Wiring Up Guitar Electronics 4, Connecting Tone Cap

[krisjingle]

hi , i noticed on your cap, it was rated for 600v. do you really think you would need that much or was it just a added value to have that much for the rated uF chosen ?

[johnplanetz]

@krisjingle - That's the maximum voltage for the cap, above which the dialectric would break down. It's essentially irrelevant for guitar applications, since guitar signals are generally well under 1 volt. I don't consider voltage ratings at all when buying caps for guitar.

[krisjingle]

@johnplanetz thank you , i wasn't sure but , good to know . i am refurbishing my ES-335 i am using 223m /100 v . thank you for your vid's , they are well explained and truly helpful.

[1273seant]

hi-i have just done a few mods to my guitar-tone split mod and push pot pot---if fitting a tone cap to a push pull pot do you put the tone cap on the bottom half ie round section as normal and then loop a piece of wire from that to one of the lugs on the botton of push pull pot-ie one of the spare pins -also i bought some caps i meant to buy 0.033uf cap but bought 0.33uf instead -can i use the 0.33uf and what is the difference beween the two---thankss sean

[johnplanetz]

@1273seant - you can think of the push pull pot as a regular pot with a totally independent dpdt switch underneath, with the the pot-shaft as the actuator. You can see my blog at planetz. com/?p=1037 for more info on push/pulls, or visit the wiring diagram archive at guitarelectronics. com. A .33uF will not be useful as a tone cap - it will be waaay too dark. See my vids on tone capacitance values for more information.

[bestijarules]

Thanks , will try that out.

[bestijarules]

I have a pot with a plastic back, so where do I solder the ground for the cap?

[johnplanetz]

@bestijarules - first confirm that it's not just a removable plastic cover. I've purchased some Alphas that came with plastic pot back-covers that are easily removed. If the pot body is really plastic, you can just find some other metal ground point to connect your grounds.

[MichaelSeanHarrell]

one of the best tutorial vids on guitar repair i've seen.good job john!

[1273seant]

hii which pot do u coonect to the one in the middle or the one near the input jack-sean

[johnplanetz]

@1273seant - depends on your guitar's control configuration. You need to look at some wiring diagrams and think about your circuit. Take a look at the wiring diagram archive at the guitarelectronics website (search or use the link at my blog at planetz).

[5150stephen]

thats one thing that annoys me about americans, they always say solder as "sodder" say it how its spelt (soul-der)

[johnplanetz]

@5150stephen - i couldn't agree more. My family is Australian, so I was raised saying sole-der. It's a struggle for me everytime to say "sodder" :)

[5150stephen]

@johnplanetz awesome, i did notice u hesitated a few times when u said it in the vid, u should just say it how u want, im sure everyone will understand from the context of wiring a guitar, by the way do u happento know anything about wiring a double neck the gibson way ?

[johnplanetz]

@5150stephen - I've never worked on a double-neck guitar. I found a schematic for the Gibson Felder EDS-1275 which should help you out. I'll send you a link.

[MichaelSeanHarrell]

@5150stephen can't even tell you what all annoys me about brits.

[5150stephen]

@MichaelSeanHarrell yeah brittish are fuckin annoyin with their pussy accents and their head-up-arse ways, should be shot the lot of them, and they all think they're too good for fucking life, now the scottish, those are the folk u wanna associate with, we will get u out of trouble and drink our way back into it, and we dnt give a shot what any other cunt thinks, freedom for the win :D

[MichaelSeanHarrell]

@5150stephen I'm only responding to the comment made about americans and the way they speak.I came to this video to learn a little about guitar electronics,and not to bitch about the way some one speaks.i am of strong irish decent,and damn proud.i do not care if some one pronounces a word differently than i do.MUSIC and the joy it brings is why i am on here!but ,I RAISE MY GLASS TO THE SCOTTISH!!!now back to the subject at hand : WIRING GUITAR ELECTRONICS.thanks for the tutorial JOHNPLANETZ.

[5150stephen]

@MichaelSeanHarrell americans have the best stuff, its just that one word :L i love jack daniels, gibson guitars, fender guitars and amps and all other cool stuff americans have invented :) and the accent is awesome, i've only met like 4 americans, 3 of them were mormons, they were pretty cool, and the 5th guy i dnt talk to much, but he's good friends with my other friend and he's pretty cool :)

[MichaelSeanHarrell]

@5150stephen im not just american I'm Texan.and proud of my accent.i tend to leave a lot of letters out of words when i speak.lol. PEACE FROM TEXAS!

[MichaelSeanHarrell]

@MichaelSeanHarrell any way why are we discussing this B.S.on this video?i think i will go check out your channel 5150.cya there.

[5150stephen]

@MichaelSeanHarrell all americans are awesome, although i would rather live in tennessee, for jack and gibsons, and the great weather, funny thing is the whole of the uk is a bit smaller than Texas haha peace from scotland man, and keep on rockin'

[5150stephen]

@MichaelSeanHarrell *4th

[anonymityrocks]

Great video thanks

[fingerboy18]

Great video! The only problem is that the flux burns off well before the solder melts. This is used to clear oxidation from the solder joint. It's much more difficult or sometimes impossible to solder by putting solder on the tip without additional flux. Most professionals would say to heat both materials that are being fused, then apply the solder between the materials without touching the tip. The flux lowers the melting point of the solder and keeps the surface clean. I've been there a

[johnplanetz]

@fingerboy18 - thanks for the tip. I've tried a flux pen and didn't really find it helped my work.  Generally I find if I add some solder to the iron tip, it gets things flowing nicely.

[gholy2743]

Thanks!



[carricod000]

Do you need to put a resistor or a capacitor on a guitar when building one? I'm making a single pickup stratocaster with one volume and one tone knob. Also, Does the tone knob just connect to the pot?

[johnplanetz]

@carricod000 - see the FAQ at my blog at planez for some links to resources on books, wiring diagrams, etc.

[carricod000]

Where can you buy a tone cap?

[johnplanetz]

@carricod000 - you can buy components at general places like radioshack, mouser, digikey, or guitar-oriented places like stewmac, guitarelectronics, guitarpartsresource, etc.

[rkey16]

will it effect the sound with u solder the tone cap with the think wires together in one big melted solder pool?? is it better to solder it spread out?

[johnplanetz]

@rkey16 - too much (or too little) solder can weaken the mechanical connection, but won't affect the electrical connection. In other words, as long as they're electrically connected, it won't sound any different with more solder.

[MitjaShi]

what's difference between connecting the other end of the cap to the back of the tone pot (like here) or to one of the lugs of the volume pot (like on Les pauls)? Thanks.

[johnplanetz]

@MitjaShi - that side of the tone cap is wired to ground. You can find ground at a number of places in the circuit, and they're all electrically equivalent.

[smartsump]

Good thing , 

[smartsump]

Your voice sounds like Neil Sedaka, good quality vids

[johnplanetz]

@smartsump - haha! is that a good thing or a bad thing!? :)

[Chamillo87]

Hey, i'm having problems wiring the tone on my guitar, i do everything but it stays as a second volume... i bought new pots and caps btw.

[johnplanetz]

@Chamillo87 - sounds like a wiring mistake. Look at the diagrams at the guitarelectronics Guitar Diagram Archive, and double check all your connections.

[MrMutron]

@johnplanetz Do you use Flux? I use Paste Flux, and NEVER had a problem. However, alot of people are telling me not to because it "Corrodes" the Connections...over time. Your Thoughts?

[johnplanetz]

@MrMutron - I've never used paste flux. I use 60/40 rosin core solder. The "rosin core" is rosin flux embedded in the solder. Assuming your paste flux is made from rosin, then it's not particularly different from the solder and shouldn't have any issues with corrosion. Avoid acid flux.

[narfanoid]

These are the first truely HELPFUL vids on wiring I have found. Thanks!!!

[longwhip]

.01 mfd is a better choice for the orange drops. You can run your tone knobs higher on your amp than you would normally play and roll the tone pot back to halfway with .01mfd caps, and have your regular tone and when you want to SOLO you dime the tone knob and the huge apparent frequency shift is like kicking on a boost pedal and RIGHT OFF your guitar. It really is the mod to do for the guitars normal frequency range. You can also turn the tone knob OFF and still have a great sound! Try it!

[johnplanetz]

@longwhip - yep, that's a .01uF orange drop that i'm wiring up in the video! i agree, it's a great choice.

[MrMutron]

@johnplanetz Do you prefere polyester or polypropylene tone caps?

[johnplanetz]

@MrMutron - i don't have a preference, but even if i did, it may not match your preferences, so try both. they're cheap! :)

[artmiller]

Very helpful video--thanks!

[SmileysRevenge100]

Dude. I love you for doing this.

[journeyquest1]

The 25w iron didnt work well for the pots. Took too long to heat and heated to much when it did. 25w was good for small connections. But i need a 40w+ for the pots and bigger stuff. My 1st solder job looked cheap but will work.

[1273seant]

hi-i dont think its a ground noise problem if i over heated the volume pot would this cuase a loud hum when volume is turned up-thanks sean

[johnplanetz]

@1273seant - it's unlikely that it's a bad pot. i suggest you unsolder and test with alligator clip leads to isolate the issue.

[1273seant]

hi-have connected three texas specials to my start i think i have all the pickups wired correctly but when i turn up the volume thier is a maaasive hum-should all the wire including the ones to the jack be to gether -any ideas sean

[johnplanetz]

@1273seant - yes the pickup ground wires all need to be electrically connected to the common ground at the jack. see my video "Guitar ground: Dealing with ground noise problems" for an overview.

[Drblooter99]

Can you help me with a small problem? I installed a rotary selector switch in my bass guitar. To it I attached 6 capacitors, from 0.033uF up to 0.47uF (for a lot of bass!). I connected a choke in series with the 3 higher value capacitors. I am happy with the improved sounds, but I get electronically amplified clicking when I switch between rotary positions. Do I need to put in a resistor somewhere?

[johnplanetz]

@Drblooter99 - if the sound is a "pop", like a cap discharge, you may be able to improve it by wiring a large resistor (like 1Meg) in parallel to ground. Experiment with alligator clip leads to see if it helps, before soldering. Or it could just be the nature of the switch.

[Drblooter99]

@johnplanetz

Thanks, I'll try that!

[stonedrocker666]

hey um, i recently bought a shadow kill pot and the stock one that came in my epiphone was wired with ground and signal to the back, and im worried about putting it in and getting no sound, any tips?

[johnplanetz]

@stonedrocker666 - as far as i know, a shadow kill pot is wired just like a regular volume pot. should be a drop-in replacement for your stock volume pot. before soldering, just use alligator clip leads to experiment and you should be able to figure it all out.

[stonedrocker666]

@johnplanetz the stock came in the tone control position, whats a good cap, .1 or .047 its for les paul

[johnplanetz]

@stonedrocker666 - .1uF is way too big. .047 or .022 are more common. some people prefer even smaller. see my part 2 of my video series on tone caps for explanation and demo of different capacitances.

[brainiestben]

@Guitarstring187 will a tone pot work as a volume pot? cheers :)

[Davesintexas]

Hey, I tried to send you a response it failed....I want to thank you for your videos, the cardboard setup really came in handy, and for the added help. I seem to have solved my own problems. First was the fact that I did a bad Soldering job letting the wires float above the caps inside the solder. Fixed that. Next, I had some wires that had been broken due to heat and bending. Very small space. Ive got 2 tone 2 vol NOW. 2 Slash pus and man will that guitar play. Check my video to hear it.

[Davesintexas]

Hey, Still love your videos......BUT? Ive seen drawings as well as the inside of one of my Les Pauls where the Caps are actually soldered between the Tone Pots and the Volume Pots. Have you ever seen this done??? And if so why is it done that way? Reason Im asking is that Ive got a real problem with Duncan Slash Pots single wire and shielded wire as a ground no other wires for the PUs. Im having all types of problems with the 2Vol and 2 Ton and 3 way toggle.

[johnplanetz]

@Davesintexas - sure - I think that's fairly common. The end result is the same as what I show- a cap and variable resistor in series to ground. It doesn't matter whether the resistor or cap comes first- it sounds the same. The only benefit of doing it the way describe, as far as I can tell, is that you need one less wire. I prefer not to string up the cap between pots like that, because you end up with exposed cap leads which are more likely to short against another wire.

[guitarheo3]

really good videos :)

[Guitarstring187]

having an issue with my mim strat. The high e string is weaker than the rest of the strings. Could this be because of a bad volume pot Ive made adjustments to every part of the guitar nothing helps.

1.Happens on all pickups-not as bad on bucker.fat strat

2.adjusted the tremolo system (it lays flat) tremlo broke in it

3.Switched around existing string saddles.(ajusted them all)

4. nut is kinda worn but problem is still there when fretted

Its been this way for ages almost since i got it in 04

[johnplanetz]

@Guitarstring187 - i don't think your volume pot is causing this. have you tried adjusting your pickups to be closer to the strings on the high E side?

[Guitarstring187]

@johnplanetz well i put out a huge thread on harmony central got some great help there. Turns out it needed a neck ajustment or possible bad volume pot on amp. but either way the problem is minimal now.But thanks for the help

[nymetsrock]

you take alot of precautions with those alligator clips, ive never done that and never had problems

[8888888060580]

Haa dont worry bout it I had the same prob, just giving you a hard time, sorry bud

[Lubial]

i have a problem my guitar neck pick up the tone wont work with it is there something wrong with it i open the guitar and i saw some cables that were not in their place and i just put solder and but still the tone knob is not doing anything but i put the the mid section and it works with it!

[johnplanetz]

@Lubial - sounds like the wires to the tone knob broke. if you're not sure where the wires should be soldered, find a wiring diagram, like at the guitarelectronics website (see links in my blog if you can't find it).

[Lubial]

@johnplanetz thanks i did look for one and found it hahahaha and i fixed it thanks

[guttersnipephil]

@Lubial it actually sounds like you have a mexican strat. am i right?

[8888888060580]

Quick tip- might want to get those finger nail checked out, that shit just doesn't look healthy

[johnplanetz]

@8888888060580 - sorry i didn't get my manicure that day :) spend a bunch of time soldering, twisting sharp metal objects,etc, and you can expect your fingers to take a beating. i should probably where nitrile gloves but I always forget...

[johnplanetz]

@Takaminelover25 - active pickups use a 9v battery in the guitar - these are less common than passive pickups. your stock pickups are passive single coils. a 50k pot wouldn't work well. standard stratocaster uses 250k volume and tone pots. 500k would also work

[johnplanetz]

@Takaminelover25 - with passive pickups, a 50k pot will load the pickup too much, causing dull sound. if you're using active pickups, a 50k pot would work.

[johnplanetz]

@Takaminelover25 - I think you're confused about the "50k variable capacitor". Variable caps are very uncommon. See my videos "Guitar Tone Capacitors", parts 1-4 for all the info you need on understanding tone caps, understanding their capacitance values, comparing material types, etc. Good luck!

[Callanbassplayer]

Could I use any small, metallic clip as a heat sink when soldering tone caps? Or specifically an alligator clip?

[johnplanetz]

@Callanbassplayer - you can use anything that will divert heat away from the capacitor. Even holding the lead with needle-nose pliers will work- but that requires an extra hand.

[JonathanAnon]

Hi John, thanks for the brilliant videos.. Successfully changed the volume pot on my Yahama Pacifica thanks to your videos which gave me the confidence / knowledge to tackle it.. Gonna tackle the dodgy pickup selector on my Jackson next. thanks again.

[JonathanAnon]

Hi John, thanks for the brilliant videos.. Successfully changed the volume pot on my Yahama Pacifica thanks to your videos which gave me the confidence / knowledge to tackle it.. Gonna tackle the dodgy pickup selector on my Jackson next. thanks again.

[w2iecmkkghht]

Thank you for this series of vids of guitar tech lessons/know-how`s.

I have a qustion.What about cap voltage.

I see that in this video you using 600V / 22nFcap.

Is there any diference if the cap is 100V , 160V or so.

Will that change the tone?

[johnplanetz]

@w2iecmkkghht - no it doesn't really matter. guitar signals are extremely low voltage, so don't worry about it. I suppose different cap construction for different voltages may change the character of the tone, but you certainly don't need to look for a specific voltage cap, and higher certainly does not mean better.

[MrAndcruz]

does it matter which lead goes to ground.....

or does a cap have a (+) and(-) lead?? will it work either way...

cheers

[johnplanetz]

@MrAndcruz - the caps typically used for tone will work either way. Electrolytic caps have a polarity (and will fail if you put them in backwards), but they're not used for guitar tone... So don't worry bout it.

[MrAndcruz]

@johnplanetz thanks for clearing that up, was wondering about that for a while

cheers

[nickstur]

if the cap gets hot when soldering will it break?

[johnplanetz]

@nickstur - if the cap gets too hot, the dialectric can be compromised. You may not be able to see any problem physically, but the cap will no longer hold a charge properly.  Test with a multimeter to confirm. If your multimeter doesn't measure capacitance, you can set it to resistance mode, and measure across the two leads. You should see a small bounce in resistance that goes back to infinite. If you see that the resistance stays low, the cap is no good.

[nickstur]

@johnplanetz ok i tried that, set it to a resistance level of 200k, it goes from 1 - 140 ( around there) then back to 1, so its working right?

[johnplanetz]

@nickstur - not sure which scale you're reading. If 1 in this case means very high resistance (often referred to as infinite), and 140 means some lower resistance, then it's all good.

[tylerammon]

where do all the ground wires go?

[johnplanetz]

all ground ultimately needs to be connected to the ground lug of the jack.

for some background, see my video on ground hum.

for more ideas, search for star grounding, and avoiding ground loops.

[redoubt9000]

I'm not sure of the technicalities, but what's is the purpose of the.. the um orange thing? XD I'm trying to find your first vid but I can't seem to.. wait! found it ^_^ Does it dock down the value of say a 500k pot to a lower value or something?

I've got a couple of pickups along with a new switch and some pots + pickguard and was hoping to put together a new wired pickguard soon

[redoubt9000]

lol I guess I jumped the gun with the questions XD Caught the explanation in another video of yours :) Awesome videos! 5/5!

[johnplanetz]

The orange thing is a capacitor.  Caps come in different sizes, shapes and colors, and different material types and capacitance values. Here it's working as a tone filter. For more info see my video "Guitar Tone Capacitors, part 2: How Tone Works, Selecting a Value". This explains how the tone cap works as a filter to shape the sound. And in part 1 of that video, I talk about the different cap material types. I also have a video about using the cap for treble bleed.

Hope this helps!

[redoubt9000]

awesome! Thanks, these vids are a great help - I'm beginning to understand it a bit more now :)

Now it's just a question of with cap XD I'm checking the wire diagrams for Seymour Duncan, they're suggesting .047 uF caps although I'd imagine that would be a bit too muddy on the rolloff? I'm thinking maybe .01 would do well enough for the filter range on a couple of humbuckers?

[johnplanetz]

They're generally pretty cheap. I suggest you buy a few different caps and try them to find the one you like. Have fun with it!

[xxcowslayerxxx]

so what happens when you dont use a heat sink? cuz, i kinda did that and my guitar is all staticy, but i rewired my whole guitar, also i didnt roughen up the post or tin them or the wires, but all the connections are there, im thinking i should start with replacing the caps (the right way this time) what do u think?

[johnplanetz]

Yes, it's possible you fried your cap. Try swapping in an alternate (with alligator clips, before soldering) and see if it makes a difference.

[SurfGreenTelecaster]

Great vids, thanks for all of these demonstrations. You walked me right through rewiring my old '79 Washburn. :)

[zabuza182]

what does tone caps exactly do? I still dont understand this. On my bass its a p bass and on the tone knob there is a cap and what does this cap do? Also what if I didnt use it and what connections are what? The middle is what again? and the sides are? Thanks please help me I want to learn and get a new pot for my guitar

[johnplanetz]

See my vid on how tone caps work.

[zabuza182]

ok so what is the difference between 25k 50k 100k 250k and 500k to 1 meg? is it just warmer to brighter? or does this also effect the volume as well?

[johnplanetz]

Have a look at my vid on tone caps, part 1. I play through the caps at various resistances. You can hear for yourself what it'll sound like at 500k, 250k, 40k, etc.

[nophobia123]

is it possible to have a volume and tone in one knob using a Dual pot?

[johnplanetz]

Sure. You an think of a dual concentric pot as two independent pots sitting on top of each other. There are two stacked knob rings for independently adjusting the two pots.

[nophobia123]

thank you very much :)

[bfv102290]

How much of a difference is there in the different amounts of microfarats?

[johnplanetz]

It affects the cutoff frequency of the filter. Bigger capacitance will cut more highs when turning the knob down. Smaller capacitance won't get as dark when turning down.

I'll be posting part 2 of my tone caps comparison video this weekend, in which I compare how different capacitance values affect the useful range of the tone knob. Stay tuned!

[StringSlinger26]

Where do I find that cap??? I have looked all over and cant find any that are rated the same as yours. Please let me know.

[johnplanetz]

It's a Vishay Sprague 715p series orange drop .01 microfarad (103),. Just search for "orange drop .01" and you'll find it. I bought mine online at mouser electronics.

If you're interested in why I chose this one, see my videos on tone cap selection.

[Syderterran]

Good tutorials, really good explanations. Although I prefer to solder all the grounds together in a point as small as it can. Regards.

[idigcars]

beauty posting

[avantgarde120]

Hey,thanks for the help.I got mine an orange cap and will try to fixed them on.Great work and am looking forward to other informative stuff from u.Thanks!i am subscribing to u now.

[avantgarde120]

Hi,which end of the cap is actually to ground?how to identify them?confused,pls help.Thanks.

[johnplanetz]

Polarity is critical for electrolytic caps - if you get them backwards they can fail or explode!

These orange drops (and most tone circuit caps) are NOT electrolytics. Polarity doesn't really matter.

I've read that there may be some noise resistance benefit if the cap's outside foil is connected to ground but I haven't really been able to tell the difference so I don't bother. As you've noticed, the outside foil often isn't marked so it's hard to figure out anyway.

So don't worry about it!

[immanrobinson]

thank you so much it was very helpful...