You make a very convincing argument against circumcision. I was just curious as to your thoughts about corpral punishment. Have you made a blog on this topic.
@Kelrik93 - Thank you. =) I'm not sure if you're referring to spanking or the death penalty. I have not made a blog on either, though I will likely post on spanking before the death penalty. Stay tuned =).
@whatUneverknew Yes, corpral punishment is spanking. The death penalty would be capital punishment. ...and yes, I will stay tuned for your views on spanking.
Doctors already take away the freedoms of people. Those who act differently, they may be harmless but people fear them, lock them up, doctors sedate them and tell them there is something wrong with them like they have to be perfect clones. Individuality is slowly being destroyed. What you said is just another perfect example of it.
This is the most perfectly stated explanation of why circumcision is a human rights violation I have ever heard. Thank you for this video. This video should be on the front page of YouTube every day until routine infant circumcision is outlawed. It is shameful that barely 1300 people have watched this video.
@nippyhippy123 - Thank you! Please share! I am going to be re-alerting the AAP to my letter on vid (currently 'front page') but will replace it when that's over.
oh man, i wish i could speak all proper like you. im so against circumcision, but i just dont have that speaking all amazing ability that you have, you know that kind of thing where you can make a virtually uncomromising statement and youve just rocked anyone who doesnt agree with you. i mean god, i dont know how anyone could possibly not agree with this. theyd have to be not trying in life at all
New rules. Respond to me, or don't respond. Don't interrupt my discussion with someone else. And take your OFF TOPIC LACK OF RELEVANT POINT comments elsewhere. =)
@DumbDuck44 It's illegal for parents to make the "informed decision" to remove healthy, valuable tissue from ANY OTHER part of their child's body, even if they believe it will reduce their child's risk of acquiring behaviorally-transmitted diseases or infections. Imagine a parent removing a child's breast-buds in order to protect them from any risk of breast cancer. Having their kid's teeth removed to prevent cavities.
It's just not a parent's right. The foreskin belongs ONLY to the individual.
@joelface Circumcision is not only NOT illegal, the AAP and the CDC per their websites are currently considering reinstating their "recommended" status per endorsement of the chief of HIV prevention at the CDC Dr. Peter Kilmarx as well as WHO's official statement that "circumcision is the most powerful intervention we have at this point in time".
My parents also consented to have my tonsils and wisdom teeth removed when I was a minor for my health. Its a parents job to make these decisions.
@DumbDuck44 Ethical doctors won't remove healthy tonsils from a child upon parental request any longer. Wisdom teeth are not removed from infants, they are only removed from adolescents or older individuals if x-rays show that they are coming in the wrong way. They may remove them upon minor indication, but comparing insensitive teeth to one of the prime erogenous zones of the genitals shows your position on the topic well.
As well, these organizations regularly review all new studies & info...
@DumbDuck44 I wanted to illustrate a single point about what you said, and only had 500 characters to say it. Considering anyone reading would also have access to your previous comment, I think that's fair practice.
If the results of that study had been the other way around you would be the 1st person touting it as fact, but since it didn't you're beyond positive it has nothing to do with circumcision.
Even if the studies weren't flawed (they are), they still don't justify infant circumcision.
@joelface When you resort to lies to make your point, you know yourself you have already lost. There is no recognized medical organization's study that has shown an increase in STD transmission for circumcision, nor will there be as that goes against all logic and science.
Wearing a condom is much better protection than circumcision, however, condom use combined with circumcision greatly reduces risks for STD transmission, as condoms can and do break.
@DumbDuck44 re: "greatly reduces risks for STD". condoms are 98% effective (some say 99, but I'm going to give you as much as I can here.) so there's a 2% window within which circumcision can reduce risk. The studies (again, just GIVING it to you, even though I don't consider it valid) say 60% effective, which means, if true, circ can improve upon condom efficacy a whole 1.2%. HOW IS THIS "GREATLY"??????
@DumbDuck44 re: "greatly reduces risks for STD". condoms are 98% effective (some say 99, but I'm going to give you as much as I can here.) so there's a 2% window within which circumcision can reduce risk. The studies (again, just GIVING it to you, even though I don't consider it valid) say 60% effective, which means, if true, circ can improve upon condom efficacy a whole 1.2%. HOW IS THIS "GREATLY"??????
@whatUneverknew Condoms are AWESOME. Condoms are more effective than having unprotected sex with a circumcised penis (not to mention the little problem of having little versions of you running all over the place in 9 months).
But again, no one, absolutely NO ONE wears a condom 100% of the time during vaginal and oral sex. And when you do wear a condom, there is always a risk of it breaking. We went for around 10 mins before I even noticed.
Dumb Duck: I have carefully explained what right is violated by forced circumcision. If you disagree, please state what point exactly that I have made that you dissagree with, so that the conversation can have some structure. The best I can make out from what you have said is that [infants have no rights]. I have already stated that this is an error, because to deny autonomy to an infant, you also deny it to the man. Unless there is an emergency, you can't remove a body part from him.
The response was to some commenter talking about civil rights, and no minors have civil rights. Minors have human rights, but human rights violations are involved only when there is clear intent of harm.
The W.H.O, the same organization vehemently promoting male circumcision, led the charge against female "circumcision" as a human rights violation, as it typically exceeded a mere hooodectomy and had no medical logic behind it while inhibiting sexual function.
@whatUneverknew How come you don't respond? Don't be afraid, I don't bite =) In fact, if everyone would refrain from giving Mr. Duck oportunities to be distracted, we could see if his argument holds any water.
Im never letting them do that to my kids... Im cut and i really wish i wasnt... it seems fucked up that they could do that to me as a baby... the sad thing is most girls i talk to about this laugh and say it looks gross when its uncut when thats really what its supposed to look like... which to i reply, well i dont like your pussy lips, lets get those removed.
Well, some people think chest hair is gross, but we're not going to laser every babies' chest so it never grows! If these girls had the opportunity to utilize rather than just look, I think they'd have something else to say. Restore and show them ;-)
So depressing, I want my foreskin back. Why isn't this a much bigger deal, it's like people are afraid to talk about it and most people don't understand how horrible it is.
Exactly! I don't know if anyone could possibly put it better. As someone else said, you made more good point and expressed more wisdom and truth with fewer words in 8 minutes than many people express in 8 years. "Freedom" in this country is an absolute lie. They are never going to uphold equal protection and stop male circumcision on their own with how embedded it is in this society. This is a sick, rotten world. I have been the victim of it. Please keep fighting to make it better, we need more
Wow! You are incredibly well informed! I've never heard so many intelligent points about infant genital mutilation and human rights made in one place! Thank you. It makes me want to live in this world knowing there are people like you in it.
All forms of circumcisions are abominations to human life. They have a lotta disadvantages, but no advantages. What the hell do modern civilised people practice this brutal, useless, uncivilised practice. All forms of circumcisions should be criminalized and then made into a capital crime, worldwide.
Taylor 'discovered' this 'ridged band' at the tip of the foreskin by studying less than a dozen dead bodies! This was by no means a scientific study. On the basis of these few observations he postulates (ie guesses) that there is a band of tissue at the tip of the foreskin with an erotic purpose. He fails to recognise that these men might, like so many uncircumcised men, have been suffering from phimosis or that rigor mortis, which would have already set in, might itself be the explanation
genuine phimosis is caused by infancy retraction which was a recommendation doctors were giving to parents for hygiene. NO one should retract child's foreskin. Leaving it alone, the intact man will grow into a healthy man with ALL his parts, healthy and fine.
You have one of the most brilliant, compassionate, and thoughtful minds I've ever come across. Further, I can't help but say how amazed I am that I come across you on youtube and not a philosophy seminar!
Thank you! =) I appreciate your saying so. I would love to present at a philosophy seminar, but I don't get my ideas from a class, and so, have no letters beside my name.
you are inferring having a circumcised penis is bad.
the foreskin has no function also.
i also think that being circumcised is a total non issue to millions of men, who are perfectly happy being circumcised.
i myself have had it both ways and i would never leave my son to live with a foreskin, i would give him a circumcision when he is born so he never has to worry about it, my experience has shown me there is no difference between the two apart from being cleaner when u r cut.
I am NOT saying having a circ'ed penis is bad, I am saying that "BAD" or "GOOD" is an opinion, and EVERYONE is entitled to their own, because we are all EQUAL. You have the right to think your penis is better off cut. Your son, like you, has the right to whatever opinion he ends up having, whether you agree or not. and, cutting your son is forcing YOUR opinion on him, violating his rights, and treating him like an inferior human. And that is wrong. Watch part one & see if you can understand.
i understand clearly what you are saying. i just dont think what you are saying is that important, being circumcised is a total non issue to millions of circumcised men.
i dont think having a son circumcised is treating him like an inferior human, quite the opposite in my opinion.
i think anti-circ people treat circumcision like its a big deal, playing the human rights card really hard. when in fact they are really stringing a really long bow and it doesnt make any diffrence at all.
of course, if not important for you procirc... I guess we can slit your arm or abdomen while you cross the street and will NOT be a violation... right.
So, what you are saying is that human rights are not a big deal? That makes sense. It's horrible. But it makes sense that someone who would violate a child would think their rights don't matter.
Let me ask you: what of the men who feel violated by being circumcised against their will?
Can you say that their opinion about their own body doesn't matter? truly?
the overwhelming majority of men who were circumcised at birth are very happy they were.
why are millions of circumcised men perfectly happy being that way is it because they are or have they just not been manipulated by no-circ yet?
i wonder if men would be less likely to 'feel' violated if they weren't set upon by aggressive extremists whos very purpose is to browbeat them into thinking they've been hard done by. they do their best to make sure a balanced opinion is not reached.
And what of women who feel violated after being raped? Are they, too, just victims of the rabid anti-rapists who vehemently insist that they should?
You are simply not conceding that a man can have a valid opinion if it doesn't agree with yours. I think you must know in your heart that there's no way that out of some 1+ billion people you've got it figured for all of them, whether they know it or not. I mean really, how narrow is that?
It looks like you're not as happy as you make out.
I don't blame you.
Someone fucked with your body at a young age, so that you wouldn't get as much sexual pleasure from your body in later life. And all for religious reasons.
The religious aren't content to fuck with a child's mind, it has to be their body as well.
Islamic female circumcision is the worst - cutting out the clitoris; religion is what causes this disgrace to humanity.
Get rid of religion - and you'll lose mutilation of kids.
Likewise, how can you possibly know the difference? Unless you were one of the many like myself that got it as a teen or later, you don't know what you're talking about. There is no difference in sensation, and it serves no real function in a modern environment where you are protected from the elements by wearing pants (yes you can still masturbate), and it is more hygienic. Check the forums, there are plenty of us that have known both, and enjoy being circumcised, although not the act.
No one has the right to tell you what to do with your body, and now that you have decided and it's done, you don't need to justify it to anyone. I would never tell you that you are wrong for choosing it. Just like I would never tell a woman she was wrong for getting breast implants. THIS isn't the issue, the issue is imposing this change and risks upon someone else. You get that, right?
The change, yes, but the risks are statistically insignificant and at least no greater than the risks associated w/ having a foreskin. Its not brain surgery.
Perhaps there is a happy middleground, as the only thing I did not like and want to help others like myself avoid was the fact that I was already sexually active and thus the change isn't nearly as easy. Perhaps wait until 10 years old?
well, why 10? A ten year old has no concept of sex, possibly his foreskin isn't retractible yet, and just isn't mature. You have to be 18 to do a lot of things, because we recognize a need for maturity. There's nothing wrong with protecting a person's rights until they're old enough to understand them, and be (relatively) free from influence.
Yes there is. Go to the forums and TALK TO US. Talk to us people that have had the procedure after puberty. Its no longer the quick and easy 1, 2, 3 as it is w/ infants and kids. We are happy w/ the results, but not the stitches w/ concerns over erections and laying properly and extra recovery time and loss of sexual function during that healing process that we could have avoided had we not waited WAY WAY too long. Neways, I just felt it was important for someone to voice the other side.
It's hard to get my point across but here I'll try.
Someone complaining that they didn't get circumcised at birth is like complaining they weren't pierced at birth. Simply an immature adolescent urge to complain.
How could they possibly know that you wouldn't adore your own foreskin? They did the RIGHT thing in letting you decide for yourself and you're taking that consideration negatively shows just how immature you really are sir.
Sure... surgery is a pain. (and you're choosing to believe that it ISN'T a pain for infants just because they usually don't remember) But it isn't right for everyone to be forced into it and remove all choice so that a few don't have to deal with the natural consequences of their personal decision.
@whatUneverknew I am not saying that babies don't experience pain. I am saying that looking at the symptoms the babies don't cry any longer or louder than when they get shots, and they don't form a memory of the experience, with an extremely low complication rate and fast healing when performed in a sterile hospital environment by a practitioner that has done thousands.
Thus if you are leaving your child uncircumcised just out of fear of traumatizing the child, thats nonsense.
if you had it done when your an adult. then you know only part of the pain. babies heal faster this is a proven fact. but a baby is also more sensitive to pain. if it hurt for you it hurts way more for a baby. just because the baby might not complain later in life does not mean its ok. as for the emotional pain. you take his right to choose and his 14 amendment rights from him just because you think it might be better. if the child knew what you did he might grow up and hate you for it.
@ madbr3991 the crying I have witnessed was no longer in duration or volume than giving a shot. if there is no memory formed, and the healing is very rapid, there is no trauma.
parents make health decisions on behalf of their children, that is called parenting.
your child might resent you for action or inaction. would you resent your parents if they didn't cut your hair or give you braces?
Yes, you could get those things as an adult, but if doing it anyway, its better as a kid.
And there is nothing wrong with a parent reading the literature, and deciding that the pros and cons of circumcision are too even and thus decide to leave their child uncircumcised.
Your kid, your decision, it only bothers me when you see lies about a standard routine procedure with documented health benefits in addition to risks spread by anti-circumcision crusaders.
Just be honest and look to advice from trained medical professionals about the facts and opinions of those with 1st hand exp.
See, these are the lies. Every major recognized health organization acknowledges there are SOME medical benefits of circumcision.
Even the opponents, but they argue that the benefits are equal to or lesser than the risks.
Others like the World Health Organization and UNAIDS very actively support male circumcision mainly due to the ~60% reduction in STD transmission rates for unprotected sex, beyond the mere hygienic and aesthetic aspects.
the Africa circumcision aids study is a lie. they never completed the study. they never provided if the person had aids before the study. more then half of there data was "lost". and you cant apply a study from Africa a third world country to the US a first world country
it is people like you DumbDuck44 that has caused and kept this mutilation going.
circumcision is a cosmetic surgery and cannot be consented to by the adult.
@ madbr3991, see this is the problem, again with the lies. Why exactly do you think the United Nations would promote circumcision if not for medical reasons? and what do you mean "THE" study. you mean all four, the three independent studies in africa and in india?
You found us out. All these loving parents, doctors, and international health organizations just feel powerful circumcising people and get off on it.... *rolleyes*
this is all about choice and power . you feel powerful when you take free choice from someone else. and when you take choice from a baby you have also taken it from that adult.
you DumbDuck44 grew up with a foreskin. it did not give you any major health problems . then you and only you used your right to choose and had your foreskin cut off. if you take that right from a baby or child then you are a hypocrite and evil.
Children do not have constitutionally protected civil rights. Decisions are made on their behalf by their children until they reach the age of 18.
Human rights violations could apply, but only if there is clear intent of harm. This does not apply to the parents and medical community that supports circumcision. Medical risks are present for circumcision as well as being uncircumcised, thus it is up to the parent.
oops "decisions are made on their behalf by their PARENTS". In any case, if you are at all subjective you wouldn't be blind to obvious facts such as a minor's inability to vote.
@DumbDuck44 Well, actually you're wrong. Removing or even unnecessarily piercing the genitals of an infant girl is illegal, regardless of intent.
The medical risk of having intact genitals is LOWER than a woman's risk of intact breasts. Does that mean its a parents right to decide if she should have her breast buds removed? It would significantly reduce her breast cancer risk, and her parents may feel they were saving her life.
The foreskin's value should be determined ONLY by the individual.
There IS a difference in sensation. This has been proven. Google "penile sensitivity test". Although men will say it makes no difference, the study proves otherwise. When one is missing something, one adapts in order to feel normal. This adaptation may convince him that no harm was done because he ignores it. But it is still there.
USC TITLE 18 PART 1 CHAPTER 7 § 114. Maiming within maritime and territorial jurisdiction.
Whoever, within the special maritime and territorial jurisdiction of the United States, and with intent to TORTURE (as defined in section 2340), MAIM, or DISFIGURE, ...cuts off or disables a limb or ANY MEMBER of another person..
The penalty?
Shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than twenty years, or both.
Well said. I have been trying to get this point across for the past 50 years. It IS about Human Rights, not "benefits". The blindness due to "cultural tradition" is the main stumbling block. Congress needs to be severely reminded of their error 12 years ago when they outlawed only female circumcision. They should be so ashamed of themselves for that "oversight".
Perfection! No one can argue with this. You've mapped out the fundamental philosophy behind the US constitution and how it's being violated by circumcising babies. Can anyone promote circumcision and truly call themselves "American" when they're violating the basic principles this country was founded upon?
Bravo! Hearing this lovely young woman explain this so clearly, I have no doubt in my mind that circumcision of children (aka genital mutilation of children) is coming to an end.
An absolutely masterfully written essay that perfectly outlines the contradictions faced by the concept of freedom and the acceptance of infant circumcision in our culture.
Thank-you SO much for sharing.
"If it isn't good enough to justify removing choice from an adult, it isn't good enough to justify removing choice from an adult when they are a child."
Great Line! I hope people will listen to the undeniable logic behind your argument.
"it is a violation of human rights to cut a baby in the absence of an immediate life threat.
What are we saying then when we not only cut a baby, but we remove healthy, living tissue from his body in the absence of any immediate threat? We're saying that babies do not have the same human right to their bodies as the men they will become - that the human right only belongs to adults.
AWESOME! WOW you touched FANTASTIC points in here, I wonder if people who watch this still think they have the right to cut their tiny helpless healthy babies?
You make a very convincing argument against circumcision. I was just curious as to your thoughts about corpral punishment. Have you made a blog on this topic.
Kelrik93 6 months ago
@Kelrik93 - Thank you. =) I'm not sure if you're referring to spanking or the death penalty. I have not made a blog on either, though I will likely post on spanking before the death penalty. Stay tuned =).
whatUneverknew 6 months ago
@whatUneverknew Yes, corpral punishment is spanking. The death penalty would be capital punishment. ...and yes, I will stay tuned for your views on spanking.
Thanks for the reply. ::)
Kelrik93 6 months ago
Doctors already take away the freedoms of people. Those who act differently, they may be harmless but people fear them, lock them up, doctors sedate them and tell them there is something wrong with them like they have to be perfect clones. Individuality is slowly being destroyed. What you said is just another perfect example of it.
azmon 1 year ago
This is the most perfectly stated explanation of why circumcision is a human rights violation I have ever heard. Thank you for this video. This video should be on the front page of YouTube every day until routine infant circumcision is outlawed. It is shameful that barely 1300 people have watched this video.
nippyhippy123 1 year ago 4
@nippyhippy123 - Thank you! Please share! I am going to be re-alerting the AAP to my letter on vid (currently 'front page') but will replace it when that's over.
whatUneverknew 1 year ago
oh man, i wish i could speak all proper like you. im so against circumcision, but i just dont have that speaking all amazing ability that you have, you know that kind of thing where you can make a virtually uncomromising statement and youve just rocked anyone who doesnt agree with you. i mean god, i dont know how anyone could possibly not agree with this. theyd have to be not trying in life at all
kittenvirginbitches 1 year ago
New rules. Respond to me, or don't respond. Don't interrupt my discussion with someone else. And take your OFF TOPIC LACK OF RELEVANT POINT comments elsewhere. =)
whatUneverknew 1 year ago
@DumbDuck44 It's illegal for parents to make the "informed decision" to remove healthy, valuable tissue from ANY OTHER part of their child's body, even if they believe it will reduce their child's risk of acquiring behaviorally-transmitted diseases or infections. Imagine a parent removing a child's breast-buds in order to protect them from any risk of breast cancer. Having their kid's teeth removed to prevent cavities.
It's just not a parent's right. The foreskin belongs ONLY to the individual.
joelface 1 year ago
@joelface Circumcision is not only NOT illegal, the AAP and the CDC per their websites are currently considering reinstating their "recommended" status per endorsement of the chief of HIV prevention at the CDC Dr. Peter Kilmarx as well as WHO's official statement that "circumcision is the most powerful intervention we have at this point in time".
My parents also consented to have my tonsils and wisdom teeth removed when I was a minor for my health. Its a parents job to make these decisions.
DumbDuck44 1 year ago
@DumbDuck44 Ethical doctors won't remove healthy tonsils from a child upon parental request any longer. Wisdom teeth are not removed from infants, they are only removed from adolescents or older individuals if x-rays show that they are coming in the wrong way. They may remove them upon minor indication, but comparing insensitive teeth to one of the prime erogenous zones of the genitals shows your position on the topic well.
As well, these organizations regularly review all new studies & info...
joelface 1 year ago
@DumbDuck44 I wanted to illustrate a single point about what you said, and only had 500 characters to say it. Considering anyone reading would also have access to your previous comment, I think that's fair practice.
If the results of that study had been the other way around you would be the 1st person touting it as fact, but since it didn't you're beyond positive it has nothing to do with circumcision.
Even if the studies weren't flawed (they are), they still don't justify infant circumcision.
joelface 1 year ago
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joelface 1 year ago
@DumbDuck44 Dude, the study wasn't completed because as soon as the researchers saw it didn't PROVE the point they WANTED it to prove, they ended it.
You say that the study results don't matter because it wasn't completed, but then go on to say that it proves some other FAR more abstract point?
soooo absurd. I can see that you are so devoted to promoting circumcision that this type of logic makes sense to you.
In any case, if you think circumcision is great, cut yourself, but not a baby.
joelface 1 year ago
FTR - fucking hate this comment system. =)
whatUneverknew 1 year ago
@whatUneverknew Yeah, youtube is always making things worst, sometimes i think they do it on purpose lol.
Rickschannel1 1 year ago
@joelface When you resort to lies to make your point, you know yourself you have already lost. There is no recognized medical organization's study that has shown an increase in STD transmission for circumcision, nor will there be as that goes against all logic and science.
Wearing a condom is much better protection than circumcision, however, condom use combined with circumcision greatly reduces risks for STD transmission, as condoms can and do break.
DumbDuck44 1 year ago
@DumbDuck44 re: "greatly reduces risks for STD". condoms are 98% effective (some say 99, but I'm going to give you as much as I can here.) so there's a 2% window within which circumcision can reduce risk. The studies (again, just GIVING it to you, even though I don't consider it valid) say 60% effective, which means, if true, circ can improve upon condom efficacy a whole 1.2%. HOW IS THIS "GREATLY"??????
whatUneverknew 1 year ago
@DumbDuck44 re: "greatly reduces risks for STD". condoms are 98% effective (some say 99, but I'm going to give you as much as I can here.) so there's a 2% window within which circumcision can reduce risk. The studies (again, just GIVING it to you, even though I don't consider it valid) say 60% effective, which means, if true, circ can improve upon condom efficacy a whole 1.2%. HOW IS THIS "GREATLY"??????
whatUneverknew 1 year ago
@whatUneverknew Condoms are AWESOME. Condoms are more effective than having unprotected sex with a circumcised penis (not to mention the little problem of having little versions of you running all over the place in 9 months).
But again, no one, absolutely NO ONE wears a condom 100% of the time during vaginal and oral sex. And when you do wear a condom, there is always a risk of it breaking. We went for around 10 mins before I even noticed.
DumbDuck44 1 year ago
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joelface 1 year ago
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joelface 1 year ago
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joelface 1 year ago
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joelface 1 year ago
Dumb Duck: I have carefully explained what right is violated by forced circumcision. If you disagree, please state what point exactly that I have made that you dissagree with, so that the conversation can have some structure. The best I can make out from what you have said is that [infants have no rights]. I have already stated that this is an error, because to deny autonomy to an infant, you also deny it to the man. Unless there is an emergency, you can't remove a body part from him.
whatUneverknew 1 year ago
The response was to some commenter talking about civil rights, and no minors have civil rights. Minors have human rights, but human rights violations are involved only when there is clear intent of harm.
The W.H.O, the same organization vehemently promoting male circumcision, led the charge against female "circumcision" as a human rights violation, as it typically exceeded a mere hooodectomy and had no medical logic behind it while inhibiting sexual function.
DumbDuck44 1 year ago
@whatUneverknew How come you don't respond? Don't be afraid, I don't bite =) In fact, if everyone would refrain from giving Mr. Duck oportunities to be distracted, we could see if his argument holds any water.
whatUneverknew 1 year ago
this video is incredible. this video tells it how it is. circumcision is WRONG for either gender and it must be stopped. 5 star to this video
madbr3991 1 year ago
Im never letting them do that to my kids... Im cut and i really wish i wasnt... it seems fucked up that they could do that to me as a baby... the sad thing is most girls i talk to about this laugh and say it looks gross when its uncut when thats really what its supposed to look like... which to i reply, well i dont like your pussy lips, lets get those removed.
Syeno 2 years ago 2
Well, some people think chest hair is gross, but we're not going to laser every babies' chest so it never grows! If these girls had the opportunity to utilize rather than just look, I think they'd have something else to say. Restore and show them ;-)
whatUneverknew 2 years ago
So depressing, I want my foreskin back. Why isn't this a much bigger deal, it's like people are afraid to talk about it and most people don't understand how horrible it is.
JUDDPOWNSYOU 2 years ago 4
Exactly! I don't know if anyone could possibly put it better. As someone else said, you made more good point and expressed more wisdom and truth with fewer words in 8 minutes than many people express in 8 years. "Freedom" in this country is an absolute lie. They are never going to uphold equal protection and stop male circumcision on their own with how embedded it is in this society. This is a sick, rotten world. I have been the victim of it. Please keep fighting to make it better, we need more
YouKnowMeImJosh 2 years ago 4
Wow! You are incredibly well informed! I've never heard so many intelligent points about infant genital mutilation and human rights made in one place! Thank you. It makes me want to live in this world knowing there are people like you in it.
Gerzul 2 years ago 4
All forms of circumcisions are abominations to human life. They have a lotta disadvantages, but no advantages. What the hell do modern civilised people practice this brutal, useless, uncivilised practice. All forms of circumcisions should be criminalized and then made into a capital crime, worldwide.
His body is his fucking decision!
dafranx 2 years ago 5
Taylor 'discovered' this 'ridged band' at the tip of the foreskin by studying less than a dozen dead bodies! This was by no means a scientific study. On the basis of these few observations he postulates (ie guesses) that there is a band of tissue at the tip of the foreskin with an erotic purpose. He fails to recognise that these men might, like so many uncircumcised men, have been suffering from phimosis or that rigor mortis, which would have already set in, might itself be the explanation
procircaustralia 2 years ago
genuine phimosis is caused by infancy retraction which was a recommendation doctors were giving to parents for hygiene. NO one should retract child's foreskin. Leaving it alone, the intact man will grow into a healthy man with ALL his parts, healthy and fine.
enithhernandez 2 years ago
if more beautiful girls spoke out this barbarian sadism against males would dissapear! thank you very much lovely woman!
IbnNero 2 years ago 6
You have one of the most brilliant, compassionate, and thoughtful minds I've ever come across. Further, I can't help but say how amazed I am that I come across you on youtube and not a philosophy seminar!
Brownyman 2 years ago 6
Thank you! =) I appreciate your saying so. I would love to present at a philosophy seminar, but I don't get my ideas from a class, and so, have no letters beside my name.
whatUneverknew 2 years ago
you are inferring having a circumcised penis is bad.
the foreskin has no function also.
i also think that being circumcised is a total non issue to millions of men, who are perfectly happy being circumcised.
i myself have had it both ways and i would never leave my son to live with a foreskin, i would give him a circumcision when he is born so he never has to worry about it, my experience has shown me there is no difference between the two apart from being cleaner when u r cut.
procircaustralia 2 years ago
I am NOT saying having a circ'ed penis is bad, I am saying that "BAD" or "GOOD" is an opinion, and EVERYONE is entitled to their own, because we are all EQUAL. You have the right to think your penis is better off cut. Your son, like you, has the right to whatever opinion he ends up having, whether you agree or not. and, cutting your son is forcing YOUR opinion on him, violating his rights, and treating him like an inferior human. And that is wrong. Watch part one & see if you can understand.
whatUneverknew 2 years ago
haha.
i understand clearly what you are saying. i just dont think what you are saying is that important, being circumcised is a total non issue to millions of circumcised men.
i dont think having a son circumcised is treating him like an inferior human, quite the opposite in my opinion.
i think anti-circ people treat circumcision like its a big deal, playing the human rights card really hard. when in fact they are really stringing a really long bow and it doesnt make any diffrence at all.
procircaustralia 2 years ago
of course, if not important for you procirc... I guess we can slit your arm or abdomen while you cross the street and will NOT be a violation... right.
enithhernandez 2 years ago 5
So, what you are saying is that human rights are not a big deal? That makes sense. It's horrible. But it makes sense that someone who would violate a child would think their rights don't matter.
Let me ask you: what of the men who feel violated by being circumcised against their will?
Can you say that their opinion about their own body doesn't matter? truly?
whatUneverknew 2 years ago
the overwhelming majority of men who were circumcised at birth are very happy they were.
why are millions of circumcised men perfectly happy being that way is it because they are or have they just not been manipulated by no-circ yet?
i wonder if men would be less likely to 'feel' violated if they weren't set upon by aggressive extremists whos very purpose is to browbeat them into thinking they've been hard done by. they do their best to make sure a balanced opinion is not reached.
procircaustralia 2 years ago
And what of women who feel violated after being raped? Are they, too, just victims of the rabid anti-rapists who vehemently insist that they should?
You are simply not conceding that a man can have a valid opinion if it doesn't agree with yours. I think you must know in your heart that there's no way that out of some 1+ billion people you've got it figured for all of them, whether they know it or not. I mean really, how narrow is that?
whatUneverknew 2 years ago
you pro-mutilators have the gall to call us the extremists when you're the ones cutting off entire erogenous zones to "prevent infection"! haha!
intactivists have no agenda other then upholding human rights! if that's not obvious enough then you sir are a moron!
drealgrin 2 years ago
Why are you called inactivists? It's not even a real word.
needles1987 2 years ago
intactivists*
because we believe babies should have their genitals intact. activists because we believe it's a serious issue that must be addressed.
drealgrin 2 years ago
Oh, intact activists. I get it now.
needles1987 2 years ago 2
It looks like you're not as happy as you make out.
I don't blame you.
Someone fucked with your body at a young age, so that you wouldn't get as much sexual pleasure from your body in later life. And all for religious reasons.
The religious aren't content to fuck with a child's mind, it has to be their body as well.
Islamic female circumcision is the worst - cutting out the clitoris; religion is what causes this disgrace to humanity.
Get rid of religion - and you'll lose mutilation of kids.
jazzx251 2 years ago
Comment removed
metalmouthmikey 2 years ago
"I love being circumcised"
It sounds like you have it done every week!
How can you possibly know the pleasure you're missing out on?
You were circumcised - I'm so sorry.
jazzx251 2 years ago
Maybe he remembers being uncut.
needles1987 2 years ago
Likewise, how can you possibly know the difference? Unless you were one of the many like myself that got it as a teen or later, you don't know what you're talking about. There is no difference in sensation, and it serves no real function in a modern environment where you are protected from the elements by wearing pants (yes you can still masturbate), and it is more hygienic. Check the forums, there are plenty of us that have known both, and enjoy being circumcised, although not the act.
DumbDuck44 2 years ago
No one has the right to tell you what to do with your body, and now that you have decided and it's done, you don't need to justify it to anyone. I would never tell you that you are wrong for choosing it. Just like I would never tell a woman she was wrong for getting breast implants. THIS isn't the issue, the issue is imposing this change and risks upon someone else. You get that, right?
whatUneverknew 2 years ago
The change, yes, but the risks are statistically insignificant and at least no greater than the risks associated w/ having a foreskin. Its not brain surgery.
Perhaps there is a happy middleground, as the only thing I did not like and want to help others like myself avoid was the fact that I was already sexually active and thus the change isn't nearly as easy. Perhaps wait until 10 years old?
DumbDuck44 2 years ago
well, why 10? A ten year old has no concept of sex, possibly his foreskin isn't retractible yet, and just isn't mature. You have to be 18 to do a lot of things, because we recognize a need for maturity. There's nothing wrong with protecting a person's rights until they're old enough to understand them, and be (relatively) free from influence.
whatUneverknew 2 years ago
Yes there is. Go to the forums and TALK TO US. Talk to us people that have had the procedure after puberty. Its no longer the quick and easy 1, 2, 3 as it is w/ infants and kids. We are happy w/ the results, but not the stitches w/ concerns over erections and laying properly and extra recovery time and loss of sexual function during that healing process that we could have avoided had we not waited WAY WAY too long. Neways, I just felt it was important for someone to voice the other side.
DumbDuck44 2 years ago
It's hard to get my point across but here I'll try.
Someone complaining that they didn't get circumcised at birth is like complaining they weren't pierced at birth. Simply an immature adolescent urge to complain.
How could they possibly know that you wouldn't adore your own foreskin? They did the RIGHT thing in letting you decide for yourself and you're taking that consideration negatively shows just how immature you really are sir.
drealgrin 2 years ago 3
Sure... surgery is a pain. (and you're choosing to believe that it ISN'T a pain for infants just because they usually don't remember) But it isn't right for everyone to be forced into it and remove all choice so that a few don't have to deal with the natural consequences of their personal decision.
whatUneverknew 2 years ago
@whatUneverknew I am not saying that babies don't experience pain. I am saying that looking at the symptoms the babies don't cry any longer or louder than when they get shots, and they don't form a memory of the experience, with an extremely low complication rate and fast healing when performed in a sterile hospital environment by a practitioner that has done thousands.
Thus if you are leaving your child uncircumcised just out of fear of traumatizing the child, thats nonsense.
DumbDuck44 1 year ago
if you had it done when your an adult. then you know only part of the pain. babies heal faster this is a proven fact. but a baby is also more sensitive to pain. if it hurt for you it hurts way more for a baby. just because the baby might not complain later in life does not mean its ok. as for the emotional pain. you take his right to choose and his 14 amendment rights from him just because you think it might be better. if the child knew what you did he might grow up and hate you for it.
madbr3991 1 year ago
@ madbr3991 the crying I have witnessed was no longer in duration or volume than giving a shot. if there is no memory formed, and the healing is very rapid, there is no trauma.
parents make health decisions on behalf of their children, that is called parenting.
your child might resent you for action or inaction. would you resent your parents if they didn't cut your hair or give you braces?
Yes, you could get those things as an adult, but if doing it anyway, its better as a kid.
DumbDuck44 1 year ago
And there is nothing wrong with a parent reading the literature, and deciding that the pros and cons of circumcision are too even and thus decide to leave their child uncircumcised.
Your kid, your decision, it only bothers me when you see lies about a standard routine procedure with documented health benefits in addition to risks spread by anti-circumcision crusaders.
Just be honest and look to advice from trained medical professionals about the facts and opinions of those with 1st hand exp.
DumbDuck44 1 year ago
and every so called health benefit of circumcision has been dis-proven within 20 years. and you can put anything in writing.
what about the kids choice. what about his right to choose or his 14th amendment rights
madbr3991 1 year ago
See, these are the lies. Every major recognized health organization acknowledges there are SOME medical benefits of circumcision.
Even the opponents, but they argue that the benefits are equal to or lesser than the risks.
Others like the World Health Organization and UNAIDS very actively support male circumcision mainly due to the ~60% reduction in STD transmission rates for unprotected sex, beyond the mere hygienic and aesthetic aspects.
DumbDuck44 1 year ago
the Africa circumcision aids study is a lie. they never completed the study. they never provided if the person had aids before the study. more then half of there data was "lost". and you cant apply a study from Africa a third world country to the US a first world country
it is people like you DumbDuck44 that has caused and kept this mutilation going.
circumcision is a cosmetic surgery and cannot be consented to by the adult.
madbr3991 1 year ago
@ madbr3991, see this is the problem, again with the lies. Why exactly do you think the United Nations would promote circumcision if not for medical reasons? and what do you mean "THE" study. you mean all four, the three independent studies in africa and in india?
You found us out. All these loving parents, doctors, and international health organizations just feel powerful circumcising people and get off on it.... *rolleyes*
DumbDuck44 1 year ago
this is all about choice and power . you feel powerful when you take free choice from someone else. and when you take choice from a baby you have also taken it from that adult.
you DumbDuck44 grew up with a foreskin. it did not give you any major health problems . then you and only you used your right to choose and had your foreskin cut off. if you take that right from a baby or child then you are a hypocrite and evil.
madbr3991 1 year ago
Children do not have constitutionally protected civil rights. Decisions are made on their behalf by their children until they reach the age of 18.
Human rights violations could apply, but only if there is clear intent of harm. This does not apply to the parents and medical community that supports circumcision. Medical risks are present for circumcision as well as being uncircumcised, thus it is up to the parent.
DumbDuck44 1 year ago
oops "decisions are made on their behalf by their PARENTS". In any case, if you are at all subjective you wouldn't be blind to obvious facts such as a minor's inability to vote.
DumbDuck44 1 year ago
@DumbDuck44 Well, actually you're wrong. Removing or even unnecessarily piercing the genitals of an infant girl is illegal, regardless of intent.
The medical risk of having intact genitals is LOWER than a woman's risk of intact breasts. Does that mean its a parents right to decide if she should have her breast buds removed? It would significantly reduce her breast cancer risk, and her parents may feel they were saving her life.
The foreskin's value should be determined ONLY by the individual.
joelface 1 year ago
There IS a difference in sensation. This has been proven. Google "penile sensitivity test". Although men will say it makes no difference, the study proves otherwise. When one is missing something, one adapts in order to feel normal. This adaptation may convince him that no harm was done because he ignores it. But it is still there.
lochinvar00465 1 year ago
The most pleasurable part of the penis is NOT the glans (head). It is the frenulum, which is mostly or completely removed.
ScottJanssen 2 years ago 10
Circumcision already IS illegal.
USC TITLE 18 PART 1 CHAPTER 7 § 114. Maiming within maritime and territorial jurisdiction.
Whoever, within the special maritime and territorial jurisdiction of the United States, and with intent to TORTURE (as defined in section 2340), MAIM, or DISFIGURE, ...cuts off or disables a limb or ANY MEMBER of another person..
The penalty?
Shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than twenty years, or both.
Circumcisers beware!
lochinvar00465 2 years ago 11
Well said. I have been trying to get this point across for the past 50 years. It IS about Human Rights, not "benefits". The blindness due to "cultural tradition" is the main stumbling block. Congress needs to be severely reminded of their error 12 years ago when they outlawed only female circumcision. They should be so ashamed of themselves for that "oversight".
lochinvar00465 2 years ago 13
Perfection! No one can argue with this. You've mapped out the fundamental philosophy behind the US constitution and how it's being violated by circumcising babies. Can anyone promote circumcision and truly call themselves "American" when they're violating the basic principles this country was founded upon?
aquarius1986 2 years ago 19
In a word, brilliant!
Stretchalot1 2 years ago 19
Too bad their is not more girls and women like you who think this procedure is just wrong.
yoda002 2 years ago 9
How can we make legislators sit and watch this? I'd be willing to violate their autonomy to do so, since it's an emergency.
Foreskin feels REALLY good. HIS body HIS decision.
TLCTugger 2 years ago 13
A brilliant essay! You have set a very high standard for others to follow.
I hope you will continue to apply your considerable intelligence to helping sort out the issue of genital mutilation.
RoseFink 2 years ago 15
Great points. We need more hot girls like you propogating the anti-circ movement.
Sambucca 2 years ago 12
That's surely the best first vlog I've EVER seen! Instantly subscribed!
freedom0f5peech 2 years ago 14
Bravo! Hearing this lovely young woman explain this so clearly, I have no doubt in my mind that circumcision of children (aka genital mutilation of children) is coming to an end.
Bonobo3D 2 years ago 14
An absolutely masterfully written essay that perfectly outlines the contradictions faced by the concept of freedom and the acceptance of infant circumcision in our culture.
Thank-you SO much for sharing.
"If it isn't good enough to justify removing choice from an adult, it isn't good enough to justify removing choice from an adult when they are a child."
Great Line! I hope people will listen to the undeniable logic behind your argument.
joelface 2 years ago 16
"it is a violation of human rights to cut a baby in the absence of an immediate life threat.
What are we saying then when we not only cut a baby, but we remove healthy, living tissue from his body in the absence of any immediate threat? We're saying that babies do not have the same human right to their bodies as the men they will become - that the human right only belongs to adults.
This is our error.
Simply being human grants you this right."
Exactly. Everyone deserves such basic rights.
joelface 2 years ago 14
AWESOME! WOW you touched FANTASTIC points in here, I wonder if people who watch this still think they have the right to cut their tiny helpless healthy babies?
I added this in my favorites! :-)
enithhernandez 2 years ago 14