In my dream, the Plaza is packed, people in every direction as far as the eye can see. All highways into Dallas are clogged with cars, and millions of people have left them, now walking to Dealy with JFK & 911 signs to be there for the Nov. 22, 50 year shakeup. The whole world watches in awe, as now, all roads into Texas are parking lots..
and then a chemtrail tanker fleet doses them with vallium and prozac....
@abennett4 What's funny is that you think that ALL those 53 points independently prove Oswald's guilt. Some do nothing of the sort, like #12 you copied a couple hours ago. It only tries to establish Brennan's credibility-and fails miserably. Or #16, which is a misrepresentation of fact. What the Bugliosi bible DOESN'T tell you is that Givens was picked up by the DPD, and he HAD left the building. Your idol yet again fails.
@smartalek65 I bet the holy Bugliosi bible does'nt tell you Givens early testimony to the FBI put Oswald in the domino room eating lunch alone at 11.50 either. Givens made liars of the FBI agents by denying he ever said that to them. Of course with typical WC attention to justice those agents were never called to testify or submit their notes to confirm Givens perjury and defend themselves against his lies.
@2001perseus givens made a statment to the fbi that he saw oswald reading a newspaper at 11.50 in the lunchroom ,the warren commision asked givens if he made such a statment he said no (that was a lie) .the commission had this fbi statment and knew givens was contradicting himself but staggeringly chose not to question givens further on it.
13."Although in his interrogation on Friday afternoon Oswald said he was having lunch on the 1st floor of the Book Depository at the time of the assassination, during Sunday’s interrogation Oswald slipped up and placed himself on the 6th floor at the time of the assassination, making him the only employee of the Book Depository who placed himself on the 6th floor, or was placed there by anyone else, at the time we know an assassin shot Kennedy from the 6th floor.' Bugliosi, Reclaiming History
12."Apart from Brennan, we know that Kennedy's assassin was at the subject 6th-floor window.Among other evidence, the rifle that was used to murder Kennedy was found on the sixth-floor of the Book Depository Building, witnesses other than Brennan saw a rifle sticking out of the southeasternmost window on the 6th floor, a sniper's nest was found around the subject window, and three cartridge casings from the murder weapon was found on the sixth floor beneath the window." V.B., Reclaiming History
But did the last shot that hit JFK in the top of the head come from in front? I haven't studied this case, so please correct me, but that's the hypothesis I'm forming.
@BanalBoxberry "But did the last shot that hit JFK in the top of the head come from in front?"
some of us believe a shot did come from an area on the knoll which is to the front and right of jfk as he travelled down elm street ,others believe all shots came from the rear . the best way to figure out all this is to not take anyones word either way but to do your own research ,a good place to statrt might be the testimony of officer joe marshall smith who believed he encountered-
@BanalBoxberry Depends on who answers you whether you get corrected or not. That's one very crucial area of contention. Gonna just have to look into it and make up your own mind. Not fair to say much else to you if you're just getting started on this.
@BanalBoxberry a fake secret service agent on the knoll ,and also you could check out dallas chief of police jesse curry who said the man smith encountered must have been bogus .as i say do your own research and thinking ,dont just take anyones word that what they say is accurate not even me check /double check and treble check everything your told /see and read .
@BanalBoxberry It might appear so because Kennedy's head goes "back and to the left". But this was caused by the "jet-effect" of the bullet exploding and exiting out the front. At the actual instant of the head shot (frame 313 of the zapruder film), Kennedy's head actually moves forward 3-4 inches and all the tissue splatter is forward indicating a shot from th rear. Ballistic test proved the bullet to the head came from Oswald's rifle, to the exclusion of all other weapons.
@abennett4 How can ballistics tests prove the bullet from the head shot came from that rifle when to this day they have'nt found the bullet you complete utter clown. Are you on LSD or what? We are also still waiting for your description of how the FBI assigned bullet "fragments" to a particular rifle in 1963. I'm underwhelmed with anticipation, especially as no fragments were ever found in or removed from JFK's head. C'mon baby put up or shut up!
The most logical conclusion was that JFK was murdered so that Johnson could become president. The fact that he destroyed some of the most important evidence (having the presidential limo cleaned and rebuilt) would alone indict him as the most important beneficiary of the assassination.
Lee Harvey Oswald the sole assassin? In your dreams. He should have picked a better spot and a better rifle.
No conspiracy? The fact that only Agent Hill responded to the shots proves it was a conspiracy.
11. "After the first and second shots rang out, a motorcade witness, Howard Brennan, sitting on a short concrete wall directly across the street from the sixth-floor window, looked up and actually saw Oswald in the window holding his rifle. Only 120 feet away from Oswald, he got a very good look as he watched, in horror, Oswald (whom he had seen in the window earlier, before the motorcade had arrived) take deliberate aim and fire the final shot from his rifle." V. Bugliosi, Reclaiming History
@abennett4 Brennan. That would be the guy who claimed he saw Oswald fire the headshot while looking directly at the depository window then, turned his head faster than a speeding bullet in time to see JFK's head explode??? Oh yes, there's a reliable account! but I'm not surprised you would'nt have a reality check over it.
@2001perseus and Brennan "just happened" to be able to tell the authorities the exact window where they "later" found Oswald's sniper's nest. Just a lucky guess? I guess you think Brennan was just a plant and part of the conspiracy. More paranoia. Try Seroquil.
@abennett4 And other witnesses totally contradict Brennan who thinks he can turn his head faster than a bullet travels. I'll go with the other witnesses who were consistent and believable in their testimonies about the man in the light shirt in the window preceded by the black man they saw there. I've never read Jim Marrs book on this but hey it must be worth a read if you can't shut up about the man.
@abennett4 "and Brennan "just happened" to be able to tell the authorities the exact window where they "later" found Oswald's sniper's nest. Just a lucky guess?"
if brennan had told them at 12.30 that the shooter was firing from the 6th floor south east corner window how come luke mooney only stumbled upon the snipers nest at 1.00 some 30 minutes later ? .
16. "After the shooting in Dealey Plaza, nearly all sixteen warehousemen who worked in the Depository Building returned to the building and were present at a roll call of employees. Only Lee Harvey Oswald and Charles Givens were not present. Givens was located shortly thereafter. So only Oswald left the building and was unaccounted for." Vincent Bugliosi, Reclaiming History
29. "After Oswald’s arrest at the Texas Theater, he refused to give his name to the Dallas police officers who captured him. As a pretty consistent rule, when a person is innocent of a crime, he cooperates with law enforcement." Vincent Bugliosi, Reclaiming istory
@abennett4 "After Oswald’s arrest at the Texas Theater, he refused to give his name to the Dallas police officers who captured him. As a pretty consistent rule, when a person is innocent of a crime, he cooperates with law enforcement." Vincent Bugliosi, Reclaiming istory"
one of the officers in the police car removed oswalds wallet which contained his name so they knew who he was ,and its more than reasonable to say even without the wallet they knew who he was .
@abennett4 "Every single one of Bugliosi's bullet points..." That has been repeatedly proven false, that's why it's considered lying. The one you repeated moments ago about Tippit's murder is one of them. There's more evidence pointing AWAY from Oswald than the weak case made by Bugliosi.
24. "Forty-five minutes after the shooting in Dealey Plaza, Lee Harvey Oswald is the one who just happened to murder Dallas police officer J.D. Tippit on Tenth Street near Patton in the Oak Cliff area, only about nine-tenths of a mile from his rooming house." Vincent Bugliosi, Reclaiming History
Ok I am open to hearing the evidence and have read tons of stuff on this issue. One thing: if that one bullet hit both Kennedy and Connally wouldn't it have been smashed all over the place? Yet the bullet was in great condition. Am I wrong on that?
@Cooks195 according to the warren commissions own experts ce399 the magic bullet couldnt have caused all wounds to jfk and connally ,the wound thats most problematic is connallys wrist wound . but if you google warren commison test bullets and look on may ferrells site you will see a bullet that hit a goat rib (mutilated ) a bullet that hit a human wrist ( badly mutilated) and two bullets fired into cotton wadding ,guess which looks most like ce399 ?.
You can either take Warren as the bible or reject it partially or on the whole..that is the simple choice.
The WCR, produced in the mid 60's was done with what we today consider primitive tools..under primitive conditions...sadly limited forensic procedures and administered by questionable appointees.
No one today would argue successfully that not a single detailed investigative process used by WC in mid 60's would be used today for the same crime.
@abennett4 "I've never posted a single lie..." Yes, you have. You've parroted Bugliosi's falsehoods, fobrien pointed numerous of those falsehoods out to you, and you persist in posting those same quotes. Those are LIES, because you knew they were false when you posted them. Then you expect those who know they're false to bow down to the great god Bugliosi and beg forgiveness for checking the facts...
@smartalek65 Every single one of Bugliosi's bullet points are based on the evidence and careful analysis. Not a single falsehood in the bunch. He lists 53 separate pieces of hard, incontrovertable pieces of evidence, all pointing directly at Oswald. If only a handful were correct, Oswald would certainly be quilty. Yet he came up with 53 (Fifty-three!!!).
@abennett4 "Every single one of Bugliosi's bullet points are based on the evidence and careful analysis. Not a single falsehood in the bunch"
how about this one for starters "oswald claimed he ate with jarmin " now wouldnt bugliosis carefull analysis of the evidence have involved looking at the interrogation notes ? i guess not . if it did he would have learned that oswald said he ate alone .
@abennett4 "Every single one of Bugliosi's bullet points are based on the evidence and careful analysis. Not a single falsehood in the bunch. He lists 53 separate pieces of hard, incontrovertable pieces of evidence"
do you know the definition of the word incontrovertible ? "Not able to be denied or disputed: "incontrovertible proof"." now lets test that out . "oswald claimed he ate with jarmin" vincent bugliosi ,i think you will find that is not only disputed but is a proven lie .
@DixonRoy a lot of haters on this thread. They have nothing going on with their lives so they Identify with Oswald, I guess. It's kind of sick if you ask me.
For those who think the head shot to Kennedy came from somewhere in front, you should closely examine frame 313 of the Zapruder film. Not only does Kennedy's head move 3 or 4 inches forward from frame 312, the blood and brain tissue splatter is up and *forwards* indicating a shot from the rear. The Nix and Muchmore films from other angles shows the exact same thing. Google "dealey plaza head wound photographic evidence" and you will see what I mean.
@fobrien1 there was no sudden breaking of the vehicle at the moment of the head shot. And any slowing of the vehicle would have been negligible compared to the force of the rear-entry bullet/fragments forcing all that blood, bone and other tissue exiting out the front of Kennedy's head. But, of course, you recognize this.
@abennett4 Suppose just for the sake of argument I stabbed you or shot you anywhere in front. What direction would blood spurt out in from the entry wound? FORWARDS out the of the entry wound Duuuuuh! Numerous witnesses testified to the limo breaking to a near stop just before the head shot. But of course you recognise this and choose to present a falsehood anyway. Do you have a single point to make that is'nt complete and utter pants? I have yet to see one, batchelor of untruth.
@2001perseus That has got to be some of the most simplystic analysis (from a physics standpoint) that I've ever heard. You clearly didn't take any math or science in high school. I leave out college because its obvious you received no seconday education. And besides, ballistic tests proved that the bullets/fragments recovered were fired from Oswald's rifle, to the exclusion of all other weapons. And we all know where Oswald's rifle was recovered from.
@abennett4 "You can't do a ballistics test on bullets you have'nt got" Perseus reclaiming physics. Neither can you trace a fragment to a particular rifle because a fragment is'nt large enough to show barrel rifling characteristics or compare with a bullet fired from that rifle that does show them. The FBI can't do it, Scotland Yard, can't do it.not in 1963 and not even now. Only a fool with no knowledge of science at all thinks you can do it. That would be you.
@2001perseus The FBI CAN do it. There are other ways in addition to the rifling characteristics. You just don't believe it because it doesn't fit neatly into your biased and paranoid belief system. I used to believe in a conspiracy. Then I grew up.
@abennett4 "Houston Chronicle Reporter Bo Byers (rode in White House Press Bus)---twice stated that the Presidential Limousine "almost came to a stop, a dead stop"; "
"DPD motorcycle officer James W. Courson--"The limousine came to a stop and Mrs. Kennedy was on the back. I noticed that as I came around the corner at Elm. Then the Secret Service agent [Clint Hill] helped push her back into the car, and the motorcade took off at a high rate of speed."
@abennett4 "Clemon Earl Johnson---"You could see it (the limo) speed up and then stop, then speed up, and you could see it stop while they (sic; Clint Hill) threw Mrs. Kennedy back up in the car. Then they just left out of there like a bat of the eye and were just gone."
"AP photographer Henry Burroughs (rode in Camera Car #2)---" we heard the shots and the motorcade stopped."
@abennett4 "DPD Earle Brown---" The first I noticed the [JFK's] car was when it stopped.. after it made the turn and when the shots were fired, it stopped."
boby hargis)---" At that time [immediately before the head shot] the Presidential car slowed down. I heard somebody say 'Get going.' I felt blood hit me in the face and the Presidential car stopped almost immediately after that." "That guy (Greer) slowed down, maybe his orders was to slow down slowed down almost to a stop."
@abennett4 "DPD D.V. Harkness---" I saw the first shot and the President's car slow[ed] down to almost a stop I heard the first shot and saw the President's car almost come to a stop and some of the agents [were] piling on the car."
"Mrs. Earle ("Dearie") Cabell (rode in the Mayor's car)---the motorcade "stopped dead still when the noise of the shot was heard."
@abennett4 "Dallas Morning News reporter Mary Woodward (Pillsworth)---" Instead of speeding up the car, the car came to a halt.";
"TSBD Supervisor Roy Truly---after the first shot " I saw the President's car swerve to the left and stop somewheres down in the area [it stopped] for a second or two or something like that I just saw it stop."
@abennett4 Oh and for the record junior you can't confirm which gun a "fragment" came from. You need a bullet. Preferably one that was actually fired through the victim. So when you even have the slightest clue what you are talking about say hello to the boys again.
@2001perseus Your point about needing a whole bullet is absolutly untrue. But that hasn't stopped you before. The FBI is quite capable of tracing fragments to weapons. Why do you think they were able to make such a positive determination? And what is this BS about preferably having a bullet that was actually fired through the victim? If that was the case, they would never be able to trace a bullet to the weapon. What is your level of education?
@abennett4 Let me make something absolutely clear Einstein. Anybody can claim to be anything they want online or have any qualifications they want, so your blurb about your degree impresses no one. It simply serves to show how divorced from any sense of reality you are. Your incessant facile remarks about the education level of others you know nothing about is yet another indicator to your indisputable claim to the title of Moron of the year.
@abennett4 You have 1 bullet. A bullet confirmed to have been fired from the depository Carcano. Which failed to hit anybody. A fact apparent by it's startlingly good condition and failure to get ANY blood on it. Being a determined little bullet, it then set off in hot pursuit of the limo down the Stemmons freeway to Parklands. Through the doors, down the corridors, to where tired and exhausted it finally spotted a stretcher with rolled up bloody sheets and surgical instruments on it.
@abennett4 It decided that stretcher had to be the right stretcher to the exclusion of all other stretchers and tucked itself precariously under its mat. Unfortunately it chose in error a trolley that never had governor Connally on it, or come out of the elevator to the op room. Don't be too hard on the poor little thing, it'd had a long trip and was thoroughly done in and confused by the time it made its awful mistake. History is very unkind to it, whether reinvented by Bugliosi or otherwise.
“For conspiracy theorists, all discrepancies, contradictions, anomalies, et cetera, are suspicious, and are the heart and soul of the conspiracy movement. In their universe, everything proceeds perfectly and there is no such thing as human error, incompetence, coincidence or failure of memory. There are no innocent, benign explanations for anything"
"[Oswald's] mouth wrinkled up into a snarl that showed his upper teeth. When that happened, he changed into something monsterous", Stephen King - "11/22/63"
@abennett4 ""[Oswald's] mouth wrinkled up into a snarl that showed his upper teeth. When that happened, he changed into something monsterous", Stephen King - "11/22/63" "
34 continued "Likewise, the firearms experts found that the whole bullet recovered from a stretcher at Parkland Hospital, believed to be the stretcher Governor Connally was on, was fired from Oswald’s rifle to the exclusion of all other weapons" Vincent Bugliosi, Reclaiming History
@abennett4 That would be the book where Bugliosi claimed the black workers at the depository were Oswalds "close friends" when the testimony of all of them was that they hardly got a word out of the man. Try "reinventing history" instead of reclaiming it.
34. "Firearms identification experts from the Warren Commission and the HSCA concluded that two large bullet fragments found in the presidential limousine were parts of a bullet fired from Oswald’s Carcano rifle to the exclusion of all other weapons. continued....
1. "Whenever Oswald had Wesley Frazier drive him out to visit his wife and daughters at the Paine residence in Irving, he'd go on a Friday evening and return to Dallas on Monday morning. The assassination was on Friday, November 22, 1963. For the very first time, Oswald went to Irving with Frazier on a Thursday evening, November 21, obviously to pick up his Mannlicher-Carcano for the following day.' Vincent Bugliosi, Reclaiming History
@fobrien1 What lies are you talking about? I'm not aware of any. Bugliosi has 53 separate pieces of hard, incontrovertable pieces of evidence that point to Oswald, and Oswald alone. If only a few were factual, Oswald would clearly be guilty. Yet all 53 (that's 53!!!) are factual and based on the best evidence. There is no way in the real world that someone with this much evidence against them could be innocent. Right?
@abennett4 "Bugliosi has 53 separate pieces of hard, incontrovertable pieces of evidence that point to Oswald, and Oswald alone. If only a few were factual, Oswald would clearly be guilty. Yet all 53 (that's 53!!!) are factual and based on the best evidence" "oswald claimed he ate with jarmin "vincent bugliosi (a complete and utter lie and whats more i previously showed you the roof of this )
It's alarming-- the rate at which this "documentary" claims that everyone who DISagrees with the lone-assassin theory is -- either a "Fame-seeking-nutjob" (Oswald) / rightoues-angry 'nutjob' (Ruby) / "nutjob" for no apparent reason (David Ferrie...Ok...the 'eyebrows') and in the same breath claims that Garrison was "immoral and cruel" while claiming that Shaw was "so poor" and 'mistreated'. Not seeing the apparnet bias in this 'doc' doesn't make one conspirationist; it makes that one an idiot.
What about the NUMEROUS (more than 30!) Live and present(at the scene) witnesses who claimed to see smoke and shots fired from the grassy knoll??? What, this "documentary" simply had NO TIME in it's running time, to address their claims-- or address the fact that MOST of these Live-Time witnesses -- were SILENCED-- using every and any measure within the immediate years after this vile assassination??? What about that?? Simply not addressing uneasy questions DO NOT MAKE THEM DISAPPEAR.
@ironhide771 So by your own calulations (Most of 30 witnesses), 16 of them were SILENCED (i.e. murdered). Name them and breifly describe the circumstances of their deaths. Your accusations are preposterous and reek of paranoia.
@abennett4 "MOST of these Live-Time witnesses -- were SILENCED-- using every and any measure within the immediate years after this vile assassination?"
"So by your own calulations (Most of 30 witnesses), 16 of them were SILENCED (i.e. murdered"
clearly you didnt understand a single word (above) that ironhide posted .
@abennett4 heard it ,your the one trying to blow smoke and not from the knoll your trying to blow it up peoples a-s . you dishonestly use the smoke to make people look crazy but if youve done even a little bit of research (and judging by your history of debating little is the correct word ) you would know multiple witnesses said they saw smoke . i asked before but you never answered could it have been a car exhaust ?.
@ironhide771 No No it's perfectly normal for assassination witnesses to get shot 6 times in the head. get garroted and found in an oil drum, commit suicide in phenomenal numbers and drive cars straight into the hardest obstacles they can find on a straight roads with no blowouts. Even though these people suffered a higher casualty rate in death by violence per capita than many units that fought on D.Day it will never be taken into consideration by some that anything other than Oswald was amiss.
@2001perseus So your theory is that there were actual "hit squads" going around bumping off witnesses? Preposterous! You would need a second "hit squad" to bump off the first. I mean the first "hit squad" would have "known too much", right? And who is going to bump off the second "hit squad"? It is just a silly accusation for which you have absolutly zero evidence to back it up. What are you - twelve?
@abennett4 It seems I have the honour of addresssing an ego unattached to a brain. I love the way you quote directly from Salerno in Myer's snow job and have the stupidity to go on about where others get their ideas. If the hit man always had to be hit by another forward back into infinity then there would be no hit men and no hits anywhere, ever, period. It would take the mind of a 12 year old to accept such a ludicrous propositition so good luck with high school next year.
@2001perseus Yet you claim all these "hits" but are unable to cite a single example of a witness to the assassination who was "hit" (let alone "MOST" - now that's just plain silly). In fact, every one of the "witnesses" cited in paranoid conspiracy literature died quite naturally or in less than nafarious circumstances. And if there were "hit squads", why didn't any of them bump off the likes of Mark Lane, Jim Marrs or Oliver $tone? BTW, my degree is in Math (as in Logic).
@abennett4 Witnesses Mr logic includes any persons with relevant testimony or involved in investigation, not just observers in Deeley Plaza. Roger Craig, shot at and grazed in the head 1967. Badly injured after being run off the road 1971. Shot in the shoulder 1974. badly injured when his car engine exploded 1975 and surprise surprise shot dead from declared self inflicted wounds 1975. Lt Commander William Pitzer who had 16mm film of the JFK autopsy. shot dead, no nitrates on the hands....
@2001perseus Craig was a cop. Cops get into gun fights. Craig's car exploded because he forgot to keep oil in it. Again, all this was investigated and nothing nafarious. There has never been any statistical study done that has shown that people connected with the Kennedy assassination have died at an unusual rate or under unusual circumstances. Conspiracy buffs make these claims all the time without any numbers or evidence to back it up. Sells a lot of books I guess. You bought it!
@abennett4 Verdict on Pitzer, shot himself from 3 feet away suicide. Reporters Hunter and Koethe, given permission to search Ruby's apartment. Hunter shot dead in the Dallas police pressroom by cop Wiggins the next day Wiggins and his partner get 3 years probation after changing his story about dropping his gun. Koethe, killed by a karate chop to the throat in his apartment within a month. Crime reporter Dorothy Kilgallen interviews Jack Ruby 1965......
@2001perseus You truly are parnoid. For one, Kilgallen died of a lethal combination of alcohol and drugs. The investigators found nothing suspicious about her death. In fact, her family was in the house when she died. And besides, she had nothing on Ruby. Ruby acted alone and never revealed anything about a conspiracy. Unless you want to count his contention that millions of Jews were being murdered in the cells below him. lol
@2001perseus its worth noting also that pitzer was found with the gun in his right hand yet pitzer was left handed .
kilgallen was found with a book she told friends she had finished reading weeks previous ,the curious thing is that kilgallen had poor eyesight and wore reading glasses to read but her reading glasses were not found in her bedroom where she was found dead with her book .
@fobrien1 All true and more Fobrien. I left some detail out and the majority of witnesses out so as not to be typing all day answering the ridiculous claim that all witnesses died of natural causes. Even so, more effort than it was worth for a lying buffoon who has clearly never read anything but Bugliosi's fantasy book. It's actually demeaning lowering myself to answer such a shameless liar.
@2001perseus "Even so, more effort than it was worth for a lying buffoon who has clearly never read anything but Bugliosi's fantasy book"
be fair he read two books ,reclaiming history and the other one was steven kings book 22/11/63 ,one of them is a work of fiction but im still having difficulty trying to figure out which one .
@abennett4 Dorothey tells Margaret Smith she's going to break the case open. Nope oh dear another "natural death" from suicide. Margaret Smith found dead two days later. Sam Giancana shot 6 times in the mouth when due to appear before the HSCA and a fitting end for the scumbag. Johnny Rosellini, also due to appear before the HSCA. Garroted and found in an oil drum. William Sullivan one of six FBI men to die before they could testify to the HSCA shot "by accident" outside his home 1977....
@2001perseus Hey, mobsters get shot. Always have! Always will. Nothing nefarious and certainly no connection to the Kennedy assassination. Just think of all the mobsters who have flipped to the goverment side in the last 50 years. None of them have ever suggested that organized crime had anything to do with it.
@abennett4 No no Mobsters can't get shot because you'd have to shoot the one who shot him then shoot the one who shot him then shoot the one who shot him. Forgotten already sunshine? Flipped to who's side? Mobsters and Government on the same side!!! My God, you're one of those conspiracy theorists!
@abennett4 I've barely even started on the list with those and it's already more of my time than your worth. "Why would'nt they hit Mark Lane, Jim Marrs or Oliver Stone?" I don't know cupcake, maybe they thought even somebody with your misfiring logic could work out out that was a few hits too many to swallow and still be a believer. What a dumb question!
@2001perseus Oh, so too few hits are suspicious and too many hits are suspicious. There just have to be that certain amount to be in tune with your paranoid fantasies. With all this connecting of the dots you're doing you're beginning to sound like the Russel Crowe character in "A Beautiful Mind". Remember to take your Lithium.
@abennett4 ALL hits are suspicious. Too complicated for you to grasp? Craig was not a cop when he was twice shot at so what gunfight? Engines seize with no oil in, they don't explode. As for Dorothy she was actually found by Marc Sinclaire her hairdresser, that's how aware the others in that large house were of what had or had not occurred. Her death certificate signed by a coroner who insisted he had never signed. it Cause of administration of alcohol and barbituates "undetermined"
@abennett4 Correction. Johnny Roselli. Would'nt want to get accused of of a falsehood over a typo now would we. That of course assuming you ever got off your backside and researched anything yourself. Nah, I was probably safe.
The thing I HATE about this type of 'documentary' claiming "lone assassin" shot JFK is that it strengthens the wise old and uneasy saying which says that;
"THE DEAD ARE ALWAYS GUILTY" -- or as in the case of L.H. Oswald, it's very convenient to place the blame on someone who CANNOT answer back or tell the truth -- even though as long as he (Oswald) lived he consistently claimed to be "a patsy". It's like when a plane crashes & pilot dies-- investigation will conclude 'pilot error'. Bogus.
@ironhide771 You are probably not intellegent enough to recognize that it is not unusual for a guilty person (Oswald) to claim that they are innocent ("I'm a patsy"). If there ever was a trial, Oswald would have been found guilty so fast it would have made your head spin. His claims of innocent (if he ever took the stand, which I doubt) would have been overwhelmed by the mountain of evidence against him.
@abennett4 "Oswald would have been found guilty so fast it would have made your head spin. His claims of innocent (if he ever took the stand, which I doubt) would have been overwhelmed by the mountain of evidence against him"
yea right and thats why your friends posner and bugliosi must twist /distort /omit and lie in order to make oswald look guilty ,and why you posted lies and reposted those lies even after having been shown your wrong .
@fobrien1 What are you even talking about? I have never posted a single lie and you have yet to demonstrate a single falsehood on my part. You are so silly.
@abennett4 "What are you even talking about? I have never posted a single lie and you have yet to demonstrate a single falsehood on my part. You are so silly."
you didnt post a qoute from bugliosi that oswald claimed he ate with jarmin ? ,a quote which i not only told you was wholly incorrect but i posted proof of it ,and you repeatedly posted the quote again knowing it was inaccurate. thats when it stops being an error and becomes lies . i could go on .
@abennett4 "proof? What proof? Again, you shade the evidence to suit your fancy. And you call it proof? Ha!"
i did indeed post proof that bugliosis was wrong in saying "oswald claimed he ate with jarmin" in fact i posted it numerous times .but just for you ill do it again . in the comments after this one .
says 11-23-63 negr came in one jr.and short negro "
the above extract is verbatim from fritz notes ,where he wrote oswald said on november 23 that whle he was in the lunchroom 2 negros came in one was called junior (this is jarmin) and he was with a short negro (this was norman ).
@abennett4 "oswald stated that on november 22,1963,he had eaten lunch in the lunchroom in the texas school book depository ,alone, but recalled possibly two negro employees walking through the room during this period.he stated possibly one of these employees was called "junior" and the other was a short individual whos name he could not recall but whom he would be able to recognize"
the above extract is verbatim from bookhouts interrogation notes .id say thats proof positive .
@The9Nazgul To chill, I'll settle for an iced tea. Seriously, though, I'm on your side on the banning issue. I may disagree with your opinion of the evidence in this case, but I'd like to be counted as defending your right to express it. Fortunately, David takes pains not to ban anyone here. Kudos to him for that.
Dan Marvin, witness to the CIA assassination of an innocent American trying to bear witness to their murder of JFK, died January 19th. Dan Marvin was asked by CIA to murder Lt Commander Pitzer of Bethesda Naval Hospital because Pitzer possessed films of wounds on JFK other than those shown to the Warren Commission. watch?v=aLxocPaeTYA&feature=related
@StSimonMartyr It's a good book worth reading. David avoids answering it. This is correct, but how much the nuke issue was the initiating cause is up to debate. More likely CIA used this as another straw by which to break JFK's back.
Ok, that's great. They figured out how one bullet hit Kennedy from behind but last I checked, Kennedy was also shot in the head with a bullet coming toward him. Did they decide they were just going to leave the headshot out of all this or...?
@auralstream yeah it is another conspiracy because the main stream media is run by the same people that run our Gov... so of course they are going to do what they can to convince the people that the Gov is good... yeah jfks head went back and to the left...
@wh1teflower Kennedy's went back and to the left (you're just parroting the movie 'JFK") because of the jet-effect caused by the exit of a projectile to the front of Kennedy's head. It is a well-known physical phenomena completely consistent with Newton’s laws of motion. The rest of your comments (about the government and media) reek of misinformation and paranoia..
@abennett4 "Kennedy's went back and to the left (you're just parroting the movie 'JFK") because of the jet-effect caused by the exit of a projectile to the front of Kennedy's head."
and your just parroting the much criticised warren report ,.the scene in the movie jfk showing jfk going back and to the left came from the actuall zapruder film perhaps you think stone altered the zapruder film and added the back and to the left motion ?.
@abennett4 ""back and to the left" :back and to the left" "back and to the left"., there you go again - parroting Oliver Stone. Silly stuff!"
ill ask again in your mind is the clip shown in the movie jfk not from the actual zapruder film ? ,now tell us all that the motion of jfks body seen in that clip wasnt back and to the left .
@auralstream This is just 10 minutes out of the 90 minute documentary. The rest addresses the head shot. As with the other shot, the head sho also clearly came from behind.
@auralstream this is just 10 minutes out of the 90 minute documentary. In the rest it clearly shows that the head shot came from the exact same location (i.e. behind from the Book Depository) as the other one.
@abennett4 I've seen the whole 90 minute documentary. It does'nt clearly show you anything of the sort. Myers tells you the right temple wound is an exit wound and backs it up with zip, even with $11,000,000 dollars worth of program to do it. If you've got video with Myers doing more than that post it and prove it.
@2001perseus i dont know if your aware but abennett posts quotes from steven kings ficticious book as tho they are based on fact ,so i wouldnt expect much in the way of facts or accuracy .but expect plenty of king followed by posner and bugliosi ,that said when it comes to writing books all 3 have one thing in common and thats fiction .
@2001perseus In addition to the jet-effect causing Kennedy's "back and to the left" head movement, at frame 313 of the zapruder film (head shot), all the blood and tissue splatter is forwards clearly indicating a shot from the rear. And besides, ballistic tests to the recovered bullet fragments proved beyond all doubt that the bullet to the head was fired from Oswald's rifle to the exclusion of all other weapons. And we all know where Oswald's rifle was found.
@abennett4 The only jet effect present is the hot air from your mouth. Here's a non Oliver Stone phrase for you. Back and on the trunk. Back and on the trunk. That's the direction part of JFK's skull and brains went in when it was blown out the back of his head by a bullet coming from the front. Now since you told that whopper about Myers and the headshot and cant post or point to a post with that in it. I take it all you've got is parroting books like Bugliosi's clunker.
@Sackrider5000 Although the range increased as the limousine moved further down Elm St, the shots actually became easier. The reason is the relative motion & geometry. The first shot would have required Oswald to take a very steep, down angle shot w/ relatively high relative motion - IN ADDITION, that shot would have to be rushed (or obstructed) by the branches of an oak tree. Elm St is downhill & moves directly away from the window, making it EASIER to track the target. Each shot became easier.
@SUSSTURUCU Although I agree with you that "OSWALD DID IT" - I disagree with your logic. You don't need to make some kind of cosmic determination based on what you see in his eyes. All you really need to do is piece together the evidence and testimony. THAT'S what tells you did it.
@SUSSTURUCU There is no doubt than one can build a compelling psychological profile of Oswald that actually makes him EXACTLY the type of person we would expect to be a presidential assassin. And, further, that his actions wreaked of one who had committed a horrible deed. Yet - this is all secondary to the HARD evidence that he was guilty of the crime. Fingerprints! Fibers! Ballistics! Medical analysis! and finally, the condemning testimony that puts him at that window.
@Sackrider5000 Contrary to the other reply you were given, the first shot already had a round in chamber therefore there was no rush and even using a scope it did'nt even hit the Lincoln. The next two shots both had to be retracked after ejecting a spent shell and relocking the bolt therefore were rushed and HARDER even with a shallower angle. Good question, you choose which is a good answer.
@2001perseus yeah and if the first shot was a hard one, why did he shoot? why wouldn't one wait a couple of seconds and keep the upper hand situation... and it's hard to believe that the gun went off by accident in the first shot. mysteries and questions after another and another...
I have tried to highlight the contrast between Bonnie Ray Williams November account to the FBI and his WC testimony. There is just as sharp a contrast between the November account to the FBI of Charles Givens and his account to the WC, which for some reason I will not presume a guess at was not conducted at the WC but in private with a single counsel in Dallas. I invite ALL who are aware of both accounts to discuss them if they are interested in doing so.
@fobrien1 Yes, that was an Airtel from SACDallas (Gordon Shanklin) to director Hoover (ol' J Edgar himself). What's more damning is the Airtel to Hoover concerning SS agent Johnsen and SS director Rowley. It says specifically that both failed "to identify bullet C one by inspection." In FBI-speak, that means that the witness said that the item didn't look like the same one they saw or handled. If it had been "it looks like it, but I'm not 100% certain, it would've read "failed to positively id."
the thing is... there's no proof that it's not a government conspiracy.
i defiantly wouldn't rule that theory out. it seems plausible that the cia would want to do away with kennedy. he worked for the people. he threatened the establishment.
it's only my opinion of course. there's not any solid evidence either way. and if there was proof, do you honestly think the government would let us know? probably not. i just feel like no one knows enough about it to say for sure either way.
@OddlyRandomPro Did you just say, "There's NO proof that it's NOT a government conspiracy?" It's hard enough to prove a negative; harder STILL to prove a DOUBLE negative. What a ridiculous statement.
Hell, for THAT matter I could say, "There's NO proof that aliens are NOT responsible for Kennedy's murder."
And your username is "OddlyRandomPro"? Well selected!
CONT'D certain that this bullet did what's alleged of it? Nope. Sorry, David, that epically fails the smell test. Look, you can profess your BELIEF in CE 399 as it's purported to be; just don't tell other people what should or should not be regarded as the truth and imply they're nuts if they don't.
@davidemerling You're still not getting the difficulty here: the 1st four men didnt simply fail to positively id CE 399 as the stretcher bullet, but did not id it AT ALL. In the case of the Secret Service men, the FBI memo specifically says "by inspection." There's no trace of human body fluids or tissue on it (odd, given its assigned career). It strikes and shatters several of Gov. Connally's bones, yet shows no more deformity than a test round fired into cotton wadding. Yet you're sooo CONT'D
@smartalek65 a document says an agent agent odum brought a bullet (ce399) to parklands and the agent in question says he never even saw or handled any bullet.pretty bad news for the LN.
@fobrien1 - Somebody REALLY does not like your posts and they continually mark them as spam. I spend a lot of time UNspamming your posts. I may not agree with what you have to say - but it's certainly topical and deserves to be read. I sure wish the mad-spam-tagger would stop this. If it continues - I will shutdown (again) the site for about a week - kind of like Wikipedia's protest to SOPA. :)
I'd rather not do that so I respectfully ask the individual responsible to please stop doing it.
@davidemerling i guess my presence on this thread is not appreciated by a particular LN ,its childish behaviour and speaks vollumes about that person .
On the Conspirology sites "LNers" get BANNED within a day by Conspirologist uploaders.
In contrast, here we have Conspirologists, some of whom who spend lots of time here, and take it for granted that they are on a "LNer" (a Conspirologist pejorative & misnomer) site, get marked as spam by others, and the uploader, a "LNer," actually protests, even to the point of shutting comments down completely.
A very telling difference in the two "camps." Just my observation.
@The9Nazgul naz with respect to david he chose to upload these videos and then post comments and invite people to reply to these comments , no one made him do anything he didnt want to do . by the same token if david decides he doesnt want a particular person posting or no one posting on his thread its his perogative to block these comments . the point your missing here naz is that a CT would have no reason to flag my comments as spam -----------------
@fobrien1 No, YOU'RE missing the point, one that I've tried to make in the past, and will continue to harp about.
If @davidemerling acted like your brethren Conspirologist uploaders, then he would've BANNED you and others eons ago. Instead, he's more willing to shut down comments completely than to see someone ELSE on his "side" censoring.
Once again, the difference between the two camps is VERY telling. And your refusal to acknowledge that is ALSO very telling.
@The9Nazgul naz you continualy say dont put all LN together yet you do that which you ask others not to do. you say "MY BRETHREN". but as far as im aware this is the only thread ive ever debated you on .so your aligning me with people you met many months or years ago is bunkum . naz you choose to debate by speculating and using terms which insult people ,and the you whine when people return the compliment .
@fobrien1 "Whine" LOL R U kidding me? Nothing I post comes close to whining. Nor do I take things personally. Ahem...
Every comment I make has a point relevant to the debate. In this case, I am pointing out a NOTABLE difference between the MO of the two camps. In the one, you have blatant, unmitigated censorship. In the other, you have precisely the opposite. Not only that, but those from the first camp don't even appreciate this about the 2nd camp.
@The9Nazgul Gentalman, Gentalman..lol. CT and LN can both be pretty reactionary at times. Goodness knows I have had my buttons press a few times. and pulled a few comments out of embarrassment. Most people write as they speak, therefore it's understandable for a reader to read something and interpret it out of context. I am guilty of that as well, and of course some of us are simply being as ass,once in a while lol..and we call one another on it. In the end this is better than a lot of places.
@NOC1TIME i agree with that . ive been called terrible names on youtube /been insulted and attacked by LN and for no reason at all other than i have an opposing view . and apart from the odd bit of sarcasm i dont react but we can all have a bad day and react when we never normally would , but i get annoyed when the LN post comments about how they were treated on a thread by CT when they are guilty of all the same things probably even more so than the CT -----------------
@NOC1TIME in my experience a lot of the time LN are the ones flinging the insults and name calling and beng abusive and the CT react to this , and some times the CT act in the same maner . and the thing is that people who feel the need to act like this or idiots and perhaps they deserve banning be they CT or LN ,but LN have to accept they are as guilty if not more of that which they accuse the CT of . ive seen thread after thread on forums ruined ------------------
@The9Nazgul naz when i said you whine i mean in terms of repeating that you were banned by someone on another thread and that that in some way reflects on me or the other people on this thread who have a different view to yours .i dont know why you got banned ,but if someone banned you for no reason it is wrong and i dont agree with it and i say i dont think anyone should be banned by either side for no reason or simply because they have an opposing view .-----------------------
@fobrien1 Point taken on that. I suppose I have been griping about that -- I guess I'm still sour about it (that I was banned), and have had an axe to grind about it.
@The9Nazgul personally i would have to say having debated with you that you dont say or act in a way that would warrant being banned from any thread . but then i wasnt posting on the thread which you were banned from so i have no idea what occurred there , but again i cant imagine you would do anything that would result in being banned and if thats the case then the person who banned you is wrong and is just being petty.----------------
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In my dream, the Plaza is packed, people in every direction as far as the eye can see. All highways into Dallas are clogged with cars, and millions of people have left them, now walking to Dealy with JFK & 911 signs to be there for the Nov. 22, 50 year shakeup. The whole world watches in awe, as now, all roads into Texas are parking lots..
and then a chemtrail tanker fleet doses them with vallium and prozac....
they forget why they came....
and go home & watch the "nooz
MrNoblemanoflove 12 hours ago
Visible Proof That Oswald Was Innocent
Anyone see these videos?
Part 1 of 9.
v=G_3sCGPQ3zk
comx427 15 hours ago
@abennett4 What's funny is that you think that ALL those 53 points independently prove Oswald's guilt. Some do nothing of the sort, like #12 you copied a couple hours ago. It only tries to establish Brennan's credibility-and fails miserably. Or #16, which is a misrepresentation of fact. What the Bugliosi bible DOESN'T tell you is that Givens was picked up by the DPD, and he HAD left the building. Your idol yet again fails.
smartalek65 17 hours ago
@smartalek65 I bet the holy Bugliosi bible does'nt tell you Givens early testimony to the FBI put Oswald in the domino room eating lunch alone at 11.50 either. Givens made liars of the FBI agents by denying he ever said that to them. Of course with typical WC attention to justice those agents were never called to testify or submit their notes to confirm Givens perjury and defend themselves against his lies.
2001perseus 16 hours ago
@2001perseus givens made a statment to the fbi that he saw oswald reading a newspaper at 11.50 in the lunchroom ,the warren commision asked givens if he made such a statment he said no (that was a lie) .the commission had this fbi statment and knew givens was contradicting himself but staggeringly chose not to question givens further on it.
fobrien1 1 hour ago
13."Although in his interrogation on Friday afternoon Oswald said he was having lunch on the 1st floor of the Book Depository at the time of the assassination, during Sunday’s interrogation Oswald slipped up and placed himself on the 6th floor at the time of the assassination, making him the only employee of the Book Depository who placed himself on the 6th floor, or was placed there by anyone else, at the time we know an assassin shot Kennedy from the 6th floor.' Bugliosi, Reclaiming History
abennett4 17 hours ago
12."Apart from Brennan, we know that Kennedy's assassin was at the subject 6th-floor window.Among other evidence, the rifle that was used to murder Kennedy was found on the sixth-floor of the Book Depository Building, witnesses other than Brennan saw a rifle sticking out of the southeasternmost window on the 6th floor, a sniper's nest was found around the subject window, and three cartridge casings from the murder weapon was found on the sixth floor beneath the window." V.B., Reclaiming History
abennett4 18 hours ago
But did the last shot that hit JFK in the top of the head come from in front? I haven't studied this case, so please correct me, but that's the hypothesis I'm forming.
BanalBoxberry 19 hours ago
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@BanalBoxberry "But did the last shot that hit JFK in the top of the head come from in front?"
some of us believe a shot did come from an area on the knoll which is to the front and right of jfk as he travelled down elm street ,others believe all shots came from the rear . the best way to figure out all this is to not take anyones word either way but to do your own research ,a good place to statrt might be the testimony of officer joe marshall smith who believed he encountered-
fobrien1 19 hours ago
@BanalBoxberry Depends on who answers you whether you get corrected or not. That's one very crucial area of contention. Gonna just have to look into it and make up your own mind. Not fair to say much else to you if you're just getting started on this.
2001perseus 19 hours ago
@BanalBoxberry a fake secret service agent on the knoll ,and also you could check out dallas chief of police jesse curry who said the man smith encountered must have been bogus .as i say do your own research and thinking ,dont just take anyones word that what they say is accurate not even me check /double check and treble check everything your told /see and read .
fobrien1 19 hours ago
@BanalBoxberry It might appear so because Kennedy's head goes "back and to the left". But this was caused by the "jet-effect" of the bullet exploding and exiting out the front. At the actual instant of the head shot (frame 313 of the zapruder film), Kennedy's head actually moves forward 3-4 inches and all the tissue splatter is forward indicating a shot from th rear. Ballistic test proved the bullet to the head came from Oswald's rifle, to the exclusion of all other weapons.
abennett4 18 hours ago
@abennett4 How can ballistics tests prove the bullet from the head shot came from that rifle when to this day they have'nt found the bullet you complete utter clown. Are you on LSD or what? We are also still waiting for your description of how the FBI assigned bullet "fragments" to a particular rifle in 1963. I'm underwhelmed with anticipation, especially as no fragments were ever found in or removed from JFK's head. C'mon baby put up or shut up!
2001perseus 17 hours ago
The most logical conclusion was that JFK was murdered so that Johnson could become president. The fact that he destroyed some of the most important evidence (having the presidential limo cleaned and rebuilt) would alone indict him as the most important beneficiary of the assassination.
Lee Harvey Oswald the sole assassin? In your dreams. He should have picked a better spot and a better rifle.
No conspiracy? The fact that only Agent Hill responded to the shots proves it was a conspiracy.
AudieHolland 22 hours ago
Anyone who actually believes that Oswald is innocent is sluggish intellectually.
abennett4 22 hours ago
11. "After the first and second shots rang out, a motorcade witness, Howard Brennan, sitting on a short concrete wall directly across the street from the sixth-floor window, looked up and actually saw Oswald in the window holding his rifle. Only 120 feet away from Oswald, he got a very good look as he watched, in horror, Oswald (whom he had seen in the window earlier, before the motorcade had arrived) take deliberate aim and fire the final shot from his rifle." V. Bugliosi, Reclaiming History
abennett4 23 hours ago
@abennett4 Brennan. That would be the guy who claimed he saw Oswald fire the headshot while looking directly at the depository window then, turned his head faster than a speeding bullet in time to see JFK's head explode??? Oh yes, there's a reliable account! but I'm not surprised you would'nt have a reality check over it.
2001perseus 22 hours ago
@2001perseus and Brennan "just happened" to be able to tell the authorities the exact window where they "later" found Oswald's sniper's nest. Just a lucky guess? I guess you think Brennan was just a plant and part of the conspiracy. More paranoia. Try Seroquil.
abennett4 18 hours ago
@abennett4 And other witnesses totally contradict Brennan who thinks he can turn his head faster than a bullet travels. I'll go with the other witnesses who were consistent and believable in their testimonies about the man in the light shirt in the window preceded by the black man they saw there. I've never read Jim Marrs book on this but hey it must be worth a read if you can't shut up about the man.
2001perseus 18 hours ago
@abennett4 "and Brennan "just happened" to be able to tell the authorities the exact window where they "later" found Oswald's sniper's nest. Just a lucky guess?"
if brennan had told them at 12.30 that the shooter was firing from the 6th floor south east corner window how come luke mooney only stumbled upon the snipers nest at 1.00 some 30 minutes later ? .
fobrien1 1 hour ago
16. "After the shooting in Dealey Plaza, nearly all sixteen warehousemen who worked in the Depository Building returned to the building and were present at a roll call of employees. Only Lee Harvey Oswald and Charles Givens were not present. Givens was located shortly thereafter. So only Oswald left the building and was unaccounted for." Vincent Bugliosi, Reclaiming History
abennett4 23 hours ago
29. "After Oswald’s arrest at the Texas Theater, he refused to give his name to the Dallas police officers who captured him. As a pretty consistent rule, when a person is innocent of a crime, he cooperates with law enforcement." Vincent Bugliosi, Reclaiming istory
abennett4 23 hours ago
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@abennett4 "After Oswald’s arrest at the Texas Theater, he refused to give his name to the Dallas police officers who captured him. As a pretty consistent rule, when a person is innocent of a crime, he cooperates with law enforcement." Vincent Bugliosi, Reclaiming istory"
one of the officers in the police car removed oswalds wallet which contained his name so they knew who he was ,and its more than reasonable to say even without the wallet they knew who he was .
fobrien1 59 minutes ago
@abennett4 "Every single one of Bugliosi's bullet points..." That has been repeatedly proven false, that's why it's considered lying. The one you repeated moments ago about Tippit's murder is one of them. There's more evidence pointing AWAY from Oswald than the weak case made by Bugliosi.
smartalek65 1 day ago
@smartalek65 Really? All 53? That's funny!
abennett4 18 hours ago
24. "Forty-five minutes after the shooting in Dealey Plaza, Lee Harvey Oswald is the one who just happened to murder Dallas police officer J.D. Tippit on Tenth Street near Patton in the Oak Cliff area, only about nine-tenths of a mile from his rooming house." Vincent Bugliosi, Reclaiming History
abennett4 1 day ago
Ok I am open to hearing the evidence and have read tons of stuff on this issue. One thing: if that one bullet hit both Kennedy and Connally wouldn't it have been smashed all over the place? Yet the bullet was in great condition. Am I wrong on that?
Cooks195 1 day ago
@Cooks195 according to the warren commissions own experts ce399 the magic bullet couldnt have caused all wounds to jfk and connally ,the wound thats most problematic is connallys wrist wound . but if you google warren commison test bullets and look on may ferrells site you will see a bullet that hit a goat rib (mutilated ) a bullet that hit a human wrist ( badly mutilated) and two bullets fired into cotton wadding ,guess which looks most like ce399 ?.
fobrien1 1 day ago
You can either take Warren as the bible or reject it partially or on the whole..that is the simple choice.
The WCR, produced in the mid 60's was done with what we today consider primitive tools..under primitive conditions...sadly limited forensic procedures and administered by questionable appointees.
No one today would argue successfully that not a single detailed investigative process used by WC in mid 60's would be used today for the same crime.
Clearly we have learned from past mistakes.
zeroceiling 1 day ago
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zeroceiling 1 day ago
@abennett4 "I've never posted a single lie..." Yes, you have. You've parroted Bugliosi's falsehoods, fobrien pointed numerous of those falsehoods out to you, and you persist in posting those same quotes. Those are LIES, because you knew they were false when you posted them. Then you expect those who know they're false to bow down to the great god Bugliosi and beg forgiveness for checking the facts...
smartalek65 2 days ago
@smartalek65 Every single one of Bugliosi's bullet points are based on the evidence and careful analysis. Not a single falsehood in the bunch. He lists 53 separate pieces of hard, incontrovertable pieces of evidence, all pointing directly at Oswald. If only a handful were correct, Oswald would certainly be quilty. Yet he came up with 53 (Fifty-three!!!).
abennett4 1 day ago
@abennett4 "Every single one of Bugliosi's bullet points are based on the evidence and careful analysis. Not a single falsehood in the bunch"
how about this one for starters "oswald claimed he ate with jarmin " now wouldnt bugliosis carefull analysis of the evidence have involved looking at the interrogation notes ? i guess not . if it did he would have learned that oswald said he ate alone .
fobrien1 18 hours ago
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@abennett4 "Every single one of Bugliosi's bullet points are based on the evidence and careful analysis. Not a single falsehood in the bunch. He lists 53 separate pieces of hard, incontrovertable pieces of evidence"
do you know the definition of the word incontrovertible ? "Not able to be denied or disputed: "incontrovertible proof"." now lets test that out . "oswald claimed he ate with jarmin" vincent bugliosi ,i think you will find that is not only disputed but is a proven lie .
fobrien1 51 minutes ago
@abennett4 y everyone hate on you good point!!!
DixonRoy 2 days ago in playlist JFK assassination
@DixonRoy a lot of haters on this thread. They have nothing going on with their lives so they Identify with Oswald, I guess. It's kind of sick if you ask me.
abennett4 1 day ago
For those who think the head shot to Kennedy came from somewhere in front, you should closely examine frame 313 of the Zapruder film. Not only does Kennedy's head move 3 or 4 inches forward from frame 312, the blood and brain tissue splatter is up and *forwards* indicating a shot from the rear. The Nix and Muchmore films from other angles shows the exact same thing. Google "dealey plaza head wound photographic evidence" and you will see what I mean.
abennett4 3 days ago
@abennett4 that forward movement wouldnt have anything to do with the fact the driver stepped on the brakes would it .
fobrien1 3 days ago
@fobrien1 there was no sudden breaking of the vehicle at the moment of the head shot. And any slowing of the vehicle would have been negligible compared to the force of the rear-entry bullet/fragments forcing all that blood, bone and other tissue exiting out the front of Kennedy's head. But, of course, you recognize this.
abennett4 1 day ago
@abennett4 Suppose just for the sake of argument I stabbed you or shot you anywhere in front. What direction would blood spurt out in from the entry wound? FORWARDS out the of the entry wound Duuuuuh! Numerous witnesses testified to the limo breaking to a near stop just before the head shot. But of course you recognise this and choose to present a falsehood anyway. Do you have a single point to make that is'nt complete and utter pants? I have yet to see one, batchelor of untruth.
2001perseus 1 day ago
@2001perseus That has got to be some of the most simplystic analysis (from a physics standpoint) that I've ever heard. You clearly didn't take any math or science in high school. I leave out college because its obvious you received no seconday education. And besides, ballistic tests proved that the bullets/fragments recovered were fired from Oswald's rifle, to the exclusion of all other weapons. And we all know where Oswald's rifle was recovered from.
abennett4 23 hours ago
@abennett4 "You can't do a ballistics test on bullets you have'nt got" Perseus reclaiming physics. Neither can you trace a fragment to a particular rifle because a fragment is'nt large enough to show barrel rifling characteristics or compare with a bullet fired from that rifle that does show them. The FBI can't do it, Scotland Yard, can't do it.not in 1963 and not even now. Only a fool with no knowledge of science at all thinks you can do it. That would be you.
2001perseus 22 hours ago
@2001perseus The FBI CAN do it. There are other ways in addition to the rifling characteristics. You just don't believe it because it doesn't fit neatly into your biased and paranoid belief system. I used to believe in a conspiracy. Then I grew up.
abennett4 21 hours ago
@abennett4 You have the floor. Please do tell us all how the FBI confirmed a fragment came from a particular rifle in 1963?
2001perseus 20 hours ago
@abennett4 "there was no sudden breaking of the vehicle at the moment of the head shot"
i guess all the witnesses who lined elm street who said the limo came to an allmost full stop must have been mistaken then .
fobrien1 18 hours ago
@abennett4 "Houston Chronicle Reporter Bo Byers (rode in White House Press Bus)---twice stated that the Presidential Limousine "almost came to a stop, a dead stop"; "
"DPD motorcycle officer James W. Courson--"The limousine came to a stop and Mrs. Kennedy was on the back. I noticed that as I came around the corner at Elm. Then the Secret Service agent [Clint Hill] helped push her back into the car, and the motorcade took off at a high rate of speed."
fobrien1 18 hours ago
@abennett4 "Clemon Earl Johnson---"You could see it (the limo) speed up and then stop, then speed up, and you could see it stop while they (sic; Clint Hill) threw Mrs. Kennedy back up in the car. Then they just left out of there like a bat of the eye and were just gone."
"AP photographer Henry Burroughs (rode in Camera Car #2)---" we heard the shots and the motorcade stopped."
fobrien1 18 hours ago
@abennett4 "DPD Earle Brown---" The first I noticed the [JFK's] car was when it stopped.. after it made the turn and when the shots were fired, it stopped."
boby hargis)---" At that time [immediately before the head shot] the Presidential car slowed down. I heard somebody say 'Get going.' I felt blood hit me in the face and the Presidential car stopped almost immediately after that." "That guy (Greer) slowed down, maybe his orders was to slow down slowed down almost to a stop."
fobrien1 18 hours ago
@abennett4 "DPD D.V. Harkness---" I saw the first shot and the President's car slow[ed] down to almost a stop I heard the first shot and saw the President's car almost come to a stop and some of the agents [were] piling on the car."
"Mrs. Earle ("Dearie") Cabell (rode in the Mayor's car)---the motorcade "stopped dead still when the noise of the shot was heard."
fobrien1 18 hours ago
@abennett4 "Dallas Morning News reporter Mary Woodward (Pillsworth)---" Instead of speeding up the car, the car came to a halt.";
"TSBD Supervisor Roy Truly---after the first shot " I saw the President's car swerve to the left and stop somewheres down in the area [it stopped] for a second or two or something like that I just saw it stop."
fobrien1 18 hours ago
@abennett4 Oh and for the record junior you can't confirm which gun a "fragment" came from. You need a bullet. Preferably one that was actually fired through the victim. So when you even have the slightest clue what you are talking about say hello to the boys again.
2001perseus 2 days ago
@2001perseus Your point about needing a whole bullet is absolutly untrue. But that hasn't stopped you before. The FBI is quite capable of tracing fragments to weapons. Why do you think they were able to make such a positive determination? And what is this BS about preferably having a bullet that was actually fired through the victim? If that was the case, they would never be able to trace a bullet to the weapon. What is your level of education?
abennett4 23 hours ago
@abennett4 Let me make something absolutely clear Einstein. Anybody can claim to be anything they want online or have any qualifications they want, so your blurb about your degree impresses no one. It simply serves to show how divorced from any sense of reality you are. Your incessant facile remarks about the education level of others you know nothing about is yet another indicator to your indisputable claim to the title of Moron of the year.
2001perseus 21 hours ago
@2001perseus Thank You!
abennett4 18 hours ago
@abennett4 You have 1 bullet. A bullet confirmed to have been fired from the depository Carcano. Which failed to hit anybody. A fact apparent by it's startlingly good condition and failure to get ANY blood on it. Being a determined little bullet, it then set off in hot pursuit of the limo down the Stemmons freeway to Parklands. Through the doors, down the corridors, to where tired and exhausted it finally spotted a stretcher with rolled up bloody sheets and surgical instruments on it.
2001perseus 21 hours ago
@abennett4 It decided that stretcher had to be the right stretcher to the exclusion of all other stretchers and tucked itself precariously under its mat. Unfortunately it chose in error a trolley that never had governor Connally on it, or come out of the elevator to the op room. Don't be too hard on the poor little thing, it'd had a long trip and was thoroughly done in and confused by the time it made its awful mistake. History is very unkind to it, whether reinvented by Bugliosi or otherwise.
2001perseus 21 hours ago
@2001perseus Your Jim Marrs is showing.
abennett4 18 hours ago
“For conspiracy theorists, all discrepancies, contradictions, anomalies, et cetera, are suspicious, and are the heart and soul of the conspiracy movement. In their universe, everything proceeds perfectly and there is no such thing as human error, incompetence, coincidence or failure of memory. There are no innocent, benign explanations for anything"
abennett4 3 days ago
"[Oswald's] mouth wrinkled up into a snarl that showed his upper teeth. When that happened, he changed into something monsterous", Stephen King - "11/22/63"
abennett4 3 days ago
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@abennett4 ""[Oswald's] mouth wrinkled up into a snarl that showed his upper teeth. When that happened, he changed into something monsterous", Stephen King - "11/22/63" "
still posting fiction i see.
fobrien1 3 days ago
anyone who actually believes Oswald is innocent is mentally sluggish (or simply unfamiliar with the evidence).
abennett4 3 days ago
@abennett4 "anyone who actually believes Oswald is innocent is mentally sluggish (or simply unfamiliar with the evidence)."
i take it you think your familliar with the evidence but your previous comments would disagree with you .
fobrien1 3 days ago
That is a lot of "exclusions" of all other weapons. LOL
abennett4 3 days ago
34 continued "Likewise, the firearms experts found that the whole bullet recovered from a stretcher at Parkland Hospital, believed to be the stretcher Governor Connally was on, was fired from Oswald’s rifle to the exclusion of all other weapons" Vincent Bugliosi, Reclaiming History
abennett4 3 days ago
@abennett4 That would be the book where Bugliosi claimed the black workers at the depository were Oswalds "close friends" when the testimony of all of them was that they hardly got a word out of the man. Try "reinventing history" instead of reclaiming it.
Anytime cupcake!
2001perseus 2 days ago
34. "Firearms identification experts from the Warren Commission and the HSCA concluded that two large bullet fragments found in the presidential limousine were parts of a bullet fired from Oswald’s Carcano rifle to the exclusion of all other weapons. continued....
abennett4 3 days ago
1. "Whenever Oswald had Wesley Frazier drive him out to visit his wife and daughters at the Paine residence in Irving, he'd go on a Friday evening and return to Dallas on Monday morning. The assassination was on Friday, November 22, 1963. For the very first time, Oswald went to Irving with Frazier on a Thursday evening, November 21, obviously to pick up his Mannlicher-Carcano for the following day.' Vincent Bugliosi, Reclaiming History
abennett4 3 days ago
@abennett4 back to posting vinnie quotes i see ,not to worry ill repost all his lies and distotions .
fobrien1 3 days ago
@fobrien1 What lies are you talking about? I'm not aware of any. Bugliosi has 53 separate pieces of hard, incontrovertable pieces of evidence that point to Oswald, and Oswald alone. If only a few were factual, Oswald would clearly be guilty. Yet all 53 (that's 53!!!) are factual and based on the best evidence. There is no way in the real world that someone with this much evidence against them could be innocent. Right?
abennett4 1 day ago
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@abennett4 "Bugliosi has 53 separate pieces of hard, incontrovertable pieces of evidence that point to Oswald, and Oswald alone. If only a few were factual, Oswald would clearly be guilty. Yet all 53 (that's 53!!!) are factual and based on the best evidence" "oswald claimed he ate with jarmin "vincent bugliosi (a complete and utter lie and whats more i previously showed you the roof of this )
fobrien1 17 hours ago
@abennett4 "For the very first time, Oswald went to Irving with Frazier on a Thursday evening, November 21"
vinnie must be unaware that oswald also went to irving on october 31st a thursday .
fobrien1 17 hours ago
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Interesting stuff check this out thequestiontimes.blogspot.com
tajk786110 4 days ago
It's alarming-- the rate at which this "documentary" claims that everyone who DISagrees with the lone-assassin theory is -- either a "Fame-seeking-nutjob" (Oswald) / rightoues-angry 'nutjob' (Ruby) / "nutjob" for no apparent reason (David Ferrie...Ok...the 'eyebrows') and in the same breath claims that Garrison was "immoral and cruel" while claiming that Shaw was "so poor" and 'mistreated'. Not seeing the apparnet bias in this 'doc' doesn't make one conspirationist; it makes that one an idiot.
ironhide771 5 days ago
What about the NUMEROUS (more than 30!) Live and present(at the scene) witnesses who claimed to see smoke and shots fired from the grassy knoll??? What, this "documentary" simply had NO TIME in it's running time, to address their claims-- or address the fact that MOST of these Live-Time witnesses -- were SILENCED-- using every and any measure within the immediate years after this vile assassination??? What about that?? Simply not addressing uneasy questions DO NOT MAKE THEM DISAPPEAR.
ironhide771 5 days ago
@ironhide771 So by your own calulations (Most of 30 witnesses), 16 of them were SILENCED (i.e. murdered). Name them and breifly describe the circumstances of their deaths. Your accusations are preposterous and reek of paranoia.
abennett4 5 days ago
@abennett4 "MOST of these Live-Time witnesses -- were SILENCED-- using every and any measure within the immediate years after this vile assassination?"
"So by your own calulations (Most of 30 witnesses), 16 of them were SILENCED (i.e. murdered"
clearly you didnt understand a single word (above) that ironhide posted .
fobrien1 4 days ago
@ironhide771 Smoke from the grassy knoll? What were they shooting with - civil war muskets? lol Who was the assassin - Jebb Clampett?
abennett4 5 days ago
@abennett4 heard it ,your the one trying to blow smoke and not from the knoll your trying to blow it up peoples a-s . you dishonestly use the smoke to make people look crazy but if youve done even a little bit of research (and judging by your history of debating little is the correct word ) you would know multiple witnesses said they saw smoke . i asked before but you never answered could it have been a car exhaust ?.
fobrien1 4 days ago
@fobrien1 It certainly wasn't a weapon.
abennett4 3 days ago
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@abennett4 "It certainly wasn't a weapon."
and that negates the possibilty of a shooter being up there how exactly ? ,who was the man on the knoll impersonating a secret service agent ?.
fobrien1 3 days ago
@ironhide771 No No it's perfectly normal for assassination witnesses to get shot 6 times in the head. get garroted and found in an oil drum, commit suicide in phenomenal numbers and drive cars straight into the hardest obstacles they can find on a straight roads with no blowouts. Even though these people suffered a higher casualty rate in death by violence per capita than many units that fought on D.Day it will never be taken into consideration by some that anything other than Oswald was amiss.
2001perseus 4 days ago
@2001perseus So your theory is that there were actual "hit squads" going around bumping off witnesses? Preposterous! You would need a second "hit squad" to bump off the first. I mean the first "hit squad" would have "known too much", right? And who is going to bump off the second "hit squad"? It is just a silly accusation for which you have absolutly zero evidence to back it up. What are you - twelve?
abennett4 3 days ago
@abennett4 It seems I have the honour of addresssing an ego unattached to a brain. I love the way you quote directly from Salerno in Myer's snow job and have the stupidity to go on about where others get their ideas. If the hit man always had to be hit by another forward back into infinity then there would be no hit men and no hits anywhere, ever, period. It would take the mind of a 12 year old to accept such a ludicrous propositition so good luck with high school next year.
2001perseus 2 days ago
@2001perseus Yet you claim all these "hits" but are unable to cite a single example of a witness to the assassination who was "hit" (let alone "MOST" - now that's just plain silly). In fact, every one of the "witnesses" cited in paranoid conspiracy literature died quite naturally or in less than nafarious circumstances. And if there were "hit squads", why didn't any of them bump off the likes of Mark Lane, Jim Marrs or Oliver $tone? BTW, my degree is in Math (as in Logic).
abennett4 1 day ago
@abennett4 Witnesses Mr logic includes any persons with relevant testimony or involved in investigation, not just observers in Deeley Plaza. Roger Craig, shot at and grazed in the head 1967. Badly injured after being run off the road 1971. Shot in the shoulder 1974. badly injured when his car engine exploded 1975 and surprise surprise shot dead from declared self inflicted wounds 1975. Lt Commander William Pitzer who had 16mm film of the JFK autopsy. shot dead, no nitrates on the hands....
2001perseus 1 day ago
@2001perseus Craig was a cop. Cops get into gun fights. Craig's car exploded because he forgot to keep oil in it. Again, all this was investigated and nothing nafarious. There has never been any statistical study done that has shown that people connected with the Kennedy assassination have died at an unusual rate or under unusual circumstances. Conspiracy buffs make these claims all the time without any numbers or evidence to back it up. Sells a lot of books I guess. You bought it!
abennett4 22 hours ago
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@abennett4 "Craig was a cop. Cops get into gun fights"
craig ceased to be a cop in 1967 so he wouldnt have been in any cop related gun fights after that time .
fobrien1 17 hours ago
@abennett4 Verdict on Pitzer, shot himself from 3 feet away suicide. Reporters Hunter and Koethe, given permission to search Ruby's apartment. Hunter shot dead in the Dallas police pressroom by cop Wiggins the next day Wiggins and his partner get 3 years probation after changing his story about dropping his gun. Koethe, killed by a karate chop to the throat in his apartment within a month. Crime reporter Dorothy Kilgallen interviews Jack Ruby 1965......
2001perseus 1 day ago
@2001perseus You truly are parnoid. For one, Kilgallen died of a lethal combination of alcohol and drugs. The investigators found nothing suspicious about her death. In fact, her family was in the house when she died. And besides, she had nothing on Ruby. Ruby acted alone and never revealed anything about a conspiracy. Unless you want to count his contention that millions of Jews were being murdered in the cells below him. lol
abennett4 22 hours ago
@2001perseus its worth noting also that pitzer was found with the gun in his right hand yet pitzer was left handed .
kilgallen was found with a book she told friends she had finished reading weeks previous ,the curious thing is that kilgallen had poor eyesight and wore reading glasses to read but her reading glasses were not found in her bedroom where she was found dead with her book .
fobrien1 17 hours ago
@fobrien1 All true and more Fobrien. I left some detail out and the majority of witnesses out so as not to be typing all day answering the ridiculous claim that all witnesses died of natural causes. Even so, more effort than it was worth for a lying buffoon who has clearly never read anything but Bugliosi's fantasy book. It's actually demeaning lowering myself to answer such a shameless liar.
2001perseus 16 hours ago
@2001perseus "Even so, more effort than it was worth for a lying buffoon who has clearly never read anything but Bugliosi's fantasy book"
be fair he read two books ,reclaiming history and the other one was steven kings book 22/11/63 ,one of them is a work of fiction but im still having difficulty trying to figure out which one .
fobrien1 1 hour ago
@abennett4 Dorothey tells Margaret Smith she's going to break the case open. Nope oh dear another "natural death" from suicide. Margaret Smith found dead two days later. Sam Giancana shot 6 times in the mouth when due to appear before the HSCA and a fitting end for the scumbag. Johnny Rosellini, also due to appear before the HSCA. Garroted and found in an oil drum. William Sullivan one of six FBI men to die before they could testify to the HSCA shot "by accident" outside his home 1977....
2001perseus 1 day ago
@2001perseus Hey, mobsters get shot. Always have! Always will. Nothing nefarious and certainly no connection to the Kennedy assassination. Just think of all the mobsters who have flipped to the goverment side in the last 50 years. None of them have ever suggested that organized crime had anything to do with it.
abennett4 22 hours ago
@abennett4 No no Mobsters can't get shot because you'd have to shoot the one who shot him then shoot the one who shot him then shoot the one who shot him. Forgotten already sunshine? Flipped to who's side? Mobsters and Government on the same side!!! My God, you're one of those conspiracy theorists!
2001perseus 21 hours ago
@abennett4 "Kilgallen had nothing on Ruby." Wrong bubba it was Dorothy who tied Ruby to his friend JD Tippett. Do you ever get anything right?
2001perseus 20 hours ago
@abennett4 I've barely even started on the list with those and it's already more of my time than your worth. "Why would'nt they hit Mark Lane, Jim Marrs or Oliver Stone?" I don't know cupcake, maybe they thought even somebody with your misfiring logic could work out out that was a few hits too many to swallow and still be a believer. What a dumb question!
2001perseus 1 day ago
@2001perseus Oh, so too few hits are suspicious and too many hits are suspicious. There just have to be that certain amount to be in tune with your paranoid fantasies. With all this connecting of the dots you're doing you're beginning to sound like the Russel Crowe character in "A Beautiful Mind". Remember to take your Lithium.
abennett4 22 hours ago
@abennett4 ALL hits are suspicious. Too complicated for you to grasp? Craig was not a cop when he was twice shot at so what gunfight? Engines seize with no oil in, they don't explode. As for Dorothy she was actually found by Marc Sinclaire her hairdresser, that's how aware the others in that large house were of what had or had not occurred. Her death certificate signed by a coroner who insisted he had never signed. it Cause of administration of alcohol and barbituates "undetermined"
2001perseus 21 hours ago
@abennett4 Correction. Johnny Roselli. Would'nt want to get accused of of a falsehood over a typo now would we. That of course assuming you ever got off your backside and researched anything yourself. Nah, I was probably safe.
2001perseus 1 day ago
The thing I HATE about this type of 'documentary' claiming "lone assassin" shot JFK is that it strengthens the wise old and uneasy saying which says that;
"THE DEAD ARE ALWAYS GUILTY" -- or as in the case of L.H. Oswald, it's very convenient to place the blame on someone who CANNOT answer back or tell the truth -- even though as long as he (Oswald) lived he consistently claimed to be "a patsy". It's like when a plane crashes & pilot dies-- investigation will conclude 'pilot error'. Bogus.
ironhide771 5 days ago
@ironhide771 You are probably not intellegent enough to recognize that it is not unusual for a guilty person (Oswald) to claim that they are innocent ("I'm a patsy"). If there ever was a trial, Oswald would have been found guilty so fast it would have made your head spin. His claims of innocent (if he ever took the stand, which I doubt) would have been overwhelmed by the mountain of evidence against him.
abennett4 5 days ago
@abennett4 "Oswald would have been found guilty so fast it would have made your head spin. His claims of innocent (if he ever took the stand, which I doubt) would have been overwhelmed by the mountain of evidence against him"
yea right and thats why your friends posner and bugliosi must twist /distort /omit and lie in order to make oswald look guilty ,and why you posted lies and reposted those lies even after having been shown your wrong .
fobrien1 4 days ago
@fobrien1 What are you even talking about? I have never posted a single lie and you have yet to demonstrate a single falsehood on my part. You are so silly.
abennett4 3 days ago
@abennett4 "What are you even talking about? I have never posted a single lie and you have yet to demonstrate a single falsehood on my part. You are so silly."
you didnt post a qoute from bugliosi that oswald claimed he ate with jarmin ? ,a quote which i not only told you was wholly incorrect but i posted proof of it ,and you repeatedly posted the quote again knowing it was inaccurate. thats when it stops being an error and becomes lies . i could go on .
fobrien1 3 days ago
@fobrien1 proof? What proof? Again, you shade the evidence to suit your fancy. And you call it proof? Ha!
abennett4 1 day ago
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@abennett4 "proof? What proof? Again, you shade the evidence to suit your fancy. And you call it proof? Ha!"
i did indeed post proof that bugliosis was wrong in saying "oswald claimed he ate with jarmin" in fact i posted it numerous times .but just for you ill do it again . in the comments after this one .
fobrien1 17 hours ago
@abennett4 "morning 23rd.
says 11-23-63 negr came in one jr.and short negro "
the above extract is verbatim from fritz notes ,where he wrote oswald said on november 23 that whle he was in the lunchroom 2 negros came in one was called junior (this is jarmin) and he was with a short negro (this was norman ).
fobrien1 17 hours ago
@abennett4 "oswald stated that on november 22,1963,he had eaten lunch in the lunchroom in the texas school book depository ,alone, but recalled possibly two negro employees walking through the room during this period.he stated possibly one of these employees was called "junior" and the other was a short individual whos name he could not recall but whom he would be able to recognize"
the above extract is verbatim from bookhouts interrogation notes .id say thats proof positive .
fobrien1 17 hours ago
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@abennett4 "You are probably not intellegent enough to recognize that it is not unusual for a guilty person (Oswald) to claim that they are innocent"
and this is coming from a person who quotes steven kings fiction as tho its fact .
fobrien1 4 days ago
@The9Nazgul To chill, I'll settle for an iced tea. Seriously, though, I'm on your side on the banning issue. I may disagree with your opinion of the evidence in this case, but I'd like to be counted as defending your right to express it. Fortunately, David takes pains not to ban anyone here. Kudos to him for that.
smartalek65 5 days ago
CIA was behind JFK assasination !
XpresloX 5 days ago
@XpresloX MaYBE MOSSAD..
SUSSTURUCU 5 days ago
Dan Marvin, witness to the CIA assassination of an innocent American trying to bear witness to their murder of JFK, died January 19th. Dan Marvin was asked by CIA to murder Lt Commander Pitzer of Bethesda Naval Hospital because Pitzer possessed films of wounds on JFK other than those shown to the Warren Commission. watch?v=aLxocPaeTYA&feature=related
Exiles800 5 days ago in playlist Favorite videos
Israeli Mossad and CIA killed JFK
JFK Opposed Nukes for Israel.
JFK tried to introduce Interest free money AND deescalate Vietnam.
With him Dead, ALL 3 of these policies were Reversed by Zionist LBJ.
Michael Collins Piper wrote a Bestseller Now banned called FINAL JUDGMENT which indicts Israel for his assassination.
'By Way Of Deception, Thu Shall Do War' -Mossad Motto
StSimonMartyr 5 days ago
@StSimonMartyr It's a good book worth reading. David avoids answering it. This is correct, but how much the nuke issue was the initiating cause is up to debate. More likely CIA used this as another straw by which to break JFK's back.
Exiles800 5 days ago in playlist Favorite videos
The Nuke issue was THE issue that got JFK killed, along with the money.
Both of them were key Jewish issues..
Israel got Nukes right after JFK death and the world hasnt been the same since.
The interest free $2 bill was an issue but not The primary issue.
All of them should be indicted, tried, convicted and hanged.
StSimonMartyr 5 days ago
@StSimonMartyr YOu ARE RİGHT...
ISRAEL DİDN'T WANT TO JFK....BECAUSE JFK DİDN'T ALLOW TO İSRAEL FOR MAKİNG NUCLEAR WEAPONS
AND HENCE ISRAEL's PRESİDENT BEN GURİON RESİGNED
AFTER JFK ASSASSİNATİON, LYNDON B JOHNSON ALWAYS HELPED TO ISRAEL IN EVERY AREA
FOR NUCLEAR WEAPONS,ECONOMİC ASSİST etc..
LBJ COULDN'T SAY ANYTHİNG TO ISRAEL FOR USS LİBERTY CARNAGE
35 AMERİCAN SOLDİER WAS KİLLED BY ISRAEL ARMY
AND NOBODY CAN SAY ANYTHİNG
SUSSTURUCU 2 days ago
Ok, that's great. They figured out how one bullet hit Kennedy from behind but last I checked, Kennedy was also shot in the head with a bullet coming toward him. Did they decide they were just going to leave the headshot out of all this or...?
auralstream 6 days ago
@auralstream yeah it is another conspiracy because the main stream media is run by the same people that run our Gov... so of course they are going to do what they can to convince the people that the Gov is good... yeah jfks head went back and to the left...
wh1teflower 6 days ago
@wh1teflower Kennedy's went back and to the left (you're just parroting the movie 'JFK") because of the jet-effect caused by the exit of a projectile to the front of Kennedy's head. It is a well-known physical phenomena completely consistent with Newton’s laws of motion. The rest of your comments (about the government and media) reek of misinformation and paranoia..
abennett4 5 days ago
@abennett4 "Kennedy's went back and to the left (you're just parroting the movie 'JFK") because of the jet-effect caused by the exit of a projectile to the front of Kennedy's head."
and your just parroting the much criticised warren report ,.the scene in the movie jfk showing jfk going back and to the left came from the actuall zapruder film perhaps you think stone altered the zapruder film and added the back and to the left motion ?.
fobrien1 4 days ago
@abennett4 "It is a well-known physical phenomena completely consistent with Newton’s laws of motion"
as you seem familliar with newton do you care to post newtons law of motion which explains the back and to the left motion as seen in the z film ? .
fobrien1 4 days ago
@fobrien1 "back and to the left" :back and to the left" "back and to the left"., there you go again - parroting Oliver Stone. Silly stuff!
abennett4 3 days ago
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@abennett4 ""back and to the left" :back and to the left" "back and to the left"., there you go again - parroting Oliver Stone. Silly stuff!"
ill ask again in your mind is the clip shown in the movie jfk not from the actual zapruder film ? ,now tell us all that the motion of jfks body seen in that clip wasnt back and to the left .
fobrien1 3 days ago
@auralstream look up bohemian grove top media, business, political people go there...
wh1teflower 6 days ago
@auralstream This is just 10 minutes out of the 90 minute documentary. The rest addresses the head shot. As with the other shot, the head sho also clearly came from behind.
abennett4 5 days ago
@auralstream this is just 10 minutes out of the 90 minute documentary. In the rest it clearly shows that the head shot came from the exact same location (i.e. behind from the Book Depository) as the other one.
abennett4 5 days ago
@abennett4 I've seen the whole 90 minute documentary. It does'nt clearly show you anything of the sort. Myers tells you the right temple wound is an exit wound and backs it up with zip, even with $11,000,000 dollars worth of program to do it. If you've got video with Myers doing more than that post it and prove it.
2001perseus 4 days ago
@2001perseus i dont know if your aware but abennett posts quotes from steven kings ficticious book as tho they are based on fact ,so i wouldnt expect much in the way of facts or accuracy .but expect plenty of king followed by posner and bugliosi ,that said when it comes to writing books all 3 have one thing in common and thats fiction .
fobrien1 4 days ago
@fobrien1 Well they all certainly belong in the horror section.
2001perseus 3 days ago
@2001perseus In addition to the jet-effect causing Kennedy's "back and to the left" head movement, at frame 313 of the zapruder film (head shot), all the blood and tissue splatter is forwards clearly indicating a shot from the rear. And besides, ballistic tests to the recovered bullet fragments proved beyond all doubt that the bullet to the head was fired from Oswald's rifle to the exclusion of all other weapons. And we all know where Oswald's rifle was found.
abennett4 3 days ago
@abennett4 The only jet effect present is the hot air from your mouth. Here's a non Oliver Stone phrase for you. Back and on the trunk. Back and on the trunk. That's the direction part of JFK's skull and brains went in when it was blown out the back of his head by a bullet coming from the front. Now since you told that whopper about Myers and the headshot and cant post or point to a post with that in it. I take it all you've got is parroting books like Bugliosi's clunker.
2001perseus 2 days ago
how did lee harvey oswald miss the first shot? the other two shots were perfect...
Sackrider5000 1 week ago
@Sackrider5000 Although the range increased as the limousine moved further down Elm St, the shots actually became easier. The reason is the relative motion & geometry. The first shot would have required Oswald to take a very steep, down angle shot w/ relatively high relative motion - IN ADDITION, that shot would have to be rushed (or obstructed) by the branches of an oak tree. Elm St is downhill & moves directly away from the window, making it EASIER to track the target. Each shot became easier.
davidemerling 1 week ago
@davidemerling ok thanks, that was actually quite a simple reason
Sackrider5000 1 week ago
@davidemerling OSWALD DiD İT....I CAN SEE THİS FACT FROM HİS EYES...
PLEASE WATCH OF HİS OLD VİDEOS...I CAN SEE THE PASSİON AND ANGER..
HE ALWAYS WANTED TO BE FAMOUS PERSON...AND HE SUCCEED..
MAYBE SOME PEOPLE HELPED HİM...LİKE JACK RUBY or DAVİD FERRİE
BECAUSE JACK RUBY and DAVİD FERRİE ARE CRAZY LİKE OSWALD
SUSSTURUCU 6 days ago
@SUSSTURUCU Although I agree with you that "OSWALD DID IT" - I disagree with your logic. You don't need to make some kind of cosmic determination based on what you see in his eyes. All you really need to do is piece together the evidence and testimony. THAT'S what tells you did it.
davidemerling 5 days ago
@davidemerling THiS İS GUİLTY psychoanalysis...Oswald did it because i reasearched him life..I read him biography..
He always want to famous and important person...He never want to normal person..
He had a lot of passion and anger...
Before assassination he had worked sniper rifle with moving targets.
SUSSTURUCU 5 days ago
@SUSSTURUCU There is no doubt than one can build a compelling psychological profile of Oswald that actually makes him EXACTLY the type of person we would expect to be a presidential assassin. And, further, that his actions wreaked of one who had committed a horrible deed. Yet - this is all secondary to the HARD evidence that he was guilty of the crime. Fingerprints! Fibers! Ballistics! Medical analysis! and finally, the condemning testimony that puts him at that window.
davidemerling 2 days ago
@Sackrider5000 Contrary to the other reply you were given, the first shot already had a round in chamber therefore there was no rush and even using a scope it did'nt even hit the Lincoln. The next two shots both had to be retracked after ejecting a spent shell and relocking the bolt therefore were rushed and HARDER even with a shallower angle. Good question, you choose which is a good answer.
2001perseus 1 week ago
@2001perseus yeah and if the first shot was a hard one, why did he shoot? why wouldn't one wait a couple of seconds and keep the upper hand situation... and it's hard to believe that the gun went off by accident in the first shot. mysteries and questions after another and another...
Sackrider5000 6 days ago
@Sackrider5000 maybe he was nervous. understandable for someone about to shoot at the president don't you think?
abennett4 5 days ago
I have tried to highlight the contrast between Bonnie Ray Williams November account to the FBI and his WC testimony. There is just as sharp a contrast between the November account to the FBI of Charles Givens and his account to the WC, which for some reason I will not presume a guess at was not conducted at the WC but in private with a single counsel in Dallas. I invite ALL who are aware of both accounts to discuss them if they are interested in doing so.
2001perseus 1 week ago
@fobrien1 Yes, that was an Airtel from SACDallas (Gordon Shanklin) to director Hoover (ol' J Edgar himself). What's more damning is the Airtel to Hoover concerning SS agent Johnsen and SS director Rowley. It says specifically that both failed "to identify bullet C one by inspection." In FBI-speak, that means that the witness said that the item didn't look like the same one they saw or handled. If it had been "it looks like it, but I'm not 100% certain, it would've read "failed to positively id."
smartalek65 1 week ago
the thing is... there's no proof that it's not a government conspiracy.
i defiantly wouldn't rule that theory out. it seems plausible that the cia would want to do away with kennedy. he worked for the people. he threatened the establishment.
it's only my opinion of course. there's not any solid evidence either way. and if there was proof, do you honestly think the government would let us know? probably not. i just feel like no one knows enough about it to say for sure either way.
OddlyRandomPro 1 week ago
@OddlyRandomPro Did you just say, "There's NO proof that it's NOT a government conspiracy?" It's hard enough to prove a negative; harder STILL to prove a DOUBLE negative. What a ridiculous statement.
Hell, for THAT matter I could say, "There's NO proof that aliens are NOT responsible for Kennedy's murder."
And your username is "OddlyRandomPro"? Well selected!
davidemerling 1 week ago
CONT'D certain that this bullet did what's alleged of it? Nope. Sorry, David, that epically fails the smell test. Look, you can profess your BELIEF in CE 399 as it's purported to be; just don't tell other people what should or should not be regarded as the truth and imply they're nuts if they don't.
smartalek65 1 week ago
@davidemerling You're still not getting the difficulty here: the 1st four men didnt simply fail to positively id CE 399 as the stretcher bullet, but did not id it AT ALL. In the case of the Secret Service men, the FBI memo specifically says "by inspection." There's no trace of human body fluids or tissue on it (odd, given its assigned career). It strikes and shatters several of Gov. Connally's bones, yet shows no more deformity than a test round fired into cotton wadding. Yet you're sooo CONT'D
smartalek65 1 week ago
@smartalek65 a document says an agent agent odum brought a bullet (ce399) to parklands and the agent in question says he never even saw or handled any bullet.pretty bad news for the LN.
fobrien1 1 week ago
@fobrien1 - Somebody REALLY does not like your posts and they continually mark them as spam. I spend a lot of time UNspamming your posts. I may not agree with what you have to say - but it's certainly topical and deserves to be read. I sure wish the mad-spam-tagger would stop this. If it continues - I will shutdown (again) the site for about a week - kind of like Wikipedia's protest to SOPA. :)
I'd rather not do that so I respectfully ask the individual responsible to please stop doing it.
davidemerling 1 week ago
@davidemerling i guess my presence on this thread is not appreciated by a particular LN ,its childish behaviour and speaks vollumes about that person .
fobrien1 1 week ago
@fobrien1 Whoosh!
On the Conspirology sites "LNers" get BANNED within a day by Conspirologist uploaders.
In contrast, here we have Conspirologists, some of whom who spend lots of time here, and take it for granted that they are on a "LNer" (a Conspirologist pejorative & misnomer) site, get marked as spam by others, and the uploader, a "LNer," actually protests, even to the point of shutting comments down completely.
A very telling difference in the two "camps." Just my observation.
The9Nazgul 1 week ago
@The9Nazgul naz with respect to david he chose to upload these videos and then post comments and invite people to reply to these comments , no one made him do anything he didnt want to do . by the same token if david decides he doesnt want a particular person posting or no one posting on his thread its his perogative to block these comments . the point your missing here naz is that a CT would have no reason to flag my comments as spam -----------------
fobrien1 1 week ago
@fobrien1 No, YOU'RE missing the point, one that I've tried to make in the past, and will continue to harp about.
If @davidemerling acted like your brethren Conspirologist uploaders, then he would've BANNED you and others eons ago. Instead, he's more willing to shut down comments completely than to see someone ELSE on his "side" censoring.
Once again, the difference between the two camps is VERY telling. And your refusal to acknowledge that is ALSO very telling.
The9Nazgul 1 week ago
@The9Nazgul naz you continualy say dont put all LN together yet you do that which you ask others not to do. you say "MY BRETHREN". but as far as im aware this is the only thread ive ever debated you on .so your aligning me with people you met many months or years ago is bunkum . naz you choose to debate by speculating and using terms which insult people ,and the you whine when people return the compliment .
fobrien1 1 week ago
@fobrien1 "Whine" LOL R U kidding me? Nothing I post comes close to whining. Nor do I take things personally. Ahem...
Every comment I make has a point relevant to the debate. In this case, I am pointing out a NOTABLE difference between the MO of the two camps. In the one, you have blatant, unmitigated censorship. In the other, you have precisely the opposite. Not only that, but those from the first camp don't even appreciate this about the 2nd camp.
My observation, not my "whining."
The9Nazgul 1 week ago
@The9Nazgul Gentalman, Gentalman..lol. CT and LN can both be pretty reactionary at times. Goodness knows I have had my buttons press a few times. and pulled a few comments out of embarrassment. Most people write as they speak, therefore it's understandable for a reader to read something and interpret it out of context. I am guilty of that as well, and of course some of us are simply being as ass,once in a while lol..and we call one another on it. In the end this is better than a lot of places.
NOC1TIME 1 week ago
@NOC1TIME i agree with that . ive been called terrible names on youtube /been insulted and attacked by LN and for no reason at all other than i have an opposing view . and apart from the odd bit of sarcasm i dont react but we can all have a bad day and react when we never normally would , but i get annoyed when the LN post comments about how they were treated on a thread by CT when they are guilty of all the same things probably even more so than the CT -----------------
fobrien1 1 week ago
@NOC1TIME in my experience a lot of the time LN are the ones flinging the insults and name calling and beng abusive and the CT react to this , and some times the CT act in the same maner . and the thing is that people who feel the need to act like this or idiots and perhaps they deserve banning be they CT or LN ,but LN have to accept they are as guilty if not more of that which they accuse the CT of . ive seen thread after thread on forums ruined ------------------
fobrien1 1 week ago
@NOC1TIME NOC, good to see the CT diplomat enter the fray! Wish you got here earlier, though, as I really needed to chill out.
The9Nazgul 1 week ago
@The9Nazgul naz when i said you whine i mean in terms of repeating that you were banned by someone on another thread and that that in some way reflects on me or the other people on this thread who have a different view to yours .i dont know why you got banned ,but if someone banned you for no reason it is wrong and i dont agree with it and i say i dont think anyone should be banned by either side for no reason or simply because they have an opposing view .-----------------------
fobrien1 1 week ago
@fobrien1 Point taken on that. I suppose I have been griping about that -- I guess I'm still sour about it (that I was banned), and have had an axe to grind about it.
The9Nazgul 1 week ago
@The9Nazgul personally i would have to say having debated with you that you dont say or act in a way that would warrant being banned from any thread . but then i wasnt posting on the thread which you were banned from so i have no idea what occurred there , but again i cant imagine you would do anything that would result in being banned and if thats the case then the person who banned you is wrong and is just being petty.----------------
fobrien1 1 week ago
@fobrien1 Thanks. BTW, I realize that YOU wouldn't have done that yourself, and I certainly didn't mean to lump you personally in that category.
The9Nazgul 1 week ago