Has this guy actual read history, Rockfeller interfered with all the small competitors. He borrowed to corner chemicals in refining oil for kerosene, bought out oil barrels so the competitors were short of barrels, he colluded with the rail companies to over price to competitors all putting competitors in a corner to put them out of business. There was no free market. Some people are so fucking negligent with the facts it's not funny. The Mise institutes pormotes free markets n fucks up facts
An oxymoron, and an impossibility, Fascism is born of Socialism (National Socialism), individualism is a tenet of Classical Liberalism, born of the age of enlightenment these concepts are, without question, antithetical to one another.
@Frumibandersnatch it was used in the sense of an analogy, are you a literalist or something?
The essense of it is this: for each person to exercise that degree of personal autonomy would be impossible. When a few individuals exercise it, it will result in adverse consequences for others, either directly, indirectly, or both. You cannot have (hypothetical) a society where every single citizen exercises the same degree of volition all of the time and equally.
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY Re: You cannot have (hypothetical) a society where every single citizen exercises the same degree of volition ...
Hypothetical? That was America from 1791 to about 1890 pal. Until Americans started going to doctoral programs in Europe and were exposed to Marx, Engles, Sombart, La Salle, Plenge all of which ended Europian Bolshevism & Naziism and the end of life for millions & millions of innocent people. The road you wish us to embark upon again... no thanks.
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY The argument we're having goes back to Locke and Hobbes. Have you seen the Three Minute Philosophy on Locke and Hobbes? Watch it, this Ausie guy is really funny!!.....
another example: a neo- Nazi opens a book shop selling anti-semite, anti-backs literature, Mein Kampf etc. He claims this is his libertarian entitlement and if the state prohibit him (by enacting legislation) this is in itself would amount to a contravention of his liberty & is therefore wrong.
Liberty cuts both ways: liberty to one can result in detriment to another. Jews and blacks have an entitlement to be free from this kind of literature?
Re: Jews and blacks have an entitlement to be free from this kind of literature?
Firstly, Naziim and Libertarianism are again, antithetical to one another, so no Libertarian would be selling such literature, so I’m supposing this is a hypothetical. Yes all speech is protected. A Jewish lawyer from the ACLU, who seems he might know or care more about freedom than you do, defended the actual Nazis right to march in IL, in 1977
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY the problem with the label "anti semitic" is that it has been demonstrated to be used to describe someone or something that the Jews hate, rather than libel or defamation. If the truth offends you, then that's your goddamned problem, isn't it? So if you consider it to be anti semitic for me to say that the Jews run Hollywood, then you can go jam your dick in a meat grinder. Are we on the same page?
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY Re: it was used in the sense of an analogy, are you a literalist or something ?
No, I use metaphors and analogies, but I can’t fit “libertarianism is fascist individualism" into any kind of metaphorical context. As far as literalism goes, I believe we should say what we mean and mean what we say.
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY I guess you could draw a parallel between Hume’s empiricism with Hayeks understanding of why central planning always fails (and it does) and that is; no single person or any assembly of people, short of all participants in the economy, can know each and every transaction within an economy, this is a kind of knowledge that can be “known” by the masses. The only way that price points can be discovered and resources can be properly allocated.
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY don't mean to keep bothering you, so this is the last one. If you do respond, I'd be delighted to keep our conversation going. -frum
If you hang around economics comment threads, you’ve probably seen this, it’s a Rap Off between Lord Manard Keynes and Friedrich A. Hayek. It’s put out by Econ-Stories with the aid of an economics professor at George Mason. It's well produced and I think it’s worth a look, if you’re really interested in economics.
That can ONLY be achieved by a system of wage slavery. One class represses another, NOT all people can be well off to the same, or similar, extent. Thus libertarian is a system of inegaitarianism and mass inequality.
If it really championed liberty the result would be a classless society
2) In the Soviet Union, resources were so misappropriated that the proletarian had virtually no access to goods at all, just access to lines and waiting lists. The Party Member, however, had access to “hated” dept stores simply by presenting their party card. Talk about oppressors and the oppressed!
@Frumibandersnatch not really, millions in the US cannot avail themselves of medical care. Blacks live in disgusting ghettos, the US and these other parasite nations have massive social problems-this is somehting that is impossible for you to deny
They also live in the white house, but that aside, the state of affairs in Ghettos is largely due to the unintended consequences of rent control, landlords cannot collect enough rent to properly maintain their housing. In the seventies, it got so bad that landlords were abandoning their properties as rent revenues could no longer keep up with land taxes and building maintenance.
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY US and these other parasite nations have massive social problems
All countries have had social problems. While we are nowhere near the level of production that we had during our ascension; productivity is in no way parasitic.
But if I had insurance and the co-pay was only $30.00 I’d go for it, leaving doctors to charge the 10 grand thereby driving up costs. I have house insurance but I don’t call my insurance to fix a leaky faucet and if I did, the plumber couldn’t charge $10,000.
@COMMIE PHIL Re: not really, millions in the US cannot avail themselves of medical care.
Because of third payer systems, if I went to a doctor in a free market system for a really bad hang nail, and he said he could perform an operation for it at only $10,000 I’d tell him where to go & see another doctor.
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY Re: “One class represses another, NOT all people can be well off to the same, or similar, extent.”
1) in Marx’ time Monarchies still existed and class structure was more rigid. In a free society one might be in the lower class at 20and upper class at 50.
Yes, capitalists take huge risks in starting a business but risk does not justify exploitation of workers. A capitalist can take a small risk yet make huge profits and visa versa. The two things are conceptually different.
Yes it does. Profit ist the return on an uncertain investment. And no, capitalists cannot take small risks and make huge profits because any such opportunity would be seen by a myriad of investors - which in return would lower profit i.e the dividend.
And from an political and moral standpoint it makes perfect sense that an individual that is capable of satisfying the wants and needs of millions of people shoud be rewarded accordingly.
@j4ck2234 if you are so keen imagine the following hypothetical senario:
you start work tomorrrow for $13 per hour (the present minimum wage in NZ). The company you work for has a record of making massive profits and screwing wages right down to the lowest denominator. In fact, this is the reason the company bosses have made their millions.
How do you feel now Mr free-thinking Libertarian? Do you have an ethical issue?
lol it doesn't work like that. Wages are determined by the market not your boss. The boss maybe wants to pay zero and the worker maybe wants an infinte amount of compensation. But what both want is irrelevant to the actual number. After billions of exchanges in the markets are done you will end up earning what value the consumers attach to your services and achievements. An underpaid worker btw, is a profit incetive for another capitalist pig which in turn drives up wages.
just take as an example the convetional wisdom about 'equal pay'. If there really were all those exploited underpaid women this would mean that you could build a factory hiring all these women who are currently much cheaper than they should be and become an instant billionaire, good luck with that.
The fact that nobody does that should reveal how much marxists/socialists actually believe in their own horseshit theories. Put your money where your mouth is, eh.
You see it is a good thing that someone can get incredibly rich by cutting the price of rice in half. Wouldn't you agree? How that profit is then spend certainly adds a moral perspective but that's not the issue, right.
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY you might be misusing the term fascist. Libertarians generally oppose the characteristics of fascism (militarism, patriotism, corporatism, collectivism ect). And utilitarian consequentialism is often the basis their economic views. Some adhere to a natural rights philosophy
@mjbarrowful generally, they support a kind of neo-liberal fascist agenda whether they agree with that or not. There is a kind of underlying brutality about libertarianism, it's self-serving and sacrificial, arguably non-consequentialist. Their idea of "freedom" smells of cruelty. Thus it is perfectly suited to the decadence of this present capitalist mode of production
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY The present system is a long way from true free markets. There is government intervention in many sectors through subsidies and regulations, There is also a central bank called the Federal Reserve that manipulates consumer behavior through interest rates. I'm not sure what you think about monetary policy. So are you an anarcho-syndicalist like Chomsky or do you want a model of some former communist country? or an existing country?
@mjbarrowful yes, the idea of a western "free" market, as in totally free from external constraints is a myth. The essence of it all is this: Communism IS based upon democracy. Can you explain why a few individuals have the right to own factories and industries worth millions even billions of dollars, then have millions employed to work for them for a wage calculated per hour (eg. in NZ minimum wage is $13 NZD). This is NOT democractic at all, it is exclusive and completely un-democratic.
capitalists seek to make a profit-this is theft, as they have not earned it, they have not worked for it, but , instead, with the aid of corrupt governments, they have "acquired" it.
It is the workers who produce wealth within a social system NOT the capitalists. What the capitalist parasites call profit is, in actuality, money belonging to the workers.
Also the risk etc in running a business does in no way justify making a "profit". The two things are differnet
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY You replacing the idea of corporatism with capitalism. Capitalists entrepreneurs bring new ideas and undertake large amounts of risk to create a company out of thin air. The workers in a system may produce the wealth directly (i.e. physically create the substance), but the entrepreneur who comes up with the ideas behind it is more responsible and more deserving of the majority of profits.
If this were not how wages were determined then why would anyone be paid more than minimum wage, i.e. the minimum government mandates all employers must pay? Why don't all the employers just agree to pay nobody more than minimum wage? In fact, most people make more than minimum wage because there is a competitive market in labor. Most American workers can produce a lot more value than minimum wage, so companies must offer more than minimum wage to attract the best workers.
In a free market, which includes a competitive labor market, wages will approach the discounted marginal productivity value (the amount of extra value the worker produces minus what could be made if the same money were saved). If a boss were paying a worker worth $40 an hour only $10 an hour then his competitor would stand to gain 25 an hour in extra value by offering the same worker $15. This process continues to bid up wage offers until they approach that marginal productivity value.
'Imagine a worker who is hired for an hour and paid $10. Once in the capitalist's employ, the capitalist can have him operate a boot-making machine using which the worker produces $10 worth of work every fifteen minutes. Every hour, the capitalist receives $40 worth of work and only pays the worker $10, capturing the remaining $30 which, after deduction of costs (the leather, depreciation of the machine, etc.) leaves a residual, i.e. surplus value or profit.
The worker cannot capture this benefit directly because he has no claim to the means of production (e.g. the boot-making machine) or to its products, and his capacity to bargain over wages is restricted by laws and the supply/demand for wage labour. Hence the rise of trade unions which aim to create a more favourable bargaining position through collective action by workers.'
Workers make a wage that approaches their productivity. If person A can make 1,000 shoes in one day and person B can only make 10, how could a manager pay person B the same as person A? Yes, the workers' salaries will never be equal to their productivity because managers also have to be compensated for the work they do investing, organizing, coordinating, and so forth. Marxism always overlooks importance of middlemen. A product's no good if it can't reach consumers.
Certainly slavery was wrong and its abolition correct, but Libertarians aren't advocating a return to slavery. In a market economy however, the mercantilist principle of "for one to gain another must lose" does not hold. If I make shoes and you make pants and I trade you a pair of shoes for a pair of pants then we are both better of the end than we would have been if neither had specialized. Government, on the other hand just redistributes wealth without creating.
@onyomi wrong, governments do indeed create wealth, in new zealand for instance there exist "state -owned enterprises". Parasitic capitalist governments enter into free-trade agreements with various nations. eg. NZ has them with China. And, unbeknownst to many, NZ actually trades with Cuba (124 mil trade) in milk products.
@onyomi wrong, governments do indeed create wealth, in new zealand for instance there exist "state -owned enterprises". Parasitic capitalist governments enter into free-trade agreements with various nations. eg. NZ has them with China. And, unbeknownst to many, NZ actually trades with Cuba (124 mil trade) in milk products.
Pure hyperbole you know nothing about.Employment is not slavery, but a contract between a consenting employer and a consenting employee. The marxian exploitation nonsense is pure hyperbole written by a crochety old geezer who just sat around theorizing his own fantasies and bigotry. Libertarian freedom is individual freedom, communist society is the chains of everyone to the collective.
@IxenBlaze you resort to abuse when you realize your lame arguments are doomed. Your fascist dogma advocates personal autonomy, agency, at the expense of others within the collective. You are the kind to support a eugenics grid
@onyomi that is because you cherish the fascist individualist freedom to exploit other members within the same social system. What glorious people you really are
How can voluntary interactions (I pay you x dollars to do y and you agree to the terms) be "exploitation"? If we're not both better off after the deal than before then no deal is struck. Only with coercive state power can true exploitation occur.
In the wage -slave system employees work for a wage. Their wage does NOT reflect the full value of what theyproduce. The capitalist parasite makes a "surplus". They do NOT pay their workers for the actual value of the wealth that is produced. If they did, all workers, owners, & managers etc would recieve roughly the same wage.
There are some factories in the world owned and operated by workers-these are examples of work-place democracies.
The problem is the Marxist "labor theory of value," which is incorrect. The value of something is not determined by how much work went into making it but by how much someone else is willing to pay for it. If I spend all day making art no one likes but which I think is great should I have a right to force people to pay what i think my art is worth?
Dr. Woods is a natural born educator. He's a very good writer,but as a speaker he is virtually without peer. His lectures remind me of Milton Friedman's " Free To Choose " and recordings of Murray Rothbard(both which can be found on Youtube)in their clarity and wit. If only the whole country could hear him.
Carnegie made his money from steel, especially railroad steel bars. Steel production and Carnegie were protected by US tariffs.
Calculated from the Mises Institute (etexts/taussig.pdf): "There were three periods of active railway building and of heavy imports of rails: 1871–74, 1879–82, 1886–88."
My calculation is the average US tariff on English steel during this time (% of English price) was 214%.
@jddrafts No way, this is a good watch, but why watch it 15 times? Why don't people think for five seconds before writing crap like this? First of all, 15 times 15 doesn't even begin to explain the almost 8000 views this video has.
@Digali I was not talking about this video in particular but other videos that more people should watch that only have 2 or 3 hundred views. It was also kind of a joke.
MilanTbay: So you're another conspiracy automaton who can't shut up and listen for ten seconds. The speaker is not endorsing every aspect of these names. He is saying that as entrepreneurs they were obviously not the wicked villians you were told they were by the mind-stealers.
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
Wow where is this hate coming from.
Ain't no 'automaton'. I'm a free thinker and always have been.
Read David Rockefellers memoirs where he ADMITS he is part of an International conspiracy to bring an end to America.
So instead of a well made, local product costing $25, we have poorly made, probably cancerous, foreign made kids cloths the product of child or slave labour for $5.
He says sometime bussiness man are wicked and should be behind bars. He says that Rockefeller did very bad things. He is just saying that he was a good entrepeneur.
The upside of public education is that everyone gets some semblence of an education. The downside is that the government that provides that education gets to decide the standards and extent of that education.
Nothing ever happens unless it is profitable. THe secondary schooling system was only implemented in this country to genereate a more skilled, competetive labor force. History is taught so as to foster patriotism (read: nationalism), and support for the government.
well, at business school, we didn't tend to hate business, but, in non business matters I definitely saw plenty of slants. The most amazing slants while in a public school, in a wealthy town ironically.
i have to disagree with the preditory price issue. in my town when the box stores came to town they drove out the local grocers and clothing stores, then drove up the prices.
can you give me evidence of your intimate knowledge of the economic history of Thunder Bay Ontario Canada? If you live here, please respond with examples of the successful small businesses against the box stores? If you can't, then apologize for your brazen ignorance.
yes you can come to my neighbourhood and explain away the empty corner groceries and clothing stores that are on literally every corner. then you can explain Tim Horton's ultimatum the the local coffee shops to sell or be driven out of business. Granted, they at least offered to buy the business, but come on. that's not predatory? I agree with Woods on everything but this issue.
If you're not lying, your town would have the first actual example of a firm engaging in monopoly pricing without government intervention. That's worthy of a dissertation.
Do you mean without government intervention ENABLING them? Because Antitrust is designed to specifically break up natural monopolies. Look at the Steel industry in the early 1990s.
US Steel was broken up because it's competitors went to the gov't out with caps in hand and said "we just can't compete. Their prices are lower and their quality is higher". Gov't dismantled the company - actually HARMING the consumer in the end, causing steel price to rise and quality to drop.
the "predatory pricing" you are talking about is exactly what Woods is saying - these companies are predatory pricers because they aren't jacking up the prices again - if they did new companies would just come back and undercut because the "monopoly" would have to recoup the losses incurred from the predatory pricing.
Otherwise it's a natural monopoly, which. This is because their prices, service and quality cannot be beat - this is the ultimate benefit to the consumer, not bad
Good Lord! an actual witness that shows predatory pricing exists and has devastated my city's business community. seriously, what are the actual chances of that on Youtube? 150 000 in 6 billion lol
kdurston1: So you have an example of a firm that lowered prices, drove out all competitors, and then raised prices again? Or did you forget that last part?
From the observations of my elderly neighbours and parents generation,(that's over 80years), the grocery market is the most pronounced. A&P and Safeways are the easy examples, here. the corner grocers where forced out by deep price cuts by these two. the distributers also went under do to the closing of their corner market customers. after the majority of corner sores went under, the prices went back up.
as the distributers went under too, any remaining stores had to buy from the big guys distributers in town. clothing was another. not designer, but regular price point. zellers and sears, price wared the liitle guys out too. then raised the prices when they where gone. one must remember tbay's geographical area too. nothing in 8 hours in any direction. so consumers don't have the freedom of movement as elsewhere.
MilanTbay: No one "crushed" these stores except consumers who were sick of paying $25 for a single baby outfit. It was the decisions of consumers not to keep getting ripped off that led to those outcomes.
"The gov't can take money from your neighbor & give it to you to help your economic situation out, but your neighbor will be pretty unhappy about it. Big businessman, on the other hand, can make the economic situation better for everyone. Take "evil" Rockefeller for example - he was able to lower the price of oil from one dollar to 10 cents. He made it equally cheaper for everyone, & bettered the economy as a whole."
^ Just one of the MANY points from this video that will stick with me forever.
I first heard about the pig/Great Depression thing when I was 20 from an old man that I worked with. He was employed by the government to shovel live baby pigs into furnaces. I only believed such a ridiculous story because he was so emotionally moved when he told about it. He could only do it a few days and was so upset he had to quit. He said he would rather starve himself than shovel live pigs into furnaces while he knew other people were starving.
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
The last two minutes are the most relevant. Classical liberals were correct in saying that government grant of privilege interfering with markets needed to end in order to elevate the condition of the poor. What the classical liberals did not do until Ricardo and Henry George was to expose the privilege/injustice inherent in ownership/monopoly of land and natural resources the value of which were created by society as a whole and are an unearned source of income to the "owners" unabated still.
To be honest, Tom, I don't at all mind the wild hand waving (I'm used to it because my parents do it all the time), but could you stand still?
xXhypn0tiiqXx 15 hours ago
Being homeschooled by Dr. Thomas Woods?
Best. Childhood. EVER.
shamgar001 2 months ago 3
Has this guy actual read history, Rockfeller interfered with all the small competitors. He borrowed to corner chemicals in refining oil for kerosene, bought out oil barrels so the competitors were short of barrels, he colluded with the rail companies to over price to competitors all putting competitors in a corner to put them out of business. There was no free market. Some people are so fucking negligent with the facts it's not funny. The Mise institutes pormotes free markets n fucks up facts
foggymedia 5 months ago
A few libertarian negative entitlements:
the right not to be compelled to help the poor
not to be compelled to pay tax
not to be compelled to help ANY other person
what a gloriously self-serving doctrine
COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY 6 months ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY Re: "libertarianism is fascist individualism"
An oxymoron, and an impossibility, Fascism is born of Socialism (National Socialism), individualism is a tenet of Classical Liberalism, born of the age of enlightenment these concepts are, without question, antithetical to one another.
Frumibandersnatch 6 months ago
@Frumibandersnatch it was used in the sense of an analogy, are you a literalist or something?
The essense of it is this: for each person to exercise that degree of personal autonomy would be impossible. When a few individuals exercise it, it will result in adverse consequences for others, either directly, indirectly, or both. You cannot have (hypothetical) a society where every single citizen exercises the same degree of volition all of the time and equally.
COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY 6 months ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY Re: You cannot have (hypothetical) a society where every single citizen exercises the same degree of volition ...
Hypothetical? That was America from 1791 to about 1890 pal. Until Americans started going to doctoral programs in Europe and were exposed to Marx, Engles, Sombart, La Salle, Plenge all of which ended Europian Bolshevism & Naziism and the end of life for millions & millions of innocent people. The road you wish us to embark upon again... no thanks.
Frumibandersnatch 6 months ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY The argument we're having goes back to Locke and Hobbes. Have you seen the Three Minute Philosophy on Locke and Hobbes? Watch it, this Ausie guy is really funny!!.....
/watch?v=X-buzVjYQvY
Frumibandersnatch 6 months ago
@Frumibandersnatch will indeed watch it.
another example: a neo- Nazi opens a book shop selling anti-semite, anti-backs literature, Mein Kampf etc. He claims this is his libertarian entitlement and if the state prohibit him (by enacting legislation) this is in itself would amount to a contravention of his liberty & is therefore wrong.
Liberty cuts both ways: liberty to one can result in detriment to another. Jews and blacks have an entitlement to be free from this kind of literature?
COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY 6 months ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY
Re: Jews and blacks have an entitlement to be free from this kind of literature?
Firstly, Naziim and Libertarianism are again, antithetical to one another, so no Libertarian would be selling such literature, so I’m supposing this is a hypothetical. Yes all speech is protected. A Jewish lawyer from the ACLU, who seems he might know or care more about freedom than you do, defended the actual Nazis right to march in IL, in 1977
kansaspress. ku. edu/strwhe. Htm l
Frumibandersnatch 6 months ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY
Hi Phil [osophy], I ran into this Thomas Sowell video on the economic fallacies of ""affordable housing" and thought of you...
watch?v=bbPYedkDU8Y&feature=feedu
Frumibandersnatch 6 months ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY the problem with the label "anti semitic" is that it has been demonstrated to be used to describe someone or something that the Jews hate, rather than libel or defamation. If the truth offends you, then that's your goddamned problem, isn't it? So if you consider it to be anti semitic for me to say that the Jews run Hollywood, then you can go jam your dick in a meat grinder. Are we on the same page?
tallswede80 1 month ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY Re: it was used in the sense of an analogy, are you a literalist or something ?
No, I use metaphors and analogies, but I can’t fit “libertarianism is fascist individualism" into any kind of metaphorical context. As far as literalism goes, I believe we should say what we mean and mean what we say.
Frumibandersnatch 6 months ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY I guess you could draw a parallel between Hume’s empiricism with Hayeks understanding of why central planning always fails (and it does) and that is; no single person or any assembly of people, short of all participants in the economy, can know each and every transaction within an economy, this is a kind of knowledge that can be “known” by the masses. The only way that price points can be discovered and resources can be properly allocated.
watch?v=r3QZ2Ko-Fog
Frumibandersnatch 6 months ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY don't mean to keep bothering you, so this is the last one. If you do respond, I'd be delighted to keep our conversation going. -frum
If you hang around economics comment threads, you’ve probably seen this, it’s a Rap Off between Lord Manard Keynes and Friedrich A. Hayek. It’s put out by Econ-Stories with the aid of an economics professor at George Mason. It's well produced and I think it’s worth a look, if you’re really interested in economics.
watch?v=GTQnarzmTOc
Frumibandersnatch 6 months ago
free to make huge profits?
That can ONLY be achieved by a system of wage slavery. One class represses another, NOT all people can be well off to the same, or similar, extent. Thus libertarian is a system of inegaitarianism and mass inequality.
If it really championed liberty the result would be a classless society
COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY 7 months ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY ...conti.
2) In the Soviet Union, resources were so misappropriated that the proletarian had virtually no access to goods at all, just access to lines and waiting lists. The Party Member, however, had access to “hated” dept stores simply by presenting their party card. Talk about oppressors and the oppressed!
Frumibandersnatch 6 months ago
@Frumibandersnatch not really, millions in the US cannot avail themselves of medical care. Blacks live in disgusting ghettos, the US and these other parasite nations have massive social problems-this is somehting that is impossible for you to deny
COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY 6 months ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY
Re: Blacks live in disgusting ghettos
They also live in the white house, but that aside, the state of affairs in Ghettos is largely due to the unintended consequences of rent control, landlords cannot collect enough rent to properly maintain their housing. In the seventies, it got so bad that landlords were abandoning their properties as rent revenues could no longer keep up with land taxes and building maintenance.
Frumibandersnatch 6 months ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY US and these other parasite nations have massive social problems
All countries have had social problems. While we are nowhere near the level of production that we had during our ascension; productivity is in no way parasitic.
Frumibandersnatch 6 months ago
@COMMIE PHIL ...Conti.
But if I had insurance and the co-pay was only $30.00 I’d go for it, leaving doctors to charge the 10 grand thereby driving up costs. I have house insurance but I don’t call my insurance to fix a leaky faucet and if I did, the plumber couldn’t charge $10,000.
Frumibandersnatch 6 months ago
@COMMIE PHIL Re: not really, millions in the US cannot avail themselves of medical care.
Because of third payer systems, if I went to a doctor in a free market system for a really bad hang nail, and he said he could perform an operation for it at only $10,000 I’d tell him where to go & see another doctor.
More...
Frumibandersnatch 6 months ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY Re: “One class represses another, NOT all people can be well off to the same, or similar, extent.”
1) in Marx’ time Monarchies still existed and class structure was more rigid. In a free society one might be in the lower class at 20and upper class at 50.
More...
Frumibandersnatch 6 months ago
Yes, capitalists take huge risks in starting a business but risk does not justify exploitation of workers. A capitalist can take a small risk yet make huge profits and visa versa. The two things are conceptually different.
Risk does not justify profit (surplus)
COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY 7 months ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY
Yes it does. Profit ist the return on an uncertain investment. And no, capitalists cannot take small risks and make huge profits because any such opportunity would be seen by a myriad of investors - which in return would lower profit i.e the dividend.
And from an political and moral standpoint it makes perfect sense that an individual that is capable of satisfying the wants and needs of millions of people shoud be rewarded accordingly.
j4ck2234 7 months ago
@j4ck2234 if you are so keen imagine the following hypothetical senario:
you start work tomorrrow for $13 per hour (the present minimum wage in NZ). The company you work for has a record of making massive profits and screwing wages right down to the lowest denominator. In fact, this is the reason the company bosses have made their millions.
How do you feel now Mr free-thinking Libertarian? Do you have an ethical issue?
COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY 7 months ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY
lol it doesn't work like that. Wages are determined by the market not your boss. The boss maybe wants to pay zero and the worker maybe wants an infinte amount of compensation. But what both want is irrelevant to the actual number. After billions of exchanges in the markets are done you will end up earning what value the consumers attach to your services and achievements. An underpaid worker btw, is a profit incetive for another capitalist pig which in turn drives up wages.
j4ck2234 7 months ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY
@j4ck2234
just take as an example the convetional wisdom about 'equal pay'. If there really were all those exploited underpaid women this would mean that you could build a factory hiring all these women who are currently much cheaper than they should be and become an instant billionaire, good luck with that.
The fact that nobody does that should reveal how much marxists/socialists actually believe in their own horseshit theories. Put your money where your mouth is, eh.
j4ck2234 7 months ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY
You see it is a good thing that someone can get incredibly rich by cutting the price of rice in half. Wouldn't you agree? How that profit is then spend certainly adds a moral perspective but that's not the issue, right.
j4ck2234 7 months ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY
btw how is offering somebody a job exploitation? I dind't even get that back when I was a commie.
j4ck2234 7 months ago
libertarianism is fascist individualism, a non-consequentialist anti-utilitarian doctrine based upon self-interest
COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY 7 months ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY you might be misusing the term fascist. Libertarians generally oppose the characteristics of fascism (militarism, patriotism, corporatism, collectivism ect). And utilitarian consequentialism is often the basis their economic views. Some adhere to a natural rights philosophy
mjbarrowful 7 months ago
@mjbarrowful generally, they support a kind of neo-liberal fascist agenda whether they agree with that or not. There is a kind of underlying brutality about libertarianism, it's self-serving and sacrificial, arguably non-consequentialist. Their idea of "freedom" smells of cruelty. Thus it is perfectly suited to the decadence of this present capitalist mode of production
as for the rest of you here? Go to hell
COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY 7 months ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY The present system is a long way from true free markets. There is government intervention in many sectors through subsidies and regulations, There is also a central bank called the Federal Reserve that manipulates consumer behavior through interest rates. I'm not sure what you think about monetary policy. So are you an anarcho-syndicalist like Chomsky or do you want a model of some former communist country? or an existing country?
mjbarrowful 7 months ago
@mjbarrowful yes, the idea of a western "free" market, as in totally free from external constraints is a myth. The essence of it all is this: Communism IS based upon democracy. Can you explain why a few individuals have the right to own factories and industries worth millions even billions of dollars, then have millions employed to work for them for a wage calculated per hour (eg. in NZ minimum wage is $13 NZD). This is NOT democractic at all, it is exclusive and completely un-democratic.
COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY 7 months ago
Comment removed
Frumibandersnatch 6 months ago
capitalists seek to make a profit-this is theft, as they have not earned it, they have not worked for it, but , instead, with the aid of corrupt governments, they have "acquired" it.
It is the workers who produce wealth within a social system NOT the capitalists. What the capitalist parasites call profit is, in actuality, money belonging to the workers.
Also the risk etc in running a business does in no way justify making a "profit". The two things are differnet
COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY 7 months ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY You replacing the idea of corporatism with capitalism. Capitalists entrepreneurs bring new ideas and undertake large amounts of risk to create a company out of thin air. The workers in a system may produce the wealth directly (i.e. physically create the substance), but the entrepreneur who comes up with the ideas behind it is more responsible and more deserving of the majority of profits.
RKAddict101 7 months ago
Does anybody know what the intro music is from?
sapientiamagna 8 months ago
Dr. Woods is my homeboy.
Hackiesacker007 11 months ago 2
If this were not how wages were determined then why would anyone be paid more than minimum wage, i.e. the minimum government mandates all employers must pay? Why don't all the employers just agree to pay nobody more than minimum wage? In fact, most people make more than minimum wage because there is a competitive market in labor. Most American workers can produce a lot more value than minimum wage, so companies must offer more than minimum wage to attract the best workers.
onyomi 1 year ago
In a free market, which includes a competitive labor market, wages will approach the discounted marginal productivity value (the amount of extra value the worker produces minus what could be made if the same money were saved). If a boss were paying a worker worth $40 an hour only $10 an hour then his competitor would stand to gain 25 an hour in extra value by offering the same worker $15. This process continues to bid up wage offers until they approach that marginal productivity value.
onyomi 1 year ago
'Imagine a worker who is hired for an hour and paid $10. Once in the capitalist's employ, the capitalist can have him operate a boot-making machine using which the worker produces $10 worth of work every fifteen minutes. Every hour, the capitalist receives $40 worth of work and only pays the worker $10, capturing the remaining $30 which, after deduction of costs (the leather, depreciation of the machine, etc.) leaves a residual, i.e. surplus value or profit.
COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY 1 year ago
The worker cannot capture this benefit directly because he has no claim to the means of production (e.g. the boot-making machine) or to its products, and his capacity to bargain over wages is restricted by laws and the supply/demand for wage labour. Hence the rise of trade unions which aim to create a more favourable bargaining position through collective action by workers.'
"Surplus value"
Wikipedia
Karl Marx segment
COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY 1 year ago
Workers make a wage that approaches their productivity. If person A can make 1,000 shoes in one day and person B can only make 10, how could a manager pay person B the same as person A? Yes, the workers' salaries will never be equal to their productivity because managers also have to be compensated for the work they do investing, organizing, coordinating, and so forth. Marxism always overlooks importance of middlemen. A product's no good if it can't reach consumers.
onyomi 1 year ago
libertarian freedom is enslavement for others. There can be no true freedom while others remain in chains. Compare your US slave trade
COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY 1 year ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY
Certainly slavery was wrong and its abolition correct, but Libertarians aren't advocating a return to slavery. In a market economy however, the mercantilist principle of "for one to gain another must lose" does not hold. If I make shoes and you make pants and I trade you a pair of shoes for a pair of pants then we are both better of the end than we would have been if neither had specialized. Government, on the other hand just redistributes wealth without creating.
onyomi 1 year ago
@onyomi wrong, governments do indeed create wealth, in new zealand for instance there exist "state -owned enterprises". Parasitic capitalist governments enter into free-trade agreements with various nations. eg. NZ has them with China. And, unbeknownst to many, NZ actually trades with Cuba (124 mil trade) in milk products.
COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY 7 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@onyomi wrong, governments do indeed create wealth, in new zealand for instance there exist "state -owned enterprises". Parasitic capitalist governments enter into free-trade agreements with various nations. eg. NZ has them with China. And, unbeknownst to many, NZ actually trades with Cuba (124 mil trade) in milk products.
COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY 7 months ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY
Pure hyperbole you know nothing about.Employment is not slavery, but a contract between a consenting employer and a consenting employee. The marxian exploitation nonsense is pure hyperbole written by a crochety old geezer who just sat around theorizing his own fantasies and bigotry. Libertarian freedom is individual freedom, communist society is the chains of everyone to the collective.
IxenBlaze 7 months ago
@IxenBlaze you resort to abuse when you realize your lame arguments are doomed. Your fascist dogma advocates personal autonomy, agency, at the expense of others within the collective. You are the kind to support a eugenics grid
COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY 7 months ago
... you Libertarians are amazing. You've managed to construct an entire political ideology based on the phrase 'FUCK OFF.'
Richard James Winters III
COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY 1 year ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY
Yes, to all those who make a living eroding our personal and economic freedom, we say: "fuck off."
onyomi 1 year ago
@onyomi that is because you cherish the fascist individualist freedom to exploit other members within the same social system. What glorious people you really are
COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY 1 year ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY
How can voluntary interactions (I pay you x dollars to do y and you agree to the terms) be "exploitation"? If we're not both better off after the deal than before then no deal is struck. Only with coercive state power can true exploitation occur.
onyomi 1 year ago
@onyomi you live under coercive state power.
In the wage -slave system employees work for a wage. Their wage does NOT reflect the full value of what theyproduce. The capitalist parasite makes a "surplus". They do NOT pay their workers for the actual value of the wealth that is produced. If they did, all workers, owners, & managers etc would recieve roughly the same wage.
There are some factories in the world owned and operated by workers-these are examples of work-place democracies.
COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY 1 year ago
@COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY
The problem is the Marxist "labor theory of value," which is incorrect. The value of something is not determined by how much work went into making it but by how much someone else is willing to pay for it. If I spend all day making art no one likes but which I think is great should I have a right to force people to pay what i think my art is worth?
onyomi 1 year ago
Dr. Woods is a natural born educator. He's a very good writer,but as a speaker he is virtually without peer. His lectures remind me of Milton Friedman's " Free To Choose " and recordings of Murray Rothbard(both which can be found on Youtube)in their clarity and wit. If only the whole country could hear him.
sleedolfine15 1 year ago
@sleedolfine15
Indeed, libertarian economists are the only few in the economics profession that can make lectures entertaining while being didactic.
CircleBastiat 1 year ago
Carnegie made his money from steel, especially railroad steel bars. Steel production and Carnegie were protected by US tariffs.
Calculated from the Mises Institute (etexts/taussig.pdf): "There were three periods of active railway building and of heavy imports of rails: 1871–74, 1879–82, 1886–88."
My calculation is the average US tariff on English steel during this time (% of English price) was 214%.
*That* is why he's called a robber baron.
wgerber 1 year ago
i like it
kommon12Cents 1 year ago
"I always get excited talking about Bromene"
Thomas E Woods is a legend.
Hxcorps 1 year ago 6
@Hxcorps Bromine
elliotgoodrich 6 months ago
Why have only 5000 people watched this video?
PlaceOfOrigin 2 years ago 3
Because it's too long for the average attention span.
JackBlair2 2 years ago 6
No I it's more like 4000 I think I have watched this video 1000 times - I tell everyone I can about this video.
Wcoltd 1 year ago
@Wcoltd I think alot of videos are like that its the same 15-20 people watching them 10-15 times.
jddrafts 1 year ago
@Wcoltd I think alot of videos, especially ones like this, are like that its the same 15-20 people watching them 10-15 times.
jddrafts 1 year ago
@jddrafts I wouldn't be surprised if fewer than 1000 people have seen this. Kind of tragic, this is such a great speech.
Wcoltd 1 year ago
@jddrafts No way, this is a good watch, but why watch it 15 times? Why don't people think for five seconds before writing crap like this? First of all, 15 times 15 doesn't even begin to explain the almost 8000 views this video has.
Digali 1 year ago
@Digali I was not talking about this video in particular but other videos that more people should watch that only have 2 or 3 hundred views. It was also kind of a joke.
jddrafts 1 year ago
15:32 Text Book bias (against big business)
16:35 John D. Rockefeller
20:30 Andrew Carnegie
22:25 Predatory Price argument debunked
24:24 Herbert Dow vs. the German Bromine Cartel
Wcoltd 2 years ago 15
30:30 The Great Depression... Why so Great?
32:33 Let's Help the Farmers!.... Destroy Crops!
35:15 Pay You to do Nothing
Wcoltd 2 years ago 15
6:32 Never Commemorated
10:28 Nullification - Jefferson's Proposal
11:42 Monopoly of Interpretation of a Contract Argument
13:54 The Principles of 1798
Wcoltd 1 year ago 7
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Listen to his heros.
Rockefeller, Dow, Carnegie (Rothschild shill)
Now look up CFR, Bilderburg, Trilateral commission.
Will a free market get rid of these crooks or allow them to buy up what they've already stolened.
MilanTbay 2 years ago
MilanTbay: So you're another conspiracy automaton who can't shut up and listen for ten seconds. The speaker is not endorsing every aspect of these names. He is saying that as entrepreneurs they were obviously not the wicked villians you were told they were by the mind-stealers.
DRNevans 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Wow where is this hate coming from.
Ain't no 'automaton'. I'm a free thinker and always have been.
Read David Rockefellers memoirs where he ADMITS he is part of an International conspiracy to bring an end to America.
So instead of a well made, local product costing $25, we have poorly made, probably cancerous, foreign made kids cloths the product of child or slave labour for $5.
Now where did that economy go?
Puttz
MilanTbay 2 years ago
He says sometime bussiness man are wicked and should be behind bars. He says that Rockefeller did very bad things. He is just saying that he was a good entrepeneur.
What video did you listen to?
hugolp 2 years ago
The upside of public education is that everyone gets some semblence of an education. The downside is that the government that provides that education gets to decide the standards and extent of that education.
Nothing ever happens unless it is profitable. THe secondary schooling system was only implemented in this country to genereate a more skilled, competetive labor force. History is taught so as to foster patriotism (read: nationalism), and support for the government.
SayYesToReason 2 years ago
well, at business school, we didn't tend to hate business, but, in non business matters I definitely saw plenty of slants. The most amazing slants while in a public school, in a wealthy town ironically.
LLCoolPass 2 years ago
wow this is amazing, thank you
Dollarisdead09 for the vid gave me as a link and thanks to Misesmedia.
mohali34 2 years ago 3
me2
LLCoolPass 2 years ago
lmao at 16:06
Dollarisdead09 2 years ago 2
i have to disagree with the preditory price issue. in my town when the box stores came to town they drove out the local grocers and clothing stores, then drove up the prices.
kdurston1 2 years ago
That's a lie.
Questfortruth86 2 years ago
can you give me evidence of your intimate knowledge of the economic history of Thunder Bay Ontario Canada? If you live here, please respond with examples of the successful small businesses against the box stores? If you can't, then apologize for your brazen ignorance.
kdurston1 2 years ago
Okay, I'm on my way. I've been looking for a dissertation topic.
Questfortruth86 2 years ago
yes you can come to my neighbourhood and explain away the empty corner groceries and clothing stores that are on literally every corner. then you can explain Tim Horton's ultimatum the the local coffee shops to sell or be driven out of business. Granted, they at least offered to buy the business, but come on. that's not predatory? I agree with Woods on everything but this issue.
kdurston1 2 years ago
If you're not lying, your town would have the first actual example of a firm engaging in monopoly pricing without government intervention. That's worthy of a dissertation.
Questfortruth86 2 years ago
Do you mean without government intervention ENABLING them? Because Antitrust is designed to specifically break up natural monopolies. Look at the Steel industry in the early 1990s.
US Steel was broken up because it's competitors went to the gov't out with caps in hand and said "we just can't compete. Their prices are lower and their quality is higher". Gov't dismantled the company - actually HARMING the consumer in the end, causing steel price to rise and quality to drop.
Coreadrin 2 years ago
the "predatory pricing" you are talking about is exactly what Woods is saying - these companies are predatory pricers because they aren't jacking up the prices again - if they did new companies would just come back and undercut because the "monopoly" would have to recoup the losses incurred from the predatory pricing.
Otherwise it's a natural monopoly, which. This is because their prices, service and quality cannot be beat - this is the ultimate benefit to the consumer, not bad
Coreadrin 2 years ago
We've also seen Silver City destroy every other theater in town. Wall Mart and Intercity Mall crush our downtown cores.
The business they destroyed was small family owned for decades to be replaced by minimum waged centralized corporate jobs.
MilanTbay 2 years ago
Good Lord! an actual witness that shows predatory pricing exists and has devastated my city's business community. seriously, what are the actual chances of that on Youtube? 150 000 in 6 billion lol
kdurston1 2 years ago
kdurston1: So you have an example of a firm that lowered prices, drove out all competitors, and then raised prices again? Or did you forget that last part?
DRNevans 2 years ago
From the observations of my elderly neighbours and parents generation,(that's over 80years), the grocery market is the most pronounced. A&P and Safeways are the easy examples, here. the corner grocers where forced out by deep price cuts by these two. the distributers also went under do to the closing of their corner market customers. after the majority of corner sores went under, the prices went back up.
kdurston1 2 years ago
as the distributers went under too, any remaining stores had to buy from the big guys distributers in town. clothing was another. not designer, but regular price point. zellers and sears, price wared the liitle guys out too. then raised the prices when they where gone. one must remember tbay's geographical area too. nothing in 8 hours in any direction. so consumers don't have the freedom of movement as elsewhere.
kdurston1 2 years ago
Hope people get it bud.
I live in a very old neighborhood. Many houses nearly 100 years old.
Almost every corner has a weird looking house on it since they were all stores 80 years ago.
That's an economy, a society and a community that was stolen from us.
With prices dropping then going up again, we have to consider what the buying power of the dollar is from then to now.
Todays American dollar is worth 4 cents compared to the time the Federal Reserve took its banking system.
MilanTbay 2 years ago 2
MilanTbay: No one "crushed" these stores except consumers who were sick of paying $25 for a single baby outfit. It was the decisions of consumers not to keep getting ripped off that led to those outcomes.
DRNevans 2 years ago 2
Sometimes I feel like my education began when i LEFT college.
Great talk. I really liked the story about Herbert Dow.
chaseef 2 years ago
I love Tom Woods!
vshagoyan 2 years ago
This is a great lecture
Wcoltd 2 years ago 2
State Nullification is perhaps one of the greatest checks against federal power. Too bad we threw the states under the bus.
djsherin 3 years ago 14
Hilarious. See 25 or 26 min. mark.
DoctorMurky 3 years ago 5
So funny!!!
snowtrot 2 years ago
Secede... and survive.
RedShirtArmy 3 years ago 3
Very good and informative video, I wish all my teachers taught like this.
cool70200 3 years ago 13
"The gov't can take money from your neighbor & give it to you to help your economic situation out, but your neighbor will be pretty unhappy about it. Big businessman, on the other hand, can make the economic situation better for everyone. Take "evil" Rockefeller for example - he was able to lower the price of oil from one dollar to 10 cents. He made it equally cheaper for everyone, & bettered the economy as a whole."
^ Just one of the MANY points from this video that will stick with me forever.
rascleattop 3 years ago 14
@rascleattop becaUSe you are decadent that's why
COMMUNISTPHILOSOPHY 7 months ago
I wish more people knew this.
I first heard about the pig/Great Depression thing when I was 20 from an old man that I worked with. He was employed by the government to shovel live baby pigs into furnaces. I only believed such a ridiculous story because he was so emotionally moved when he told about it. He could only do it a few days and was so upset he had to quit. He said he would rather starve himself than shovel live pigs into furnaces while he knew other people were starving.
harryogre 3 years ago 9
This comment has received too many negative votes show
The last two minutes are the most relevant. Classical liberals were correct in saying that government grant of privilege interfering with markets needed to end in order to elevate the condition of the poor. What the classical liberals did not do until Ricardo and Henry George was to expose the privilege/injustice inherent in ownership/monopoly of land and natural resources the value of which were created by society as a whole and are an unearned source of income to the "owners" unabated still.
ourearthhome 3 years ago
good video
Zgoalie18 3 years ago 6
Our state governers need more courage to do whats right.
Seiku 3 years ago 5
What a great speech without notes.
The DOW chemical story was great!
cowbot2 3 years ago 28