9mm +P Federal HST 124 gr

[Pr0jeCtPa7]

hey TN, plan on re testing this ammo with your new sim-test setup?? I cant decide on this or the 147gr or the 147+p

[RainmanE350]

Anyone able to point me to tests or data when a short 3 inch barrel is used? Also 2 inch .380 rounds

THANKS

[hispanic88]

Where are you guys gettingthese from? I went to two of my local ammo stores and I cant find any.

[JUKEBOXX1990]

@hispanic88 got mine at gun show

[Trashbilly]

Damn BlueJays!! Thanks for a great vid..

[faffaflunkie]

Your a good shot. Most of these "bullet test" videos are inconclusive because the shooter can't hit anywhere near the center of the target.

[GrenMoyo]

@nebula25x every flb counts :D

[GrenMoyo]

@nebula25x no....a 230 grain will not transfer as much energy as the 147g HST round because it is a hollow point and traveling substantially faster than a 230g hard ball round...a 45 fmj will not transfer a lot of energy because it zips right through a person, this dumps practically all its energy into the target as it expands...thus the concept of a hollow point. :)

[Murdock029]

i think federal ammo oerforms way better than winchester...amazing round

[seven47katana]

I got box off 50 for 24$ dollars Today : )

[anspol69]

what do you think is best 9mm jhp for taurus pt 809?

[jwelsh1238]

hey there, thanks for the time u put into these tests. what round do u like better gold dots or hst's and also 124+p or 147. thanks. Joe (north alabama)

[joeratti]

@jwelsh1238 go with the 124

[NzouHntr]

Except for the round that got all the denim stuck in the hollow point and converted it to a solid, it appears that ALL of these cartridges perform essentially the same. I suspect that my cheapie HP's aren't going to perform much different, especially for the cost.

[trocha419]

hey...maybe you have said it somewhere...whats stoping you from getting balistic gel for these test? just wondering....btw great informal video!

[tnoutdoors9]

@trocha419

Expense, regardless if I buy it or make it myself. Figure $70 or so for the block I need, and I would not recycle, just to be consistent. Also, I have very limited storage for gel, and with my travel schedule, there is a narrow timeline for using the gel within guidelines. As of Oct. 2010, I would like to try something other than newspaper, but not certain yet what that will be.

[frodo70444]

@tnoutdoors9 really thick jello??

[tnoutdoors9]

@frodo70444

My guess.....would not be dense enough. Then, someone would question why I didn't go ahead and use real ballistic gel......the point would circle back around.

[frodo70444]

@tnoutdoors9 understandable

[mpd19666]

@tubevideoguy762

if you look at the momenum graphs they tell a different story:

For JUST energy calc: a lighter, faster load will have more KE(1/2*m*v^2) but have you ever wondered why they a heavier bullet seems to penetrate farther within a caliber? I think its because it loses a lot of that energy on impact.

I did the calculations on the Federal HST rounds...

Form an energy stand point (high to low): 124+p, 124, 147+p, 147

BUTTTTTTTTTTTT

From a momentum stand point: 147+p, 124+p, 147, 124

[tubevideoguy762]

@mpd19666

yeah the 124 grains are my preferred since im kind of a medium for caliber guy like 124+p for 9mm 165 for 40 and 200+ for 45

[jorgelr85]

Ammunition to go, has 147gr HST +p in stock now.....wonder if thats a good round.

[1234lukerr]

why newspaper?

[dereckthomas121695]

thats asum



[TheGriz18]

What was the chrono on this? I've watched it a few times. Maybe I missed it? I know Fed says 1200 fps.

[tnoutdoors9]

@TheGriz18

This was one of the first tests I ever posted, early video as well. I probably did not chrono....started doing that later in 2009. I plan to retest this sooner than later using denim.

[MamoDad]

Dude, where's the denim?

That's the real test for expansion.

[tnoutdoors9]

@MamoDad

Denim test is on the project list. When I first started doing this, I ran a handful of tests early-on before I incorporated denim.

[RRViper800TT]

these petals are much sharper than the gold dot...would you say that this round is more effective due to that?

[tnoutdoors9]

@RRViper800TT

Hard to say without testing both in ballistic gel, which would give a more accurate representation of the cutting motion. The HST petals are definitely sharper, so when you consider what it does to soft tissue, I would guess the "damage path" could be more destructive. But you never know....this HST isn't bonded like the Gold Dot, so you have to give and take with your choices.

[joesphx19]

@tnoutdoors9

A while back the controversy over the Black Talons included "testimony" by ER MDs that the Talon opened up into sharp petals, thus causing greater damage to a wounded individual and increased difficulty in the bullet removal.

[eamonher]

so not enough penetration?

[ben2point0]

fucking rednecks...

[tnoutdoors9]

@ben2point0

Problem with that? I've been to 46 states and encountered rednecks in all of them. Perhaps you are in one of the 4 that I haven't visited?

[ben2point0]

@tnoutdoors9

nope no problem, rednecks are everywhere :-) some of um' are kinda fun ta shoot with too! tehe.

[mpd19666]

@tnoutdoors9

Based on your experience will a slow/heavy load recoil more than a light/fast one(147 vs 124 vs 115)

Also, which HST round performs the best overall,factoring in penetration, expansion and recoil? Thanks!

I've been researching the HST round and I found that, going purely on an energy calculation, that the most energetic rounds going from greatest to least are:

124+p , 124, 147+p, 147

BUT in my momentum calc. the winners are: 147+p, 124+p, 147, 124. <--IS THIS WHAT YOU SEE?????

[Ronald3570]

what would you suggest to be the best ammo to use for home defense in a beretta 92fs? i have 115 gr speer gold dots in it right now and they function 100% in it, but with all the great new ammo choices out now i kinda wanna upgrade to a better, heavier round.

[partya11night20]

Nice serious review, thank you!

[gshdrums]

Hey TN, any chance of doing a test on the XTP`s....in 9mm....or if not 40.....Dont know how hard they are to get over there but ive used them before so would like to see them expand!

[AnarchAngel1]

@gshdrums they are pretty moderate expanders, usually 1.5 the starting diameter or a little less, and they do not expand well through denim, but they do penetrate a few more inches than most other loading in equal bullet weights. I would use them in the summer or for hunting in some calibers as they are are very accurate.

[dennisthemenace0WNS]

Jug #1 looked painful.

[excelerater]

........deadly ammo gj

[CaptainXanax]

In your opinion, if you were shooting out of a 3.25" barrel, would you choose the 124 gr +p or the 147 gr? Thanks for any info, and your vids, I think I've watched them all. lol

[tnoutdoors9]

@CaptainXanax

I would lean toward the 124 +P, but the premium 147's should be fine in that barrel length. The 147 might be a softer shooter in a smaller gun as well....all kinds of factors to consider.

[NoiseMostBeautiful]

After watching the warning you gave on the jhp winchester white box 147 grain. I'm looking for a suitable replacement for my wife's protection load for her M&P9! This had much less penetration considering it's a +p configuration. I use a low grain weight (110) hornaday critical defense load in my .38 snubby and I love it. Standard preasure .38 tends to be about ideal stopping power without over penetration. What of the good 9mm loads would you recomend for a service length 9mm, home defense

[tnoutdoors9]

@ NoiseMostBeautiful

First, I think that shot was a fluke. It will be tested again. Second, I have the WWB 147 gr for backup if all the good stuff is ever gone and impossible to locate.

For 9mm home defense, of what I've tested so far, the Speer Gold Dot 124 +P. Any premium 124 +P would probably suffice. 115 +P+ Federal BPLE could be considered, but that is the only 115 gr I can suggest based on what I've tested on or off YouTube.

[lexmark136]

that mushroomed hunk of metal is a beautiful thing!

[tnoutdoors9]

@ lexmark136

I like the 124 gr HST, but the 147 gr HST is a freaking work of art. I could make some bling with that slug.

[pjicleanair420]

GOLD DOTS

[KLmatt3006]

Well done video...very informative and very precise in your explaining. Youtube needs more videos like this.I carry these very rounds in my EDC but mine are +P+

[CHEVDUCK]

You need to use some of those HST's on those stupid magpies squawking in the background.

[perspicacity89]

LOL!

[tnoutdoors9]

They are evident in pretty much every video that I filmed in the backyard in 2009. I'll start clearing the yard with the Mossberg.

[dylthethrill]

Awesome video thanks!

[rtv798506]

I agree with Blk05titan26, you make some real nice videos. Nice setup with the milk jugs and wet newspaper. They are very informative videos and they get the point across with some real good and interesting stuff to look at.....keep'em coming!!!

[Blk05titan26]

you make good vids great info you put alot into it.........im gonna subscribe now

[803honda]

how could somethin so good have such a bad name?

[BordeauxBulldog]

ive been dissapointed by the accuracy of hsts, their tactical bonded bullet on the other hand is super accurate, i would like to see these tested in a similar way

[Outdoorsmen44]

I plan on buying a 9mm Beretta M9. Im looking for very good ammunition that I will keep in the pistol.

[unbeatableshooter]

u might wanna try speer gold dot i like it it up to u though just an idea has great penatration and exspansion

[fruchttragend]

Great video man..

Kepp up the testing and the good work.

And thanks for sharing your videos, really good queality..

[Deezilla1]

Is the HST 147gr bullet in your other vid more powerful than this HST 124gr +p bullet???????????

[tnoutdoors9]

I don't know that you can or should mention "power" and handguns in the same sentence, because even the "powerful" rounds such as a .44 magnum, etc. cannot replace high-power rifle rounds. The 147 gr will probably penetrate deeper than the 124, but it carries less energy. You essentially gain something on one principle of physics, but give up another. The best handgun round for self defense is an optimal medium of both, for most people.

[EchoSixGolf]

Great review! Always liked the HST's. I'd like to see how Double Tap's and Buffalo Bore 9mm +P and +P+ 124gr rounds would compare with the HST. Their advertised muzzel velocity is 1295 and 1296 fps out of a G19.

[MuscIeBound]

Yes, I too would like to see how 124gr and 147gr double tap ammo compares to this with this type of test.

[tnoutdoors9]

I used to shoot alot of DoubleTap ammo, and may have a few rounds of the 124 and 147 Gold Dot around....will check. I can confirm that it chronographs faster than the Speer loads. Would be interesting to see how that translates to penetration and expansion.

[pmalveda02]

greatt vid man.. very informative! thanks for sharing.. stay safe!