but isnt our problem also that us people think our troops are there for xyz reasons but the us establishment are actually doing their thing from a quite different [and probably criminal] set of reasons? its got to be sorted out. afghanistan like every islamic country is vile. but so are our political leaders. nobody cared about women/freedom in islam before so i dont care for the crocodile tears now. news is they finally got bin lid but wheres the corpse?? ten years to get one man?
You may say this is not a well thought out tactic... but more troops, with more troops there can be more helicopters, more artillery, more "things" to kill the enemy... so they don't kill you.
I believe what we are doing is right, but if we really are combating terrorism then we ned a global approach, committing all of our forces in Afghanistan, Pakistan, Yemen, and many more terrorist "hubs"
You're seriously awesome. I am kind of comment-stalking your videos, but its so rare to find someone sensible and informed about politics and all that. I think we should be in Afghanistan. The US media switched to Anti-War viewpoints almost immediately after pushing for everyone to go to war, manipulative bastards. If we pull out Afghanistan is not going to get any better. Abuse of women and misinformation as well as religious propaganda will all still exist. I think thats why we should stay.
No way is it that simple. They would have realized war meant death, war is built on death. The media just realized they could get their hands on sob stories from the families who lost people in the war with Afghanistan (which is really terrible) and went with that tearjerker. The media doesn't care all that much about conveying a rationalized story.
@Saneblueberry Hell yeah man. Freakin media, I swear... it's the reason why so many people think we went to the middle east for oil and that we "lost" vietnam.
Well Im An Afghan. We (Afghans) have So Many Problems Going On In Our country that in some ways having naito forces that "accidentaly" Bomb the Innocent and Poor REALLY Doesnt Help. I Think You Right The British do need to make it clear the exact reason the are there and what they intend to do. sending young and foolish troupes that make abuse poor and hungry children on the streets!! what do they think will happen the Afghans will just shrug it off and not do anything.
we can't win. its a fact, the best we can do is make it look like we've won and pull out quickly before it all starts to go pear-shaped which it inevitably will and then watch afghanistan revert to its norm. having said that, even making it look like we've won will be tricky cos the ANA are so shite.
but more on topic; the situation in afghanistan needs help, I think we should be there to help them govern themselves although I'm not sure if that's the true reason why we are there. I'm not very informed on this at the minute though but that's what I gather from the tidbits I've read.
Pull our forces out of Afghanistan but help train local military to deal with further insurgent attacks. The Americans are probably going to transfer a lot of personnel there sometime in the future.
Afghanistan; resisted Alexander the Great, the Mughals, the Marathas, the British Empire on three ocassions(1839,1880 and 1919), the Soviets (1979-1989) and now it has sucked the modern superpower into its vortex. History is there to be learnt from, and clearly it hasn't. The MoD planned for a short war and now we're paying the price. The terrain of Afghanistan is perfect for insurgency style guerrila warfare and this was underappreciated when the war was launched. 'Lions led by Donkeys'.
you may be right about the oil issue for Iraq, but we aint in Afganistan for oil.
many young service men and women have died in Afganistan to protect us, so for you to say that "we should stop genociding the arabs for oil" is disrespectful! we're in there to both HELP the afgani people and to protect ourselves! have a wee bit of respect mate!!
and also to add, Afgani people aint arabs they are Asains.
Let's just be honest, shall we? The reason for the war was an expansion for Israel. Oil profits were the reason for striking iraq specifically, and the booming opium trade from Afghanistan is raking in a black budget fortune.
Iran, the most dangerous country to them, is now completely surrounded, if you know your geography.
I feel sad for the soldiers who've died, they were duped into fighting the rich man's profit-war, and their actions have certainly not protected me in any way.
we have led to sooo many girls being given equal oppertunity in education. many girls who at one point werent allowed to go to school is now educated.
many afgani people resent the taliban and cant wait to see the back of em.
for me thats success, many afganis are grateful that we are there because they know that if the taliban get in power they are doomed and will fall under a dictatorship.
Depends how you like to put. i just believe that people should be given the respect that they deserve. esp. when what they are doing is risky and could cost them their own lives.
Already the afghani people are showing little signs of resistance which will ultimately mean that once our troops leave areas the Taliban cant return and even if they do try the afghani army and public dont fall into their trap!
I also strongly believe that other countires in the NATO need to pull their weight and need to contribute more whether thats to provide men and women to fight the Taliban or to educate the people or to educate the afghani army.
we should stay there. If we really want to secure our borders then we need to not only just fight the Taliban BUT to educate the afghani people so that they dont join that cult in the first place, otherwise we will NEVER defeat the Taliban and will continue to run around in circles which we seem to be doing at the moment.
Nothing new, people who played part in 1st WW, 2nd WW, WMD, Holocaust, first making and then using nuclear bomb, slavery, colonialism are now invading for oil and gass in Asia. Civilization I guess! Our leaders are dooming us.
Great vid. This is a very important topic. Our involvement in Afghanistan is crucial. I think we have a duty to help countries like Afghanistan where people have been oppressed for so long, and where there is a danger of a terrorist state coming back. I've had the privilege of meeting a number of Afghan MPs, including women, who appreciate the international community's efforts to secure their country and stop the sadistic Taliban from taking rights and freedoms away from women and girls again.
1 - The UK military are in Afghanistan to validate the US's sordid little plan to monopolise oil production in the Middle East. The US has already successfully stolen Iraqi oil on behalf of the oil corporations (30 year binding contracts!! LOL) and the UK will get a slice of the action for kissing the US's arse all the way through the illegal invasion and ongoing occupation of Iraq.
2 - The "war" in Afghanistan is also about oil but as Afghanistan is not an oil producer this "war" is about securing safe passage for the vast oil and gas reserves in the Caspian Sea to "friendly" ports in Pakistan. The only other route is through Iran. Don't believe me? Try this for a laugh. Get a map of Afghanistan, overlay that with a map showing the various oil and gas pipelines then overlay that with a map showing US and UK military bases. It's a perfect match!!
i could not give a shit about afghanistan .we should bring all our troops home to protect our own borders,while they are out there we have wannabe terrorists sneaking in to the uk through the back door ,bring our brave troops home
If we had invaded, deposed the Taliban, captured Bin Laden & then gone home the enterprise would have been an unqualified success. The Taliban would have re-emerged, and over the long term nothing much would have changed. That's the same thing that's going to happen when the U.S. and NATO leave Afghanistan, or when troops and aggressive operations are reduced. We could have saved ourselves a lot of blood & money by leaving some years ago, & we would save future losses if we left now.
We may succeed in fighting for and holding some tribal areas, and the combination of McCrystal and Petraeus may make that possible. But once troops are withdrawn from an area, the situation will revert to what it was before they arrived.
There's no possibility that anything the U.S. does will be successful in turning Afghanistan into something resembling a modern nation state, much less a functional democracy. Invaders and would-be conquerors throughout history have learned that lesson, sometimes at great cost. In truth it's a land of primitive tribes and clans to whom the concept of loyalty to some distant government in Kabul is totally foreign.
It is very clear to me why we should be in Afghanistan. We have to stop taliban! The evil is spreading and we have to prevent them from taking over more countries instead of running away. Yes, people die. This is war. Unfortunately.
Jazza would not be interested in you darling , he is 100% gay ,and as for him being awesome you obviously need to go to spec savers and ask your doctor why you are so attracted to dickheads ,he is a complete tosser
How about we stay but we get rhymingwith oranges to take the lead this will give the afghan army a false sense of security and bring them out into the open as they will think we have sent out the 1st battalion of brainwashed nerdy left wing gay boys ,then when they are out in the open we can send in the real men to kill the bastards
dude...the Allied Forces need to leave Afghanistan and let them live in peace. The presence of Allied Forces is doing more harm than good, they are highly unpopular and have killed a ridiclous amount of people in the name of War on Terror.
The west cannot force their ideals of 'democracy' on other nations...and that too...thru the barrel of a gun.
God I hate people like you, I dont know why the left always preaches a free mind, but then spews such filth out of their mouths. Do you forget what happened on 9/11? Do you forget that over 3,000 innocent people died, I mean jesus I can understand the argument for Iraq, but the people we ARE looking for ARE in Afganistan. And about civillians dying there, its a shame but its part of war, innocent Germans died in WW2, but should we have rolled over and left there too?
what do you by "the peole we're looking for ARE in Afghanistan"??
Reality Check: 19 of those highjackers were Saudi nationals and had never travelled to Afghanistan. The Afghanis had nothing to do with 9/11, so wasnt the US Government supposed to bring those people to justice who were the brains behind the carnage? If 3000 people died then the one's responsible shud be brought to justice, its not about being a leftist, its about whats right.
they were saudi nationalists true, but the brains behind the whole damn thing IS in Afghanistan, if it wasn't there is no reason we would be there. there is no financial gain, there is not strategic point. They are there and they are getting what is coming to them.
And your ideals in democracy are faulty, our government wouldn't care how their country would be ran, we just want to impose a new system of freedom there, becuase if we did not, the amount of jihadists and islamic extremists we would have to fight, would force us to leave. And we need Iraq to systematically hold Afghanistan. Picture this if we invaded Afghanistan alone, they would have had people pour to their aid from Iraq and Iraq, AND we would lose intellegence from Pakistan.
why should british troops be in afghanistan? i find it vaguely naive that anyone could think they are doing more good than harm; the civilian death toll is appallingly high. and for what, "education schemes" that have been apparently set up? compare the british death toll with afghani (i realise it is inhumane to compare numbers of deaths but for the sake of argument) i believe the threat of the taliban, though present, is not deserving of tanks raiding and crushing afghan civilan homes.
This is a really good point. I've always wondered and have been asking why exactly are people fighting in Afghanistan in general and I always get the most mixed views on what it is we're fighting for. Sometimes people tell me its for the sake of the people of the country and to support women and create a democracy but some people tell me its for resources. I've never got a strict definition on what this war was about and at times that can scare me lol. I just want wanna know what's going on.
I am American, so my perspective is a bit different. I do not believe we should have gotten involved in the middle east arena. There is no "winning" there, and every time we try and change another country through military force, we end up pissing them off and creating another group who is angry with us. The problem was that we wanted retribution (which all children feel is fair) but an eye for an eye makes the whole world blind. We should fight with kindness, not arms.
Britain should never have gotten involved in these wars in the first place However, During the great wars millions of people lost their lives and we didnt get news reports on every single person dead.... the modern warfare combined with the media report on every single death as if each one is an attrocity that should never have happend. Soldiers join the army and get paid to go to war and die for their country, the media playing it all up as if 11 deaths are significant is silly.
This is very difficult question. By leaving Afghanistan there could be problems with the Taliban and other terrorists in the area.
By staying in Afghanistan it could endanger more soldiers there while they could help defeat the Taliban. It is a difficult decision if they need help with the Democracy and if there are real problems there with the Taliban then we have stay if there is something serious.
What a lot of people fail to understand is that the current Government of Afghanistan is trying to embrace democracy, but is being seriously hindered by the Taliban and the extremists there. We are there at their request. Besides, putting something off can have serious implications in the future.
Also, destroying the Taliban will help a current democracy, Pakistan, as well, which is fighting them off as best as they can.
If we withdraw from Afghanistan now the terrorists will treat it as a victory over the UK and use it as propaganda for their cause and it will spark yet more attacks on us. I'm not entirely sure we should have attacked in the first place but now we have we have to see it through until the end or at least until Afghanistan's own army can control what is left.
But if usa and the other one, UK stay, ... irrelevant, but leave germans go back, they really have nothing to do there, and no reasson for dying in one of th emutiple wars you two invent.
The future of Afganistan depends on the people there. We (U.S. and U.K.) cannot bring democracy to them, they must embrace it themselves. I really feel we would be better withdrawing and providing humanitarian support in equal levels.
You made a great commentary by the way. I thought I had tuned in the BBC.
i kinda dont think we should have been in afghan from the start,
BUT now we're there, we can't leave.
what i dont like is the emphasis on how many of our troops died, at the end of the day, we walked into afghan and we've probably killed more afghans/taliban/insergents or whatever than we've lost troops... and although we think we're fighting for whats right.. so do they. no one thinks about their loss, just ours, because we're meant to be imposing something "good" but it might just not work!
The UK is in Afghanistan as part of a long running doctrine that the interests of the UK are best served by maintaining 'special relations' with the US. The UK is just reinforcing US forces along-side many other countries. If the UK pulls out, I believe many others from Europe will do so too. It could have a positive outcome by Europe strengthening and evidently becoming a dominate super-power once again. Then again, it'd break treaties. Not that breaking treaties has ever mattered.
Not to forget that pulling out any time soon would allow terrorism to strengthen. We need to solve this terrorism problem now, not 20 years later when we're nuked by them.
The war wont be over until 2012 Why? Jewish i mean freemason (illumanity) r the main terrorist in the world thy control all the media since 60s thr mission is to destroy all the muslim country so thy can releasd the devil frm palestin mosqe. Adt 70% president of the country r freemason.
I really dont think we should stay there, what are we even doing there, my brother is in the army he is only 19 and he might go there soon, but the people who die out there are far to young people as young as 18 die, its not right
It completely baffles me as to why we are in Afghanistan at all. It seems the most cack handed round-about and expensive way to defend the UK from terrorism.
And while they are supposedly fighting terrorism in far flung Afghanistan - back in the UK they are giving known terrorist convicts social welfare housing etc. I question their misguided attempts at so-called fighting terrorism! I wonder what the real motivation is?
I would like to know the opinions of the local people in Afghanistan. If they beleive that The british army is doing the right job, then i think I can support the conflict. If on the other hand they see us as oppressors or occupyers, i think its time to leave. You cant help those who dont want to be helped.
For the public we should not be worrying about why we are there but focusing on giving our support to the soldiers out there and making sure those who have died did not die in vain. The Generals in Afghanistan say we need more troops to maintain control and personally i think they know best.
it started out as terrorists for most thats a few beer bellys in a mask holding a shotgun with a few suger bombs up there sleave but how wrong was we its a fully equipped never ending army that is making it a 10 year war , from my happy bubble perspective i think we should pull out but then from the perspective of the soldiers whos seen what a huge problem this is and the threat it has to us i think they would rather stick to the end i doubt its something that can be swept under the carpet
war can be the answer. if you're an american then you would that that america was born because we defeated Britain in the revoulutionary war. without war there wouldnt ever any america or alot of other coutries such as "the union".
Well the people of America could do it like the Indians did or the people in Iran in the 70s. And could you do me a favour? Please watch History of USA and terrorism. Its made by a german cabarettist Volker Pispers. Its very funny and informative. BTW: We know that in America war is a traditon ;-D
we really should stay. the UK is partly responsible for the state of that nation.. we can't back out like we did in Iraq. I respect our troops and the work they do to promote democracy and protect freedom.. they should not have been pulled out to leave the americans to do the heavy lifting.
it would be enormously disrespectful to all those who have died in afghanistan, to leave before the job is done. we should not be leaving anytime soon. those calling for withdrawal know little about the situation there.
its too late to even consider wheather we should be there or not. to be honest, now, if our troops leave, then its more than likely that they will return to the way they were before we invaded. That taken into consideration means that those 184 deaths and the ones that are certain to come, would be almost pointless. and they do not deserve that.
You know its odd, I wasn't even aware that there was controversy in Britain over your presence there. How can you not try to eradicate the roots of terrorism? Bush was stupid, it was Cheney and Rumsfeld and Co. who were war mongers and war profiteers. The entire Iraq nonsense was about ensuring continued income for Cheney's Haliburton et al. Obama has had the sense to go after the terrorists where they really are - Afghanistan/Pakistan.
There isnt really mainstream controversy over it although a rising deathtoll is going to lead to more calling for withdrawl.
The two main political parties support the efforts, so neither would withrdaw our troops. Now far more troops are being pumped into Afghanistan by America things on the ground will change. It is ashame that most NATO members are not prepared to commit more troops.
YES! Now you've hit it - NATO (and more correctly the United Nations!!!!!!! - Ha! what a misnomer THAT is!!!!!) needs to take the lead in ALL of these conflicts, not the bloody flaming United States World Police Organization.
You Brits have suffered about 100x more terrorism than we here in the Colonies. And since the Afghanistan/Pakistan area is the principle source of 90% of the terrorism, you need to be making a greater commitment. Unless of course you are seriously trying to challenge the French for their position in world stature.
I agree, its about time the British government took this war seriously and committed the correct level of force and resources to deal with this problem.
Sadly they see Afghanistan and previous Iraq as a part time war. Its a full time one and every part of government should focus on winning it. Instead our government is too busy focusing on bloody climate change and other pathetic topics.
i am from pakistan and familier with the pashtuns and some afghan history and the people, i think if the british and american stay there will be fighting and if they leave there still be fighting. if the british and americans withdraw then at least they wont be facing casualties bcoz the afghans are going to start fighting amoungst themselves, one solution could be that american make a truce with taliban that they can have their government in afghanistan but not allow al qaeda to stay here.
An interesting solution, In an ideal world that would be a fantastic solution. But the Taliban have been demonised too much by politicians and the media. Any kind of an agreement doesn't sound plausible.
the afghans have been occupied by oppressors many times before, back then british didnt come to help, they took their freedom back by themselves, and they will take their freedom back by themselves this time too, you cant possibily say that british are there to free afghans, if so they should have invaded in 1994/1996 when taliban came in control of the country, secondly if thats the logic then when are we launching operation zimbabwe freedom? we are there to eliminate alqaeda.
We are there because terrorists responsible for a direct attack on a NATO ally were based there and protected by the regime running it. We are there now to try and help the people and increase the strenght of the Afghans armed forces, its democracy and better services.
Our actions today do not compare to previous examples because they were occupations.. this is not an occupation, we want to leave and we will when the threat is reduced and the Afghan security forces can handle the problems.
Oh complicated. Being that I'm American I have the unfortunate guilt for living somewhere that has sent many a nation to war. I'd really like to say I think we should all come home and have parades for everyone but with all the damage we've done in the region due to war there's no real stable way to make it happen. For the mean time I think staying is the only options that won't make things worse.
We have to leave Afghanistan. We've taken down the Taliban, and we can just increase security in our country to stop any terrorist or anarchist attacks from happening.
This war is costing lives, and the troops will be safer back home than they will be fighting the war!
The taliban is still there and if Britain pulls out the other small contributors will as well leaving just America which would put huge pressure on them to withdraw too quickly as well.
We need a successful Pakistan and Afghanistan, this is vital for our long term national security there for the troops must remain.
Now the operation itself is being handled very badly because of Brown and co. We need far more troops there and far more resources.
If you one does some research about the nature of Afghans and their history with invaders,, it will come to a conclusioin that inorder to rule the afghans, you will have to wipe them out,, cuz a living afghan will fight you to the last drop of their blood.
SabirAyaz there is a big difference between what happened in the past and today. NATO troops in Afghanistan are not occupying the country and we do not want to stay. Previous "invaders" didnt want to go there, train up their army, give their people lots of aid and help in developing civil society then leave.
Those that say we should accept Afghan history that this war can never be "won" need to see its a completly different mission
Its all very well saying we should stop the terrorists in our own country but that is not so easy when we have a huge pakistani community which travels back and forth to that region
Id rather we have a stable pakistan (which needs a stable afghanistan) that are both against terrorism and radical islam
"The troops will be safer back home" duh, but if we are not going to use our armed forces whats the point in having them? We are there because 67 British people died on 9/11 and NATO was attacked
Firstly, luv your vlogs they always provoke healthy debate. Afghanistan if we (the western world) leave too there will surely be a larger conflict down the line. We need to have bases here to maintain a steady growth in Afghanistans economy. A strong economy provides jobs and education this promotes democracy and capitalism (the western religion) which in turn reduces the possibility of fundamentalism and feudalism. *Note all isms in excess are bad.
My cousin died in Afghanistan. I think there has been a lot of good done. However, a reassessment of goals and a concentrated effort to bring it to completion quickly is something that's necessary IMO. I don't know that forced democracy should be a goal, as long as terrorists are not in power.
I am sorry to hear about your cousin. I agree with you that we need a goal that needs immediate funding so that it can be resolved rapidly. I also agree with you about democracy. But technically, the ousted Taliban were never a terrorist threat to us...
We should stay, of the recent three big wars (those being Iraq, Afghanistan and Vietnam) Afghanistan is the only one to make sense. Eradicating terrorism is a big thing, and we can't just give up after all that's happened; the soldiers shouldn't have to give up their lives in vain.
One thing that I do dislike is the fact that the western world seems to shove democracy down the throat of everyone else. Just because we're using it doesn't mean it's perfect in any way.
I believe that if the purpose of the war is to fight the Taliban and other terrorist cells in the region it's an excellent idea, so long as the troops sent there are properly supplied and can accurately complete their mission.
If however it is to provide aid, or educate women, then I have to disagree with them being there. If those are our goals they can be provided by charity organizations and the such.
As for creating a democracy, I'm totally opposed. I like democracy as much as the next person, however lets look at where imperialism in the Middle East has gotten us.
The majority of our issues with Iran can probably be dated back to Operation Ajax.
Also let's not forget how difficult democracy can be in a region filled with sectarian violence. We shouldn't repeat historical mistakes by believing we know what is best for a region. Western democracy was not built in a day.
Look at the history, for what it is. No nation has ever created an imported ruling establishment in the history of that country. I know that isn't the goal of the occupation now, but the history serves. Between the terrain, the warlords, the opium, and other influences less tangible like religion and tribal affairs, nothing will be accomplished. It's in the history books, and hopefully I'm wrong, but I don't think there is a chance in hell of positive accomplishment happening.
I'm not British, but I say everyone needs to get out. I feel like there is no progress being made lately and the people there don't really want us (America, Canada, Great Britain, etc.) there. I also feel like the U.S. is there majorly for oil. They can protect it and keep the Middle East from rising the prices.
The supposed 'war on terror' would have never had happened if the 9/11 attacks did not take place (and even then people think it was the US government themselves), this war is pointless, innocent people, on both sides, are being killed daily, the British and Americans are crying over a couple of soldiers who were killed, when over the years HUNDREDS if not THOUSANDS of innocent people are dying in Afghanistan.
Wake up world, they havent won now, they never will.
Snap! I was going to make a comment on how much I liked that shirt! Sadly I can not wear it. Horizontal stripes are not a big guys best friend. Thanks for being awesome Jazza and Johnny!
The Americans and British are there to raise up their little brown brothers in other nations from savagery into the light of enlightened Western freedom, just like they did in the 19th century. It has NOTHING to do with exploitation of natural resources, like it was in the...uh...19th century. THE 19TH CENTURY RACIST COLONIALIST MENTALITY RULES!!! [he writes, with a hint of sarcasm]
Send evryone over there, maybe they can learn some culture. And if it doens't work out they can shoot up some weddings and bomb some sheepherders via drone plane. Their culture and way of life is superior and sustainable, that is why the west is there, theirs is not.
the only ones confused about the war are all the people trying to understand it
i know with out a doubt that the arm forces know what there doing and why they are there and for you and any one not in the arm forces to question there ability and desire to be the best and to do every thing in there power to keep the people safe is just insane. talk with a solder direct and more then one if you may
and he or she will tell you why they need finish and not back down or give up
I saw the plane carrying soldiers to Lyneham to parade through Wootten Bassett (I live in Calne). You always see people saluting the planes around Lyneham.
I don't support the idea of any military from another country going in to another. If one country wishes to defend itself it can easily do so within its own territory as a defence force.
That's my view on this matter anyway. Awesome topic video Jazza :)
Whilst we should probably revise our tactics (I don't know quite what to do, but I do know we need a change) and now try to establish a structure in which we can eventually withdraw from the country and leave in the hands of their own security forces, much like Iraq, we cannot just pull out now - The Taleban would simply re establish control and use the country as a base of operations - they might then try to destablize Pakistan, which is a big concern as it is nuclear-armed power.
I haven't a clue about war, but I would say if Britian has changed Afghanistan for the better then they should stay as if they left, it may all fall apart again.
Wierdly as I was watching this either fireworks or bisley rangers started shooting as there were lots of shots and bangs...
I don't really know enough about the war to make an educated comment so I'll just give some general statements on my thoughts on war and let you draw your own conclusions. I believe there will never be peace. War is a part of humanity we must live with and to help others at the risk or loss of your own life is a noble and honourable thing to do.
I saw an interview on tv the other day with some head of military who said that the helman (sp?) province is the last key refuge for the terrorists, and once we finish here then we've won the war, which is why the fighting has got so bad recently.
I think the only danger is that it could turn into like the Korean War (they push them back, and we loose tpractically the whole thing).
oh and i think its about time the Government gave the MOD a little cash to finish kitting out all the Hc3 Chinnoks that have been sitting at RAF Odiham for god knows how long.
British and Americans should leave.There is no victory when there is no clear objective. Our mission was to hunt down/eiminate the Taliban and thats impossible.George Bush promised not to get into nation-building and im sorry British were dragged into the conflict. The fact of the matter is we have broken the law bombing nuclear Pakistan without authority from our congress and we are getting bogged down just like Soviets and we will have to stop when we run out of money and/or soldiers to die.
Theres a lot of reasons were in Afghanistan. Afghansitan was in a huge mess when the taliban took over. Women had no rights what so ever, they couldnt see a doctor, couldnt go out of the house without a male relative, couldnt work or go to school and were flogged many times for no reason also were forced to cover themselves from head to toe and were not aloud on TV Listening to music became illegal aswell as men shaving their beards and flying kites.
We needed to get the taliban out of that country in order to save the Afghan people. The taliban are still trying to regain power and if they do they will continue where they left off taking all the Afghan's rights away aswell they will become a breeding ground for international terrorist attacks and put the whole world at danger. Staying in Afghanistan is a very big deal. We have to get the country to where they should be. Get them out of poverty, start a democracy government, and
make sure that they will be able to defend themselves against the taliban if they try to regain power. We've put so much money towards this war and have accomplished so much we cant just leave and give up. Its just going to take a while to help this country since its been corrupt for so long. the amount of deaths in this war is actually nothing compared to the millions lost in most wars so i dont see why its such a big issue.
Wonderful comment & a very good argument. But the fact is we did not enter Afganistan because we thought the government there is unfair. Yes, I do believe we should stay there and make the country stable enough to survive on it;s own steam, it is our duty now we have entered. But I don't believe right now we are doing things right. We need to have one big goal. One reason for being there, push that reason to the Afgans and our own people, complete that goal and leave the place; hopefully better.
You can't just split people into good guys and bad guys. Yes, members of the taliban are being killed. But many of them are young people who have been educated and raised by the group. Many civilians also die in the conflict, our own people die in the conflict. We have to ask ourselves the question as to whether these casualties are worth the cost, of money and life. In wars the bad guys aren't the only ones that get killed unfortunately.
I totally agree. I was being very basic in my comment. I think that terrorists would only get stronger and have greater means of inflicting terror on their own people and others if our military was not there. Military intervention is just one way to aid in the attack on terrorism. Of course, it's a war, innocent people are going to be killed and recruited. So it's always going to be a reason not to go to war. In any job which concerns the protection of people there is high risk involved.
I think Brown should pull out UK troops! But I might be saying this because I think we shouldn't have any war anywhere at the moment, because citizens of the countries in which we have troops do not know anything about progress in the war and if it is actually helping or not. Support the troops by getting them home safe.
The citizens are very aware of the progress in the war! The women now have rights, they can go to school, work, go out of their house,and arent forced to be completely covered from head to toe The Afghan people are very aware of the rights they have recieved back because of the troops there and there have been spokes people from afghanistan that were there during taliban ruling and when the troops went in and have stated how greatful they were
I really don't know. Can terrorism actually be fought and defeated? Its a loaded question. Something should be done but I'm afraid I lack the wisdom to come up with the appropriate path to take.
It does feel like we are sometimes fighting a concept rather than a physical enemy. And the thing is, you can't beat a concept, no matter how many people you bomb. If anything conflict fuels and backs it up.
I really didn't understand why British troops or American troops were there until we read The Kite Runner in Lit Honors this past school year. I think we need to finish it out, but really, I don't know. I agree with some other comments about the UN. I remember learning while doing our model UN in school that they kind of are not really putting much input into the Afghanistan War. I agree with Jazza, we need a clear goal to keep us there to finish it out. :/ I hope this comment made some sense.
we do need to take our soldiers out of afghanistan, however, if we wish to maintain the progress we have made so far, we should leave a sort of defensive or protective force so that all the progress that will/has be/been made will not unravel and go backwards, or decline even further.
But I don't think leaving some protective troops there now would work. There is still massive conflict happening and they would be bombarded by the Taliban. It will (hopefully) work in Iraq because the threat had been eradicated. Wee need to make significant progress if we are going to leave people there.
We need to finish what we started...well what the Americans started in the 80's and we joined in on. The conflict is central not only to ensuring the freedom of a population that hasn't enjoyed any sort of realistic liberty in many years (for some group such liberties have never existed), but also it is crucial to stemming the flow of illegal drug production. The war is about the security of many nations on many levels. Some people see only the immediate impact, they should look deeper.
A lot of that drug production is also legal, opium in the bases of many drugs used in industry and medicine. It is a pillar of the economy and I feel the destroying of it will ultimately be detrimental to the country.
Why would you want to slow down the opium farming? Where do you think all those pain killers they give you at the hospital come from? Most of them come from opium. If anything, since it's a big part of their economy, they should be helped with the opium farming and just add other crops to give them a stronger economy. There's nothing wrong with helping them move into other industries as well but you can't kill their major source of livelihood and one of our major source of opium.
Once again we've tried to inflict our type of democracy, welcome or not - it's unlawful for the amount of civillians injured. And to be honest that cannot be tolerated. it's time for the UN or some higher authority to step it up and sort out why we are there, if we should be there at all AND what we are trying to achieve in the long term. I agree with Jazza's comment reply, no one seems to REALLY know what's going on over there :( x
With an undefined war of aggression, we opened ourselves up as occupying forces, not liberators. We need to withdraw, as our Governments have not the best intentions for the region or it's people
It's the same story in Canada. I don't think there is a possibility of installing a democracy in Afghanistan because the country will be torn apart . In the past, we have seen that imposing a governement to a country has not worked: Korean war, Vietnam war ( only to name a few). In the end, I think that the UN should intervene with the Trusteeship Council. Also, I believe we should gradually withdraw all military forces from Afghanistan.
The Trusteeship Council was formed originally during the decolonization of Africa. Basicly, the council would help the old colonies with their new independent government. Now since the Trusteeship has done its purpose, I think the UN should reinvent it and make the council help countries who have just come out of the war (Afghanistan).
but isnt our problem also that us people think our troops are there for xyz reasons but the us establishment are actually doing their thing from a quite different [and probably criminal] set of reasons? its got to be sorted out. afghanistan like every islamic country is vile. but so are our political leaders. nobody cared about women/freedom in islam before so i dont care for the crocodile tears now. news is they finally got bin lid but wheres the corpse?? ten years to get one man?
3leopardsblue 10 months ago
You may say this is not a well thought out tactic... but more troops, with more troops there can be more helicopters, more artillery, more "things" to kill the enemy... so they don't kill you.
I believe what we are doing is right, but if we really are combating terrorism then we ned a global approach, committing all of our forces in Afghanistan, Pakistan, Yemen, and many more terrorist "hubs"
alex471996 1 year ago
You are so homosexual I have to clean my computer. Can you tone down the gay routine please?
tryanjohnson 1 year ago
Leaaaaave!
PorkpieHatz 2 years ago
You're seriously awesome. I am kind of comment-stalking your videos, but its so rare to find someone sensible and informed about politics and all that. I think we should be in Afghanistan. The US media switched to Anti-War viewpoints almost immediately after pushing for everyone to go to war, manipulative bastards. If we pull out Afghanistan is not going to get any better. Abuse of women and misinformation as well as religious propaganda will all still exist. I think thats why we should stay.
Saneblueberry 2 years ago 4
The US media switched to anti-war viewpoints when they realised that War means death.
Kasigerman 2 years ago
No way is it that simple. They would have realized war meant death, war is built on death. The media just realized they could get their hands on sob stories from the families who lost people in the war with Afghanistan (which is really terrible) and went with that tearjerker. The media doesn't care all that much about conveying a rationalized story.
Saneblueberry 2 years ago
@Saneblueberry Hell yeah man. Freakin media, I swear... it's the reason why so many people think we went to the middle east for oil and that we "lost" vietnam.
USparatroopersurgeon 7 months ago
Well Im An Afghan. We (Afghans) have So Many Problems Going On In Our country that in some ways having naito forces that "accidentaly" Bomb the Innocent and Poor REALLY Doesnt Help. I Think You Right The British do need to make it clear the exact reason the are there and what they intend to do. sending young and foolish troupes that make abuse poor and hungry children on the streets!! what do they think will happen the Afghans will just shrug it off and not do anything.
palwasha03 2 years ago
this is comming from a current US soldier geting ready to depoy to Afghanistn actully and here is what I think..
I personally think Afghanistan is another failure. It's going to be the same outcome. Waste of money, time, and lives.. It's time to pull out now.
99bmwM3 2 years ago
we can't win. its a fact, the best we can do is make it look like we've won and pull out quickly before it all starts to go pear-shaped which it inevitably will and then watch afghanistan revert to its norm. having said that, even making it look like we've won will be tricky cos the ANA are so shite.
d4yogurt 2 years ago
I have your glasses :)
but more on topic; the situation in afghanistan needs help, I think we should be there to help them govern themselves although I'm not sure if that's the true reason why we are there. I'm not very informed on this at the minute though but that's what I gather from the tidbits I've read.
pinkcactuschannel 2 years ago
Pull our forces out of Afghanistan but help train local military to deal with further insurgent attacks. The Americans are probably going to transfer a lot of personnel there sometime in the future.
dreamsofequal 2 years ago
we should bring our lads home and if the afgans ever attack either the uk or the us again eradicate their whole fukin toilet of a nation
GBRF2D 2 years ago
Die for oil, suckers.
Ricardo72 2 years ago
totaly what a student try going out there and then comment dickhead!
dazzla111 2 years ago
You can say its wrong to send them in...
But you can question the quality and bravery of our troops.
Help for heroes!
KBS6991 2 years ago
Afghanistan; resisted Alexander the Great, the Mughals, the Marathas, the British Empire on three ocassions(1839,1880 and 1919), the Soviets (1979-1989) and now it has sucked the modern superpower into its vortex. History is there to be learnt from, and clearly it hasn't. The MoD planned for a short war and now we're paying the price. The terrain of Afghanistan is perfect for insurgency style guerrila warfare and this was underappreciated when the war was launched. 'Lions led by Donkeys'.
tearthatup 2 years ago
I think we should stop genociding the arabs for their oil. It's unfair, and we've been had by international bankers.
TheWiretap 2 years ago
that is such an ignorant statement.
missvirgoxx 2 years ago
And how, exactly, is that?
That was about as simply as the war can be described.
TheWiretap 2 years ago
you may be right about the oil issue for Iraq, but we aint in Afganistan for oil.
many young service men and women have died in Afganistan to protect us, so for you to say that "we should stop genociding the arabs for oil" is disrespectful! we're in there to both HELP the afgani people and to protect ourselves! have a wee bit of respect mate!!
and also to add, Afgani people aint arabs they are Asains.
missvirgoxx 2 years ago
Let's just be honest, shall we? The reason for the war was an expansion for Israel. Oil profits were the reason for striking iraq specifically, and the booming opium trade from Afghanistan is raking in a black budget fortune.
Iran, the most dangerous country to them, is now completely surrounded, if you know your geography.
I feel sad for the soldiers who've died, they were duped into fighting the rich man's profit-war, and their actions have certainly not protected me in any way.
TheWiretap 2 years ago
mate but this video is not about iraq or iran!
we have led to sooo many girls being given equal oppertunity in education. many girls who at one point werent allowed to go to school is now educated.
many afgani people resent the taliban and cant wait to see the back of em.
for me thats success, many afganis are grateful that we are there because they know that if the taliban get in power they are doomed and will fall under a dictatorship.
and yes they have protected your sorry arse!
missvirgoxx 2 years ago
wow, you're so into the whole 'military hero' thing, aren't you? It's sadly not the truth though.
TheWiretap 2 years ago
Depends how you like to put. i just believe that people should be given the respect that they deserve. esp. when what they are doing is risky and could cost them their own lives.
missvirgoxx 2 years ago
we should be supporting them by bringing them home.
TheWiretap 2 years ago
continue...
Already the afghani people are showing little signs of resistance which will ultimately mean that once our troops leave areas the Taliban cant return and even if they do try the afghani army and public dont fall into their trap!
I also strongly believe that other countires in the NATO need to pull their weight and need to contribute more whether thats to provide men and women to fight the Taliban or to educate the people or to educate the afghani army.
missvirgoxx 2 years ago
we should stay there. If we really want to secure our borders then we need to not only just fight the Taliban BUT to educate the afghani people so that they dont join that cult in the first place, otherwise we will NEVER defeat the Taliban and will continue to run around in circles which we seem to be doing at the moment.
missvirgoxx 2 years ago
Nothing new, people who played part in 1st WW, 2nd WW, WMD, Holocaust, first making and then using nuclear bomb, slavery, colonialism are now invading for oil and gass in Asia. Civilization I guess! Our leaders are dooming us.
parrasraja 2 years ago
Great vid. This is a very important topic. Our involvement in Afghanistan is crucial. I think we have a duty to help countries like Afghanistan where people have been oppressed for so long, and where there is a danger of a terrorist state coming back. I've had the privilege of meeting a number of Afghan MPs, including women, who appreciate the international community's efforts to secure their country and stop the sadistic Taliban from taking rights and freedoms away from women and girls again.
UKLablon 2 years ago
1 - The UK military are in Afghanistan to validate the US's sordid little plan to monopolise oil production in the Middle East. The US has already successfully stolen Iraqi oil on behalf of the oil corporations (30 year binding contracts!! LOL) and the UK will get a slice of the action for kissing the US's arse all the way through the illegal invasion and ongoing occupation of Iraq.
silverthumper 2 years ago
2 - The "war" in Afghanistan is also about oil but as Afghanistan is not an oil producer this "war" is about securing safe passage for the vast oil and gas reserves in the Caspian Sea to "friendly" ports in Pakistan. The only other route is through Iran. Don't believe me? Try this for a laugh. Get a map of Afghanistan, overlay that with a map showing the various oil and gas pipelines then overlay that with a map showing US and UK military bases. It's a perfect match!!
silverthumper 2 years ago
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silverthumper 2 years ago
i could not give a shit about afghanistan .we should bring all our troops home to protect our own borders,while they are out there we have wannabe terrorists sneaking in to the uk through the back door ,bring our brave troops home
gunnergreg1965 2 years ago
If we had invaded, deposed the Taliban, captured Bin Laden & then gone home the enterprise would have been an unqualified success. The Taliban would have re-emerged, and over the long term nothing much would have changed. That's the same thing that's going to happen when the U.S. and NATO leave Afghanistan, or when troops and aggressive operations are reduced. We could have saved ourselves a lot of blood & money by leaving some years ago, & we would save future losses if we left now.
zebu79 2 years ago
We may succeed in fighting for and holding some tribal areas, and the combination of McCrystal and Petraeus may make that possible. But once troops are withdrawn from an area, the situation will revert to what it was before they arrived.
zebu79 2 years ago
There's no possibility that anything the U.S. does will be successful in turning Afghanistan into something resembling a modern nation state, much less a functional democracy. Invaders and would-be conquerors throughout history have learned that lesson, sometimes at great cost. In truth it's a land of primitive tribes and clans to whom the concept of loyalty to some distant government in Kabul is totally foreign.
zebu79 2 years ago
come on guys, it's a war, you gotta expect casualties, better avoided definately and should get funded better but they should stay
speddsk8rocker 2 years ago
It is very clear to me why we should be in Afghanistan. We have to stop taliban! The evil is spreading and we have to prevent them from taking over more countries instead of running away. Yes, people die. This is war. Unfortunately.
Phanaoshot 2 years ago
Jazza would not be interested in you darling , he is 100% gay ,and as for him being awesome you obviously need to go to spec savers and ask your doctor why you are so attracted to dickheads ,he is a complete tosser
gregthegooner 2 years ago
Frankly, stop being a student.
tallicalad 2 years ago
God! I love debating...and i think i love u 2!
Ur so awesome
ShakSparrow 2 years ago
you should do a vlog in chinese!
greenNINJAspam 2 years ago
you sound like a reporter
SubZeroNinjaVampire 2 years ago 2
Why are so many people mesmerized with what a 20 year old would say? How did this guy get so popular?
ShaytanBozorg 2 years ago
How about we stay but we get rhymingwith oranges to take the lead this will give the afghan army a false sense of security and bring them out into the open as they will think we have sent out the 1st battalion of brainwashed nerdy left wing gay boys ,then when they are out in the open we can send in the real men to kill the bastards
gregthegooner 2 years ago
dude...the Allied Forces need to leave Afghanistan and let them live in peace. The presence of Allied Forces is doing more harm than good, they are highly unpopular and have killed a ridiclous amount of people in the name of War on Terror.
The west cannot force their ideals of 'democracy' on other nations...and that too...thru the barrel of a gun.
zebu79 2 years ago
God I hate people like you, I dont know why the left always preaches a free mind, but then spews such filth out of their mouths. Do you forget what happened on 9/11? Do you forget that over 3,000 innocent people died, I mean jesus I can understand the argument for Iraq, but the people we ARE looking for ARE in Afganistan. And about civillians dying there, its a shame but its part of war, innocent Germans died in WW2, but should we have rolled over and left there too?
toastycigar 2 years ago
what do you by "the peole we're looking for ARE in Afghanistan"??
Reality Check: 19 of those highjackers were Saudi nationals and had never travelled to Afghanistan. The Afghanis had nothing to do with 9/11, so wasnt the US Government supposed to bring those people to justice who were the brains behind the carnage? If 3000 people died then the one's responsible shud be brought to justice, its not about being a leftist, its about whats right.
zebu79 2 years ago
they were saudi nationalists true, but the brains behind the whole damn thing IS in Afghanistan, if it wasn't there is no reason we would be there. there is no financial gain, there is not strategic point. They are there and they are getting what is coming to them.
toastycigar 2 years ago
And your ideals in democracy are faulty, our government wouldn't care how their country would be ran, we just want to impose a new system of freedom there, becuase if we did not, the amount of jihadists and islamic extremists we would have to fight, would force us to leave. And we need Iraq to systematically hold Afghanistan. Picture this if we invaded Afghanistan alone, they would have had people pour to their aid from Iraq and Iraq, AND we would lose intellegence from Pakistan.
toastycigar 2 years ago
why should british troops be in afghanistan? i find it vaguely naive that anyone could think they are doing more good than harm; the civilian death toll is appallingly high. and for what, "education schemes" that have been apparently set up? compare the british death toll with afghani (i realise it is inhumane to compare numbers of deaths but for the sake of argument) i believe the threat of the taliban, though present, is not deserving of tanks raiding and crushing afghan civilan homes.
famiwid 2 years ago
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CISCLnumber1fangirl 2 years ago
This is a really good point. I've always wondered and have been asking why exactly are people fighting in Afghanistan in general and I always get the most mixed views on what it is we're fighting for. Sometimes people tell me its for the sake of the people of the country and to support women and create a democracy but some people tell me its for resources. I've never got a strict definition on what this war was about and at times that can scare me lol. I just want wanna know what's going on.
AnekaSvajone 2 years ago
I feel like we should ask ourselves what would happen if we allow the Taliban to continue doing what they are doing.
You get FIVE stars for horizontal stripes.
tripthe1 2 years ago
I am American, so my perspective is a bit different. I do not believe we should have gotten involved in the middle east arena. There is no "winning" there, and every time we try and change another country through military force, we end up pissing them off and creating another group who is angry with us. The problem was that we wanted retribution (which all children feel is fair) but an eye for an eye makes the whole world blind. We should fight with kindness, not arms.
lessasgirls 2 years ago
Britain should never have gotten involved in these wars in the first place However, During the great wars millions of people lost their lives and we didnt get news reports on every single person dead.... the modern warfare combined with the media report on every single death as if each one is an attrocity that should never have happend. Soldiers join the army and get paid to go to war and die for their country, the media playing it all up as if 11 deaths are significant is silly.
GarySpedding 2 years ago
This is very difficult question. By leaving Afghanistan there could be problems with the Taliban and other terrorists in the area.
By staying in Afghanistan it could endanger more soldiers there while they could help defeat the Taliban. It is a difficult decision if they need help with the Democracy and if there are real problems there with the Taliban then we have stay if there is something serious.
BarryAldridge 2 years ago
What a lot of people fail to understand is that the current Government of Afghanistan is trying to embrace democracy, but is being seriously hindered by the Taliban and the extremists there. We are there at their request. Besides, putting something off can have serious implications in the future.
Also, destroying the Taliban will help a current democracy, Pakistan, as well, which is fighting them off as best as they can.
Snagprophet 2 years ago
this is true to a point depleted uranium is not used in small arms fire like ak m16 or sa80's but for the bombs e.g b21
i can tell you for a fact that not one DU bomb has been fired or dropped into afghanistain FACT
kandlooting 2 years ago
If we withdraw from Afghanistan now the terrorists will treat it as a victory over the UK and use it as propaganda for their cause and it will spark yet more attacks on us. I'm not entirely sure we should have attacked in the first place but now we have we have to see it through until the end or at least until Afghanistan's own army can control what is left.
TRDPaul 2 years ago
dont join the army if you arent prepared to kill and be killed
L0VEgun 2 years ago 5
there has never been a clear target or goal
bagOmagic 2 years ago 2
Go.
But if usa and the other one, UK stay, ... irrelevant, but leave germans go back, they really have nothing to do there, and no reasson for dying in one of th emutiple wars you two invent.
Illbrucka 2 years ago
The future of Afganistan depends on the people there. We (U.S. and U.K.) cannot bring democracy to them, they must embrace it themselves. I really feel we would be better withdrawing and providing humanitarian support in equal levels.
You made a great commentary by the way. I thought I had tuned in the BBC.
SanDiegoArtNut 2 years ago
i kinda dont think we should have been in afghan from the start,
BUT now we're there, we can't leave.
what i dont like is the emphasis on how many of our troops died, at the end of the day, we walked into afghan and we've probably killed more afghans/taliban/insergents or whatever than we've lost troops... and although we think we're fighting for whats right.. so do they. no one thinks about their loss, just ours, because we're meant to be imposing something "good" but it might just not work!
imustbeTINO 2 years ago
Cannonfodder is comepletely correct. As the saying goes, you can take a horse to water, but you can't make it drink.
We can stay there and set up a democracy, but we can't force them to use it.
DarkChrist888 2 years ago
The UK is in Afghanistan as part of a long running doctrine that the interests of the UK are best served by maintaining 'special relations' with the US. The UK is just reinforcing US forces along-side many other countries. If the UK pulls out, I believe many others from Europe will do so too. It could have a positive outcome by Europe strengthening and evidently becoming a dominate super-power once again. Then again, it'd break treaties. Not that breaking treaties has ever mattered.
Phuxx0r 2 years ago
Not to forget that pulling out any time soon would allow terrorism to strengthen. We need to solve this terrorism problem now, not 20 years later when we're nuked by them.
Phuxx0r 2 years ago
The war wont be over until 2012 Why? Jewish i mean freemason (illumanity) r the main terrorist in the world thy control all the media since 60s thr mission is to destroy all the muslim country so thy can releasd the devil frm palestin mosqe. Adt 70% president of the country r freemason.
bodrul0007 2 years ago
I really dont think we should stay there, what are we even doing there, my brother is in the army he is only 19 and he might go there soon, but the people who die out there are far to young people as young as 18 die, its not right
T5igger63 2 years ago
It completely baffles me as to why we are in Afghanistan at all. It seems the most cack handed round-about and expensive way to defend the UK from terrorism.
And while they are supposedly fighting terrorism in far flung Afghanistan - back in the UK they are giving known terrorist convicts social welfare housing etc. I question their misguided attempts at so-called fighting terrorism! I wonder what the real motivation is?
amaqula 2 years ago
I would like to know the opinions of the local people in Afghanistan. If they beleive that The british army is doing the right job, then i think I can support the conflict. If on the other hand they see us as oppressors or occupyers, i think its time to leave. You cant help those who dont want to be helped.
cannonfodder9 2 years ago
For the public we should not be worrying about why we are there but focusing on giving our support to the soldiers out there and making sure those who have died did not die in vain. The Generals in Afghanistan say we need more troops to maintain control and personally i think they know best.
lottieherb 2 years ago
it started out as terrorists for most thats a few beer bellys in a mask holding a shotgun with a few suger bombs up there sleave but how wrong was we its a fully equipped never ending army that is making it a 10 year war , from my happy bubble perspective i think we should pull out but then from the perspective of the soldiers whos seen what a huge problem this is and the threat it has to us i think they would rather stick to the end i doubt its something that can be swept under the carpet
user7671 2 years ago
Go, like we should go.
WAR cant be the answer!
Germanator93 2 years ago
war can be the answer. if you're an american then you would that that america was born because we defeated Britain in the revoulutionary war. without war there wouldnt ever any america or alot of other coutries such as "the union".
surfergal2040 2 years ago
Well the people of America could do it like the Indians did or the people in Iran in the 70s. And could you do me a favour? Please watch History of USA and terrorism. Its made by a german cabarettist Volker Pispers. Its very funny and informative. BTW: We know that in America war is a traditon ;-D
greetings
Germanator93 2 years ago
we really should stay. the UK is partly responsible for the state of that nation.. we can't back out like we did in Iraq. I respect our troops and the work they do to promote democracy and protect freedom.. they should not have been pulled out to leave the americans to do the heavy lifting.
TheDefunktPistol 2 years ago
I'm really sorry to break the seriousness of the rest of the comments...but I noticed....you do a shimmy when you talk xP
alphaclone0220 2 years ago
it would be enormously disrespectful to all those who have died in afghanistan, to leave before the job is done. we should not be leaving anytime soon. those calling for withdrawal know little about the situation there.
milton690 2 years ago
its too late to even consider wheather we should be there or not. to be honest, now, if our troops leave, then its more than likely that they will return to the way they were before we invaded. That taken into consideration means that those 184 deaths and the ones that are certain to come, would be almost pointless. and they do not deserve that.
MrsGrrrg 2 years ago
You know its odd, I wasn't even aware that there was controversy in Britain over your presence there. How can you not try to eradicate the roots of terrorism? Bush was stupid, it was Cheney and Rumsfeld and Co. who were war mongers and war profiteers. The entire Iraq nonsense was about ensuring continued income for Cheney's Haliburton et al. Obama has had the sense to go after the terrorists where they really are - Afghanistan/Pakistan.
robertbangkok 2 years ago
There isnt really mainstream controversy over it although a rising deathtoll is going to lead to more calling for withdrawl.
The two main political parties support the efforts, so neither would withrdaw our troops. Now far more troops are being pumped into Afghanistan by America things on the ground will change. It is ashame that most NATO members are not prepared to commit more troops.
TheBritishWatcher 2 years ago
YES! Now you've hit it - NATO (and more correctly the United Nations!!!!!!! - Ha! what a misnomer THAT is!!!!!) needs to take the lead in ALL of these conflicts, not the bloody flaming United States World Police Organization.
robertbangkok 2 years ago
You Brits have suffered about 100x more terrorism than we here in the Colonies. And since the Afghanistan/Pakistan area is the principle source of 90% of the terrorism, you need to be making a greater commitment. Unless of course you are seriously trying to challenge the French for their position in world stature.
robertbangkok 2 years ago
I agree, its about time the British government took this war seriously and committed the correct level of force and resources to deal with this problem.
Sadly they see Afghanistan and previous Iraq as a part time war. Its a full time one and every part of government should focus on winning it. Instead our government is too busy focusing on bloody climate change and other pathetic topics.
TheBritishWatcher 2 years ago
i am from pakistan and familier with the pashtuns and some afghan history and the people, i think if the british and american stay there will be fighting and if they leave there still be fighting. if the british and americans withdraw then at least they wont be facing casualties bcoz the afghans are going to start fighting amoungst themselves, one solution could be that american make a truce with taliban that they can have their government in afghanistan but not allow al qaeda to stay here.
AshfaqDesigns 2 years ago
An interesting solution, In an ideal world that would be a fantastic solution. But the Taliban have been demonised too much by politicians and the media. Any kind of an agreement doesn't sound plausible.
rhymingwithoranges 2 years ago
We must not surrender and allow a regime that oppresses its people to be returned to power. Then the loss of life would truely be wasted.
TheBritishWatcher 2 years ago
the afghans have been occupied by oppressors many times before, back then british didnt come to help, they took their freedom back by themselves, and they will take their freedom back by themselves this time too, you cant possibily say that british are there to free afghans, if so they should have invaded in 1994/1996 when taliban came in control of the country, secondly if thats the logic then when are we launching operation zimbabwe freedom? we are there to eliminate alqaeda.
AshfaqDesigns 2 years ago
We are there because terrorists responsible for a direct attack on a NATO ally were based there and protected by the regime running it. We are there now to try and help the people and increase the strenght of the Afghans armed forces, its democracy and better services.
Our actions today do not compare to previous examples because they were occupations.. this is not an occupation, we want to leave and we will when the threat is reduced and the Afghan security forces can handle the problems.
TheBritishWatcher 2 years ago
Oh complicated. Being that I'm American I have the unfortunate guilt for living somewhere that has sent many a nation to war. I'd really like to say I think we should all come home and have parades for everyone but with all the damage we've done in the region due to war there's no real stable way to make it happen. For the mean time I think staying is the only options that won't make things worse.
letterheadloyalty 2 years ago
We have to leave Afghanistan. We've taken down the Taliban, and we can just increase security in our country to stop any terrorist or anarchist attacks from happening.
This war is costing lives, and the troops will be safer back home than they will be fighting the war!
Writerofthebizzarre 2 years ago
The taliban is still there and if Britain pulls out the other small contributors will as well leaving just America which would put huge pressure on them to withdraw too quickly as well.
We need a successful Pakistan and Afghanistan, this is vital for our long term national security there for the troops must remain.
Now the operation itself is being handled very badly because of Brown and co. We need far more troops there and far more resources.
TheBritishWatcher 2 years ago
If you one does some research about the nature of Afghans and their history with invaders,, it will come to a conclusioin that inorder to rule the afghans, you will have to wipe them out,, cuz a living afghan will fight you to the last drop of their blood.
SabirAyaz 2 years ago
SabirAyaz there is a big difference between what happened in the past and today. NATO troops in Afghanistan are not occupying the country and we do not want to stay. Previous "invaders" didnt want to go there, train up their army, give their people lots of aid and help in developing civil society then leave.
Those that say we should accept Afghan history that this war can never be "won" need to see its a completly different mission
TheBritishWatcher 2 years ago
Its all very well saying we should stop the terrorists in our own country but that is not so easy when we have a huge pakistani community which travels back and forth to that region
Id rather we have a stable pakistan (which needs a stable afghanistan) that are both against terrorism and radical islam
"The troops will be safer back home" duh, but if we are not going to use our armed forces whats the point in having them? We are there because 67 British people died on 9/11 and NATO was attacked
TheBritishWatcher 2 years ago
I would need to know more about it, because it seems whenever I take a side, some news comes out that completely changes my mind.
Director705 2 years ago
Firstly, luv your vlogs they always provoke healthy debate. Afghanistan if we (the western world) leave too there will surely be a larger conflict down the line. We need to have bases here to maintain a steady growth in Afghanistans economy. A strong economy provides jobs and education this promotes democracy and capitalism (the western religion) which in turn reduces the possibility of fundamentalism and feudalism. *Note all isms in excess are bad.
coollikeyodais 2 years ago
You be a Mega awesome Cool Dude.
scottklaw 2 years ago
My cousin died in Afghanistan. I think there has been a lot of good done. However, a reassessment of goals and a concentrated effort to bring it to completion quickly is something that's necessary IMO. I don't know that forced democracy should be a goal, as long as terrorists are not in power.
kalaway 2 years ago
I am sorry to hear about your cousin. I agree with you that we need a goal that needs immediate funding so that it can be resolved rapidly. I also agree with you about democracy. But technically, the ousted Taliban were never a terrorist threat to us...
rhymingwithoranges 2 years ago
I didn't hear a word you said, your shirt was too distracting!
juanpablofx 2 years ago
try listening with your eyes closed.
rhymingwithoranges 2 years ago
I did, haha. sorry.
juanpablofx 2 years ago
We should stay, of the recent three big wars (those being Iraq, Afghanistan and Vietnam) Afghanistan is the only one to make sense. Eradicating terrorism is a big thing, and we can't just give up after all that's happened; the soldiers shouldn't have to give up their lives in vain.
One thing that I do dislike is the fact that the western world seems to shove democracy down the throat of everyone else. Just because we're using it doesn't mean it's perfect in any way.
Saaduk92 2 years ago 2
I believe that if the purpose of the war is to fight the Taliban and other terrorist cells in the region it's an excellent idea, so long as the troops sent there are properly supplied and can accurately complete their mission.
If however it is to provide aid, or educate women, then I have to disagree with them being there. If those are our goals they can be provided by charity organizations and the such.
Dracofav 2 years ago
As for creating a democracy, I'm totally opposed. I like democracy as much as the next person, however lets look at where imperialism in the Middle East has gotten us.
The majority of our issues with Iran can probably be dated back to Operation Ajax.
Also let's not forget how difficult democracy can be in a region filled with sectarian violence. We shouldn't repeat historical mistakes by believing we know what is best for a region. Western democracy was not built in a day.
Dracofav 2 years ago
Look at the history, for what it is. No nation has ever created an imported ruling establishment in the history of that country. I know that isn't the goal of the occupation now, but the history serves. Between the terrain, the warlords, the opium, and other influences less tangible like religion and tribal affairs, nothing will be accomplished. It's in the history books, and hopefully I'm wrong, but I don't think there is a chance in hell of positive accomplishment happening.
silvertongue 2 years ago
I wanna go to Afghanistan i heard that they do delicious things with cobras.
S0cialGhost 2 years ago
I'll try and make the blog tv show, tho I've got a date, so if all goes well there might be coffees back at mine.
cheekychen 2 years ago
I'm not British, but I say everyone needs to get out. I feel like there is no progress being made lately and the people there don't really want us (America, Canada, Great Britain, etc.) there. I also feel like the U.S. is there majorly for oil. They can protect it and keep the Middle East from rising the prices.
Heartze 2 years ago
The supposed 'war on terror' would have never had happened if the 9/11 attacks did not take place (and even then people think it was the US government themselves), this war is pointless, innocent people, on both sides, are being killed daily, the British and Americans are crying over a couple of soldiers who were killed, when over the years HUNDREDS if not THOUSANDS of innocent people are dying in Afghanistan.
Wake up world, they havent won now, they never will.
gothgal06 2 years ago
please bring that shirt with you to new york.
it's simply fabulous.
;)
JohnnyDurham19 2 years ago 3
I agree. It shows off the right amount of chest hair ;]
asimplecadence 2 years ago
Snap! I was going to make a comment on how much I liked that shirt! Sadly I can not wear it. Horizontal stripes are not a big guys best friend. Thanks for being awesome Jazza and Johnny!
ANBUop 2 years ago
The Americans and British are there to raise up their little brown brothers in other nations from savagery into the light of enlightened Western freedom, just like they did in the 19th century. It has NOTHING to do with exploitation of natural resources, like it was in the...uh...19th century. THE 19TH CENTURY RACIST COLONIALIST MENTALITY RULES!!! [he writes, with a hint of sarcasm]
MustafaPresents 2 years ago
Send evryone over there, maybe they can learn some culture. And if it doens't work out they can shoot up some weddings and bomb some sheepherders via drone plane. Their culture and way of life is superior and sustainable, that is why the west is there, theirs is not.
mogilny89p 2 years ago
the only ones confused about the war are all the people trying to understand it
i know with out a doubt that the arm forces know what there doing and why they are there and for you and any one not in the arm forces to question there ability and desire to be the best and to do every thing in there power to keep the people safe is just insane. talk with a solder direct and more then one if you may
and he or she will tell you why they need finish and not back down or give up
dexter2433 2 years ago
Maybe books should be dropped in place of bombs: Shakespeare, Byron, Orwell, Susan Hill, Phillip Roth, Gunter Grass, that kind of thing.
timboslayer 2 years ago
I saw the plane carrying soldiers to Lyneham to parade through Wootten Bassett (I live in Calne). You always see people saluting the planes around Lyneham.
hollium 2 years ago
get our boys outta there
god
curlykid1 2 years ago
I am not British, but I will say this:
I don't support the idea of any military from another country going in to another. If one country wishes to defend itself it can easily do so within its own territory as a defence force.
That's my view on this matter anyway. Awesome topic video Jazza :)
keithzworld 2 years ago
cool vid
bakingwithmish 2 years ago
Whilst we should probably revise our tactics (I don't know quite what to do, but I do know we need a change) and now try to establish a structure in which we can eventually withdraw from the country and leave in the hands of their own security forces, much like Iraq, we cannot just pull out now - The Taleban would simply re establish control and use the country as a base of operations - they might then try to destablize Pakistan, which is a big concern as it is nuclear-armed power.
goldanima 2 years ago
I haven't a clue about war, but I would say if Britian has changed Afghanistan for the better then they should stay as if they left, it may all fall apart again.
Wierdly as I was watching this either fireworks or bisley rangers started shooting as there were lots of shots and bangs...
luvhorses946 2 years ago
lets all GTFO!!!
GAMEZILLA50K 2 years ago
nice use of acronyms :P
rhymingwithoranges 2 years ago
I don't really know enough about the war to make an educated comment so I'll just give some general statements on my thoughts on war and let you draw your own conclusions. I believe there will never be peace. War is a part of humanity we must live with and to help others at the risk or loss of your own life is a noble and honourable thing to do.
MegTao 2 years ago
I saw an interview on tv the other day with some head of military who said that the helman (sp?) province is the last key refuge for the terrorists, and once we finish here then we've won the war, which is why the fighting has got so bad recently.
I think the only danger is that it could turn into like the Korean War (they push them back, and we loose tpractically the whole thing).
Also....new background =/
jochannel 2 years ago
it's more dangerous to cross a road then be a soldier in Afghanistan
xjabi 2 years ago
oh and i think its about time the Government gave the MOD a little cash to finish kitting out all the Hc3 Chinnoks that have been sitting at RAF Odiham for god knows how long.
lomasca 2 years ago
British and Americans should leave.There is no victory when there is no clear objective. Our mission was to hunt down/eiminate the Taliban and thats impossible.George Bush promised not to get into nation-building and im sorry British were dragged into the conflict. The fact of the matter is we have broken the law bombing nuclear Pakistan without authority from our congress and we are getting bogged down just like Soviets and we will have to stop when we run out of money and/or soldiers to die.
UberSciFiNerd 2 years ago
Theres a lot of reasons were in Afghanistan. Afghansitan was in a huge mess when the taliban took over. Women had no rights what so ever, they couldnt see a doctor, couldnt go out of the house without a male relative, couldnt work or go to school and were flogged many times for no reason also were forced to cover themselves from head to toe and were not aloud on TV Listening to music became illegal aswell as men shaving their beards and flying kites.
MalaryLovesBlink182 2 years ago
We needed to get the taliban out of that country in order to save the Afghan people. The taliban are still trying to regain power and if they do they will continue where they left off taking all the Afghan's rights away aswell they will become a breeding ground for international terrorist attacks and put the whole world at danger. Staying in Afghanistan is a very big deal. We have to get the country to where they should be. Get them out of poverty, start a democracy government, and
MalaryLovesBlink182 2 years ago
make sure that they will be able to defend themselves against the taliban if they try to regain power. We've put so much money towards this war and have accomplished so much we cant just leave and give up. Its just going to take a while to help this country since its been corrupt for so long. the amount of deaths in this war is actually nothing compared to the millions lost in most wars so i dont see why its such a big issue.
srry couldnt fit all the words into 1 comment
MalaryLovesBlink182 2 years ago
Wonderful comment & a very good argument. But the fact is we did not enter Afganistan because we thought the government there is unfair. Yes, I do believe we should stay there and make the country stable enough to survive on it;s own steam, it is our duty now we have entered. But I don't believe right now we are doing things right. We need to have one big goal. One reason for being there, push that reason to the Afgans and our own people, complete that goal and leave the place; hopefully better.
rhymingwithoranges 2 years ago
Is killing bad people good? I think it can be but it comes with inevitable costs.
sach3 2 years ago
You can't just split people into good guys and bad guys. Yes, members of the taliban are being killed. But many of them are young people who have been educated and raised by the group. Many civilians also die in the conflict, our own people die in the conflict. We have to ask ourselves the question as to whether these casualties are worth the cost, of money and life. In wars the bad guys aren't the only ones that get killed unfortunately.
rhymingwithoranges 2 years ago
I totally agree. I was being very basic in my comment. I think that terrorists would only get stronger and have greater means of inflicting terror on their own people and others if our military was not there. Military intervention is just one way to aid in the attack on terrorism. Of course, it's a war, innocent people are going to be killed and recruited. So it's always going to be a reason not to go to war. In any job which concerns the protection of people there is high risk involved.
sach3 2 years ago
I think Brown should pull out UK troops! But I might be saying this because I think we shouldn't have any war anywhere at the moment, because citizens of the countries in which we have troops do not know anything about progress in the war and if it is actually helping or not. Support the troops by getting them home safe.
emmfan09 2 years ago
The citizens are very aware of the progress in the war! The women now have rights, they can go to school, work, go out of their house,and arent forced to be completely covered from head to toe The Afghan people are very aware of the rights they have recieved back because of the troops there and there have been spokes people from afghanistan that were there during taliban ruling and when the troops went in and have stated how greatful they were
MalaryLovesBlink182 2 years ago
I really don't know. Can terrorism actually be fought and defeated? Its a loaded question. Something should be done but I'm afraid I lack the wisdom to come up with the appropriate path to take.
Agriking 2 years ago
It does feel like we are sometimes fighting a concept rather than a physical enemy. And the thing is, you can't beat a concept, no matter how many people you bomb. If anything conflict fuels and backs it up.
rhymingwithoranges 2 years ago
I really didn't understand why British troops or American troops were there until we read The Kite Runner in Lit Honors this past school year. I think we need to finish it out, but really, I don't know. I agree with some other comments about the UN. I remember learning while doing our model UN in school that they kind of are not really putting much input into the Afghanistan War. I agree with Jazza, we need a clear goal to keep us there to finish it out. :/ I hope this comment made some sense.
birdrage 2 years ago 2
It made wonderful sense. Thankyou.
:)
rhymingwithoranges 2 years ago
your welcome:)
MalaryLovesBlink182 2 years ago
Fighting for peace, yeah right. The world revolution is coming and soon.
rollsthepaul 2 years ago
What revolution is this? I haven't heard of it, I wana piece of the action!
rhymingwithoranges 2 years ago
we do need to take our soldiers out of afghanistan, however, if we wish to maintain the progress we have made so far, we should leave a sort of defensive or protective force so that all the progress that will/has be/been made will not unravel and go backwards, or decline even further.
LavenderCullen 2 years ago
But I don't think leaving some protective troops there now would work. There is still massive conflict happening and they would be bombarded by the Taliban. It will (hopefully) work in Iraq because the threat had been eradicated. Wee need to make significant progress if we are going to leave people there.
rhymingwithoranges 2 years ago
Comment removed
sl1993locko 2 years ago
We need to finish what we started...well what the Americans started in the 80's and we joined in on. The conflict is central not only to ensuring the freedom of a population that hasn't enjoyed any sort of realistic liberty in many years (for some group such liberties have never existed), but also it is crucial to stemming the flow of illegal drug production. The war is about the security of many nations on many levels. Some people see only the immediate impact, they should look deeper.
OSUbrit 2 years ago
A lot of that drug production is also legal, opium in the bases of many drugs used in industry and medicine. It is a pillar of the economy and I feel the destroying of it will ultimately be detrimental to the country.
rhymingwithoranges 2 years ago
Obama is helping Afghan opium farmers find other ways of making a living and other crops to farm in order to slow down the opium farming.
MalaryLovesBlink182 2 years ago
Why would you want to slow down the opium farming? Where do you think all those pain killers they give you at the hospital come from? Most of them come from opium. If anything, since it's a big part of their economy, they should be helped with the opium farming and just add other crops to give them a stronger economy. There's nothing wrong with helping them move into other industries as well but you can't kill their major source of livelihood and one of our major source of opium.
unclesaboin 2 years ago
no idea mate. I'm just as indecisive as you on this one.
mooxim 2 years ago
Once again we've tried to inflict our type of democracy, welcome or not - it's unlawful for the amount of civillians injured. And to be honest that cannot be tolerated. it's time for the UN or some higher authority to step it up and sort out why we are there, if we should be there at all AND what we are trying to achieve in the long term. I agree with Jazza's comment reply, no one seems to REALLY know what's going on over there :( x
CheekTV 2 years ago 2
With an undefined war of aggression, we opened ourselves up as occupying forces, not liberators. We need to withdraw, as our Governments have not the best intentions for the region or it's people
darktoadthesticky 2 years ago
have you ever considered being an MP? i'd vote for you..
collinslfc 2 years ago 2
Maybe in the distant future. But certainly not for a long time yet.
rhymingwithoranges 2 years ago
It's the same story in Canada. I don't think there is a possibility of installing a democracy in Afghanistan because the country will be torn apart . In the past, we have seen that imposing a governement to a country has not worked: Korean war, Vietnam war ( only to name a few). In the end, I think that the UN should intervene with the Trusteeship Council. Also, I believe we should gradually withdraw all military forces from Afghanistan.
Carpediem161 2 years ago
But what more could the UN do? Add more troops to the mix? I am not familiar with the Trusteeship Council. Please explain.
:)
rhymingwithoranges 2 years ago
The Trusteeship Council was formed originally during the decolonization of Africa. Basicly, the council would help the old colonies with their new independent government. Now since the Trusteeship has done its purpose, I think the UN should reinvent it and make the council help countries who have just come out of the war (Afghanistan).
Carpediem161 2 years ago