Soul Reaver 2 - Raziel finds Turel

[MrMente322]

hi i hope you can help me , i have a few question . is from soul reaver 1 of ps1 , why turel travel to the past and how? , and why kain not bring back to malek when he find the tombs of the serafan?

[AMVTides]

@MrMente322 Azimuth the Planer one of the pillar guardians from BO1 used one of Moebius' time streaming devices to go forward and bring Turel into their time to Sever as Hasha'gik.

And Kain didn't bring Malek back because when Mortanius Severed Maleks soul from his body and sealed it in his armor. Maleks soul was released separate so there was no soul in in Maleks body to modify with Kain's soul therefore he couldn't bring him back.

[AMVTides]

@AMVTides my theory on malek is speculation it is not ever actually stated in the series



[THEIAN11]

the music on thsi version is the same from the one i played on, im glad to hear the good version i like

[flashinfect]

is spamming the fuck out of the same button the only way to play? Can't you guard-break or anything of the sort?

[menaname123]

Hehe... I find it quite ironic now that Turel speaks of ''getting back to the pit you crawled from'', considering his future fate. Anyway, the Sarafan Stronghold music I find on youtube seems to be different from the one in your videos, do you know why?

[Joudas]

@menaname123 The PC versions of the SR games have pretty buggy music, I'd guess that's the reason.

[smoking1212]

@menaname123 lol.

[Ghostglue]

lolz dumah died before rahab xD he wasnt that good then :P

[pochazet]

revenge

[Melonreality13]

na many nerds

[Reingnus]

In those fights you are indestructible, soo its not funny...

[0NoName9]

I wonder what would have the Sarafan done if Raziel told them he was invincible and stood there getting hit for a while, just to terrify them before their inevitable death.

[chemsprite1]

i remember this part. i was invincible but still frustrated at the difficulty.

[XxXKaMeHaMeAhXxX]

u suck at fighting

[Xsquad22]

Damn Turel looks like a beast GET BACK TO THE PIT U CRAWLED FROM DEMON!!!

[marko89med]

ok I've finished this game again yesterday lol...best game serials ever...but i never liked BO 1 & 2...I must say that SR1 is the best,regarding the graphics and all...

[russiangirl112]

i didnt play the soul reaver for ps1? and i cant find it in shops some1 know website to downlaod it ^-_-^

[SuperRaven333]

If you have a PS3 you can download it from the Playstation Store

[AnGEILaTiNo]

Finally I get to see Turel. He was missing from SR and I wanted to know what happened to him.

[Sonic3323]

play LoK: Defiance, then you know

[starilious1989]

he was cut out of the first soul reaver due to production. but makes his appearance in lok defiance.

[Darkstar263]

Yesterday, I got the part in Defiance where Raziel encounters Turel. All I was able to say was holy fuck at what he had become. A really fucked up monster. And I really enjoyed killing him too, it was a fun fight.

Sorry If I've spoiled it for you at all. If you haven't played Defiance yet that is.

[xDYoutypxD]

what happened to him after he gets vampire u can see in legacy of kain defiance !!!

[magnawiz]

poor turel becomes a guinea pig :(

[KimHero32]

They could make this game as a movie! and if they do I hope they dont spoil the story and characters.

[Danny77uk]

Does anyone know why Turel wasn't in SR1?

[Joudas]

He was originally going to be. In the original design, defeating Kain gave the 'Shift at Will' ability, letting you shift from spectral to material anywhere, without a conduit. You then used that to reach Turel's area (an industrial factory spewing ash into the air, blotting out the sun). This was changed midway through development - you can find screenshots of Turel's area if you search a little (it was in several previews in magazines).

[draklorian]

@Joudas

i am sure that Morlock the vampire turelim that you get telekenesis from was going to be Turel and all the vampires that look like him would have been morlock vampires, but time went on things changed, for the better i say : )

[shadowman320]

he was only he was at the intro of the game watching wile raziel was trown into the abis

[KyuubiRasenX]

No, Turel along with Dumah threw Raziel into the abyss

[scorpmk]

cause raziel couldent find him simple lol hes in 3rd one though and razial kicks the shit into him lol

[ReyBrujoAngmar]

he was kidnapped by Azimuth

[Omegabahamut999]

@Danny77uk

Story wise, he was taken to the past to the time of Mortanius. He is a boss in Defiance and makes Raziel's TK ability to be that on par with Kain's.

[escrown]

if im honest i liked the graph of legacy of kain soul reaver was better than 2

[Acuraintegraman1]

it is because kains nature as scion of balance that he cannot be killed. and not even raziel could kill him in avernus when he ripped his heart out, but if he had used the soul reaver he probably could have.

[leahcimrac]

The music in the Stronghold is great.

[Acuraintegraman1]

in defiance Kain has the blood reaver as without raziels soul in it yet, and he is far from invincible. and even after raziel is absorbed and ariel as well he is still not invincible, he can die.

[clickingpinging]

My explanation is that Raziel because he was near to his final fate (to become the Soul Reaver),he had became invicible in order to fulfill his fate..

[Acuraintegraman1]

surely kain is not invincible when he wields the blood reaver.

[Joudas]

Kain never wields the blood reaver. He wields the soul reaver, because it ceases being the blood reaver when it absorbs Raziel's soul, losing the blood-stealing properties in favor of soul stealing.

[Acuraintegraman1]

@Joudas actually he does in DEFIANCE it is the best of all the games i suggest you all try it. kane 4tw

[Joudas]

@Acuraintegraman1 I am going to assume you're kidding. If you're not, suffice to say I have played Defiance many times. :P

[llVIU]

@Joudas I am going o assume you haven't played Legacy of Kain long enough. He does weild the "blood" reaver, the thing is that it would simply suck to have a game where you would've been invincible as Kain, it doesn't have to make sense or have logic story-wise

[Joudas]

@llVIU You're assuming incorrectly, then, but that's beside the point. When, then, in your opinion, does it cease being the blood reaver, and become the soul reaver?

[llVIU]

nobody knows, they never show afterwards how the soul reaver (raziel in it) takes the blood or soul of its victims

[Joudas]

@llVIU Ah, but we know (for a fact!) that at some point it stops being the Blood Reaver and starts being the Soul Reaver. Kain's description of the weapon in BO1 clues us in here, as does the fact that it never again steals blood - only souls. Further, after Defiance, Raziel ceases to be - and I think we can agree that his captive soul is the reason for the switch from Blood Reaver to Soul Reaver.

[Joudas]

@llVIU Now, in the original timeline, the Soul Reaver came into being, however, in the original timeline, the Reaver consumes Raziel in the Sarafan Stronghold after he kills his human self. I will concede that, since Kain stops this from happening, the change from Blood to Soul reaver may have been delayed (until the end of Defiance, when it does in fact consume Raziel, willingly this time), but there is no evidence to support or refute that it remains the Blood Reaver.

[Joudas]

@llVIU EXCEPT, of course, that it no longer consumes the blood of its victims. So, using that as evidence (and discounting that it's merely that way for continuity and gameplay, which is a sloppy answer at best), it can be reasoned that when it attempted to consume Raziel's soul (and was nearly successful), it ceased being the Blood Reaver, and became something else. Maybe not the soul reaver (yet), but it certainly ceased being the Blood Reaver. Can you show me evidence to the contrary?

[smoking1212]

@Joudas When raziel was killing his serafan brothers was he wielding the blood reaver or the soul reaver?

[Joudas]

@smoking1212 The Blood Reaver. He found it conveniently placed in his path as he was running through the Citadel, and wields it for the remainder of the game.

[MisterTwoPiece]

@Joudas - get a life?

[Joudas]

@MisterTwoPiece What brought about that comment?

[manmadebeefcake7]

@Acuraintegraman1 defiance was awesome but soul reaver 1 is the best

[jebotimater]

Kain is invincible, only Raziel can kill Kain.

[ClaudiaSwann]

and only kain can kill raziel.

all explained in the story line really - well it;'s the whole point of the story line xD

[Syfa]

@Acuraintegraman1 Hate to comment on a year old message, but being a blood stealing weapon doesn't mean much when your victim has no blood.

[Acuraintegraman1]

@Syfa youre clearly drunk or retarded. good luck with that.

[Acuraintegraman1]

but it was his purpose to redeem kain. as janos says it was a necessary evil to pass on the dark gift, they created more vampires despite the curse, the same could be said of raziels immorality.

[Acuraintegraman1]

when i say divine i refer to the ancient vampires. and for raziel to hold a vampirec weapon that became one with his body made him invincible suggests otherwise than for a big squid to endow him wit these bodily attributes.

[Joudas]

The blood reaver made him invincible because that's what it was made to do - it absorbs the blood of its victims and heals its wielder. The ancient vampires would never have created anything that bestowed immortality, as their entire belief system revolved around death and rebirth - it was actually immortality that the Hylden cursed them with, causing their madness and ultimate fall from grace.

[Joudas]

The Blood Reaver was created after the vampires fell, by Vorador - not the ancient vampires. Raziel technically is a parasitic wraith just like the rest of the Elder God's minions - he's a wraith (in the spectral realm) who consumes the souls of others to sustain himself - this is a parasitic existence.

[Acuraintegraman1]

but in defiace it shows former agents of elder god as parasitic wraiths and raziel eludes to the fact he will become like them over. so why does he contradict himself? why did the vampire messiah have to be resurected by a squid instead of having a natural divine ressurection?

[Joudas]

My understanding here is that Raziel isn't sure how his resurrection came about. He muses in SR1 that perhaps the Elder God didn't resurrect him, perhaps he was simply there and decided to use the situation to his advantage, but he never finds out for sure. We know the Elder God is capable of resurrecting his followers (See: Moebius), so it is feasible to believe that Raziel was actually raised by the Elder God, and his musings to the contrary were simply attempts at defiance on his part.

[Joudas]

A divine resurrection would suggest that some sort of divinity cared about Raziel or his fate, which is never suggested or alluded to in any of the games (nor is the presence of such a divinity even mentioned). The Elder God is the only 'god' (if you want to call him that) that's ever mentioned, unless I'm mistaken.

[Acuraintegraman1]

i too require your infinite knowledge joudas, in SR2 raziel says that the elder god was merely present when his resurection occured.

[ihatenarain]

"The Vampire Turel had eluded my vengeance"

-> Raziel came for T in Defiance

[TheRavenLord13]

1 question Joudas. elder god was in spectral realm, but in defiance he fights with kain in the material realm

[Joudas]

He exists in both - this is apparent in both SR1 and SR2, when you see him in the physical realm - you can then shift to spectral, and he's there as well.

[RednessAlpha]

Only Raziel could see him, because he was an agent of the EG. He existed in both realms, but was not visible to all. Kain was able to see him in Defiance because the Reaver had purified his sight.

[TheRavenLord13]

so complicated, 1 ex. vorador dies in bo1 , but u can see him in defiance

[Joudas]

There's a lot of time travel in the series - he dies at the same point in each game, time line-wise (except BO2, for which the best explanation is that somehow Kain changed the time line when he defeated the Elder God, but it's more likely just sloppiness).

[Phovoz]

yes, the time line chance but here in soul reaver 2, and vorodor somehow scape from moebius's hunters, because the fight with elder (false) god it's after blood omen, i mean, after the pillar's colaps.

[Joudas]

We don't see Vorador in SR2 after the point in the timeline when he is killed. When we see him in Defiance, it's also before that point in the timeline, and Moebius specifically tells Raziel that he is dead later on in the game. Unless we assume that Moebius is lying there, which he really has no reason to do, it's a flaw in the story that he appears in BO2. BO2 wasn't written by Amy Hennig (who wrote the other games), so this is very possible.

[Acuraintegraman1]

did amy hennig write defiance?

[Joudas]

Yes - Blood Omen 2 was the only one she didn't write.

[TheRavenLord13]

what do you mean false elder god?

[Phovoz]

Kain says that at the end of defiance "false god"

that thing is not a god, its a cancer like raziel said.

[Phovoz]

you should play it again

[CarboniteML8]

old habits die hard and in some cases twice lol

[esetios]

Raziel sounds scary on this video :X

[S4rc4st1c]

Maybe it's not about video but what the hell - I always wonder why the hell Hyldens even try to conquer the world if they know the future - and the secret of Soul Reaver (everybody knew that :P). Hylden Lord bring his army, kill the vampires - but for god sake Hyldens bring Turel to be Hash'Ak'Gik - so they knew that Kain will build his empire. But even with all the incongruity - I love LoK series.

[timonczesq]

It is explained within the game: The Soul Reaver blade is able to change future. Hylden were most probably aware of that fact, but the have probably hoped they could prevent any major changes and then conquer the world.

[DarthSutekh]

I think its more the Hylden are INSANE. A fact they repeat fairly often.

[ClaudiaSwann]

its explained in all the games,

from BO 1

the soul reaver, brought to meet itself from another time, shifts time so that the future can change,

besides,

in defiance the Hylden dont fail. the Hylden lord like it atualy there, in nosgoth.

[hence BO2 and Janos and all that]

the story is flawless<3

LoK.. if only there could be more of them

[Thomaspwgy]

i would rather not call it incongruity

[TwilightKitsune89]

This is hard to explain with the paradox ((Talking about the Soul Reaver Timeline)). Blood Omen 2 takes place year after Blood Omen 1 where Kain didn't take the Reaver out of Raziel as he died. That Kain grows up to remove the blade, that was the paradox in SR2 because Kain was there when he orignally wasn't. Raziel was attacking the stronghold at the same time as Vorador.

[michaelthonger]

damn, this series is confusing!!!

[DaSeek3r]

Movies, books and games that include time travel are always confusing

[TheRavenLord13]

that's true

[22Osamis22]

dude if blood omen 2 is after defiance why is kain using the soul reaver since in defiance he is using the reaver containing raziel`s spirit?and how come kain is so much younger then?

[Joudas]

The Reaver containing Raziel's spirit is the Soul Reaver. Purified or not, it's still the Soul Reaver.

As for him being younger, depending on who you ask, it's either a general incongruity error (of which there are many), or it is the 'original' Kain, during his rise to power, but in the post-Defiance time line.

[gamesrock80]

kain gets the reaver after raziel killed his borthers in sr2

[slipsen92]

Malek was the strongest ^^ ive just completed Legacy of kain im going 2 buy blood omen and all soul reavers

But wich one is first is it first like Legacy then Soulreaver Then blood omen?

[Joudas]

Blood Omen 1, Soul Reaver 1, Soul Reaver 2, Defiance, Blood Omen 2

[DrawingLord]

Actually I think Blood Omen 2 is before Defiance.

[Joudas]

BO2 was made before Defiance, but storyline-wise, comes afterwards. It details what happens to Kain after Defiance, as he goes after the Hylden Lord, to stop him from using Janos' body to power The Device.

[DrawingLord]

Oh, my bad, I thought you were talking released wise. My bad.

[DarkEmblem]

really? i thought blood omen 2 was just what happens after blood omen and soul reaver as after and so on until defiance

[Joudas]

The events of Blood Omen 2 are, chronologically speaking, between BO1 and SR1. However, Defiance (which ended, chronologically, shortly after BO1 did) had to have happened in order for the events in BO2 to be possible. So BO2 is, theoretically, the re-written future after Defiance.

[BaronDavisPwns]

I thought BO2's storyline was the result of the paradox caused by Kain taking the Reaver out of Raziel when he was dying? In any case, BO2 was made by a different group of people than in the other games, so I believe people should pretend it wasn't ever made.

[dk2k1]

Basically, BO2 was able to happen because the Hylden Lord possessed Janos during Defiance.

[Hasfast]

Which was possible only because Raziel was not absorbed by the Soul Reaver and thus, he could restore the Heart of Darkness to Janos, who could not be possessed being dead. That is why Kain advised him not to bring Janos back to life... not knowing that he himself had the Heart of Darkness in his chest. D.R.

[wowarlord]

nope dude blood omen1 , soul reaver 1 , SR 2 , Blood omen 2 , Defiance i think it is that way , omen 2 was released in 2002 a year later defiance

[Joudas]

But BO2 was released out of sequence, story-wise. Playing them in that order will result in being pretty confused about what exactly is going on in BO2.

[Zardozthedestroyer]

Actually, I think it doesn´t. BO2 tells the story of the history changes that take place after SR2 (I think). Bear in mind that BO2 takes place before Kain has created any liutenaunts at all.

[Joudas]

This is incorrect - BO2 reflects the history changes after Defiance. In BO2, the Hylden Lord is free, and has Janos Audron's body, which he's taking to power The Machine. This doesn't occur until the end of Defiance. Although the story is butchered due to BO2 being written by (if I'm not mistaken) Brett Robins, Carol Wolf, and Steven Ross - not Amy Hennig (the writer of the other 4 games), it's generally accepted that they occur in this order.

[wowarlord]

i was talking about the release dates

[FagDrag]

Malek was the strongest of the Sarafan. He was their leader. He was the Kain to Raziel's... Raziel.

[purefuryteam]

i dont understand though who malek is i haven't played any of the blood omen games but i've beaten all of the soul reavers so who is a stronger sarafan malek or Raziel?

[Joudas]

Malek was the original Conflict guardian (if I recall correctly) in Blood Omen 1. In the intro movie to BO1, he's the armored man who comes to the rest of the circle's aid (albeit too late) when Vorador murders them, is subsequently killed by Vorador, and is cursed to animate his own armor and serve the circle for eternity.

[Joudas]

Further, Kain is tasked with killing him again in BO1, but he fails, and is forced to enlist Vorador's assistance to kill him once again. Though the outcome of this battle is never actually shown, we can assume that Vorador succeeds, since Kain discovers Malek's helmet when he returns to the chamber, and the pillar Malek was guardian of is cleansed.

[purefuryteam]

well basically to me i'd say rahab is the strongest seems how he can live in water and doesn't burn up all the others would burn to a crisp

[hanxopx]

he could easy burn up from the light and and couldnt change his environment.

[GypsyRed]

Wait... You're joking right? You must've been lying about having played SR1 or else you'd remember that the ONLY way to defeat Rahab... IS BY BURNING HIM TO A CRISP USING SUNLIGHT.

*facepalm*

[CraigWilloughby]

i'd guess turel since he made it to legacy of kain defiance and the rest died in soul reaver 1 :P

[kesasika]

is it becouse of a cheat code or a time paradox that you cant die in these parts?

[trambient]

The Blood Reaver

[6CTCEL]

yup cause when Raz kills his little brothers Melchiah and Zephon he notes that while holding the reaver his physical energy doesn't deteriorate so he doesn't have a limit on the amount of time he can stay in the material realm and the reaver heals his wounds almost instantaneously so he's "invincible"

[Joudas]

Turel, in theory. In SR1, you fight them in the same order Raziel fights them here - ending with Dumah; Turel doesn't fall to him until Defiance. If Turel was stronger then Dumah, theoretically we'd have killed Turel in SR1, and Dumah'd have been Hash'ak'gik instead.

[DurhamBulls789]

dude thats fucked up his own brothers betrayed him so Truel and Dumah were the strongest guys but who was strogner Turel or or Dumah?