Evan LYSACEK Cup of China 2009 LP

[victorjlt]

plushenko and Lambiel are better!!

[jani1109]

lisasek no es mas que un gay con patines, pense que a los yanquis solo les importaba robarse el petroleo de medio oriente, pero veo que ahora tambien se roban las medallas en los juegos olimpicos, lisasek no es ni el 000000000000.1% de lo que Evgeny Plushenko es como patinador, desde luego Evgeny Gold Gold Gold

[nAdDlEkAtI]

why cant you find lysaceks performance at olympics in youtube?

[MrEvan75]

@xxflyingsoulxx101 What about Evan's flip? Negative goe was -0,4 instead of -2-3 (The difference between 1st and 2nd places is 1,31, so calculate)

Where did you find the superior choreography? I can't help laughing when I watch Evan on ice, but it is subjective, of course )))

And yes, 3-3 and 3-2-2 (with a rude mistake!) is ladies' level. Look at the performance of Adelina Sotnikova (13 years old) watch?v=i_327e4ktyQ BTW sorry for my English)))

[xxflyingsoulxx101]

@MrEvan75 Why did you ignore a crucial point I put in front of you? Plushenko's jumping layout. You must keep in mind that Evan's 3A+2T was after the half point of the program, his overall jumping layout was more difficult and intelligently put together than Evgeni's. Plushenko's program was very front loaded, he didn't save any of his hardest elements for later in his program, which 1) would've garnered him a lot of bonus points and 2) it would have left more room for him to put transitions.

[xxflyingsoulxx101]

@MrEvan75 Evan's program was full of them raising the overall difficulty. Had Plushenko been marked correctly in his components, Evan still would have won even if his flip had been given more negative GOE marks. Another thing that would've given Plush the gold taking into consideration only the scores that the judges gave that night was him adding the double he left out of his beginning quad combo, he would have won by 1.2 points if my calculations are correct. Also, your english is just fine.

[xxflyingsoulxx101]

As for the choreography...Yes, I know that it is very subjective, but it seemed pretty obvious to me that Plushenko had a very imbalanced program as opposed to Evan's. Evan's elements were all intelligently woven together, balanced, jumps in the beginning and after the half point, and although he is not whom I would consider a very artistic skater on ice, his interpretation seemed stronger to me than Plush's. Plush's program was very vacant going towards the end filled little but posing.

[xxflyingsoulxx101]

@MrEvan75 Finally, I happen to have seen her program before, and I find her to be very, very good. However, I didn't see any triple axels in her program along with her 3-3 combo. Her program in no way can be compared to that of a mens' in the top rankings, or the one that Evan performed for that matter. I find your "a lady could have done that program" argument pointless, really.

[MrEvan75]

@xxflyingsoulxx101 I don't ignore your arguments, I know all of them. I agree that Lysacek used the modern scoring system well. But I think, the absence of 4-3 in both programs, prerotation in 3,5A, wrong edge in flip are very strong arguments contra Evan Lysacek.

Don't forget that two judges put Plush on the 21st place for skating skills after SP. Those lowest marks were not excluded!

And Plushenko got better points in artistry than Lysacek! That is true.

[xxflyingsoulxx101]

@MrEvan75 Yes, Evan used the modern system well, and Plushenko failed to do so.

I also think that your problem is Evan should have been more severely deducted on those certain elements you mentioned? Even so, what I am arguing is that Plushenko was definitely overscored on his components, and that Evan should have beaten him on both the technical and artistic merits. Plushenko's choreography/composition was scored at 8.20 which baffles me, as well as his skating skills that were marked 8.40.

[MrEvan75]

@xxflyingsoulxx101 Evan used the modern system very well, but the judges helped him very well too.

Plushenko is not the 20th in skating skills, OK? Wrong edge must be the reason of 2-3 points deduction according with the rules! Without variants!

[xxflyingsoulxx101]

@MrEvan75 Even if Evan did deserve to be more severely deducted, I believe that there is still to argue Plushenko's high component scores and how ridiculous it is that they tied on them overall.

[MrEvan75]

@xxflyingsoulxx101 watch?v=hes8MZEjVpg

Oh, here is Liza and her Triple Axel :) Mao is great too, she can do two 3,5A in a program. Of course, girls (kids!) are not able to perform his LP clean, but they are very close. The only element that female skaters can't perform now is a quad.

BTW, Evan is not capable to perform Evgeni's SP and LP;) Evgeni would do it easily, but he would be on the 5-6 place in this case - like Weir.

[MrEvan75]

@xxflyingsoulxx101 Yes, Adelina didn't perform 3,5A, only 3-3 and 3-2-2. But look at another sweet child Liza Tuktamysheva (it's just a practice, of course).

watch?v=hes8MZEjVpg&feature=re­lated

Mao Asada and other brave girls will make male skaters do difficult elements.

watch?v=FK01mukJJe0&playnext=1­&videos=9zRmQLseRq0

[MrEvan75]

@MrEvan75 watch?v=FK01mukJJe0; watch?v=hes8MZEjVpg (Elizaveta Tuktamysheva - Triple Axel, 13 years old)

[xxflyingsoulxx101]

@MrEvan75 Wrong video. ;-) You sent me 'Triple Axel, by Evgeni Plushenko vs Mao Asada'. And even when you do send me the correct video, I don't think you grasp what I'm saying here. In order to find a ladies program that is even comparable, she needs to be doing 8 triples, with two of them being triple axels. As far as my knowledge goes, there as been no girl or lady to have done this, thus rendering your argument pointless.

[xxflyingsoulxx101]

@MrEvan75 Yes, she is another very sweet child, but again, all I see her doing is the triple axel. I can think of many ladies who have done this: Midori Ito, Kimmie Meissner, Mao Asada, Yukari Nakano...etc. Again, it is not proving that this girl is capable of performing Evan's program, no lady today that I can think of is capable of performing his program. I fail to see your point.

[Algorithm16]

still can't believe that he finished 2nd in this competition...MUCH better than oda!

the evan haters are grasping at straws again, as usual. the only thing plushy has on evan is the quad, and can't even land that cleanly.

(plus, evan is such a gracious guy that those who attack his personality and not his skating is a fool, coughcough sooniemix)

[tinymavy]

I love how Evan just skated with the confidence and strength of a champion since the very begining of the season. Winning that World Championship was the best thing that ever happened to him IMO.

[Drgarfieldable]

the best performance!!!!!!

[MrEvan75]

Olympic champion? Very bad joke.

Нет, в самом деле, это ржач какой-то. Более нелепого зрелища я не припомню))) А костюм вообще за гранью моего понимания.

[xxflyingsoulxx101]

@MrEvan75 then plushenko should have won? no, now THAT would have been a very bad joke. plushenko could barely land a 3Lz without wobbling, the only superior aspect of his program to that of evan's was the quad, and it wasn't that great of a quad to begin with.

[MrEvan75]

@xxflyingsoulxx101The most difficult elements performed by Evan were 3,5-2, 3-2-2 and 3-3. Girls (children) can do such elements.

[MrEvan75]

@MrEvan75 @xxflyingsoulxx101 Plush performed 4-3 combo in SP and LP. There was the only his mistake in 3A in LP (-0.36) Evan made two errors: 3A2T (-0.56), 3F2T2R (-0.40) According with the rules he had to get -2-3 for his wrong flip!!

[xxflyingsoulxx101]

@MrEvan75 plush had all of his hardest elements back to back right at the beginning of the program; his 4T+3T, 3A, 3A+2T, whereas evan had more jumps (which included his harder combos) after the half point (garnering 10% bonuses); such as his 3F+2T+2Lo and 3A+2T. plushenko needed that extra double that he left out of his quad combo to have won by 1.2 points, but he didn't have it. plush also lacked the transitions going into all of his jumps. there were no intricate or creative steps(cont)

[xxflyingsoulxx101]

@MrEvan75 going into any of his jumps, he was greatly lacking in that aspect. also, i am surprised that evan and plushenko tied in the program components, again 1) plushenko lacked the transitions that evan had plenty of, and 2) there is no doubt that evan had the superior choreography.

i also find it laughable that you seem to imply that a triple is a 'ladies' jump when plushenko could barely land a 3Lz w/o wobbling. LOL. ;)

[peterlenhard]

I wonder when Gringo are gonna realize dollar doesn't buy all. The rest of the world knows Plushenko was the real winner.

[sooniemix]

Hello, I am one of the rest of the world, and I don't think your ass-hero was the real winner. LOL. What a child you are and your hero.

[peterlenhard]

You're the biggest state of the USA, you're not part of "the REST of the WORLD".

[noturbusiness90]

when anything amazing in his performance starts, please wake me up!

[ToyMannequin]

Vancouver Olympics 2010 amazing enough for you?

[janeym]

7:34 makes me smile =)

[krokabrot1]

How can you compare this mediocrity to Plushenko's art on the ice, poetry on the ice... This is bad taste!

[amarantabuendia80]

he isn't powerfull at all...he looks like a girl...no passion, no energy at all...

[markouditsa]

Evgeni is first in our hurts and has the gold metal.....huge ιnjustice what happend in Vancouver,they stole it from him!!!!

Maria-Greece

[soul416]

Shut the fuck up, he sucks.

[markouditsa]

Evgeni is the first in our hurts.....huge ιnjustice what happend in Vancouver

Maria-Greece

[SVETAfotini]

he s nothing

[soul416]

Whatever you say. You're just pissed because you look like more of a man than PUSSenko, and you're FEMALE.

[SVETAfotini]

Hey i really didn t get what u d just said..hehe,it s ok,don t worry,Likesuchdick is a normal guy,no one is against him in this world! But he ll never be as genial as Pussenko! woooooo!!!

[rochelimit55555]

really cool

[stevesimpson33]

Felicidades campion. Eres lo mejor. Congratulations champ! The country is proud. You've done only what others can dream of doing.

[hermankatnip]

Well done Lysacek.Olympic champion ! You proved there is more to skating than quads

[indiatree]

This is just offered as advice....not criticism. He has got to hold the edges on the entries of his Lutz and flip. His engry edges are borderline in terms of being incorrect. His flip is almost done on an outside edge, and his Lutz entry is not deep enough on the outside edge. In Vancouver. the judges could get very strict with that and it will ruin his scores. He also has to be careful about not rotating too much on the ice on his triple axel takeoff. These could be huge problems.

[faeryquene]

I agree-and unless I'm not mistaken he got nailed for those less stellar jump techniques at Nationals-I hope he's 'cleaned' them up for tonights men's SP. I want all the best men vying for gold at the end of the night. :)

[soul416]

Almost doesn't care and they are a hell of a lot "cleaner" than PUSSenko's - especially when the dude always lands on his toepick.

[OrioleBeagle]

What a funny coincidence! I just realized that fellow Americans Caydee Denney & Jeremy Barrett used the same music as Evan for both their short and long programs!

[sumimimi0]

his opening jump, same as yuna kim.

[signorinakitty]

ke classe! ke eleganza! e quant'è bello!

[snoopyy3k]

WOW!! I did not realize how many Evan haters are out there. Any how.... I think for it being the start of his skating season he did really well. Also considering he won the WC in March and does not seem to have hit rock bottom after such a triumph. Can wait to see these programs at the NC and OG. I'm sure he will tweek them out to perfection. If he skates cleanly and with great presentation, which he is very capable of doing, he has a shot at winning Olympic gold.

[Alekfendi]

To me it's like he's always skating to the same piece of music. Always black...always slow boring performances... but who the hell chooses his musics for him? You should wake up Evan, make us smile, this will have me switch off the telly.

[1dumbbird]

He's a bit too smiley instead of interpreting the music with his face. I love this piece of music but really wasn't inspired by his program. Maybe I've seen too many programs to this...This costume is more masculine than his SP. It's still black like everyone else though. A good start!

[sassystarr]

I think Evan did fine considering this is the start of the season. There are improvements needed. His jumps need to be sharper. I think he is very artistic, I always have loved that about him, however I do agree, this program is a bit lackluster and I expect more from him. He needs to work on this program to build better momentum and excitement. These are the ones that can and will beat him unless he changes a few things: Plushenko, Oda, even Joubert (unless he gets sloppy again)

[sassystarr]

I actually got a chance to see this performance again on television and it looks MUCH better on the TV screen. It was actually a great performance IMO. What you REALLY need to see though is his most recent performance at the Grand Prix Finals. AMAZING!

[elvenlife]

I used to be a huge fan of Evan's...but sorry, this is just sooo boring :( his programs are still the same...

[amandaskater]

Well, I like him so there!

[heyheyheylolita]

Ok I am not a fan of Lysacek. I want to be though. But he has to give me material to believe in him!! And the main thing that bothers me about him is his choice of music. He always takes music that has been done in the past by others and were masterpieces (Bolero, american in paris, sheherazade). So i think the base of the problem is there. And so many music out there!!!!!

[5757anna]

ヨナの曲、真央の振り付けを混ぜたようにみえてなんかさみしい

[yolandaq]

not alot of substance to the program. I know Evan is trying to create an 'olympic moment' with this program but it needs to build to a climax and it doesnt do that effectively.

[citysurfer1]

That comment doesn't even make sense. Lysacek thinks he's going to win gold and it's so pathetic because I can think of about 5 skaters that will demolish him in vancouver including plushenko.

[didiandfamily]

The music isn't perfect, but he need the middle part to breaths, the hand movement distract me the most.

There are rooms to improve.

[SecondPlaceYuya]

His footwork sequences were really nice and went well with the music. Not bad for the first time out this season. I'm not a huge Evan fan, but he is strong here.

[MrAmazingness1234567]

he should be happy with that skate

[sk8ingdreamer]

I wish he didn't do so many twizzles.

[faeryquene]

I think twizzles are point-getters though.

[sk8ingdreamer]

Yeah, that's what I suspected 3 months ago. Actually, I suspected that as soon as the new judging system took into effect. Skaters weren't doing this many twizzles under the old system. It was basically just the ice dancing couples back then doing twizzles. It's beginning to become too much. But what does it matter. Real captivating artistry is very rare in figure skating nowadays. And so many skaters have been choosing terrible music, too. I'll probably stop watching it on TV after Vancouver.

[soul416]

Patently untrue, Yagudin did the all the time, where do you think they got them from?!

[sk8ingdreamer]

You're right, soul416. Alexei Yagudin must have been one of the very few--if not, the only one--who did do difficult footwork we've been familiar with today. But other skaters didn't seem to bother under the the old scoring system because footwork as well as non-jump elements didn't have measurable value. You're right. Anyway, I liked Alexei Yagudin's skating. He could've won more gold medals if he stuck around after 2002.

[Fakeemo24]

This music doesnt suit to him and costumes also! But Anyway I like him!

[dyuo0o]

Only Jumps in program.. and those jumps are poor quality. :(

I hope he would get better

[jeonkiseop]

He is serious flutz guy

[MrAmazingness1234567]

where did you come up with that????

[melannebew]

Awesome start. He was really pounding the triple axel over the summer; glad to see its working. Costumes okay, needs to cover the nipples lol

[DFLHSMUSE18]

He keeps remind me of Yuna Kim's program...Although some brass instrument is added, still I think Scheherazade is a piece more for women.

However, overall performance of Evan was nice and enjoyable!

[jacquesjapan]

He needs another musical choice and a different costume-either something really masculine or on the opposite end, something more sexy/ edgy. This is very underwhelming...

Agree with what flyfrog1362 said as well.

[citysurfer1]

I think his costume probably looks overdone on TV, but to judges and live audience, it's probably not so over the top. Also yu na's version is like a million times better and although his is good, I bet people will unavoidably compare them.

[turckhater]

...which they shouldn't do because he and Kim are COMPLETELY different skaters. I'd like to see her do a men's long program, complete with the over-emphasis on the stupid quad.

[citysurfer1]

If he wants to win gold, he's going to need to step it up to compete against plushenko. It doesn't matter how artistic he thinks he is, he will lose out on technical #. He has great lines and presentation, but not enough jumping. Also, does he think he's michelle kwan or yu na kim with the music. Weird

[ArtemisDianaSelene]

He wouldn't be able to win against Plushenko even if his jumps were better.

[desglacons]

Poor jump technique on the flip and axel (which are not 3 axels at all).

He is quite the gamine....

[Satellitegirl41]

I really like this program....he has a lot more fluidity than we usually see from him. Looks good.

[nondescriptnyc]

I this program had great potential, and I am so happy to see that Evan is in good shape.

pspruce18: Actually, Frank Carroll and Scheherazade go all the way back to 1976--when her had Linda Fratianne skate to it.

stefrevollo: How about John Curry's Scheherazade? I thought that was considered one of the best programs of all times.

Also

[pspruce18]

He's such a great skater...I still think that in his case less would be more....no gloves, no frills...just a clean look...I'm a little disappointed in the musical selection...he rehashes a lot of Kwans music....but, nonetheless, still love him and hope he challenges for gold at Vancouver...he definitely deserves it.

[lauramariful]

His back is quite rigid in the step sequence.

[flyfog1362]

An improvement with his arms, there was less flailing. Hopefully this is permanent. Really what almost every singles skater needs is more tension in their arm movements. It has to come from the back instead of the shoulder, adding some dynamics instead of flowing from one place to another with no real light or shade.

Couldn't the zipper have been put at the side? It's really distracting down the middle of his back, unless that's what they were going for.

[stefrevollo]

Never seen a man skating to Sheherazade before but why not?

His costume is ridiculous with those plums on the shoulders, gee...

Good choreography but the jumps are still tiny and borderline...

[flyfog1362]

I think John Curry did at one point.

[stefrevollo]

I can imagine, I was talking in the past 20 years or so...