Jesus was a crazy evil wicked man! or God?

[satanisthetruegod666]

You seem to immediately dismiss that jesus was a lunatic or liar out of hand but consider: There have been thousands of people who actually did claim to be god (jesus didn't it was subject to a vote at the council of Nicea and the "not god" crowd lost.) and of all those people what are the chances any one actually are god? effectively zero. so what is the chance any individual claimed by a religion is actually a god in the flesh? effectively zero. thus jesus was lunatic or a liar.

[dpapaioannow]

you forgot another little tiny option...that is jesus never claiming to be god(as in not telling people to worship him alone,referring to god in the third person,he himself praying to god,telling that he couldnt do anything without god's permission etc etc etc)in the first place and people who missed the point of his teachings start putting words in his mouth over the centuries

[PJDesseyn]

My opinion: it's far more likely that Jesus was a lunatic or a liar, presenting some good moral lessons (with some bad ones as well), than him being God. Even the desert has its roses and oases, so why can't a lunatic say something sane or a liar tell some truths?

Best to do, is learn what he said, pick out what you think is good, and drop all the bad stuff, then continue on to the next moral teacher and do the same.

[ZeppelinForever9]

@PJDesseyn To do that you would be contradicting Jesus' teachings, that through him (god) sacrificing himself as a pure replacement for our human sins, and that He is the ONLY way, so if you follow some of his teachings, you have to follow all of them, otherwise you are doing deeds in vain and not in the lords name.

[PJDesseyn]

@ZeppelinForever9: I'm not contradicting myself at all...I said PICK OUT THE GOOD STUFF. The part where he claims to be God and his sacrifice is to undo the sins of our fathers (not all our sins), is clearly a lie...or the lunatic part. With good things, I mean: don't murder people, try to keep lying to a minimum, don't commit adultery, try helping people the best you can, etc. The good stuff, not the insane stuff.

Once you realise God doesn't exist, it'll make sense.

[ZeppelinForever9]

@PJDesseyn maybe when you find out he does exist it'll make sense to you.

[PJDesseyn]

@ZeppelinForever9: but he doesn't exist and it does make sense, without invoking any imaginary, magical sky daddies...

God doesn't exist...if you still believe in God, it's time for you to grow up and get a realitycheck.

[ZeppelinForever9]

@PJDesseyn well sorry but im going to continue beliveing, because ive experienced his grace personally, and i see his work in everything around me, ive seen lives changed and restored by his love, so you can choose to belive or not to my friend but no matter what you decide, God loves you regardless, so thts all i have to say, have a nice day.

[PJDesseyn]

@ZeppelinForever9: nope, you're delusional. God doesn't exist, period, so you can't have experienced his grace. This is a common delusion among religious people, and the god differs per religion. Muslims get Allah, Hindus get Vishnu, Buddhists get Buddha and Christians get God. My disbelief is not a choice btw. Reality forces it on me. Either I accept reality, or I'm crazy, like you.

Again: GOD DOES NOT EXIST, HE'S JUST A FAIRY TALE. GROW THE FUCK UP.

[ZeppelinForever9]

@PJDesseyn well sir, i went to your channel and checked out some of your vids, but it seems to me like you have some preconceived ideas about people who have faith that may not be exactly true. first of all, christians have done us all the great favor of making a "war" between science and god, i dont say religion because religion is a man made method of regaining relationship with god, whereas faith is god's way back to us. anyhow, i have absolutely no problem with having faith AND being

[ZeppelinForever9]

@ZeppelinForever9 scientifically educated, in fact i would encourage it. this means that yes i believe that evolution is completely plausible, and unavoidable really. However i dont think that this disproves the existence of an originator of life at all, and to say that imperfections in the design of life is the result of an absence of a god is incorrect because in gods word it states that we live in an imperfect world were pain, suffering, disease, ect. is commonplace because of sin, that we

[ZeppelinForever9]

@ZeppelinForever9 brought into the world by disobeying his law. Also i noticed that you are an advocate of evolution, yet you think that homosexuality is a natural genetic anomaly, but this doesnt make sense, even if they possessed inactive genes according to natural selection, they would go extinct because homosexuals cant reproduce, so without the genetic inconsistency being passed along it would have eliminated itself long long ago. im NOT trying to force any beliefs on you or anyone else

[PJDesseyn]

@ZeppelinForever9: Evolution itself makes no claims to the supernatural. However, science concludes the supernatural doesn't exist or at the very least is completely useless. For example: we could live in the Matrix, but since we can't perceive this in any way, it's useless and should be ignored.

The whole creation story is bullshit and every sane person understands this. Maybe you're not sane? Homosexuality can be a common mutation, not necessarily being passed on. (cont)

[PJDesseyn]

@ZeppelinForever9: it also isn't detrimental per say. As a heterosexual man, if you see lesbian girls "get it on", you get...pleased. This is the same in many animals. This leads to an invigorated spirit and an increased libido to produce more offspring. It's also so that homosexuals can still reproduce, albeit not with their natural partners. Though this isn't much of an issue in the rest of the animal world.

And I'm trying to force reality on you, but it's up to you to accept it.

[PJDesseyn]

@ZeppelinForever9: theism (belief in a god) is detrimental to society. It may have temporary benefits, but in the long run, it's destructive. By its nature, theism is superstition and fantasy. It doesn't concern the truth, only whatever fantasy we can make up to explain the unexplained. Science is explaining the unexplained through reality. What you see is what you get. So you have a conflict there, that can't be reconciled. You can't both deny reality and accept it at the same time.

[infinitum17]

The passages in Romans which endorse preaching to Gentiles reflect Paul's independent decision to do so, based on his reading of Isaiah, which led to a huge fight with Peter, after which Paul left Jerusalem and Antioch, never to return. And the passages in Acts (written by the author of Luke) which endorse preaching to non-Jews were written nearly 60 years after the death of Jesus, reflect that later Pauline attitude, which won out for the simple reason that his approach created more followers.

[infinitum17]

If Jesus was just one of many claimants to divinity, then your same logic applies to all of them, too. What makes you think that Jesus was any different from all the others? If you took my class, you would learn all about how Jesus message was warped by the next four generations of his followers into something that was spreadable to Gentiles. In Matthew, Jesus specifically forbids his followers from preaching to non-Jews.

[infinitum17]

good try, but a few essential flaws:

couldn't Jesus have though that he had a good moral message, but misrepresented himself as divine because he knew that no one would listen to him otherwise?

Look, Jesus was one of many people in Roman Jerusalem claiming to be God, or more precisely, the messiah prophesied by Jewish scripture. I encourage you to read Josephus, who documents many of them, including Jesus. He was unexceptional; they were all crucified except this one guy called The Egyptian.

[D20018200]

There's at least two more options you miss here. One is the possibility that Jesus did not exist and was a made up character (there are many who say the whole story is plagiarized from old religions). The other possibility is that Jesus existed but was not as described in the books (they were written after his death by unknown authors). Having said that I see your point and can grasp your way of thinking. I just don't believe it for many (to me obvious) reasons.

[conscript93]

wow you and your videos are gay

[xconvuXlsionsx]

when i read the new testament it seems to me kind of like be for his resurrection he was only a man, only the son of God not yet one with God, it seems as though through many different challenges of his (fasting in the dessert etc.) life he was becoming God and ultimately after the resurrection he was God. I believe that is why we must follow his teachings, because he was a man (as we are) and became one with God (like i believe that we are meant to)

[Riphes]

You´re saying that Jesus said that he was God, could you please tell me where in the Bible he claims such a thing?

[Cootabux]

The primary thing is to show that the bible accounts are true, and no one can do that.

Xians take hearsay accounts and call them rtuth...on what basis?

We have no idea who wrote M,M,L, & John. We have no way of knowing anything concerning the supernatural claims, which is all I'm concerned with, are true!

If anyone can verify these S.N. events are true, I'd like to know how? If U can't, then U can't proclaim them as true...period!

[xconvuXlsionsx]

can you prove hannibal marched elephents over the alps

can you prove rome existed

can you prove atlantis didn't?

[scrin18]

Some weak evidence says that a man called Jesus walked the earth 2000 years ago. But there is NO evidence or reason to belive that a god called Jesus walked the earth 2000 years ago performing miracles. And the NT are not direct word from Jesus. The earliest writtings of the NT is dated 30 years after Jesus death. The people who wrote the NT didn`t even meet Jesus. So dont take the NT serious its just hearsays. And seriously the majority of the humans are more moral then ANYONE in the Bible.

[izbo10]

ok all those examples after the bible was written none during his life. No one disputes the fact at some point people wrote about the character jesus. The dispute is there is no cotemporary evidence of him.

[KletosApostolos]

morrisgeorgee U said "Ahh but I have done my reasearch and These are just christian writings that didn't make it into the bible."

U obviously havent done your research. Josephus not Christian.

izbo10 - I get what U are saying. Im saying Jesus meets all qualifications by which every historian evaluates historical figures. Every unbiased legitimate historian acknowledges that the man, Jesus lived.

It is only prejudice that makes some people say he didnt live. The Facts reveal that he did.

[izbo10]

lol you have done your research and use Josephus which the only part that in any of Josephus' writings that isn't clearly a forgery that even mentions a Jesus is this something like"...the brother of Jesus". Wow the brother of Jesus which Jesus we know there were lots of Jesus. Its christian bias saying he existed writings of him after his death confirm what nobody is disputing anyway, that at some point even people outside of christianity started to believe the legend as truth.

[izbo10]

I am sorry but all this video does is says jesus is god because if he wasn't it wouldn't fit my beliefs. This is a backwards way to do things, u should find the facts and base your beliefs around them not the facts around your beliefs.  Just a side note I doubt a jesus even existed as their is no evidence outside the bible.

[DallasCourierService]

morrisgeorgee & izbo10... you guys are completely ignoring the standards by which we evaluate the legitimacy of historical figures & ancient texts.

First off, it would be odd if there were alot of other writings about Jesus considering the circumstances. But, there are some: Flavius Josephus, Cornelius Tacitus, Justin Martyr, Origen. There are more. This is just off the top of my head.

There are just too many facts about this to argue with you. You both should do more research first.

[lexZender57732]

I agree that Jesus is the god of the Christians. If you know any history, this happened gradually among geek and roman converts to the Nazarene Jewish sect that was later seized by the roman authority making it the christianity that we know today. Rome declared that Jesus was god over two hundred years after the destruction of the Temple. At this point rome persecuted anyone who disagreed with their newly created doctrines (mixture of paganism and Judaism), including the deity of Jesus, etc.

[morrisgeorgee]

Christinaity became famous when the emperor of rome Constintine coverted to the faith. Than Rome was decalaring that Jesus was God.

[morrisgeorgee]

Jesus may have never ever clamied to be God. That does not even come into your evaluation. Since we have the storys of his until 40 years after his death than we have no way of knowing what he clamed.

[redwingblackjack]

Right on the money morrisgeorgee! If a historical Jesus existed (big if), why didn't he write his own book instead of waiting for his followers to write contradicting accounts? We have no way of knowing what he actualy have claimed.

[chuckfaststrat]

a book report from someone who just got back from Hell 3 days ago.

= D

watch?v=haAXYxHFNa0

[chuckfaststrat]

Kletos, I hope she becomes one of your subscribers

: )

watch?v=u_fJLFXyac8&feature=ch­annel_page

[KletosApostolos]

Seriously, she must be the craziest person on YouTube. Of course, NephilimFree is trying his best by saying that the Earth is stationary and the sun revolves around Earth.

But, I still think this girl is the champ.

[KletosApostolos]

Wow. I don't know if I can wath this lunacy much longer.

watch?v=MFHwkCbyUxQ

[chuckfaststrat]

That is the wrong Christian attitude. Here- have some bliss bombs

= D

watch?v=Zljp9TbK7_o&feature=ch­annel_page

[KletosApostolos]

YouTube allows all these crazy people to find each other.

[chuckfaststrat]

I take it the bliss bombs didn't change your mind??

[chuckfaststrat]

= D

watch?v=IcoBqm0ApCU&feature=ch­annel_page

[jjpetkusiii]

Sorry for any confusion that the deletion may have caused, Kletos Apostolos, but I made a couple of typographical errors in that reply.

I tried to correct them, and I will try again. By the way, is something at your end delaying the posting of the corrected reply?

[KletosApostolos]

Nope. But, I have noticed the same thing lately on a number of other videos. When I post a reply, sometimes it takes up to 10 minutes to show up.

[jjpetkusiii]

WITH CORRECTIONS, the deleted reply reads:

Well, KletosApostolos, did I miss it: Where is your argument that the Lord Jesus Christ is God?

Frankly, not everyone who refers to himself these days as a Christian can honestly say that he knows Him as Saviour and Lord. I want to assure you, however, that I will be happy to watch this video again, if you think that I can help you communicate Biblical truth.

Please let me know your thoughts about this reply.

[jjpetkusiii]

The fatal error in this video--perhaps your first attempt at PowerPoint threw you totally off base--was that you did not present any COGENT ARGUMENT THAT THE LORD JESUS CHRIST IS GOD.

As charitably as I'm able, I suggest that you take a break from making YouTube videos--perhaps forever--because the Deity of the Lord Jesus Christ is foundational to the doctrine of SALVATION BY GRACE THROUGH FAITH IN HIM ALONE.

[KletosApostolos]

jjpetkusiii, I am feeling the love brother.

John 13:35. lol

[KletosApostolos]

jpetkusiii, why did you delete your comment?

If you watch the video again, you should hear that I said this video was directed to a specific group of people. There are alot of people who say Jesus was just a good teacher. The purpose of this video is just to show that he can't just be a good teacher.

[chuckfaststrat]

"1.29 million abortions in the U.S. alone, tells me we still slaughter people. How is that better than the OT? "

Here is the difference- in the OT, (supposedly) God specifically commanded genocide & infanticide.

If someone aborts today, they are responsible for the decision & action and not God.

[TheKruptos]

In your last comment (chuckfaststrat) you said "When I said "better", what I meant is that at least we are turning our backs on Bronze Age barbarism and excuses, and we are finally being accountable for ourselves- no more "God told me to" or "God said not to". " Does that admission of guilt really matter if the behaviors don't change? The same behaviors of the OT still exist today. 1.29 million abortions in the U.S. alone, tells me we still slaughter people. How is that better than the OT?

[chuckfaststrat]

I will say this, though, Kruptos, ...your response has me thinking. Perhaps I am wrong about people today being better...

But I know that whatever offense I may feel towards bad things happening today, I find that same offense in God ordering genocide and infanticide. If He exists, I need to think better of Him than that. I think the writers must have lied and framed Him.

[TheKruptos]

Well, in the spirit of full disclosure, the 1.2 million innocent fetuses slaughtered is declining. So, to your point, maybe we are making baby steps at getting better. Not that 1.2 Mil deaths is to be commended. But I guess humanity doesn't suck as bad as it did last year, or the year before. Go team! (sorry I shouldn't be glib about something so serious.)

I trust God, even when it doesn't make sense to nonbelievers. There is purpose in all He does, even if I don't understand.

God bless

[chuckfaststrat]

" I trust God, even when it doesn't make sense to nonbelievers. There is purpose in all He does, even if I don't understand.

"

- And that is what religion does to one's mind. It makes them excuse the inexcusible. Justify the unjustifiable. It clouds one's ability to think clearly and rationaly. The one thing I would not do is "trust" the OT God, other than to trust that He has a schizophrenic nature.

[TheKruptos]

Just one more thing. After studying the Bible for years, one of the ideas I got from the old and new testaments is that even the people whom God has called have an OT and a NT chapter of their lives. I think present day Christian humanity is the New Israel. Hopefully, we are coming into our "Jesus years." Just a thought to ponder when contemplating OT purpose.

[chuckfaststrat]

Well, basically most people expereince church as a positive thing. We are social animals, and the bonding over religion is what gives people good feelings. Purpose. They do it by cherry picking the nice parts of the bible and leaving out the rest. andyouknowwhat? I'm fine with that. It's the only way to make this stuff work. But as someone who is more aware of the less desirable content, it cannot be taken seriously as the writings given from a God.

[TheKruptos]

I'm pretty aware of the good and scary parts of the Bible. Intimately familiar. It's the inspired Word of God, even if people don't like some of the parts that aren't depicted in Norman Rockwell paintings. It isn't all warm and fuzzy. Some of it is brutal. You won't understand it all. (frequently people are confused because they don't know enough about the history during Biblical time that is not contained in the Bible) But if you look deeper, you could believe too. God does exist.

[chuckfaststrat]

Two points- First, there is no amount of "historical context" that will make me see genocide, infanticide & slavery as being Holy and a thing desired by God. They are merely the excuses given by Bronze Age minds.

Second, it's not all just the ugly & fuzzy parts of the OT that expose it as being false. IT is also some of the claims they make about our natural world, which we know is not right. They guessed wrong.

[Nagraath]

Pathetic.

[KletosApostolos]

Very thought provoking comment Nagraath. Thank you.

[TheKruptos]

I agree. Nagraath's thought provoking comment changed my whole outlook. My life is forever changed by his wisdom and depth. I, I, I, think I have a tear in my eye. :) I think I need some alone time now. lol

[vk8nat]

Good discussion... if we are all creations of God... then aren't we all sons and daughters of God? So Jesus as a man is a son of God... and in those days, that sort of talk was heracy... blasphemy... The Old Testament = history of the encient world... new testament = moral stories of the new age (AD)... they are books about Jesus living in Jerusalem during Roman rule... BUT most important gives us as a society a moral foundation... again... liked your thought process!

[chuckfaststrat]

Old Testament= the beta test version for morality...still working out the bugs. (i.e. infanticide/ genocide, slavery, multiple wives & concubines, etc)

New Testament= New & Improved "Do over" version. Sorry for all the confusion.

(i.e. Love your enemies, don't beat your slaves anymore, and being eunich is really the way to go...)

[TheKruptos]

Seriously, did you just use the words "beta test"? As if our ancestors were a practice run.?? ReallY? LOL The israelites were openly defiant. It's not like God didn't give them the rules for the big game. He gave them over 600 of them as I recall. They weren't working out the bugs, they just didn't obey.

(the eunich part was pretty funny though)

[chuckfaststrat]

"As if our ancestors were a practice run.?? "

- We've had lots of ancestors. From the genus Homo alone, there was habilus, rudolfensis, georgicus, ergaster, etc. Apparently, lots of "practice models" before we ever got here.

As for us breaking over 600 rules, well, an omniscient God shouldn't have been suprised. In fact, it was part of "the skit" all along. Had to be...if what they say of God is real and true...Hmmm....

[TheKruptos]

Nothing was a practice run for God, not human kind, nor the decisions that they would make. ("Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, And before you were born I consecrated you; I have appointed you a prophet to the nations.") Not sure what version of the Bible that you read from, but no where that I have found in the NIV does it say that God was super shocked at the behaviors. He wasn't. He still isn't.

Sorry but I don't know what you mean by "the skit". Could you explain?

[chuckfaststrat]

Nor should an omniscient God be suprised by anything. Indeed, it is His doing.

It would be like a person building a lawnmower, knowing full well it will break down 15 minutes after starting, and then getting mad and blaming the mower for doing what it was designed to do all along. No, God should not be shocked at all. We did what we were designed to do.

[TheKruptos]

Not really, because you wouldn't build a lawnmover for the purpose of having a relationship with it. (...or I hope you wouldn't) God made humanity for the purpose of a loving relationship. A relationship implys humanity has the option to love or not love back. The Hebrews of the OT failed at that many times. He knew Jesus would have to come to save us eventually. He always knew it.

[chuckfaststrat]

We simply disagree. I think religion is a shell game, a tapestry of sophistry so thick that believers themselves do not understand it. We humans are hard wired for it, I guess. You may rationalize what you wish, and accept any interpretation that gives you comfort. I choose to live in the real world.

[chuckfaststrat]

...and I wonder, is this an example of divine love?

watch?v=kz0ye1j31jk&feature=ch­annel_page

[TheKruptos]

When I pulled up this link, I found an old episode of charlies angels. So, um, no...in my opinion, it is not an example of divine love. But, that's just me. Crazy, I know. :)'

[chuckfaststrat]

Wierd....well, the link was to a user on youtube called holysinecure. Go to thier page, and click thier "honest search for the truth" series, video #2, regarding murder and genecide in the bible.

[TheKruptos]

People like the woman who spoke in video #2 frighten me. She knows just enough about the Bible to SOUND like she knows what she is talking about, and confuse others. She isn't serching for the truth, but for an excuse not to believe, which is much easier. She sees and reads what she wants to see. God sees the whole picture. She rants about genecide, yet kills souls with her words. Hard to decide which is worse.

[chuckfaststrat]

"She isn't searching for the truth..."

- You don't know that, nor do I. Maybe she has simply come to a different conclusion.

"She sees and reads what she wants to see."

- This, coming from a believer. Ironic.

"She rants about genocide...Hard to decide which is worse."

-A bunch of people showing up and wanting to slay me & my family/countrymen in the name of thier God because thier God told them to do it...I vote THAT being worse than a lady making a video.

[TheKruptos]

"Maybe she has simply come to a different conclusion." She could think the sky was pink with purple polka-dots too, however, it wouldn't make her correct.

Comparing OT theology to present day is apples v. oranges. You have the benefit of thousands of years of NT theology the Israelites didn't have. They had to learn God. God protected His people from the Canaanites by destroying them beause  Canaanites were polytheistic Molech and Ashtoreth worshipers. Israel fell anytime they comingled.

[chuckfaststrat]

I am shocked how anyone can justify the merciless bloodshedding supposedly commanded by God in the OT.

Canaanites are but one example. Duet 3:6-7, 2: 34, 13:15, 1 Sam 15:2-3, 2 Sam 12:31, Num 31: 16-18, Eze 9:5-6...the list goes on and on.

Couldn't God just stop thier hearts? Or cause them infertility? Or turn them to salt? Or not let them be born at all?

No- obviously, the solution is violent death at the hands of His people.

Maybe...God didn't command any of this...and barbarians did...

[TheKruptos]

Aarcheologists studing Canaanites found many of jars of the remains of their newborn babies. When they built a home, a child would be sacrificed and its body built into the wall of the house"for luck for the family". The 1st born was sacrificed to Molech, a bronze statue with a burning fire. Parents placed children in its hands and living babies would roll down into the fire. The sacrifice was worthless if the mother cried, she was supposed to dance/sing. Gosh...wonder why God was angry???

[chuckfaststrat]

Canaanites did that?? That is disgusting! It's a good thing the Isrealites were able to kill the parents, and then take all the children, toddlers, infants (who had the misfortune of merely being born in the wrong culture and were too young to be accountable for any wrongdoing) and get them into orphanages and raise them with the knowledge of the true loving God. That IS what happened...right??

[chuckfaststrat]

No...it's not what happened. Turns out the Isrealites took all the children, toddlers, infants... and ran swords through them. That's what God wanted, according to what they wrote. So, God was pleased that day, and a lovely day of doing Holy work was done.

And let's face it- if you were on the recieving end of any of this, whether it's your culture, or the armies of Joshua, or Ghengis Khan...the result for you would be the same.

...(cont)

[chuckfaststrat]

(Cont) See, and that's the whole problem with listening to to the ramblings of superstitous, irrational people living in the Bronze Age- they were savages. They didn't know any better. WE do. It is time we acknowledge our past for what it is, and leave this nonsense behind.

We are men of education, of reason, of logic. It is time we acted better, because we ARE better.

[TheKruptos]

"We ARE better". Seriously? Really??? Last year in the U.S. alone 1.29 abortions were performed. (thats more than all the Canannites put together) 10% of the women seeking abortions listed the reason for the abortion as "an inconvenient time due to college or career". ARE WE BETTER??? I would have to challenge your perspective on this one. With all our EDUCATION, LOGIC AND REASON we are even more barbaric. It makes me sad.

[chuckfaststrat]

When I said "better", what I meant is that at least we are turning our backs on Bronze Age barbarism and excuses, and we are finally being accountable for ourselves- no more "God told me to" or "God said not to". We, as humans, are growing up and accepting reality.

To be sure, our human nature is still there. Give education, logic, & reason a chance... it hasn't had as much time to work as religion...

[TheKruptos]

You are right. .. we disagree. I need no further comfort than what God offers so I don't REALLY don't need to rationalize anything. I know you live in the "real world". My hope is not that you live in the next world. God bless you.

[TheKruptos]

oopsie...I did a typo. I meant to say that "I know you live in the real world, my hope is that you DO live in the next world." So sorry. Seriously, I would never say to anyone that I wish them to be condemned. Again, sorry.

[chuckfaststrat]

"the skit". = in order to Revelation to be "true", then actions are predetermined. Your "free will" is usless, and indeed, merely an illusion. We are all simply automatons playing our roles in this divine drama (if we were free by our wills to alter our future, the Revelation can be changed. If this happens, then God has lied about knowing/controling the future)

The whole subject is absurd, imho. No one knows the future- not us, not "God", no one. You are truly free.

[TheKruptos]

You have a choice over your actions. He just already knows the outcome of the game.  Don't assume just because you don't know the decisions that you will make, that you are on the same playing field with a God who knows and sees everything before it happens. He is unbound by time or space. "The Skit " thing sounds just a little bitter to me.

P.S. God doesn't lie.

[chuckfaststrat]

"P.S. God doesn't lie"

-Perhaps not. But people do. And people wrote the bible.

[TheKruptos]

not the red parts.

[chuckfaststrat]

"not the red parts"

I don't think most people have a problem with the red parts. It's some of the horrors in the other 62 books some take issue with. And that's the rub, eh. "Accepting Jesus" is just the selling point for all of it. They rarely tell you that right up front.

[chuckfaststrat]

...and we all know that there is no way any misinformation or deception could possibly be directed by God.

...Or could it??

watch?v=WAm9qlaTRjY&feature=ch­annel_page

[NephilimFree]

This is a good argument. For atheists to not believe Jesus was who He said He was, they must believe He was a madman. It's perposterous to believe a man who spoke the greatest wisdomims of history and gave the most profound speech in the history of the world (Sermon on the Mount) could have been insane. That's simply not logical or rationale.

[chuckfaststrat]

It appears David Carridine just took his own life.

...goodbye, grasshopper...

: (

[KletosApostolos]

So, did he stray from the teachings of Master Po or is Taoism not all that it is cracked up to be?

[chuckfaststrat]

...I think that Hollywood is not all that it's meant to be.

watch?v=kGRQJgFio20&feature=re­lated

[KletosApostolos]

I guess worshipping life is not all that it's meant to be either.

[KletosApostolos]

:-p

[KletosApostolos]

Nice. You really need to do some comedy skits on your channel. The world needs to know the Chuck that I have known for 20+ years now.

You gotta get your webcam working. When are you gonna bring your puter over here?

[chuckfaststrat]

Actually, I was about to call you. I have some free time now, and I want to bring the webcam over and the rest of the DVDs of guitar playing I did in 2004.

When are you free?

[KletosApostolos]

I am free all day tomorrow (Friday).

[chuckfaststrat]

"Those that can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities"

*sigh*...gosh, I'm smart

: )

[KletosApostolos]

Voltaire?

[chuckfaststrat]

Yeah, Voltaire. He was a smart guy, too. All us smart guys know each other.

X D

[ChapelGirl1]

Thanks! Looking forward to seeing your videos.

[ChapelGirl1]

Thanks! I thought so, but I wasn't sure. I don't take Biblical Greek until next semester.

[KletosApostolos]

Cool. That will be fun.

I'm going to be making more of these videos. I will be covering both Greek & Hebrew texts. I would love for you to subscribe & be a part of future discussions.

[ChapelGirl1]

Not really...He is everywhere! Even in the heart of guys who think they are agnostic. Mr. Faststrat (the Zen-master) was a believer and I think he still is but is confused by flawed youtube theology and secular education.. God still lives there. He is waiting patiently. :) ...just my humble opinion.

[KletosApostolos]

I have been friends with Chuck for over 20 years now. You seem to have a pretty good grasp of his situation. The fact that you seem to know him so well, goes to show that Chuck is pretty much an open book. Very honest. What you see is what you get. He is a great guy. mislead, but a great friend.

[ChapelGirl1]

You are right. He is a great guy. Guess that's why I was hoping that you could help him see his way back to God. Does Kletos Apostolos translate to Called Apostle? Just curious.

[KletosApostolos]

Yes it does. Good job.

[ChapelGirl1]

Nice video. Keep working on your friend Chuckfaststrat. He needs your help. God still lives in his heart.

[KletosApostolos]

That's a weird place for God to live ;-)

Thx for the comment ChapelGirl.

[chuckfaststrat]

we must grow and change, grasshopper

: )

watch?v=w5X8Xv2XjSY

[KletosApostolos]

hey Goombah.... uh, I mean zen-master Chuck.

I like Master Po better than Master Kan.

watch?v=MOcOwVvY3y8

[chuckfaststrat]

Master Po was the bomb...and everyone knows it!

watch?v=e1RBODBhoPE&feature=ch­annel_page

[KletosApostolos]

"The Bible says Jesus was not a god; it also says Jesus was not a good moral teacher. "

I was hoping you would tell me where the Bible says that.

[Bueller007]

Your conclusion is inane and self-refuting. Plus you've omitted the most OBVIOUS possibility of all: other people put words into Jesus's mouth. (Although I tend to agree with Desertphile that Jesus was neither a god nor a good moral teacher.)

And why do you call this "your" thought process, when it's lifted directly from Mere Christianity by C.S. Lewis without accreditation?

[KletosApostolos]

Not lifted from C.S. Lewis. It is merely my thought process. I'm not claiming that I invented logic. I just charted out what I think on the subject.

Can you explain how my conclusion is self-refuting?

[Bueller007]

It's probably the most famous argument in modern Christian apologetics. Everyone knows it comes from C.S. Lewis. Mere Christianity, Book II, Chapter 3.

The argument is self-refuting because as you admitted, there are lots of people who claim to be God (although I find the New Testament is largely equivocal on the matter). If the argument is valid for Jesus, it should be equally valid for anyone else.

You've also omitted the obvious possibility that he was sane but honestly mistaken.

[KletosApostolos]

I haven't spent much time on Christian apologetics. The little I have seen on YouTube has been a tremendous waste of time. So, I'm sorry that I didn't know this most famous argument.

It's funny you talk about my omission. A good buddy of mine watched the video and said that would be the first thing I would get hammered on. He is turning out to be a YouTube Zen-master.

I still think someone that thinks they are God is insane. Just because one is sincere, doesn't make them less crazy.

[Bueller007]

Sure, if that's how you personally define "insane". Problem is that labels like that are subjective. (Look up the Rosenhan experiment.)

Personally, I don't think a mistaken belief necessarily makes someone crazy. That would be inability to think rationally. If you reason logically from false premises, you're not "crazy", you're just "wrong".

[Desertphile]

"Was Jesus really god or just a good moral teacher?"

Neither: read the Bible.

[KletosApostolos]

Care to explain Desertphile?

[Desertphile]

"Care to explain Desertphile?"

Explain what? The Bible says Jesus was not a god; it also says Jesus was not a good moral teacher.