Why do people believe in something totally illogical when we have logical, scientific answers.When you throw a rock into the water that's what it's going to do,drop into the water, every time.It's just plain logic and so embracing scientific answers should be the logical thing for everyone to do.But peoples egos just won't have it that they won't be living on forever and ever.Especially those who were denied something here in life that they think they might achieve in a wonderful afterlife.
Oh I just lol right away at the very beginning where inmendham can barely contain himself while professoranton is talking. This is gonna be a good one.
Respect to Cory for getting in the ring with Gary, but, that's about it. How many times did Cory say "I don't know what to say to that?"? Cory might as well have thrown in the towel.
Reminds me of the dueling philosophies presented in the movie~ I Heart Huckabees. A meaningful holistic interconnected worldview vs a meaningless disconnected existence of cruelty and betrayal.Hah! Thanks guys
@krll98 A "psychopath" so concerned with the welfare of sentient beings that he believes that it would have been better for us never to have been born because of the suffering we all inevitably experience?
Strange kind of psychopath.
But of course you weren't actually being serious, were you?
The main problem with Gary's philosophy is this: He applies a metric to suffering and joy such that any suffering greatly out weighs the joy. Feeding hundreds of hungry people is a drop in a bucket, but someone who dies from cancer is an entire ocean. So to Gary the good we can do can never empty the ocean of sorrow his condition has made out of life.
Inmendham needs to take a fukking chil pill. You cant rationalise and condem lives witch you havent experienced. Its arogant, foolish and disrespectfull.
@MakkaPakka666 Wisdom? locking yourself in an apartment, excluding yourself from sosiety and rationalising life to death from a strangers poin of viev you call wisdom!? No. Wisdom is meeting the world and having experience, not condeming it and daming it with the lexikon as the bible. But ive beet you love this man, he is a great filosofer for those who need to justufie theyr own shitty acts. I mean if we all are shit why not be true to our selves right?
I don't know if this is a mirror or what. I don't agree with person A's christian additions to everything a person does, but Gary is just a walking mass of complexes. He's so lost in his own screwwy logical world he can't even see the big contradictions he makes.
@djancak that was a long video, and I honestly don't remember if there was a particular one that stuck out during it. One thing I remember was his saying that people can live perfectly fine lives in other countries using a tenth of the resources per person that we do in the US, which strongly contradicted his saying that most people in 3rd world countries like that are in a state of constant suffering.
I feel like there's something childish about the Inmendman's way of thinking. I agree that the world is horrific, but not with the apparent conclusion that we should sit around shouting about it, and that nobody should be allowed to have children. This in no way would end global suffering; who's to say that a new species wouldn't just replace humans as the main destroyers the future? This plan is not productive, to use his term. Maybe we should all just be robots, crafted to these ideals?
Ok, hum... philosophicals opinions aside (I´m with Inmendham for the most part), I think Anton really showed himself to be a polite and civil individual. Really enjoyed his elegance on the debate. Props for that. Cheers
Re-watched this dialogue, Gary showed very little respect and/or understanding for the professor's perspective, clearly Anton showed restraint and in many ways won this debate, I am an antinatalism not as Gary (Inmendham/GloomBoomDoom) coined an "efilist" this is his new radical "implement antinatalism for the world" group. Antinatalism is not a position that Gary respects in a democratic sense of the word, he wants to label it an objective fact/truth, while it is clearly psychological.
@Metalheadtill1die or Gary is such an cynical and bitter asshole about life that he wish to drag everyone else into the shit hole with him you can just say that LOL
@Sarahon06 I don't write off what we know about physics, and I didn't mean to suggest ignoring as much of reality as we can grasp. But even some of the greatest laws of physics are not fully understood... gravitation and thermodynamics seem to contradict themselves when looked at on a Universal scale. (The Universe is clumping instead of dispersing.) We can't write off the possibility that what we believe are immutable laws are actually flexible attributes.
@Sarahon06 I don't write off what we know about physics, and I didn't mean to suggest ignoring as much of reality as we can grasp. But even some of the greatest laws of physics are not fully understood... gravitation and thermodynamics seem to contradict themselves when looked at on a Universal scale. (The Universe is clumping instead of dispersing.) We can't write off the possibility that what we believe are immutable laws are actually flexible attributes.
@flyingdrifter Existential despair is not the sign of a neurosis--it's quite normal actually. What makes it abnormal, however, is when a masochist sees Life as only horror and suffering, and then within his own psychodrama, casts himself as some all-sacrificing (all-feeling) hero & the rest of humanity as unfeeling "weasels and morons" and people who have babies as evil (morally wrong); who also equates gassing two-year-olds with pork sandwiches. It's laughable, but also tiresomely tragic.
@flyingdrifter The only thing you have "exposed" is your own hidden (unconscious) teleological definition when you call life a "failed experiment," thinking it should be any kind of experiment in the first place. Therefore, your attempt to make Life fit into the Procrustean bed of this neurotic definition is the actual failure.
@flyingdrifter Like I said, by you calling it an "experiment," by defining it as such--you are exposing your own teleological presumption of what life *should* be. And then when it does not meet the expectation of what you think the experiment should be, you say that it--the experiment--is a failure, and completely disregard (or are unconscious to the fact) that it is YOU that has the expectation. Life simply is. And just because it fails your neurotic expectations, doesn't make it a failure.
@fly "Nihilism doesn't care about sentience." No, to be exact, nihilism doesn't care about anything; & wanting to end all life is nihilistic. Anti-natalism is based upon the frustration of a teleological assumption--that life (& suffering) should have a meaning, but b/c it does not, it should be ended. Both you and the religious person have the same teleological foundation for your belief-system. But yours is different because your solution (heaven) to suffering is ending life? LOL.
@flying Nope. By calling it an experiment--chemical or otherwise--you are making the exact same fallacy of intent as a the religious person. You call it a "chemical experiment," they call it a "divine experiment," but both imply a teleological assumption, and this is exactly what Prof. Anton hits upon when he says there's a hidden religiosity in "ant-natalism." You expose your own unconscious *frustrated* "point of existence," which is the cause of your own neurotic fatalism.
@fly By calling life an experiment--by defining it as such--you are making a teleological assumption: same thing religious fundamentalists do. Both of you--"anti-natalists" and fundamentals--feel entitled to pronounce what kind of experiment is Life , *then* enforce some kind of judgment (no babies, heaven, hell, etc.). The truth is, you have NO idea what Life really is or is "supposed to be," and just because you fail at finding a meaning, doesn't mean you speak for the rest of humanity.
@f I mean, honestly, I'm supposed to out-argue this pseudo-philosophy--this neurotic fatalism, a slap-dash of Janism, utilitarianism, & nihilism--by a man who strikes me as a clinical masochist personality type? Who thinks the suffering of a pork sandwich is equal to gassing a two-year-old in her sleep, if the video I watched about him has any truth in it? Sorry. Unless I'm being paid to listen, I'm not wasting any more energy on this. You cannot out-agrue a neurotic out of his perception.
@fl The question of suffering is an individual one, and it is up to the individual to take responsibility for his own suffering--to find meaning in it--not to blame others because they have babies. Yes, man is a finite being; yes, his conditions are limited; yes, suffering is unavoidable. But you, as a human being, always have the power to decide your attitude. So, in that regard, man is ultimately free, and not the pawn and plaything of circumstance--contrary to what the neurotic claims.
@flying Practice what you advocate on yourself before asking others to do the same, if you want to play this holier-than-thou game & criticize those who have babies. Why not end the suffering of others you're creating by undoing the mistake of your birth with a very late-term abortion? (I am only joking.)
Life is only all-consuming horror and death and suffering? No. That's only 1 part, which is magnified & distorted through this masochistic lens of neurotic fatalism, "anti-natalism."
@f "Does Gary try to separate life from death (suffering) you, moron?" Does Gary advocate the ending of suffering by the ending of life because to live is to suffer? Yes: b/c he refuses to see that the two are one and can *not* be separated, which is why he wants to preemptively end life. Yet I'm supposed to take seriously a man who sees no difference in eating a pork sandwich and gassing a two-year-old? The level of clinical masochism exhibited by him and neurotic acolytes is staggering.
@f Same old neurotic ranting. Suffering is a part of life, and life is a part of suffering. There is no causal connection between the two: the two are one. It is you who wants to play this imaginary division game, ratiocinating about "accountability,"; you who do not accept responsibility for your own failure to find meaning in your own suffering. All neurotics sees themselves as perpetual victims--pawns of chance. I have been a hospice volunteer. How many dying people have you helped to die?
Anti-natalism = neurotic fatalism. Neurotics believe themselves the helpless victims of circumstance beyond their control (SUFFERING!). We are free--free to choose meaning--attitude--no matter the suffering. You cannot separate life from death (suffering). Failure to acknowledge this is the neurotic's failure to take responsibility for his own failure to find meaning in his suffering, i.e., how "anti-natalists (really: masochists) see the world.
perhaps conversational narcissism?? doesnt Gary like suspension of thought?? nahh!! too boring! much better to yell non stop and swear!!! dialogue from Anton + support response, shift response from Gary. but this has been brilliant, to me the best comment that of barwanderer: freaking exhausting!! indeed!! cool
There is a problem in this dialogue, Corey is talking as one while Gary is talking about the whole, and there are many layers that this dialogue can be discussed. When you were six years old Gary you knew you wanted to be happy it is your dominate factor, when you grew up you found all this injustice and hardship that makes you angry.
I can relate to both of you I don't watch the news because when I do it makes me sick to the stomach to see peopling dying for no apparent reason, no one has the right to do this. The other reason is that after watching it I feel like crap! This may sound selfish I don’t want to feel like crap and live in fear f being stabbed; I don’t want to see all those people in pain
More importantly I think that the news promotes violence, crimes and the suffering in the world. Why the hell there is no good news there is good people in the world, that are doing good things and if others heard about these people they too will also feel encouraged in joining in help ease someone’s suffering.
We will never be able to solve the suffering and injustice in the world if we don’t come together as humanity as one… so as long as there are racism, countries, cultures, religions and political idiots that are running the sates then injustice will proceed and maybe develop probably get worse.
People need to get involved more I mean this on any scale possible or valid to those individuals. Do something about it for your own sake so you can sleep at night thinking I did my bit because that is really what you can do, but people end up talking about it rather than doing.
I strongly disagree that every pleasure I have will only ever serve me, myself… and no I am not talking about sex…When I give money to charity I benefit them and benefit myself. When I offered to carry a bag for an 88 year old women last week I felt exhilarated high and she was so grateful.
The point that I am trying to make here is that my motive for action then wasn’t pleasure, although I felt pleasure. And I would have never known that I would experience that pleasure if I hadn’t taken that action. Talk less do more!
You can't say my existense is no longer connected and then say that my very existence is affecting you by the use of the resources at my disposal. That is a conflict and truth can not exist in conflict, unless the conflict itself is they truth. :)
I do not disagree that we can apply ourselves and our minds to many issues we face, but here again, who do we step on in order to have the world the way a few or even many want to have.
The gentleman with the hair is a classic case of disconnect. Complete with identification with his own front man. Scary aberration of exteme dualistic paradigm.
"...intelligence always reveals itself..." Once again... "...intelligence is a psychological word" or concept; thus, psychology and philosophy compliment one another....like bread and butter. :-)
I have drawn the conlusion that Inmendham is a stuipd moron that does not care about anyone on this earth. He his completely powerless to do anything try and stop anyone of us from doing what we want. He is a direct threat to society and to the rest of this world in my opinoin.
Corey is withholding the position that life is meaningless, and it is up to the individual to sort through the ambiguity and find a personal, subjective meaning.
Gary, like corey, withholds the view that life is meaningless, but he sees the ambiguity as a totality of negativity, (i.e. "trash").
So, in a way they agree, but corey thinks life has value and gary doesn't.
One issue about this dialogue is the difference between religious and scientific approaches to understanding life. You want to find the person in this dialogue who is "religious"? Well, wait. I mean the one who is religious in their beliefs and the one who is spiritual ? Which of the two speaks more like a frothy mouthed preacher?
@batfly Antinatalism is about not having children. Ending all sentient life in the universe has nothing to do with having children or not. Life ends when we die (for us). That is the truth.
@batfly I´m just saying that "not having children" is not the same as "ending all sentient life in the universe". That´s not even a goal. A goal has to be realistic, and even if someone wanted to "end all sentient life in the universe" of course it could not be done.
Is too much complexity looks like chaos for those who can’t understand it?
It seems that the old age tried to get the answer through a metaphysical explanation in a specific way, like Adam and Eve for existence, and as this failed, the new age tries to get it through something like chaos, the common thing between the two is really finding the relive by having an answer, while the truth is they have no fuckin clue!
Healthy cell to Mr Cancer cell: "To metastasize and corrupt every living cell in the body will inevitably kill the body including yourself. Please stop because that is just pure insanity."
Mr Cancer cell to a healthy cell: "To kill the body including myself is insanity? Why is that?"
Misanthropes are bitter and miserable wretches. Their only purpose in life is to corrupt happy people into being miserable until they achieve one huge misanthropic suicidal borg like cube.
Sterile planets has no meaning when there is no sentient intelligence to appreciate anything.
The professor nailed it when he accused Gary of being religious... Y'all are actually more radical than popular dogmatic religions... You're worse than Scientology...
You all are no different than a lame Jim Jones kool-aide drinking cult.
The universe does not need any sentient life to continue.
Things like planets do not need humans to appreciate their existance, this "meaning" only exists for you.
Your thinking that planet earth, which is filled with ignorant life forms that are romanticizing about life is the standart in the universe, but it isn't.
Aye. Gary's a pessimist (and cynic). Not entirely new or original: he has many progenitors, which is perfectly ok, though he's far less enjoyable and revealing than his philosophic forefathers. But Gary fails on many points: he has never even attempted to established his morally prescriptive position. He presupposes it and everything unfolds from there. Normatively speaking (epistemically) what reason is there to be a moral realist?
Because Gary is passionate about his position (he knows how to scream and insult) is simply no reason at all. Consumption, reproduction, cannibalism and addiction (the last two are superfluous relative to the first two)... I don't think he's compelling in his reduction of life to said matters: of course life involves consumption and reproduction, but it certainly isn't reducible to them. He's like a Christian who is still pining over the discovery of God's death.
Life is consumption (eating food everyday) , reproduction (producing new generations). They are the key components. Take them away and you have no life.
He seems to demand infinite chains of justification as regards 'meaning;' forgetting that it's not unjustified to take an Aspirin when one has a headache because the universe may die a heat death billions of years from now; the act, the contemplation, aesthetic appeal, these are often experienced as intrinsically justified in themselves. Of course, he never even accounts for the word 'justification' and his use of it either.
"forgetting that it's not unjustified to take an Aspirin when one has a headache because the universe may die a heat death billions of years from now;" I dont think Gary would deny that. But someones behaviour in the world says nothing about the truth surrounding it. Otherwise naive realism would make sense because "well durr a rock is a rock derp".
"he has never even attempted to established his morally prescriptive position." - Lol hes similar to Schopenhauer then! :-P
Way to twist the argument, the holocaust was bad because of suffering. You cant justify the suffering. Death is preferable to suffering according to Gary.
Theres no inconsistency whatsoever. And once again "Gary is darth vader and hitler and pol pot DURRR HURR DERP!" gets pretty tiring...
I agree... if there is unmitigated suffering death is preferable. However there isn't unmitigated suffering... So to want to end all Sentient life is insanity.
The only thing tiring is sincere people continuing to debate with insane belligerence.
@batfly If what you're saying is true I would like to see an instance where Gary has promoted murder instead of birth reduction? It seems clear, in this video at least, that the only thing he promotes "murdering" are fetus' which I have to agree don't seem to possess nearly the same amount of sentience as a cow which most people eat on a daily basis for mere comfort.
Pick a word any word or any label ...Genocide, Murder, extermination, euthanasia ... it is academic. Gary's philosophy ultimately culminates in the extinction of ALL sentient life on this planet and indeed the ENTIRE universe (See this video for your one example)
Or see this video watch?v=KwpiAyy8Bgs
Heck watch any inmendham video... if he's not talking about how fucking awesome he is and how everyone else SUCKS then he is talking about ending ALL SENTIENT LIFE.
@batfly If it's the button concept you're talking about he's stated in many videos it's a THOUGHT EXPERIMENT. He's later gone on to discuss a sort of raffle system for how many children you can have. And even in this very video he talks about how increased public education would help. Sounds like murder.
But the reality is this is about YOUR lifestyle and not philosophy. You either eat meat, feel a social obligation to have children or own pets. Just like everyone else who hates Inmendham. cont
love both of you guys, enjoyed this
gary12211 2 days ago
Why do people believe in something totally illogical when we have logical, scientific answers.When you throw a rock into the water that's what it's going to do,drop into the water, every time.It's just plain logic and so embracing scientific answers should be the logical thing for everyone to do.But peoples egos just won't have it that they won't be living on forever and ever.Especially those who were denied something here in life that they think they might achieve in a wonderful afterlife.
carrboygirl 4 days ago
Oh I just lol right away at the very beginning where inmendham can barely contain himself while professoranton is talking. This is gonna be a good one.
carrboygirl 4 days ago
This is so depressing
BearWindAppleyard 5 days ago
15:00 I just love gary
lookatmepleasesir 1 week ago 2
when did Sam from Cheers start doing philosophical videos?
SFreedberg1 2 weeks ago
Respect to Cory for getting in the ring with Gary, but, that's about it. How many times did Cory say "I don't know what to say to that?"? Cory might as well have thrown in the towel.
DeterministicOne 2 weeks ago
'Popetuating' is not a word. Intelligence reveals the word is 'perpetuating'.
eldorado61guy 2 weeks ago
Anton posed some important questions and Inmendham kept his temper in check, i watched all of this and i enjoyed it. Thanks.
SirGunishment 2 weeks ago
Their positions are best summarized at 1:09:24 to 10:11. Great that you guys got together for this.
MsMrNoface 3 weeks ago
all is rite ~ as long as I don't receive any more troll-tarded replies :)
TJae1 1 month ago
Neither are right...
Existence is neither flawed nor perfect. Neither tolerable or intolerable, worth it or not worth it.
Neither good or bad, useful or non-useful, it's merely a series of things happening.
Seedr0 1 month ago
1:01:40 - 1:02:05 I loved that response.
theinflatablehuman 1 month ago
Reminds me of the dueling philosophies presented in the movie~ I Heart Huckabees. A meaningful holistic interconnected worldview vs a meaningless disconnected existence of cruelty and betrayal.Hah! Thanks guys
summondadrummin 1 month ago
You sir have the patience of a saint.
crazybasement 1 month ago
Corey trolling Gar like a boss at 15:00
JRHartly1984 1 month ago
Duality guys vs. non-duality guy. lol
talesfromthemidwest 1 month ago
There is a reason that in most of the movies with people trying to destroy the world the perpetrator is usually a genius.
guitarfuckist 1 month ago
@krll98 A "psychopath" so concerned with the welfare of sentient beings that he believes that it would have been better for us never to have been born because of the suffering we all inevitably experience?
Strange kind of psychopath.
But of course you weren't actually being serious, were you?
void110 1 month ago
Inmendham seems somewhat unstable, but it is intriguing to watch such a man argue the "truth."
rangaman94 1 month ago in playlist Dialogues
Professoranton's talks so damn slow and condescending. No wonder the other guy's pissed.
Revalga 2 months ago
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kileer7 2 months ago
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kileer7 2 months ago
This is like watching a father try to talk to his retarded ADD having son.
SeedsofJoy 2 months ago
15:00 Professor Anton, was it necessary to provoke him to respond in that manner?
kileer7 2 months ago
The main problem with Gary's philosophy is this: He applies a metric to suffering and joy such that any suffering greatly out weighs the joy. Feeding hundreds of hungry people is a drop in a bucket, but someone who dies from cancer is an entire ocean. So to Gary the good we can do can never empty the ocean of sorrow his condition has made out of life.
TheMathLife 2 months ago
@TheMathLife I think that's an accurate description of his philosophy.
kileer7 2 months ago
Inmendham needs to take a fukking chil pill. You cant rationalise and condem lives witch you havent experienced. Its arogant, foolish and disrespectfull.
saltfan2 2 months ago
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MakkaPakka666 2 months ago
@MakkaPakka666 Wisdom? locking yourself in an apartment, excluding yourself from sosiety and rationalising life to death from a strangers poin of viev you call wisdom!? No. Wisdom is meeting the world and having experience, not condeming it and daming it with the lexikon as the bible. But ive beet you love this man, he is a great filosofer for those who need to justufie theyr own shitty acts. I mean if we all are shit why not be true to our selves right?
saltfan2 2 months ago
Try to respond to the right comments.
MakkaPakka666 2 months ago
@MakkaPakka666 Is that all?
saltfan2 2 months ago
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saltfan2 2 months ago
Inmendham is hurting people.
saltfan2 2 months ago
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MakkaPakka666 2 months ago
How can a man filled with anger and hate help any one?
saltfan2 2 months ago
Hahaha he thinks og empathy as an invention. This man dosent understand shit!
saltfan2 2 months ago
Why cant inmendham just admit that he want the world to die. And no this man is not filled with love he is saturated by hate.
saltfan2 2 months ago
How does inmendham go on vacation? He opens a lexikon.
saltfan2 2 months ago
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TJae1 3 months ago
Prof anton sorta reminds Me of my rodent of a lawyer :)
TJae1 3 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@TJae1 Inmendham sorta reminds me of a rodent, full stop. ;-)
fuckriverpointchurch 3 months ago
@fuckriverpointchurch ~ the lion-king mayb :) never a rodent
TJae1 3 months ago
Chck out Marcbldc7 forgiveness video :)
TJae1 3 months ago
U gotta b kiddin' ~ Chck out ~ Youtube Stalker Continues to Slander My Child and Me ~ Ur average Ytube ~ Christo ~ LOL
TJae1 3 months ago
IOW ~ Logic trumphs feelings :)
TJae1 3 months ago
The dude normally rulzs ~ oh ~it's live :) fine ~ @pyrrho314 @daughterofjerusalem should do this :)
TJae1 3 months ago
"They love babies" - of course that's ridiculously selfish, I don't get how you can find any 'maybe' about that.
laffer35 3 months ago
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MakkaPakka666 3 months ago
I don't know if this is a mirror or what. I don't agree with person A's christian additions to everything a person does, but Gary is just a walking mass of complexes. He's so lost in his own screwwy logical world he can't even see the big contradictions he makes.
htomerif 3 months ago
@htomerif what contradiction did he make?
djancak 3 months ago
@djancak that was a long video, and I honestly don't remember if there was a particular one that stuck out during it. One thing I remember was his saying that people can live perfectly fine lives in other countries using a tenth of the resources per person that we do in the US, which strongly contradicted his saying that most people in 3rd world countries like that are in a state of constant suffering.
htomerif 3 months ago
I fail to see any distinction between Anton's so called "Dialogues" and others "Debates".
ja524309 4 months ago
"Dialogue"? More like 1 hour and 30 minutes of train wreck.
otonanoC 4 months ago
I feel like there's something childish about the Inmendman's way of thinking. I agree that the world is horrific, but not with the apparent conclusion that we should sit around shouting about it, and that nobody should be allowed to have children. This in no way would end global suffering; who's to say that a new species wouldn't just replace humans as the main destroyers the future? This plan is not productive, to use his term. Maybe we should all just be robots, crafted to these ideals?
TheHumanFiction 4 months ago
thankyou to both of you! was a good watch.
PornographicSoul 4 months ago
Gary's 'futile' sounds like 'feudal'
PornographicSoul 4 months ago
Ok, hum... philosophicals opinions aside (I´m with Inmendham for the most part), I think Anton really showed himself to be a polite and civil individual. Really enjoyed his elegance on the debate. Props for that. Cheers
yupiie 5 months ago 8
To err.... is human
crimsonsamuraiftw 5 months ago
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Metalheadtill1die 5 months ago
And no offense, you remind me of the dad from back to the future, Anton. :P
Sarahon06 5 months ago
Gary, you are a fucking Nietschien!
BMJToday 6 months ago in playlist BMJToday's Favorited Videos 2
I love inmendhams rants. At 15:00 one of his rants begin.
He used to do these rants much more often some years ago.
dunnudoit 6 months ago
Re-watched this dialogue, Gary showed very little respect and/or understanding for the professor's perspective, clearly Anton showed restraint and in many ways won this debate, I am an antinatalism not as Gary (Inmendham/GloomBoomDoom) coined an "efilist" this is his new radical "implement antinatalism for the world" group. Antinatalism is not a position that Gary respects in a democratic sense of the word, he wants to label it an objective fact/truth, while it is clearly psychological.
Metalheadtill1die 6 months ago
@Metalheadtill1die How can you say anton won this debate gary totally owned this guy and made him look really stupid
mannyste 6 months ago
@mannyste I agree more with Cory on the issue, but Gary kicked his ass in the debate.
pantocyclus 2 weeks ago
@Metalheadtill1die or Gary is such an cynical and bitter asshole about life that he wish to drag everyone else into the shit hole with him you can just say that LOL
MAETHCOMBAT 4 months ago
I played a 90 minutes tetris-game while listening to this video... Whenever I see any of these guys Tetris comes to mind.
mkklmann 6 months ago
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burntclouds 6 months ago
this is really a amazing debate, rofl.
yoyoboy70 6 months ago 2
Most of the Universe is Dark Energy... how does Gary know that is suffering?
Chaos and Order, Positive and Negative are OUR ideas for explaining the world around us, they are not laws. Neither really exists concretely.
WOW these 2 are amazing together.
paxguerilla 6 months ago
@paxguerilla
Yes these are *our* ideas but they *can* be supported. There are in fact "laws" that we can identify. I'm not sure it's wise to write that off.
Sarahon06 5 months ago
@Sarahon06 I don't write off what we know about physics, and I didn't mean to suggest ignoring as much of reality as we can grasp. But even some of the greatest laws of physics are not fully understood... gravitation and thermodynamics seem to contradict themselves when looked at on a Universal scale. (The Universe is clumping instead of dispersing.) We can't write off the possibility that what we believe are immutable laws are actually flexible attributes.
paxguerilla 5 months ago
@Sarahon06 I don't write off what we know about physics, and I didn't mean to suggest ignoring as much of reality as we can grasp. But even some of the greatest laws of physics are not fully understood... gravitation and thermodynamics seem to contradict themselves when looked at on a Universal scale. (The Universe is clumping instead of dispersing.) We can't write off the possibility that what we believe are immutable laws are actually flexible attributes.
paxguerilla 5 months ago
@paxguerilla yin and yang
MAETHCOMBAT 4 months ago
@MAETHCOMBAT Oh yeah. I love the contrast and variety we are able to see in life.
paxguerilla 4 months ago
inmendham needs to read the first book of Beyond Good and Evil. This commitment to Truth and Logic is all over youtue I've noticed.
Debordsbullet 6 months ago
@flyingdrifter Existential despair is not the sign of a neurosis--it's quite normal actually. What makes it abnormal, however, is when a masochist sees Life as only horror and suffering, and then within his own psychodrama, casts himself as some all-sacrificing (all-feeling) hero & the rest of humanity as unfeeling "weasels and morons" and people who have babies as evil (morally wrong); who also equates gassing two-year-olds with pork sandwiches. It's laughable, but also tiresomely tragic.
alienbaroque 6 months ago
@flyingdrifter The only thing you have "exposed" is your own hidden (unconscious) teleological definition when you call life a "failed experiment," thinking it should be any kind of experiment in the first place. Therefore, your attempt to make Life fit into the Procrustean bed of this neurotic definition is the actual failure.
alienbaroque 6 months ago
@flyingdrifter Like I said, by you calling it an "experiment," by defining it as such--you are exposing your own teleological presumption of what life *should* be. And then when it does not meet the expectation of what you think the experiment should be, you say that it--the experiment--is a failure, and completely disregard (or are unconscious to the fact) that it is YOU that has the expectation. Life simply is. And just because it fails your neurotic expectations, doesn't make it a failure.
alienbaroque 6 months ago
@fly "Nihilism doesn't care about sentience." No, to be exact, nihilism doesn't care about anything; & wanting to end all life is nihilistic. Anti-natalism is based upon the frustration of a teleological assumption--that life (& suffering) should have a meaning, but b/c it does not, it should be ended. Both you and the religious person have the same teleological foundation for your belief-system. But yours is different because your solution (heaven) to suffering is ending life? LOL.
alienbaroque 6 months ago
@flying Nope. By calling it an experiment--chemical or otherwise--you are making the exact same fallacy of intent as a the religious person. You call it a "chemical experiment," they call it a "divine experiment," but both imply a teleological assumption, and this is exactly what Prof. Anton hits upon when he says there's a hidden religiosity in "ant-natalism." You expose your own unconscious *frustrated* "point of existence," which is the cause of your own neurotic fatalism.
alienbaroque 6 months ago
@fly By calling life an experiment--by defining it as such--you are making a teleological assumption: same thing religious fundamentalists do. Both of you--"anti-natalists" and fundamentals--feel entitled to pronounce what kind of experiment is Life , *then* enforce some kind of judgment (no babies, heaven, hell, etc.). The truth is, you have NO idea what Life really is or is "supposed to be," and just because you fail at finding a meaning, doesn't mean you speak for the rest of humanity.
alienbaroque 6 months ago
@f I mean, honestly, I'm supposed to out-argue this pseudo-philosophy--this neurotic fatalism, a slap-dash of Janism, utilitarianism, & nihilism--by a man who strikes me as a clinical masochist personality type? Who thinks the suffering of a pork sandwich is equal to gassing a two-year-old in her sleep, if the video I watched about him has any truth in it? Sorry. Unless I'm being paid to listen, I'm not wasting any more energy on this. You cannot out-agrue a neurotic out of his perception.
alienbaroque 6 months ago
@fl The question of suffering is an individual one, and it is up to the individual to take responsibility for his own suffering--to find meaning in it--not to blame others because they have babies. Yes, man is a finite being; yes, his conditions are limited; yes, suffering is unavoidable. But you, as a human being, always have the power to decide your attitude. So, in that regard, man is ultimately free, and not the pawn and plaything of circumstance--contrary to what the neurotic claims.
alienbaroque 6 months ago
@flying Practice what you advocate on yourself before asking others to do the same, if you want to play this holier-than-thou game & criticize those who have babies. Why not end the suffering of others you're creating by undoing the mistake of your birth with a very late-term abortion? (I am only joking.)
Life is only all-consuming horror and death and suffering? No. That's only 1 part, which is magnified & distorted through this masochistic lens of neurotic fatalism, "anti-natalism."
alienbaroque 6 months ago
Inmendham make a lot more rational sense in my opinion. Professoranton seems to be all wishy washy.
metaldave9 6 months ago
@f "Does Gary try to separate life from death (suffering) you, moron?" Does Gary advocate the ending of suffering by the ending of life because to live is to suffer? Yes: b/c he refuses to see that the two are one and can *not* be separated, which is why he wants to preemptively end life. Yet I'm supposed to take seriously a man who sees no difference in eating a pork sandwich and gassing a two-year-old? The level of clinical masochism exhibited by him and neurotic acolytes is staggering.
alienbaroque 6 months ago
@f Same old neurotic ranting. Suffering is a part of life, and life is a part of suffering. There is no causal connection between the two: the two are one. It is you who wants to play this imaginary division game, ratiocinating about "accountability,"; you who do not accept responsibility for your own failure to find meaning in your own suffering. All neurotics sees themselves as perpetual victims--pawns of chance. I have been a hospice volunteer. How many dying people have you helped to die?
alienbaroque 6 months ago
Anti-natalism = neurotic fatalism. Neurotics believe themselves the helpless victims of circumstance beyond their control (SUFFERING!). We are free--free to choose meaning--attitude--no matter the suffering. You cannot separate life from death (suffering). Failure to acknowledge this is the neurotic's failure to take responsibility for his own failure to find meaning in his suffering, i.e., how "anti-natalists (really: masochists) see the world.
alienbaroque 6 months ago
What gives us the right to pardon ourselves from the inate suffering of the universe, given that we are the "same" as any other animal.
suddenuprising 6 months ago
perhaps conversational narcissism?? doesnt Gary like suspension of thought?? nahh!! too boring! much better to yell non stop and swear!!! dialogue from Anton + support response, shift response from Gary. but this has been brilliant, to me the best comment that of barwanderer: freaking exhausting!! indeed!! cool
hazaira 6 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
There is a problem in this dialogue, Corey is talking as one while Gary is talking about the whole, and there are many layers that this dialogue can be discussed. When you were six years old Gary you knew you wanted to be happy it is your dominate factor, when you grew up you found all this injustice and hardship that makes you angry.
LauraDania 6 months ago
I can relate to both of you I don't watch the news because when I do it makes me sick to the stomach to see peopling dying for no apparent reason, no one has the right to do this. The other reason is that after watching it I feel like crap! This may sound selfish I don’t want to feel like crap and live in fear f being stabbed; I don’t want to see all those people in pain
LauraDania 6 months ago
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LauraDania 6 months ago
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LauraDania 6 months ago
More importantly I think that the news promotes violence, crimes and the suffering in the world. Why the hell there is no good news there is good people in the world, that are doing good things and if others heard about these people they too will also feel encouraged in joining in help ease someone’s suffering.
LauraDania 6 months ago
We will never be able to solve the suffering and injustice in the world if we don’t come together as humanity as one… so as long as there are racism, countries, cultures, religions and political idiots that are running the sates then injustice will proceed and maybe develop probably get worse.
LauraDania 6 months ago
People need to get involved more I mean this on any scale possible or valid to those individuals. Do something about it for your own sake so you can sleep at night thinking I did my bit because that is really what you can do, but people end up talking about it rather than doing.
LauraDania 6 months ago
I strongly disagree that every pleasure I have will only ever serve me, myself… and no I am not talking about sex…When I give money to charity I benefit them and benefit myself. When I offered to carry a bag for an 88 year old women last week I felt exhilarated high and she was so grateful.
LauraDania 6 months ago
The point that I am trying to make here is that my motive for action then wasn’t pleasure, although I felt pleasure. And I would have never known that I would experience that pleasure if I hadn’t taken that action. Talk less do more!
LauraDania 6 months ago
Who needs a TV when there's discussions like this one to enjoy. :)
FatherTuck 6 months ago
Become conscious of the responsibility inherent in the power of choice.
Give attention to the intention of your thoughts, words, and actions.
Circumstances are the means by which the soul receives its own.
corpusmundi 6 months ago
Wow... I was actually able to enjoy this dialogue. I hope there's more.
Antep654 6 months ago
Kind of ironic how i was watching the trailer for the coming "Terminator" at one point of this conversation...
whannes 6 months ago
You can't say my existense is no longer connected and then say that my very existence is affecting you by the use of the resources at my disposal. That is a conflict and truth can not exist in conflict, unless the conflict itself is they truth. :)
slanelcla 6 months ago
I do not disagree that we can apply ourselves and our minds to many issues we face, but here again, who do we step on in order to have the world the way a few or even many want to have.
slanelcla 6 months ago
Yes, he must believe in God. He is angry at God. I can see why you would see this in him.
slanelcla 6 months ago
Not true, positive and negative are inherent in the natural world without human beings.
slanelcla 6 months ago
Can I ask, Why is an ape bad? Is the ape aware he is bad? The alternative he presents is unaceptable.
slanelcla 6 months ago
'Professor'anton just does NOT get it ...
SpookyAction123 6 months ago
I submitted a video response. :-)
inspirediam 6 months ago
The gentleman with the hair is a classic case of disconnect. Complete with identification with his own front man. Scary aberration of exteme dualistic paradigm.
dhRzztt 7 months ago
"...intelligence always reveals itself..." Once again... "...intelligence is a psychological word" or concept; thus, psychology and philosophy compliment one another....like bread and butter. :-)
inspirediam 7 months ago
"...intelligence is a psychological word." Excellent point, my friend. :-)
inspirediam 7 months ago
I have drawn the conlusion that Inmendham is a stuipd moron that does not care about anyone on this earth. He his completely powerless to do anything try and stop anyone of us from doing what we want. He is a direct threat to society and to the rest of this world in my opinoin.
Elvis1972MovieTour 7 months ago
i will sum this up for everyone:
Corey is withholding the position that life is meaningless, and it is up to the individual to sort through the ambiguity and find a personal, subjective meaning.
Gary, like corey, withholds the view that life is meaningless, but he sees the ambiguity as a totality of negativity, (i.e. "trash").
So, in a way they agree, but corey thinks life has value and gary doesn't.
Thumbs up if you agree
TDP788 7 months ago
i know this is somewhat rudimentary, but philosophy is the great grandparent of psychology
TDP788 7 months ago
this is great.
TDP788 7 months ago
One issue about this dialogue is the difference between religious and scientific approaches to understanding life. You want to find the person in this dialogue who is "religious"? Well, wait. I mean the one who is religious in their beliefs and the one who is spiritual ? Which of the two speaks more like a frothy mouthed preacher?
Jhiatus3 7 months ago
Antinatalism is not about ridiculing life. It is just about not starting new life. But we might still have a great life in a great world.
PeterRoeder31 7 months ago
@PeterRoeder31
I'm confused... Isn't the ultimate goal to end all sentient beings on Earth and the Universe?
How does "having a great life" fit in with ending all sentient beings?
batfly 7 months ago
@batfly Antinatalism is about not having children. Ending all sentient life in the universe has nothing to do with having children or not. Life ends when we die (for us). That is the truth.
PeterRoeder31 7 months ago
@batfly In my opinion, any kind of "interest" in what is going to happen here after we die is pure hypocricy. Death is the end.
PeterRoeder31 7 months ago
@PeterRoeder31
Now I am even more confused. It seems to me your philosophy is just about obfuscation and manipulation and appealing to ridicule.
batfly 7 months ago
@batfly I´m just saying that "not having children" is not the same as "ending all sentient life in the universe". That´s not even a goal. A goal has to be realistic, and even if someone wanted to "end all sentient life in the universe" of course it could not be done.
PeterRoeder31 7 months ago
@PeterRoeder31
Well somebody better tell Gary that.
batfly 7 months ago
@theantinatalist /watch?v=bGCdXUBUVFg
Professoranton 7 months ago
Is too much complexity looks like chaos for those who can’t understand it?
It seems that the old age tried to get the answer through a metaphysical explanation in a specific way, like Adam and Eve for existence, and as this failed, the new age tries to get it through something like chaos, the common thing between the two is really finding the relive by having an answer, while the truth is they have no fuckin clue!
Loved it, though i didnt watch the hole thing :P
thx for both of u.
spherocyte 7 months ago 2
Emotional upset causes imbalance! Inmendham is annoyed.
helloimbubbles 7 months ago
Emotional upset causes imbalance!
helloimbubbles 7 months ago
Christianity doesnt have monopoly on values, besides values existed way before christianity was even an idea.
sanctiX 7 months ago
watched this on and off for the past few days. pretty interesting to say the least.
kyledrums 7 months ago
@theantinatalist
Yeah Cancer feels the same when it Metastasizes. When people even engage you ... You win... We feed your cancer.
batfly 7 months ago
Spinoza VS Peter Singer by Proxy
your both right
random5241 7 months ago
...That was freaking exhausting.
BardWanderer 7 months ago
Gary really comes into his own when he yells.
xplah 7 months ago
Gary:" We are eating our own flesh"
Professoranton: "Whats wrong with that? Its beautiful!"
jokskol 7 months ago
@theantinatalist
Cancer. That's all you are. You feed on all positive energy...
I despise every last ounce of what you stand for.
Disingenuous dialog and Manipulation is your communication platform...
I see straight through to the core of your insane agenda.
Go ahead and jump off the cliff... I'm cutting loose any life line to your kind... anti humanist misanthropes.
batfly 7 months ago
@luvthatsoy
Healthy cell to Mr Cancer cell: "To metastasize and corrupt every living cell in the body will inevitably kill the body including yourself. Please stop because that is just pure insanity."
Mr Cancer cell to a healthy cell: "To kill the body including myself is insanity? Why is that?"
Misanthropes are bitter and miserable wretches. Their only purpose in life is to corrupt happy people into being miserable until they achieve one huge misanthropic suicidal borg like cube.
batfly 7 months ago
@batfly
Actually you are the cancer that spreads on this planet... truly healthy planets are the sterile ones.
And replace "happy" with addicted.
jokskol 7 months ago
@jokskol
Sterile planets has no meaning when there is no sentient intelligence to appreciate anything.
The professor nailed it when he accused Gary of being religious... Y'all are actually more radical than popular dogmatic religions... You're worse than Scientology...
You all are no different than a lame Jim Jones kool-aide drinking cult.
batfly 7 months ago
@batfly
The universe does not need any sentient life to continue.
Things like planets do not need humans to appreciate their existance, this "meaning" only exists for you.
Your thinking that planet earth, which is filled with ignorant life forms that are romanticizing about life is the standart in the universe, but it isn't.
jokskol 7 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@jokskol
"Things like planets do not need humans to appreciate their existance"
So who what why and how does a thing like a planet appreciate its existence?
batfly 7 months ago
@theantinatalist
Oh I see...
You are one of Gary's fellow lemmings... Corrupt some other miserable philosophically handicapped loser you miserable misanthrope.
batfly 7 months ago
@theantinatalist
Hysterical is a good description for Gary too.
batfly 7 months ago
@15:00 the fun starts there.
MensRifleAssociation 7 months ago
can someone save me some time pls.
if inmendham goes apeshit - let me know - and where.
MensRifleAssociation 7 months ago
THIS IS GREAT! THANKS GUYS!!!
RevJoshua 7 months ago
What and who is Gary angry at?
Who is he helping?
ezemdi 7 months ago
@ezemdi
watch his videos and listen, mabye then you wouldnt have to ask such tired questions.
SecularNumanist 7 months ago
Anton nailed Gary's psychology to the wall.
DynaCatlovesme 7 months ago
@DynaCatlovesme yeah, his psychology. but not his points. its the same thing over and over again.
SecularNumanist 7 months ago
@SecularNumanist
Maybe it's just me, but I fail to see what points Gary makes... he's a philosophic clown.
LudditeReturns 6 months ago
@LudditeReturns
Think of Schopnehauer. Replace "will" with "DNA" and see what happens.
SecularNumanist 6 months ago
@SecularNumanist
Aye. Gary's a pessimist (and cynic). Not entirely new or original: he has many progenitors, which is perfectly ok, though he's far less enjoyable and revealing than his philosophic forefathers. But Gary fails on many points: he has never even attempted to established his morally prescriptive position. He presupposes it and everything unfolds from there. Normatively speaking (epistemically) what reason is there to be a moral realist?
LudditeReturns 6 months ago
@SecularNumanist
Because Gary is passionate about his position (he knows how to scream and insult) is simply no reason at all. Consumption, reproduction, cannibalism and addiction (the last two are superfluous relative to the first two)... I don't think he's compelling in his reduction of life to said matters: of course life involves consumption and reproduction, but it certainly isn't reducible to them. He's like a Christian who is still pining over the discovery of God's death.
LudditeReturns 6 months ago
@LudditeReturns
Life is consumption (eating food everyday) , reproduction (producing new generations). They are the key components. Take them away and you have no life.
jokskol 6 months ago
@SecularNumanist
He seems to demand infinite chains of justification as regards 'meaning;' forgetting that it's not unjustified to take an Aspirin when one has a headache because the universe may die a heat death billions of years from now; the act, the contemplation, aesthetic appeal, these are often experienced as intrinsically justified in themselves. Of course, he never even accounts for the word 'justification' and his use of it either.
LudditeReturns 6 months ago
@LudditeReturns
"forgetting that it's not unjustified to take an Aspirin when one has a headache because the universe may die a heat death billions of years from now;" I dont think Gary would deny that. But someones behaviour in the world says nothing about the truth surrounding it. Otherwise naive realism would make sense because "well durr a rock is a rock derp".
"he has never even attempted to established his morally prescriptive position." - Lol hes similar to Schopenhauer then! :-P
SecularNumanist 6 months ago
@DynaCatlovesme retard
sanctiX 7 months ago
Funny shit. ThanX
TWITfromURANUS 7 months ago
Pointless discussion
Ontologistics 7 months ago
It completely blows me away to hear Gary say...
"I can't justify 1 Holocaust victim let alone 6 million..."
Ultimately Gary's philosophy promotes the extermination of all sentient life.
Gary's wet dream is to become an Empire Death Star blowing the fuck out of every life inhabited planet in the universe.
This example alone should convince you Gary is completely out of his mind insane.
batfly 7 months ago
@batfly
Way to twist the argument, the holocaust was bad because of suffering. You cant justify the suffering. Death is preferable to suffering according to Gary.
Theres no inconsistency whatsoever. And once again "Gary is darth vader and hitler and pol pot DURRR HURR DERP!" gets pretty tiring...
SecularNumanist 6 months ago
@SecularNumanist
I agree... if there is unmitigated suffering death is preferable. However there isn't unmitigated suffering... So to want to end all Sentient life is insanity.
The only thing tiring is sincere people continuing to debate with insane belligerence.
batfly 6 months ago
@batfly If what you're saying is true I would like to see an instance where Gary has promoted murder instead of birth reduction? It seems clear, in this video at least, that the only thing he promotes "murdering" are fetus' which I have to agree don't seem to possess nearly the same amount of sentience as a cow which most people eat on a daily basis for mere comfort.
ThedogDio 6 months ago
@ThedogDio
Pick a word any word or any label ...Genocide, Murder, extermination, euthanasia ... it is academic. Gary's philosophy ultimately culminates in the extinction of ALL sentient life on this planet and indeed the ENTIRE universe (See this video for your one example)
Or see this video watch?v=KwpiAyy8Bgs
Heck watch any inmendham video... if he's not talking about how fucking awesome he is and how everyone else SUCKS then he is talking about ending ALL SENTIENT LIFE.
batfly 6 months ago
@batfly If it's the button concept you're talking about he's stated in many videos it's a THOUGHT EXPERIMENT. He's later gone on to discuss a sort of raffle system for how many children you can have. And even in this very video he talks about how increased public education would help. Sounds like murder.
But the reality is this is about YOUR lifestyle and not philosophy. You either eat meat, feel a social obligation to have children or own pets. Just like everyone else who hates Inmendham. cont
ThedogDio 6 months ago