Knowing somebody well isn't the same as knowing what that person will do. The person may surprise you and actually wait.
I can make you entire arguement invalid with 1 single question. Can you make a different choice than an omniscient god knows your going to make? Answer that if you dare.
Thats stupid. I know the weather forecast tomorrow therefore I control the weather? I don't think so. I know how many days are in a month therefore I control the days?
Another 5 stars for a great short, concise and professional video. One day I hope to master all the trappings of the atheists as you have. Thank you and God bless you in the name of our Lord Jesus.
You ignore that god is supposed to be all powerful too. If he is all-powerful, then he created you knowing you would make such a choice and did nothing about it. Again, humans are not responsible for their actions if god is omnipotent (or really, if he exists).
Your logic does not consider god's supposed omnipotence, and is therefore insufficient.
Why would he need to do something about it? I am assuming you're talking of the sin in the garden of eden since what you're saying has really nothing to do with any of the points I addressed in the video. But I'll answer it anyway. CON-
Amen! God gave us all free will and will not compromise it. He chose us before the beginning of the world, knowing our choice beforehand. But God does not force people to chose, they chose on their own account. We could have not chosen, and God would not have chosen us.
In regards to your reply on Franks video, you are wrong as usual. You used a fallacy of equivocation. As you equivocated between (seeing the choice), and Omniscience. Omniscience means Infinite knowledge. To have infinite knowledge, prior to (X), means (X) cannot choose any different from what that Omniscient being already knows.
Again Dhorpatan, you base this all on assumptions. Just because someone knows someone will do something does not mean the other person had no choice in the matter.
so you believe in a 'god' who's 'plan' is subject to change at the whim of mortals , since with our 'free will' we make choices which may not be choices that your 'god' would wish us to make?
(you could say this was also based on assumption as I am still unsure of what you believe , but I feel that my assumption is correct)
Saggard! I remember you, long time no talk. We constantly make choices God would not want us to make for example: choosing to reject God and go to hell, God would not want us to go to hell this is clearly seen throughout the Bible such as: 2 Peter 3:9 "The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. He is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance." But He must respect our decision because He is just. Thanks for the comment.
I do believe God has a plan, and He could use what someone meant for evil to be good, but I do believe we will still have a free choice in the matter. Let me give you an example; let's say you are thirsty and want to get a drink and this is a sin(its not a sin, but just for an example) You still have free will to choose to go get that drink, a unknown force doesn't force you to go get a drink. I hope that answers your question. Keep up the good work in school & take care.
even with that example (forgive me if you think I'm 'trolling' you) your 'god's plan still relies on certain people doing certain things which since he created them (if he created everything then he is responsible for the end circumstance or situation which occurs) he caused to happen , as in he would know the end result of any alteration to the method he used to create the world we have , a slight change could have meant Adolf Hitler wasn't born , a ridiculous example I know but the point
Hmm I am a bit confused at what you mean't here, feel free to pm me if you need a bigger character amount to explain you're position. You know though, Having prior Knowledge and divine intervention is a bit different.
But if he is omnipotent and benevolent (as described by common Christians), then his decision to make us in a way that would allow us to sin is directly condemning us. He created us knowing we would sin and created us that way anyway. It is still a fallacy of equivocation because you neglected these features of god and then attempted to say seeing a choice is the same as omniscience.
He gave us a choice of FREE WILL. It's funny how atheists will always cry for freedom of speech, freedom of religion(I agree) etc yet mock God for giving us free will. He created us knowing we would sin yes and He knew He would end up dying for us, He didn't want us to be robots and He even offers us a way out of condemnation. Just a simple act of you're free will by turning to Him, and accepting the free gift of forgiveness through His son. But you still wont accept it will you?
You still will use you're FREE WILL to reject the FREE gift of forgiveness. Will you still mock the gift of free will God gives you even though you enjoy using it so much?
The same applys, just because God can see the choice you will make does not mean you couldn't still freely choose the other option. To say God knows I will choose answer A so that denies me the right to choose answer B is a fallacy based on nothing.
@DhorpatanMORON, "So indeed, if God is real, we have no free will. " Yes, we have stupid, but it's already known what your free will is. How can you be so moronic ?! Tell me, does the universe exist or is it eternal ? If it exists it means it came into existence by your own definition, but you also claim the universe to be eternal , watch the featured clip on my channel guys, thanks to me Veritas48 favorited it !!!
Dhorpatan, I knew I would find you here, your trolling behavior is very obvious
have you considered theories which suggest the universe has always been in existence and will always be ? (perpetual) given that time is just a concept we have created and does not as such actually exist , nor is there any particularly strong evidence to suggest that the universe had a definite beginning and will have a definite end (while I'm sure you could argue both ways with the evidence we have now perhaps "definitive evidence" would have been better than "strong")
If time doesn't exist then we must assume many other parts of science and our own existence is questionable. This is entering into denialism. If your ready to assume that we do in fact exist, and that what we observe in nature is true, then we can further our own condition. Otherwise, continue questioning dimensions.
apologies , my point was badly worded(written at 5am ...lol) what I was trying to say was time is supposedly linear (to the best of our knowledge , flows forward from a position previously behind it) why does it have to have a beginning or an end?
Ahh. Well that remains a question to be answered. I doubt science will ever be able to explain whether time began or not. There is just no way of knowing. Perhaps only faith can lead us to into the dark unkown? :)
The first verse in the Bible is "In the beginning" Science is just starting to catch up with that phrase now. I don't know of any cosmologist or highly respected scientist who would argue that the universe is eternal. We know it had a beginning. The question then arises, what was the first cause? or what is outside of our universe? that's the part that cannot be answerd by science. I thank you all for you're comments. Many blessings to you.
Knowing somebody well isn't the same as knowing what that person will do. The person may surprise you and actually wait.
I can make you entire arguement invalid with 1 single question. Can you make a different choice than an omniscient god knows your going to make? Answer that if you dare.
lautz73 9 months ago
LOGICAL FAIL
you believe what your friend would do...
God KNOWS what your friend will do...
tireironman 1 year ago
Thats stupid. I know the weather forecast tomorrow therefore I control the weather? I don't think so. I know how many days are in a month therefore I control the days?
thats the logical FAIL my friend.
pur3o3end 1 year ago
Another 5 stars for a great short, concise and professional video. One day I hope to master all the trappings of the atheists as you have. Thank you and God bless you in the name of our Lord Jesus.
ReligousTruth 2 years ago
You ignore that god is supposed to be all powerful too. If he is all-powerful, then he created you knowing you would make such a choice and did nothing about it. Again, humans are not responsible for their actions if god is omnipotent (or really, if he exists).
Your logic does not consider god's supposed omnipotence, and is therefore insufficient.
snoman99991 2 years ago
Why would he need to do something about it? I am assuming you're talking of the sin in the garden of eden since what you're saying has really nothing to do with any of the points I addressed in the video. But I'll answer it anyway. CON-
pur3o3end 2 years ago
Good Video
VyckRo 2 years ago
Amen! God gave us all free will and will not compromise it. He chose us before the beginning of the world, knowing our choice beforehand. But God does not force people to chose, they chose on their own account. We could have not chosen, and God would not have chosen us.
NephilimFree 2 years ago
Good one brother !!! Indeed, they are compatible, but those who don't want to realize that are blind before they even tried to understand that.
5 stars and faved as always, God bless you brother
CreationistsWON 2 years ago
good response, it was kinda a bad argument on his part
iToyRobot 2 years ago
In regards to your reply on Franks video, you are wrong as usual. You used a fallacy of equivocation. As you equivocated between (seeing the choice), and Omniscience. Omniscience means Infinite knowledge. To have infinite knowledge, prior to (X), means (X) cannot choose any different from what that Omniscient being already knows.
So indeed, if God is real, we have no free will.
Dhorpatan 2 years ago
Again Dhorpatan, you base this all on assumptions. Just because someone knows someone will do something does not mean the other person had no choice in the matter.
pur3o3end 2 years ago
so you believe in a 'god' who's 'plan' is subject to change at the whim of mortals , since with our 'free will' we make choices which may not be choices that your 'god' would wish us to make?
(you could say this was also based on assumption as I am still unsure of what you believe , but I feel that my assumption is correct)
saggard 2 years ago
Saggard! I remember you, long time no talk. We constantly make choices God would not want us to make for example: choosing to reject God and go to hell, God would not want us to go to hell this is clearly seen throughout the Bible such as: 2 Peter 3:9 "The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. He is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance." But He must respect our decision because He is just. Thanks for the comment.
pur3o3end 2 years ago
so you don't believe that your 'god' has a plan ?
as such
and it has indeed been too long xD I've been bust with school not on youtube a lot , how has life been treating you?
saggard 2 years ago
I do believe God has a plan, and He could use what someone meant for evil to be good, but I do believe we will still have a free choice in the matter. Let me give you an example; let's say you are thirsty and want to get a drink and this is a sin(its not a sin, but just for an example) You still have free will to choose to go get that drink, a unknown force doesn't force you to go get a drink. I hope that answers your question. Keep up the good work in school & take care.
pur3o3end 2 years ago
even with that example (forgive me if you think I'm 'trolling' you) your 'god's plan still relies on certain people doing certain things which since he created them (if he created everything then he is responsible for the end circumstance or situation which occurs) he caused to happen , as in he would know the end result of any alteration to the method he used to create the world we have , a slight change could have meant Adolf Hitler wasn't born , a ridiculous example I know but the point
saggard 2 years ago
should still stand.
saggard 2 years ago
Hmm I am a bit confused at what you mean't here, feel free to pm me if you need a bigger character amount to explain you're position. You know though, Having prior Knowledge and divine intervention is a bit different.
pur3o3end 2 years ago
@pur3o3end
But if he is omnipotent and benevolent (as described by common Christians), then his decision to make us in a way that would allow us to sin is directly condemning us. He created us knowing we would sin and created us that way anyway. It is still a fallacy of equivocation because you neglected these features of god and then attempted to say seeing a choice is the same as omniscience.
snoman99991 2 years ago
He gave us a choice of FREE WILL. It's funny how atheists will always cry for freedom of speech, freedom of religion(I agree) etc yet mock God for giving us free will. He created us knowing we would sin yes and He knew He would end up dying for us, He didn't want us to be robots and He even offers us a way out of condemnation. Just a simple act of you're free will by turning to Him, and accepting the free gift of forgiveness through His son. But you still wont accept it will you?
pur3o3end 2 years ago
You still will use you're FREE WILL to reject the FREE gift of forgiveness. Will you still mock the gift of free will God gives you even though you enjoy using it so much?
pur3o3end 2 years ago
The same applys, just because God can see the choice you will make does not mean you couldn't still freely choose the other option. To say God knows I will choose answer A so that denies me the right to choose answer B is a fallacy based on nothing.
pur3o3end 2 years ago
@DhorpatanMORON, "So indeed, if God is real, we have no free will. " Yes, we have stupid, but it's already known what your free will is. How can you be so moronic ?! Tell me, does the universe exist or is it eternal ? If it exists it means it came into existence by your own definition, but you also claim the universe to be eternal , watch the featured clip on my channel guys, thanks to me Veritas48 favorited it !!!
Dhorpatan, I knew I would find you here, your trolling behavior is very obvious
michaeljacksongone 2 years ago
have you considered theories which suggest the universe has always been in existence and will always be ? (perpetual) given that time is just a concept we have created and does not as such actually exist , nor is there any particularly strong evidence to suggest that the universe had a definite beginning and will have a definite end (while I'm sure you could argue both ways with the evidence we have now perhaps "definitive evidence" would have been better than "strong")
saggard 2 years ago
saggard,
If time doesn't exist then we must assume many other parts of science and our own existence is questionable. This is entering into denialism. If your ready to assume that we do in fact exist, and that what we observe in nature is true, then we can further our own condition. Otherwise, continue questioning dimensions.
g00america 2 years ago
apologies , my point was badly worded(written at 5am ...lol) what I was trying to say was time is supposedly linear (to the best of our knowledge , flows forward from a position previously behind it) why does it have to have a beginning or an end?
saggard 2 years ago
Ahh. Well that remains a question to be answered. I doubt science will ever be able to explain whether time began or not. There is just no way of knowing. Perhaps only faith can lead us to into the dark unkown? :)
g00america 2 years ago
The first verse in the Bible is "In the beginning" Science is just starting to catch up with that phrase now. I don't know of any cosmologist or highly respected scientist who would argue that the universe is eternal. We know it had a beginning. The question then arises, what was the first cause? or what is outside of our universe? that's the part that cannot be answerd by science. I thank you all for you're comments. Many blessings to you.
pur3o3end 2 years ago