A threat to remove the regime, perhaps. A threat to defeat them militarily, maybe. But to obliterate a nation? And what if they call your bluff? Do you then obliterate a nation? Tit for tat? Should we gas six million Germans to teach Germany a lesson about the Holocaust?
It's thinking like this that got us where we are today in Iraq.
There's a huge difference between nuclear saber rattling and nuclear deterrence. Maybe eight years of Bush has blurred the distinction. True leaders don't rattle sabers. That's for folks like Saddam Hussein and John "Hussein" McCain. Hillary should know better, but she's walked away from her ideals in the quest for the uneducated white vote.
There's no difference between nuclear sabre rattling and nuclear deterrence.
It is no deterrence if people don't think you're insane enough to use them. Have a read through of the Cuban missile crisis and the collapse of the Soviet Union. The Russians and allies were so scared that the United States was insane and cowboy enough to actually follow through on threats that they had to back down.
Of course the cowboy act was a measured move to make it look like they were crazy.
What the world needs out of Iran is political change. Ask any Iranian student who opposes the mullahs, ask any Iranian human rights activist, ask any reasonable person in Israel, and they will tell you how much good it does for American leaders to speak glibly about nuking Iran. None at all. Iranian democrats have been pleading for years for us to stop doing this, for it only reinforces the position of our enemies there. Tough talk feels good but solves nothing.
My argument is tough talk/stances to work on occasion and I have named you 3 instances where tough talk did work or would have worked if used correctly.
We have been talking tough on Iran for some years now and last time I checked Iranian influence in the region had grown by leaps and bounds. Today it rivals Saudi Arabia's.
The only success we have had in the whole region in the last eight years is with Libya, which had just as many scary features as Iran. We did it by cutting out the rhetoric and offering a carrot. It worked. Today Libya is largely neutralized as a threat to our interests.
Yes great success with Libya. From what I can tell, the western powers have caved into all demands by Gaddafi to leave him alone in exchange for the free flow of oil.
Political, religious and economic freedom in Libya = 0.
Hardly the model that I'd personally be advocating.
strange how things turn out
inijjer1 10 months ago
I don't see what the big deal is. If Iran nuke Israel then do they expect people to send them flowers?
BTW I'm not American, nor Jewish, nor Israeli, nor Muslim.
inijjer 3 years ago
No. No big deal here. Just a few million smoking corpses.
papakilatube 3 years ago
You talking about the hypothetical Israeli corpses or the Iranian corpses ?
inijjer 3 years ago
both.
papakilatube 3 years ago
So a pre-emptive threat in order to deter the use of nuclear weapons should be fine then.
inijjer 3 years ago
A threat to remove the regime, perhaps. A threat to defeat them militarily, maybe. But to obliterate a nation? And what if they call your bluff? Do you then obliterate a nation? Tit for tat? Should we gas six million Germans to teach Germany a lesson about the Holocaust?
It's thinking like this that got us where we are today in Iraq.
Someone has to say "Stop".
papakilatube 3 years ago
Disagree, its thinking like that which kept the cold war, cold.
Without the threat of Mutual Assured Destruction, how many more people would have died post 1945.
inijjer 3 years ago
That's a novel analysis seeing as its appeasement that enabled the Germans to build up an army big enough to invade multiple countries.
inijjer 3 years ago
There's a huge difference between nuclear saber rattling and nuclear deterrence. Maybe eight years of Bush has blurred the distinction. True leaders don't rattle sabers. That's for folks like Saddam Hussein and John "Hussein" McCain. Hillary should know better, but she's walked away from her ideals in the quest for the uneducated white vote.
papakilatube 3 years ago
There's no difference between nuclear sabre rattling and nuclear deterrence.
It is no deterrence if people don't think you're insane enough to use them. Have a read through of the Cuban missile crisis and the collapse of the Soviet Union. The Russians and allies were so scared that the United States was insane and cowboy enough to actually follow through on threats that they had to back down.
Of course the cowboy act was a measured move to make it look like they were crazy.
inijjer 3 years ago
What the world needs out of Iran is political change. Ask any Iranian student who opposes the mullahs, ask any Iranian human rights activist, ask any reasonable person in Israel, and they will tell you how much good it does for American leaders to speak glibly about nuking Iran. None at all. Iranian democrats have been pleading for years for us to stop doing this, for it only reinforces the position of our enemies there. Tough talk feels good but solves nothing.
papakilatube 3 years ago
politics is the art of the possible.
My argument is tough talk/stances to work on occasion and I have named you 3 instances where tough talk did work or would have worked if used correctly.
inijjer 3 years ago
We have been talking tough on Iran for some years now and last time I checked Iranian influence in the region had grown by leaps and bounds. Today it rivals Saudi Arabia's.
The only success we have had in the whole region in the last eight years is with Libya, which had just as many scary features as Iran. We did it by cutting out the rhetoric and offering a carrot. It worked. Today Libya is largely neutralized as a threat to our interests.
So much for tough talk.
papakilatube 3 years ago
Yes great success with Libya. From what I can tell, the western powers have caved into all demands by Gaddafi to leave him alone in exchange for the free flow of oil.
Political, religious and economic freedom in Libya = 0.
Hardly the model that I'd personally be advocating.
inijjer 3 years ago
"Go fuck yourself with your atom bomb."
---Allen Ginsberg
papakilatube 3 years ago
"Let him who desires peace prepare for war."
--- Vegetius
inijjer 3 years ago
Speak carelessly and carry a big stick.
papakilatube 3 years ago
Was this George Bush speaking? In a feminine voice?
Archimetaus 3 years ago