Bullshit from the first half minute. Catholics and Jews, in bed together. They don't fight each other, they compliment each other. Religion to kep us stupid and banking to kep us poor, while they live inthe lap of luxury and look down ther noses at us. Babylon system?? Jew banking and Roman Fascism is what rules this world. Satan's little helpers.
@SuperNewf1 Yep, Lenny is famous for his Jesuit blaming to make the world problems a Jesuit problem when it is a Jewsuit problem. When I was a Catholic kid I used the hear some truth about Jews being evil but you would never hear that now. A Pope Pius and other older popes told about Jews but they are all in on it now. Jews took over Freemasonry and the Catholics were not aloud to join Freemasonry. Pope John Paul 2 was a Jew. Lenny is a disinfo-agent for the Jews and is full of shit.
By the way Francis Brown was too busy taking pictures to even get a word to the captain. "The lucky priest that got off" was just there for photographs. He just boarded it in Ireland for pictures and then went back on a tender.
Hahahaha! What a bunch of nonsense! I thought the Pope torpedoed the Titanic with a Vatican submarine and then sent Swiss frogmen to retrieve the gold bars in the ships hold.
Well I think you got all NINE (9) of them on the 14th. I don't know how many more were can find that were tracking this Ice field prior to the 14th, but I would guess just about as many in the dates leading up to the Titanic's intentional sinking. Estimate about 8 a day, I suppose. As I have said before EJ Smith could have been planning this mass murder Before he left South Hampden with all this info available on the wireless. Why would he even NEED updates on the 14th after watching for a week?
@WillSee11 Nope he did not know about the ice until April 13th ice warnings are for ships not land -__- and they dont go posting them in newspapers. If Smith heard about ice again the ice warnings he knew they must be from ships near Newfoundland becauce ice is not suppose to be so far south in as the Atlantic. As a matter of fact when he sailed 10 miles south and then turned to New York he was actually only hitting the TIP of the ice field and thats it. Type in Ice Warning eight and go to it.
Really?! These conspiracies are so stupid. Captain Smith was never a jesuit. He did some saftery precuations. He steered 10 miles south to avoid the ice, he ordered the distress signal sent, he ordered the lifeboats ready, he ordered the rockets fired. Bruce Ismay, Smith's employer really told Smith to speed up faster just to break a speed record.
@1Historygenius Smith Did NOT pay heed to any of these warnings. He knew the Ice Shelf (not a lone berg) was out there EXACTLY like the story of the sinking of the Titan in the book written 14 years earlier. This is NOT a coincidence. The Titanic was headed directly into a Brick wall of ICE, and if they had not hit the ice berg on the way in, nearly everyone would have died. The Mt. Temple, Birma, Frankfurt, Parisian and Californian ALL warned the Titanic of this BRICK Wall of Ice. No excuses.
@WillSee11 First off Captain Smith did do something. He sailed 10 miles south to avoid most of the ice. The Californian's message was told to shut up. The Captain only received 1 or 2 of these 6 ice warnings and 4th Officer Boxhall calculated them to be far to the north of Titanic. Ismay was encoouraging and somewhat ordering Smith to speed up because he was Smith's employer and this is known by survivors' accounts.
@1Historygenius Really? 10 miles to the south was NOT Enough was it? WHY? Another JP Morgan owned ship, the Californian was within EYESIGHT of the titanic and they DAMN well knew the Ice field was dead ahead. They didn't dare attempt to cross it, and they warned the Titanic. How MANY TIMES does it take to warn an EXPERIENCED Capt. about something ALL the ships in the N. Atlantic KNEW was there? Capt. Smith wouldn't even give the order to lower the lifeboats until he was pressed to do it. WHY???
@WillSee11 Captain Smith may had been experienced but he was un aware of the winter of 1912 and what it had done to the shipping lanes. The cold Labrador current had acutally forced more ice south than usual and ships did not really expect this not even Smith. And if you want to know more of this type in Who Sank the Titanic? (2008) Discovery Channel on yotube and go right away to 23:11 you will find more on this. Smith sailed 10 miles south thinking he could save the Titanic.
@1Historygenius Come on now. In 1912 the Marconi wireless system was able to report conditions at sea by the minute. This would be exactly like a commercial Jet pilot knowing that a Volcanic plume of ash was directly in the path of his flight plan, and then flying right into it--- tearing up the engines with pumice and crashing the plane. He should have known, and (probably did) EXACTLY where this Ice Shelf was BEFORE the Titanic left Belfast. This was a mass murder made to look accidental.
@WillSee11 Now you need to watch the hole documentary to understand how the Titanic REALLY sank. He knew ice did come down but not so far down up until 1912 ice always ususally stopped down in Newfoundland and the Grand Banks every geologists knows that. But in 1912 the Labrador Current was moving south and that is hows ice came down and if the Labrador current was normal Ice would be pushed by the Gulf Current to melt and up to Greenland. Smith did not expect ice so far south.
It really does not matter how fast Marconi wireless can go when the captain is not receiving the ice warnings. As I said he only found two and one of his fficers calculated the ice to be north of Titanic. The Wireless operators were employed by Marconi not White Star which meant that these men were more in charge of sending messages from the passengers than just reciving ice warnings.
@1Historygenius I really don;t you can make a case for Smith not being informed of what was out at sea. He had 25 years experience here. The Very FIRST thing any Captain would do would be to check ALL reports coming in about conditions. Just like I said about a pilot checking weather. There were messages sent to the Titanic with the heading MSG. which meant the HAD to be returned by the Captain him personally. The Californian, was in Eyesight of the ship and warned them. Plenty of warnings!
@WillSee11 1. It is well known Smith only recived two ice warnings because the wireless operator and survivor Harold Bride was there! He knew Smith received the first and the 4th officer calculated the ice to be well to the north with that warning. Not to mention Smith was used to the ice being north so he was experienced in the ocean but in 1912 the number of ice in the Atlantic was more than usual do to currents. If this happened every year there would probrably be no voyages n April.
@WillSee11 For the second ice warning, Smith received that and gave it to Bruce Ismay who was the Ttanic's owners and you cannot forget he was Smith's boss. Ismay thought that it would be good for buisness and time as well as saftey to speed up so he told Smith to do so. Ismay also knew there should not be so much ice down in April in 1912 but this year there was more ice. The third warning was given to an officer on the bridge who probably placed on the bulletin board that was never looked at.
@1Historygenius Ok, so we both Agree that Smith had at least Two (2) Ice warnings. I gather that you think Smith's experience misled him to believe that the Ice Shelf ahead was further north of course. But there were as many as nine warnings about the Ice shelf, and these were all known by all the other ships in the area, Including the Californian, (another JP Morgan owned ship) Obviously, with 25 years of experience here, Smith would have seen these giant Ice shelfs before. Now he ignores this?
@WillSee11 As I said the ice went further SOUTH than usual you are denying the Labrador Current which during 1912 rand further south so the Gulf current had no effect the icebergs and the ice wall went further south that usual. IF Captain Smith knew it he knew it would be north and somewhere around Newfoundland and not as south as New York. So in other words Smith was not expecting this to happen.
@WillSee11 The reason why other ships got more ice warnings is that you have to think of passengers. Californian has no passengers as it was a cargo ship which mean the operator there had really nothing to do but send these ice warnings. Titanic on the other hand is a giant luxury liner with over 300 wealthy people on board who want these messages sent. If the operators wanted to get pay they made sure the go it off. Which took a Stock Broker's message over and ice warning.
@1Historygenius So you say the Californian should be excused from ANY responsibility because the "telegraph operator was asleep" when the Titanic sent out its QCD and SOS messages. WAKE HIM UP! They should have done that immediately, especially when they saw the flares and SEVERAL attempts by MORSE lamp were flashed over and over. People in the lifeboats from the Titanic could see the Red and green Port and Starboard lights when Titanic sunk. They could HEAR the ship some say. No excuses here.
@WillSee11 Titanic morse lamp was hard to see and Titanic did not fire its distress rockets at 1 minute intervals and again they do not stand for distress if the rockets are not fired every one minute.
@1Historygenius You know, I hate to be crass and vulgar, but let's face it. it was a VERY PISS POOR EXCUSE that over 1517 people DIED, because Capt. Lord would NOT wake up the Wireless telegraph operator to check on the Titanic after they saw flares in dangerous waters. I don't buy it. UNBELIEVABLE that the Californian did not hear the Titanic's distress signal (s) When ALL the other ships in the area did, including the Olympic and David Sarnoff in New York City at the speed of LIGHT.
@WillSee11 There was some confusion going on remember wireless messages were the new thing and were very good and awesome but sometimes there was errors. One message sent from New York City asked: "Are titanic passengers safe" and the response was fixed by many ships and said "All Titanic passengers safe". Lord thought the rockets were private signals because in order for them to be distress they needed to be fired at one minute intervals.
@1Historygenius Well I think this stinks of a Jesuit plot. It's typical of the Mass Murders they do to obtain power. JP Morgan cashed in his bit insurance policy and set up the Federal Reserve Act one year later.
@WillSee11 Guess what?: He DIED one year later too. I can tell you this which is if he did he must have been the most stupid person ever. After the sinking by 1915 his shipping lines were bankrupt. I do not think he did if he lost heavily in this deal. Really the Federal Reserve was not needed for the jesuits. The reason Morgan supported it wa because n 1907 the American economy was crippled.
@1Historygenius Yes you are right, Morgan did die about one year later. Poor JP..seems like he got "sick" and just couldn't get well. Maybe something he ate didn't agree with him? You are also right that in the end he was stupid, or maybe a better definition would be FOOLISH. In 1907-08 he helped bring on the stock market crash, then bailed out the US with gold and silver, gaining a grip on the US Treasury that he would later tighten with the Fed Act. Wonder how he is doing today?
@WillSee11 I do not think he ate something bad and that it is somehow linked to Titanic as he was a busy man traveling abroad and such so I do not think they poisoned himm and if they did there poison does not work because he died traveling abroad in Italy and died in his sleep seems odd he was able to travel so much with poison in him?
@1Historygenius Oh ya. thanks for reminding me. JP Morgan Did die in Rome, while on a visit to the Vatican as I recall. I think he was on some "spiritual enlightenment path" when all of this happened. I guess he "saw God" or probably the devil, his new master then. Maybe he got a good look at his unused suite on the Titanic on the way down. I don't know, and I don't plan to see him in the future to ask about it all.
@WillSee11 No I think a greedy person like Morgan can care so much about religion. While he may had been a bit religious which really I mean going to church like once every two months but besides that no. There is no proof he was ever at the vatican.
@1Historygenius In answer to your comment about the Length of time it took for JP Morgan to die, Here is your comment: "I do not think they poisoned him and if they did there poison does not work because he died traveling abroad in Italy and died in his sleep seems odd he was able to travel so much with poison in him?"
Good Point. But Remember the Jesuits as MASTERS of the Poison cup. They have slow working toxins that work over time, and FAST ones like what they used on their Pope John Paul 1.
@1Historygenius The reason why I suggested in the last post that JP Morgan might have eaten something bad, is because that is the usual means by which the Jesuits poison people who are powerful and who are insiders that might ruin their plans. This is how they got rid of Pope Clement XIV who banned them for all their evils in 1773, Clement knew they were trying to kill him, he died of probable poisoning the next year too. More recently, it was John Paul 1, in 1978. poisoned after only 33 days.
@WillSee11 At some point during the voyage the wireless machine broke which may be another reason why Titanic did not get as much ice warnings. Then they were backed up with first class messages and that is why when under this huge pressure from the first class messagesthe Titanic Senior operator Jack Phillips told the Californian operator Cyril Evans to shut up causing him to go to bed. Type in on Youtube: Titanic: Death of a Dream (1994) A&E Special - Part 1 and go to 51:36.
@1Historygenius Yes you are correct here. The Titanic 's wireless system failed for a few hours on Sunday, before the accident. (possibly sabotaged by the Jesuits? could be) But Jack Phillips got it working again, and they don't buy and sell stocks on SUNDAY, so nothing was pressing. They Still delivered plenty of Ice Warnings to the Bridge, some marked MSG, meaning the Capt. MUST REPLY. Marconi officers 1st obligation were those HIGH PRIORITY navigational messages. They WERE delivered.
@WillSee11 No they were not oe ice warning came from a ship that had wrote down an ice field but logitude and latitude and sent it to the Titanic but the wirless operators did not send it to the bridge. I do not see how the Jesuits were able to sabotage it when it was working for the entire beggining of the voyage and then just did not work for a couple hours. You have to remember wireless telgraphs were the new toy and on many accounts they sometimes broke down.
@WillSee11 The 4th ice warning was ignored and the other was placed on the bulletin which I said was usually never noticed or it to was ignored. The 6th from the Californian was told to shut up by operator Jack Phillips on Titanicn because the telegraph broke and they were fixing it. So they were backed up with passenger messages which was more important for the operators who wanted to get paid rather then send ice warnings to the bridge. Therefore ice warnins were never important to them.
@1Historygenius So after all of these WARNINGS. Capt. Smith speeds up into a moonless night headed directly into what he should have known (and actually did) was a BRICK WALL of floating ICE CAP, then retires to his quarters. In the meantime, another JP Morgan ship, the Californian, stops its attempt to pass further west into this disaster zone and sends ANOTHER warning being within eyesight of the Titanic. Then the Californian ignores Distress signals, Telegraph and the ship's fog horn. Right!
@WillSee11 Again most warnings were ignored. How was Smith suppose to know the night would be moonless. If this was a brick wall really the Titanic would probrably stop and not get damaged at all and just stop for the night. Before going to bed he was with Second Officer Lightoller and said: "If something comes up let me know" I am sure if they ended up in front of that ice wall he would have stopped and if he did not again only one compartment would be hurt and it would stay afloat.
@1Historygenius WHAT? Now I won't hold you to this. But did you ACTUALLY mean this? "How was Smith suppose to know the night would be moonless?" Come on now..Almanac, Calendar, the moon on the night before. He could have known 10 years before the night would not have moonlight. Every sea captain knows the phases of the moon. That's ALL you have out there but stars, which they used to navigate.
@WillSee11 Then if he did he did not care they were allready on there voyage. Ismay was telling the Captain to go faster anf faster to beat the speed record her sister ship Olympic made on its maiden voyage. Basically it was buisness over saftey for Ismay and he was on a higher level of authority than Smith. Also JP Morgan was going to be on the Titanic and that is a fact. Why would he want to go on a ship that he knew would sink? He would had been swarmed by passengers..
@WillSee11 ...passengers asking questions and he survived he would probrably be the most hated man in the world and no one would like him and thus ending his wealth because no one would want to work with him. Morgan was sick and had to cancel boarding the ship.
@WillSee11 Califronan's wireless operator was a sleep. Titanic distress signals were thought to be private signals because of the Titanic did not fire the rockets at one minute intervals and instead between 5 or 6 minutes. These are the reasons Californian never helped.
@1Historygenius Well I think review of the case against Capt. Lord of the Californian are certainly open to public debate, and Capt. Lord doesn't look very good at all. In fact he changes his story as do others between public statements and court records. Most people who read the transcript give him an "F". James Cameron was afraid to even Mention of show the Californian in his film - due to ongoing controversy STILL raging in 1995 over this treatment of the Californian.
@WillSee11 He was not even on the bridge at the time but again the crew of the Titanic were very in experienced and they did not fire the distress rockets at one minute intervals thus they did not mean distress.
@1Historygenius Marconi officers were under very strong constraints to deliver vital navigational warnings and information, which they did. Why did this work on all the other ships? If you Google Bob Tuskin Titanic at about 50:15 you can see the map of this ice shelf that was used in the trial. There are Pictures of this online you can see. The Mt. Temple barely made it through the south end of this shelf in daylight, and would NOT DARE try to aid the Titanic in moonless darkness this route.
@WillSee11 So there is a big Ice shelf. Titanic rams into the ice shelf that they really never knew was there. Titanic will stay afloat. The reason why is because if it rammed into the ice shelf ONLY the first compartment would be damaged. Titanic could stay afloat with 4 compartments damaged. Have you ever heard of the SS Arizona. It collided into an iceberg and stayed afloat the same thing would have happened to the Titanic and this fake Jesuit crap plan would fail.
Captain Smith did not know because he was held in Belfast with the Oylmpic's damages which he was commanding so he had to be switched to Titanic. But he was not at sea anytime to view your Ice Shelf and the only thing close to that would be the glaciers crashing in Newfoundland which was to far from Titanic's positison
@1Historygenius You are making excuses for Smith that don't add up at all. As a matter of fact NONE OF this makes any sense at all, including the Californian incident. You still did not address the BOOK, written 14 years BEFORE the Titanic that explained the exact same conditions with the ICE SHELF that were not rare at all in warmer winters. How is it that this book was so EXACT to detail, even with the ship's name? The ONLY difference is the lone ice berg vs. the HUGE ICE cap with Titanic.
@WillSee11 But because of how far the current went south the icebergs did to which means the ice was more southren than usual something Smith was not aware of until he just recived 2 out of 6 ice warnings. And remember these were miscalculated to be more nothrenely by 4th Officer Boxhall. There is no conspiracy. By the way again the brick wall of ice would mean nothing. Titanic had a compartment design and if any 4 compartments were flooded it would stay afloat. head on crash damges just 1.
@1Historygenius So you are saying that steering the Titanic under nearly full speed into an ICE CAP, would not sink it? Was it just going to flounder out there in all of those growlers (small chunks of ice) banging on the paper thin hull? Look at the damage just one small berg did. In the book" Futility- Wreck of the Titan", the ship rolled over. Let's talk about that book. Should we hum the "Twilight Zone" theme when we consider the "coincidental" comparisons between the TITAN and the Titanic!
@WillSee11 That is a book and not a true story and I have read it and that is not what exactly happened to the Titanic because the Titanic never rolled over. It is a coincidence because the author, Morgan Robertson had nothing to do with Titanic. Robertson had a ship made of steel in his story but Titanic was made of mostly wrought iron so they are not exactly the same. His ship had 24 and Titanic had 20.
@1Historygenius So you are saying here that the book written 14 years before about the fictional ship called the Titan (Google Futility- The wreck of the Titan) was just "coincidental" in that both ships were very similar and sunk after hitting Ice at this location? Maybe Capt. Smith should have READ that book, if as you say, he "accidentally" made the same stupid mistake. OR---Maybe it was NOT a "coincidence" and that JP Morgan and the Jesuits designed Titanic as a DEATH TRAP like the book.
@WillSee11 JP Morgan: "We should build a ship that will cost several million dollars and sink it!"
After this and several years later White Star went bankrupt and is responsible for the end of the gilded age. In other words it made JP Morgan and other rich banker poor not rich.
Jesuit: "Yeah great idea!"
JP Morgan: "I will also add more lifeboats on it to save more people!" JP Morgan had really nothing to do with Titanic because the idea was made by Lord Pirrie and Bruce Ismay.
@WillSee11 JP Morgan never came up with the idea. The Titanic had more lifeboats because by law the abseloute minimum could be 16 but the Titanic actually had 20. In other words you are saving more lifes then loosing them. Also if it was a death trap why did they add so much saftey features? I find it odd they are giving more time for the people to get saved and rescued.
@1Historygenius WHATTT??? Now are you trying to say the Titanic had Special added safety features like 4 extra lifeboats? You got to be kidding here: Your Quote: The Titanic had more lifeboats because by law the abseloute minimum could be 16 but the Titanic actually had 20. In other words you are saving more livesthen loosing them. Also if it was a death trap why did they add so much saftey features? I find it odd they are giving more time for the people to get saved and rescued."
@WillSee11 Yes it it common sense that it did, thus giving more people a chance of survival. Titanic management which Morgan was NOT part of suggested 4 extra lifeboats also known as collapsibles which would save more people then kill them which if the jesuit plan was to sink and kill certain people why are you giving them more chance of survival. If I wanted to sink the ship I would not make a compartment design at all that could save the ships which is why Titanic was not a jesuit conspiracy.
@1Historygenius Captain Smith was a mass murderer. That was his mission, for the Great Man/God religion these people believe in. Capt. Smith knew the ice field was there, he didn't think they would hit a lone ice berg first, which thew the whole plan into confusion (always a hitch right?) this even caught the Californian off guard as the escort to Titanic's death. JP Morgan, Smith and the Jesuits do not believe the Gospel of Christ. They serve Lucifer, and this agenda. They BELIEVE in Lucifer!
@WillSee11 There is no evidence Smith killed anyone. They just decide he should do it now? Yes he knew the ice field was there but the only number of ice that would go south was small icebergs or growlers. If Smith wanted to kill these people why did he order an SOS? To many things add up that do not make this look like a conspiracy. Remember the point was to kill Astor, Strauss, and Guggenheim. So they were according to the conspiracy invited on board the Titanic.
@1Historygenius Yes. but remember EJ Smith much earlier piloted the Titanic's sister ship the Olympic into a brush with the MHS Hawk, that split the hull in much the same way the Titanic's hull's split with the ice berg. The Olympic was just outside of harbor, Now if you were Capt. Smith would want to be anywhere NEAR any ICE at all way out at sea. You wouldn't want to hit a duck with a hard hat on, knowing these paper thin hulls would peel open and flood the midship. Smith IGNORED many warnings
@WillSee11 -__- If you would no anything I said you if you would really know about the Titanic you would that I stated earlier: Captain Smith steered 10 miles south believing that the ice was not so far south remeber the video I told you to go to that you must have not went to. The reason Smith did not sail any further south is because he believed there would be no ice if not little. I now I am going to say again that the science has proven that the Labarador current brought ice further south.
@1Historygenius As I said before, 10 miles South on a course correction was NOT near enough OBVIOUSLY, It doesn't matter what we think he believed. He was headed DIRECTLY into a Brick Wall of ICE that Everyone KNEW and warned him was there! No excuses for EJ Smith's act of mass murder here.
@1Historygenius All this talk about the EJ (mass murderer) Smith's position is NONSENSE. He was told over and over the Ice FIELD was as low as 40 degrees Latitude. Where did they find the Titanic? The Location of the heavier wreckage, was found at 49 degrees 56' 49". That is 13.5 miles way north of even where they reported. He should have been at least at about 38 degrees to avoid ANYTHING that would damage this ship---unless he INTENDED to ram the Ice field. History of a Mass Murder here,
@WillSee11 Again he knew ice fields were there in April. Did he think they were large no. Most ice is melted once it reaches the Gulf Stream to brought hot water and melted the ice. The colder Labrador current however had brought more ice south than expected. He KNEW there was an ice field but ice fields were suppose to be small. Remember these two ice warnings were both calculated to be well north. They did not expect so much none of the officer did, nor Smith, nor Ismay.
@1Historygenius Oopps One apology here. I listed the western Coordinate Longitude which was 49 degrees. For the Record, the heavier wreckage (which is believed to be below the point where the ship sunk) was at 41 degrees 43 minutes, 32 seconds NORTH. But this is still WAY to far North for safe travel. As ships in this area were reporting LARGE BERGS five miles to the south of 41 degrees and flat Ice fields in this area. He should have NEVER been Close to this!
@WillSee11 These ships reported it but that does not mean Smith go them we are goonjg back to the wireless issue and all I have to say is this: Smith go two the rest he never recieved and 4th officer Boxhall calculated the ice to be well to the north based on these warnings
@1Historygenius My question is, Have you ACTUALLY looked at the LOG of messages sent on Sunday, April 14th about the Ice field directly in Titanic's path? The wireless system was abuzz with these messages, many of which were received by the Titanic. Capt. Murderer EJ, has obviously seen these messages. Even James Cameron's silly movie has the scene right after the church meeting where Smith stuffs one in his pocket, (probably the message from the Baltic) though the actor mumbles "Nordic" ???
@WillSee11 Let me give you the list of ice warnings:
1. French liner La Turenne a ship far north of Titanic sends warning calculated by 4th officer to be far north.
2. Rappahannock send morse lamp warning of ice the Titanic replies but this is not posted for captain smith.
3. Caronia a ship OWNED by Morgan warns Titanic. Smith does get this and puts it on the bulletin board 2nd officer says they will reach it at 11. Smith gives 10 miles south order.
Were there more than 9 on the 14th? And of course these would be coming in and audible all across the Northern Hemisphere on the nights BEFORE the 14th as well.
@WillSee11 4. Noordam ice warning Smith receives it but does not post since it is the same area as Carona and delays the turn to New York again by 20 minutes to allow the Titanic to sail further south.
5. Baltic: OWNED by Morgan. Reports ice. Smith now more concerened gives it to Bruce Ismay who tells him to speed up to avoid the ice.
6. Amerika reports ice. Not given to captain or officers.
7.Californian. OWNED by Morgan. reports ice it is given to 1st officer who does not post it.
@1Historygenius When the Volcanic plume erupted recently in Iceland, Jets all across Europe were either grounded or re-routed to avoid hitting the air filled with pumice. That is prudent we would agree. But as you point out here, Capt. EJ Smith, has almost a week to avoid this Ice field and then sails right into the middle of it. Does this make sense? Unless he intended to destroy that ship for his Luciferian god.
@WillSee11 These guys in the modern world have radar and you are comparing them to an elderly captain who has never used the maroni system before on his ships. And you think he is confident this thing is good and correct. There are more practical ways to destroy a ship then an icefield. Also WHAT!!! You do not post messages in the log you post them on the bulletin board in the chart room which was ignored.
@1Historygenius You have to remember that LONG before the wireless telegraph,(which by 1912 was really VERY advanced and audible at night up to ranges of 3,000 miles) Mariners and captains had been using Morse Lamps / or reflectors to bounce navigational info across the Atlantic form ship to ship with incredible speed and accuracy. Getting the latest sea conditions was nothing new via all of these systems. Smith really didn't need updates anyway, He knew right WHERE he was going sink the ship.
@WillSee11 New ice warning: "ice field has melted" Yeah sure he did not need updates. This was some of the first times marconi wireless was brought on ships. To bad the records of this ice wall are more north than were Titanic sank.
@1Historygenius No, Marconi, private and Naval wireless operators had been very plentiful since 1906. That is Obvious as to why ALL the Other (large) ships had Wireless Radio operators And NO you did not look at the map of Where the Ice field was reported and WHERE they saw large Ice bergs even five miles to the south of 41 degrees N. If Smith really cared about the ship he would have set course to about 38 degrees instead of being in the middle of the Ice at above 41 degrees.
@WillSee11 Smith does not have to steer clear of the whole field. Remember he has a schedule, he has Bruce Ismay on board and you think he can do whatever he wants. If you are going through the tip of the ice field which is proven true by all maps. Baltic reports: 48, 51 degrees north.
"Captain Smith, Titanic. Have had moderate variable winds and clear fine weather since leaving. Greek steamer Athinai reports passing icebergs and large quantity of field ice today in latitude 41.51 N, longitude 49.52 W.
7.30 p.m.
14 April 1912
S.S. Antillian to R.M.S. Titanic:
"6.30 p.m., apparent time, ship; latitude 42.3 N, longitude 49.9 W. Three large bergs five mile to southward of us".
@1Historygenius 9.30 p.m. 14 April 1912 S.S. Mesaba to R.M.S. Titanic and All Eastbound Ships: "Ice report: In latitude 42 N to 41.25 N, longitude 49 W to 50.3 W. Saw much heavy pack ice and great number of large icebergs, also field ice. Weather good, clear" 9.35 p.m. TITANIC ANSWERS! 14 April 1912 R.M.S. Titanic to S.S. Mesaba: "Recieved, thanks". 11.00 p.m. (approx) 14 April 1912 R.M.S. Californian to R.M.S. Titanic: "Say, old man, we are stopped and surrounded by ice".
"CQD CQD SOS Titanic Position 41.44 N 50.24 W. Require immediate assistance. Come at once. We struck an iceberg. Sinking". So far, two ships had responded to the Titanic's distress call. They included the 'Frankfurt', nearly 170 miles away, and the 'Olympic', 500 miles away.
12.20 a.m.
15 April 1912
R.M.S. Titanic to R.M.S. Carpathia:
"Come at once. We have struck a berg. It's a CQD, old man. Position 41.46 N 50.14 W"
@1Historygenius So If you read what I posted here from the BOTTOM UP in order. You can plainly see that Titanic was warned beginning at 1:40 PM by the Baltic that heavy ICE and ICE FIELDS in the middle of the DAY were at 41.51 N. Of course the warnings continue.
NOW WHERE did Titanic report her position? 41.46 N at Midnight when MORE ICE would be expected. The actual wreck was found at 41. 43' 42" They were NOT even close to being in SAFE water.. WHY?
@WillSee11 You gave one reason why. Miss coordination did the Titanic in but there is always mis coordination there is no high tech computers. How are we sure the Baltic was at its coordinates and as I said Smith had a schedule to keep. It seems odd he would even move south in the first place. Not to mention he sent a distress signal during the sinking. There are so many things that add up to that make it not a conspiracy. Extra lifeboats, extra lifejackets, extra compartments, and other things.
@1Historygenius How can you say EXTRA LIFEBOATS? EXTRA LIFE JACKETS? It took Smith 30 minutes to sent the first QCD / SOS in which time the Californian wireless operator went to bed NOT to be awoken by Capt. Lord on the Californian when they saw the distress flares. Smith dithered and had to be urged to lower the few lifeboats they had. And then there is BRUCE ISMAY who SURVIVED! He should have been on that ship until it went down. NO excuses for Ismay or EJ Smith!
@WillSee11 Titanic had 4 extra lifeboats than the minimum capacity. Ttanic had exactly 3,560 and Titanic had 2,230 people on board. No he did not. Second Officer Lightoller can prove that. He asked should we put the women and children in the boats sire. Smith gave the order. Bruce Ismay was a hero during the sinking because he helped women and children into the boats. The lifeboats he was at was not entirely full so he boarded it.
@WillSee11 After all on first officer Murdoch's side it was first come first saved which Smith ordered Women and cihildren first then if there were no more standing there he allowed men. But second Officer Lightoller mistakend it for women and children only and thats why Astor and Straus could not board. Lightoller was somewhat pathetic during the sinking. When he saw no more women and children left he lowered the boat one of his had 25 women and children out of 65 spaces.
@WillSee11 And you know what? Before Ismay SPOKE with Smith, the ship was at some 20 knotts but when Ismay spoke with Smith to increase engine speed which is known from survivors the Titanic was now traveling at 22 knotts after lighting the last 2 boilers. So Ismay did speed up and he sailed south. Which every ship did! The Baltic, Amerika, Mesaba and others steered south, but did that mean they avoided the iceberg no they were all near Titanic an all in the ice field.
@WillSee11 So Titanic was like any other ship they sail south to meet less icebergs which sailing south already gives Smith a plus for not being a fake worker for the jesuits which the conspiracy was made by conspirators for profit. How can you say no excuses for Ismay and Smith when they were in charged I think if Morgan was on there he would had done the same things as Ismay after all if he wanted these men dead I should had went but no he was sick.
@1Historygenius The Titanic was made to LOOK like an accident. As we have pointed out, there are way too many holes in this story for any attempted explanation of an "accident" to draw that conclusion. The Jesuit / Rothschild banking agents created the Federal Reserve, the IRS, World War I, the Bolshevik / Communist revolution in Russia, and the lock down on ENERGY use and control thought this mass murder. They server Lucifer, and will DO anything to further this agenda.
@WillSee11 know it was an accident. The only people thinking this is a conspiracy are the people who want to make a profit. That is what you believe oddly enough. WW1 started with the assination of the Archduke in Serbia. Austria wanted police down there and several policies which Serbia refused. Austria declares war on Serbia. Russia on Austria, Germany on Russia, France had an alliance with Russia so the went to war. When Germany invade Belgium Britain is in the war.
@1Historygenius I really wonder where you come up with the idea that "conspiracy theorists" want to make money selling their "theories" How much MONEY did James Cameron make with his blockbuster White Wash film 'Titanic" (BTW, he plans to re-release that propaganda crap again in 3 D next year for the 100th anniversary of this mas murder) You want to talk MONEY? You Got to be kidding! Think of the Federal Reserve Act, the greatest act of white collar crime in HISTORY. You know that.
@WillSee11 And again you ignore the fact that the Titanic movie was made for a love story more than it was for historically accurate. If you knew anything you would no the two and other main characters are fake. Why can't you let people have the freedom to make a movie that they want. You think they can just put everything in it. If it is any proganda it is giving the propaganda that love at first sight can happen.
@1Historygenius You say: "Titanic movie was made for a love story more than it was for historically accurate" I agree, it was PHONY. You say: "Why can't you let people have the freedom to make a movie that they want. You think they can just put everything in it. " LOOK we are talking about HISTORY HERE. It is VERY important that we understand what happened, and WHY? Your are the one who is the "HistoryGenius" Does changing HISTORY appeal to you?
@WillSee11 Ok then. Then you will agree to not mention any Titanic movie and the Titan. Since that is media and not facts. Your the one who brought them up in the first place.
@1Historygenius Ni I brought up the fictional book written 14 years BEFORE the Titanic on the Wreck of the fictional ship the "Titan" as a clear example of something that was "beyond coincidence with FACTUAL events" that occurred later. I did not pay loose with the actual HISTORY of the Titanic like James Cameron has done. BIG difference. I am specifically NOT re-writing History. but relating to a NOVEL that was written 14 years earlier that predicted the Titanic disaster to a "T". HISTORY!
@WillSee11 As for the author he was never on the Titanic nor had anything to do with the thing. 14 years before Titanic this guy came with a very imaginary ship. No one had built those big liners yet not Cunard or White Star. I would not say to a T but very close. Her are the slith inacurracies: Titan not Titanic, 24 lifeboats instead of 20, and the biggest one is that the ship rolled over on its side but gravity would hold it down unless the iceberg had a slope.
@1Historygenius I think this IS important. As you point out, the fictional novel ship the "Titan" had 24 life boats, which were not enough for the almost 3,000 passengers on board. The Titanic has EVEN LESS..only 20! Now this number (20) may have exceeded the legal requirement, but it was not "extra" nor was it enough, obviously. In may ways, the Titanic was DESIGNED to be a death trap in excess of the fictional Titan, which I find to be indicative of a "planned mass murder" by the Jesuits.
@WillSee11 IF Titanic was going to be the death trap then we did Olympic only have 20 too since it took no part in the so-called mission. And it was typical for ships to not have enough lifeboats why would big steamers need them? Even Cunard saw no need in excess boats. Bascially ships really never had disasters and if they did have a disaster Olympic proved itself unsinkable with the Hawke accident. Also if the Titanic was being used as the vechicle of destruction why did they build more?
@WillSee11 But many people had Titanic related incidents.
New York Lawyer Isaac Frauenthal was on the Titanic and had a dream about a steam ship crashed into something and went down. He needed no eoncouragement to get on a boat.
On April 14, 1912, a young scottish girl, Jessie had a vision before she died in the hospital of a ship sinking people dowrning and some guy named Wally playing a fiddle. After hours of her death the Titanic sank with Wallace Hartley in the ship band playing.
@WillSee11 The only holes you can point out is the ship's position. You know why Titanic is so far from its recorded position? The ship was diving down in the war offcourse it would be far from its recored position. And in case you have not noticed: Its the ATLANTIC OCEAN!
@1Historygenius You don't bother to read or investigate. The position Ballard found the HEAVY WRECKAGE is believed to be virtually directly over the spot that the Titanic sank above. Other parts such as the forth stack broke off and drifted away..but we are talking about big portions of the Iron Keel that drop like a rock, Now in case you didn't notice, the position is even further SOUTH than the reported QCD position that was given by the Titanic. SO,.the were actually south of where they said!
@WillSee11 The ship was sinking by the bow in a nose dive. So it dove several miles forward and down into the water if it plumbed straight down the bow would be up vertical and probrably be a bigger disaster than it appears.
@1Historygenius You say: "The ship was sinking by the bow in a nose dive. So it dove several miles forward and down into the water if it plumbed straight down the bow would be up vertical and probrably be a bigger disaster than it appears." - NO, what you need to understand is that a large portion of the iron keel was found separate from the wreck, Sinking ships do NOT fly through the air like superman or Air Force One. The go down virtually straight just like a rock in a pool as Ballard said.
@WillSee11 So you are saying it cannot even move a few feet difference as it goes down? SO somehow the ship was able to level itslef when you said it can go straight down. Since the ship was going straight down it would have landed veritcally. Bow down and the stern of the bow sticking straigh up underwater.
@WillSee11 JP Morgan never came up with the Titanic idea he wanted a return on his invesment and he expected White Star to do something if they did nothing he would have just abadoned White Star. It was again J. Bruce Ismay and Lord Pirrie's idea to build the Titanic. There were saftey features on the ship and extra lifeboats and extra lifejackets. Most ice warning swere ignored and few were for the captain. He sailed 10 miles south like any ship anyway.
@1Historygenius SO the Titanic KNEW they were FAR north of where should be, having received WARNING AFTER WARNING AFTER WARNING. The ship was found even slightly south of where they reported their position. What does that tell you? They KNEW they were NORTH of 41 degrees latitude headed INTO heavy ice fields and large bergs...almost five miles thick of BRICK WALL ice ahead. The Californian abandoned any attempt to go through this.
@WillSee11 Everyone miscaultulates how are you so sure the Baltic, Californian, and Mesaba were where they were suppose to be. Not to mention Captain Lord on the Californian thought he saw a DIFFERENT ship possibly and illegal Norweigan shipping boat and how do you explain the fact that the Titanic was not firing their rockets the correct way. It is beleived the Norweigan shipping boat also fired rockets to signals its fisherman in the row boats.
@1Historygenius I think you do a GREAT disservice to the victims of the Titanic, in particular the survivors. Tell me, HOW MANY of their first hand witness accounts have you listened to? Have you heard them with your own ears or watched them say that the Californian was so close they could see people walking on the deck after the Titanic sank and they were all alone out there in the sea? Did you go to Catholic schools under the tutelage of these Jesuit murderers? I really wonder about you.
@WillSee11 You are the one doing the diservice as well as the Jesuits. Do you think the people related to these Titanic victims and survivors like hearing that all there relatives were in a conspiracy that I have already proven wrong in a video on Youtube and a short story on DeviantART. I have read many and Archibald Graice said he saw a bright lght how are you so sure it was the californian many ships were traveling around. And again the rockets did not work they needed to bet at 1 min interva
@1Historygenius As far as the "Mystery ship" that Californian Capt. Lord claimed must have been in the vicinity of the sinking Titanic---that ship was never verified, identified, or named. It WAS struck down as being real by the investigation and an excuse created in the mind of Capt. Lord. It really didn't matter anyway! Lord was completely negligent in his duties and should have been sent to jail under international maritime law for NOT responding to the Titanic's distress signals.
@WillSee11 I was like you for many years believing Lord should have been jailed but I recently looked it up when somebody said white means part and red means distress. The only sources for the red distress rocket theory was he Jesuit conspiracy, A nazi Titanic movie, and a titanic movie from 1996. But I found out the truth when I looked up the rockets on the Titanic historical society. The white rockets should have been fired at 1 minute inervals rather than 5 but the crew was new.
@1Historygenius The Titanic obviously did not plunge "nose dive" like a dart as you said. Though it sank by the bow, the heavier weight at midship began to level the sinking vessel out in it's decent. to the bottom Ballard and all the other expeditions show that it landed upright, with the bow slightly embedded deeper in the ocean floor, which you can PLAINLY see from all the photographs..Even the rail on the bow (now famous) was still there and intact virtually below where it went down.
@WillSee11 I have read: Graice, Bride, Ismay, Ryerson, Lightoller (who even said he did not get ice warnings) and was convinced he could see a growler in time to move away (No ship besides the Arizona had really met an iceberg before so close and they were doing standard 1912 things), Edward Brown, Lowe, and I can name more.
@WillSee11 You think they have compuer and can pin point there exact spots. And this is the only strong theory you have. I have stated to you ice warnings were ignored and science which always over theories has pointed out the Labrador current was not suppose to carry ice so far south everyone knows little ice should be able to go into the Atlantic all ice is usually melted in Newfoundland and Titanic was no where near Newfoundland.
@1Historygenius If you notice, it wasn't just the Baltic that knew where this Ice field was. EVERY ship knew in this area. Why not the Titanic? Smith DID know. but he was on a mission to SINK that SHIP. I think you have to come to that conclusion. There are just far too many "mistakes" oversights" miscalculations" and stupidities, for this to be and "ACCIDENT" WAY TOO many. Then you have the MOTIVE. Who Benefits. The Morgan / Rockefeller / Rothschild / Vatican banksters--- who profit on murder.
@WillSee11 And again you fail to remeber most were not received to Captain Smith how do we know this well one of the wireless operators did survive. Harold Bride gave some mesages to the bridge but most were ignored by the crew and they were ignore. And again it was never Morgan's idea to build the Titanic it was made by Ismay and Lord Pirrie. Morgan madea trust and if that company did not give him a profit he would sell it. Titanic was built to keep white star in business.
@WillSee11 Of all stories I know I got one BETTER than Morgan Robertson's Titan. William T. Stead was an English journalist aboard first class on the Titanic. He wrote a stroy about a ship sinking the North Atlantic without enough lifeboats so people died and the survivors were rescued by a ship captained by E.J. SMITH. 20 years later he was last scene ready a book in the first class smoking room on the Titanic. He and Captain Smith lost their lifes on board Titanic.
@1Historygenius Yes, I have read the short versions of thestories that Stead wrote. Though William T. Stead was a spiritualist who conducted seances, and seemed to have a "sixth sense" about future events, his articles were intended to address TWO MAJOR concerns that were very REAL and tangible. 1. The lack lifeboats available on the ships, and 2. The foolish manner in which the captains endangered these ship in Icy waters. What does that tell us about EJ Smith? Another warning at least.
@WillSee11 I do o think Captain Smith could care for these stories if he read them and we do not know if he did. In fact as I have said ice is not usually so far south. Stead was pointing at the facts when he was arguing that ships that took the more nothrenly routes like close to Newfoundland and Maine (Titanic took an ever furthrer southren route). Only so few did as it was protcol to go south in April.
@1Historygenius Perhaps you are aware of this, but there is an "code of ethics" among these Luciferian believers. They believe in Hiding things in PLAIN SIGHT. In other words, they actually TELL US what they plan to do, not only to fulfill this code, but to alert their other members that these events were indeed created by them for the great man-god religion. It's like the way Jack the Ripper would leave clues. They enjoy this prank which illustrates how STUPID we are, and why they should Rule.
@WillSee11 I found nothing saying they like to hide things in place sight and this so called "conspiracy" has a failure in coordination if they were builing the Titanic how would they be so sure these men like J.J. Astor would be in Europe. Astor just left America because of scandal and went back because his wife was pregnant. Guggenheim and Straus are really the same they maybe would not be there when Titanic was ready.
@1Historygenius Well I think you actually answered your own questions. the Timing of having Astor and Guggenheim in London was critical. BUT we also had TWO ships. the Olympic and the Titanic, either of which would suit the purpose, and both (ODDLY ENOUGH) had only 20 lifeboats. I think you need to review the Olympic incident again. Capt. Smith nearly sunk the Olympic in port with just a slight bump. It was hardly "unsinkable" in that it almost sunk right there. These ships were deathtraps all.
@WillSee11 True but every ships was a death trap in those days Charles Dickens stated that also. Also it really shows how much you know about Titanic: Astor boarded IN Cherbourg and was in Cairo when he heard about disaster and Titanic was NEVER in London. Nice to know you had wikipedia Jack the Ripper just so he can have a scoop in your endless theories which again have failed except for the coordinates one but ships back then do not have GPS.
@1Historygenius We also need to recall that the Olympic SURVIVED and actually was in service for 25 years and sunk an enemy ship! BUT this was ONLY after the hull was refitted and fortified way beyond the horrible construction it had almost identical to the Titanic: The Olympic has the unique distinction of being the only vessel of its kind to directly sink an enemy ship without the use of armaments. With its new SUPER HULL it Rammed and sunk a German U-boat! If the Titanic had only been similar
@WillSee11 The reason why these hulls were so big is because Ismay could NOT even afford a ship with so much. The real reason why Titanic was built was so they had something to rival Cunard. You do realize the U-boat only sank because it hit Olympic's propeller not its hull. So now you are pulling lies to defend yourself.
@1Historygenius But getting back to the Luciferian code of hiding things in PLAIN SIGHT. Do you think we really are as STUPID as they say? Have we not learned ANYTHING from that Repeat Offender called HISTORY? What other group of people "agents" that have been thrown out of countries at least 73 times for "conspiracy, treason, political intrigue, subversion, revolution, theft, torture and murder? Can we say the "C" word 'Conspiracy" here if EVER there was one? Are we that STUPID??? No all of us
@WillSee11 Yes we have learned about History: Informs us about the past to prepare for the future you obviously skipped that class. Why would countries want to waste their time with Jesuits they are a group we can do without. If the Jesuits are so smart then why do some of there plans FAIL. Like the one where they thought some gunpowder un parliament could blow up the place.
@1Historygenius the Jesuits are so smart. many prominent people have warned us about them through history. they are the ones that control the secret societies getting them to do the dirty work whilst they stay in the background. even many catholics dont know about them and even more so dont know bout the black pope.
@m1onie Could you provide documented evidence? OR is this another conspiracy theory? I am going to guess you are to give that "Secret Instructions of the Jesuits" spin. Even when it is common sense that the bill would have passed even with those 3 wealthy men alive anyway.
@1Historygenius are you sure it would of passed without the wealthy? are u not even at the slightest suspicious about the jesuit connections with the ship? the rest are just quotes from prominent people they could be wrong about their statements but i think not. i can post them if u wish.
@m1onie It is a known fact that President Woodrow Wilson signed the act before he even took office. Originally the act was proposed by the Republicans and was blocked by the Democrats but when Wilson supportred it being a Democrat then the Democrats did as well. Seems like you need no motivation from rich people, all you need is the president. Just because several rich people died does not seem several rich survived to.
@WillSee11 Olympic sucked Hawke into it. Titanic sunk New York into. You again decide to put Jesuits before thing that are scientifaclly true. Science > Jesuit. Also that shows how much you do not know about the Titanic.
@1Historygenius I have to admit that I can barely make any sense out of most of what you write. (And I do try) When you say" Olympic sucked Hawke into it. Titanic sunk New York into" Uh, I haven't the foggiest idea of what you mean? Are you drinking while you write this stuff? We have been over and over the important details about the Titanic and I have yet to hear ANYTHING here that matters even when it does come out coherently.
@WillSee11 The suction of the Olympic is what caused the Hawke to collide into it. As the Titanic was leaving port, the New York go caught in the suction of the Titanic and collided into it. It was not typical for ships to catch others in suction.
@1Historygenius We should address James Cameron's Smoke Screen Cover-up movie of the Titanic Mass Murder. I'll bet you a nickel, that you can't describe the ONLY reference to the Californian in this multi-million dollar White Wash? Do you know WHY Cameron didn't even touch the Californian issue, unlike Walter Lord's book and movie "A Night To Remember"? (that even mentions the prophetic novel Wreck of the TITAN, 1898) Walter Lord's book really explored the Californian "mystery of negligence".
@WillSee11 I could care less for the James Cameron movie. The movie is more about drama than history and I am not looking at history from Cameron's point of view I am looking for at drama. You do know there was a scene with the Californian in it but it was a deleted scene. If you reall think James Cameron was in some cover up crap you are wrong. All movies are made for profit. Kind of like conspiracies.
@1Historygenius The point is simply this. Capt, EJ Smith KNEW from his bad experience with the Olympic that all it took was a minor BUMP to split the thin hulls on these ships. Why would he even THINK of damaging a Brand NEW ship. Even IF he was confident in the water tight compartments, he could barely control the Olympic after it hit the HMS Hawk in harbor due to the way it listed. It ruined the drive shaft. Why would he do this in the Mid Atlantic? No excuses, he was on a death mission!
@WillSee11 Remember he was never on the bridge when the ship hit the iceberg and we now what 1st Officer Murdoch who was in charge should have done. In order to avoid the ice the should have kept the engine at full spees ahead and had the quartermaster turn the wheel. It is assured he could had avoided it. So that is how you avoid the ice.
@WillSee11 Morgan's illness just stopped him from boarding the ship. If he knew what would happen why did he board in the first place? Also JP Morgan NEVER came up with the idea of the Titanic it was Bruce Ismay the manging director of the White Star Line and William Pirrie, owner of the shipbuilding company Harland & Wolf. Also these 3 men were never invited, Astor, Straus, and Guggenheim they had to buy there ticket like everyone else.
@1Historygenius Well I guess JP Morgan had "Lucky Larry Silverstein" moment. You know Lucky Larry right, the owner of the WTC towers, who ALWAYS at Breakfast at the Windows on the World Restaurant? He was Lucky on Sept. 11th, and had to go to a "dermatologist" appointment. So Lucky Larry did not burn up with tenants. I am sure it was "just a coincidence" in the long line of Titanic events that JP Morgan was not on his ship with those he invited. Just Coincidental that he was setting up the Fed.
@WillSee11 No one was invited everyone had to buy tickets. How else are you suppose to make a proift. For example Colonel John Jacob Astor IV was enjoying his time in Egypt and Europe away from the scandal in America when he made his divorce and married a beautiful young woman. The only reason he went on the Titanic was that he discovered his wife was pregnant so they had to go to America.
@1Historygenius Well JJ Astor really didn't have to dig deep to spring for the ticket, regardless of how his fare was paid, but the vast number of prominent millionaires on board were lured there by the glamor of JP Morgan's persona. Of course EJ Smith (the mass murderer) was not on the bridge. He was comfortably awaiting the Ice field, which they would hit much later. He was SURPRISED and when they (by the grace of God or no one would have survived) hit the iceberg early, as was the Californian
@WillSee11 Yes they were but they all bought tickets. Now we are going back to the ship's construction. No one builds a multi million dollar ship to sink. The Titanic disaster bankrupted J.P. Morgan's IMM trust and the Federal Reserve did not help either. Not to mention it was NEVER Morgan's idea to build the ship. The men who came up with the idea were Lord Pirrie and Ismay. People keep saying this is a conspiracy but if it was the plan was guranteed to fail.
@WillSee11 I already told you if they were going to deliberately sink this ship why did they had saftey like watertight compartments and extra lifeboats and more lifejackets than needed. Remeber of this was a plan it would fail. You said theres an ice wall in front of the ship. Smith rams it rather than stop it and the ship would stay afloat because only 1 compartment was flooding and it could stay afloat with 4.
@1Historygenius The Titanic murder accomplished EXACTLY what it was intended to do. Eliminate the competition to the Rockefeller / Morgan/ Rothschild / Vatican banking interests. WHO benefits, and WHY? That is what we cal MOTIVE. Do you suppose building biggest international banking swindle the world has ever seen might MOTIVATE some psychopaths? WHO BENEFITED. JP Morgan was hardly broke due to White Star's failure AFTER he died in Rome visiting the Vatican. WHO BENEFITED? FRB Act. WW I? IRS?
Some would argue that it is'nt even the Titanic lying on the Atlantic floor, but rather the "badly damaged" Olympic.
Many of those who worked at the H&W yard even claimed it to be common local knowledge, but it'd never have made it in mainstream news..
I'm still un-decided on this one, but given how canniving these big money players were (and still are) it would'nt surprise me one bit!
DeadOriginal 1 month ago
I did a turd this morning that closely resembled the Titanic... the band even kept playing as I flushed it
cicatrixta 1 month ago
Bullshit from the first half minute. Catholics and Jews, in bed together. They don't fight each other, they compliment each other. Religion to kep us stupid and banking to kep us poor, while they live inthe lap of luxury and look down ther noses at us. Babylon system?? Jew banking and Roman Fascism is what rules this world. Satan's little helpers.
SuperNewf1 1 month ago
@SuperNewf1 Yep, Lenny is famous for his Jesuit blaming to make the world problems a Jesuit problem when it is a Jewsuit problem. When I was a Catholic kid I used the hear some truth about Jews being evil but you would never hear that now. A Pope Pius and other older popes told about Jews but they are all in on it now. Jews took over Freemasonry and the Catholics were not aloud to join Freemasonry. Pope John Paul 2 was a Jew. Lenny is a disinfo-agent for the Jews and is full of shit.
elucidative 1 month ago
By the way Francis Brown was too busy taking pictures to even get a word to the captain. "The lucky priest that got off" was just there for photographs. He just boarded it in Ireland for pictures and then went back on a tender.
1Historygenius 4 months ago
Hahahaha! What a bunch of nonsense! I thought the Pope torpedoed the Titanic with a Vatican submarine and then sent Swiss frogmen to retrieve the gold bars in the ships hold.
abukamoon 4 months ago
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What a load of crap
no1hoopsman 6 months ago
Well I think you got all NINE (9) of them on the 14th. I don't know how many more were can find that were tracking this Ice field prior to the 14th, but I would guess just about as many in the dates leading up to the Titanic's intentional sinking. Estimate about 8 a day, I suppose. As I have said before EJ Smith could have been planning this mass murder Before he left South Hampden with all this info available on the wireless. Why would he even NEED updates on the 14th after watching for a week?
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 Nope he did not know about the ice until April 13th ice warnings are for ships not land -__- and they dont go posting them in newspapers. If Smith heard about ice again the ice warnings he knew they must be from ships near Newfoundland becauce ice is not suppose to be so far south in as the Atlantic. As a matter of fact when he sailed 10 miles south and then turned to New York he was actually only hitting the TIP of the ice field and thats it. Type in Ice Warning eight and go to it.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
Really?! These conspiracies are so stupid. Captain Smith was never a jesuit. He did some saftery precuations. He steered 10 miles south to avoid the ice, he ordered the distress signal sent, he ordered the lifeboats ready, he ordered the rockets fired. Bruce Ismay, Smith's employer really told Smith to speed up faster just to break a speed record.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius Smith Did NOT pay heed to any of these warnings. He knew the Ice Shelf (not a lone berg) was out there EXACTLY like the story of the sinking of the Titan in the book written 14 years earlier. This is NOT a coincidence. The Titanic was headed directly into a Brick wall of ICE, and if they had not hit the ice berg on the way in, nearly everyone would have died. The Mt. Temple, Birma, Frankfurt, Parisian and Californian ALL warned the Titanic of this BRICK Wall of Ice. No excuses.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 First off Captain Smith did do something. He sailed 10 miles south to avoid most of the ice. The Californian's message was told to shut up. The Captain only received 1 or 2 of these 6 ice warnings and 4th Officer Boxhall calculated them to be far to the north of Titanic. Ismay was encoouraging and somewhat ordering Smith to speed up because he was Smith's employer and this is known by survivors' accounts.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius Really? 10 miles to the south was NOT Enough was it? WHY? Another JP Morgan owned ship, the Californian was within EYESIGHT of the titanic and they DAMN well knew the Ice field was dead ahead. They didn't dare attempt to cross it, and they warned the Titanic. How MANY TIMES does it take to warn an EXPERIENCED Capt. about something ALL the ships in the N. Atlantic KNEW was there? Capt. Smith wouldn't even give the order to lower the lifeboats until he was pressed to do it. WHY???
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 Captain Smith may had been experienced but he was un aware of the winter of 1912 and what it had done to the shipping lanes. The cold Labrador current had acutally forced more ice south than usual and ships did not really expect this not even Smith. And if you want to know more of this type in Who Sank the Titanic? (2008) Discovery Channel on yotube and go right away to 23:11 you will find more on this. Smith sailed 10 miles south thinking he could save the Titanic.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius Come on now. In 1912 the Marconi wireless system was able to report conditions at sea by the minute. This would be exactly like a commercial Jet pilot knowing that a Volcanic plume of ash was directly in the path of his flight plan, and then flying right into it--- tearing up the engines with pumice and crashing the plane. He should have known, and (probably did) EXACTLY where this Ice Shelf was BEFORE the Titanic left Belfast. This was a mass murder made to look accidental.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 Now you need to watch the hole documentary to understand how the Titanic REALLY sank. He knew ice did come down but not so far down up until 1912 ice always ususally stopped down in Newfoundland and the Grand Banks every geologists knows that. But in 1912 the Labrador Current was moving south and that is hows ice came down and if the Labrador current was normal Ice would be pushed by the Gulf Current to melt and up to Greenland. Smith did not expect ice so far south.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
It really does not matter how fast Marconi wireless can go when the captain is not receiving the ice warnings. As I said he only found two and one of his fficers calculated the ice to be north of Titanic. The Wireless operators were employed by Marconi not White Star which meant that these men were more in charge of sending messages from the passengers than just reciving ice warnings.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius I really don;t you can make a case for Smith not being informed of what was out at sea. He had 25 years experience here. The Very FIRST thing any Captain would do would be to check ALL reports coming in about conditions. Just like I said about a pilot checking weather. There were messages sent to the Titanic with the heading MSG. which meant the HAD to be returned by the Captain him personally. The Californian, was in Eyesight of the ship and warned them. Plenty of warnings!
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 1. It is well known Smith only recived two ice warnings because the wireless operator and survivor Harold Bride was there! He knew Smith received the first and the 4th officer calculated the ice to be well to the north with that warning. Not to mention Smith was used to the ice being north so he was experienced in the ocean but in 1912 the number of ice in the Atlantic was more than usual do to currents. If this happened every year there would probrably be no voyages n April.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@WillSee11 For the second ice warning, Smith received that and gave it to Bruce Ismay who was the Ttanic's owners and you cannot forget he was Smith's boss. Ismay thought that it would be good for buisness and time as well as saftey to speed up so he told Smith to do so. Ismay also knew there should not be so much ice down in April in 1912 but this year there was more ice. The third warning was given to an officer on the bridge who probably placed on the bulletin board that was never looked at.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius Ok, so we both Agree that Smith had at least Two (2) Ice warnings. I gather that you think Smith's experience misled him to believe that the Ice Shelf ahead was further north of course. But there were as many as nine warnings about the Ice shelf, and these were all known by all the other ships in the area, Including the Californian, (another JP Morgan owned ship) Obviously, with 25 years of experience here, Smith would have seen these giant Ice shelfs before. Now he ignores this?
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 As I said the ice went further SOUTH than usual you are denying the Labrador Current which during 1912 rand further south so the Gulf current had no effect the icebergs and the ice wall went further south that usual. IF Captain Smith knew it he knew it would be north and somewhere around Newfoundland and not as south as New York. So in other words Smith was not expecting this to happen.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@WillSee11 The reason why other ships got more ice warnings is that you have to think of passengers. Californian has no passengers as it was a cargo ship which mean the operator there had really nothing to do but send these ice warnings. Titanic on the other hand is a giant luxury liner with over 300 wealthy people on board who want these messages sent. If the operators wanted to get pay they made sure the go it off. Which took a Stock Broker's message over and ice warning.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius So you say the Californian should be excused from ANY responsibility because the "telegraph operator was asleep" when the Titanic sent out its QCD and SOS messages. WAKE HIM UP! They should have done that immediately, especially when they saw the flares and SEVERAL attempts by MORSE lamp were flashed over and over. People in the lifeboats from the Titanic could see the Red and green Port and Starboard lights when Titanic sunk. They could HEAR the ship some say. No excuses here.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 Titanic morse lamp was hard to see and Titanic did not fire its distress rockets at 1 minute intervals and again they do not stand for distress if the rockets are not fired every one minute.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius You know, I hate to be crass and vulgar, but let's face it. it was a VERY PISS POOR EXCUSE that over 1517 people DIED, because Capt. Lord would NOT wake up the Wireless telegraph operator to check on the Titanic after they saw flares in dangerous waters. I don't buy it. UNBELIEVABLE that the Californian did not hear the Titanic's distress signal (s) When ALL the other ships in the area did, including the Olympic and David Sarnoff in New York City at the speed of LIGHT.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 There was some confusion going on remember wireless messages were the new thing and were very good and awesome but sometimes there was errors. One message sent from New York City asked: "Are titanic passengers safe" and the response was fixed by many ships and said "All Titanic passengers safe". Lord thought the rockets were private signals because in order for them to be distress they needed to be fired at one minute intervals.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius Well I think this stinks of a Jesuit plot. It's typical of the Mass Murders they do to obtain power. JP Morgan cashed in his bit insurance policy and set up the Federal Reserve Act one year later.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 Guess what?: He DIED one year later too. I can tell you this which is if he did he must have been the most stupid person ever. After the sinking by 1915 his shipping lines were bankrupt. I do not think he did if he lost heavily in this deal. Really the Federal Reserve was not needed for the jesuits. The reason Morgan supported it wa because n 1907 the American economy was crippled.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius Yes you are right, Morgan did die about one year later. Poor JP..seems like he got "sick" and just couldn't get well. Maybe something he ate didn't agree with him? You are also right that in the end he was stupid, or maybe a better definition would be FOOLISH. In 1907-08 he helped bring on the stock market crash, then bailed out the US with gold and silver, gaining a grip on the US Treasury that he would later tighten with the Fed Act. Wonder how he is doing today?
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 I do not think he ate something bad and that it is somehow linked to Titanic as he was a busy man traveling abroad and such so I do not think they poisoned himm and if they did there poison does not work because he died traveling abroad in Italy and died in his sleep seems odd he was able to travel so much with poison in him?
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius Oh ya. thanks for reminding me. JP Morgan Did die in Rome, while on a visit to the Vatican as I recall. I think he was on some "spiritual enlightenment path" when all of this happened. I guess he "saw God" or probably the devil, his new master then. Maybe he got a good look at his unused suite on the Titanic on the way down. I don't know, and I don't plan to see him in the future to ask about it all.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 No I think a greedy person like Morgan can care so much about religion. While he may had been a bit religious which really I mean going to church like once every two months but besides that no. There is no proof he was ever at the vatican.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius In answer to your comment about the Length of time it took for JP Morgan to die, Here is your comment: "I do not think they poisoned him and if they did there poison does not work because he died traveling abroad in Italy and died in his sleep seems odd he was able to travel so much with poison in him?"
Good Point. But Remember the Jesuits as MASTERS of the Poison cup. They have slow working toxins that work over time, and FAST ones like what they used on their Pope John Paul 1.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@1Historygenius The reason why I suggested in the last post that JP Morgan might have eaten something bad, is because that is the usual means by which the Jesuits poison people who are powerful and who are insiders that might ruin their plans. This is how they got rid of Pope Clement XIV who banned them for all their evils in 1773, Clement knew they were trying to kill him, he died of probable poisoning the next year too. More recently, it was John Paul 1, in 1978. poisoned after only 33 days.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 JP Morgan was just old he died in his sleep probrably of old age.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@WillSee11 At some point during the voyage the wireless machine broke which may be another reason why Titanic did not get as much ice warnings. Then they were backed up with first class messages and that is why when under this huge pressure from the first class messagesthe Titanic Senior operator Jack Phillips told the Californian operator Cyril Evans to shut up causing him to go to bed. Type in on Youtube: Titanic: Death of a Dream (1994) A&E Special - Part 1 and go to 51:36.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius Yes you are correct here. The Titanic 's wireless system failed for a few hours on Sunday, before the accident. (possibly sabotaged by the Jesuits? could be) But Jack Phillips got it working again, and they don't buy and sell stocks on SUNDAY, so nothing was pressing. They Still delivered plenty of Ice Warnings to the Bridge, some marked MSG, meaning the Capt. MUST REPLY. Marconi officers 1st obligation were those HIGH PRIORITY navigational messages. They WERE delivered.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 No they were not oe ice warning came from a ship that had wrote down an ice field but logitude and latitude and sent it to the Titanic but the wirless operators did not send it to the bridge. I do not see how the Jesuits were able to sabotage it when it was working for the entire beggining of the voyage and then just did not work for a couple hours. You have to remember wireless telgraphs were the new toy and on many accounts they sometimes broke down.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@WillSee11 The 4th ice warning was ignored and the other was placed on the bulletin which I said was usually never noticed or it to was ignored. The 6th from the Californian was told to shut up by operator Jack Phillips on Titanicn because the telegraph broke and they were fixing it. So they were backed up with passenger messages which was more important for the operators who wanted to get paid rather then send ice warnings to the bridge. Therefore ice warnins were never important to them.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius So after all of these WARNINGS. Capt. Smith speeds up into a moonless night headed directly into what he should have known (and actually did) was a BRICK WALL of floating ICE CAP, then retires to his quarters. In the meantime, another JP Morgan ship, the Californian, stops its attempt to pass further west into this disaster zone and sends ANOTHER warning being within eyesight of the Titanic. Then the Californian ignores Distress signals, Telegraph and the ship's fog horn. Right!
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 Again most warnings were ignored. How was Smith suppose to know the night would be moonless. If this was a brick wall really the Titanic would probrably stop and not get damaged at all and just stop for the night. Before going to bed he was with Second Officer Lightoller and said: "If something comes up let me know" I am sure if they ended up in front of that ice wall he would have stopped and if he did not again only one compartment would be hurt and it would stay afloat.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius WHAT? Now I won't hold you to this. But did you ACTUALLY mean this? "How was Smith suppose to know the night would be moonless?" Come on now..Almanac, Calendar, the moon on the night before. He could have known 10 years before the night would not have moonlight. Every sea captain knows the phases of the moon. That's ALL you have out there but stars, which they used to navigate.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 Then if he did he did not care they were allready on there voyage. Ismay was telling the Captain to go faster anf faster to beat the speed record her sister ship Olympic made on its maiden voyage. Basically it was buisness over saftey for Ismay and he was on a higher level of authority than Smith. Also JP Morgan was going to be on the Titanic and that is a fact. Why would he want to go on a ship that he knew would sink? He would had been swarmed by passengers..
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@WillSee11 ...passengers asking questions and he survived he would probrably be the most hated man in the world and no one would like him and thus ending his wealth because no one would want to work with him. Morgan was sick and had to cancel boarding the ship.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@WillSee11 Califronan's wireless operator was a sleep. Titanic distress signals were thought to be private signals because of the Titanic did not fire the rockets at one minute intervals and instead between 5 or 6 minutes. These are the reasons Californian never helped.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius Well I think review of the case against Capt. Lord of the Californian are certainly open to public debate, and Capt. Lord doesn't look very good at all. In fact he changes his story as do others between public statements and court records. Most people who read the transcript give him an "F". James Cameron was afraid to even Mention of show the Californian in his film - due to ongoing controversy STILL raging in 1995 over this treatment of the Californian.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 He was not even on the bridge at the time but again the crew of the Titanic were very in experienced and they did not fire the distress rockets at one minute intervals thus they did not mean distress.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius Marconi officers were under very strong constraints to deliver vital navigational warnings and information, which they did. Why did this work on all the other ships? If you Google Bob Tuskin Titanic at about 50:15 you can see the map of this ice shelf that was used in the trial. There are Pictures of this online you can see. The Mt. Temple barely made it through the south end of this shelf in daylight, and would NOT DARE try to aid the Titanic in moonless darkness this route.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 So there is a big Ice shelf. Titanic rams into the ice shelf that they really never knew was there. Titanic will stay afloat. The reason why is because if it rammed into the ice shelf ONLY the first compartment would be damaged. Titanic could stay afloat with 4 compartments damaged. Have you ever heard of the SS Arizona. It collided into an iceberg and stayed afloat the same thing would have happened to the Titanic and this fake Jesuit crap plan would fail.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
Captain Smith did not know because he was held in Belfast with the Oylmpic's damages which he was commanding so he had to be switched to Titanic. But he was not at sea anytime to view your Ice Shelf and the only thing close to that would be the glaciers crashing in Newfoundland which was to far from Titanic's positison
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius You are making excuses for Smith that don't add up at all. As a matter of fact NONE OF this makes any sense at all, including the Californian incident. You still did not address the BOOK, written 14 years BEFORE the Titanic that explained the exact same conditions with the ICE SHELF that were not rare at all in warmer winters. How is it that this book was so EXACT to detail, even with the ship's name? The ONLY difference is the lone ice berg vs. the HUGE ICE cap with Titanic.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 But because of how far the current went south the icebergs did to which means the ice was more southren than usual something Smith was not aware of until he just recived 2 out of 6 ice warnings. And remember these were miscalculated to be more nothrenely by 4th Officer Boxhall. There is no conspiracy. By the way again the brick wall of ice would mean nothing. Titanic had a compartment design and if any 4 compartments were flooded it would stay afloat. head on crash damges just 1.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius So you are saying that steering the Titanic under nearly full speed into an ICE CAP, would not sink it? Was it just going to flounder out there in all of those growlers (small chunks of ice) banging on the paper thin hull? Look at the damage just one small berg did. In the book" Futility- Wreck of the Titan", the ship rolled over. Let's talk about that book. Should we hum the "Twilight Zone" theme when we consider the "coincidental" comparisons between the TITAN and the Titanic!
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 That is a book and not a true story and I have read it and that is not what exactly happened to the Titanic because the Titanic never rolled over. It is a coincidence because the author, Morgan Robertson had nothing to do with Titanic. Robertson had a ship made of steel in his story but Titanic was made of mostly wrought iron so they are not exactly the same. His ship had 24 and Titanic had 20.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius So you are saying here that the book written 14 years before about the fictional ship called the Titan (Google Futility- The wreck of the Titan) was just "coincidental" in that both ships were very similar and sunk after hitting Ice at this location? Maybe Capt. Smith should have READ that book, if as you say, he "accidentally" made the same stupid mistake. OR---Maybe it was NOT a "coincidence" and that JP Morgan and the Jesuits designed Titanic as a DEATH TRAP like the book.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 JP Morgan: "We should build a ship that will cost several million dollars and sink it!"
After this and several years later White Star went bankrupt and is responsible for the end of the gilded age. In other words it made JP Morgan and other rich banker poor not rich.
Jesuit: "Yeah great idea!"
JP Morgan: "I will also add more lifeboats on it to save more people!" JP Morgan had really nothing to do with Titanic because the idea was made by Lord Pirrie and Bruce Ismay.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@WillSee11 JP Morgan never came up with the idea. The Titanic had more lifeboats because by law the abseloute minimum could be 16 but the Titanic actually had 20. In other words you are saving more lifes then loosing them. Also if it was a death trap why did they add so much saftey features? I find it odd they are giving more time for the people to get saved and rescued.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius WHATTT??? Now are you trying to say the Titanic had Special added safety features like 4 extra lifeboats? You got to be kidding here: Your Quote: The Titanic had more lifeboats because by law the abseloute minimum could be 16 but the Titanic actually had 20. In other words you are saving more livesthen loosing them. Also if it was a death trap why did they add so much saftey features? I find it odd they are giving more time for the people to get saved and rescued."
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 Yes it it common sense that it did, thus giving more people a chance of survival. Titanic management which Morgan was NOT part of suggested 4 extra lifeboats also known as collapsibles which would save more people then kill them which if the jesuit plan was to sink and kill certain people why are you giving them more chance of survival. If I wanted to sink the ship I would not make a compartment design at all that could save the ships which is why Titanic was not a jesuit conspiracy.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius Captain Smith was a mass murderer. That was his mission, for the Great Man/God religion these people believe in. Capt. Smith knew the ice field was there, he didn't think they would hit a lone ice berg first, which thew the whole plan into confusion (always a hitch right?) this even caught the Californian off guard as the escort to Titanic's death. JP Morgan, Smith and the Jesuits do not believe the Gospel of Christ. They serve Lucifer, and this agenda. They BELIEVE in Lucifer!
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 There is no evidence Smith killed anyone. They just decide he should do it now? Yes he knew the ice field was there but the only number of ice that would go south was small icebergs or growlers. If Smith wanted to kill these people why did he order an SOS? To many things add up that do not make this look like a conspiracy. Remember the point was to kill Astor, Strauss, and Guggenheim. So they were according to the conspiracy invited on board the Titanic.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius Yes. but remember EJ Smith much earlier piloted the Titanic's sister ship the Olympic into a brush with the MHS Hawk, that split the hull in much the same way the Titanic's hull's split with the ice berg. The Olympic was just outside of harbor, Now if you were Capt. Smith would want to be anywhere NEAR any ICE at all way out at sea. You wouldn't want to hit a duck with a hard hat on, knowing these paper thin hulls would peel open and flood the midship. Smith IGNORED many warnings
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 -__- If you would no anything I said you if you would really know about the Titanic you would that I stated earlier: Captain Smith steered 10 miles south believing that the ice was not so far south remeber the video I told you to go to that you must have not went to. The reason Smith did not sail any further south is because he believed there would be no ice if not little. I now I am going to say again that the science has proven that the Labarador current brought ice further south.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius As I said before, 10 miles South on a course correction was NOT near enough OBVIOUSLY, It doesn't matter what we think he believed. He was headed DIRECTLY into a Brick Wall of ICE that Everyone KNEW and warned him was there! No excuses for EJ Smith's act of mass murder here.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 By everyone you mean two ships and thats it.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius All this talk about the EJ (mass murderer) Smith's position is NONSENSE. He was told over and over the Ice FIELD was as low as 40 degrees Latitude. Where did they find the Titanic? The Location of the heavier wreckage, was found at 49 degrees 56' 49". That is 13.5 miles way north of even where they reported. He should have been at least at about 38 degrees to avoid ANYTHING that would damage this ship---unless he INTENDED to ram the Ice field. History of a Mass Murder here,
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 Again he knew ice fields were there in April. Did he think they were large no. Most ice is melted once it reaches the Gulf Stream to brought hot water and melted the ice. The colder Labrador current however had brought more ice south than expected. He KNEW there was an ice field but ice fields were suppose to be small. Remember these two ice warnings were both calculated to be well north. They did not expect so much none of the officer did, nor Smith, nor Ismay.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius Oopps One apology here. I listed the western Coordinate Longitude which was 49 degrees. For the Record, the heavier wreckage (which is believed to be below the point where the ship sunk) was at 41 degrees 43 minutes, 32 seconds NORTH. But this is still WAY to far North for safe travel. As ships in this area were reporting LARGE BERGS five miles to the south of 41 degrees and flat Ice fields in this area. He should have NEVER been Close to this!
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 These ships reported it but that does not mean Smith go them we are goonjg back to the wireless issue and all I have to say is this: Smith go two the rest he never recieved and 4th officer Boxhall calculated the ice to be well to the north based on these warnings
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius My question is, Have you ACTUALLY looked at the LOG of messages sent on Sunday, April 14th about the Ice field directly in Titanic's path? The wireless system was abuzz with these messages, many of which were received by the Titanic. Capt. Murderer EJ, has obviously seen these messages. Even James Cameron's silly movie has the scene right after the church meeting where Smith stuffs one in his pocket, (probably the message from the Baltic) though the actor mumbles "Nordic" ???
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 Let me give you the list of ice warnings:
1. French liner La Turenne a ship far north of Titanic sends warning calculated by 4th officer to be far north.
2. Rappahannock send morse lamp warning of ice the Titanic replies but this is not posted for captain smith.
3. Caronia a ship OWNED by Morgan warns Titanic. Smith does get this and puts it on the bulletin board 2nd officer says they will reach it at 11. Smith gives 10 miles south order.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius good. Glad your tracking these..you need to list TIME and date.
WillSee11 8 months ago
Don't forget the warnings of Large BERGS and flow ice shelfs SOUTH of 41 degrees N Longitutde. Also Please DENOTE the ones labeled MSG.
WillSee11 8 months ago 2
@WillSee11 Denote the msg ones ok: 2 were only msg
1Historygenius 8 months ago
Were there more than 9 on the 14th? And of course these would be coming in and audible all across the Northern Hemisphere on the nights BEFORE the 14th as well.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 4. Noordam ice warning Smith receives it but does not post since it is the same area as Carona and delays the turn to New York again by 20 minutes to allow the Titanic to sail further south.
5. Baltic: OWNED by Morgan. Reports ice. Smith now more concerened gives it to Bruce Ismay who tells him to speed up to avoid the ice.
6. Amerika reports ice. Not given to captain or officers.
7.Californian. OWNED by Morgan. reports ice it is given to 1st officer who does not post it.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius When the Volcanic plume erupted recently in Iceland, Jets all across Europe were either grounded or re-routed to avoid hitting the air filled with pumice. That is prudent we would agree. But as you point out here, Capt. EJ Smith, has almost a week to avoid this Ice field and then sails right into the middle of it. Does this make sense? Unless he intended to destroy that ship for his Luciferian god.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 These guys in the modern world have radar and you are comparing them to an elderly captain who has never used the maroni system before on his ships. And you think he is confident this thing is good and correct. There are more practical ways to destroy a ship then an icefield. Also WHAT!!! You do not post messages in the log you post them on the bulletin board in the chart room which was ignored.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius You have to remember that LONG before the wireless telegraph,(which by 1912 was really VERY advanced and audible at night up to ranges of 3,000 miles) Mariners and captains had been using Morse Lamps / or reflectors to bounce navigational info across the Atlantic form ship to ship with incredible speed and accuracy. Getting the latest sea conditions was nothing new via all of these systems. Smith really didn't need updates anyway, He knew right WHERE he was going sink the ship.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 New ice warning: "ice field has melted" Yeah sure he did not need updates. This was some of the first times marconi wireless was brought on ships. To bad the records of this ice wall are more north than were Titanic sank.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius No, Marconi, private and Naval wireless operators had been very plentiful since 1906. That is Obvious as to why ALL the Other (large) ships had Wireless Radio operators And NO you did not look at the map of Where the Ice field was reported and WHERE they saw large Ice bergs even five miles to the south of 41 degrees N. If Smith really cared about the ship he would have set course to about 38 degrees instead of being in the middle of the Ice at above 41 degrees.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 Smith does not have to steer clear of the whole field. Remember he has a schedule, he has Bruce Ismay on board and you think he can do whatever he wants. If you are going through the tip of the ice field which is proven true by all maps. Baltic reports: 48, 51 degrees north.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius 1.40 p.m.
14 April 1912
S.S. Baltic to R.M.S. Titanic:
"Captain Smith, Titanic. Have had moderate variable winds and clear fine weather since leaving. Greek steamer Athinai reports passing icebergs and large quantity of field ice today in latitude 41.51 N, longitude 49.52 W.
7.30 p.m.
14 April 1912
S.S. Antillian to R.M.S. Titanic:
"6.30 p.m., apparent time, ship; latitude 42.3 N, longitude 49.9 W. Three large bergs five mile to southward of us".
WillSee11 8 months ago
WillSee11 8 months ago
@1Historygenius 12.17 a.m.
15 April 1912
R.M.S. Titanic to Any Ship:
"CQD CQD SOS Titanic Position 41.44 N 50.24 W. Require immediate assistance. Come at once. We struck an iceberg. Sinking". So far, two ships had responded to the Titanic's distress call. They included the 'Frankfurt', nearly 170 miles away, and the 'Olympic', 500 miles away.
12.20 a.m.
15 April 1912
R.M.S. Titanic to R.M.S. Carpathia:
"Come at once. We have struck a berg. It's a CQD, old man. Position 41.46 N 50.14 W"
WillSee11 8 months ago
@1Historygenius So If you read what I posted here from the BOTTOM UP in order. You can plainly see that Titanic was warned beginning at 1:40 PM by the Baltic that heavy ICE and ICE FIELDS in the middle of the DAY were at 41.51 N. Of course the warnings continue.
NOW WHERE did Titanic report her position? 41.46 N at Midnight when MORE ICE would be expected. The actual wreck was found at 41. 43' 42" They were NOT even close to being in SAFE water.. WHY?
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 You gave one reason why. Miss coordination did the Titanic in but there is always mis coordination there is no high tech computers. How are we sure the Baltic was at its coordinates and as I said Smith had a schedule to keep. It seems odd he would even move south in the first place. Not to mention he sent a distress signal during the sinking. There are so many things that add up to that make it not a conspiracy. Extra lifeboats, extra lifejackets, extra compartments, and other things.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius How can you say EXTRA LIFEBOATS? EXTRA LIFE JACKETS? It took Smith 30 minutes to sent the first QCD / SOS in which time the Californian wireless operator went to bed NOT to be awoken by Capt. Lord on the Californian when they saw the distress flares. Smith dithered and had to be urged to lower the few lifeboats they had. And then there is BRUCE ISMAY who SURVIVED! He should have been on that ship until it went down. NO excuses for Ismay or EJ Smith!
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 Titanic had 4 extra lifeboats than the minimum capacity. Ttanic had exactly 3,560 and Titanic had 2,230 people on board. No he did not. Second Officer Lightoller can prove that. He asked should we put the women and children in the boats sire. Smith gave the order. Bruce Ismay was a hero during the sinking because he helped women and children into the boats. The lifeboats he was at was not entirely full so he boarded it.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@WillSee11 After all on first officer Murdoch's side it was first come first saved which Smith ordered Women and cihildren first then if there were no more standing there he allowed men. But second Officer Lightoller mistakend it for women and children only and thats why Astor and Straus could not board. Lightoller was somewhat pathetic during the sinking. When he saw no more women and children left he lowered the boat one of his had 25 women and children out of 65 spaces.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@WillSee11 And you know what? Before Ismay SPOKE with Smith, the ship was at some 20 knotts but when Ismay spoke with Smith to increase engine speed which is known from survivors the Titanic was now traveling at 22 knotts after lighting the last 2 boilers. So Ismay did speed up and he sailed south. Which every ship did! The Baltic, Amerika, Mesaba and others steered south, but did that mean they avoided the iceberg no they were all near Titanic an all in the ice field.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@WillSee11 So Titanic was like any other ship they sail south to meet less icebergs which sailing south already gives Smith a plus for not being a fake worker for the jesuits which the conspiracy was made by conspirators for profit. How can you say no excuses for Ismay and Smith when they were in charged I think if Morgan was on there he would had done the same things as Ismay after all if he wanted these men dead I should had went but no he was sick.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius The Titanic was made to LOOK like an accident. As we have pointed out, there are way too many holes in this story for any attempted explanation of an "accident" to draw that conclusion. The Jesuit / Rothschild banking agents created the Federal Reserve, the IRS, World War I, the Bolshevik / Communist revolution in Russia, and the lock down on ENERGY use and control thought this mass murder. They server Lucifer, and will DO anything to further this agenda.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 know it was an accident. The only people thinking this is a conspiracy are the people who want to make a profit. That is what you believe oddly enough. WW1 started with the assination of the Archduke in Serbia. Austria wanted police down there and several policies which Serbia refused. Austria declares war on Serbia. Russia on Austria, Germany on Russia, France had an alliance with Russia so the went to war. When Germany invade Belgium Britain is in the war.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius I really wonder where you come up with the idea that "conspiracy theorists" want to make money selling their "theories" How much MONEY did James Cameron make with his blockbuster White Wash film 'Titanic" (BTW, he plans to re-release that propaganda crap again in 3 D next year for the 100th anniversary of this mas murder) You want to talk MONEY? You Got to be kidding! Think of the Federal Reserve Act, the greatest act of white collar crime in HISTORY. You know that.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 And again you ignore the fact that the Titanic movie was made for a love story more than it was for historically accurate. If you knew anything you would no the two and other main characters are fake. Why can't you let people have the freedom to make a movie that they want. You think they can just put everything in it. If it is any proganda it is giving the propaganda that love at first sight can happen.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius You say: "Titanic movie was made for a love story more than it was for historically accurate" I agree, it was PHONY. You say: "Why can't you let people have the freedom to make a movie that they want. You think they can just put everything in it. " LOOK we are talking about HISTORY HERE. It is VERY important that we understand what happened, and WHY? Your are the one who is the "HistoryGenius" Does changing HISTORY appeal to you?
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 Ok then. Then you will agree to not mention any Titanic movie and the Titan. Since that is media and not facts. Your the one who brought them up in the first place.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius Ni I brought up the fictional book written 14 years BEFORE the Titanic on the Wreck of the fictional ship the "Titan" as a clear example of something that was "beyond coincidence with FACTUAL events" that occurred later. I did not pay loose with the actual HISTORY of the Titanic like James Cameron has done. BIG difference. I am specifically NOT re-writing History. but relating to a NOVEL that was written 14 years earlier that predicted the Titanic disaster to a "T". HISTORY!
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 As for the author he was never on the Titanic nor had anything to do with the thing. 14 years before Titanic this guy came with a very imaginary ship. No one had built those big liners yet not Cunard or White Star. I would not say to a T but very close. Her are the slith inacurracies: Titan not Titanic, 24 lifeboats instead of 20, and the biggest one is that the ship rolled over on its side but gravity would hold it down unless the iceberg had a slope.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius I think this IS important. As you point out, the fictional novel ship the "Titan" had 24 life boats, which were not enough for the almost 3,000 passengers on board. The Titanic has EVEN LESS..only 20! Now this number (20) may have exceeded the legal requirement, but it was not "extra" nor was it enough, obviously. In may ways, the Titanic was DESIGNED to be a death trap in excess of the fictional Titan, which I find to be indicative of a "planned mass murder" by the Jesuits.
WillSee11 7 months ago
@WillSee11 IF Titanic was going to be the death trap then we did Olympic only have 20 too since it took no part in the so-called mission. And it was typical for ships to not have enough lifeboats why would big steamers need them? Even Cunard saw no need in excess boats. Bascially ships really never had disasters and if they did have a disaster Olympic proved itself unsinkable with the Hawke accident. Also if the Titanic was being used as the vechicle of destruction why did they build more?
1Historygenius 7 months ago
@WillSee11 But many people had Titanic related incidents.
New York Lawyer Isaac Frauenthal was on the Titanic and had a dream about a steam ship crashed into something and went down. He needed no eoncouragement to get on a boat.
On April 14, 1912, a young scottish girl, Jessie had a vision before she died in the hospital of a ship sinking people dowrning and some guy named Wally playing a fiddle. After hours of her death the Titanic sank with Wallace Hartley in the ship band playing.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@WillSee11 The only holes you can point out is the ship's position. You know why Titanic is so far from its recorded position? The ship was diving down in the war offcourse it would be far from its recored position. And in case you have not noticed: Its the ATLANTIC OCEAN!
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius You don't bother to read or investigate. The position Ballard found the HEAVY WRECKAGE is believed to be virtually directly over the spot that the Titanic sank above. Other parts such as the forth stack broke off and drifted away..but we are talking about big portions of the Iron Keel that drop like a rock, Now in case you didn't notice, the position is even further SOUTH than the reported QCD position that was given by the Titanic. SO,.the were actually south of where they said!
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 The ship was sinking by the bow in a nose dive. So it dove several miles forward and down into the water if it plumbed straight down the bow would be up vertical and probrably be a bigger disaster than it appears.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius You say: "The ship was sinking by the bow in a nose dive. So it dove several miles forward and down into the water if it plumbed straight down the bow would be up vertical and probrably be a bigger disaster than it appears." - NO, what you need to understand is that a large portion of the iron keel was found separate from the wreck, Sinking ships do NOT fly through the air like superman or Air Force One. The go down virtually straight just like a rock in a pool as Ballard said.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 So you are saying it cannot even move a few feet difference as it goes down? SO somehow the ship was able to level itslef when you said it can go straight down. Since the ship was going straight down it would have landed veritcally. Bow down and the stern of the bow sticking straigh up underwater.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@WillSee11 JP Morgan never came up with the Titanic idea he wanted a return on his invesment and he expected White Star to do something if they did nothing he would have just abadoned White Star. It was again J. Bruce Ismay and Lord Pirrie's idea to build the Titanic. There were saftey features on the ship and extra lifeboats and extra lifejackets. Most ice warning swere ignored and few were for the captain. He sailed 10 miles south like any ship anyway.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius SO the Titanic KNEW they were FAR north of where should be, having received WARNING AFTER WARNING AFTER WARNING. The ship was found even slightly south of where they reported their position. What does that tell you? They KNEW they were NORTH of 41 degrees latitude headed INTO heavy ice fields and large bergs...almost five miles thick of BRICK WALL ice ahead. The Californian abandoned any attempt to go through this.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 Everyone miscaultulates how are you so sure the Baltic, Californian, and Mesaba were where they were suppose to be. Not to mention Captain Lord on the Californian thought he saw a DIFFERENT ship possibly and illegal Norweigan shipping boat and how do you explain the fact that the Titanic was not firing their rockets the correct way. It is beleived the Norweigan shipping boat also fired rockets to signals its fisherman in the row boats.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius I think you do a GREAT disservice to the victims of the Titanic, in particular the survivors. Tell me, HOW MANY of their first hand witness accounts have you listened to? Have you heard them with your own ears or watched them say that the Californian was so close they could see people walking on the deck after the Titanic sank and they were all alone out there in the sea? Did you go to Catholic schools under the tutelage of these Jesuit murderers? I really wonder about you.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 You are the one doing the diservice as well as the Jesuits. Do you think the people related to these Titanic victims and survivors like hearing that all there relatives were in a conspiracy that I have already proven wrong in a video on Youtube and a short story on DeviantART. I have read many and Archibald Graice said he saw a bright lght how are you so sure it was the californian many ships were traveling around. And again the rockets did not work they needed to bet at 1 min interva
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius As far as the "Mystery ship" that Californian Capt. Lord claimed must have been in the vicinity of the sinking Titanic---that ship was never verified, identified, or named. It WAS struck down as being real by the investigation and an excuse created in the mind of Capt. Lord. It really didn't matter anyway! Lord was completely negligent in his duties and should have been sent to jail under international maritime law for NOT responding to the Titanic's distress signals.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 I was like you for many years believing Lord should have been jailed but I recently looked it up when somebody said white means part and red means distress. The only sources for the red distress rocket theory was he Jesuit conspiracy, A nazi Titanic movie, and a titanic movie from 1996. But I found out the truth when I looked up the rockets on the Titanic historical society. The white rockets should have been fired at 1 minute inervals rather than 5 but the crew was new.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius The Titanic obviously did not plunge "nose dive" like a dart as you said. Though it sank by the bow, the heavier weight at midship began to level the sinking vessel out in it's decent. to the bottom Ballard and all the other expeditions show that it landed upright, with the bow slightly embedded deeper in the ocean floor, which you can PLAINLY see from all the photographs..Even the rail on the bow (now famous) was still there and intact virtually below where it went down.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 I know I have seen the photographs.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@WillSee11 I have read: Graice, Bride, Ismay, Ryerson, Lightoller (who even said he did not get ice warnings) and was convinced he could see a growler in time to move away (No ship besides the Arizona had really met an iceberg before so close and they were doing standard 1912 things), Edward Brown, Lowe, and I can name more.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@WillSee11 You think they have compuer and can pin point there exact spots. And this is the only strong theory you have. I have stated to you ice warnings were ignored and science which always over theories has pointed out the Labrador current was not suppose to carry ice so far south everyone knows little ice should be able to go into the Atlantic all ice is usually melted in Newfoundland and Titanic was no where near Newfoundland.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius If you notice, it wasn't just the Baltic that knew where this Ice field was. EVERY ship knew in this area. Why not the Titanic? Smith DID know. but he was on a mission to SINK that SHIP. I think you have to come to that conclusion. There are just far too many "mistakes" oversights" miscalculations" and stupidities, for this to be and "ACCIDENT" WAY TOO many. Then you have the MOTIVE. Who Benefits. The Morgan / Rockefeller / Rothschild / Vatican banksters--- who profit on murder.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 And again you fail to remeber most were not received to Captain Smith how do we know this well one of the wireless operators did survive. Harold Bride gave some mesages to the bridge but most were ignored by the crew and they were ignore. And again it was never Morgan's idea to build the Titanic it was made by Ismay and Lord Pirrie. Morgan madea trust and if that company did not give him a profit he would sell it. Titanic was built to keep white star in business.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@WillSee11 Of all stories I know I got one BETTER than Morgan Robertson's Titan. William T. Stead was an English journalist aboard first class on the Titanic. He wrote a stroy about a ship sinking the North Atlantic without enough lifeboats so people died and the survivors were rescued by a ship captained by E.J. SMITH. 20 years later he was last scene ready a book in the first class smoking room on the Titanic. He and Captain Smith lost their lifes on board Titanic.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius Yes, I have read the short versions of thestories that Stead wrote. Though William T. Stead was a spiritualist who conducted seances, and seemed to have a "sixth sense" about future events, his articles were intended to address TWO MAJOR concerns that were very REAL and tangible. 1. The lack lifeboats available on the ships, and 2. The foolish manner in which the captains endangered these ship in Icy waters. What does that tell us about EJ Smith? Another warning at least.
WillSee11 7 months ago
@WillSee11 I do o think Captain Smith could care for these stories if he read them and we do not know if he did. In fact as I have said ice is not usually so far south. Stead was pointing at the facts when he was arguing that ships that took the more nothrenly routes like close to Newfoundland and Maine (Titanic took an ever furthrer southren route). Only so few did as it was protcol to go south in April.
1Historygenius 7 months ago
@1Historygenius Perhaps you are aware of this, but there is an "code of ethics" among these Luciferian believers. They believe in Hiding things in PLAIN SIGHT. In other words, they actually TELL US what they plan to do, not only to fulfill this code, but to alert their other members that these events were indeed created by them for the great man-god religion. It's like the way Jack the Ripper would leave clues. They enjoy this prank which illustrates how STUPID we are, and why they should Rule.
WillSee11 7 months ago
@WillSee11 I found nothing saying they like to hide things in place sight and this so called "conspiracy" has a failure in coordination if they were builing the Titanic how would they be so sure these men like J.J. Astor would be in Europe. Astor just left America because of scandal and went back because his wife was pregnant. Guggenheim and Straus are really the same they maybe would not be there when Titanic was ready.
1Historygenius 7 months ago
@1Historygenius Well I think you actually answered your own questions. the Timing of having Astor and Guggenheim in London was critical. BUT we also had TWO ships. the Olympic and the Titanic, either of which would suit the purpose, and both (ODDLY ENOUGH) had only 20 lifeboats. I think you need to review the Olympic incident again. Capt. Smith nearly sunk the Olympic in port with just a slight bump. It was hardly "unsinkable" in that it almost sunk right there. These ships were deathtraps all.
WillSee11 7 months ago
@WillSee11 True but every ships was a death trap in those days Charles Dickens stated that also. Also it really shows how much you know about Titanic: Astor boarded IN Cherbourg and was in Cairo when he heard about disaster and Titanic was NEVER in London. Nice to know you had wikipedia Jack the Ripper just so he can have a scoop in your endless theories which again have failed except for the coordinates one but ships back then do not have GPS.
1Historygenius 7 months ago
@1Historygenius We also need to recall that the Olympic SURVIVED and actually was in service for 25 years and sunk an enemy ship! BUT this was ONLY after the hull was refitted and fortified way beyond the horrible construction it had almost identical to the Titanic: The Olympic has the unique distinction of being the only vessel of its kind to directly sink an enemy ship without the use of armaments. With its new SUPER HULL it Rammed and sunk a German U-boat! If the Titanic had only been similar
WillSee11 7 months ago 2
@WillSee11 The reason why these hulls were so big is because Ismay could NOT even afford a ship with so much. The real reason why Titanic was built was so they had something to rival Cunard. You do realize the U-boat only sank because it hit Olympic's propeller not its hull. So now you are pulling lies to defend yourself.
1Historygenius 7 months ago
@1Historygenius But getting back to the Luciferian code of hiding things in PLAIN SIGHT. Do you think we really are as STUPID as they say? Have we not learned ANYTHING from that Repeat Offender called HISTORY? What other group of people "agents" that have been thrown out of countries at least 73 times for "conspiracy, treason, political intrigue, subversion, revolution, theft, torture and murder? Can we say the "C" word 'Conspiracy" here if EVER there was one? Are we that STUPID??? No all of us
WillSee11 7 months ago 2
@WillSee11 Yes we have learned about History: Informs us about the past to prepare for the future you obviously skipped that class. Why would countries want to waste their time with Jesuits they are a group we can do without. If the Jesuits are so smart then why do some of there plans FAIL. Like the one where they thought some gunpowder un parliament could blow up the place.
1Historygenius 7 months ago
@1Historygenius the Jesuits are so smart. many prominent people have warned us about them through history. they are the ones that control the secret societies getting them to do the dirty work whilst they stay in the background. even many catholics dont know about them and even more so dont know bout the black pope.
m1onie 4 months ago
@m1onie Could you provide documented evidence? OR is this another conspiracy theory? I am going to guess you are to give that "Secret Instructions of the Jesuits" spin. Even when it is common sense that the bill would have passed even with those 3 wealthy men alive anyway.
1Historygenius 4 months ago
@1Historygenius are you sure it would of passed without the wealthy? are u not even at the slightest suspicious about the jesuit connections with the ship? the rest are just quotes from prominent people they could be wrong about their statements but i think not. i can post them if u wish.
m1onie 4 months ago
@m1onie It is a known fact that President Woodrow Wilson signed the act before he even took office. Originally the act was proposed by the Republicans and was blocked by the Democrats but when Wilson supportred it being a Democrat then the Democrats did as well. Seems like you need no motivation from rich people, all you need is the president. Just because several rich people died does not seem several rich survived to.
1Historygenius 4 months ago
@1Historygenius . You obviously do not understand the revenge factor. It is always a factor.
larosablanca100 1 month ago
@larosablanca100 But it is a factor that had no effect because their is no proof anyone was taking revenge on anyone.
1Historygenius 1 month ago
@WillSee11 Olympic sucked Hawke into it. Titanic sunk New York into. You again decide to put Jesuits before thing that are scientifaclly true. Science > Jesuit. Also that shows how much you do not know about the Titanic.
1Historygenius 7 months ago
@1Historygenius I have to admit that I can barely make any sense out of most of what you write. (And I do try) When you say" Olympic sucked Hawke into it. Titanic sunk New York into" Uh, I haven't the foggiest idea of what you mean? Are you drinking while you write this stuff? We have been over and over the important details about the Titanic and I have yet to hear ANYTHING here that matters even when it does come out coherently.
WillSee11 7 months ago 2
@WillSee11 The suction of the Olympic is what caused the Hawke to collide into it. As the Titanic was leaving port, the New York go caught in the suction of the Titanic and collided into it. It was not typical for ships to catch others in suction.
1Historygenius 7 months ago
@WillSee11 Stead's book is called from the old world to the new.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@WillSee11 8. Mesaba: was not passed to the bridge.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@WillSee11 9. Californian: Told to shut up.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius We should address James Cameron's Smoke Screen Cover-up movie of the Titanic Mass Murder. I'll bet you a nickel, that you can't describe the ONLY reference to the Californian in this multi-million dollar White Wash? Do you know WHY Cameron didn't even touch the Californian issue, unlike Walter Lord's book and movie "A Night To Remember"? (that even mentions the prophetic novel Wreck of the TITAN, 1898) Walter Lord's book really explored the Californian "mystery of negligence".
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 I could care less for the James Cameron movie. The movie is more about drama than history and I am not looking at history from Cameron's point of view I am looking for at drama. You do know there was a scene with the Californian in it but it was a deleted scene. If you reall think James Cameron was in some cover up crap you are wrong. All movies are made for profit. Kind of like conspiracies.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius The point is simply this. Capt, EJ Smith KNEW from his bad experience with the Olympic that all it took was a minor BUMP to split the thin hulls on these ships. Why would he even THINK of damaging a Brand NEW ship. Even IF he was confident in the water tight compartments, he could barely control the Olympic after it hit the HMS Hawk in harbor due to the way it listed. It ruined the drive shaft. Why would he do this in the Mid Atlantic? No excuses, he was on a death mission!
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 Remember he was never on the bridge when the ship hit the iceberg and we now what 1st Officer Murdoch who was in charge should have done. In order to avoid the ice the should have kept the engine at full spees ahead and had the quartermaster turn the wheel. It is assured he could had avoided it. So that is how you avoid the ice.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@WillSee11 Morgan's illness just stopped him from boarding the ship. If he knew what would happen why did he board in the first place? Also JP Morgan NEVER came up with the idea of the Titanic it was Bruce Ismay the manging director of the White Star Line and William Pirrie, owner of the shipbuilding company Harland & Wolf. Also these 3 men were never invited, Astor, Straus, and Guggenheim they had to buy there ticket like everyone else.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius Well I guess JP Morgan had "Lucky Larry Silverstein" moment. You know Lucky Larry right, the owner of the WTC towers, who ALWAYS at Breakfast at the Windows on the World Restaurant? He was Lucky on Sept. 11th, and had to go to a "dermatologist" appointment. So Lucky Larry did not burn up with tenants. I am sure it was "just a coincidence" in the long line of Titanic events that JP Morgan was not on his ship with those he invited. Just Coincidental that he was setting up the Fed.
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 No one was invited everyone had to buy tickets. How else are you suppose to make a proift. For example Colonel John Jacob Astor IV was enjoying his time in Egypt and Europe away from the scandal in America when he made his divorce and married a beautiful young woman. The only reason he went on the Titanic was that he discovered his wife was pregnant so they had to go to America.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius Well JJ Astor really didn't have to dig deep to spring for the ticket, regardless of how his fare was paid, but the vast number of prominent millionaires on board were lured there by the glamor of JP Morgan's persona. Of course EJ Smith (the mass murderer) was not on the bridge. He was comfortably awaiting the Ice field, which they would hit much later. He was SURPRISED and when they (by the grace of God or no one would have survived) hit the iceberg early, as was the Californian
WillSee11 8 months ago
@WillSee11 Yes they were but they all bought tickets. Now we are going back to the ship's construction. No one builds a multi million dollar ship to sink. The Titanic disaster bankrupted J.P. Morgan's IMM trust and the Federal Reserve did not help either. Not to mention it was NEVER Morgan's idea to build the ship. The men who came up with the idea were Lord Pirrie and Ismay. People keep saying this is a conspiracy but if it was the plan was guranteed to fail.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@WillSee11 I already told you if they were going to deliberately sink this ship why did they had saftey like watertight compartments and extra lifeboats and more lifejackets than needed. Remeber of this was a plan it would fail. You said theres an ice wall in front of the ship. Smith rams it rather than stop it and the ship would stay afloat because only 1 compartment was flooding and it could stay afloat with 4.
1Historygenius 8 months ago
@1Historygenius The Titanic murder accomplished EXACTLY what it was intended to do. Eliminate the competition to the Rockefeller / Morgan/ Rothschild / Vatican banking interests. WHO benefits, and WHY? That is what we cal MOTIVE. Do you suppose building biggest international banking swindle the world has ever seen might MOTIVATE some psychopaths? WHO BENEFITED. JP Morgan was hardly broke due to White Star's failure AFTER he died in Rome visiting the Vatican. WHO BENEFITED? FRB Act. WW I? IRS?
WillSee11 8 months ago