Charlie Parker & Dizzie Gillespie play Hothouse after being insulted on TV

[halcyonacoustic]

It's one thing to say "You boys got anything else to say?" and it's another to say "Get of my property, boy." I mean, they're giving out awards from Downbeat Magazine. You know, that publication that to this day champions Jazz as America's art form?

[SoulDaddy33]

It must feel so gratifying to play the victim role, right?

If Diz and Bird were white and the MC called them BOYS would that have been an issue? Should he have said, "Do you MEN got anything else to say?" Of course not. I remember my father referring to his friends as boys ... guess what - they were white. Oh, the horror!

What I would say is ingrained is the automatic assumption of racism. Vilify, vilify, vilify.

[DrumzzKool]

Did you hear that pompous, entitled, little no class moron? You BOYS got anything more to say???!! Who in hell did that goofball think he was talkin to? Parker reply was beautiful though...lettin the music speak for itself.

[HouseofFlipFlop]

Who's the piano player?

[pindaric]

Who remembers Earl now? Dizzie and Bird always.

[beastraeatsall]

"Well, Earl, they say music speaks louder than words, so we'd rather voice our opinion that way, if you don't mind"

[tesdnzakzp]

other than you boys I can't see nothing else. I will say this reminds of you the better times in music in America, this crap they call music now days sucks.

[postatility]

When Earl Wilson says "You boys got anything to say?" toward the end of the presentation,I keep thinking they've been pulled over by the sheriff.

[AcucarFM3]

Charlie & Dizzie dont even care for the son of bitch ~ Play on Brothers ~ the music speaks for itself !!!

[SoulDaddy33]

More importantly (ignoring the silly concerns over common terms used very probably without malice), who were the sidemen?

[DrumzzKool]

@SoulDaddy33. Without malice? Racism is so ingrained...it's part of the thin, see thru fabric of the good 'ol u.s.of a.

[aWinkler2010]

God that drummer grooves so hard and has so much fun doing it. Bliss

[NinjaSkitch]

For all the commenters who aren't aware of this, "boy" is an older insult used to refer to black men. It's been around since slavery, where black men were never referred to as "men" so as to deny them respect and acceptance as real men. Charlie and Dizzy were 31 and 33 respectively at the time of this video, so he certainly wasn't calling them "boys" because they were young, he was being rude.

[ajpthree]

@NinjaSkitch yeah & I'm not even sure he's intentionally being rude to them either (I've watched this performance many many times), I think it was almost unconscious for white men to say that in those days. not saying it wasn't rude, but just that unconscious learned racism (that "boy" shit dates back to the 17th/18th century, I'm sure)

[renatomoya]

dos grandes!

[ladesneffous]

i do like it thank a lot

[SuperStuey2]

What insults? ///your a moron...now THAT's an insult....lol....good posting..thanks

[ajpthree]

@SuperStuey2 see the above comments, the host definitely insulted them (it's not obvious to us since to our modern ears it's very subtle)

[facethefaceandmore44]

I didn't see any insults being traded there, on the contrary he seemed to be demonstrating great respect. It seemed to me he was being friendly using 'you boys'.

[ajpthree]

@facethefaceandmore44 none traded, for sure, but definitely heard/recorded. the host called them "boys", which was an insult at the time, & consequently why beboppers started calling each other "man" as part of their slang. when Bird says "we'll let the music speak for us" he's basically saying "I'd like to kill you, but we'll play this burnin' contra fact of a popular tune & hopefully you'll realize how pissed off we are at the white establishment & the powers that be"

[itsallrigid]

should he have called them girls ?

youre an asshole

[MrClayshaw]

maybe Dizzy would have been insulted to see that you spelled his nickname wrong.

[trostbob]

You boys?

[mattdd05]

@trostbob He does call them "you boys", but he also call them men, (Charlie a sax Man, and Dizzy a trumpet man). He also calls them fellas. I just assumed he was calling them boys because they are younger than him, but maybe I'm being naive.

[ajpthree]

@mattdd05 yeah I think those awards were actually called "___ man" - the host was probably doing ok until he said "you boys," & you can tell he is a bit jittery/nervous; but from what Bird says you can tell he wasn't too thrilled about being called "boy" on television

[ajpthree]

@trostbob yep, nailed it. that's the main insult right there.

[MrParangaricutirimi]

Mr. Parker..and Mr. gillespie... please share with us your great talent please.!!... that way is okay...XD ..

[achiappa]

How did they get insulted?

[youngchardin]

@achiappa Right before this video starts the host was asking how to greet them: with some special handshake, and what do you call them Diz or Dizzy; he also broke into a facial twitch when he actually had to shake their hands. Not nearly as bad as other insults they endured, like being physically attacked after a show, or neglecting Bird his just due till long after he was dead. But the little insults add up, especially when they come in between the big ones. Still, they got to play music on tv.

[ajpthree]

@youngchardin hey where did you hear about what happened before the video starts? I think I've heard that somewhere before, but I don't recall right now... thanks!

[triofdoom]

@achiappa

it's the way white men talk to black men, he called them boys, when they are legends.

[KevTheYoungMusicGeru]

@achiappa they definitely insulted bird, they gave him an award just for best sax player of the year and gave diz an award for one of the best ever (which he was.) Charlie Parker more than deserved a better award, he was one of the best sax players ever and he was very influential.

[ajpthree]

@KevTheYoungMusicGeru those awards were determined by the readers of Downbeat Magazine, not the host of this program, so there's no way either of them would have been insulted about that. although I completely agree with you about Bird deserving a similar award as DG, the fact is that Bird was still not very well known (even by '51) & Dizzy was a bandleader who had more notoriety by that time

[lkb3rd]

@achiappa

I believe it's the awkward part where he says to "Diz" he is "one of the best" or something while Charlie Parker seems to glare at him.

[ajpthree]

@lkb3rd yeah I think that glare is kind of Bird just thinking the guy is a major tool. the definite rudeness is when the host called them "boys"

[ajpthree]

@achiappa the reason people say "man" nowadays is because the bebop generation created that slang - the host called them "boys" which was a common thing to say to black men in those days, as a verbal assertion of white "superiority"

hope that helps! =]

[BRazor92]

@achiappa :34 "You boys got anything else to say?" He's gonna call two of the most iconic musicians of all time "boys"? o.O

[rovingeye5]

Yeah, how about statues of Diz & Bird on 52nd St.!

[TonyCook2012]

@rovingeye5 AGREED!



[ajpthree]

@rovingeye5 FUCK YEAH!!

[smileykermit]

Hey Fat, the guy's just doing his shtick... this is so typical of the times, but if you want to hear racism where it isn't, that's up to you. All that aside, thanks for posting this.

[ajpthree]

@smileykermit it's not just schtick, & no one is hearing racism where it isn't. Look it up, beboppers started calling each other "man" because of white men like him calling grown black men "boys;" that shit had been going on for hundreds of years, it's racism that was passed down to him from his grandparents. Don't chime in like that when you're uncertain of the facts, someone might think what you're saying is legitimate.

[mattdd05]

@ajpthree That's cool! I didn't know sayin "man" at the end of a sentence came from beboppers, I use it all the time (maybe too often)!

[3rdStoneObliterum]

"you boys"? jeez, he shoulda known this wasnt cool.

[guanaco561]

now this is true music unlike that justin bieber crap

[fatovamingus]

@guanaco561 I'm with you on that

[pegrueneis]

@fatovamingus sooooooo right !!!

[da1prophet]

"Uh...that's *Mr. Gillespie* to you"

[porchdog1961]

These guys should have monuments built in their honor.