(MIRROR) Adam Kokesh body slammed, choked, police brutality at Jefferson Memorial

[HRRyan2]

cops are told to yell stop resisting whether someone is actually resisting or not.

[Darusdei]

well i guess this explains why u.s. incarcarates more people than any other country in the world and has the biggest prison population on the planet...

"land of the free" ooh the irony :p

[geffel]

@Darusdei

It IS ironic.

In fact I saw a chart this morning that shows the prison population of each country. America wins by a factor of 2 to 1 over the next largest. Iceland, Japan, the more civilised northern European countries and Nepal have the lowest number of incarcerations. Of course the US has the highest number of privatised prisons in the world, which is of course just a coincidence.

[DonQuixotedeKaw]

This is why the first amendment implies that theocracy is the only form of speech that is to be discouraged, & considered seditious. Theocracies always create police states, that brutalize in order to stop all forms of speech that are NOT sycophantic to the state theocracies incantations. Money worshipers require conformity and subjugation, just as forcefully as any other perversions of faiths into tyrannies.

Welcome to the new inquisition. But if you think this is bad, talk to Bradly Manning.

[Vidar33]

I'm so very glad I don't live in the USA. I live in the Netherlands, and the police around here are professional and patient, not legalised thugs on a powertrip.

[kevin108]

"This kind of thing should have ended when Bush was kicked out."

It would appear your concept of what your "new" president stands for is incorrect.

[ifly135]

Play syupid games, win stupid prizes.

[LiftedShooter]

What has happened to my country?

[JustaEropeanGuy]

Why are they protecting the monument to someone who's values don't understand!??

[JustaEropeanGuy]

I don't fucking get it. Why can't you dance in public?

[JustaEropeanGuy]

For the laaaand of the meek and the home of the lame.

[theatheistgal]

Should go to the orginal video. People are defending the law. Well its the law they say. Well that law should never been a law.. get it.

[Hereticbooks]

Welcome to America!

[debbieomi]

I wish I lived close to DC. They are planning another "Dance" for this Saturday.

[dtm52]

We need to arrest the so called cops.

[kelliko70]

When I went to DC to visit family they took me to the Jefferson Memorial. I read the quotes on the walls and it was almost a holy experience for me. I wanted to be a photojournalist and writer. Jefferson was god-like to my young mind. This video has shown to me a desecration to the very principles I believed in so hard. My inner child died a little more today.

[rayruiz12345]

Next day, the statue somehow walked away

[no1saphead]

Some cops need the week off without pay.

[flyingfisbeefilms]

Oh dear!

[HRRyan2]

Why is our freedom only as good as allowed by the police enforcing laws, and not all the freedoms under the law? This is bullshit.

[HRRyan2]

stunned. that's all i can say.

[0x8x0]

This would be unthinkable in my country...

[geffel]

@0x8x0

Well obviously you don't live in the Land of the Free!

[0x8x0]

@geffel And I'm thankful for that: only a few Creationists, no megachurches, no guns, relatively low crime rate, social security, healthcare. Through extensive travel and international contacts I have rather come to love my country. It's not perfect, but very well habitable. :)

[0x8x0]

LOL, "land of the free"?

[geffel]

@0x8x0

That's what they call it...

Where are you from?

[0x8x0]

@geffel Somewhere in old Europe.

[fuckoverload]

It's a beautiful thing to behold, is it not, when the state begins acting like a hate-filled disciplinarian step-parent. The Taliban hate dancing too, but thank goodness the freedom-loving USA is there to wipe out such affronts to humanity.

[unixhead101]

So now it's illegal to move in a rythmic fashion? Absolutely unbelievable! This can't be right... can it?

[PostSurgeOperative]

@unixhead101 They were not arrested for dancing. Kokesh and his merry klavern of teabaggers were arrested for demonstrating INSIDE THE ROTUNDA without a permit. Not only were they warned by the cops, but they were also explicitly advised by Kokesh that participants in this 'protest' should expect to be arrested.

It is a crime to disobey a lawful order of a police official, and it is a crime to resist a lawful arrest. Imo, they're LUCKY they were only charged with demonstrating without a permit.

[unixhead101]

@PostSurgeOperative Wow I had no idea that they were a unit of the Klu Klux Klan! Thanks for that, it's always good to get the correct information.

[SpiritKeeper]

Hmm, i would think police brutality is going in with a nightstick, that was a pretty big guy, if he was being deliberately unco-operative i'm not sure how else i could have cuffed him. I don't know enough about the situation, why is dancing a protest? Is there a new law prohibiting that in a public place? The officers seemed to be fairly cool, so i don't think i'd call it unwarranted force.

[geffel]

@SpiritKeeper

I'd say picking up a man and slamming him onto the floor constitutes unnecessary force, by my standards at least. After all, these people were just standing about dancing, not exactly assault on a cop.

We've also been seeing this kind of thing in the UK; famously, the case of Jody McIntyre being dragged out of his wheelchair during last winter's student protests. A couple of years ago a man was beaten & killed by police as he made his way home from work during a protest. It's bad.

[SpiritKeeper]

@geffel i don't think we can equate the two, the officer was asking the guy to drop to his knees, and was attempting to get his hands behind his back. The officer was being very clear abouot this, and the guy wasn't co-operating, evading the officer and keeping his arms out. The guy wasn't being violent by any means, but he was being deliberately unco-operative. The officer didn't lose control, and dropped him - and in a similar situation i think i'd do the same.

[geffel]

@SpiritKeeper

We used to call it 'civil disobedience'.

The point is the cope were repeatedly asked which law was being broken and the cops couldn't answer. I have no doubt those people spent 48 hours locked up and were released without being formally charged because the people weren't doing anything wrong.

[SpiritKeeper]

@geffel well sure, i instinctively support the protest itself, and i'm certain that it fell as you describe - but i don't think this is police brutality by any means, nor excessive force given the size of that guy. I'm happy that people are protesting, but that should be the focus of people's attention. Cops can be real dicks, and i've seen cases where a cop or cops are outnumbered, feel threatened and lash out - and i don't think that was the case here.

[mecher3k]

@SpiritKeeper

Fascist.

[PostSurgeOperative]

@geffel Mr. Kokesh is no civil rights leader. He is a neo-confederate teabagging self-promoter who uses his RT program to misinform the public about our rights, responsibilities, and duties under the law, as well as the facts regarding the purpose, scope, and function of govt rules and regulations. He has the right to oppose govt regulations, but no one has the 'right' to violate those rules, or to disobey a lawful order of a police official, or to resist a lawful arrest.

[PostSurgeOperative]

1st Amendment rights includes the right to petition the govt for redress of grievance; Mr. Kokesh made no effort to address his concerns lawfully, either through his legal representatives or through the US Park Service's policy process.

I've participated in organizing dozens of parades, protests, demonstrations, etc, to affect change at the local, state, and federal level, and often a permit of some kind was required. I've never been denied a permit. Mr. Kokesh never even applied for one.

[Hereticbooks]

@PostSurgeOperative

Whatever side of the political spectrum this guy is from, it's still wrong. I can't imagine going to a public place and not be able to hug and move about with my partner. Freedom of expression is for all of us, not just those of our own political persuasion.

[PostSurgeOperative]

@Hereticbooks Again, the dancing was not the issue. The issue is that they participated AS A GROUP in a political demonstration without obtaining a permit.

The Park Service has the right to enforce rules and regulations, just as librarians have the right to ask you to shut your trap when you're browsing through the stacks. You have the right to petition the govt to change rules with which you disagree, just as you have the right to address the library's board of trustees regarding their rules.

[Hereticbooks]

@PostSurgeOperative

I didn't hear a single slogan, nor see a single placard.

[PostSurgeOperative]

@Hereticbooks Whether they had signage or sloganeering is totally irrelevant to the question of whether they were in fact in violation of US Park Service rules.

Go read Kokesh's FB page. Read the tweets from TJDanceParty. They announced their intent long before they committed their acts of 'civil disobedience.' Kokesh and his brigade of malcontents was perfectly aware of the possible consequences of his actions. They were advised by the cops they would be arrested if they violated Park Rules.

[whoarentyou]

@PostSurgeOperative

Park rules are not laws. So they would have to be arrested for trespassing if they refused to leave. You can't just lock someone up for the weekend without pressing any charges on them. That would be sending them directly to jail for punishment, with no trial, no charges.

[whoarentyou]

As that is what the officer threatened them with. Being locked up in jail, without any charges.

[Hereticbooks]

@PostSurgeOperative

Jefferson was ALL FOR "civil disobedience" in the face of tyrrany. I'm afraid on this issue, we'll have to agree to disagree. Peace.

[geffel]

@PostSurgeOperative

I'm really not concerned with how right-wing this Kokesh individual is. Can you not see that, from any angle, locking people up for hugging and/or dancing is an affront to freedom?

Again, the cop actively ignores the question "what law is that?" The reason for this is because he does not know what the law is, presumably because there is no law that prevents people from hugging and dancing in a public place.

[PostSurgeOperative]

@geffel Kokesh, et alia, were not arrested for hugging and/or dancing; they were arrested for conducting a political demonstration without a permit, in violation of NPS rules.

Kokesh, et al, KNEW which laws they intended to violate that day, and broadcast their intent on the internet. NPS cops are not obliged to cite case law before making an arrest.

Again, Kokesh, et al, made no effort to obtain a permit, nor did they petition their congressional representatives or the NPS to change the law.

[insightnew]

@PostSurgeOperative I saw the police telling people they could not video tape in a public place. That was not a lawful order. It was a lie. I saw the police telling people they need permits to video tape. Another lie. He even stated that the press could not video tape. Yet another lie. Dancing in public is not a crime. Kissing in public is not a crime. So what happened here was far from lawful on the part of the police.

Member ACLU :-)

[PostSurgeOperative]

@insightnew The cop didn't say people needed a permit, he asked if they HAD a permit.

The fact is, cops can lie to you while they are conducting an investigation, affecting an arrest, etc. They can lie to you. This is a fact. If you don't believe me, then fine, explain your legal theories to the judge.

But since no one was charged with 'videotaping in a public space,' and no one was forced to turn off their cameras, I doubt that you or anyone else has any legal basis for such a complaint, LOL!

[geffel]

@PostSurgeOperative

Yeah not really.

[PostSurgeOperative]

@geffel They were charged with 'demonstrating without a permit', and were released within a couple of hours after being arrested.

Mr. Kokesh and his group KNEW in advance which laws they intended to violate. The federal court ruling they were 'protesting' was issued in January. If they were TRULY concerned with changing US Park Service rules and regulations, they could have exercised their 1st Amendment right to petition the govt for redress of grievance.

nps. gov/aboutus/lawsandpolicies. html

[SpiritKeeper]

@geffel i'd probably agree with you if i thought the officers were out of control and gave no warning, but that's not the impression i get from the video.

[Aspartame69]

Someone needs to visit these worthless pigs and arrest them in the most anally penetrating way possible.