@1culture1 Yep, or challenge Dr. Finkelstein personally. Like in the Q&A period. He always invites 'dissenters' to ask the first questions. Few lately come forward because that means defending unjustifiable policies and debunked lies.
The semetic Palestinian Arabs have lived in this land for thousands of years. The UN was founded in 1945, how can they have any legality to 'give' this land to someone else?
The semetic Palestinian Arabs have lived in this land for thousands of years. The UN was founded in 1945, how can they have any legality to 'give' this land to someone else?
funny how he never presents facts, only claims about the historical record.
btw finkelstein doesnt say the right of return is uncontroversial bc of 194 only, but also bc of the Universal Declaration of HR article 13, the point of view amongst HR organisations, and general opinion among scholars... this guy, hillels, has no credibility whatsoever and never documents his claims
There were over 700000 Palestinians clensed from there homes in 48.
THe Aphartide is refered to in the Occupied Territories. THe Illegal settlers are only 2 percent of the population there and they enjoy everything that is denyed the occupied people.
Why don't you turds send someone TO DEBATE Finkelstein? Know why? Because he'd kick your damn asses!! Better stick to posting dumbass videos on YouTube.
Hahaha! Because the Palestinians are supposedly unwilling to return and "live in peace," then Israel can simply deny them the right to return. This douchebag sounds like a lawyer. FAIL
So let me get this straight. According to Hillel the Arab right of return is extremely controversial. However, Israel is so kind and nice that they offered to grant at least 100,000 of them this right to settle back in their land but the evil Arabs said no we will not allow this we want them to be permanent refugees! So the controversy is that Israel recognizes the right but the Arabs don't? Are you serious? This is your argument?
HA HA HA AH A AHAHA AHA - Even better - They have a governement, so they're not Israelis...
The Government are being boycotted by Israel.
If Palestine is an independent state with its own Government, why are the Israeli forces IN there country? Is there a formal declaration of war between the State of Palestine and the State of Israel? Where is the frontline? Along the border? Oh. Where are the borders....?
salute to Dr. Finkelstein. We need more jews with conscious like him and tony judt and judith butler to come out and to put a stop to defaming the jews by the ziofascist
Israel legalized torture in 1997. In 2001, Israel dropped a 1 ton bomb on a densely populated civilian neighborhood. Israel and the US are the only two countries who vote "no" EVERY YEAR" on a UN resolution calling on all nations to denounce terrorism.
Israel and the US are the ONLY UN member countries who vote "no" on a 2 state solution along the 1967 borders. Again, research mainstream sources like Amnesty Intl., and Human Rights Watch for the truth.
What does the year 638 have to do w/anything? Are you prepared to give up your home and land due to the conquest of european forces on indigenous natives who resided in what is now the United States? Maybe, in accord w/ your analogy, we should re-align the planet as it was 2000 years ago. That is rational.
By US state dept.definition, both the US an Israel are terrorist states.And so are those too who support and engage in terror against the state of Israel. No sane person endorses terrorism. However, it is crucial to expose the grievances which create a reservoir of sympathy for terror and murder. This is where Israel and the US are both accountable, for in the case of the ILLEGAL occupation of palestine(WORLD COURT DECISION 2001), Israel has no right to 1 iota of the occupied territories.
Dear nilesmoney, are you referring to the ICJ decision against Israel's security fence? That's quite a leap to "occupation of Palestine". Who was Palestine's President in 1967 and who was its UN representative?
Incidentally, Palestine was home to Jews two thousand years before the first Arab set foot there in 638 as part of an imperial conquest.
No, the ICJ decision on the security fence is in 2004. The world court decision from 2000 states that Israel has no right ro ANY(not one inch) of the now occupied territories since it was aquired as a result of the 1967 war, which is a violation of international law. This is not in dispute. Again, annually, the entire UN general assembly votes in favor of a Palestinian State on the June 1967 border.The only 2 countries that vote "no" on this are the US and Israel. Does this happen, or not?
Yes it was. And as soon as it began a monstrous campaign of agression, it was done in by the allies forces in WWII. In this case, over the last 25 years, it has been Israel who has continually invaded and occuopied Lebanon, and in this aspect, I support any govt. who resist agression and oppression of a sovereign state.And who is it that contends Hezbollah is not the govt. of Lebanon?
By the way, Hezbollah is a democrarically elected govt. It is moot whether I support them or not. The fight here is for self-determination, not govt. of your choosing.
The last time I checked, Hamas was not a government, but a political party within Lebanon (aside from having terror cells inside Gaza). Of course, some would contend that Hezbollah is the de facto "government" of southern Lebanon. As for their being "democratically elected", I must remind you that the Nazi party was "democratically" elected in 1933 in Germany.
You do have power and propoganda on your side, and I realize that force is real. But, the truth always floats to the top. It merely takes honest information. Thankfully, this process is in motion.
I know you were there. I've heard you ask questions. Incidentally, is it troubling that recently released israeli documents expose the long standing mistruths about the occupation. Why is Israel one of 3 countries on the planet whoo annually "no" votes a UN resolution for all countries to oppose terrorism? Oh yeah, the last paragraph of the resoltion allows all occupied countries to resist and fight for independence. Yours is a losing battle.
I own this talk, and at no time does Finkelstein, a realist on the resolution of this conflict, promote the right of return. Also, the facts you expouse have been exposed a hoax and are no longer allowed in any college texts, and the book this rhetoric was lifted from, FROM TIME IMMEMORIAL, was pulled from print in the UK after Finkelstein exposed it in the 80's. All the truth is available at the sturdy mainstream sources, Amnesty International, and Human Right Watch, unless Amnesty is lying?
Sorry to disabuse you of your idol worship(incidentally, if Norman were promoting the "right of return",would you have a problem with that?), but Norman said in person at a Brandeis event two years ago that he supported the Palestinian "right of return." I never mentioned From Time Immemorial, and so what does that have to do with the allegations made in the short video? You're probably also denying his support for Hezbollah. Are you also a 9/11 Truther?
If it is the arab world who wishes Israel off the face of the Earth, then why is it Israel who overwhelmingly invades and occupies it's neighbors including Lebanon for the last 25 years. A UN resolution is brought to a vote every year which resolves to settle the the conflict w/ a 2 state solution on the 1967 border. This is vetoes by only 2 countries in the entire UN. The US and Israel. The truth is available through Amnesty International, Human Right Watch,and Israeli Human Rights Records.
I beg to differ. I suppose you agree that in 1948 the newly UN endorsed nation of Israel invaded 5 arab countries, right? Or that in 1967, Nasser's Egypt did not expel UN peacekeepers from the Sinai or close off the Straits of Tiran, a casus bellum according to international law, right?
It is a clear cut violation of international to acquire territory by war. The world (a conservative body) has ruled against Israel on EVERY count of the indictment against them. This is an Israeli dilemna as with the record of torture recently available through declassified Israeli documents, a majority of American jews do not favor Israli policy any longer. No serious person supports aggression and violence on either side, but thank god the record is there and VERY TRANSPARENT.
Unlike the Kingdom of Jordan which acquired (and annexed) the West Bank in 1948, Israel views that region as "disputed" and has not (although it is within its international rights to do so since territory acquired in defense of its existence is recognized under international law). If one applied your standards of territoriality, no nation on earth (with the possible exception of Lichtenstein) would be legitimate.
Sir, I don't know if it is delusion you suffer from, and I hope so, but all of these propagandized arguments you submit have already fallen apart. I do ask ,however, what is your reaction to the World Court decision that ruled this is a clear violation of international law? How do you quell the reportings of human rights watch, and Amnesty International? I suppose these groups are lying about the brutal occupation. Terror of any kind is reprehensible. Israel,and the US are terror states.
I certainly hope that none of this crazed information was taken from Time Immeroial, a collection of distortion and outright fabrication so silly, it was pulled from publication after being exposed in the UK. Anyone reading this and interested in the truth can simply google the World Copurt decision, Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch, and Israel's own mainstream human right agencies to see the truth, at which time all of the Israeli victim nonsense simply falls apart.
Israel has been an agent of murder in an illegal occupation of Palestine for decades. The entire world is in favor of a 2 state solution except for the US and Israel.Don't take my word for it. Do the research yourself. This narrative dirvel is filth.
I wish normal everyday Jews would realize that the actions of Israel, AIPAC, ADL et al. are hurting them so bad. They're creating antisemitism by calling everyone an antisemite. And there encouraging conspiracy theories by lying and suppressing debate.
The idea that Carter is Finkelstein's mentor is ludicrous. The assumption made here that "Carter as mentor" is necessarily a bad thing is just plain ignorant. Hasbara video propagandists may continue trying to spread ignorance about the problem in Palestine, but the historical record is clear. Finkelstein knows this historical record better than anyone alive. In the end the pen is always mightier than the sword.
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
A cheap demogogue and scoundrel exposed. Bravo! Thank goodness he was not given tenure. He should never have been given a teaching job to begin with. Perhaps Hamas or Hezbollah will offer this shmuck a job.
Regarding the second point of this video, Finkelstein explicitly refers to "the current situation in the occupied territories". He is not talking about the state of Israel, but the situation being imposed upon the Palestinian peoples of the West Bank through military occupation BY Israel. It is this context, this situation, which resembles the apartheid conditions of pre-Mandela South Africa, not the situation within the legally defined State of Israel.
Israel has the right to take necessary security measures in the territories, while "final status negotiations" are pending. The security fence (only 10% is concrete wall) was built only when Palestinian violence reached unprecedented levels in 2002. It is an unfortunate and damaging measure, but it saves lives. Incidentally, there are also Israeli settlers who have been negatively affected by the fence.
So the situation in the West Bank cannot be apartheid, because the fence adversely affects Israelis as well as Palestinians. A Palestinian non-terrorist has nothing to fear from security fences and roadblocks. Also, Palestinians in the West Bank/Gaza can vote in PA elections. Apartheid in SA was completely enshrined in its political institutions. There's no comparison.
The Israelis expelled had somewhere to go ... and yes, Israel was a super-power. Palestinians were a people conquered by the Ottomans and the British. This was not fulfillment of prophecy - Palestinians were helpless and the statistics prove it. Besides, defending your land is not a war-crime - International Law recognizes every persons right to defend their own land.
Of course, it's different. Now why doesn't the international community require Canada to provide health care to Mexico. Oh, I guess it's because Mexicans aren't Canadians.
Terror suspects who (allegedly) knocked down the Twin Towers get free health care, dental care and eye-care ... the people who ran to the scene to look for survivors of the Twin Towers get nothing.
Why are Gitmo detainees - the worst of the worst terrorists - given better care than American citizens ? Reagan was a long time ago - is it still a sin to be poor in America ?
About the first part, while the surrounding Arab countries might have rejected that 48 offer by the Israelis, Israel just rejected an offer by the Arab League that wanted the same: Right of Return & a Palestinian state in exchange for normal diplomatic relations. Or look at the 2002 Saudi peace plan. That's not 60 years ago but it happened in the last 5 years. Why did Israel reject that? Are they less willing now to let the refugees return?
As for the second part of your video, Finkelstein refers to "the obvious analogy to what Israel is doing *in the occupied territories*", not to what is happening inside of Israel. Carter's book too is called "Palestine: Peace not Apartheid", not "Israel: Peace not Apartheid". Obviously the situation of Arabs inside Israel is different.
The Saudi plan admits not only the original refugees, but the 3.7 million additional descendants of the original: The intent is clear - to disestablish Israel as a Jewish state. Why didn't the arab league reciprocate with Jewish repatriation?
That says quite a lot about Israel's priorities though if its Jewish identity is more important to it than the legitimate rights of the refugees, don't you think?
Yes, the Jewish refugees have a right of return as well, maybe such a swap would be interesting - though unlikely. Still, there's a difference between the Jewish and the Arab refugees: The Jews who fled in 48 are a lot better off now than the Arabs who did the same and most Jews likely don't want to return now anyway.
Precisely. Why are the Jews better off? Because their brothers and sisters took care of them. The Arabs, on the other hand, kept their refugees in squalor deliberately to this day. Would you want to return to a fascist state?
Then why do you bring up the Jewish right of return in the first place?
You say that if the Arab states don't want the Palestinians to return, they are keeping them in squalor (which indeed they are) and if they do want them to return, they only do so to disestablish Israel as a Jewish state - what do you suggest they do then?
So, for those keeping track at home, Israel makes millions homeless without remorse and now has a problem allowing their DESCENDANTS to return ? That spin conveniently confuses polity (people) and territory (land title). We allow Israelis to return to the MidEast after 1,500 years, but Israel gets constipated about allowing Palestinians (made homeless by Zionism) to return after a few decades. Hypocrites !
"Millions homeless?" Check with the Arab Higher Committee who made 500,000 homeless by launching a war of extermination in May of 1948. And since when do you "allow" Jews to live in their aboriginal homeland. Mighty presumptuous of you. Perhaps you "permitted" Zulus to live in S. Africa?
I'm talking about the point where the entrenched powers decide to recognize a map showing NO boundaries and NO people rather than drawing lines that reflect or mirror the reality on the ground. Dynasties practice Geo-Politics, so they are the ALLOWERS, kinda Bush is a DECIDER.
If Israel is so up-front about how they deal with innocent Palestinians, whose lands they stole and whose relatives they killed. If your view is mainstream, then why did the UN condemn Israel 100x with a vote of 160-3 ? Israel needs to recognize its neighbours and treat its minority fairly - or face a reciprocal altruism from the International Community.
Why did the international community tacitly consign 800,000 Rwandans to genocide, 2 million Sudanese to the same and appoint Sudan among others to their Human Rights Council? Don't put too much moral faith in the UN.
... because Internationalism is a charrade (anyone recall what class warriors donated the building in New York ? same folks who said, "I want workers, not thinkers" when the commoners wanted Public School) Internationalism is simply a fig-leaf for Imperialism.
Time to leap into the 21st century. Imperialism began in the 7th century with the annexation of Spain by the Ummayads. It's coming again straight out of that century.
Imperialism is an advanced form of capitalism, characterized by ignoring land divisions. In the case of the New World, it's a process of de-territorializing, then re-territorializing. In the Old World & Africa the preferred method for the past 500yrs has been : Divide & Quit.
There were alot more than 100,000 refugees, so agreeing to UNR194 would have disenfranchised at least a half million Palestinians. I steal $100 from you and offer you $10. Arab States had no right to speak for Palestinians anyways. Apartheid shoe fits - Israel must wear it until their leaders abandon the fantasy of Zionism (Jewish State from Cairo to Baghdad) and develop a conscience.
100,000 was the initial offer by the Ben Gurion government. Considering the fact that 0 Jewish refugees were offered repatriation by the 22 arab states, that's a no brainer. 100,000 isn't bad for a bad, apartheid state, is it?
lucky for us we can demonstrate how dummies like you write nonsense about unarmed when there are over 10,000,000 pictures disproving this pointless propaganda you still spread.
1mil or so (give or take) Jewish refugees expelled by force from arab lands v UP TO 600,000 palestinians many of which left from fear rather than were forced in any way. Now you expect Israel to simply accept 5m arabs. No. We're full from the all the Jews Arabs ethnically cleansed.
@ hillels
why do you de-construct Finkelstein on a video instead of having a face to face debate like Dershowitz had with him?
If your arguments were so strong you shouldn't hide behind a camera.
That would be more convincing to people like us who look at reality in its fullness rather than in fading versions of it.
1culture1 1 year ago
@1culture1 Yep, or challenge Dr. Finkelstein personally. Like in the Q&A period. He always invites 'dissenters' to ask the first questions. Few lately come forward because that means defending unjustifiable policies and debunked lies.
Redcarpet01 3 months ago
The semetic Palestinian Arabs have lived in this land for thousands of years. The UN was founded in 1945, how can they have any legality to 'give' this land to someone else?
darkknight17 1 year ago
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The semetic Palestinian Arabs have lived in this land for thousands of years. The UN was founded in 1945, how can they have any legality to 'give' this land to someone else?
darkknight17 1 year ago
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darkknight17 1 year ago
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darkknight17 1 year ago
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darkknight17 1 year ago
Why bother with Finkelstein? He is an attack dog without an iota of credibility.
1kkyu 2 years ago
funny how he never presents facts, only claims about the historical record.
btw finkelstein doesnt say the right of return is uncontroversial bc of 194 only, but also bc of the Universal Declaration of HR article 13, the point of view amongst HR organisations, and general opinion among scholars... this guy, hillels, has no credibility whatsoever and never documents his claims
phornuphto 2 years ago
There were over 700000 Palestinians clensed from there homes in 48.
THe Aphartide is refered to in the Occupied Territories. THe Illegal settlers are only 2 percent of the population there and they enjoy everything that is denyed the occupied people.
This narrator is ignorant as fuck.
genYprogressive 2 years ago
Why don't you turds send someone TO DEBATE Finkelstein? Know why? Because he'd kick your damn asses!! Better stick to posting dumbass videos on YouTube.
Katin11 3 years ago 10
Hahaha! Because the Palestinians are supposedly unwilling to return and "live in peace," then Israel can simply deny them the right to return. This douchebag sounds like a lawyer. FAIL
Katin11 3 years ago 2
@Katin11 Well said! Agreed 100%
darkknight17 1 year ago
Bla Bla Bla...this commenter sucks..
buffyguy10 3 years ago
So let me get this straight. According to Hillel the Arab right of return is extremely controversial. However, Israel is so kind and nice that they offered to grant at least 100,000 of them this right to settle back in their land but the evil Arabs said no we will not allow this we want them to be permanent refugees! So the controversy is that Israel recognizes the right but the Arabs don't? Are you serious? This is your argument?
robnaro 3 years ago
Blablabla,blablablabla.....
bkh72 3 years ago
Hillels fails.
Arjuna1901 3 years ago 2
wtf, u know anything about int law? dum ass
Reptile0000 3 years ago
This Judeo-Nazi voice-over is a real slime-bag.
helenbransgrove 3 years ago 4
that was weak as hell.
thewiffenpoof 3 years ago
HA HA HA AH A AHAHA AHA - Even better - They have a governement, so they're not Israelis...
The Government are being boycotted by Israel.
If Palestine is an independent state with its own Government, why are the Israeli forces IN there country? Is there a formal declaration of war between the State of Palestine and the State of Israel? Where is the frontline? Along the border? Oh. Where are the borders....?
calorus 3 years ago 2
hillels, go get a grip.
MaxFriedman 3 years ago 2
disgusting cheap hitpiece. whoever you are, "hillels". and respect to norman finkelstein.
trycoun 3 years ago 4
salute to Dr. Finkelstein. We need more jews with conscious like him and tony judt and judith butler to come out and to put a stop to defaming the jews by the ziofascist
a0sn 3 years ago 4
Israel legalized torture in 1997. In 2001, Israel dropped a 1 ton bomb on a densely populated civilian neighborhood. Israel and the US are the only two countries who vote "no" EVERY YEAR" on a UN resolution calling on all nations to denounce terrorism.
Israel and the US are the ONLY UN member countries who vote "no" on a 2 state solution along the 1967 borders. Again, research mainstream sources like Amnesty Intl., and Human Rights Watch for the truth.
nilesmoney 3 years ago 7
What does the year 638 have to do w/anything? Are you prepared to give up your home and land due to the conquest of european forces on indigenous natives who resided in what is now the United States? Maybe, in accord w/ your analogy, we should re-align the planet as it was 2000 years ago. That is rational.
nilesmoney 3 years ago 3
By US state dept.definition, both the US an Israel are terrorist states.And so are those too who support and engage in terror against the state of Israel. No sane person endorses terrorism. However, it is crucial to expose the grievances which create a reservoir of sympathy for terror and murder. This is where Israel and the US are both accountable, for in the case of the ILLEGAL occupation of palestine(WORLD COURT DECISION 2001), Israel has no right to 1 iota of the occupied territories.
nilesmoney 3 years ago 6
Dear nilesmoney, are you referring to the ICJ decision against Israel's security fence? That's quite a leap to "occupation of Palestine". Who was Palestine's President in 1967 and who was its UN representative?
Incidentally, Palestine was home to Jews two thousand years before the first Arab set foot there in 638 as part of an imperial conquest.
hillels 3 years ago
No, the ICJ decision on the security fence is in 2004. The world court decision from 2000 states that Israel has no right ro ANY(not one inch) of the now occupied territories since it was aquired as a result of the 1967 war, which is a violation of international law. This is not in dispute. Again, annually, the entire UN general assembly votes in favor of a Palestinian State on the June 1967 border.The only 2 countries that vote "no" on this are the US and Israel. Does this happen, or not?
nilesmoney 3 years ago 3
Yes it was. And as soon as it began a monstrous campaign of agression, it was done in by the allies forces in WWII. In this case, over the last 25 years, it has been Israel who has continually invaded and occuopied Lebanon, and in this aspect, I support any govt. who resist agression and oppression of a sovereign state.And who is it that contends Hezbollah is not the govt. of Lebanon?
nilesmoney 3 years ago
By the way, Hezbollah is a democrarically elected govt. It is moot whether I support them or not. The fight here is for self-determination, not govt. of your choosing.
nilesmoney 3 years ago
The last time I checked, Hamas was not a government, but a political party within Lebanon (aside from having terror cells inside Gaza). Of course, some would contend that Hezbollah is the de facto "government" of southern Lebanon. As for their being "democratically elected", I must remind you that the Nazi party was "democratically" elected in 1933 in Germany.
hillels 3 years ago
You do have power and propoganda on your side, and I realize that force is real. But, the truth always floats to the top. It merely takes honest information. Thankfully, this process is in motion.
nilesmoney 3 years ago
I know you were there. I've heard you ask questions. Incidentally, is it troubling that recently released israeli documents expose the long standing mistruths about the occupation. Why is Israel one of 3 countries on the planet whoo annually "no" votes a UN resolution for all countries to oppose terrorism? Oh yeah, the last paragraph of the resoltion allows all occupied countries to resist and fight for independence. Yours is a losing battle.
nilesmoney 3 years ago
I own this talk, and at no time does Finkelstein, a realist on the resolution of this conflict, promote the right of return. Also, the facts you expouse have been exposed a hoax and are no longer allowed in any college texts, and the book this rhetoric was lifted from, FROM TIME IMMEMORIAL, was pulled from print in the UK after Finkelstein exposed it in the 80's. All the truth is available at the sturdy mainstream sources, Amnesty International, and Human Right Watch, unless Amnesty is lying?
nilesmoney 3 years ago
Sorry to disabuse you of your idol worship(incidentally, if Norman were promoting the "right of return",would you have a problem with that?), but Norman said in person at a Brandeis event two years ago that he supported the Palestinian "right of return." I never mentioned From Time Immemorial, and so what does that have to do with the allegations made in the short video? You're probably also denying his support for Hezbollah. Are you also a 9/11 Truther?
hillels 3 years ago
If it is the arab world who wishes Israel off the face of the Earth, then why is it Israel who overwhelmingly invades and occupies it's neighbors including Lebanon for the last 25 years. A UN resolution is brought to a vote every year which resolves to settle the the conflict w/ a 2 state solution on the 1967 border. This is vetoes by only 2 countries in the entire UN. The US and Israel. The truth is available through Amnesty International, Human Right Watch,and Israeli Human Rights Records.
nilesmoney 3 years ago
I beg to differ. I suppose you agree that in 1948 the newly UN endorsed nation of Israel invaded 5 arab countries, right? Or that in 1967, Nasser's Egypt did not expel UN peacekeepers from the Sinai or close off the Straits of Tiran, a casus bellum according to international law, right?
hillels 3 years ago
It is a clear cut violation of international to acquire territory by war. The world (a conservative body) has ruled against Israel on EVERY count of the indictment against them. This is an Israeli dilemna as with the record of torture recently available through declassified Israeli documents, a majority of American jews do not favor Israli policy any longer. No serious person supports aggression and violence on either side, but thank god the record is there and VERY TRANSPARENT.
nilesmoney 3 years ago
Unlike the Kingdom of Jordan which acquired (and annexed) the West Bank in 1948, Israel views that region as "disputed" and has not (although it is within its international rights to do so since territory acquired in defense of its existence is recognized under international law). If one applied your standards of territoriality, no nation on earth (with the possible exception of Lichtenstein) would be legitimate.
hillels 3 years ago
Sir, I don't know if it is delusion you suffer from, and I hope so, but all of these propagandized arguments you submit have already fallen apart. I do ask ,however, what is your reaction to the World Court decision that ruled this is a clear violation of international law? How do you quell the reportings of human rights watch, and Amnesty International? I suppose these groups are lying about the brutal occupation. Terror of any kind is reprehensible. Israel,and the US are terror states.
nilesmoney 3 years ago
I certainly hope that none of this crazed information was taken from Time Immeroial, a collection of distortion and outright fabrication so silly, it was pulled from publication after being exposed in the UK. Anyone reading this and interested in the truth can simply google the World Copurt decision, Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch, and Israel's own mainstream human right agencies to see the truth, at which time all of the Israeli victim nonsense simply falls apart.
nilesmoney 3 years ago
Israel has been an agent of murder in an illegal occupation of Palestine for decades. The entire world is in favor of a 2 state solution except for the US and Israel.Don't take my word for it. Do the research yourself. This narrative dirvel is filth.
nilesmoney 3 years ago
blah, blah, Zionists (note: not all encompasing of the peoples that are Jews) are ripping off the Arabs.
T - H - I - E - V - S
chewbaca1989 4 years ago
so why did you not choose a deserted area in africa or somewhere else? why did you want so bad an area already densily populated?
is it like that simple: wipe out palestine of its arabic population?
aktal 4 years ago
I suggest Peace, Propaganda, and the Promised Land, as well as Occupation 101 if you want a documentary that will tell you what's really going on.
pobasted 4 years ago 2
I wish normal everyday Jews would realize that the actions of Israel, AIPAC, ADL et al. are hurting them so bad. They're creating antisemitism by calling everyone an antisemite. And there encouraging conspiracy theories by lying and suppressing debate.
pobasted 4 years ago 4
The idea that Carter is Finkelstein's mentor is ludicrous. The assumption made here that "Carter as mentor" is necessarily a bad thing is just plain ignorant. Hasbara video propagandists may continue trying to spread ignorance about the problem in Palestine, but the historical record is clear. Finkelstein knows this historical record better than anyone alive. In the end the pen is always mightier than the sword.
7271961 4 years ago 2
This is crap...
YaLibnanTV 4 years ago 3
This comment has received too many negative votes show
A cheap demogogue and scoundrel exposed. Bravo! Thank goodness he was not given tenure. He should never have been given a teaching job to begin with. Perhaps Hamas or Hezbollah will offer this shmuck a job.
Amerizionist 4 years ago
Regarding the second point of this video, Finkelstein explicitly refers to "the current situation in the occupied territories". He is not talking about the state of Israel, but the situation being imposed upon the Palestinian peoples of the West Bank through military occupation BY Israel. It is this context, this situation, which resembles the apartheid conditions of pre-Mandela South Africa, not the situation within the legally defined State of Israel.
HugoNewman 4 years ago 3
Israel has the right to take necessary security measures in the territories, while "final status negotiations" are pending. The security fence (only 10% is concrete wall) was built only when Palestinian violence reached unprecedented levels in 2002. It is an unfortunate and damaging measure, but it saves lives. Incidentally, there are also Israeli settlers who have been negatively affected by the fence.
corcman19 4 years ago
So the situation in the West Bank cannot be apartheid, because the fence adversely affects Israelis as well as Palestinians. A Palestinian non-terrorist has nothing to fear from security fences and roadblocks. Also, Palestinians in the West Bank/Gaza can vote in PA elections. Apartheid in SA was completely enshrined in its political institutions. There's no comparison.
corcman19 4 years ago
The Israelis expelled had somewhere to go ... and yes, Israel was a super-power. Palestinians were a people conquered by the Ottomans and the British. This was not fulfillment of prophecy - Palestinians were helpless and the statistics prove it. Besides, defending your land is not a war-crime - International Law recognizes every persons right to defend their own land.
4449911 4 years ago 2
Why ? Because of hypocrisy. 1,500yr old Jewish right of return versus 40yr or 60yr old Palestinian right of return.
4449911 4 years ago
Of course, it's different. Now why doesn't the international community require Canada to provide health care to Mexico. Oh, I guess it's because Mexicans aren't Canadians.
hillels 4 years ago
But Canada doesn't occupy Mexico...
DoJaenin 4 years ago
Terror suspects who (allegedly) knocked down the Twin Towers get free health care, dental care and eye-care ... the people who ran to the scene to look for survivors of the Twin Towers get nothing.
4449911 4 years ago
Wrong on the second count, but let's not get bogged down in reality. Orient yourself back to the point and we'll debate economic determinism later.
hillels 4 years ago
Why are Gitmo detainees - the worst of the worst terrorists - given better care than American citizens ? Reagan was a long time ago - is it still a sin to be poor in America ?
4449911 4 years ago
So you'd rather be an inmate in Gitmo than a US-citizen?
DoJaenin 4 years ago
About the first part, while the surrounding Arab countries might have rejected that 48 offer by the Israelis, Israel just rejected an offer by the Arab League that wanted the same: Right of Return & a Palestinian state in exchange for normal diplomatic relations. Or look at the 2002 Saudi peace plan. That's not 60 years ago but it happened in the last 5 years. Why did Israel reject that? Are they less willing now to let the refugees return?
DoJaenin 4 years ago
As for the second part of your video, Finkelstein refers to "the obvious analogy to what Israel is doing *in the occupied territories*", not to what is happening inside of Israel. Carter's book too is called "Palestine: Peace not Apartheid", not "Israel: Peace not Apartheid". Obviously the situation of Arabs inside Israel is different.
DoJaenin 4 years ago
The Saudi plan admits not only the original refugees, but the 3.7 million additional descendants of the original: The intent is clear - to disestablish Israel as a Jewish state. Why didn't the arab league reciprocate with Jewish repatriation?
hillels 4 years ago
That says quite a lot about Israel's priorities though if its Jewish identity is more important to it than the legitimate rights of the refugees, don't you think?
Yes, the Jewish refugees have a right of return as well, maybe such a swap would be interesting - though unlikely. Still, there's a difference between the Jewish and the Arab refugees: The Jews who fled in 48 are a lot better off now than the Arabs who did the same and most Jews likely don't want to return now anyway.
DoJaenin 4 years ago
Precisely. Why are the Jews better off? Because their brothers and sisters took care of them. The Arabs, on the other hand, kept their refugees in squalor deliberately to this day. Would you want to return to a fascist state?
hillels 4 years ago
Then why do you bring up the Jewish right of return in the first place?
You say that if the Arab states don't want the Palestinians to return, they are keeping them in squalor (which indeed they are) and if they do want them to return, they only do so to disestablish Israel as a Jewish state - what do you suggest they do then?
DoJaenin 4 years ago
So, for those keeping track at home, Israel makes millions homeless without remorse and now has a problem allowing their DESCENDANTS to return ? That spin conveniently confuses polity (people) and territory (land title). We allow Israelis to return to the MidEast after 1,500 years, but Israel gets constipated about allowing Palestinians (made homeless by Zionism) to return after a few decades. Hypocrites !
4449911 4 years ago
"Millions homeless?" Check with the Arab Higher Committee who made 500,000 homeless by launching a war of extermination in May of 1948. And since when do you "allow" Jews to live in their aboriginal homeland. Mighty presumptuous of you. Perhaps you "permitted" Zulus to live in S. Africa?
hillels 4 years ago
I'm talking about the point where the entrenched powers decide to recognize a map showing NO boundaries and NO people rather than drawing lines that reflect or mirror the reality on the ground. Dynasties practice Geo-Politics, so they are the ALLOWERS, kinda Bush is a DECIDER.
Shaka Zulu :-)
4449911 4 years ago
If Israel is so up-front about how they deal with innocent Palestinians, whose lands they stole and whose relatives they killed. If your view is mainstream, then why did the UN condemn Israel 100x with a vote of 160-3 ? Israel needs to recognize its neighbours and treat its minority fairly - or face a reciprocal altruism from the International Community.
4449911 4 years ago
Why did the international community tacitly consign 800,000 Rwandans to genocide, 2 million Sudanese to the same and appoint Sudan among others to their Human Rights Council? Don't put too much moral faith in the UN.
hillels 4 years ago
... because Internationalism is a charrade (anyone recall what class warriors donated the building in New York ? same folks who said, "I want workers, not thinkers" when the commoners wanted Public School) Internationalism is simply a fig-leaf for Imperialism.
4449911 4 years ago
Time to leap into the 21st century. Imperialism began in the 7th century with the annexation of Spain by the Ummayads. It's coming again straight out of that century.
hillels 4 years ago
Imperialism is an advanced form of capitalism, characterized by ignoring land divisions. In the case of the New World, it's a process of de-territorializing, then re-territorializing. In the Old World & Africa the preferred method for the past 500yrs has been : Divide & Quit.
4449911 4 years ago
There were alot more than 100,000 refugees, so agreeing to UNR194 would have disenfranchised at least a half million Palestinians. I steal $100 from you and offer you $10. Arab States had no right to speak for Palestinians anyways. Apartheid shoe fits - Israel must wear it until their leaders abandon the fantasy of Zionism (Jewish State from Cairo to Baghdad) and develop a conscience.
4449911 4 years ago
100,000 was the initial offer by the Ben Gurion government. Considering the fact that 0 Jewish refugees were offered repatriation by the 22 arab states, that's a no brainer. 100,000 isn't bad for a bad, apartheid state, is it?
hillels 4 years ago
Lucky for the Israelis, they were (and still are) a military super-power shooting at unarmed civilians ...
4449911 4 years ago
lucky for us we can demonstrate how dummies like you write nonsense about unarmed when there are over 10,000,000 pictures disproving this pointless propaganda you still spread.
1mil or so (give or take) Jewish refugees expelled by force from arab lands v UP TO 600,000 palestinians many of which left from fear rather than were forced in any way. Now you expect Israel to simply accept 5m arabs. No. We're full from the all the Jews Arabs ethnically cleansed.
rulllar 4 years ago