People of the Valley - Part 81 - Iolo and Macs

[Knappa22]

Shit, is that awful woman his boss?

Headteachers are suppossed to be pastoral experts and able to deal with issues like this very sensitively!

[canadaguy666]

i love the welsh accent (when speaking english, i mean). so unique

[goebels99]

I love the female teacher. Lol. Talk about a LUSH!

[shinojosa8]

Coerced sex is rape. Just because someone is not physically beaten or held down does not mean they have not been raped. If one does not feel that they have the free will to consent that is a rape especially if one is talking about a minor. By your standards a child who is violated has not been raped simply because the adult has said things to them such as I will hurt your mommy if you tell anyone. A discussion of who deserves to be called victim is denegration of all rape victims.

[nenewtahiyyah]

what are you talking about "real rape" I didnt know there was any other kind of rape other than "real rape" we dont have to agree but please dont twist my words. in my opinion if you consent to having sex then its not rape. Izzy could have said no but she didnt say no she said yes. macs never gave his consent he was raped.

[randomthings5]

@nenewtahiyyah Let's just hope you don't have a 16 - 18 year old child who's teacher blackmails them into having sex with them then.

[PlatypusRising55]

@randomthings5 Age of consent in the UK is 16. Izzy was not underage when she was dating Macs.

Their relationship was against the rules but it was consentual. They were a couple, then they broke up. Despite what her mother FEELS, Izzy sleeping with Macs to save Jinx has nothing to do with age. It has to do with poor choices.  IMO both Izzy and Macs failed that test.

Further, If Izzy was too young for Macs, she wasalso too young for Jinx.

The issue is that Izzy wasn't raped. Macs was raped.

[frankduke2]

isnt blackmailing someone for sex u know blackmail and not considered rape

[randomthings5]

"It's frightening how many people reveal in argument they think only dragging a stranger off the street & pinning her down is 'real' rape"

[PlatypusRising55]

@randomthings5 I don't think anyone is saying that. At least, I haven't seen anyone say that. I think people are saying that there is a difference between being forced to do something against your will and making a choice to do something.

Izzy made a bad choice to sleep with Macs to keep Jinx out of jail. But she HAD the opportunity to say "no". Her life was not in danger nor was she worried about being beaten or physically harmed.

Izzy should have walked away and told Macs to go to hell.

[nenewtahiyyah]

scott took what he wanted he didnt ask shit he druged beat and raped macs you really cant see the difference between the 2. Im not talking about the difference in serverity Im saying these are 2 completely different things there is no grey area when dealling in facts

[nenewtahiyyah]

@Imogen 1885 yes it is still a deal a bargain a choice. Izzy had the right to say no and she was given a choice to say no but she didnt I undetstand she didnt want her boyfriend to go to jail but he is a grown ass man and just like her he is responsible for his own actions. Izzy had to pick the lesser of 2 evils. Hard choice to make an unfair thing to ask of anyone but at least she was asked Macs wasnt given that much.

[reieto]

I'd like to congratulate the actor that plays Macs - what an incredible believable confession you gave the character. Excellent work.

[skyemcleod1]

I appreciate this SL-it's interesting. I do not know that much about Izzy,except that the lady rubbed her so-called rape into Macs face,right after he took a risk & trusted her-therefore kicking him when he was down. NOT cool. Gr8 acting,btw.

-Sorry,but I am I the only one here who finds these lengthy, hurtful arguments about Izzy depressing?! Plez.,fellow Iolo-ites, can you give it a rest?...

[DMR2006]

Is the character of Izzy even ON the soap right now? This storyline is about Macs not being able to cope during the aftermath of him being raped by Scott. It's about him NOT about Izzy.

[crazychildruns]

It looks like this storyline might begin to speed up a bit :)

[juicyj725]

@AvacadoPear I looked back at my posts and I think that I was clearly arguing about terminology. Maybe I miss-communicated some things and maybe you misunderstood some things. However, I am curious; If you did not think I was debating u about the use of the word rape as terminology for Izzy's ordeal, what DID you think I was debating about?

[AvocadoPear]

@juicyj725 You said, "If Izzy was smart she would have told him... All I am saying is that she was not forced because I can see a million other ways for her to get out of it and sex is the last on the list. She was just weak. She should have fought back." as well as, "Have sex with me or ur bf goes to jail. For anyone to fall for that is just ridiculous unless the backmailer is a cop. She could have said NO and let the bf fight his own battle." I fail to see how these are issues of terminology.

[juicyj725]

@AvocadoPear I was saying that she was not raped because her choices were not taken from her. I was trying to demonstrate that she had other options. I was just using her situation to reiterate my point. That was my example to show you why I thought her situation was different from that of someone who is drugged or physically forced into have sex and thus should not be called rape.

[AvocadoPear]

@juicyj725 Somewhere along the lines, the argument did shift into a discussion more about terminology (I do remember talking about my definition of rape - ie, "enthusiastic consent" as well as the varying legal definitions of rape) but I don't feel like your arguments were always appropriate rebuttals in a discussion about word usage.

[juicyj725]

@AvocadoPear Maybe some of my rebuttals were a bit over-the-top, but I still thought they were valid.

[juicyj725]

@AvocadoPear Its kind of like reading to kids(no offense to you). First, you read the passage and then you turn the book around to show them the pictures. I was just trying to paint a picture for you.

[AvocadoPear]

@juicyj725 Well if that's the metaphor you're going to use, then I think that you forgot to "read the passage" before showing the very graphic pictures. Or maybe you read the passage in a foreign language or slurred your words.

[juicyj725]

@AvocadoPear LOL, I think you were only interested in the pictures so you didn't pay attention to the captions.

[AvocadoPear]

@juicyj725 Look, I think that somewhere along the lines this whole discussion twisted into something that it shouldn't have. If you do want to continue the argument focusing solely on matters of terminology regarding sex crimes, refer back to my own "enthusiastic consent" definition of rape as well as the thought I posted on the varying legal definitions of what was done to Izzy and respond to those. If you don't want to continue this, then goodnight.

[AvocadoPear]

@juicyj725 In these instances, you were very clearly attacking, not the use of the word "rape," but Izzy's strength and choices. I even said at one point, "you don't have to call it rape if you don't want to, but it still makes no sense to me to blame her for what happened," in response to statements like the ones I just posted and yet you continued to argue with that.

[juicyj725]

@AvocadoPear I also clearly said at one point that I was not blaming her. Saying that she could have done things differently is not the same thing as blaming her. I never said it was her fault. I was not watching at the time so I would never "attack" her choices. I was just trying to tell you why I thought what I thought and I believed you would view my comments only in the context of our conversation.

[AvocadoPear]

@juicyj725 I still think that, with some of the statements you made, you did blame her even if that was not your intention, but even if you disagree with that assessment, you can't deny that you did judge her.

[juicyj725]

@AvocadoPear I want to be really clear. I do believe the girl to be a victim of sexual assualt. I don't believe that calling what happened to her something other than rape minimizes what happened. I am just saying that You cant just lump all instances of sexual assault under the category of rape. IMO, rape is not an umbrella term for all sexually motivated crime.

[AvocadoPear]

@juicyj725 lol. Look at you contradicting yourself. Now you're trying to make it seem like all along, our disagreement was merely a question of differing terminology and that you weren't trying to minimize what happened to her when ALL ALONG you were saying that she should have been stronger and walked away or that she wasn't smart enough to come up with another way out. The fact that you're going back on all of this now is just laughable.

[juicyj725]

@AvocadoPear I am sorry if I got carried away, but my problem was with the terminology. I was simply using her situation make my point more clearly which I obviously failed at. I certainly can't speak to what someone in her situation should do. I was just showing you her situation through my eyes. What I see as a weakness someone else may see as a strength. I stand by my statements but they were only my opinions.

[AvocadoPear]

@juicyj725 Also, terminology always gets tricky in regards to sexual offenses. If we're talking about legal definitions, what Macs did to Izzy may be considered "rape" in some states or countries while in others it might be "sexual assault" or some lesser charge like blackmail or unlawful coercion. Feel free to use a word other than rape to describe what happened, but don't try to pretend like this was your whole argument all along.

[corvus13]

Jeez, Gaynor, just walk in the front door, why don't you?

i was SO worried Ffion was going to drive those kids drunk.



[cyryac]

what a stupid woman

[seanandnaim]

omg there is such bullshit arguments here. Rape is defined as unwilling sexual acts. everyone want to make it ok for the dude because he is good looking, that alone does not make someone special, now his brother, yeah

[juicyj725]

@seanandnaim The argument is not about the definition of rape, it is about whether blackmail falls under the category of rape. The word you used is "unwilling." I completely agree with you. However, I don't believe that succumbing to blackmail and being forced are the same thing. If you have sex with someone to protect someone else (who is not a child), you are no longer "unwilling." It is completely in the realm of reason to let another adult fight their own battle.

[ETSINTERIORS]

@juicyj725 You are a very hard person. Do you care at all for anyone in your life? Because someone is an adult does not mean you should abandon them.

[juicyj725]

@ETSINTERIORS You are right; you should not abandon them. However, you should let them fight their own battles and let them decide what kind of help they need from you. Saying no to a blackmailer is not abandonment.

[AvocadoPear]

I can't believe this is actually being debated. COERCED SEX IS RAPE. I can't say it any clearer than that. When you're in a situation where someone is taking advantage of you and trying to hurt someone you love, you'll often feel like there IS no other option than to do what is demanded of you. Ultimately, what Macs went through was probably more scarring, but you don't need to detract from Izzy's experiences or judge her for her choices in order to show that.

Gaynor responded HORRIBLY though.

[juicyj725]

@AvocadoPear I disagree. All coerced sex is not rape. If a boy says to a girl that he will leave her if she doesn't sleep with him and she does it because she feels like there " no other option," do you call that rape too. I think blackmail is the same thing. There WAS another option...let the guy go to jail. It would be different if he threatened to kill the guy. I can agree that coerced sex can be rape but only in life and death situations.

[AvocadoPear]

@juicyj725 yes, actually, I would call that rape. lol

I think forcing someone to choose one shitty outcome over another is the same as forcing a single awful act on them...if that makes sense.

[juicyj725]

@AvocadoPear Wow! Really? I understand what u r saying but it doesnt make sense. It does really depend on the two shitty outcomes. Have sex with me or ur bf goes to jail. For anyone to fall for that is just ridiculous unless the backmailer is a cop. She could have said NO and let the bf fight his own battle. She was extorted not raped. Unless the fuzz(cops) was standing on the other side of the door waiting for her bf, she had plenty of time to make something else happen.

[AvocadoPear]

@juicyj725 You see, people get caught up in these situations all the time and then they hear the comments that they should have been smart enough or strong enough to change the outcome and fall even deeper into the horror of the aftermath. I feel like in this situation, words really matter. I think that by calling situations of sexual "extortion" or coercion "rape" you can empower the victims to come forward by letting them know that the crime wasn't their fault for being too stupid and weak.

[juicyj725]

@AvocadoPear And yes, she may not have wanted to feel guilt and self-blame,but those feelings would be premature. Macs would have to follow through with the threat before she would feel that way. She would have time to warn the bf and get him out of town or something else. I also have to say that although Macs is clearly the villain, some of the blame for what happened to her lies with the boyfriend. Where was he? Would you let your partner sleep with someone to keep you out of jail?

[juicyj725]

@AvocadoPear Teaching is probably one of the worst professions to be in if you are going to blackmail someone. If Izzy was smart she would have told him that if he tried anything she might have to start a little rumor that a certain blackmailing teacher likes to fondle little children. All I am saying is that she was not forced because I can see a million other ways for her to get out of it and sex is the last on the list. She was just weak. She should have fought back.

[AvocadoPear]

@juicyj725 Look, you don't have to call it rape if you don't want to, but it still makes no sense to me to blame her for what happened. You just called Izzy not very smart and "weak" and for what? Being caught up in the moment and not seeing a way out? In hindsight, she probably would've thought of all of the million other options that you speak of. All of that comes to you with the guilt and self-blame and makes the whole thing feel that much worse.

[juicyj725]

@AvocadoPear You are absolutely right. I completely get that she felt that way and I can see how she felt that way. My problem is that u cant use any of those things as an excuse to call it something it is not. By calling those situations rape, you may empower the victims, but then you end up equating what happened to her with "real" rape. I dont think that someone who was held down or drugged would think her situation was the same. Those people have no power to walk away.

[AvocadoPear]

@juicyj725 You see this in such black and white terms, don't you? As if there's being able to walk away and not being able to and no middle ground. As if when faced with situations where someone's clear intent is to bring himself pleasure without regard for your suffering, you could so easily think through your other options. It's not that simple!

[juicyj725]

@AvocadoPear If i saw this in black and white terms, then i would say that it is rape. Also, I do think that there is middle ground, I just don't think that Izzy's case falls into that category. And I do understand that one may not be able to easily think through a situation like that. You keep telling me that it is not that simple and I completely agree. I think that calling it rape oversimplifies it. Calling it rape discounts so many other factors.

[AvocadoPear]

@juicyj725 To me, for something to be considered "sex," it requires that both participants give "enthusiastic consent." I would define enthusiastic consent as each person being willing and able (not drunk, drugged, underage, asleep, etc.) to say yes to sex without reservations. It requires that the participants do not feel threatened or coerced by the situation. Anything else is rape.

I'm sorry if that seems like a black and white definition of rape to you, but it also happens to be logical.

[AvocadoPear]

@juicyj725 Also, if you completely agree that it isn't that simple, WHY do you keep making general statements about being able to walk away and not being able to walk away or being able to fight back and not being able to fight back? You've said these things to every person here who has argued with you and now you're trying to agree that it isn't that simple? That's ridiculous.

[PlatypusRising55]

@AvocadoPear I have a problem with women who let men manipulate them. It's the oldest trick in the book. "Sleep with me and I won't do ex or I will do ex". Please!. Why should Izzy have sex with someone she doesn't want just so Jinx didn't go to jail for something he ACTUALLY did?

Yes, people freak out in the moment. But Macs wasn't threatening to kill her or Jinx, he was basically being an asshole wanting to get back at someone who broke up with him.

All 3 of them were idiots, IMO.

[AvocadoPear]

@juicyj725 and do you really want to know what (using your own general term) victims of "real" rape (which is an absolute bullshit qualifier to begin with) feel about calling these situations rape? From what I've seen, survivors of any form of sexual trauma don't want anyone to go through the pain and suffering that they have. Victims of "real" rape understand that any form of sexual assault can bring about the same horrors for the victim, and don't judge situations in b&w terms like you seem to

[juicyj725]

@AvocadoPear I was not trying to be offensive when I said "real" rape, I was just trying to distinguish between our viewpoints. Also, I did not say that victims of sexual trauma don't empathize with one another, I said that I don't think they would equate the situations. I am also not underestimating the effects of the traumas, but it is entirely possible for two different situations to have similar ramifications on their respective victims.

[AvocadoPear]

@juicyj725 yes, they would understand that sexual trauma can have similar ramifications, so in most cases, they wouldn't try to tell another victim of sexual assault that they "weren't *really* raped" like you're implying they would.

[juicyj725]

@AvocadoPear Whoa whoa whoa! I certainly was not implying anything of the sort. I was just saying that they probably would not equate the situations, and thats what calling izzy a rape victim does. I really dont think you understand what I am saying. I don't mean to minimize what happened to her, its just that I believe that saying she was raped minimizes what someone in a situation like macs went through.

[AvocadoPear]

@juicyj725 And I'M saying that even if that is YOUR opinion of the situation, you are in no place to generalize what most (or any) rape victims might feel about it. Don't say that you think a rape victim would be offended by using the word rape to describe what Izzy went through, when really that is YOUR opinion and no one else's that you know of.

[juicyj725]

AvocadoPear When I tell you what I think, I believed that there was an implication that it is just my opinion and not a generalization. Please don't put words into my mouth; I never said they would be offended by usind the word rape to describe izzys situation, I just said that I though they would not equate the two situations which is to say that they would not agree with the terminology. Saying that they would not equate the situations is not the same thing as saying they would be offended.

[AvocadoPear]

@juicyj725 And to be clear, I don't think that you are in a place to have an "opinion" about what SOMEONE ELSE might feel about the terminology. You *were* stating your opinion but using the idea of a generic rape victim to try to back it up. You could have said, "personally, I wouldn't equate the two offenses" without saying, "personally, I think that these people wouldn't equate the two offenses." THAT is generalizing.

[juicyj725]

@AvocadoPear I don't think you are in a place to tell me what I should or should not have an opinion about. I can have an opinion about anything I want; even about what someone else might feel. I both of those statements ARE my opinions. I just though our conversation was a safe place to speak without being judged.

[AvocadoPear]

@juicyj725 YOU CAN'T HAVE AN OPINION ABOUT WHAT SOME OTHER FICTITIOUS PERSON'S FEELINGS ABOUT A SITUATION ARE. Inventing a group of people (a "some people say..." group) and projecting your own opinion onto that general group is NOT having an opinion, it's trying to use a "type" of person whose thoughts and emotions you've created to make your argument seem more valid.

[juicyj725]

@AvocadoPear And yes, the last statement was a generalization but that is my opinion based on my knowledge and experience. As I gain more knowledge and experience in life, I will adjust my opinions accordingly.

[seanandnaim]

@AvocadoPear the response is appropriate, if and when you have children you will see and realize that you had no idea how much you can love a person, so i think she responded just as a parent would

[AvocadoPear]

@seanandnaim while the response may have been understandable, I wouldn't call it an "appropriate" thing to say to someone who has just revealed a very personal traumatic experience to you. I'll accept that in the moment, she felt it needed to be said, but it also seems like she instantly regretted it because she realized that it was the wrong response at that time.

[WelshHelen1]

To me, Macs did rape Izzy. It may not have been the "stereotypical" violent rape but she was told, "Sleep with me or I'll make sure that your boyfriend goes to jail." What would your reaction have been faced with this dilemma? Maybe 'officially' it's sexual cohersion but I'm pretty sure that Izzy used the word rape, so that's what she felt. Very surprised that Macs would tell the girl's mother about his rape!

[jspccz]

@WelshHelen1 Gaynor is Izzy's mother?Was anything done to Macs or they couldn't prove it was rape so therefore he kept his job,or like Macs she felt ashamed and thought it was her fault and didn't want to prosecute.

[WelshHelen1]

@jspccz Yes, Gaynor is Izzy's mother which is why Macs confiding in her is so surprising. From memory, nothing was done at the time because Gaynor didn't believe that Izzy had been attacked and Izzy would have thought that no-one else would believe her either. It took a long time for Gaynor to come round and by then it was too late. Gaynor did tell Sion, who told Iolo and for a long time Iolo wouldn't speak to Macs so he obviously believed that what M had done was serious.

[jspccz]

@WelshHelen1 than you for the info.wow didn't believe her own daughter.this is quite an interesting program.

[nenewtahiyyah]

macs was an ass for what he did to izzy but he let her know what he wanted he gave her a chance to walk away she chose not to. Scott didnt let macs know what he really wanted he tricked him into having a drink that was druged then he beat and raped him macs was never given a chance to walk away. two bad things took place but they are not the same when you factor in free will. apples and stawberrys are both red fruits but apples are apples and strawberrys are strawberrys.

[PlatypusRising55]

@nenewtahiyyah TOTALLY.

[Raggedy9]

I didn't see the episodes involving Izzy, so I can't comment on her situation. But I worry that Macs will attempt suicide.

[superxx57]

Macs was in a position of power over Izzy, and if she thought for a second that there weren't going to be consequences for refusing, she would've never gone through with it. When anyone abuses their power to force sex on someone, it's no different than rape in my eyes. Sexual abuse is sexual abuse. Macs has done some pretty bad things to other people, and now he knows what it feels like to be a victim. Do I have sympathy for him? Yes. Do I expect others to have sympathy for him? Absolutely not.

[PlatypusRising55]

@superxx57 The consequence was Macs telling the police that Jinx attacked him (which was true). That's not power over Izzy. That's power over Jinx (Jinx put himself into that situation)

Izzy had free will, wasn't under a spell, wasn't in physical danger. She wasn't drugged and Macs didn't threaten to kill Jinx. So how did Macs have power over her? Izzy was grown enough to date grown men, then she was grown enough to make her own decisions.

Macs is no saint but he didn't DESERVE this.

[superxx57]

@PlatypusRising55 No one deserves to be raped, just like no one deserves to be blackmailed. Say what you want, what Macs did was wrong period. Writing an essay to everyone saying that Izzy had a choice isn't going to change that in the slightest. My point in writing what I wrote is that after victimizing others, Mac now knows what feels like to be a victim, whether he deserved this or not. I hope he comes out a better person than he was before the incident, and seeks redemption for his actions.

[PlatypusRising55]

@superxx57 1) The point of the thread is to make comments about the show. Why should it matter to you what I say to anyone else or how much I say? 2) I completely believe that blackmail is wrong. I think Macs is a manipulative jerk. Which I've said, repeatedly. 3) My point has to do with language and how it has meaning and not wanting to see something like "rape" get used so easily. 4) Everyone involved has been a victim and done some victimizing. That's how soaps are. No one is innocent.

[superxx57]

@PlatypusRising55 It doesn't matter to me, I was just informing you that being repetitive about Izzy being at fault doesn't change what Macs did. In my eyes, rape and coerced sex are equally wrong. Maybe if Macs didn't do such terrible things to other people, none of this would've happened to him. Hopefully, things will change after this.

[debrmck]

@superxx57 With that type of logic only good people deserve not to be raped. Rape is not a tool to punish bad deeds.

[superxx57]

@debrmck Did I ever say that it was? I specifically stated earlier that no one deserves to be raped. However, I also believe that if you do wrong to others, it's going to come back and bite you in the ass 10x harder.

[Elaiyel]

@debrmck "Rape is not a tool to punish bad deeds." Tell that to men in prison.

[isoron]

No it's not. Otherwise you could blackmail someone into murder and they would have no moral onus. Blackmail is in the eyes of the beholder. Ad it denigrates what rape is. Macs was really raped!

[TinyBeauregard]

In many places, blackmail for sex is seen as unlawful coercion and is therefore considered rape. Some are upset with the way Gaynor handled the situation because Macs was "really" raped, while Izzy was "just" blackmailed into having sex she didn't want. The fact is both characters were victims of sexual abuse, and both deserved to be treated with respect in their times of need. In other words, Gaynor acted inappropriately, but that Macs was raped doesn't make his crime any less abhorrent.

[PlatypusRising55]

@TinyBeauregard Izzy had a choice. Macs did not. THAT is the difference. "Sexual abuse" implies that the victim had no choice. If you kill someone because someone threaten to tell the police that your boyfriend hit them, you are going to jail.

Izzy put her desire NOT to see Jinx go to jail above her desire NOT to sleep with Macs. IMO, stupid choice but hers to make.

People throw phrases like "rape" and "sexual abuse" around too easily.

Macs was drugged, incapacitated, beaten and raped.

[Too2ManyLuvas]

I don't know the circumstances fully, but what he did to the student could be considered rape (legally) in some places, although maybe not in Wales. If she was underage and him being an adult, it could be statutory rape. Duress can also lead to it being considered a rape, blackmail is duress, also an abuse of power him abusing his power position (teacher) is considered rape...in some areas.

[Imogen1885]

Blackmailing someone into having sex IS rhe same as rape.

[juicyj725]

@Imogen1885 I don't think it is the same thing. People who are being blackmailed always have the option of letting secrets come into the light and accepting what consequences may come with that. Blackmail is not force.

[Imogen1885]

@juicyj725 If blackmail is not force, I don't know what else to call it.

[juicyj725]

@Imogen1885 The very definition of "blackmail" is the antithesis of "force." With blackmail you either choose one of the options the blackmailer gives you or you do nothing and let the chips fall where they may. In a "force" situation there are no choices or options. There are no outs. In blackmail there are many options, they just may not be the ones you want. With force, there is absolutely no choice involved. No one forces me to pay my light bill; I could just live without electricity.

[juicyj725]

Once you give in to blackmail, you are making a conscious choice. You are AGREEING to abide by the terms set forth by the blackmailer. You then become a WILLING participant. You can always tell a blackmailer no, but telling a rapist no wont have the same effect..

[juicyj725]

@Imogen1885 I do realize that there are some situations where blackmail is tantamount to force. I absolutely believe that when someones life is in direct danger or when the safety of children is at stake, then yes it IS force. However, Izzy's situation was neither one of those things. Macs cant just send someone to jail, he can only possibly get someone arrested. The person would get bail and await trial if there is even sufficient evidence to sustain the charge.

[budd2nd]

@Imogen1885 It's not the same because it's a bargain. " you let me do **** and I'll do **** in return" Izzy could have said "No" . It's really horrible but she agreed to a type of deal.

[Imogen1885]

@budd2nd What if someone threatened to kill your child if you did not do something, so you agreed to do it. Is it still just a deal?

[yerdyang]

@Imogen1885 Haha! I just had to comment cause your rebuttal made me ROFL. Wow, you chose the MOST extreme example to illustrate your point. Next thing we know, you'll be comparing things to Hitler. Killing a child and a boyfriend going to jail are two completely different scenarios with two completely different consequences. But thanks for the laugh. Good times, good times.

[Imogen1885]

@yerdyang No probs.

[frankduke2]

wow gaynor thats marvelous someone seeks help from u and u reply with wounds u know i give u an A for Failure!!!

[ludwinlunatics]

I can't believe Macs told that lady about being raped i really thought he was going to tell lolo first.Macs talking about it telling her how he felt about it .It broke my heart.But then she throws in his face thats how Izzy felt when he raped her.So reading the comments he didn't rape her.So she is the wrong she should get her info straight.What Macs did to Izzy was wrong but he didn't rape her.Macs needs counseling or to talk to lolo.The actor is doing such a good job.

[jspccz]

How did Gaynor and Ffion find out Macs blackmailed and had sex with Izzy?Gaynor is really ripping into Macs about refusing to go to Cardiff ready to call the chairman of the governors so was there a coverup about it?Having sex with a student seems a lot worse that saying I can't go pickup the students.I hope Macs calls someone from those pamphlets.To answer the question did he tell right one no if he wanted sympathy and yes if he wanted to be judged and get a reality check by a cold hard person.

[lhola29]

that woman is an idiot, macs should talk to his brother, he needs professional help, he has ptsd

[pripropra1]

How old was Izzy then?

[anthonydlangford]

I agree Macs didn't rape Izzy. Yes, he blackmailed her into having sex with him, but it wasn't rape. Gaynor just refuses to see it how it really happened. She's also a very mean-spirited and cold woman. If you saw her in her own storyline, you'd understand her better.

[ShanetheConquerer]

@anthonydlangford She was forced into sex against her will. How is that not rape?

[anthonydlangford]

@ShanetheConquerer Because she had the power to say 'no' and walk away. She chose to have sex with Macs to spare her boyfriend from going to jail. Granted what Macs did was sleazy, but rape? Not to me.

[dcsmerf12]

@anthonydlangford I agree with Anthony, she gave in to blackmail. She was not forced, she consented to the agreement, no matter how sleazy it actually was.

[PlatypusRising55]

@ShanetheConquerer It wasn't against her will. She had free will and she wasn't forced. That is why it wasn't rape. Izzy could have told Macs to kiss her ass and refused to play his game. She could have called his bluff. If Macs told on Jinx and Jinx wound up in jail, that's on Jinx because if you are on probation and you KNOW your ass might go to jail if you get into a physical fight, you don't put yourself in a situation where you'd bee provoked. Izzy could have said "Hell no". End of.

[str8outdaswamp]

Macs has problems with Iolo being gay. The last thing he wants to talk to Iolo about is being savagely sodomized.

[anthonydlangford]

@str8outdaswamp Actually Macs doesn't have a problem with Iolo being gay. It hasn't been an issue between them and they went to gay bars often quite often as was recently discussed. I think Iolo being gay adds an extra layer of difficulty for Macs, but Macs is not homophobic, which is why Iolo finds his recent comments so troubling.

[PlatypusRising55]

Izzy made a choice. She gave consent. Macs DID NOT have a choice and he did not give consent to sexual activity with Scott. I don't understand why folks can't see the VAST difference between these 2 situations.

What Macs asked of Izzy was gross and inappropriate but he didn't rape her. He didn't force her to sleep with him. She slept with him to protect Jinx. She could have said "No". She had free will. She bargained with Macs. That is NOT the same as being drugged, beaten and forcibly raped.

[PlatypusRising55]

@PlatypusRising55 Macs is not a rapist and this is not "justice" or "karma". It's sexist to act like Izzy had no power in that situation. Jinx attacked Macs (Macs provoked him but still he took the bait) and Izzy wanted to keep Jinx out of jail. What Macs asked of Izzy was wrong but calling it "rape" is gratuitous and undermines actual rape. Izzy was compelled, not forced. Her life wasn't at stake. She wasn't threatened with violence. She could have said no and let Jinx face his fate.

[ShanetheConquerer]

@PlatypusRising55 You could say she had a choice, and that's true. It's also true that Mac had the choice to not drink with Scott after he had humiliated him repeatedly. He had the choice to kick Scott out of the house earlier than he did. He had the choice not to be alone with him. He had the choice not to sleep with Scott's girlfriend. There is no difference between Scott and Macs.

[radcliffegurl1993]

@ShanetheConquerer if macswas not drugged, he would not have let scott to that do him. but the student that macs slept with was not drugged, was not drunk, and made the choice to sleep with macs. macs did not have a choice. if u truly do not see the difference between these two situations, then i truly feel sorry for you :/

[PlatypusRising55]

@ShanetheConquerer Scott cheated on his beloved girlfriend when she was in JAIL and asked Macs to lie about it so I have no sympathy for Scott where his "love life" is concerned.

There is a BIG difference between Scott and Macs when it comes to Macs being raped.

Macs was drugged, incapacitated, beaten and raped. He didn't choose any of that. He didn't consent. Macs didn't make a deal with Scott to "save" anyone. Macs didn't willing have sex with Scott, he was unconscious. HUGE difference.

[Iclabon72]

Wow. The administrator's Izzy comment was a slap in the face for him and me. Was it really called for? I guess that's up to personal opinion.

Of course it's going to come out, and I have no idea how it's going to be resolved. What do most rape victims need to overcone the trauma? That initial anger and irritability with others that represents their dominance and resistance to being victimized, and then just time? I need him to ask himself if has any thoughts as to how he could deal.

[OmniaVincit414]

As a school administrator, or whatever she is, shouldn't she had some instruction on the proper way to deal with situations like this? Like to avoid victim blaming and being generally unhelpful. Maybe someone who actually cares about Macs' well-being will find those leaflets and put two and two together? She did leave them didn't she?

[anthonydlangford]

@OmniaVincit414 My guess is the pamphlets will be found and I suspect Iolo will be the one to find them.

[anthonydlangford]

It's far too soon for Macs to be telling anyone he's close to the truth. I think it's going to get much, much worse before it gets better.

[agcorona]

Is this in Wales?

[dipsyhappy]

@agcorona yes

[sanyrub]

Oh Macs why??? I was so sure he was going to tell Iolo first

[xunoticedxtearsx]

Why would Macs feel more comfortable telling that woman about his assault than Iolo?

[PABWECG]

@xunoticedxtearsx

If he feels ashamed and is blaming himself, which he obviously he is, it's always easier to tell someone who isn't as close to you. He probably would be more afraid of Iolo's opinion of him changing.

[SIRinLTHR]

@xunoticedxtearsx Also, she threatened to call the school administrators. And talking one man about getting butt-raped by another man can't be all that easy, even if that guy is your gay brother. He just broke down under various pressures. He is very fragile and needs hugs.

[16emmi]

@SIRinLTHR butt raped? seriously! I know its a just a tv show. You sound like a person who has no concern for rape victims. i hope you here me clearly! no means no. Sounds like you got some issues with male on male rape and gays, you might want to get some help before you commit a hate crime and end up in prison on the receiving end of a butt rape. wow .

[DMR2006]

BRAVO!!!