Tomiki Tournament - shomen-ate1

[matkasim]

aint no aikido techniques here, just judo leg sweeps. get real

[Samperor]

do you recommend Tomiki Aikido or Judo in your opinions?

[Hotora86]

Funny to see all these "real Aikido" naysayers when they know deep inside that what they do is a dance and they'd get whooped by any of these guys.

Respect to Tomiki Aikido.

[Godagesil]

The fallacy of the competition is this... what was keeping either one of them from punching the crap out of each other while they clung to one another inside Maii? While Tori was clinging to my arm, I would have punched him with my left if I was unfamiliar with Aikido. Personally I would have just gone with him as he pulledmy arm and done Udegaeshi on him. They look like they are doing a tug of war.

[nappyheaded]

Huh? It's just a torunament dude. Do you at least do Judo or something cause I don't understand where your coming from.

[chrisco27]

All that brute strength! That's NOT Aikido, I'm sorry!

[nappyheaded]

Could you take him? Do you even know the name of that technique he just used is called in other styles?

[PRehse]

Are you blind? That was a perfectly timed counter to gykugamae-ate. These guys are both fit, strong and well- trained - what dominates is superior technique. Brute strength would never pull that off.

[Godagesil]

The worst aikido I've ever seen. Brute strength, off balance, out of posture, it is total crap. Looks like the mixed martial arts stuff on TV. It should be called playground grappling.

[Nudz]

because it's not the choreographed useless dance that traditional akikido teaches? Maybe you should watch ballet instead, it's got the same martial merit.

[xEtiquettex]

I disagree. I do not think that is good Aikido. It is very good technique, but not good Aikido technique. I'm sorry, I hope we can agree to disagree.

[TheRealUnderherfeet]

Dance? I can see you never trained seriously. Hardly a dance when it comes down to it. There are some who would like it to be ut when confronted in a potentially violent situation, real world sort of thing, the traditional aikido won't be a dance. Trust me on this one. Don't be fooled y some of these videos.

[abdelinho]

Here is a video of one of the greatest master. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v­=fBp4KI94CPw

Enjoy yourself

[towag]

Still set up though! His uke's are very good, Wonder how well he would do against Gene Labelle!!

[PRehse]

Actually no that wasn't. That was shiai (full resistance) and expertly done. Mifune would have known.

[towag]

I was making reference to Tissier.... All his demonstrations are set up!

[abdelinho]

I agree with you I cannot always stop or prevent them from coming too close but what seems strange here is that the guy is waiting or searching a technique while in a real situation he won't have enough time to do so I mean if we want to use Aikido as a defensive art

[nappyheaded]

The guy was trying to unbalance him. Competitions are the closest thing to a real setting because it's actually against a real opponent not someone set up as nage or uke. Aikido isn't a defensive art. You don't need to wait for your opponent to attack you for the techniques to work. My instructor demonstrated once that even if your a school bully you can still use the techniques on a helpless victim who's too afraid to attack you.

[xEtiquettex]

It *can* be for attacking. And, yes, you can use the techniques to attack, but I would argue they are better for defense and are meant to be as such. Ueshiba would not make nage charge at an opponent. So, although it is Aikido, I would not consider it to be. (a painting that's 1/2 Aikido 1/2 something else is still not Aikido)

[TheRealUnderherfeet]

I have to agree with what you're saying. You can use it as an attack.

[abdelinho]

It is only a matter of timing not force.

When we train we always ask Uke to attack as strongly as possible to act as if it was a real attack. Uke knows how to protect himself from a technique but does not know which technique we will use that's the difference. An aikidoka have to prevent his oponent to come too close

[nappyheaded]

There is no uke or nage in these clips. You can't always stop them from coming so close.

[abdelinho]

Ok the guy did fine but if he was acting like that with a judoka he wouldn't have made it, Judo still remains the martial art for such techniques.

Aikido is based on movements and distances.

Regarding this kokyunage I rather prefer to say that the guy has only pushed his oponent it is not real Kokyu anybody can throw like that Kokyu is much difficult

[nappyheaded]

An actual fight or sparring is different than what you imagine it would be. You can't just say I would do this and that's what would happen.

If you think it's so easy to do. Go to your local judo club and try that "push," on them and see if it would work.

[abdelinho]

I have been practising Aikido for several years and actually I completely agree with you that Aikido is a great martial art and in my opinion perhaps one of the best system. Master Tomiki was a great one but always in competition the spirit goes away unfortunately.

IN this shot we see that there is too much contact it is not Aikido but a position for judo or juijitsu techniques, aikidoka will lose in such position even in a real situation.

[nappyheaded]

you have been practicing for several years but, you still couldn't recognize a kokyunage. the spirit goes away? these guys did fine in "such position." Do you really think you could do better?

[patrino]

"Master Tomiki was a great one but always in competition the spirit goes away unfortunately". As originally taught by o'sensei he intended no competition in Aikido, but as Kenji Tomiki was also a master judoka he would have had a great deal of resistive fighting experience in judo and so could see the benefit and need for some type of sparring in Aikido. Single random attacks really dont cut it.Even Tissier spars against a kickboxer regularly.

[TheRealUnderherfeet]

I actually agree with this. Your aikido would be that much better in a real world situation.

[abdelinho]

too much contact I said, Judo is much appropriated for such techniques

[nappyheaded]

don't forget Aikido is a martial art too and it can be used effectively just like any other martial art.

[abdelinho]

In Aikido we avoid as much as possible contact with the oponent I do not understand this technique, they should have pratised Judo...

[nappyheaded]

In a fight or sparring you can't decide what happens. The technique is a kokyunage to the face. If you don't know what a kokyunage is ask your instructor. Why should they have practiced Judo?