Le cheval est completement bloquer dans ses mouvement, ça se voit qu'il a mal au dos! cette technique, prolongée est mauvaise, un bon rollkur dur pas plus de deux minutes et le cheval n'est pas bloquer dans ses mouvements, ni la tête contre la poitrine! c'est rond et bas, pour muscler, pas bloquer! depuis quand on muscle un cheval quand on le bloque?????????? franchement, j'espère que la FEi va qualifier cette technique de maltraitance point. heureusement qu'ils ont déjà réagit en partie
I thought spurs were supposed to be used to back up leg aids? It looks to me as though Anky's using them AS an aid.. How can the horse respond to leg aids anyway, if it's head is pinned to it's chest and it has to drag itself around on the forehand??
i want to rip her OFF that magnificent animal. i hate this. so much. even more now that i lost my dressage mare. professoinal or not, riding in this manner is not right.
Der Fuchs in der ersten Szene gefällt mir gut, er trabt schön locker und schlägt nicht die ganze zeit mit dem Schweiß, wie der Braune. Man sieht richtig, dass er nicht gerne arbeiten möchte, weil es ihm schmerzen bereitet. Ganz häufig versucht er über rennen, wegzukommen von den hilfen, wie kann man das nur SO missverstehen und keiner sagt was. der reiter sitzt total im Stuhlsitz und ist nur am Ziehen! Das geht überhaupt nicht!!!
wenn man das sieht wird éinen schlecht wie kann man als zuschauer da zuschauen?? ich verstehe es nicht...warum schaut jeder tatenlos zu wie sie ein pferd quält? echt schlimm und sie macht es auch noch in der öffentlichkeit und und trübt kein wässerchen! wahnsinn das arme pferd keine wunder warum ihre pferd so schnell kaputt geritten sind..vorallem was bezwegt sie damit wie kann nur einen pferd sowas antun...es versteht keiner auser die rollkurqueen! dasn müsste man mal mit ihr machen!
Am Anfang sieht man gut, dass ein Pferd sich hinten nicht setzen kann, wenn es so aufgerollt wird.... schaufelt nur nach hinten raus, drückt den Rücken weg und Taktfehler an Taktfehler.
Ein tolles Pferd, das spätestens in 5 Jahren so Arthrose im Genick haben wird, dass es nicht mehr reitbar ist und zum Abdecker geht.... tief einstellen okay, aber es gibt einen Unterschied zwischen tief und tief...
This is really some of the uglyest riding ive ever seen. Shes not only breaking the horse down physically, but mentally aswell. The horse can not see where its going, and have to "trust" the rider. Theyre not evolving the horse, they are breaking it down, so they an show it off in competitions! The horse is suffering a lot more than most people are able to see.
well hes moving "amazing" so this is a fantastic horse, which is obeying the riders commands. He doesnt have a choice. The horses are amazing creatures, I cant belive they let their owners abuse them so hard!!
How can you know that? Horses do not have the gift to tell us how they feel...
I wont start a argue, but I must say that research tell us that this method causes inner bleedings and fraction on a whole bunch of nerves, that leads to eyes, nose, and the horses face. AND it completely ruins the earspit-gland. Because the preasure from the bit and behind the ears(when using kandhar) is much more higher than we think.
Rememeber this: Im not saying that its your intesion to hurt him. The horses wich is trained in this position, addapt to the pain. We think the horse is happy, but after researching on dead dressage horses that apparently was "happy", scientists found deep wounds in their muscles on the neck. 3-13 cm long deep cracks.
Seen the whole movie? They are going to release another movie later, after he summer. It will contain some documentation on why they are against bits, and bridles. I think....:)
This could come out the wrong way, so let me start off by saying this is an actual question I'm interested in knowing the answer too. True dressage, the classical method of riding, is about natural movement of the horse and would therefore never collect the horse more than it would naturally offer, the amount of collection that Nevzorov rides with. So is this statement referring to competition dressage?
Hi, Daisy. What you see here is called modern dressage and what you are talking about is classical dressage.Modern dressage is terrible on the horses but as long as the winning is more important to a lot of people and the judges pick this type to win, it will continue.Sad commentary, but true.
AN trains with a bit and spurs. He's a fraud. I have some photos on my website of him riding with a bit and the cordeo at the same time. He trains them to respond to the cordeo using a bit. That's why he is so secretive. He's a fraud.
Rollkur becomes more an more widely used as the method giving to the rider protection from horse's revolt.
When overbent horse can not breath, it is in awful pain in neck, back, chest and mouth. All that is quite evident if the person has a bit of logical thinking....
Nevzorov is teaching horses to true collection, which has nothing in common with the forced, "false", collection used in sport by means of the bridle
I'm a western rider ...Quarter Horse. Cutting is my sport. Someone please educate me about hyperflexation. The words using "hyper" ussually indicates somethig's not right.I collect my horse to keep her in frame and to perform a slide stop. So, can a horse be over-flexed?
Horseriding is not getting reflectorical responses it is giving the horse the opportunity to plan its movements. Reflectorical movement is very injuring to the body of the horse planned movements are round and are not injuring.
and thats your opinion. "some say shes the best rider in the world?" hmm no if im not braindead I saw her winning the WEG final in aachen back in -06, so yes honey she IS the worlds best rider, like it or not.
Was auf manchen Abreiteplätzen zu sehen ist...die Frau reitet auch überhaupt nicht mit Bein. Ständig liegt das Bein noch vor dem Gurt. Aber Rollkur und Taktfehler sieht man deutlich!
Oha des pferd kann gar nich richtig atmen des fällt auch ständig aus dem Rytmus weil des nich gescheit sieht und atmen kann des is ja quelerei was die macht und vor allem wie kann man so was noch zulassen ??
Is it me or does watching this make you go all tense?
The horse looked very tense and on his toes and maybe overreacting to the aids which i don't see very often on horses that aren't ridden hyperflexed..
Does anyone else see the horse locking up behind? He does it quite a few times, also throwing a hind leg out to the side on occasion. Ive noticed it on a few videos of different hyperflexed horses.
I think those who says this is evil they don't think about.. She is riding totaly okay warm up.. We do thing's like that to when we are riding we just don't see it and feel it.. Anky is a GREAT rider and she wont hurt her horse.. Those who are evil to there horse can't get so far as she did..
Daamhot - i agree, animal abuse is when you hit someone a animal over the head with a brick or something. This isnt abuse. Its a great training method that works for so many riders and horses.
Jaccko14-In my experience with Cutting Horses over the last 10 years, I hve seen horses' hocks injected w/steroids to get more outta them & feet nerve blocked;of course pain medication. I consider using a horse until it's joints break down to be abuse.I've seen some unscrupulous techniques used to keep a horse in competition and help make a bigger name for the trainer.Where there's too big of purses to be won, there's corruption... & abuse."Hitting" is only one form of abuse.
Training like this is abuse. The horse is unbalanced, on the forehand, body is disconnected, BTV - avoiding contact (nuchal ligament damage at back of skull) - should I go on? She is spurring, whipping, driving, & pulling for no reason.
Just because Bonfire was ridden with the Rollkur method and is well over 20, does not mean he did not develop the damage most horses get under that kind of horrid "training". Do you believe everything you see on TV or read in an article? Bonfire was a nice horse, but he had his flaws.
ankys bonfire was trained by rollkur, Ive heard that he is like over twenty years old know am I right? he manage to to very well in athens winning the gold medal when he was 17 years old. If rollkur was so bad to the horses, should bonfire have won the olympic gold at a age of 17? thats the reason I belive in rollkur. Its spelled FACT.
well you come with fals aclaims all the time, and now you're acting like teacher again! I can say ecaxtly what I want. No worries that I will stop. About the vet thing, the sorce is from horsemagazine. They put up an article about it so that people like you wopuld shut up sometimes, or at least mind your one buissnes.
A well built horse w/the best care money can buy can take a lot of abuse. Horses aren't fragile creatures that die @ the drop of a hat, a lot get injured or die because of how we keep and train them. BTW, 17 isn't old. The sr. horse @ the SRS is 26 and doesn't look a day over 10; he went on their last world tour and gave performances most younger horses couldn't ever hope to give (he was classically trained, if you couldn't guess).
i like Anky's riding but after i saw those videos and those poor horses i'll deffend any horse i'll see that it's rider is hurting him in that kind of way.. :(
I had my mare in training for a year with a reputable classical trainer and she was hardly training level. Now she is with a modern trainer and is solid second after 6months.If I walk around the corner and see a guy hittin' his horse I wouldn't know that a minute earlier it tried to bite him. You're taking one part of modern dressage and juding the theory on it.
If a guy was hittin' his horse because he just got bitten then I would be thinking 1. that the guy doesn't know his horse enough to know when his horse is about to bite and 2. good on the horse for biting an obvious idiot of a man who has taught his horse to do just that.
and haven't u seen anky riding krack c stallion show vid where she is competing him in the competition position and loses his balance in extended trot pushing off with his 2 hind legs together.
bcos they r sad hypercrits! think they know it all! probably can't admit they r totally jealous what these top riders achieved. everyone has 2 start somewhere down the line to get where they r NOW!
wow.. nice grammar and really good english. we can be intelligent and use real words. And I have no reason to be jealous. I understand that I'll never be grand prix level dressage, but my horse and I work well together without pain or unhappiness.
this horse is not in pain! he is relaxed, supple, content, listening to his rider! rider using soft hands and simple not confusing aids. Cruel is beating a horse up, fastened enclose small areas, no farrier treatment(long curled feet) under fed showing bone and ribs that's cruel!!!!!!!
simple, not confusing aids? Did you not notice the horse's head pulled so far down, while the rider tries to send him forward? Did you not see the horse's indecision at the tims 1:10, 1:36, and 2:02? Where he's off balance and tries to correct himself and instead gets pushed forward more?
There are indeed different levels of cruel, the ones you mentioned being the worst. That doesn't however, prevent this from being it's own type of cruelty.
cont'd: They are teaching these horses learned helplessness. After being forced to be off balance so long, they stop trying to balance themselves. They stop resisting. That doesn't mean it's good for them.
Rolkur/LDR should be banned. Thank you for highlighting this abomination.
If this is modern dressage then I want nothing to do with it. Everything is wrong about this picture. The horse, quite apart from the rolkur, isn't working correctly, looks unhappy and tense and the rider looks like they're using their whole body weight on the horse's mouth.
It's about time that this practice was banned and the results of it marked down in competition.
The video clip I just posted in my last comment is Philippe Karl demonstrating a CORRECT, TRUE example of collection-piaffe, to levade, to piaffe. If you don't know who Philippe Karl is, then study dressage until you understand what the real principles are, instead of blindly hero-worshipping the people who are winning in today's FEI arenas. They are not winning because they are training correctly, they are winning because of fashionable trends, and because of politics.
Please look at the video of The happy athlete. There you can see a stallion moving in harmony and enjoying movement. That is what dressage should bee! The horse should ENJOY what the rider is doing TOGETHER with him. He should not be forced into exaggerated movements which have nothing to do with natural balance. Can you tell this from the video's above?
Warming up fysiology is the same for humans aas for horses. WARMING UP is to make the body relaxed and happy to go on for a test not to make it HYPERACTIVE and TENSED and STRESSED. It is a pity that a lot of riders (and judges) are getting used to all the pictures of tensed and stressed horses thinking that this is normal behaviour. It is NOT.
I'm not a horse, and I don't have the anatomy a horse has. My neck is a little bit more shorter. For example I (human being) can't walk on my nails, a horse can. So you can't compare mammals (horse and human being) to each other.
Look at the video's without having in your mind who is riding there and please just look at the body language of the horse, it's anatomy and what is happening to its neck, its mouth and its back. Then try to do some sports with tension in your neck and back and then tell us what YOU are feeling.
A stallion is a horse with the same psychology and anatomy as all other horses. I myself have ridden stallions and know from experience myself. If a horse gets HOT this is not a compliment for the rider, because the rider should give the horse TRUST to make it CALM and not make it TENSE. TENSION has always to do with NOT FEELING OK.
I haven't you haven't the slightest idea what kind of horse she rides here. It's a hot STALLION, who should be ridden this way and the person who knows best is still Anky. Not Ulrike who was there making videos of the training systems of the dutch riders. By the way this is just warming up, later on the horses aren't that overbended like on this video. Why all these jealousy against one of the best riders in the world, who happens to be dutch.
A stallion is a horse with the same psychology and anatomy as all other horses. I myself have ridden stallions and know from experience myself. If a horse gets HOT this is not a compliment for the rider, because the rider should give the horse TRUST to make it CALM and not make it TENSE. TENSION has always to do with NOT FEELING OK
It doesn't matter if it's "just warming up" She's still hurting them. It doesn't make it better. If you ride a horse with it's neck bent like that for more than ten minutes, it's not a good thing. Stretching should be done on relaxed muscles, not muscles under strain, like being ridden.
I don't think that you understand what I mean by being hot: hot in the way of a lot of energy and power. I can see that this horse does something that doesn't reflect in the way of "the perfect wallk" or something, but I think we can't judge if it's his temperament or a way of training. Anky knows what she's doing, she is number1 of the world! a couple of years! doesn't say that enough? Horses that aren't treated well won't compeed at that level!
just cause she wins doesn't mean she treats them well. It means she uses whatever means nescessary to MAKE them perform well. A horse cannot see in front of itself with it's head cranked around like that. The horse cannot collect itself if it's balance is being pulled to the forehand.
a horse that is ill-treated or something like that, will never work for you like the horses of anky and you will never become the number one of the world.the riders in all these movies don't do anything wrong, they bend their horses and you know: a horse CAN bend his neck so far, and it won't break! And don't you think that if these horses were having pain or anything like that, they would refuse to do all those things like piaffe etc. ?! I know for sure that they would if you ill-treat them!
.... that't not what I mean :S (and where do you see it fall over?....) All I'm trying to say is that when a horse has pain, it will let you know that, because then he isn't able to do things natural
Ok.. so because you CAN bend your chin all the way down to your chest and hold it there while balancing yourself, you should? I think not. Just cause a horse is able to bend it's neck that far, doesn't mean that it's built to hold it that way for extended periods of time. Do some research, and you'll find that it does actually do them damage to ride this way.
Contd: And you can force a horse to do things. Just cause they're bigger than you doesn't mean they realize that. When you put pressure on their mouths, you can make them do lots of things they'd probably rather not do.
And by the way, Anky doesn't do this in the ring, which is why she wins. Yeah, she's technically a good rider, but she's ruining these horses.. and yeah, the riders ARE doing things wrong.
Contd2: Muscles stretched while under stress become damaged. The tendons they are connected to become strained and unable to return to their normal position. Stretching is supposed to be done in a relaxed state, not while under pressure, and not for extended periods of time. You obviously know less about horses than you think you do.
Further more, hero worship because she "wins" makes you look like a fool. Just because anky wins, doesn't make her automatically right. You would be angry if people used performance enhancing drugs on horses, because it hurts them, but this is ok? I think not.
Why are you only saying Anky? and Damage? you don't have any prove. and you know why? because it DOESN'T damage the horses. I know: you comment on this one and say: it does :S but it really doesn't
a horse will react from its nature. So if it has pain in his leg it will try not standing on that leg. or if his back hurts, he will not let you sit on him. what I'm trying to say is that this technique of riding doesn't hurt him.
this technique is trying to make him relaxe (flexible) and to try taking some pressure of his back away. So at first: it is not the intension to do the horse any king of pain and at second: if it would hurt, the horse would refuse to do it
know about anky: you always say anky, but there are plenty of other topriders who use this technique. their horses become better because of this technique and they get more muscles: they are stronger and more flexible than the horses of riders who always ride their horses in the same position
may I ask you how you ride your horse(s) when they are stiff and if they are leaning on hour hands? This technique is based on riding the horse with different positions of his head, and that's why these horses are so flexible.
Yes, my horse does get stiff. I walk her in circles. I bend her, at a walk. I also have stretches for her that I do from the ground. To get off the rider's hands, the horse needs to collect from the back, not from the neck.
This technique does not make more useful muscles. It causes the horse to lift it's back from the neck, and from the forequarters, which puts it's weight and balance on the forehand. In dressage, the balance is supposed to be on the hind legs and there is supposed to be collection from the back. To properly lift the back and collect, the horse needs to willingly engage it's hindquarters, which it can't do when it's pulled down like this. It doesn't work when used like this.
Do a google search with the term "Sustainable Dressage" and go to the first site. My proof is on that site. And some others that I've found by searching google. I've seen it confirmed in enough places to feel that it's true, not make believe. Look through the diagrams. Actually read the articles. You'll find that in the long term, it does do the horses damage.
Horses are called into pressure animals. When something pushes them, their first reaction is to push back. Yes, they react to pain, but they also react to force which is what she's using. If you use enough force, you can break a horse's will to push back.
Horses are damaged when their nuchal ligament is stressed and the point of insertion at the skull is changed. They show this by throwing their heads, having a tender poll, and things like that. Their reaction to the pain is often just mistaken for misbehavior so they are punished and eventually learn to just deal with the pain.
Like i said in my other comment, the site about sustainable dressage has plenty of scientific proof for me. It totally proves the fact that this does do the horses damage.
The last thing I want to say is that I understand that this movie doesn't look nice for some people but if you experience this technique and if you have profesional training with it, then you will understand it better
Just to make clear: I don't want to attack you and your thoughts but I'm just trying to say that it isn't horrible and it looks wors than it is. It's too bad that we all can't talk about it around a table, because then we would understand eachother so much more. and you would probably never agree with me and I not with you, but I guess that's ok
It is a pity that you cannoty see what the body language of the horse is telling. The fact that a horse is "hot"has everything to do with the fact that he is NOT treated well. A horse that has confidence in his rider is not "hot" in the way we see in these horses.
I'm just speachless! You all don't know what you're talking about! The horse is hot, his environment is different and he has so much activity in his behind legs, that's why he has some mis staps in his walking!
And why are all those videos of holland riders? Holland is doing so good, and a horse won't do something at that level if it isn't treated well!
begging your pardon, some of us DO know what we're talking about. "A horse won't do something at that level if it isn't treated well?" Hmmm...Exactly what do you do with horses, that you believe this?
Do you ride at this level yourself?
His environment is different? This is an FEI international horse. He shows A LOT.
sorry that I reacted so furious. And just to let you know: I treat my horse absolutely good! but you know as well as I that a horse that wants to work for you, will perform better than a horse that doesn't. And just so you know I don't ride on that level. :P
and about FEI Inter.... horse: have you ever seen a stalion show? no mather how old or how experienced the horses are, they will always be a little bit spooky
Sorry, I haven't seen that. Of course there may well be horses out there with very reactive tails, but normally this kind of reaction indicates that the horse does not like the signals being given to him: in dressage with the spurs and/or bit, in racing with the whip.
Le cheval est completement bloquer dans ses mouvement, ça se voit qu'il a mal au dos! cette technique, prolongée est mauvaise, un bon rollkur dur pas plus de deux minutes et le cheval n'est pas bloquer dans ses mouvements, ni la tête contre la poitrine! c'est rond et bas, pour muscler, pas bloquer! depuis quand on muscle un cheval quand on le bloque?????????? franchement, j'espère que la FEi va qualifier cette technique de maltraitance point. heureusement qu'ils ont déjà réagit en partie
alexiadu1213 1 year ago
I thought spurs were supposed to be used to back up leg aids? It looks to me as though Anky's using them AS an aid.. How can the horse respond to leg aids anyway, if it's head is pinned to it's chest and it has to drag itself around on the forehand??
iStillRunDeep 1 year ago 2
i want to rip her OFF that magnificent animal. i hate this. so much. even more now that i lost my dressage mare. professoinal or not, riding in this manner is not right.
ranix721 2 years ago 3
Der Fuchs in der ersten Szene gefällt mir gut, er trabt schön locker und schlägt nicht die ganze zeit mit dem Schweiß, wie der Braune. Man sieht richtig, dass er nicht gerne arbeiten möchte, weil es ihm schmerzen bereitet. Ganz häufig versucht er über rennen, wegzukommen von den hilfen, wie kann man das nur SO missverstehen und keiner sagt was. der reiter sitzt total im Stuhlsitz und ist nur am Ziehen! Das geht überhaupt nicht!!!
Cartinka1704 2 years ago
1:50: Kann mir jemand sagen, was das darstellen sollte? Für dieses Getrippel kriegt die Punkte??
Guckt euch das Pferd an, was da durchs Bild reitet. DAS nennt man reiten, nicht das, was Madame da abzieht.
XblindelveX 2 years ago
wenn man das sieht wird éinen schlecht wie kann man als zuschauer da zuschauen?? ich verstehe es nicht...warum schaut jeder tatenlos zu wie sie ein pferd quält? echt schlimm und sie macht es auch noch in der öffentlichkeit und und trübt kein wässerchen! wahnsinn das arme pferd keine wunder warum ihre pferd so schnell kaputt geritten sind..vorallem was bezwegt sie damit wie kann nur einen pferd sowas antun...es versteht keiner auser die rollkurqueen! dasn müsste man mal mit ihr machen!
MiSSTOTALLY 2 years ago
Comment removed
mywildinstinct 2 years ago
man ey wie kann man nur so krank sein?!
TheSTONY009 2 years ago
Am Anfang sieht man gut, dass ein Pferd sich hinten nicht setzen kann, wenn es so aufgerollt wird.... schaufelt nur nach hinten raus, drückt den Rücken weg und Taktfehler an Taktfehler.
Ein tolles Pferd, das spätestens in 5 Jahren so Arthrose im Genick haben wird, dass es nicht mehr reitbar ist und zum Abdecker geht.... tief einstellen okay, aber es gibt einen Unterschied zwischen tief und tief...
moonlightgirl89 2 years ago 2
I still want to hit her in the face
shikoku1234 3 years ago 10
u can see plain as day how locked up the horse is he cant move properly
Bolgie136 3 years ago 9
poor horse. i'd hate to be that horse. i mean who wants someone pulling on your head while you're trying to run?
hanster2289 3 years ago 3
This is really some of the uglyest riding ive ever seen. Shes not only breaking the horse down physically, but mentally aswell. The horse can not see where its going, and have to "trust" the rider. Theyre not evolving the horse, they are breaking it down, so they an show it off in competitions! The horse is suffering a lot more than most people are able to see.
rutta89 3 years ago
he is moving amazing.. extravagant with the front and his hocks are still active
xbethlovesux 3 years ago
well hes moving "amazing" so this is a fantastic horse, which is obeying the riders commands. He doesnt have a choice. The horses are amazing creatures, I cant belive they let their owners abuse them so hard!!
rutta89 3 years ago
i use this method! my horse is not abused
xbethlovesux 3 years ago
How can you know that? Horses do not have the gift to tell us how they feel...
I wont start a argue, but I must say that research tell us that this method causes inner bleedings and fraction on a whole bunch of nerves, that leads to eyes, nose, and the horses face. AND it completely ruins the earspit-gland. Because the preasure from the bit and behind the ears(when using kandhar) is much more higher than we think.
rutta89 3 years ago
fair enough but hes not abused cos he's really happy and will happily go into a low deep positon quite happily
xbethlovesux 3 years ago
Rememeber this: Im not saying that its your intesion to hurt him. The horses wich is trained in this position, addapt to the pain. We think the horse is happy, but after researching on dead dressage horses that apparently was "happy", scientists found deep wounds in their muscles on the neck. 3-13 cm long deep cracks.
rutta89 3 years ago
really? Thats bad is that just from rollkur?
xbethlovesux 3 years ago
Not only rollkur but dressage itself, though rollkur makes it even worse. Seen the Nevzorov-movie?
rutta89 3 years ago
ooo right :( thats bad
and nooo will i find it on youtube?
xbethlovesux 3 years ago
ooo that! yes i have :) i think that is amazing!
xbethlovesux 3 years ago
Seen the whole movie? They are going to release another movie later, after he summer. It will contain some documentation on why they are against bits, and bridles. I think....:)
rutta89 3 years ago
yeahh it is soo clever but i really am for the bit beacuse in dressage there is no other physical means of contact without one..
xbethlovesux 3 years ago
Are you saying that you dont think its possible to reach high-lever dressage without a bit?
rutta89 3 years ago
no not at all cos u can teach collection on the lunge and long reining but at shows it is compulsary to wear a double bridle
xbethlovesux 3 years ago
I see. Well, you should try to get the Nevzorov-dvd...:)
rutta89 3 years ago
This could come out the wrong way, so let me start off by saying this is an actual question I'm interested in knowing the answer too. True dressage, the classical method of riding, is about natural movement of the horse and would therefore never collect the horse more than it would naturally offer, the amount of collection that Nevzorov rides with. So is this statement referring to competition dressage?
daisyfields 3 years ago 2
Anyone going to answer or just mark my comment down because I bring up a valid point?
daisyfields 3 years ago
Hi, Daisy. What you see here is called modern dressage and what you are talking about is classical dressage.Modern dressage is terrible on the horses but as long as the winning is more important to a lot of people and the judges pick this type to win, it will continue.Sad commentary, but true.
lovesbriardi 3 years ago
I'm well aware of that, but it still does not answer my question about the NHE claims made here.
daisyfields 3 years ago
AN trains with a bit and spurs. He's a fraud. I have some photos on my website of him riding with a bit and the cordeo at the same time. He trains them to respond to the cordeo using a bit. That's why he is so secretive. He's a fraud.
Karyn64 3 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Poor girl:)... Looks like you will never learn to read:).....
fleur4198 2 years ago
No it is not.
Rollkur becomes more an more widely used as the method giving to the rider protection from horse's revolt.
When overbent horse can not breath, it is in awful pain in neck, back, chest and mouth. All that is quite evident if the person has a bit of logical thinking....
Nevzorov is teaching horses to true collection, which has nothing in common with the forced, "false", collection used in sport by means of the bridle
They can not be compared equally .
fleur4198 2 years ago
Schrecklich !!!!
Der kann dochb gar nicht richtig laufen !!!!
Das ist keine Dressur, das ist MORD !!!!!!:`(
Palominostute 3 years ago
I'm a western rider ...Quarter Horse. Cutting is my sport. Someone please educate me about hyperflexation. The words using "hyper" ussually indicates somethig's not right.I collect my horse to keep her in frame and to perform a slide stop. So, can a horse be over-flexed?
min54teresa 3 years ago
take a peek at alexander nevzorovs homesite, I think youll find some of his articles interesting.
rutta89 3 years ago
gracia mille.
min54teresa 3 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
she bearly touches him with her legs and when she does she get an response, thats how it should be! fantastic.
Minga90ame 4 years ago
Horseriding is not getting reflectorical responses it is giving the horse the opportunity to plan its movements. Reflectorical movement is very injuring to the body of the horse planned movements are round and are not injuring.
ulrikethiel 4 years ago
If Anky could ride like she does in competition all the time, her horses would be much happier... and safer.
loveleehrsrdr 4 years ago
oh and you have proof of that, dont you?
Minga90ame 4 years ago
And some say she is the best rider in the world. Clearly they do not know how a horse is supposed to look because it isn't like this.
Karyn64 4 years ago
and thats your opinion. "some say shes the best rider in the world?" hmm no if im not braindead I saw her winning the WEG final in aachen back in -06, so yes honey she IS the worlds best rider, like it or not.
Minga90ame 4 years ago
I think you wanted to say: the best trainer. Horses might learn a lot even with training that will hurt their body and health in the long term.
Caramonn 3 years ago
Was auf manchen Abreiteplätzen zu sehen ist...die Frau reitet auch überhaupt nicht mit Bein. Ständig liegt das Bein noch vor dem Gurt. Aber Rollkur und Taktfehler sieht man deutlich!
traderworld 4 years ago
Where is the regularity of gaits and straightness???
pferdlady 4 years ago 2
there is no regularity beacuse she is making him off her leg....that is a key factor in LDR
xbethlovesux 4 years ago
Oha des pferd kann gar nich richtig atmen des fällt auch ständig aus dem Rytmus weil des nich gescheit sieht und atmen kann des is ja quelerei was die macht und vor allem wie kann man so was noch zulassen ??
Cari147 4 years ago
MY LORD THAT HORSE IS UNHAPPY!
BlueWaterLillysGirl 4 years ago
MY LORD THIS HORSE IS HAPPY!
DanceOfDevotion 4 years ago
The horse looks really tense, it looks horrible. I don't like it.
nikkiandtiexx 4 years ago
HORRIBLE!
stallholtaas 4 years ago
Is it me or does watching this make you go all tense?
The horse looked very tense and on his toes and maybe overreacting to the aids which i don't see very often on horses that aren't ridden hyperflexed..
DarkBay24 4 years ago
Does anyone else see the horse locking up behind? He does it quite a few times, also throwing a hind leg out to the side on occasion. Ive noticed it on a few videos of different hyperflexed horses.
irishcobfan 4 years ago
I think those who says this is evil they don't think about.. She is riding totaly okay warm up.. We do thing's like that to when we are riding we just don't see it and feel it.. Anky is a GREAT rider and she wont hurt her horse.. Those who are evil to there horse can't get so far as she did..
Daamhot 4 years ago
Daamhot - i agree, animal abuse is when you hit someone a animal over the head with a brick or something. This isnt abuse. Its a great training method that works for so many riders and horses.
Jaccko14 4 years ago
Jaccko14-In my experience with Cutting Horses over the last 10 years, I hve seen horses' hocks injected w/steroids to get more outta them & feet nerve blocked;of course pain medication. I consider using a horse until it's joints break down to be abuse.I've seen some unscrupulous techniques used to keep a horse in competition and help make a bigger name for the trainer.Where there's too big of purses to be won, there's corruption... & abuse."Hitting" is only one form of abuse.
min54teresa 3 years ago
Training like this is abuse. The horse is unbalanced, on the forehand, body is disconnected, BTV - avoiding contact (nuchal ligament damage at back of skull) - should I go on? She is spurring, whipping, driving, & pulling for no reason.
canterpir0uette 4 years ago
Just because Bonfire was ridden with the Rollkur method and is well over 20, does not mean he did not develop the damage most horses get under that kind of horrid "training". Do you believe everything you see on TV or read in an article? Bonfire was a nice horse, but he had his flaws.
canterpir0uette 4 years ago
ankys bonfire was trained by rollkur, Ive heard that he is like over twenty years old know am I right? he manage to to very well in athens winning the gold medal when he was 17 years old. If rollkur was so bad to the horses, should bonfire have won the olympic gold at a age of 17? thats the reason I belive in rollkur. Its spelled FACT.
Minga90ame 4 years ago
You can't justify that at all, have you ever had a bit in your mouth? Have you ever been forced into this position?
bassguitarfreak4 4 years ago 2
well you come with fals aclaims all the time, and now you're acting like teacher again! I can say ecaxtly what I want. No worries that I will stop. About the vet thing, the sorce is from horsemagazine. They put up an article about it so that people like you wopuld shut up sometimes, or at least mind your one buissnes.
Minga90ame 4 years ago
A well built horse w/the best care money can buy can take a lot of abuse. Horses aren't fragile creatures that die @ the drop of a hat, a lot get injured or die because of how we keep and train them. BTW, 17 isn't old. The sr. horse @ the SRS is 26 and doesn't look a day over 10; he went on their last world tour and gave performances most younger horses couldn't ever hope to give (he was classically trained, if you couldn't guess).
USNhcc 4 years ago 2
i like Anky's riding but after i saw those videos and those poor horses i'll deffend any horse i'll see that it's rider is hurting him in that kind of way.. :(
poor horses :(
LulitaInPita 4 years ago
I had my mare in training for a year with a reputable classical trainer and she was hardly training level. Now she is with a modern trainer and is solid second after 6months.If I walk around the corner and see a guy hittin' his horse I wouldn't know that a minute earlier it tried to bite him. You're taking one part of modern dressage and juding the theory on it.
varemaerke 4 years ago
If a guy was hittin' his horse because he just got bitten then I would be thinking 1. that the guy doesn't know his horse enough to know when his horse is about to bite and 2. good on the horse for biting an obvious idiot of a man who has taught his horse to do just that.
nztasha 4 years ago
and haven't u seen anky riding krack c stallion show vid where she is competing him in the competition position and loses his balance in extended trot pushing off with his 2 hind legs together.
fallding123 4 years ago
bcos they r sad hypercrits! think they know it all! probably can't admit they r totally jealous what these top riders achieved. everyone has 2 start somewhere down the line to get where they r NOW!
fallding123 4 years ago
wow.. nice grammar and really good english. we can be intelligent and use real words. And I have no reason to be jealous. I understand that I'll never be grand prix level dressage, but my horse and I work well together without pain or unhappiness.
lightordark24 4 years ago 2
Funny how the people who are anti rollkur use no science, but simply the arguments og it doesn't hurt them and you're just jealous.
daisyfields 4 years ago
this horse is not in pain! he is relaxed, supple, content, listening to his rider! rider using soft hands and simple not confusing aids. Cruel is beating a horse up, fastened enclose small areas, no farrier treatment(long curled feet) under fed showing bone and ribs that's cruel!!!!!!!
fallding123 4 years ago
you're absolutely right but why doesn't anybody understands that here :S
talental 4 years ago
simple, not confusing aids? Did you not notice the horse's head pulled so far down, while the rider tries to send him forward? Did you not see the horse's indecision at the tims 1:10, 1:36, and 2:02? Where he's off balance and tries to correct himself and instead gets pushed forward more?
There are indeed different levels of cruel, the ones you mentioned being the worst. That doesn't however, prevent this from being it's own type of cruelty.
lightordark24 4 years ago
cont'd: They are teaching these horses learned helplessness. After being forced to be off balance so long, they stop trying to balance themselves. They stop resisting. That doesn't mean it's good for them.
lightordark24 4 years ago
I hate Anky and her wrong smile. The poor horses!
Blame to her!
Sammy2109 5 years ago
These just keep getting more disgusting as they go. I cannot express the loathing I feel towards people who support this mess.
Would someone do dressage a favor and BAN ROLLKUR?
shnookems 5 years ago
Rolkur/LDR should be banned. Thank you for highlighting this abomination.
If this is modern dressage then I want nothing to do with it. Everything is wrong about this picture. The horse, quite apart from the rolkur, isn't working correctly, looks unhappy and tense and the rider looks like they're using their whole body weight on the horse's mouth.
It's about time that this practice was banned and the results of it marked down in competition.
Tashakat 5 years ago
Rollkur is not a bad thing. But when used like this?haha..absolutley disgusting.
There are simply no words to describe the amount of anger and hate I feel towards Anky.
She sucks.
Sorry.
bniemcziek 5 years ago
Rolkur anyone? Ugh, this is horrible to watch.
ImpossibleDreams 5 years ago
please check out my comment on 3A. Thanks guys
nickinac1 5 years ago
Ooo, fashion. History's most dedicated influence for ruining horses. Stupid humans. I hate us.
keylime1602 5 years ago
The video clip I just posted in my last comment is Philippe Karl demonstrating a CORRECT, TRUE example of collection-piaffe, to levade, to piaffe. If you don't know who Philippe Karl is, then study dressage until you understand what the real principles are, instead of blindly hero-worshipping the people who are winning in today's FEI arenas. They are not winning because they are training correctly, they are winning because of fashionable trends, and because of politics.
pablicasso25 5 years ago
Please look at the video of The happy athlete. There you can see a stallion moving in harmony and enjoying movement. That is what dressage should bee! The horse should ENJOY what the rider is doing TOGETHER with him. He should not be forced into exaggerated movements which have nothing to do with natural balance. Can you tell this from the video's above?
ulrikethiel 5 years ago
Warming up fysiology is the same for humans aas for horses. WARMING UP is to make the body relaxed and happy to go on for a test not to make it HYPERACTIVE and TENSED and STRESSED. It is a pity that a lot of riders (and judges) are getting used to all the pictures of tensed and stressed horses thinking that this is normal behaviour. It is NOT.
ulrikethiel 5 years ago
I'm not a horse, and I don't have the anatomy a horse has. My neck is a little bit more shorter. For example I (human being) can't walk on my nails, a horse can. So you can't compare mammals (horse and human being) to each other.
sullie97 5 years ago
Look at the video's without having in your mind who is riding there and please just look at the body language of the horse, it's anatomy and what is happening to its neck, its mouth and its back. Then try to do some sports with tension in your neck and back and then tell us what YOU are feeling.
ulrikethiel 5 years ago
A stallion is a horse with the same psychology and anatomy as all other horses. I myself have ridden stallions and know from experience myself. If a horse gets HOT this is not a compliment for the rider, because the rider should give the horse TRUST to make it CALM and not make it TENSE. TENSION has always to do with NOT FEELING OK.
ulrikethiel 5 years ago
I haven't you haven't the slightest idea what kind of horse she rides here. It's a hot STALLION, who should be ridden this way and the person who knows best is still Anky. Not Ulrike who was there making videos of the training systems of the dutch riders. By the way this is just warming up, later on the horses aren't that overbended like on this video. Why all these jealousy against one of the best riders in the world, who happens to be dutch.
sullie97 5 years ago
A stallion is a horse with the same psychology and anatomy as all other horses. I myself have ridden stallions and know from experience myself. If a horse gets HOT this is not a compliment for the rider, because the rider should give the horse TRUST to make it CALM and not make it TENSE. TENSION has always to do with NOT FEELING OK
ulrikethiel 5 years ago
It doesn't matter if it's "just warming up" She's still hurting them. It doesn't make it better. If you ride a horse with it's neck bent like that for more than ten minutes, it's not a good thing. Stretching should be done on relaxed muscles, not muscles under strain, like being ridden.
lightordark24 4 years ago
I am talking about the difference between activity, tension stress and hurting back- muscles.
ulrikethiel 5 years ago
I don't think that you understand what I mean by being hot: hot in the way of a lot of energy and power. I can see that this horse does something that doesn't reflect in the way of "the perfect wallk" or something, but I think we can't judge if it's his temperament or a way of training. Anky knows what she's doing, she is number1 of the world! a couple of years! doesn't say that enough? Horses that aren't treated well won't compeed at that level!
philipsmanluxe 5 years ago
just cause she wins doesn't mean she treats them well. It means she uses whatever means nescessary to MAKE them perform well. A horse cannot see in front of itself with it's head cranked around like that. The horse cannot collect itself if it's balance is being pulled to the forehand.
lightordark24 4 years ago
a horse that is ill-treated or something like that, will never work for you like the horses of anky and you will never become the number one of the world.the riders in all these movies don't do anything wrong, they bend their horses and you know: a horse CAN bend his neck so far, and it won't break! And don't you think that if these horses were having pain or anything like that, they would refuse to do all those things like piaffe etc. ?! I know for sure that they would if you ill-treat them!
talental 4 years ago
yeah, so lets ride the horse so far behind the bit that it almost falls over.... wow your smart.....
pcw225 4 years ago
.... that't not what I mean :S (and where do you see it fall over?....) All I'm trying to say is that when a horse has pain, it will let you know that, because then he isn't able to do things natural
talental 4 years ago
Ok.. so because you CAN bend your chin all the way down to your chest and hold it there while balancing yourself, you should? I think not. Just cause a horse is able to bend it's neck that far, doesn't mean that it's built to hold it that way for extended periods of time. Do some research, and you'll find that it does actually do them damage to ride this way.
lightordark24 4 years ago
Contd: And you can force a horse to do things. Just cause they're bigger than you doesn't mean they realize that. When you put pressure on their mouths, you can make them do lots of things they'd probably rather not do.
And by the way, Anky doesn't do this in the ring, which is why she wins. Yeah, she's technically a good rider, but she's ruining these horses.. and yeah, the riders ARE doing things wrong.
lightordark24 4 years ago
Contd2: Muscles stretched while under stress become damaged. The tendons they are connected to become strained and unable to return to their normal position. Stretching is supposed to be done in a relaxed state, not while under pressure, and not for extended periods of time. You obviously know less about horses than you think you do.
lightordark24 4 years ago
Further more, hero worship because she "wins" makes you look like a fool. Just because anky wins, doesn't make her automatically right. You would be angry if people used performance enhancing drugs on horses, because it hurts them, but this is ok? I think not.
lightordark24 4 years ago
Why are you only saying Anky? and Damage? you don't have any prove. and you know why? because it DOESN'T damage the horses. I know: you comment on this one and say: it does :S but it really doesn't
talental 4 years ago
a horse will react from its nature. So if it has pain in his leg it will try not standing on that leg. or if his back hurts, he will not let you sit on him. what I'm trying to say is that this technique of riding doesn't hurt him.
talental 4 years ago
this technique is trying to make him relaxe (flexible) and to try taking some pressure of his back away. So at first: it is not the intension to do the horse any king of pain and at second: if it would hurt, the horse would refuse to do it
talental 4 years ago
know about anky: you always say anky, but there are plenty of other topriders who use this technique. their horses become better because of this technique and they get more muscles: they are stronger and more flexible than the horses of riders who always ride their horses in the same position
talental 4 years ago
may I ask you how you ride your horse(s) when they are stiff and if they are leaning on hour hands? This technique is based on riding the horse with different positions of his head, and that's why these horses are so flexible.
talental 4 years ago
Yes, my horse does get stiff. I walk her in circles. I bend her, at a walk. I also have stretches for her that I do from the ground. To get off the rider's hands, the horse needs to collect from the back, not from the neck.
lightordark24 4 years ago
This technique does not make more useful muscles. It causes the horse to lift it's back from the neck, and from the forequarters, which puts it's weight and balance on the forehand. In dressage, the balance is supposed to be on the hind legs and there is supposed to be collection from the back. To properly lift the back and collect, the horse needs to willingly engage it's hindquarters, which it can't do when it's pulled down like this. It doesn't work when used like this.
lightordark24 4 years ago
Do a google search with the term "Sustainable Dressage" and go to the first site. My proof is on that site. And some others that I've found by searching google. I've seen it confirmed in enough places to feel that it's true, not make believe. Look through the diagrams. Actually read the articles. You'll find that in the long term, it does do the horses damage.
lightordark24 4 years ago
Horses are called into pressure animals. When something pushes them, their first reaction is to push back. Yes, they react to pain, but they also react to force which is what she's using. If you use enough force, you can break a horse's will to push back.
lightordark24 4 years ago
Horses are damaged when their nuchal ligament is stressed and the point of insertion at the skull is changed. They show this by throwing their heads, having a tender poll, and things like that. Their reaction to the pain is often just mistaken for misbehavior so they are punished and eventually learn to just deal with the pain.
daisyfields 4 years ago
Like i said in my other comment, the site about sustainable dressage has plenty of scientific proof for me. It totally proves the fact that this does do the horses damage.
lightordark24 4 years ago
The last thing I want to say is that I understand that this movie doesn't look nice for some people but if you experience this technique and if you have profesional training with it, then you will understand it better
talental 4 years ago
Just to make clear: I don't want to attack you and your thoughts but I'm just trying to say that it isn't horrible and it looks wors than it is. It's too bad that we all can't talk about it around a table, because then we would understand eachother so much more. and you would probably never agree with me and I not with you, but I guess that's ok
talental 4 years ago
It is a pity that you cannoty see what the body language of the horse is telling. The fact that a horse is "hot"has everything to do with the fact that he is NOT treated well. A horse that has confidence in his rider is not "hot" in the way we see in these horses.
ulrikethiel 5 years ago
I'm just speachless! You all don't know what you're talking about! The horse is hot, his environment is different and he has so much activity in his behind legs, that's why he has some mis staps in his walking!
And why are all those videos of holland riders? Holland is doing so good, and a horse won't do something at that level if it isn't treated well!
philipsmanluxe 5 years ago
begging your pardon, some of us DO know what we're talking about. "A horse won't do something at that level if it isn't treated well?" Hmmm...Exactly what do you do with horses, that you believe this?
Do you ride at this level yourself?
His environment is different? This is an FEI international horse. He shows A LOT.
pablicasso25 5 years ago
sorry that I reacted so furious. And just to let you know: I treat my horse absolutely good! but you know as well as I that a horse that wants to work for you, will perform better than a horse that doesn't. And just so you know I don't ride on that level. :P
and about FEI Inter.... horse: have you ever seen a stalion show? no mather how old or how experienced the horses are, they will always be a little bit spooky
talental 4 years ago
The tail says it all
fionat2001 5 years ago
no it doesn't : have you ever seen Blue Horse Matine? Happy atlete: absolutely, tail is overreacting: yeah
talental 4 years ago
have you ever seen Blue Horse Matine?
Sorry, I haven't seen that. Of course there may well be horses out there with very reactive tails, but normally this kind of reaction indicates that the horse does not like the signals being given to him: in dressage with the spurs and/or bit, in racing with the whip.
fionat2001 4 years ago
this is no way to train a horse.
pablicasso25 5 years ago