choose radical transformation. they got the army and packs of killers we dont. you cant reform the system because everyone in it is contaminated. so hive off within it. own informal currency, cooperation. protests, leave the big bad banks . etc. free america grows, mad america shrivels. till one day its too foul to live on...
If you truly believe that we are at the point where voting doesn't matter you are either delusional or an agent of the Koch brother's and/or their ilk....for your message is music to their ears.
We need to intelligently/effectively struggle on ALL fronts!
heres a thought when can go about getting it by getting off our asses and doing something about "it". whether it be presenting petitions to officials, protesting at the capitol, boycotting a product, working with local governments for new laws, or making smaller changes in the community. How many conversations/discussions/dialogues can we have until we are just regurgitating & recycling the same ideological crap over & over again?
Che also said that the model of the Cuban revolution would be wrong in the USA....he wasn't stupid. In America....getting a 95% turnout rate at the ballot box would be revolutionary.
WE are the majority! That's why cynicism is being marketed so damned hard by the monied interests.
If we get to the point where we have the kind of truly authoritarian regime you see in places like Syria and Russia and China etc it would take the functional equivalent of a civl war.
always refreshing but sad to see that views almost value zero...so keep on working on a masochistic way of life to enjoy beeing a victim all day long???
Sun Tzu in Chapter II Waging Wars says that "There is no instance of a country having benefited from prolonged warfare. It is only one who is thoroughly acquainted with the evils of war that can thoroughly understand the profitable way of carrying it on." This has been interpreted by Lionel Giles as "Only one who knows the disastrous effects of a long war can realize the supreme importance of rapidity in bringing it to a close."
create a new system from within the present so that it can evolve & take over... and if they refuse to fund it, then anything goes... we need change a long time before yesterday & these visionless morons should not be leaders if this is the best they can do
Our leaders are not leading. They need to put their feet in the shoes of working Americans…. Instead, all they think about is re-election and implementing United Nations Agenda 21 and ICELI. If you don't know what UN Agenda 21 and ICELI are, then LEARN before you vote! It's why Obama did nothing to help US people--Obama wants WORLD redistribution of wealth.
and be glad to see the good and influential individuals among them run in debt, because we observe that when these debts get beyond what the individuals can pay, they become willing to lop them off by a cession of lands. ~ letter from Thomas Jefferson to William Harrison - Feb. 27 1803
When they withdraw themselves to the culture of a small piece of land, they will perceive how useless to them are their extensive forests, and will be willing to pare them off from time to time in exchange for necessaries for their farms & families. To promote this disposition to exchange lands which they have to spare and we want for necessaries, which have to spare and they want, we shall push our trading houses,........
do we have the will to rewrite the laws by which each human should behave on his path to happiness? do we have what it takes to get it right this time? can we steer civilization down a road where cities no longer have to rely on imports to sustain themselves because vertical farms provide not only the jobs so desperately needed, but also the food to support the residents of cities? can we look ourselves in the mirror and admit our folly and set things in motion to repair the damage done?
the sad simple fact is that "they" will not stop, they don't care how many people die as long as the accounts continue to grow...they will not stop, they will continue to take and take and take, and the people of this planet will begin to die off until there is no one left except the that richest 1%...so you ask what will it take? public executions, riots on wall st., a complete redesign on how human beings conduct themselves...the question is, do we really have the will?
I believe Americans are already under attack from these traders called republicans. We are being distroyed by there greed. I will make a predicition today and say that the more they try to distroy america from the inside out the more we see you dogs for who you really are, Treason, trader and most of all hell's children. We will have to have a civil war. All who are against these republicans should defend them selfves because they could snapp at anytime. This time put them down for good. get sum
Chuck Baldwin, Ralph Nader, Bob Barr, and Cynthia McKinney were also on the ballot. I voted for one of them. There were also a few great candidates in both the democratic and republican primaries, which I previously mentioned. Listen, I agree with you about mainstream media being poisonous and influencing the populace towards voting for treasonous pricks, but if you fell for it then perhaps you should direct your disappointment inwards and learn from your mistake. THAT's personal responsibility.
ok ok, Monetary Reform is weird... but honestly, its at the core of our problem and the problems of the world. Consider what the IMF is doing to everyone. Watch Economic Hitmen to get a clue. Tell the bankers to pound sand.
If we don't push back against the current trajectory of the oligarchy, then the prospects of an American future with a middle class looks pretty grim.
@IdRevision What I mean is that yes, it does sound very nice, but it's an unrealistic utopia -- which is why I reject it. You see, while a great deal of people out there would (and obviously do) support such a movement, all it takes is one greedy bastard to destroy it all in a heartbeat. I'm sure you've seen that we have no shortage of greedy bastards out there. ;) The only reason it hasn't been brought down already is that the movement hasn't grown large enough yet to be exploited.
A nationwide general strike would do the trick, but I think too many people are still too comfortable and have too much to lose for that to be possible.
Also, stop buying from any company that practices bad politics, minimize use of fuel (just about all the energy companies are evil), buy supplements from the health products store for prevention.
My strategy: donate to progressives during primaries to get them in the pipeline, exercise a lot and eat vegan and vegetarian and farmer's market foods to avoid health problems, make your own or buy used clothing to have money for donations, repair and recycle to help the planet, cook from scratch yourself to improve the health of foods you eat, avoid overpriced brand names altogether (their profits wind up as donations to bad candidates), prescriptions for managing problems.
I'm beginning to think that one of the few things that stands a chance of turning things around by taking power away from the top 1% and from their wicked corporations is ANONYMOUS and ANY DERIVATION THEREOF. We the People have tried Nearly Everything else.
I would say that we could try and CATCH THE ELITES IN THEIR ACTS OF TERRORISM but we've already done this. Take the Underwear bomber for example. But so many IDIOTS STILL BUY INTO THE CRAP ON TV!
I don't like to say it, but I think we need a second revolution, even if it had to be violent. The threat of death is the only thing the elite will understand, they can't relate to the rest of us on any other level. As Jefferson said, the tree of liberty must be refreshed. If the tree needs blood, then so be it.
...can suffer to make our world a better place, or we can all continue to suffer to make their's better. Spineless lefties won't agree with me, and of course the right are scared of these ideas, even though it wouldn't be their necks on the block but their corporate masters, but when you really ask yourself what has to be done, we all know what it comes down to.
I can only recommend the guillotine. A lot of people might think that's a radical idea, to end the life of someone to set and example for those like him, and yeah, I guess it is. But to me it doesn't seem any more radical than say, letting that bastard live so that he can continue to extort well-being from his fellow citizens, cause children in third world countries to starve to death, pillage the planet we all depend on for survival, and ensure that his progeny can do the same. Only a few...
Put power back in the hands of the people?...It...It was there before?
Last I checked power has always been consummated in the few; however some have the sheep following along behind...whilst others have not.
At any rate: Transformation and Reform are both out. What is needed is revolution that leads to the abolishment of government in centralized form. Look to thinkers like: Kropotkin, Bakunin, Goldman, and other Anarchists for inspiration.
@donnyforte2 Unless of course the negative that is the corporate machine is merely the symptom of the form of centralized system that allowed it and encouraged it to spawn in the first place.
@donnyforte2 Exactly, from a meticulous and systematic assertion of a corporate agenda, the aim of which was to slowly decentralize the government stateside, or, failing that, to plant their own stooges in positions of power, a prime example being the FDA, the largest scam since The Federal Reserve. Whether these organizations don't have enough power to do their job, or are administrated by stooges who won't exercise that power means little difference to the right.
@donnyforte2 Yes, it happened gradually...I never claimed otherwise. However, I stand by my proposition...the incremental movements towards Corporate rule could have only occurred with the protection and good graces of the Government. In an Anarchist society, wherein Citizens would be more personally responsible for the world that they live in...We might not even have the sheep that continue to stand unopposed to these injustices..and if we do..in a society where they are accountable...deserved.
"Citizens would be more personally responsible for the world that they live in"
They're responsible for their government.
"have only occurred with the protection and good graces"
And what you're talking about here is a corrupt government. I don't know of anyone that thinks of corporatism as a model government aside from those running it. And thinking anarchist societies are void of the same corruption is just silly.
@donnyforte2 Please, even the ancients understood that democracy is a way of creating a situation that breeds mediocrity and only allows for the illusion of involvement in political process. It's nothing more than a stage for charlatans and sophists. In an Anarchist world, your personal dealings have to be set up by you, for you, nothing is provided. So the world "You" live in is created by "You" and those choices that have weight require deliberation and active participation...
@JRock589 You're a product of your environment. Everything in life requires active participation (even through inaction). There's no such thing as an individual and when you say stuff like "your personal dealings have to be set up by you, for you, nothing is provided," it's bullshit. You thoughts, advances, expansions... are governed directly by your surroundings. You're part of a much bigger collective and you're trying to say you don't benefit directly/indirectly from those experiences.
@donnyforte2 I never sought to suggest that Anarchism does away with human interdependence and solidarity in the form of the collective...Did you see my original post where I listed Kropotkin and Bakunin as thinkers to look to? Are you even familiar with their ideas on human solidarity and human nature? I'm guessing no...I'm done here, you're only becoming increasingly rude as this conversation continues, and making more assumptions about my position without justification.
@JRock589 "their ideas on human solidarity and human nature"
I didn't see this part.... All too often, name dropping is just a way to avoid conversation. It's useless unless you pique my interest with some details and, without that, it's just a way to cage a person without an honest discussion. In short, I want your words, not theirs. Recommend me books when we've come to terms.
@donnyforte2 Fair enough, however these character-limited boxes hardly seem a place to be asking for honest discussion of that caliber. Frankly, my ideals lies with Anarcho-Syndicalism which is centered around direct democracy, voluntarism, and the abolishment of private property. However, I would take a free market Anarchist society over being governed by any force which derives it powers from legitimized force as a reluctant alternative.
@donnyforte2 And, I also recognize that Syndicalism can often come across as idealistic. Which is why I often put forward these ideas ("Austrian economics" as you called them) as being more realistic, and I am actually convinced they could make for a functioning Anarchist Society, although not an ideal one. In terms of human solidarity: that is the centerpiece of all Anarchist thinking, and in fact it all relies upon faith in the voluntarism of others to operate as a unit.
@donnyforte2 Primarily because he gives a readily available resource on one possible organisation for an Anarchist society, and does so with a strong adherence to some very good philosophical principles. So while I disagree with him on what the ideal economic organisation of an anarchist society would be, I do think he articulates things like the Non-Aggression Principle and the focus on the development of Virtue quite well. He also gives a good model for the replacement of public services...
@donnyforte2 ...Which I think is one of the primary issues people who rally against Anarchism have a hard time coming to terms with. So ultimately, I like the guy and his work....As for Fluff pieces, yeah I'll admit he has a good number, but the core reasoning is sound: especially his Philosophy that draws heavily from Aristotelian principles. Plus...he's getting the word out about not needing the State..Can't argue with that effort =)
@donnyforte2 Which is where Kropotkin comes in: One of his primary works "Mutual Aid" is a justification for the belief in humanity's co-operative nature without the need for formalized structure, and he argues this point from multiple standpoints. Another of his works "The Conquest of Bread" puts all the ideas into the context of how that society might look, albeit he focuses largely an agricultural society's, but the points seem to be universally applicable to an ideal organisation model
@donnyforte2 As for the point on Participation: it mainly stems from the fact that life in which the Government provides many of the social networks which would otherwise need to be established organically ultimately creates citizens that are apathetic and detached from one another on a fundamental level. When that organisation is removed, we'll see more "participation" on a personal level that will be required for Society to function. Ultimately breeding responsibility,and a stronger collective
@JRock589 "When that organisation is removed, we'll see more "participation" on a personal level that will be required for Society to function. Ultimately breeding responsibility,and a stronger collective"
You're just painting pretty pictures here, you're not telling me anything.
@donnyforte2 In the name of Zeus, i'm working with a character limit here...The essential idea is by being forced to create stronger affinities with your neighbors for the essentials of life, it will force the individual to have a greater sense of responsibility and ultimately a greater amount of participation in the informal structure of society. By breeding this sort of responsibility it makes Anarchism a more viable ideal by pointing to where the voluntarism will come from to a greater degree
@donnyforte2 You're not a student of Philosophy...are you? Otherwise you'd be used to the painting of pretty pictures when talking about things like this. lol
@donnyforte2 Very true and there certainly is some shit out there.But part of the value of Philosophy is in it's speculative nature that helps to inspire new ideas about how to live life, or about the fundamental aspects of what it means to be human. Some of the greatest figures who act in the "real world" do so based upon those speculative frameworks, and we owe a great deal to Philosophers for just that. Check out Bertrand Russell-"The Value of Philosophy", or Seneca-"On the Shortness of Life"
@donnyforte2 I can go into further detail and attempt to relinquish myself from this free-market box I got myself into...but I would have to leave a million comments to do it justice. I hope this clears things up a bit. Also: Frankly I don't think you deserved conversation as opposed to name dropping for this charade, and requesting it in your last comment made you sound like an arrogant shit. I owe you nothing; what I give you is out of courtesy.
@donnyforte2 All Governments are corrupt, because they rely upon the supposed legitimate use of force based upon arbitrary distinctions. I understand that no-one thinks Corporatism is not the ideal government, I just take it one step further: NO Government is ideal, or useful, and does nothing to breed the sort of world in which anyone would want to live. Also, Anarchism is not devoid of corruption: I don't recall saying that.
@donnyforte2 The point is how the system (or the lack thereof) is able to deal with the corruption that stems from power in it's varying social, economic, and political forms. Personally, I would exchange A Corrupt Central System for: smaller bits of corruption without a big pot of so-called legitimized force with which to stew in any day of the week. Unless of course your suggesting that there is an ideal form of government where bits of paper can restrict human greed for power. Also, your rude
@JRock589 I'm inclined to agree with you, for the most part, but I honestly don't think you're imagining what a world without centralized government would be like. Imagine, say, Afghanistan. There's a world without centralized government. A society with no accomplishments to speak of, and with little power to ensure the welfare of it's own citizens. Small, decentralized local governments could never have a space program, or a well-prepared disaster relief program, for instance. And what would...
@JRock589 ...local government do in the face of an encroaching foreign invasion? I think that centralized government is far too useful to be discarded along with it's problems. We just need a better way to hold that government accountable, i.e., if not to return power to the people, for people to seize power however they can. One other point I have to make is that, without a strong government, all money and power worth speaking of will belong to corporations. Good luck holding them accountable.
@SpookyJohnathan I wholeheartedly appreciate such a well articulated response! Although I will say that I have been an Anarchist long enough to have considered all that you have brought up, and that it is a bit of an assumption on your part that I have not. First off: What sort of decentralized system do you suppose I was envisioning? I would argue that first: Afghanistan is a terrible example given the political climate of the region and the history of the region over the last 100 years...
@SpookyJohnathan ...I could bring up two plausible Anarchist societies that function on most (if not all) the levels you bring up: Anarcho-Capitalism, and Anarcho-Communism. The 1st I would say being the more plausible, but the 2nd being the more attractive as far as ideals are concerned. Free market investment in a Anarcho-Capitalist situation would allow for funding for most of those programs, given individual interest and competent groups willing to take up the banners.
@JRock589 I agree that Afghanistan probably isn't the best example, but there really dosn't seem to be much inbetween a tribal state like Afghanistan is presently, and a strong central government, without handing power directly to corporations, and anarcho-capitalism is a prime example. A corporation's bottom line is, well, it's bottom line. A corp's only responsibility is to it's investors, not to provide people with valuable services, and what's more they have no accountability to the people..
@JRock589 ...outside of the cost vs. supply and demand relationship. Consider the privatized water supply in Atlanta, GA, and other major cities accross the United States. Sure, we like to say the market can decide these things but really, without a strong force to counter the weight of the market, there's no way to combat monopolies like those in Atlanta, and that's simply unacceptable when something as essential as drinking water is on the line. Why would any other commodity be different?
@SpookyJohnathan Actually, the majority of monopolies can in one way or another be traced to Government support, and if they cannot than that is the fault of the consumer for not demanding and standing up for better business practice. Anarchism gives us the Society we Shape by our Autonomous Actions, not the Society we Want regardless of our inability to participate adequately.
@Jrepole92 Ofcourse liberals have an agenda. All political organisations and groups do. You say it like it's somehow innately bad to have a plan for what you want to do.
Or to put it plainly, If I simply replied to you with "No-one wants to hear you try and perpetuate the [insert ideology here] Agenda", would you feel like I had beaten you in the debate? Would you feel like I'd even brought up a relevant argument?
@ArtetlaMusique87 if you truly believe in democracy, then you have to accept what we have is a result of it. If the population is so incompetent they can't vote out corrupt politicians, then how can you still believe this bullshit can work in the real world? The reality is most people have no incentive to care about politics, and the ones that do tend to act in their best interest even if it sacrifices other groups like minorities, the rich, the poor, future generations, other countries, etc.
@ArtetlaMusique87 you do know politicians are elected by the general population, right? You can't shift the blame to some other group that has nothing to do with it.
What we need is to get all the protesters to agree on what we're protesting. The Tea Party movement has been misled into thinking there is a difference whether we have a republican or a democrat in the White House. We don't need thousands of grassroots groups with a few members focused on different issues... We need to somehow get everyone who is pissed off on the same page, and then get them to the same place. Think we can't make a difference? Bullshit. There are literally millions of us.
A Democratic Republic is just as bad personally. Before that we were a Constitutional Republic. When our Constitution limited the size, powers, and spending habits of government.
@katey1dog: "A Democratic Republic is just as bad personally."
But that's what we are. That's what our nation as founded to be: a Constitutional Democratic Republic, not this banana Republic that Ron Paul and co. like to push on us.
No, we were founded as a Constitutional Republic. Both Madison and Jefferson were at odds during the debate and came with this compromise. Madison was for a more Democratic process yet firmly believed in the tenets of the Republic. Jefferson believed in the Constitution which Madison was the father of, yet both feared true democracy.
Untrue. A Constitutional Republic elects the Chief Executive through the Electoral College eliminating the possibility of voter fraud in a Democratic system. The Chief Executive being the President is only the enforcer of laws which the House creates, Senate approves, and the Justices agree or disagree on Constitutionality. It's a perfect system. A system that is dependent upon Checks and Balances. No Branch is more powerful than the other.
@katey1dog I understand how it works, at least in theory. In reality, it's still a democracy with all branches being elected directly or indirectly by voters. A constitution can easily be changed or ignored, and it still gives the government plenty of arbitrary powers to play with.
@katey1dog: " A Constitutional Republic elects the Chief Executive through the Electoral College eliminating the possibility of voter fraud in a Democratic system."
Unfortunately, not only is that untrue, but there is even GREATER, and EASIER potential for voter fraud because electors are like politicians: they can be bought and sold without potentially leaving a paper trail. At least with the voters, any crooks will have a much harder time rigging public votes without somebody noticing.
@MiracleMile90 Unfortunately, not only is that untrue, but there is even GREATER, and EASIER potential for voter fraud because electors are like politicians:
Actually, the 100 Senators might vote independently to elect the President and the Vice President, yet cannot vote twice. Granted, coercion of politicians be it for financial of political gain HAS ensued before, particularly during our FIRST election of the Chief Executive, George Washington. But that was intrigue and popularity.
@MiracleMile90 they can be bought and sold without potentially leaving a paper trail. At least with the voters, any crooks will have a much harder time rigging public votes without somebody noticing.
Of which happens excruciatingly, too much even by todays standards. But research the 1960 Presidential election. Even in THAT election the dead still turned out to vote. Especially in Texas. The dead LOVED Nixon. But even they couldn't beat Kennedy.
@katey1dog I disagree. Right now the House thinks they can hold the U.S economy and global economy hostage unless they get their way. Unprecedented as far as I know. So this branch of gov't(with the fringe right wing extremist tea party) thinks that that is their bargaining chip, and that all the other branches of gov't have to bow down to them or their will be an economic catarastrophe? God, Y'all are #$%!ed up.
@katey1dog: Sorry Katey, but you may want to look up REAL history sometime, instead of the teabagger version. I should also point out that China is a constitutional republic, in theory, as well. Are they free? No, of course not. But unfortunately, there are some who would like to take away the democratic principles in this country, and replace them with something with something like what we see in post-Maoist China, or the Chile & Argentina of the mid-/late '70s.
@katey1dog: China isn't Communist anymore. Although the country does seemingly operate under a socialist veil, what it truly is, is a corporatist banana republic, which, btw, is what the faux Constitutionalists want us to become(as opposed to real ones, who understand the dangers of denying our democratic heritage).
China isn't communist any more. You may be correct. It's a Corporatocracy. But in it's heart and soul, the Party is SMART, but still clings to it's Cultural Revolution.
Radical transformation. I don't disagree that America is bully on the block, but the fact that two countries can legally fight each other over issues most of the citizens don't care about, is wrong. Having the world broken up into countries makes rich countries and poor countries. By having both, it's not an efficient solution to using the world's dwindling resources. But money is getting shifted around... but will someone try to break some skulls in the near future is the question.
Someone will snap and violence will begin. Here's my timeline...
Early 2012: Republicans nominate a Tea Party crackpot (Bachmann or Perry) or Romney wins but the Tea Party splits and tries to run a candidate of their own.
Nov. 2012: Obama wins with ease as a result.
Nov. 2012 to early 2013: Fox News, Rush, Beck, etc. spend all their energy saying someone stole the election and that Obama is not legitimately president.
Early 2013: Someone tries to assassinates the president. Maybe successfully.
Firstly, a new court ruling struck down a law in Arizona that said the government would level the playing field if one political candidate was able to spend a lot of their own money on the race. The courts said it was against the 1st Amendment. So now free speech includes the right to shout others down.
Secondly, most people who go bankrupt because of medical bills have insurance.
Screw the bankster who have rigged this system. I am an oath keeper and part of the 3%.
I find Ron Paul to be the only politician who is not in corporate pocket and is honest. You can disagree with him and know where you stand. A liar like obummer, well he will lie and you will burn!
I yearn for Radical Transformation... I despise Reform and fear Revolution. Because if all we continue to get is Reform, the people who are withheld from attaining true Radical Transformation could potentially revolt. Lest we use needless bloodshed to remove TPTB from power. But, if you are naïve than I must also be. Because I believe radical, positive change can happen in my lifetime.
reform or revolution. well that's going to have to be revolution, the only problem is that if revolution succeeds in toppling a power structure you first get a period of anarchy which, most of the time, isn't pretty.then your going to need a new system because, lets face it, all currently existing systems have failed miserably because of misuse of power, this in turn is caused by a lack of overview of the general population when concerning the actions of their leader('s) (continuation next post)
@lopendepaddo This is the main reason systems of government fail and the main reason why equality between population groups always deteriorates the more people are under one leadership. the ideal society has, I think, a population between 200 and 500 people, much bigger than this and corruption will show its ugly head. we live on a dirtball with 6 bil. people and most of those live in cities with populations above the 10.000 people. too split them up too 500 people per society is kinda hard.
For now, do nothing. I know, it sounds foolish, but look at what's going on: In spite of overwhelming polls to the contrary, in spite of the fact that the Republicans gained the House to bring jobs, which they've failed to, the Tea Baggers are running roughshod over everything. I say, let them. Let them have their way. The system will collapse rather quickly, and the sane people will have enough power to put it back together. Others, sadly, need to learn the hard way.
People die for lack of health care in countries with socialized medicine, so to insist that socialization will eliminate this is a bit bold. Dead is dead. Efficacy is of the utmost importance. Not every socialized health care system succeeds, nor can it be said that they all fail to achieve better care than private medical systems. Pragmatism over idealism my good man. Many "randian regressives" would have some things to say about efficacy and redistribution.
@beenz07 Socialized medicine is better than no medicine, which is the point of socialized medicine. I could care less about how fast or luxurious it is. Need before greed, son!
Learn to take care of yourself on earth, its called independence, and to get it you have to be willing to learn how to survive without the need of others labor.
Canada is WAY too cold. I thought about that too. I've thought a lot about how to change things but the ugly truth of the matter is WE have to make the hard choices independently and collectively if we want to see change. An example is stop investing in the Ponzi scheme AKA Wall Street. Stop trying to be rich. People are almost programmed to desire great wealth and forget to live while they busily chase their elusive dream.
Democracy is the form of government which our Founders were firmly set against. Democracy is the belief that a simple majority can make decisions. But it's the majority that also make the wrong decisions because people vote for the "likable" candidate, not the necessary one.
As Ben Franklin put it, "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote."
We need to stop supporting corporations with our money, remember the phrase, starve the beast. We also need to stop operating in our normal lives like the Egyptians and the Tunisians and sit in our square and not move till the govt meets our demands. We can learn from them. If only we have the will to do it!
There will be a radical transformation or some kind brought together by the REAL people like scientists, engineers, academics, etc. The fascist oligarchy we have today is just a natural progression of the price system. So, I don't believe in those crazy ass conspiracy theories. How do we fix it? Well, in truth, we need to create a new social system that is science based and humanitarian. Technocracy is one such idea that was created by influential people like R.C. Tolman and M.K. Hubbert.
Reform won't happen because of corporations. Most ppl can be bought. So revolution is the next solution, but ppl will have to die for it. I don't know if Americans are ready for that. Sometimes I don't even know if I am ready for it either. i guess when it gets bad enough I will. And I think this is how most of America thinks at this point.
(...) less fuss, and smaller profits. America is just the worst-case scenario, but all other countries have bullshit in their systems. Bullshit is built in the system, and there is really no way around it. It only stands if we somehow manage not to look, not to light that small spark, not to wield our blades.
Burn it all. Whatever's real doesn't need any of our protection, and the rest is just bullshit anyways.
What we need are sharp blades, or maybe just a spark. You see, all of this democracy, anarchy, capitalism, free market... all these concepts, and the institutions built upon them, are highly flammable, almost explosive. The only way to live with them is by not looking, and what you, Mr. Dennis Trainor Jr., do in these videos is to look. That's why it shakes people awake, and makes them angry too. The deal is that there is no safe haven, no salvation. Canada is just the same lies, but with (...)
@Desslock85 Compared with what? Oligarchy? REALLY? So Scandinavia THE most DEMOCRATIC states on the planet with THE best results on just about EVERY social indicator are not to be admired WHY? Yeah it's VERY clear the right wing in the US are becoming NAKEDLY fascist and antitruth and reality!
@ncftTV What ever path we take we must never abandon the rights of Assembly, Association, & Anonymity. Founding Father Thomas Paine said "An avidity to punish is always dangerous to liberty. It leads men to stretch, to misinterpret, & to misapply even the best of laws. He that would make his own liberty secure must guard even his enemy from oppression; for if he violates this duty he establishes a precedent that will reach to himself."
@ebent24 Through six degrees of separation we can only progress society to prosperity as one with critical thinking & discussion of the issues immediate, large or small. John Fitzgerald Kennedy said "Without debate, without criticism, no Administration & no country can succeed — & no republic can survive. That is why the Athenian lawmaker Solon decreed it a crime for any citizen to shrink from controversy."
@ebent24 That is why we must avoid the root of all problems assumption & ignorance so that for no reason should we compromise honest moral values towards the natural liberties of humanity we all share Desmond Mpilo Tutu Archbishop of Cape Town. said "My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together." As nations also as citizens of planet earth
While reform and revolution are perhaps the two best words to use they are also very likely to be taken and spun by the MSM (main stream media) into something super negative and scary and create a huge boogie man of the cause.
While I believe that we need less MSM influence in this country I also understand that it's so rooted into the system that it's almost too big to fight effectively. Almost.
Things need to change now, or we will have a revolution later. I don't know how it'll start.
@russkeller actually there is- not from the standpoint of the politicians but from the people. If the people don't think the constitution is worth anything then what are they going to supplant it with
the constitution is dead and has been from the standpoint of tptb but if it dies amonst the people then I doubt that we could ressurect it in any form
Honestly, I don't have an answer -- at least, not a good one.
Revolution almost always ends up with us having a worse government than the one in which it replaced. Look at Cuba for our most recent example of this.
Reform? What would the new reform look like, and how do we get that reform past the Corporations' watchdogs who guard Washington the way Cerberus guards the gates of hell?!?
As to "Radical Transformation," before I can even comment on its feasibility we have to know what it is.
It's gonna have to be a revolution. It could be socialist/green/anarchist/communist or a combo. I can't understand for the life of me why anyone would think electing a Libertarian into office would fix anything, it would make things worse as the gap between rich and poor would increase even more and people would be reduced to levels of third world poverty, which would fuck the economy even more since no one will be able to buy anything. We would be living in a permant depression.
choose radical transformation. they got the army and packs of killers we dont. you cant reform the system because everyone in it is contaminated. so hive off within it. own informal currency, cooperation. protests, leave the big bad banks . etc. free america grows, mad america shrivels. till one day its too foul to live on...
3leopardsblue 3 months ago
If you truly believe that we are at the point where voting doesn't matter you are either delusional or an agent of the Koch brother's and/or their ilk....for your message is music to their ears.
We need to intelligently/effectively struggle on ALL fronts!
nilent 4 months ago
heres a thought when can go about getting it by getting off our asses and doing something about "it". whether it be presenting petitions to officials, protesting at the capitol, boycotting a product, working with local governments for new laws, or making smaller changes in the community. How many conversations/discussions/dialogues can we have until we are just regurgitating & recycling the same ideological crap over & over again?
try2openyoureyes 5 months ago
The revolution is not an apple that falls when it is ripe. You have to make it fall. - Che Guevara
try2openyoureyes 5 months ago
@try2openyoureyes
Che also said that the model of the Cuban revolution would be wrong in the USA....he wasn't stupid. In America....getting a 95% turnout rate at the ballot box would be revolutionary.
WE are the majority! That's why cynicism is being marketed so damned hard by the monied interests.
If we get to the point where we have the kind of truly authoritarian regime you see in places like Syria and Russia and China etc it would take the functional equivalent of a civl war.
nilent 4 months ago
always refreshing but sad to see that views almost value zero...so keep on working on a masochistic way of life to enjoy beeing a victim all day long???
NeidhardtMatthias 5 months ago
Sun Tzu in Chapter II Waging Wars says that "There is no instance of a country having benefited from prolonged warfare. It is only one who is thoroughly acquainted with the evils of war that can thoroughly understand the profitable way of carrying it on." This has been interpreted by Lionel Giles as "Only one who knows the disastrous effects of a long war can realize the supreme importance of rapidity in bringing it to a close."
ThePositiveAussie 6 months ago
It's called REVOLUTION!
Ron Paul Revolution, Google it up!
bmhcj6gg 6 months ago
Don't move to commie Kanada, everything here seems good on paper, but we have restricted freedom.
Montyfiable 6 months ago
create a new system from within the present so that it can evolve & take over... and if they refuse to fund it, then anything goes... we need change a long time before yesterday & these visionless morons should not be leaders if this is the best they can do
tarose71 6 months ago
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Our leaders are not leading. They need to put their feet in the shoes of working Americans…. Instead, all they think about is re-election and implementing United Nations Agenda 21 and ICELI. If you don't know what UN Agenda 21 and ICELI are, then LEARN before you vote! It's why Obama did nothing to help US people--Obama wants WORLD redistribution of wealth.
vechorik 6 months ago
Supreme Court justices need to have their life tenures removed for starters !
luchpockets 6 months ago
put obamas ass in jail. He ain't gonna see his little girlly girls grow up due to his war crimes =)
JazzRabbit086 6 months ago
and be glad to see the good and influential individuals among them run in debt, because we observe that when these debts get beyond what the individuals can pay, they become willing to lop them off by a cession of lands. ~ letter from Thomas Jefferson to William Harrison - Feb. 27 1803
theRevolutionof2012 6 months ago
When they withdraw themselves to the culture of a small piece of land, they will perceive how useless to them are their extensive forests, and will be willing to pare them off from time to time in exchange for necessaries for their farms & families. To promote this disposition to exchange lands which they have to spare and we want for necessaries, which have to spare and they want, we shall push our trading houses,........
theRevolutionof2012 6 months ago
sadly i just don't see it happening...
revolt81 6 months ago
do we have the will to rewrite the laws by which each human should behave on his path to happiness? do we have what it takes to get it right this time? can we steer civilization down a road where cities no longer have to rely on imports to sustain themselves because vertical farms provide not only the jobs so desperately needed, but also the food to support the residents of cities? can we look ourselves in the mirror and admit our folly and set things in motion to repair the damage done?
revolt81 6 months ago
the sad simple fact is that "they" will not stop, they don't care how many people die as long as the accounts continue to grow...they will not stop, they will continue to take and take and take, and the people of this planet will begin to die off until there is no one left except the that richest 1%...so you ask what will it take? public executions, riots on wall st., a complete redesign on how human beings conduct themselves...the question is, do we really have the will?
revolt81 6 months ago
I believe Americans are already under attack from these traders called republicans. We are being distroyed by there greed. I will make a predicition today and say that the more they try to distroy america from the inside out the more we see you dogs for who you really are, Treason, trader and most of all hell's children. We will have to have a civil war. All who are against these republicans should defend them selfves because they could snapp at anytime. This time put them down for good. get sum
40247 6 months ago 2
Chuck Baldwin, Ralph Nader, Bob Barr, and Cynthia McKinney were also on the ballot. I voted for one of them. There were also a few great candidates in both the democratic and republican primaries, which I previously mentioned. Listen, I agree with you about mainstream media being poisonous and influencing the populace towards voting for treasonous pricks, but if you fell for it then perhaps you should direct your disappointment inwards and learn from your mistake. THAT's personal responsibility.
glassandsteel 6 months ago
Zeitgeist Movement and Venus Project -The ONLY way out!!! google also Jordan Maxwell. Get informed
willywillyization 6 months ago
Here's my stupid list, like it matters:
1. Military withdrawl
2. End the war on drugs
3. Medicare for all, Now
4. Monetary Reform
ok ok, Monetary Reform is weird... but honestly, its at the core of our problem and the problems of the world. Consider what the IMF is doing to everyone. Watch Economic Hitmen to get a clue. Tell the bankers to pound sand.
etzel33 7 months ago
@etzel33 Great list , not sure why people arent getting it .
marco9bear 6 months ago
This is a great one to re-watch. Inspiring stuff Dennis.
etzel33 7 months ago
If we don't push back against the current trajectory of the oligarchy, then the prospects of an American future with a middle class looks pretty grim.
514Climber 7 months ago
@IdRevision What I mean is that yes, it does sound very nice, but it's an unrealistic utopia -- which is why I reject it. You see, while a great deal of people out there would (and obviously do) support such a movement, all it takes is one greedy bastard to destroy it all in a heartbeat. I'm sure you've seen that we have no shortage of greedy bastards out there. ;) The only reason it hasn't been brought down already is that the movement hasn't grown large enough yet to be exploited.
darkridr25 7 months ago
A nationwide general strike would do the trick, but I think too many people are still too comfortable and have too much to lose for that to be possible.
thethegreenmachine 7 months ago
moonlandings were part of the American Dream
marktimmer2212 7 months ago
@IdRevision Sorry about that. Here you go: watch?v=Fwcd01i-S1o
darkridr25 7 months ago
Also, stop buying from any company that practices bad politics, minimize use of fuel (just about all the energy companies are evil), buy supplements from the health products store for prevention.
splaaaack 7 months ago
My strategy: donate to progressives during primaries to get them in the pipeline, exercise a lot and eat vegan and vegetarian and farmer's market foods to avoid health problems, make your own or buy used clothing to have money for donations, repair and recycle to help the planet, cook from scratch yourself to improve the health of foods you eat, avoid overpriced brand names altogether (their profits wind up as donations to bad candidates), prescriptions for managing problems.
splaaaack 7 months ago
I'm beginning to think that one of the few things that stands a chance of turning things around by taking power away from the top 1% and from their wicked corporations is ANONYMOUS and ANY DERIVATION THEREOF. We the People have tried Nearly Everything else.
I would say that we could try and CATCH THE ELITES IN THEIR ACTS OF TERRORISM but we've already done this. Take the Underwear bomber for example. But so many IDIOTS STILL BUY INTO THE CRAP ON TV!
Hopefully MURDOCH and the like GO DOWN!
rdority 7 months ago
@IdRevision Hello sir. I looked up that project, and reject it thoroughly. See part one of the video for my full comment on why.
darkridr25 7 months ago
I don't like to say it, but I think we need a second revolution, even if it had to be violent. The threat of death is the only thing the elite will understand, they can't relate to the rest of us on any other level. As Jefferson said, the tree of liberty must be refreshed. If the tree needs blood, then so be it.
DarkPonzu 7 months ago
I say we take off and nuke the entire site from orbit !
Can i get a ' Fukin A '
twistedbass15 7 months ago
...can suffer to make our world a better place, or we can all continue to suffer to make their's better. Spineless lefties won't agree with me, and of course the right are scared of these ideas, even though it wouldn't be their necks on the block but their corporate masters, but when you really ask yourself what has to be done, we all know what it comes down to.
SpookyJohnathan 7 months ago
I can only recommend the guillotine. A lot of people might think that's a radical idea, to end the life of someone to set and example for those like him, and yeah, I guess it is. But to me it doesn't seem any more radical than say, letting that bastard live so that he can continue to extort well-being from his fellow citizens, cause children in third world countries to starve to death, pillage the planet we all depend on for survival, and ensure that his progeny can do the same. Only a few...
SpookyJohnathan 7 months ago
You have purrrdy eyes.
aznlalaland 7 months ago
Burn the fucking buildings down. Just kidding.
chefbakercook 7 months ago
Put power back in the hands of the people?...It...It was there before?
Last I checked power has always been consummated in the few; however some have the sheep following along behind...whilst others have not.
At any rate: Transformation and Reform are both out. What is needed is revolution that leads to the abolishment of government in centralized form. Look to thinkers like: Kropotkin, Bakunin, Goldman, and other Anarchists for inspiration.
JRock589 7 months ago
@JRock589 This has less to do with centralized government and more to do with corporate interests, power, and influence.
donnyforte2 7 months ago
@donnyforte2 Unless of course the negative that is the corporate machine is merely the symptom of the form of centralized system that allowed it and encouraged it to spawn in the first place.
JRock589 7 months ago
@JRock589 "centralized system that allowed it and encouraged it to spawn in the first place."
This didn't happen overnight. The corporate takeover of government was decades in the making; from propaganda to education or lack thereof.
donnyforte2 7 months ago
@donnyforte2 Exactly, from a meticulous and systematic assertion of a corporate agenda, the aim of which was to slowly decentralize the government stateside, or, failing that, to plant their own stooges in positions of power, a prime example being the FDA, the largest scam since The Federal Reserve. Whether these organizations don't have enough power to do their job, or are administrated by stooges who won't exercise that power means little difference to the right.
SpookyJohnathan 7 months ago
@donnyforte2 Yes, it happened gradually...I never claimed otherwise. However, I stand by my proposition...the incremental movements towards Corporate rule could have only occurred with the protection and good graces of the Government. In an Anarchist society, wherein Citizens would be more personally responsible for the world that they live in...We might not even have the sheep that continue to stand unopposed to these injustices..and if we do..in a society where they are accountable...deserved.
JRock589 7 months ago
@JRock589 "In an Anarchist society"
You lost me.
"Citizens would be more personally responsible for the world that they live in"
They're responsible for their government.
"have only occurred with the protection and good graces"
And what you're talking about here is a corrupt government. I don't know of anyone that thinks of corporatism as a model government aside from those running it. And thinking anarchist societies are void of the same corruption is just silly.
donnyforte2 7 months ago
@donnyforte2 Please, even the ancients understood that democracy is a way of creating a situation that breeds mediocrity and only allows for the illusion of involvement in political process. It's nothing more than a stage for charlatans and sophists. In an Anarchist world, your personal dealings have to be set up by you, for you, nothing is provided. So the world "You" live in is created by "You" and those choices that have weight require deliberation and active participation...
JRock589 7 months ago
@JRock589 You're a product of your environment. Everything in life requires active participation (even through inaction). There's no such thing as an individual and when you say stuff like "your personal dealings have to be set up by you, for you, nothing is provided," it's bullshit. You thoughts, advances, expansions... are governed directly by your surroundings. You're part of a much bigger collective and you're trying to say you don't benefit directly/indirectly from those experiences.
donnyforte2 7 months ago
@donnyforte2 I never sought to suggest that Anarchism does away with human interdependence and solidarity in the form of the collective...Did you see my original post where I listed Kropotkin and Bakunin as thinkers to look to? Are you even familiar with their ideas on human solidarity and human nature? I'm guessing no...I'm done here, you're only becoming increasingly rude as this conversation continues, and making more assumptions about my position without justification.
JRock589 7 months ago
@JRock589 [insert rude comment here]
I'm not a fan of Austrian economics.
"I'm done"
Ciao. Live long and prosper.
donnyforte2 7 months ago
@JRock589 "their ideas on human solidarity and human nature"
I didn't see this part.... All too often, name dropping is just a way to avoid conversation. It's useless unless you pique my interest with some details and, without that, it's just a way to cage a person without an honest discussion. In short, I want your words, not theirs. Recommend me books when we've come to terms.
donnyforte2 7 months ago
@donnyforte2 Fair enough, however these character-limited boxes hardly seem a place to be asking for honest discussion of that caliber. Frankly, my ideals lies with Anarcho-Syndicalism which is centered around direct democracy, voluntarism, and the abolishment of private property. However, I would take a free market Anarchist society over being governed by any force which derives it powers from legitimized force as a reluctant alternative.
JRock589 7 months ago
@donnyforte2 And, I also recognize that Syndicalism can often come across as idealistic. Which is why I often put forward these ideas ("Austrian economics" as you called them) as being more realistic, and I am actually convinced they could make for a functioning Anarchist Society, although not an ideal one. In terms of human solidarity: that is the centerpiece of all Anarchist thinking, and in fact it all relies upon faith in the voluntarism of others to operate as a unit.
JRock589 7 months ago
@JRock589 Well, you're the one who tossed me that stefbot link. And I think he does a lot of fluff pieces.
donnyforte2 7 months ago
@donnyforte2 Primarily because he gives a readily available resource on one possible organisation for an Anarchist society, and does so with a strong adherence to some very good philosophical principles. So while I disagree with him on what the ideal economic organisation of an anarchist society would be, I do think he articulates things like the Non-Aggression Principle and the focus on the development of Virtue quite well. He also gives a good model for the replacement of public services...
JRock589 7 months ago
@donnyforte2 ...Which I think is one of the primary issues people who rally against Anarchism have a hard time coming to terms with. So ultimately, I like the guy and his work....As for Fluff pieces, yeah I'll admit he has a good number, but the core reasoning is sound: especially his Philosophy that draws heavily from Aristotelian principles. Plus...he's getting the word out about not needing the State..Can't argue with that effort =)
JRock589 7 months ago
@donnyforte2 Which is where Kropotkin comes in: One of his primary works "Mutual Aid" is a justification for the belief in humanity's co-operative nature without the need for formalized structure, and he argues this point from multiple standpoints. Another of his works "The Conquest of Bread" puts all the ideas into the context of how that society might look, albeit he focuses largely an agricultural society's, but the points seem to be universally applicable to an ideal organisation model
JRock589 7 months ago
@donnyforte2 As for the point on Participation: it mainly stems from the fact that life in which the Government provides many of the social networks which would otherwise need to be established organically ultimately creates citizens that are apathetic and detached from one another on a fundamental level. When that organisation is removed, we'll see more "participation" on a personal level that will be required for Society to function. Ultimately breeding responsibility,and a stronger collective
JRock589 7 months ago
@JRock589 "When that organisation is removed, we'll see more "participation" on a personal level that will be required for Society to function. Ultimately breeding responsibility,and a stronger collective"
You're just painting pretty pictures here, you're not telling me anything.
donnyforte2 7 months ago
@donnyforte2 In the name of Zeus, i'm working with a character limit here...The essential idea is by being forced to create stronger affinities with your neighbors for the essentials of life, it will force the individual to have a greater sense of responsibility and ultimately a greater amount of participation in the informal structure of society. By breeding this sort of responsibility it makes Anarchism a more viable ideal by pointing to where the voluntarism will come from to a greater degree
JRock589 7 months ago
@donnyforte2 You're not a student of Philosophy...are you? Otherwise you'd be used to the painting of pretty pictures when talking about things like this. lol
JRock589 7 months ago
@JRock589 Well, there is a lot of shit philosophy and it doesn't mean it'll translate in the real world.
donnyforte2 7 months ago
@donnyforte2 Very true and there certainly is some shit out there.But part of the value of Philosophy is in it's speculative nature that helps to inspire new ideas about how to live life, or about the fundamental aspects of what it means to be human. Some of the greatest figures who act in the "real world" do so based upon those speculative frameworks, and we owe a great deal to Philosophers for just that. Check out Bertrand Russell-"The Value of Philosophy", or Seneca-"On the Shortness of Life"
JRock589 7 months ago
@donnyforte2 I can go into further detail and attempt to relinquish myself from this free-market box I got myself into...but I would have to leave a million comments to do it justice. I hope this clears things up a bit. Also: Frankly I don't think you deserved conversation as opposed to name dropping for this charade, and requesting it in your last comment made you sound like an arrogant shit. I owe you nothing; what I give you is out of courtesy.
JRock589 7 months ago
@donnyforte2 All Governments are corrupt, because they rely upon the supposed legitimate use of force based upon arbitrary distinctions. I understand that no-one thinks Corporatism is not the ideal government, I just take it one step further: NO Government is ideal, or useful, and does nothing to breed the sort of world in which anyone would want to live. Also, Anarchism is not devoid of corruption: I don't recall saying that.
JRock589 7 months ago
@JRock589 "Also, Anarchism is not devoid of corruption: I don't recall saying that."
One corrupt system for another. Makes perfect sense.
donnyforte2 7 months ago
@donnyforte2 The point is how the system (or the lack thereof) is able to deal with the corruption that stems from power in it's varying social, economic, and political forms. Personally, I would exchange A Corrupt Central System for: smaller bits of corruption without a big pot of so-called legitimized force with which to stew in any day of the week. Unless of course your suggesting that there is an ideal form of government where bits of paper can restrict human greed for power. Also, your rude
JRock589 7 months ago
@JRock589 I'm inclined to agree with you, for the most part, but I honestly don't think you're imagining what a world without centralized government would be like. Imagine, say, Afghanistan. There's a world without centralized government. A society with no accomplishments to speak of, and with little power to ensure the welfare of it's own citizens. Small, decentralized local governments could never have a space program, or a well-prepared disaster relief program, for instance. And what would...
SpookyJohnathan 7 months ago
@JRock589 ...local government do in the face of an encroaching foreign invasion? I think that centralized government is far too useful to be discarded along with it's problems. We just need a better way to hold that government accountable, i.e., if not to return power to the people, for people to seize power however they can. One other point I have to make is that, without a strong government, all money and power worth speaking of will belong to corporations. Good luck holding them accountable.
SpookyJohnathan 7 months ago
@SpookyJohnathan I wholeheartedly appreciate such a well articulated response! Although I will say that I have been an Anarchist long enough to have considered all that you have brought up, and that it is a bit of an assumption on your part that I have not. First off: What sort of decentralized system do you suppose I was envisioning? I would argue that first: Afghanistan is a terrible example given the political climate of the region and the history of the region over the last 100 years...
JRock589 7 months ago
@SpookyJohnathan ...I could bring up two plausible Anarchist societies that function on most (if not all) the levels you bring up: Anarcho-Capitalism, and Anarcho-Communism. The 1st I would say being the more plausible, but the 2nd being the more attractive as far as ideals are concerned. Free market investment in a Anarcho-Capitalist situation would allow for funding for most of those programs, given individual interest and competent groups willing to take up the banners.
JRock589 7 months ago
@JRock589 I agree that Afghanistan probably isn't the best example, but there really dosn't seem to be much inbetween a tribal state like Afghanistan is presently, and a strong central government, without handing power directly to corporations, and anarcho-capitalism is a prime example. A corporation's bottom line is, well, it's bottom line. A corp's only responsibility is to it's investors, not to provide people with valuable services, and what's more they have no accountability to the people..
SpookyJohnathan 7 months ago
@JRock589 ...outside of the cost vs. supply and demand relationship. Consider the privatized water supply in Atlanta, GA, and other major cities accross the United States. Sure, we like to say the market can decide these things but really, without a strong force to counter the weight of the market, there's no way to combat monopolies like those in Atlanta, and that's simply unacceptable when something as essential as drinking water is on the line. Why would any other commodity be different?
SpookyJohnathan 7 months ago
@SpookyJohnathan Actually, the majority of monopolies can in one way or another be traced to Government support, and if they cannot than that is the fault of the consumer for not demanding and standing up for better business practice. Anarchism gives us the Society we Shape by our Autonomous Actions, not the Society we Want regardless of our inability to participate adequately.
JRock589 7 months ago
@SpookyJohnathan "that's simply unacceptable when something as essential as drinking water is on the line"
Exactly. But you won't hear an honest answer to concerns of this nature. It's the same for environmental issues.
donnyforte2 7 months ago
catastrophe, I mean.
johnnyyow 7 months ago
"you are watching acronym because you love to hear a liberal agenda"
Jrepole92 7 months ago
@Jrepole92 Ofcourse liberals have an agenda. All political organisations and groups do. You say it like it's somehow innately bad to have a plan for what you want to do.
Or to put it plainly, If I simply replied to you with "No-one wants to hear you try and perpetuate the [insert ideology here] Agenda", would you feel like I had beaten you in the debate? Would you feel like I'd even brought up a relevant argument?
OatSharpener 7 months ago
@Jrepole92 TROLL!
psychokillercrab 7 months ago
@ArtetlaMusique87 if you truly believe in democracy, then you have to accept what we have is a result of it. If the population is so incompetent they can't vote out corrupt politicians, then how can you still believe this bullshit can work in the real world? The reality is most people have no incentive to care about politics, and the ones that do tend to act in their best interest even if it sacrifices other groups like minorities, the rich, the poor, future generations, other countries, etc.
Houshalter 7 months ago
@ArtetlaMusique87 you do know politicians are elected by the general population, right? You can't shift the blame to some other group that has nothing to do with it.
Houshalter 7 months ago
I'm working on a platform to help everyone in the world work together. Check it out - Group Effect
ginoItalianino 7 months ago
Are you going to arrest obama since you think he along with bush are war criminals if you're successful?
SnEaKyBoT 7 months ago
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whatis-theplan[dot]org. Join us.
oexnorth 7 months ago
aging hipster.
RalphRules92 7 months ago
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I don't like you. Hate me? spam me dislike?
Grusum2 7 months ago
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What we need is to get all the protesters to agree on what we're protesting. The Tea Party movement has been misled into thinking there is a difference whether we have a republican or a democrat in the White House. We don't need thousands of grassroots groups with a few members focused on different issues... We need to somehow get everyone who is pissed off on the same page, and then get them to the same place. Think we can't make a difference? Bullshit. There are literally millions of us.
Adarascarlet 7 months ago
non copliance but hold to organise it globally
jasonzwsa 7 months ago
voting doesn't matter? theres been a lot of uncorporate candidates.
look at bernie sanders of vermont, the senator of wisconsin/etc.
Vide0buzz 7 months ago
I like this person, probably since I'm not an american.
TheKamikazeen 7 months ago
@ArtetlaMusique87
A Democratic Republic is just as bad personally. Before that we were a Constitutional Republic. When our Constitution limited the size, powers, and spending habits of government.
But you are right, we are a Corporatocracy.
katey1dog 7 months ago
@katey1dog: "A Democratic Republic is just as bad personally."
But that's what we are. That's what our nation as founded to be: a Constitutional Democratic Republic, not this banana Republic that Ron Paul and co. like to push on us.
MiracleMile90 7 months ago
@MiracleMile90
No, we were founded as a Constitutional Republic. Both Madison and Jefferson were at odds during the debate and came with this compromise. Madison was for a more Democratic process yet firmly believed in the tenets of the Republic. Jefferson believed in the Constitution which Madison was the father of, yet both feared true democracy.
So, the Constitutional Republic was born.
katey1dog 7 months ago
@katey1dog a constitutional republic has all the same problems that regular democracy does.
Houshalter 7 months ago
@Houshalter
Untrue. A Constitutional Republic elects the Chief Executive through the Electoral College eliminating the possibility of voter fraud in a Democratic system. The Chief Executive being the President is only the enforcer of laws which the House creates, Senate approves, and the Justices agree or disagree on Constitutionality. It's a perfect system. A system that is dependent upon Checks and Balances. No Branch is more powerful than the other.
katey1dog 7 months ago
@katey1dog I understand how it works, at least in theory. In reality, it's still a democracy with all branches being elected directly or indirectly by voters. A constitution can easily be changed or ignored, and it still gives the government plenty of arbitrary powers to play with.
Houshalter 7 months ago
@katey1dog: " A Constitutional Republic elects the Chief Executive through the Electoral College eliminating the possibility of voter fraud in a Democratic system."
Unfortunately, not only is that untrue, but there is even GREATER, and EASIER potential for voter fraud because electors are like politicians: they can be bought and sold without potentially leaving a paper trail. At least with the voters, any crooks will have a much harder time rigging public votes without somebody noticing.
MiracleMile90 7 months ago
@MiracleMile90 Unfortunately, not only is that untrue, but there is even GREATER, and EASIER potential for voter fraud because electors are like politicians:
Actually, the 100 Senators might vote independently to elect the President and the Vice President, yet cannot vote twice. Granted, coercion of politicians be it for financial of political gain HAS ensued before, particularly during our FIRST election of the Chief Executive, George Washington. But that was intrigue and popularity.
katey1dog 7 months ago
@MiracleMile90 they can be bought and sold without potentially leaving a paper trail. At least with the voters, any crooks will have a much harder time rigging public votes without somebody noticing.
Of which happens excruciatingly, too much even by todays standards. But research the 1960 Presidential election. Even in THAT election the dead still turned out to vote. Especially in Texas. The dead LOVED Nixon. But even they couldn't beat Kennedy.
katey1dog 7 months ago
@katey1dog I disagree. Right now the House thinks they can hold the U.S economy and global economy hostage unless they get their way. Unprecedented as far as I know. So this branch of gov't(with the fringe right wing extremist tea party) thinks that that is their bargaining chip, and that all the other branches of gov't have to bow down to them or their will be an economic catarastrophe? God, Y'all are #$%!ed up.
johnnyyow 7 months ago
@katey1dog: Sorry Katey, but you may want to look up REAL history sometime, instead of the teabagger version. I should also point out that China is a constitutional republic, in theory, as well. Are they free? No, of course not. But unfortunately, there are some who would like to take away the democratic principles in this country, and replace them with something with something like what we see in post-Maoist China, or the Chile & Argentina of the mid-/late '70s.
MiracleMile90 7 months ago
@MiracleMile90 Sorry Katey, but you may want to look up REAL history sometime, instead of the teabagger version.
No, that is real history. Read your Constitution. Not a sentence referring to the word democracy or the implication of democracy.
I should also point out that China is a constitutional republic, in theory, as well.
IN THEORY? No, I'm sure it's the People's Republic of China. No, there is no Constitution, but there is Chairman Mao's little red book.
katey1dog 7 months ago
@katey1dog: China isn't Communist anymore. Although the country does seemingly operate under a socialist veil, what it truly is, is a corporatist banana republic, which, btw, is what the faux Constitutionalists want us to become(as opposed to real ones, who understand the dangers of denying our democratic heritage).
usconstitution . net/china.html
MiracleMile90 7 months ago
@MiracleMile90
China isn't communist any more. You may be correct. It's a Corporatocracy. But in it's heart and soul, the Party is SMART, but still clings to it's Cultural Revolution.
katey1dog 7 months ago
revolution.
arm yourself, and your neighbor, fight your brother, and one day you will be free.
WeeeeBeep 7 months ago
I disagree on one point.
IF our votes meant nothing, cons wouldn't be working so hard to take it away from as many people as they could.
It's just that voting isn't the end of the process, it's just the beginning. The PTB depend on everybody going home after they cast their ballot.
booley 7 months ago
Radical transformation. I don't disagree that America is bully on the block, but the fact that two countries can legally fight each other over issues most of the citizens don't care about, is wrong. Having the world broken up into countries makes rich countries and poor countries. By having both, it's not an efficient solution to using the world's dwindling resources. But money is getting shifted around... but will someone try to break some skulls in the near future is the question.
EngineeringIsMagic 7 months ago
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There Will Be Blood?
rezdude087 7 months ago
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JazzRabbit086 7 months ago
Someone will snap and violence will begin. Here's my timeline...
Early 2012: Republicans nominate a Tea Party crackpot (Bachmann or Perry) or Romney wins but the Tea Party splits and tries to run a candidate of their own.
Nov. 2012: Obama wins with ease as a result.
Nov. 2012 to early 2013: Fox News, Rush, Beck, etc. spend all their energy saying someone stole the election and that Obama is not legitimately president.
Early 2013: Someone tries to assassinates the president. Maybe successfully.
BrotherAlpha 7 months ago
@BrotherAlpha: Scary scenario but it's quite possible, unfortunately. =(
MiracleMile90 7 months ago
Couple of things you missed...
Firstly, a new court ruling struck down a law in Arizona that said the government would level the playing field if one political candidate was able to spend a lot of their own money on the race. The courts said it was against the 1st Amendment. So now free speech includes the right to shout others down.
Secondly, most people who go bankrupt because of medical bills have insurance.
It's worse than you think.
BrotherAlpha 7 months ago
Screw the bankster who have rigged this system. I am an oath keeper and part of the 3%.
I find Ron Paul to be the only politician who is not in corporate pocket and is honest. You can disagree with him and know where you stand. A liar like obummer, well he will lie and you will burn!
Ron Paul 2012!
calrenman 7 months ago
I yearn for Radical Transformation... I despise Reform and fear Revolution. Because if all we continue to get is Reform, the people who are withheld from attaining true Radical Transformation could potentially revolt. Lest we use needless bloodshed to remove TPTB from power. But, if you are naïve than I must also be. Because I believe radical, positive change can happen in my lifetime.
TheKaleidoscopian 7 months ago
reform or revolution. well that's going to have to be revolution, the only problem is that if revolution succeeds in toppling a power structure you first get a period of anarchy which, most of the time, isn't pretty.then your going to need a new system because, lets face it, all currently existing systems have failed miserably because of misuse of power, this in turn is caused by a lack of overview of the general population when concerning the actions of their leader('s) (continuation next post)
lopendepaddo 7 months ago
@lopendepaddo This is the main reason systems of government fail and the main reason why equality between population groups always deteriorates the more people are under one leadership. the ideal society has, I think, a population between 200 and 500 people, much bigger than this and corruption will show its ugly head. we live on a dirtball with 6 bil. people and most of those live in cities with populations above the 10.000 people. too split them up too 500 people per society is kinda hard.
lopendepaddo 7 months ago
@lopendepaddo IAW: we are fucked..... at least until the world population return to pre-oil numbers.
lopendepaddo 7 months ago
For now, do nothing. I know, it sounds foolish, but look at what's going on: In spite of overwhelming polls to the contrary, in spite of the fact that the Republicans gained the House to bring jobs, which they've failed to, the Tea Baggers are running roughshod over everything. I say, let them. Let them have their way. The system will collapse rather quickly, and the sane people will have enough power to put it back together. Others, sadly, need to learn the hard way.
VigilanteNighthawk 7 months ago
@VigilanteNighthawk This is actually a rather interesting concept. I wonder if it'll work....
darkridr25 7 months ago
People die for lack of health care in countries with socialized medicine, so to insist that socialization will eliminate this is a bit bold. Dead is dead. Efficacy is of the utmost importance. Not every socialized health care system succeeds, nor can it be said that they all fail to achieve better care than private medical systems. Pragmatism over idealism my good man. Many "randian regressives" would have some things to say about efficacy and redistribution.
beenz07 7 months ago
@beenz07 Socialized medicine is better than no medicine, which is the point of socialized medicine. I could care less about how fast or luxurious it is. Need before greed, son!
Tougemaster06 7 months ago
something else...
Learn to take care of yourself on earth, its called independence, and to get it you have to be willing to learn how to survive without the need of others labor.
bryphi77 7 months ago
Canada is WAY too cold. I thought about that too. I've thought a lot about how to change things but the ugly truth of the matter is WE have to make the hard choices independently and collectively if we want to see change. An example is stop investing in the Ponzi scheme AKA Wall Street. Stop trying to be rich. People are almost programmed to desire great wealth and forget to live while they busily chase their elusive dream.
UsedNewsToday 7 months ago
@ArtetlaMusique87
Democracy is the form of government which our Founders were firmly set against. Democracy is the belief that a simple majority can make decisions. But it's the majority that also make the wrong decisions because people vote for the "likable" candidate, not the necessary one.
As Ben Franklin put it, "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote."
katey1dog 7 months ago
We need to stop supporting corporations with our money, remember the phrase, starve the beast. We also need to stop operating in our normal lives like the Egyptians and the Tunisians and sit in our square and not move till the govt meets our demands. We can learn from them. If only we have the will to do it!
psychokillercrab 7 months ago
There will be a radical transformation or some kind brought together by the REAL people like scientists, engineers, academics, etc. The fascist oligarchy we have today is just a natural progression of the price system. So, I don't believe in those crazy ass conspiracy theories. How do we fix it? Well, in truth, we need to create a new social system that is science based and humanitarian. Technocracy is one such idea that was created by influential people like R.C. Tolman and M.K. Hubbert.
newb2yutube 7 months ago
I understood obongo was the change...lol
dalihendrix 7 months ago
Track down guys like George Soros & Davey Rockerfeller & give them Lobotomies.
StinkFingerr 7 months ago
Reform won't happen because of corporations. Most ppl can be bought. So revolution is the next solution, but ppl will have to die for it. I don't know if Americans are ready for that. Sometimes I don't even know if I am ready for it either. i guess when it gets bad enough I will. And I think this is how most of America thinks at this point.
psychokillercrab 7 months ago
The time is now, REVOLUTION!
psychokillercrab 7 months ago
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psychokillercrab 7 months ago
revolution.
xleezybee 7 months ago
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Despite being one of the few americans to know that socialism is right and capitalism is wrong, I can't fucking stand this guy.
He's so arrogant and self-righteous. Add to that some pretentiousness.
jumpingflash95 7 months ago 3
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jumpingflash95 7 months ago
Hahahahahahahaha, Reform, Revolution, Radical Transformation? FUCK NO!! I'm leaving this sinking ship as soon as I can, fuck America!
Shadowlit001 7 months ago
(...) less fuss, and smaller profits. America is just the worst-case scenario, but all other countries have bullshit in their systems. Bullshit is built in the system, and there is really no way around it. It only stands if we somehow manage not to look, not to light that small spark, not to wield our blades.
Burn it all. Whatever's real doesn't need any of our protection, and the rest is just bullshit anyways.
furetosan 7 months ago
What we need are sharp blades, or maybe just a spark. You see, all of this democracy, anarchy, capitalism, free market... all these concepts, and the institutions built upon them, are highly flammable, almost explosive. The only way to live with them is by not looking, and what you, Mr. Dennis Trainor Jr., do in these videos is to look. That's why it shakes people awake, and makes them angry too. The deal is that there is no safe haven, no salvation. Canada is just the same lies, but with (...)
furetosan 7 months ago
We vote for Ron Paul in the republican primary
mjbarrowful 7 months ago
Hey we just hit 28 Celsius up here! cold my ass. Good vid though again.
RavenMad101 7 months ago
@MrSuperpunch019,
No, but we should do it for being an EVIL president.
StinkFingerr 7 months ago
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sweettalker22 7 months ago
RadicalRevolution!
CaliSchiff 7 months ago
majority rule is overrated.
Desslock85 7 months ago 8
@Desslock85
Democracy is way over-rated.
katey1dog 7 months ago
@Desslock85 Compared with what? Oligarchy? REALLY? So Scandinavia THE most DEMOCRATIC states on the planet with THE best results on just about EVERY social indicator are not to be admired WHY? Yeah it's VERY clear the right wing in the US are becoming NAKEDLY fascist and antitruth and reality!
StunnedByStupidity 7 months ago
"Never be deceived that the rich will allow you to vote away their wealth." - Lucy Parsons
wistoncap 7 months ago
default on constitution. lets states decide things that aren't in constitution. (10th amendment)
metroidfan01987 7 months ago
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@ncftTV What ever path we take we must never abandon the rights of Assembly, Association, & Anonymity. Founding Father Thomas Paine said "An avidity to punish is always dangerous to liberty. It leads men to stretch, to misinterpret, & to misapply even the best of laws. He that would make his own liberty secure must guard even his enemy from oppression; for if he violates this duty he establishes a precedent that will reach to himself."
ebent24 7 months ago
@ebent24 Through six degrees of separation we can only progress society to prosperity as one with critical thinking & discussion of the issues immediate, large or small. John Fitzgerald Kennedy said "Without debate, without criticism, no Administration & no country can succeed — & no republic can survive. That is why the Athenian lawmaker Solon decreed it a crime for any citizen to shrink from controversy."
ebent24 7 months ago
@ebent24 That is why we must avoid the root of all problems assumption & ignorance so that for no reason should we compromise honest moral values towards the natural liberties of humanity we all share Desmond Mpilo Tutu Archbishop of Cape Town. said "My humanity is bound up in yours, for we can only be human together." As nations also as citizens of planet earth
We are Legion.
Invincible as One.
Indivisible by None.
We Outnumber You.
Expect us.
ebent24 7 months ago
your going to have to shut down washingon dc to get your shit too work man. possinly by violence
AgateSoft 7 months ago
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ebent24 7 months ago
throw his sorry ass out and vote in a real progressive.
chingon711 7 months ago
While reform and revolution are perhaps the two best words to use they are also very likely to be taken and spun by the MSM (main stream media) into something super negative and scary and create a huge boogie man of the cause.
While I believe that we need less MSM influence in this country I also understand that it's so rooted into the system that it's almost too big to fight effectively. Almost.
Things need to change now, or we will have a revolution later. I don't know how it'll start.
jasonsgroovemachine 7 months ago
barack obama bombs and kills little kids in the mideast.
AgateSoft 7 months ago
shut down the capital and let me call shots!
RaabBlog 7 months ago
reform is probably the best option.
Revolution would destroy the consitution and cause a military junta in some places and nothing at all in other places
1x93cm 7 months ago
@1x93cm The constitution has already been destroyed there's nothing to loose.
russkeller 7 months ago
@russkeller actually there is- not from the standpoint of the politicians but from the people. If the people don't think the constitution is worth anything then what are they going to supplant it with
the constitution is dead and has been from the standpoint of tptb but if it dies amonst the people then I doubt that we could ressurect it in any form
1x93cm 7 months ago
Honestly, I don't have an answer -- at least, not a good one.
Revolution almost always ends up with us having a worse government than the one in which it replaced. Look at Cuba for our most recent example of this.
Reform? What would the new reform look like, and how do we get that reform past the Corporations' watchdogs who guard Washington the way Cerberus guards the gates of hell?!?
As to "Radical Transformation," before I can even comment on its feasibility we have to know what it is.
darkridr25 7 months ago
kick out the war criminals. all of them.
DizzyDude2000 7 months ago
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Revolution. Overthrow the government.
superfighterken 7 months ago
It's gonna have to be a revolution. It could be socialist/green/anarchist/communist or a combo. I can't understand for the life of me why anyone would think electing a Libertarian into office would fix anything, it would make things worse as the gap between rich and poor would increase even more and people would be reduced to levels of third world poverty, which would fuck the economy even more since no one will be able to buy anything. We would be living in a permant depression.
sirmercutio99 7 months ago
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superfighterken 7 months ago