After those 10 clean clear shots to the legs and torso, i would have stopped that fight too. That fighter did right in hitting harder and harder. but his second fight he lost control and wailed on that guys head without giving him a chance to sit up. Very dishonorable and I would have pulled him to talk to him about it.
@thoamsfox0 perhaps in your local area one is required to allow a legged fighter a "chance to sit up". however, in atlantia a fighter is expected to be ready at all times. the legged fighter was in range and could be legally hit at any point until his sword tip was grounded. the blow was thrown as soon as the tip came off the ground. nothing "dishonorable" about that at all.
also can you define what you mean by "he lost control"?
@dukelogan1 Its not the fact of he has to let him sit up, it the fact that its the honorable thing to do.
Also, if you noticed, the other fighter was in pain when he took that leg shot and as soon as he turned around the Red and White guy just clocked him one without giving him a chance to defend himself. The red and white guy was obviously pissed about the first fight and it carried over to the second one.
@thoamsfox0 but that implies to not do so is "dishonorable" which is inaccurate if local custom says differently. if, in local custom, it is expected that a fighter always be prepared then there is no issue. also, you are making an assumption about the guy being "pissed off". unless, of course, youve spoken with him you really dont know what he was feeling. im not suggesting that your local customs are wrong, just reminding you that they may in fact be very different.
@dukelogan1 I noticed you posted that you are from Atlanta. I have heard that the Georgia groups go by a completely different fighting standard than most of the SCA does.
And yes, what he did was dishonorable in my book. Whenever i hit my Father in the leg and he went down in pain, I didnt wait for him to turn around before wailing on him. I stopped and asked if he was alright. That is the honorable thing to do. This man did not.
The black obviously needs retraining to defend safely.
@thoamsfox0 atlantia, not atlanta. the georgia area, aside from augusta which belongs to atlantia, probably have the lowest force expectations in the sca. thats their local custom. i think it would be safe to say "thats not how i would have done it" but its wrong to call it dishonorable if it is acceptable by local (kingdom) custom. hope that makes sense.
Honor system- if you land a good hit and you know it, although your opponent does not accept it, it is YOUR duty to Hold and explain/ talk/ learn. If they do not accept your blow, well , then you need to ramp it up. And the legged opponent was not set, the Knight exercised no largesse to his legged opponent. He was obviously angry and put his first opponent in danger, who seemed to be outmatched and could not SAFELY defend. And the legged opponent did not engage until recognized.
@drewstein3500 perhaps in your local area its acceptable to question your opponent. in most areas it is frowned up greatly (except at a practice of course). same thing with a legged opponent, in most areas the fight continues and you are expected to be prepared. as for the first guy how was he ever in "danger"? i repect your opinion but i remind you that your local culture may not be the same as someone elses.
@MrMeineNamen just because some one has the know how does not mean that some times they use it. just because this is not something you like does not mean that you can just bash it. learn to let things be and not be such a critic. agree to dissagree that we all love the middle ages
agree to disagree but as a fighter myself I would want someone to do that to me if I was not taking shots or acting with out chivalry. I got into trouble once when i was a new fighter for smacking someone to the dome without them looking and in my opinion the knight had the right to do what he did.
I think I'd rather do fencing this looks a bit too rough for me, I respect the sport but then again you have all these people saying that NFL and SCA are really brutal sports and encourage violence.
HAHAHAHAH!!!! I just love it when he walks up after legging that dude and just blast him in the face...... and then he stares at him as if to say "You can pull your skirt down now bitch..I'm thru fuckin ya" AND THE OSCAR GOES TO????? Back stabbin Lil red belt that shoulda taken some of those other shots.
@broadsword "Lastly, just because somebody doesn't go down when they clearly get hit doesn't give you the right to hit them harder and harder until it does damage." umm yes it does. A fight doesnt stop until a blow is accepted or hold is called we never asume, so if a person is getting hit solid or is getting "damage" it is thier responsibility to stop the fight or they will continue to take blows escpecially in a tournament. the exception is fighting a newer/learning fighter at a PRACTICE.
@Dimitri0809 oh so ur a wire weenie eh? haha jk. its really hard to disobey the honor system with how hard we hit. and i dont care if someone doesnt call a shot because it just means i should be hitting harder. power is verry important in sca. i would like to see u try and come out to a practice and not call shots u r just gonna get torn down like the two in the video only way worse.
Lastly, just because somebody doesn't go down when they clearly get hit doesn't give you the right to hit them harder and harder until it does damage. If people aren't going to go down when they need to, be the 'honourable' one and keep your head.
SCA combat doesn't work in my opinion, because you can't hurt people purposely, but you have to 'die' anyway when you get bopped. I'm only participating because I love the Middle Ages. Not to boost my self esteem by physically smothering people.
Hey, the real Sir Broadsword didn't even make these comments... I left my account logged in and my brother used it to make them. I actually do agree with what he said, though, based purely on the video, though he has a MUCH better idea of what's going on here than I do, given that he's into medieval stuff and the SCA and I'm not...
If my assmptions are wrong, then your real intentions are clouded by your behaviour in this video. I didn't want to be nasty before, so hopefully I didn't offend, but I was speaking purely out of this video. And if what I see is wrong then I'm sure a lot of viewers are wrong as well.
You're the one in the vid, so please say what's really going on and prove me wrong.
(p.s. this is Broadsword's bro. I'll tell him not to post to avoid confusion).
@SirBroadsword ok. i followed our rules. i never questioned my opponents honor. i struck them until they felt they were bested. that is how our sport combat works. your brother should know what he is commenting on before he pipes up. clearly he doesnt. the rules are the rules and until he actually understands them he should keep silent.
@dukelogan No, I meant, I am the one who made the original comments. The real 'Sir Broadsword' only made that other comment.
To rebuttle, I never said you breached the rules. Not my issue. They breached them by not dying. Although, the first guy did get your head a few times. :P
I was referring to your behaviour. You can't tell me that last hit on his head, glaring at him, then walking off, wasn't personal, can you? When you saw he was hurt after he went down, you should have backed off.
@SirBroadsword actually no, he never hit me. and yes, i was annoyed and i walked off in a way that in over 20 years of fighting i never have before. if he was "hurt" he should have called a hold which he didnt. thats how our sport combat system works. again, you make a lot of assumptions. perhaps you should ask questions before jumping to conclusions.
@dukelogan He hits you on the head at 0:15. It's up to you to decide a killing blow, but again, he obviously wasn't honest about yours.
I do know how the system works. I don't like some of the red tape, because it restricts the activity a lot, but atleast nobody gets badly hurt .
I have nothing else to add at this point bro. I've said what i think and I still think it. I'm sure you're a nice guy and nothing I say is personal towards you, only towards the way you handle these guys here.
@SirBroadsword you mean when he flips his wrist over and hits the back of shield above my head? like i said, neither of them ever touched me with a shot. and i could only assume the shots i hit them with that did not accept were light although the first guy admitted to me that he wasnt going to take my shots because he thought his first shot (the one i punch blocked) actually hit me. so i kept throwing perfectly legal blows until the did.
What I enjoy the most personally is just some sword fighting. The goal in SCA combat is to get around your opponent and K.O, but then you're bound to system of taking shots and dying after two seconds.
If you fight sword to sword then it may not be realistic, but I find it very enjoyable. You aim for their body, but instead of the usual bear hugging in giant jack of plates, you sword clash until somebody is too slow to block. Not many people want to fight that way though.
My point is, people need to chill and have some fun. Hang out with your pals, learn to fight, but don't take things personally and MAKE it personal. Dukey wasn't in the right by purposely trying to put that guy 'in his place' by using SCA combat as a guise to ACTUALLY hurt him. What a convenient way to disguise it.
SCA combat never seems fun anyway. People stand around for a few minutes, then someone gets hit on the head and dies. It may not be realistic, but some sword play would be cool.
I think the majority of these people take it seriously to the point where it isn't 'fun' anymore. To the point where they aren't playing a 'game', they let it dominate.
Such as that silly guy calling out "Your majesty!" when clearly, there is an actual, cold blood confrontation (not an 'SCA' fight). Sure, the second guy did Dukey wrong by charging, but bashing the SHIT out of him is no justification.
I wonder if people call the 'king' "your majesty" or the actual person behind the 'title'.
Been taught that if you don't call a shot, they're just going to hit you harder.
I expect nothing less. Personally, if I had been on the receiving end, I would have known better.
I was actually impressed with his restraint in the end. He waited for the second fighter to turn around and ready himself before clocking him. Some fighters wouldn't have given him that luxury.
Cn anyone direct me to an image/source of the helmet that this Duke that all the hubub is about is wearing? I'd like to try my hand at making one, but I'm having a hard time seeing detail here on youtube. Is there a supplier that readily makes that model, or was it a custom piece? Thanks!
@MrMeineNamen sure they can. anyone can mimic a fetchbook if they want. the sca, and its combat sport, has little to do with reenactors or "real" medieval techniques so im not sure why you would make such a comment.
@MrMeineNamen i beg your pardon but i use the I33 techniques when heavy fighting. Besides just because it may not look like people are using actual techniques doesn't mean that they don't have the know how.
@MrMeineNamen like most guys who mimic the fight books your kata stuff works for your choreographed practice. things are very different once you start throwing full force, full speed, non-choreographed blows. apples and flip-flops. you could always go to a local sca practice and try what you do if its so superior. you will find, like so many before you, that it wont. the best flag football guys never do well when they come over to tackle ball.
at me saying I was hitting him to hard. REALLY? ok..then take the shots. I believe the Duke did the right thing here. Sometimes, thats what it takes.
Watching this fight, if your going to call Duke Logan out, you should call the other fighter out as well, after the first fight, at 0:25 the second fighter charged, barely giving the Duke time to turn and defend, that is a pretty "dickish" move as well. It is no fun when you hit your opponent over and over and over and they do not take anything. I did that at Estrella War against a combatant, hit him harder and harder and harder, after I nearly knocked his helmet off he yelled
@aristotle29 - It's no worse than when that same fighter nearly attacked Logan from behind earlier. This was a melee and melee is a bit of a different situation from one-on-one tourney fighting. In a tourney I make sure my opponent is comfortable and ready. In a melee, acknowledgement is all that is needed, not full, on guard readiness. I think that goes double in a obviously fishy situation like this.
I have been in the sca for 11 years and the only time I have seen people act like that is at crown tourny. That knight is not knightly. If someone doesn't take your shots, hit them harder until they do, but don't get pissed. That was not the way to handle that at all. Hit them harder and when the fight ends talk to them about it in a calm manner. That last hit to the guy on his knees was a dick move. Again no knight should ever act like that.
@aristotle29 - Read down the comments. What makes that last hit a "dick move?" He had engagement, as you can clearly see the legged fighter turn his head and make eye contact. In fact, he took a long time to drop to his knees after the blow. Duke Logan would have been justified in hitting him three or four times while he did his little "oww" spin move.
@PumpkinTuna So what if he took a few seconds to get on his knees, that doesn't mean a damn thing. If the "Duke" had hit him three or four times then he would have lost all respect, at least in my kingdom anyway. You don't do that because there is no honor in it. If your opponent takes the leg shot the way that squire did, you let them get on their knees and get ready. That is honorable combat.
Now I will agree that those fighters were not taking the Dukes hits, however it is the job of a knight to rise above that, not sink below. Again like I said in the first first post, hit them harder if they don't take your shots, break them if you have to, but don't ever get pissed and dishonor yourself like that. If they don't take your good shots, the dishonor is on them. If you get angry about it, the dishonor is on you. Because then you look like a bully like this "Duke".
@aristotle29 - But I'm still not sure why that move was "dickish." If he had hit him when he was still looking away, I could see your point, but It was pretty clear that there was some acknowledgement. I won't speak for Logan, but I'm guessing he *was* a bit irritated at that point (I would have been) and perhaps he thought it was better to get it over with quickly and leave the field.
@PumpkinTuna The part I'm saying is dickish is that he is swinging before the fighter on his knees even has his shield up and is clearly not even ready. At 0:32 you can see the Dukes swing in motion while the fighter doesn't have his shield or sword up. You may be right, he could have just wanted to get off the field.
@PumpkinTuna i was, for the first time in my sca sport combat career, not having fun. i could have hit him at any time as we were legally engaged. i paused once his sword was grounded and as soon as he lifted it i struck him with a legal blow. aristotles problem is that he feels its ok to attack others based on what he feels is right (or what his culture tells him is "honorable"). my kingdom says i was nice. he can point his finger all he wants and shame on him for it. i sleep well at night.
@dukelogan - That's always been my reading of the situation. I can tell you weren't having fun. I think you acted appropriately. I always tell people that I'll stop doing this when it stops being fun. Guys who do what the first fighter did make it not fun.
@aristotle29 With all due respect, how long do we have to wait to see if a man falls down? I was taught that if you take a good shot to the leg, you don't play drama queen, you act out the blow. If he had needed a moment to massage his aching cheek, he should have called a hold. At the least he could have called, "good leg" loudly and then slowly gotten to his knees. I think Logan was probably just wanting to get off the field and end what was obviously a completely messed up fight.
I think a knight needs to be talk to big time, if your having that bad of getting new fighters to take hits stop fighting and talk to them don't be a ass about it.
All I have to say about this is that I am proud of some of my bruises I get from the SCA, that guy in green...thats one bruise I would NOT be proud of..... Id still like to see it though!!!!
As a new fighter in The S.C.A. (An Tir, 3 mountains) I watch this fight about every other month just to remind myself of what NOT to do when totally outclassed. Rhinohiding is never a good thing, and it is an honor to fight someone much better then me, as it is a chance to learn. I'm sure Duke Logans second opponent learned something, not to attack from behind with no challenge given.
As a new fighter in The S.C.A. (An Tir, 3 mountains) I watch this fight about every other month just to remind myself of what NOT to do when totally outclassed. Rhinohiding is never a good thing, and it is an honor to fight someone much better then me, as it is a chance to learn. I'm sure Duke Logans second opponent learned something, not to attack from behind with no challenge given.
Duke Logan was right to give that second coward a further hit - attacking from behind is just pathetic. I hate people who don't take shots. And especially the first combatant was hit so many times by him...
lol, I know people are going to whine at me for posting this, but this video made my day. I understand that SCA fighting is "Honorable" fighting, and so many would slap the Lord of his wrist. We must all remember, he is a fighter; and what does a fighter do when he hits someone and that person doesn't react? he hits harder.
I am sorry I see nothing wrong here, he gave as much force as needed to prove his lesson, and then left. This showed control.
@Traith01 then he is a sorry knight we're not out there to beat the crap out new fighters we're to and teach, if I want to beat the crap out of some one it will who understands how to fight back, this showed us how to be a bully and needs to have his belt pulled.
@thebigone3996hard to follow your grammar but i think you are confusing what we do at a practice and what we do in a tourney setting. in a tourney/competition, all fighters are supposed to already understand "how to fight back". also, it is a violation of the rules (not to mention the spirit) of our sport to "stop fighting and talk to them" as this implies you are calling them a cheater and calling thier blows. if i hit someone and they dont take it i simply assume it was no good. period.
@TheManperson what do you mean? im sure you have some image in your head of "real" sword fighting although you have never done so. but the sca is very clear about what we do, we stick to it, and we do not pretend to be anything else. so whats your little snipe all about?
@TheManperson Depends on your definition of realistic...does it acurately depict period combat? Not really, our style of fighting is shaped by modern ideas of safety and insurance regulations. It IS realistic in the fact that the fighting is not choreographed. The goal of the SCA was never to exactly replicate the Medieval and Rennaisance world. Some individuals within the Society do strive to be as authentic as possible but it isn't a requirement of the Society.
@TheManperson The SCA is about honorable combat. For realistic combat I do EMP. Look them up. it's Empire of Medieval pursuits. I'm sure you'll like it man. I do.
I must admit that you are the first person I have met in the SCA that openly admits that the SCA is not supposed to be realistic. I'll take your advice and look that EMP place up.
@TheManperson emp is kinda cool but its hardly "realistic". the sca has never, since it was created, attempted to claim it was realistic anything. we have no idea how life in the middle ages was. the sca is a pretty good resource for learning about the middle ages and the fighting is, i think, as close to sword fighting out there. even if some of our rules are dumb as shit. still, its a great place to be. so is the emp. i say that not from first hand but just that i know folks in it.
@SooMaTai its a sport, sports have rules. what makes you think this is a "real" combat situation? besides, even war has rules. but hey, you seem to be well versed in real combat and how you fight people with swords and what not.
@dukelogan Combat only has two rules...Don't kick below the soles of the feet, and never hit a girl in the balls. In real combat I can gouge out your eyes, attack your groin. use joint locks and other seriously dangerous attacks, that aren't allow in combat games. I do actually know a bit about combat and sword fighting, having done this for 20 years or so, including SCA heavy. But apparently only people from the SCA have any idea what's what when it comes to combat, amirite?
@SooMaTai huh? what the fuck are you trying to suggest? go back to playing on your xbox. by the way, i never suggested sca folks know shit about real fighting. never, not once. clearly you dont either with your silly dont kick the soles of the feet or a woman in her balls. whatever. like i said, go back to your internet gameplay or whatever ruleset you ramble on about. makes no sense at all.
@dukelogan I was actually pointing out that neither the SCA, nor EMP, or any other combat game, is realistic, due to it's need to adhere to rules concerning personal safety of the combatants.
@SooMaTai well go on you. nobody ever suggested sca combat was some, as you say, "realistic" form of combat. i will say that sca sport combat has taught many folks how to strike someone really hard with a stick-;ike object in their hand. so, again, you make no point of worth.
@dukelogan Funny, I had always heard SCA guys were pompus assholes, especially once they get knighted. What do you know it's true. Can't even make a return comment without trying to belittle someone and call them names. Why don't you try making an intelligent retort, instead of spewing profanity, if you are capable.
@SooMaTai wait, your the fella that showed up and made some comments about "real combat" which, of course, made no sense. then you ask for some retort to your non-relevant (and silly) comments? really?
@dbjdi@dbjdi I've been participating in the SCA for almost 30 years. I've never noticed anyone saying what we do is "realistic." We are more akin to King Rene d'Anjou's Tournament or the Tourney of the Field of Cloth of Gold between Henry VIII and Francis I of France. The "rebated" swords or wooden swords covered in silver leaf, or even the swords made from whale baleen are more like our rattan weapons than anything else. And, I see on the EMP heavy weapon's web page "combat legal claws"?
@dukelogan why not? many non fighters seemed dismayed by this fight . it seemed to me you were holding back a little.are you unaproachable to ask a question my lord
@dukelogan to get ur attention when your facing the other way would a fighter need to call out or tap ur shoulder? an second if someone disarms you would it be honorable to kick it back to them an continue to fight
@neoprower777 there are several ways to "engage" someone in a melee. sca.org has the marshals handbook which goes through them. your second question depends. in a singles fight (1vs1) you cannot engage a helpless opponent so he would be allowed to regain his weapon. in a melee he is not although the most common situation is that someone allows him to regain his weapon of course. beating up a guy who cant fight back offers no reknown. again, not required but most often it is offered.
@itsrichards. "intent to injure" How so? I've fought Logan, and frankly, if he had "intended to injure" these guys, they would have been on the ground with a lot more than bruised butt cheeks.
I've been in the SCA for 11 years and by our rules I counted at least six solid death blows on the first guy and three on the second. Not to mention all the legs. In the end his opponent could have no doubt that he was beaten and the better man walked away.
Probably though -- most of what we're seeing and thinking is poor behavior on the other fighters "may" be a common newbie malady -- the adrenaline rush clouds higher thought, and they don't remember how the game is played. A little "hunter vision" can go a long way for doing dumb things. ;)
@Zargogo Ohhhh yes it can.... These "mock" weapons have the same balance and weight as a "real" sword. And the armor is also "real" -- these weapons can snap 2x4's when wielded by a skilled fighter.
However, that dolt who wasn't recognizing honest leg hits -- with a "real" sword he would have been hopping around like a Monty Python skit... and soon dead. (Which is why you're supposed to REACT like you just had a major leg injury when you do get hit in the leg, arm, or whatever.)
@roetemeteor Getting "smacked in the head" (oodles of padding there and nice thick steel) doesn't hurt NEARLY as much as getting smacked in the back of the leg.... where that fighter had NO padding. (snicker) THAT'S gonna leave a mark....
Thing is, that second fighter attacked after a "HOLD" was called -- (which is an ALL STOP) command, and from behind, to boot. ....And he (or she) will hopefully learn to recognize when an "alpha" is miffed. 'Tain't a boffer competition... ;)
Yeah, I cringed when he got smacked there. And I didn't say he didn't deserve what he got, because he was stupid enough to try to back attack someone that just tanned someone's hide real good.
@illustratz Same balance and weight of a real sword? Come now, it's a club. I don't know where you do your research at but you may need to keep looking. Also with the comment on real armour....using that when talking about the mad max kits of most of the SCA members or one such as Logan with all his hidden plastic/leather is humorous as best. Back to the research library for yourself. For historically accurate gear, I would look elsewhere then the SCA.
@skyknight1281 Have you used / or balanced a "heavy weapons" sword and used it in active combat? Have you been on a heavy weapons fighting field? Have you worked intimately with the armor needed? They're rattan because they're designed to NOT CUT through your opponent. Now, I grant you, the plastic and kevlar is too modern for my tastes (I didn't use the stuff myself), and there is a LOT of "fantasy" armor out there. But there is also VERY high quality, and fine workmanship out there, too.
@illustratz I used to be in the SCA and have fought heavy. I still have my old weapons but saying they are based on real weapons is as far as you can push it really. They don't feel or weight like real swords or other weapons of which I own as well. The SCA weapons are basically clubs in tape. Even the actually combat is like fighting with clubs, historical combat was nothing like SCA combat. I fought in a 15th century harness which I still own as well. I really detest the "Mad Max" kits.
@skyknight1281 Ok, your points are valid (and you've got the experience to back them). I also used to be in the SCA, and also fought heavy -- our experiences differ somewhat. And I have to agree with you about the "Mad Max" constructions. My fighting ended with a knee injury because I trusted an... "expert" (I was a squire), who "re-designed" my knee protection -- that caused it to hyper-extend on the field. Nowadays, I follow the PERIOD "experts" whose lives depended on their armor working.
@illustratz It's a shame really, the SCA could be so much more but as it stands now. It's sort of like all the kids who used to play stick fighting when they were young, they just use the backdrop excuse of reenacting medieval history to play. I also detest seeing stuff like in the above video. It was obvious the guys were rookies and it wasn't the right answer to treat them like that because they failed to take blows. Unchivalrous behavior and disrespect wasn't the way to rectify the situation.
@skyknight1281 first, you know that the combat sport in the sca has nothing to do with period sword fighting. right? second, you know nothing about period sword fighting. right? i mean reading some books on the subject from the 14th century really tells us nothing about what it really was like. its like reading a book about getting head but never getting it. silly right? and last, nothing "unchivalrous" about what i did. it was very chivalric in fact. or do you confuse chivalry with courtesy?
@dukelogan Yea I know and that is what I was basically telling the other person. I also guarantee I know more then you do on the historical aspects of it. But all of that is besides the point of the video. Your ethical conduct is in question. It's a good thing not everyone follows your "Style of Chivarly". Last time I looked courtesy was part of the core values of chivalry. Just make sure to keep teaching the rookies with your sword instead of actually talking to them.
@skyknight1281 in question? how so? our rules clearly state that the person struc calls the blow. until the first guy was disarmed he didnt feel he was bested. once i disarmed him he stopped. the second guy was legged and ended up "3 points down" so i waited until he lifted his sword tip off the ground and struck him. 100% legal and by the rules. so please explain how my ethics are in question or whatever your charge is. especially since you dont know a thing about me.
@paleomike8 the first guy was not and was new but was in the same remote area. talking with the knight would have been useless since he was the one, according to the 1st guy, who planted these ideas in their heads. dude was a transplant knight and spewed a bunch of "opinions" about a bunch of folks. the whole idea of embracing the culture when you move into a new kingdom somehow missed him i guess.
If the sword wasn't a versatile weapon, it wouldn't had been a stable in any military.
But it was.
Those swords are weighed to be like an actual blade, and if the fighter feels like it, there's tape going down one side of the 'blade' and the other to signify what's the sharp part and what's not.
That's not regulation, but I've seen it done before. I HAVE Seen someone rip all the way through drywall fluidly with one of those. Getting hit with one is NOT fun.
I heard of SCA from my AP Physics teacher (he's a massive nerd for it, talks about it all the time in class). What i want to know is: do I have to be 18 to take part in a full scale war (or even a skirmish or one v one). And to be autorized for fighting, do I have to be formally trained?
@Sorewinner1994 short answer about the age is no. trained? yes. ive personally met thousands of new fighters from all kinds of backgrounds. none of them do well until they get some training. ours is a very unique sport. you can go to sca dot org and search for the "marshals handbook" to read the rules and check out scademo dot com for some helpful information.
Seems like I'm coming in late as well, not sure how I missed this one. The Duke has absolutely nothing to defend himself against; he did nothing wrong. He followed the rules of the list. The Marshals did the correct thing by stopping the fight. As soon as they called a stop to the fight (not a hold notice) the Duke broke off his engagement. I think that fight would have pist anyone off, so the way Logan walked off the field, though he says himself was shitty, was completely understandable
The Duke did nothing wrong. The second guy made a huge mistake by dropping his guard just because he got hit in the rear as he relied on the Dukes chivalry not to hit him. The Duke would have been in his right to continue engaging him even as the guy turned around. Yet he was good enough to let him get on his knees and make eye contact to finish the fight. Never take your eyes off your opponent. Especially a DUKE!
@lostbooger I never strike someone until they are ready to continue, honor demands no less. Make eye contact you say? That is utter crap. Just listen to the people in the background during the fight, that alone should give you a good hint on whats going on. This was just another case of a thug duke beating the crap out of new fighters.
@skyknight1281 Respectfully, there were many fights going on at that time so you are only assuming the voices are referring to the fight on the video. In my kingdom all that is required to engage somebody is eye contact, which is more privledge then the unbelted fighter gave the Duke. In a tournament setting especially, you NEVER assume the opposing fighter is going to stop his assault because you have been legged or armed. Dropping your guard does not win tourneys.
@skyknight1281 so you play outside the rules of the list (which say nothing about waiting for someone until they are ready , even if they didnt afford you the same when they attacked from behind). ok, thats your way and thats fine. but to call someone a "thug" when they followed the rules shows a lack of character on your part. so be it. change the rules if you can. but please save yourself the foolish chatter when you expect everyone else to play the way you do. its unbecoming at best. feh.
Nearly four years since this video was first posted and the chivalrous Logan is still fighting with the posters trying to defend his actions. Well done Logan, teach these Rhino's to take proper shots. It's always good that we have kingdom peers to teach rookies proper honor and chivalry.
the last shot is what finally ended the fight. we had eye contact and as soon as he lifted his sword off the ground i fired the head shot. so i dont understand why there would be a question. now the walking away part i admit was shitty on my part but i felt that if the had shot wasnt good i had nothing left for the fight. still, i should have waited a second to see if he called it instead of just walking off like that.
@dukelogan i understand the frustration that these guys are really not being sportsmen like , especially the first one , he got way to many hits and should of went down long time ago , the second guy i understand came from behind to try and help out his friend , and he as well dint go down wen he should off and wen the shoots came in ... this all said , that last shoot would not make up for their lack of sportsmanship or lack of respect , but lower you to their level . and the fight was over .
Thank god for Dukes who take care of the jerks who won't call their shots. I doubt I would have gotten mad enough to take that last shot, that's just me. I'm just beginning and right now, the only way I have to deal with guys like that is to walk away and not fight them again. I look forward to the day when I have another honorable course of action besides walking away.
In the case of people ignoring good hits - one of our guys has a saying - make sure the next hit makes him squeal. Thats what the Duke did and I find it acceptable.
Hmmm... obviously I came in late to see this (four years late to be precise) but upon my first viewing of this it seemed 'obviously' as though the Duke was merely having a bad day and sought to vent his frustrations upon these two hapless whelps. However, upon closer examination of just how many 'good' hits were placed by him, it seems justified. However I will admit that his final head strike to the second opponent was uncalled for.
GOD OF WAR ^^"
rollinsen 8 hours ago
If this is MMA, then great good job. If this is like sparring, then it's bullshit. Funny either way though :)
mrscottybizzer 4 days ago
Marshall in training here.
After those 10 clean clear shots to the legs and torso, i would have stopped that fight too. That fighter did right in hitting harder and harder. but his second fight he lost control and wailed on that guys head without giving him a chance to sit up. Very dishonorable and I would have pulled him to talk to him about it.
thoamsfox0 4 days ago
@thoamsfox0 perhaps in your local area one is required to allow a legged fighter a "chance to sit up". however, in atlantia a fighter is expected to be ready at all times. the legged fighter was in range and could be legally hit at any point until his sword tip was grounded. the blow was thrown as soon as the tip came off the ground. nothing "dishonorable" about that at all.
also can you define what you mean by "he lost control"?
dukelogan1 4 days ago
@dukelogan1 Its not the fact of he has to let him sit up, it the fact that its the honorable thing to do.
Also, if you noticed, the other fighter was in pain when he took that leg shot and as soon as he turned around the Red and White guy just clocked him one without giving him a chance to defend himself. The red and white guy was obviously pissed about the first fight and it carried over to the second one.
thoamsfox0 4 days ago
@thoamsfox0 but that implies to not do so is "dishonorable" which is inaccurate if local custom says differently. if, in local custom, it is expected that a fighter always be prepared then there is no issue. also, you are making an assumption about the guy being "pissed off". unless, of course, youve spoken with him you really dont know what he was feeling. im not suggesting that your local customs are wrong, just reminding you that they may in fact be very different.
dukelogan1 4 days ago
@dukelogan1 I noticed you posted that you are from Atlanta. I have heard that the Georgia groups go by a completely different fighting standard than most of the SCA does.
And yes, what he did was dishonorable in my book. Whenever i hit my Father in the leg and he went down in pain, I didnt wait for him to turn around before wailing on him. I stopped and asked if he was alright. That is the honorable thing to do. This man did not.
The black obviously needs retraining to defend safely.
thoamsfox0 4 days ago
@thoamsfox0 atlantia, not atlanta. the georgia area, aside from augusta which belongs to atlantia, probably have the lowest force expectations in the sca. thats their local custom. i think it would be safe to say "thats not how i would have done it" but its wrong to call it dishonorable if it is acceptable by local (kingdom) custom. hope that makes sense.
dukelogan1 4 days ago
Well met sir. All I know is what I see, and my opinion is just that.
drewstein3500 5 days ago
Honor system- if you land a good hit and you know it, although your opponent does not accept it, it is YOUR duty to Hold and explain/ talk/ learn. If they do not accept your blow, well , then you need to ramp it up. And the legged opponent was not set, the Knight exercised no largesse to his legged opponent. He was obviously angry and put his first opponent in danger, who seemed to be outmatched and could not SAFELY defend. And the legged opponent did not engage until recognized.
drewstein3500 6 days ago
@drewstein3500 perhaps in your local area its acceptable to question your opponent. in most areas it is frowned up greatly (except at a practice of course). same thing with a legged opponent, in most areas the fight continues and you are expected to be prepared. as for the first guy how was he ever in "danger"? i repect your opinion but i remind you that your local culture may not be the same as someone elses.
dukelogan1 5 days ago
the last shot
drewstein3500 6 days ago
the knight went too far....
drewstein3500 1 week ago
@drewstein3500 how so?
dukelogan1 6 days ago
Good fight in my books. You're wearing armor and using sticks. Well played, and I too would love to train with him!
bmworgii 3 weeks ago
@MrMeineNamen just because some one has the know how does not mean that some times they use it. just because this is not something you like does not mean that you can just bash it. learn to let things be and not be such a critic. agree to dissagree that we all love the middle ages
massies 1 month ago
agree to disagree but as a fighter myself I would want someone to do that to me if I was not taking shots or acting with out chivalry. I got into trouble once when i was a new fighter for smacking someone to the dome without them looking and in my opinion the knight had the right to do what he did.
massies 1 month ago
@SooMaTai
@dukelogan
As a neutral third-party, my opinion is that you both are coming off as fools...
F22Rapter2468 1 month ago
I love the person who gets hit in the leg at 30 seconds... "Oww" haha Then turns around and BOOM!!! haha
ChamorruWarrior 2 months ago
lmfao sacrément belle
FlipTheDish 3 months ago
0:32 Holy shit. We call that strike the "Pimps Up, Hoes Down".
assamurai 3 months ago 2
bad-a walk away. Nice.
F22Rapter2468 3 months ago
no matter how long its been since i've been here the debate still goes on
monkeyishi 3 months ago
I think I'd rather do fencing this looks a bit too rough for me, I respect the sport but then again you have all these people saying that NFL and SCA are really brutal sports and encourage violence.
Dimitri0809 3 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
HAHAHAHAH!!!! I just love it when he walks up after legging that dude and just blast him in the face...... and then he stares at him as if to say "You can pull your skirt down now bitch..I'm thru fuckin ya" AND THE OSCAR GOES TO????? Back stabbin Lil red belt that shoulda taken some of those other shots.
darkeworthe 3 months ago
Comment removed
darkeworthe 3 months ago
7 - 7 - 7 - 7 - 7 -7 -7
Badgers - Badgers - Badgers -Badgers - Badgers - Badgers - Badgers -
/watch?v=EIyixC9NsLI
Aserox 4 months ago
Keep pressing 9 lmao
streetgangtm 4 months ago
@broadsword "Lastly, just because somebody doesn't go down when they clearly get hit doesn't give you the right to hit them harder and harder until it does damage." umm yes it does. A fight doesnt stop until a blow is accepted or hold is called we never asume, so if a person is getting hit solid or is getting "damage" it is thier responsibility to stop the fight or they will continue to take blows escpecially in a tournament. the exception is fighting a newer/learning fighter at a PRACTICE.
khamfl 5 months ago 9
@khamfl
interesting you say that because in fencing we don't need a stupid honor system where people are always going to disobey and not abide by..
Dimitri0809 2 weeks ago
@Dimitri0809 oh so ur a wire weenie eh? haha jk. its really hard to disobey the honor system with how hard we hit. and i dont care if someone doesnt call a shot because it just means i should be hitting harder. power is verry important in sca. i would like to see u try and come out to a practice and not call shots u r just gonna get torn down like the two in the video only way worse.
khamfl 1 week ago
hahahahahaha
baldwinthefox 5 months ago
Looks like a nice, intense match to me.
Unless a good shot is acknowledged, expect the opponent to ramp it up.
The fighter on his knees had plenty of time to prepare his defense.
More time than he gave as he engaged from behind.
I wouldn't expect any hard feelings on either side. It's combat, after all,
I would love to train with that Knight.
DontPanic6X7 5 months ago 6
The execution and walking off? This guy is alpha as fuck.
Tronzxz 5 months ago
Lastly, just because somebody doesn't go down when they clearly get hit doesn't give you the right to hit them harder and harder until it does damage. If people aren't going to go down when they need to, be the 'honourable' one and keep your head.
SCA combat doesn't work in my opinion, because you can't hurt people purposely, but you have to 'die' anyway when you get bopped. I'm only participating because I love the Middle Ages. Not to boost my self esteem by physically smothering people.
SirBroadsword 5 months ago
@SirBroadsword you sure make a whole lot of assumptions. wrong assumptions....... but dont let that stop ya!
dukelogan 5 months ago
@dukelogan
Hey, the real Sir Broadsword didn't even make these comments... I left my account logged in and my brother used it to make them. I actually do agree with what he said, though, based purely on the video, though he has a MUCH better idea of what's going on here than I do, given that he's into medieval stuff and the SCA and I'm not...
SirBroadsword 5 months ago
@SirBroadsword "he has a MUCH better idea of what's going on here"
no....... no he doesnt.....
dukelogan 5 months ago
Comment removed
SirBroadsword 5 months ago
Comment removed
SirBroadsword 5 months ago
@dukelogan Then what is going on here?
If my assmptions are wrong, then your real intentions are clouded by your behaviour in this video. I didn't want to be nasty before, so hopefully I didn't offend, but I was speaking purely out of this video. And if what I see is wrong then I'm sure a lot of viewers are wrong as well.
You're the one in the vid, so please say what's really going on and prove me wrong.
(p.s. this is Broadsword's bro. I'll tell him not to post to avoid confusion).
SirBroadsword 5 months ago
@SirBroadsword ok. i followed our rules. i never questioned my opponents honor. i struck them until they felt they were bested. that is how our sport combat works. your brother should know what he is commenting on before he pipes up. clearly he doesnt. the rules are the rules and until he actually understands them he should keep silent.
dukelogan 5 months ago
@dukelogan No, I meant, I am the one who made the original comments. The real 'Sir Broadsword' only made that other comment.
To rebuttle, I never said you breached the rules. Not my issue. They breached them by not dying. Although, the first guy did get your head a few times. :P
I was referring to your behaviour. You can't tell me that last hit on his head, glaring at him, then walking off, wasn't personal, can you? When you saw he was hurt after he went down, you should have backed off.
SirBroadsword 5 months ago
@SirBroadsword actually no, he never hit me. and yes, i was annoyed and i walked off in a way that in over 20 years of fighting i never have before. if he was "hurt" he should have called a hold which he didnt. thats how our sport combat system works. again, you make a lot of assumptions. perhaps you should ask questions before jumping to conclusions.
dukelogan 5 months ago
@dukelogan He hits you on the head at 0:15. It's up to you to decide a killing blow, but again, he obviously wasn't honest about yours.
I do know how the system works. I don't like some of the red tape, because it restricts the activity a lot, but atleast nobody gets badly hurt .
I have nothing else to add at this point bro. I've said what i think and I still think it. I'm sure you're a nice guy and nothing I say is personal towards you, only towards the way you handle these guys here.
SirBroadsword 5 months ago
@SirBroadsword you mean when he flips his wrist over and hits the back of shield above my head? like i said, neither of them ever touched me with a shot. and i could only assume the shots i hit them with that did not accept were light although the first guy admitted to me that he wasnt going to take my shots because he thought his first shot (the one i punch blocked) actually hit me. so i kept throwing perfectly legal blows until the did.
dukelogan 5 months ago
@dukelogan
What I enjoy the most personally is just some sword fighting. The goal in SCA combat is to get around your opponent and K.O, but then you're bound to system of taking shots and dying after two seconds.
If you fight sword to sword then it may not be realistic, but I find it very enjoyable. You aim for their body, but instead of the usual bear hugging in giant jack of plates, you sword clash until somebody is too slow to block. Not many people want to fight that way though.
SirBroadsword 5 months ago
@SirBroadsword - You don't fight a persons sword, you fight them. Standing back and sword fighting, is not combat by any stretch.
SooMaTai 3 months ago
My point is, people need to chill and have some fun. Hang out with your pals, learn to fight, but don't take things personally and MAKE it personal. Dukey wasn't in the right by purposely trying to put that guy 'in his place' by using SCA combat as a guise to ACTUALLY hurt him. What a convenient way to disguise it.
SCA combat never seems fun anyway. People stand around for a few minutes, then someone gets hit on the head and dies. It may not be realistic, but some sword play would be cool.
SirBroadsword 5 months ago
I think the majority of these people take it seriously to the point where it isn't 'fun' anymore. To the point where they aren't playing a 'game', they let it dominate.
Such as that silly guy calling out "Your majesty!" when clearly, there is an actual, cold blood confrontation (not an 'SCA' fight). Sure, the second guy did Dukey wrong by charging, but bashing the SHIT out of him is no justification.
I wonder if people call the 'king' "your majesty" or the actual person behind the 'title'.
SirBroadsword 5 months ago
Totally in the right here.
Been taught that if you don't call a shot, they're just going to hit you harder.
I expect nothing less. Personally, if I had been on the receiving end, I would have known better.
I was actually impressed with his restraint in the end. He waited for the second fighter to turn around and ready himself before clocking him. Some fighters wouldn't have given him that luxury.
Durante824 5 months ago
yell hold if u need time to git on ur knees if not its fair
gagurmom 6 months ago
i wont to see after that ppl be not callin hits wtf all good hits on them fucking around some one could git hert
for real
gagurmom 6 months ago
Cn anyone direct me to an image/source of the helmet that this Duke that all the hubub is about is wearing? I'd like to try my hand at making one, but I'm having a hard time seeing detail here on youtube. Is there a supplier that readily makes that model, or was it a custom piece? Thanks!
MiddleEarthRanger 6 months ago
@MiddleEarthRanger my helm (a helmet is a small helm or skullcap) was made by tom justus. google his name and it will take you to his website.
regards
logan
dukelogan 6 months ago
*sigh* sad the only true reanactors left cant even use real medieval weaponry techniques
MrMeineNamen 6 months ago
@MrMeineNamen sure they can. anyone can mimic a fetchbook if they want. the sca, and its combat sport, has little to do with reenactors or "real" medieval techniques so im not sure why you would make such a comment.
dukelogan 6 months ago
@MrMeineNamen i beg your pardon but i use the I33 techniques when heavy fighting. Besides just because it may not look like people are using actual techniques doesn't mean that they don't have the know how.
massies 1 month ago
@massies well if they DO have the know how why are they flailing around like nonsense. i do know medieval weapon teqnuique and this is not it
MrMeineNamen 1 month ago
@MrMeineNamen like most guys who mimic the fight books your kata stuff works for your choreographed practice. things are very different once you start throwing full force, full speed, non-choreographed blows. apples and flip-flops. you could always go to a local sca practice and try what you do if its so superior. you will find, like so many before you, that it wont. the best flag football guys never do well when they come over to tackle ball.
regards
logan
dukelogan1 4 weeks ago
at me saying I was hitting him to hard. REALLY? ok..then take the shots. I believe the Duke did the right thing here. Sometimes, thats what it takes.
Logiquid 6 months ago
Watching this fight, if your going to call Duke Logan out, you should call the other fighter out as well, after the first fight, at 0:25 the second fighter charged, barely giving the Duke time to turn and defend, that is a pretty "dickish" move as well. It is no fun when you hit your opponent over and over and over and they do not take anything. I did that at Estrella War against a combatant, hit him harder and harder and harder, after I nearly knocked his helmet off he yelled
Logiquid 6 months ago
@aristotle29 - It's no worse than when that same fighter nearly attacked Logan from behind earlier. This was a melee and melee is a bit of a different situation from one-on-one tourney fighting. In a tourney I make sure my opponent is comfortable and ready. In a melee, acknowledgement is all that is needed, not full, on guard readiness. I think that goes double in a obviously fishy situation like this.
PumpkinTuna 6 months ago
I have been in the sca for 11 years and the only time I have seen people act like that is at crown tourny. That knight is not knightly. If someone doesn't take your shots, hit them harder until they do, but don't get pissed. That was not the way to handle that at all. Hit them harder and when the fight ends talk to them about it in a calm manner. That last hit to the guy on his knees was a dick move. Again no knight should ever act like that.
aristotle29 6 months ago
@aristotle29 - Read down the comments. What makes that last hit a "dick move?" He had engagement, as you can clearly see the legged fighter turn his head and make eye contact. In fact, he took a long time to drop to his knees after the blow. Duke Logan would have been justified in hitting him three or four times while he did his little "oww" spin move.
PumpkinTuna 6 months ago
@PumpkinTuna So what if he took a few seconds to get on his knees, that doesn't mean a damn thing. If the "Duke" had hit him three or four times then he would have lost all respect, at least in my kingdom anyway. You don't do that because there is no honor in it. If your opponent takes the leg shot the way that squire did, you let them get on their knees and get ready. That is honorable combat.
aristotle29 6 months ago
Now I will agree that those fighters were not taking the Dukes hits, however it is the job of a knight to rise above that, not sink below. Again like I said in the first first post, hit them harder if they don't take your shots, break them if you have to, but don't ever get pissed and dishonor yourself like that. If they don't take your good shots, the dishonor is on them. If you get angry about it, the dishonor is on you. Because then you look like a bully like this "Duke".
aristotle29 6 months ago
@aristotle29 - But I'm still not sure why that move was "dickish." If he had hit him when he was still looking away, I could see your point, but It was pretty clear that there was some acknowledgement. I won't speak for Logan, but I'm guessing he *was* a bit irritated at that point (I would have been) and perhaps he thought it was better to get it over with quickly and leave the field.
PumpkinTuna 6 months ago
@PumpkinTuna The part I'm saying is dickish is that he is swinging before the fighter on his knees even has his shield up and is clearly not even ready. At 0:32 you can see the Dukes swing in motion while the fighter doesn't have his shield or sword up. You may be right, he could have just wanted to get off the field.
aristotle29 6 months ago
@PumpkinTuna i was, for the first time in my sca sport combat career, not having fun. i could have hit him at any time as we were legally engaged. i paused once his sword was grounded and as soon as he lifted it i struck him with a legal blow. aristotles problem is that he feels its ok to attack others based on what he feels is right (or what his culture tells him is "honorable"). my kingdom says i was nice. he can point his finger all he wants and shame on him for it. i sleep well at night.
dukelogan 6 months ago
@dukelogan - That's always been my reading of the situation. I can tell you weren't having fun. I think you acted appropriately. I always tell people that I'll stop doing this when it stops being fun. Guys who do what the first fighter did make it not fun.
PumpkinTuna 6 months ago
@aristotle29 With all due respect, how long do we have to wait to see if a man falls down? I was taught that if you take a good shot to the leg, you don't play drama queen, you act out the blow. If he had needed a moment to massage his aching cheek, he should have called a hold. At the least he could have called, "good leg" loudly and then slowly gotten to his knees. I think Logan was probably just wanting to get off the field and end what was obviously a completely messed up fight.
PumpkinTuna 4 months ago
Like a boss
GUITARPLAYAx93x 6 months ago
:) i like that!. it looks agressive and suffocating
LunaNegraYGarcia 6 months ago
I think a knight needs to be talk to big time, if your having that bad of getting new fighters to take hits stop fighting and talk to them don't be a ass about it.
thebigone3996 7 months ago
the moral of the story is TAKE YOUR HITS!!!!!!
bladestormviking 7 months ago
lol nice
berserkpaladin1234 7 months ago
i wonder if that guy got his card pulled for that?
Eyeoftheshadows 7 months ago
@Eyeoftheshadows : If anything he should be commended for not actually beating their asses after they take 800 hits and don't count them.
Halofreakanoid 7 months ago
All I have to say about this is that I am proud of some of my bruises I get from the SCA, that guy in green...thats one bruise I would NOT be proud of..... Id still like to see it though!!!!
ThanagarianTragedy 7 months ago
THIS IS TRUE FIGHTING, YOU MY DEAR WARRIOR ARE A BROTHER OF MINE >:)
AkimoProductions 7 months ago
As a new fighter in The S.C.A. (An Tir, 3 mountains) I watch this fight about every other month just to remind myself of what NOT to do when totally outclassed. Rhinohiding is never a good thing, and it is an honor to fight someone much better then me, as it is a chance to learn. I'm sure Duke Logans second opponent learned something, not to attack from behind with no challenge given.
-Luden
BerserkerBrandMovies 7 months ago
As a new fighter in The S.C.A. (An Tir, 3 mountains) I watch this fight about every other month just to remind myself of what NOT to do when totally outclassed. Rhinohiding is never a good thing, and it is an honor to fight someone much better then me, as it is a chance to learn. I'm sure Duke Logans second opponent learned something, not to attack from behind with no challenge given.
-Luden
BerserkerBrandMovies 7 months ago
that was awesome
sifupintado 7 months ago
BIG MAN!
JKT6 8 months ago
Bravo!
Duke Logan was right to give that second coward a further hit - attacking from behind is just pathetic. I hate people who don't take shots. And especially the first combatant was hit so many times by him...
PandemicalShade 8 months ago
lol, I know people are going to whine at me for posting this, but this video made my day. I understand that SCA fighting is "Honorable" fighting, and so many would slap the Lord of his wrist. We must all remember, he is a fighter; and what does a fighter do when he hits someone and that person doesn't react? he hits harder.
I am sorry I see nothing wrong here, he gave as much force as needed to prove his lesson, and then left. This showed control.
Traith01 8 months ago
@Traith01 then he is a sorry knight we're not out there to beat the crap out new fighters we're to and teach, if I want to beat the crap out of some one it will who understands how to fight back, this showed us how to be a bully and needs to have his belt pulled.
thebigone3996 7 months ago
@thebigone3996hard to follow your grammar but i think you are confusing what we do at a practice and what we do in a tourney setting. in a tourney/competition, all fighters are supposed to already understand "how to fight back". also, it is a violation of the rules (not to mention the spirit) of our sport to "stop fighting and talk to them" as this implies you are calling them a cheater and calling thier blows. if i hit someone and they dont take it i simply assume it was no good. period.
dukelogan 7 months ago
@thebigone3996
I would say that it was a very good lesson! Little to question in that one.
Practice is where the teaching happens.
Fighters are authorized, no?
They should know how to fight, or the marshal that authed them should have HIS card pulled.
pimpolympic 7 months ago
What is on this guys helm it looks almost like a hood but its around the top of his hslm
sage481 8 months ago
and people say the SCA is realistic...
TheManperson 8 months ago
@TheManperson what do you mean? im sure you have some image in your head of "real" sword fighting although you have never done so. but the sca is very clear about what we do, we stick to it, and we do not pretend to be anything else. so whats your little snipe all about?
dukelogan 8 months ago
@TheManperson Depends on your definition of realistic...does it acurately depict period combat? Not really, our style of fighting is shaped by modern ideas of safety and insurance regulations. It IS realistic in the fact that the fighting is not choreographed. The goal of the SCA was never to exactly replicate the Medieval and Rennaisance world. Some individuals within the Society do strive to be as authentic as possible but it isn't a requirement of the Society.
pem1968 8 months ago
@TheManperson The SCA is about honorable combat. For realistic combat I do EMP. Look them up. it's Empire of Medieval pursuits. I'm sure you'll like it man. I do.
dbjdi 8 months ago
@dbjdi
I must admit that you are the first person I have met in the SCA that openly admits that the SCA is not supposed to be realistic. I'll take your advice and look that EMP place up.
TheManperson 8 months ago
@TheManperson emp is kinda cool but its hardly "realistic". the sca has never, since it was created, attempted to claim it was realistic anything. we have no idea how life in the middle ages was. the sca is a pretty good resource for learning about the middle ages and the fighting is, i think, as close to sword fighting out there. even if some of our rules are dumb as shit. still, its a great place to be. so is the emp. i say that not from first hand but just that i know folks in it.
dukelogan 8 months ago
@TheManperson IF there are rules to the combat, then it is not realistic. Period. Real combat has no rules.
SooMaTai 3 months ago
@SooMaTai its a sport, sports have rules. what makes you think this is a "real" combat situation? besides, even war has rules. but hey, you seem to be well versed in real combat and how you fight people with swords and what not.
dukelogan 3 months ago
@dukelogan Combat only has two rules...Don't kick below the soles of the feet, and never hit a girl in the balls. In real combat I can gouge out your eyes, attack your groin. use joint locks and other seriously dangerous attacks, that aren't allow in combat games. I do actually know a bit about combat and sword fighting, having done this for 20 years or so, including SCA heavy. But apparently only people from the SCA have any idea what's what when it comes to combat, amirite?
SooMaTai 3 months ago
@SooMaTai huh? what the fuck are you trying to suggest? go back to playing on your xbox. by the way, i never suggested sca folks know shit about real fighting. never, not once. clearly you dont either with your silly dont kick the soles of the feet or a woman in her balls. whatever. like i said, go back to your internet gameplay or whatever ruleset you ramble on about. makes no sense at all.
dukelogan 3 months ago
@dukelogan I was actually pointing out that neither the SCA, nor EMP, or any other combat game, is realistic, due to it's need to adhere to rules concerning personal safety of the combatants.
SooMaTai 3 months ago
@SooMaTai well go on you. nobody ever suggested sca combat was some, as you say, "realistic" form of combat. i will say that sca sport combat has taught many folks how to strike someone really hard with a stick-;ike object in their hand. so, again, you make no point of worth.
dukelogan 3 months ago
@dukelogan Funny, I had always heard SCA guys were pompus assholes, especially once they get knighted. What do you know it's true. Can't even make a return comment without trying to belittle someone and call them names. Why don't you try making an intelligent retort, instead of spewing profanity, if you are capable.
SooMaTai 3 months ago
@SooMaTai wait, your the fella that showed up and made some comments about "real combat" which, of course, made no sense. then you ask for some retort to your non-relevant (and silly) comments? really?
dukelogan1 2 months ago
@dbjdi @dbjdi I've been participating in the SCA for almost 30 years. I've never noticed anyone saying what we do is "realistic." We are more akin to King Rene d'Anjou's Tournament or the Tourney of the Field of Cloth of Gold between Henry VIII and Francis I of France. The "rebated" swords or wooden swords covered in silver leaf, or even the swords made from whale baleen are more like our rattan weapons than anything else. And, I see on the EMP heavy weapon's web page "combat legal claws"?
bnitons 7 months ago
Do they still do this and if im 15 can I do it
sage481 8 months ago
By 2nd thigh strike he should have realized and went down. No questions asked.
MosJav13 8 months ago
By 2nd thigh strike he should have realized and went down. No questions asked.
MosJav13 8 months ago
haha,
he smashed the guy, even when the coward tried to sneak in from behind.
served him right.
good job duke logan
hennoxxx 9 months ago
Don't blame him for getting mad. He had several kill shots on those guys and they refused to die.
SilentRaeth1 9 months ago
OMG THE GUY OF THE RED ARMOUR IS VERY FORIUS
TIRANT00 9 months ago
who was the knight what kingdom?
stevenpuhich 9 months ago
who was the knight what kingdom?
stevenpuhich 9 months ago
@stevenpuhich i was and the kingdom was atlantia. im curious why you would ask.
regards
logan
dukelogan 9 months ago
@dukelogan why not? many non fighters seemed dismayed by this fight . it seemed to me you were holding back a little.are you unaproachable to ask a question my lord
stevenpuhich 9 months ago
@stevenpuhich im one of the most approachable guys in the world. ;^) i was just curious is all.
regards
logan
dukelogan 9 months ago
who was the knight what kingdom?
stevenpuhich 9 months ago
this duke logan guy sounds like a faggot id kick his ass if he tried this to me
Finchy000 9 months ago
@Finchy000 sure you would. sure you would......
dukelogan 9 months ago
@dukelogan to get ur attention when your facing the other way would a fighter need to call out or tap ur shoulder? an second if someone disarms you would it be honorable to kick it back to them an continue to fight
neoprower777 8 months ago
@neoprower777 there are several ways to "engage" someone in a melee. sca.org has the marshals handbook which goes through them. your second question depends. in a singles fight (1vs1) you cannot engage a helpless opponent so he would be allowed to regain his weapon. in a melee he is not although the most common situation is that someone allows him to regain his weapon of course. beating up a guy who cant fight back offers no reknown. again, not required but most often it is offered.
logan
dukelogan 8 months ago
@itsrichards. "intent to injure" How so? I've fought Logan, and frankly, if he had "intended to injure" these guys, they would have been on the ground with a lot more than bruised butt cheeks.
PumpkinTuna 9 months ago
This is what we call "intent to injure"
itsrichards 9 months ago
I've been in the SCA for 11 years and by our rules I counted at least six solid death blows on the first guy and three on the second. Not to mention all the legs. In the end his opponent could have no doubt that he was beaten and the better man walked away.
Kermbee 9 months ago
Hey is there a bridge around cause i think some of the trolls are out tonight!
LordDuncanRose 9 months ago
man, he was pissed
TheVoraciousSnapmare 9 months ago
That last shot sums it all up, they were out classed and wouldn't take the hits - a bell ringer like that might be what's needed to wake them up...
I like the complaint about the leg shot...what a tool
irockupthebigstuff 9 months ago 2
I support Duke Logan's actions. Clearly those guys just weren't gonna take anything.
sinistersaracen 10 months ago
Wow, 58,006 views. Unbelievable.
PumpkinTuna 10 months ago
wow, now HE was really pssed. and wow what a killer s glare he gave be4 leaving the field. where was that?
martinmercenary 10 months ago
Probably though -- most of what we're seeing and thinking is poor behavior on the other fighters "may" be a common newbie malady -- the adrenaline rush clouds higher thought, and they don't remember how the game is played. A little "hunter vision" can go a long way for doing dumb things. ;)
illustratz 10 months ago
But dang, if you can swing it that fast in real combat it's such a better weapon than I had previously thought.
Zargogo 10 months ago
That dude Pwned those guys
austinpaul33 11 months ago
im glad that guy was hitting them like that
KaelofFortriu 11 months ago
wtf a real sword can't be swung around like that
Zargogo 11 months ago
@Zargogo sure it can. perhaps you cant do it but i know i can and have.
dukelogan 11 months ago
@Zargogo Ohhhh yes it can.... These "mock" weapons have the same balance and weight as a "real" sword. And the armor is also "real" -- these weapons can snap 2x4's when wielded by a skilled fighter.
However, that dolt who wasn't recognizing honest leg hits -- with a "real" sword he would have been hopping around like a Monty Python skit... and soon dead. (Which is why you're supposed to REACT like you just had a major leg injury when you do get hit in the leg, arm, or whatever.)
illustratz 10 months ago
@illustratz i see
Zargogo 10 months ago
@illustratz
Or else you'll get smacked in the head with that weapon as that guy did.
That HAD to have hurt.
roetemeteor 10 months ago
@roetemeteor Getting "smacked in the head" (oodles of padding there and nice thick steel) doesn't hurt NEARLY as much as getting smacked in the back of the leg.... where that fighter had NO padding. (snicker) THAT'S gonna leave a mark....
Thing is, that second fighter attacked after a "HOLD" was called -- (which is an ALL STOP) command, and from behind, to boot. ....And he (or she) will hopefully learn to recognize when an "alpha" is miffed. 'Tain't a boffer competition... ;)
illustratz 10 months ago
@illustratz
Yeah, I cringed when he got smacked there. And I didn't say he didn't deserve what he got, because he was stupid enough to try to back attack someone that just tanned someone's hide real good.
roetemeteor 10 months ago
@illustratz Same balance and weight of a real sword? Come now, it's a club. I don't know where you do your research at but you may need to keep looking. Also with the comment on real armour....using that when talking about the mad max kits of most of the SCA members or one such as Logan with all his hidden plastic/leather is humorous as best. Back to the research library for yourself. For historically accurate gear, I would look elsewhere then the SCA.
skyknight1281 9 months ago
@skyknight1281 Have you used / or balanced a "heavy weapons" sword and used it in active combat? Have you been on a heavy weapons fighting field? Have you worked intimately with the armor needed? They're rattan because they're designed to NOT CUT through your opponent. Now, I grant you, the plastic and kevlar is too modern for my tastes (I didn't use the stuff myself), and there is a LOT of "fantasy" armor out there. But there is also VERY high quality, and fine workmanship out there, too.
illustratz 9 months ago
@illustratz I used to be in the SCA and have fought heavy. I still have my old weapons but saying they are based on real weapons is as far as you can push it really. They don't feel or weight like real swords or other weapons of which I own as well. The SCA weapons are basically clubs in tape. Even the actually combat is like fighting with clubs, historical combat was nothing like SCA combat. I fought in a 15th century harness which I still own as well. I really detest the "Mad Max" kits.
skyknight1281 9 months ago
@skyknight1281 Ok, your points are valid (and you've got the experience to back them). I also used to be in the SCA, and also fought heavy -- our experiences differ somewhat. And I have to agree with you about the "Mad Max" constructions. My fighting ended with a knee injury because I trusted an... "expert" (I was a squire), who "re-designed" my knee protection -- that caused it to hyper-extend on the field. Nowadays, I follow the PERIOD "experts" whose lives depended on their armor working.
illustratz 9 months ago
@illustratz It's a shame really, the SCA could be so much more but as it stands now. It's sort of like all the kids who used to play stick fighting when they were young, they just use the backdrop excuse of reenacting medieval history to play. I also detest seeing stuff like in the above video. It was obvious the guys were rookies and it wasn't the right answer to treat them like that because they failed to take blows. Unchivalrous behavior and disrespect wasn't the way to rectify the situation.
skyknight1281 9 months ago
@skyknight1281 first, you know that the combat sport in the sca has nothing to do with period sword fighting. right? second, you know nothing about period sword fighting. right? i mean reading some books on the subject from the 14th century really tells us nothing about what it really was like. its like reading a book about getting head but never getting it. silly right? and last, nothing "unchivalrous" about what i did. it was very chivalric in fact. or do you confuse chivalry with courtesy?
dukelogan 9 months ago
@dukelogan Yea I know and that is what I was basically telling the other person. I also guarantee I know more then you do on the historical aspects of it. But all of that is besides the point of the video. Your ethical conduct is in question. It's a good thing not everyone follows your "Style of Chivarly". Last time I looked courtesy was part of the core values of chivalry. Just make sure to keep teaching the rookies with your sword instead of actually talking to them.
skyknight1281 9 months ago
@skyknight1281 in question? how so? our rules clearly state that the person struc calls the blow. until the first guy was disarmed he didnt feel he was bested. once i disarmed him he stopped. the second guy was legged and ended up "3 points down" so i waited until he lifted his sword tip off the ground and struck him. 100% legal and by the rules. so please explain how my ethics are in question or whatever your charge is. especially since you dont know a thing about me.
dukelogan 9 months ago
@dukelogan I hope you had a few words with the last guy's knight. I don't think the first guy was squired, was he?
paleomike8 9 months ago
@paleomike8 the first guy was not and was new but was in the same remote area. talking with the knight would have been useless since he was the one, according to the 1st guy, who planted these ideas in their heads. dude was a transplant knight and spewed a bunch of "opinions" about a bunch of folks. the whole idea of embracing the culture when you move into a new kingdom somehow missed him i guess.
dukelogan 9 months ago
@Zargogo
Can and has.
If the sword wasn't a versatile weapon, it wouldn't had been a stable in any military.
But it was.
Those swords are weighed to be like an actual blade, and if the fighter feels like it, there's tape going down one side of the 'blade' and the other to signify what's the sharp part and what's not.
That's not regulation, but I've seen it done before. I HAVE Seen someone rip all the way through drywall fluidly with one of those. Getting hit with one is NOT fun.
roetemeteor 10 months ago
I heard of SCA from my AP Physics teacher (he's a massive nerd for it, talks about it all the time in class). What i want to know is: do I have to be 18 to take part in a full scale war (or even a skirmish or one v one). And to be autorized for fighting, do I have to be formally trained?
Sorewinner1994 11 months ago
@Sorewinner1994 short answer about the age is no. trained? yes. ive personally met thousands of new fighters from all kinds of backgrounds. none of them do well until they get some training. ours is a very unique sport. you can go to sca dot org and search for the "marshals handbook" to read the rules and check out scademo dot com for some helpful information.
dukelogan 11 months ago
@Sorewinner1994 i think the age is 16 and yes you do need to be "trained" its not just a game its dangerous when you don't know what your doing.
xMikeCCx 10 months ago
Seems like I'm coming in late as well, not sure how I missed this one. The Duke has absolutely nothing to defend himself against; he did nothing wrong. He followed the rules of the list. The Marshals did the correct thing by stopping the fight. As soon as they called a stop to the fight (not a hold notice) the Duke broke off his engagement. I think that fight would have pist anyone off, so the way Logan walked off the field, though he says himself was shitty, was completely understandable
Vargre 11 months ago
The Duke did nothing wrong. The second guy made a huge mistake by dropping his guard just because he got hit in the rear as he relied on the Dukes chivalry not to hit him. The Duke would have been in his right to continue engaging him even as the guy turned around. Yet he was good enough to let him get on his knees and make eye contact to finish the fight. Never take your eyes off your opponent. Especially a DUKE!
lostbooger 11 months ago
@lostbooger I never strike someone until they are ready to continue, honor demands no less. Make eye contact you say? That is utter crap. Just listen to the people in the background during the fight, that alone should give you a good hint on whats going on. This was just another case of a thug duke beating the crap out of new fighters.
skyknight1281 11 months ago
@skyknight1281 Respectfully, there were many fights going on at that time so you are only assuming the voices are referring to the fight on the video. In my kingdom all that is required to engage somebody is eye contact, which is more privledge then the unbelted fighter gave the Duke. In a tournament setting especially, you NEVER assume the opposing fighter is going to stop his assault because you have been legged or armed. Dropping your guard does not win tourneys.
lostbooger 11 months ago
@skyknight1281 so you play outside the rules of the list (which say nothing about waiting for someone until they are ready , even if they didnt afford you the same when they attacked from behind). ok, thats your way and thats fine. but to call someone a "thug" when they followed the rules shows a lack of character on your part. so be it. change the rules if you can. but please save yourself the foolish chatter when you expect everyone else to play the way you do. its unbecoming at best. feh.
dukelogan 11 months ago
The first guy has to take at least one of those...He was getting beat like a pinata.
tokabul 11 months ago
Well done to the gentleman in red. i wonder how new those fellows were or if they were truly ignoring shots? Either way a well delivered blow.
JWA8402 11 months ago
They got PWND!!!
zeronova77 11 months ago
Nearly four years since this video was first posted and the chivalrous Logan is still fighting with the posters trying to defend his actions. Well done Logan, teach these Rhino's to take proper shots. It's always good that we have kingdom peers to teach rookies proper honor and chivalry.
skyknight1281 11 months ago
the last shot is what finally ended the fight. we had eye contact and as soon as he lifted his sword off the ground i fired the head shot. so i dont understand why there would be a question. now the walking away part i admit was shitty on my part but i felt that if the had shot wasnt good i had nothing left for the fight. still, i should have waited a second to see if he called it instead of just walking off like that.
dukelogan 11 months ago
ya .. both of them should of went down long time ago ... but the last shot was really uncalled for .
delophonos 11 months ago
@delophonos uncalled for? im curious, why do you say that?
dukelogan 11 months ago
@dukelogan i understand the frustration that these guys are really not being sportsmen like , especially the first one , he got way to many hits and should of went down long time ago , the second guy i understand came from behind to try and help out his friend , and he as well dint go down wen he should off and wen the shoots came in ... this all said , that last shoot would not make up for their lack of sportsmanship or lack of respect , but lower you to their level . and the fight was over .
delophonos 11 months ago
Thank god for Dukes who take care of the jerks who won't call their shots. I doubt I would have gotten mad enough to take that last shot, that's just me. I'm just beginning and right now, the only way I have to deal with guys like that is to walk away and not fight them again. I look forward to the day when I have another honorable course of action besides walking away.
MidnightMaelstrom 1 year ago
In the case of people ignoring good hits - one of our guys has a saying - make sure the next hit makes him squeal. Thats what the Duke did and I find it acceptable.
shashaveli 1 year ago
Hmmm... obviously I came in late to see this (four years late to be precise) but upon my first viewing of this it seemed 'obviously' as though the Duke was merely having a bad day and sought to vent his frustrations upon these two hapless whelps. However, upon closer examination of just how many 'good' hits were placed by him, it seems justified. However I will admit that his final head strike to the second opponent was uncalled for.
Danthar 1 year ago