts
My point is that there is no rule list for being a christian, it's the christian themself that gets to decide what they call themselves. If someone wants to call themselves a christian, then they are a christian. Other christians may disagree that they are a "true christian" but it doesn't matter.
nakedapedude 3 months ago
@nakedapedude That may be so, but like I've said a few times now but you seem to be deliberately ignoring it, there are big hypocritical holes in the original statement that they made which neither they nor you have exactly supported, but instead just went off topic. But I see I'm never gonna get anywhere with this conversation so I'll be the mature one and end it now. Good day to you.
ThnkHppyThghts 3 months ago
@nakedapedude And like I've already explained, I'm not attacking their faith, I'm just pointing out the problem with that statement. I couldn't care less about religion as an atheist, so please think before you cut into finished debates with unrelated comments. Thank you.
ThnkHppyThghts 3 months ago
@Hadraedan96 I suppose the most you could say is you accept Theistic evolution, but that's a really debatable theory. But hey, that's just my opinion. I'm an atheist so makes no difference to me lol :D
ThnkHppyThghts 3 months ago