What you also have to remember is that there are beautifully adapted evolutionary reasons for morality. Morality stems from evolution, not philosophy.
E.g. Not killing another human stems from when we lived tribally, so killing a member of your tribe would be detrimental to the tribe numbers.
The scientific method discovers what it believes to be the truth based on current testable evidence, until new research/evidence emerges. I.e. Science is ever growing and changing as we learn more.
So, then, when you said that science KNOWS the earth is round, you weren't telling the truth. As you admit, science can never know any ultimate truth because it is ever-changing and adapting. So you really, you don't know anything.
Religion by stark contrast clings to its traditions and archaic beliefs with less and less success as science pushes forward. (I dare say you may have in your lifetime feasted on some of the animals that Leviticus states, quite clearly, are forbidden? To give an example...if you can eat prawns, why is homosexual intercourse wrong?)
You shot yourself in the foot with your 'circular reasoning' comment. How did you first hear about Jesus? From the Bible. How do you know that's correct? You don't. So the bible is correct because the bible says it is?
"So the bible is correct because the bible says it is?"
Well consider this, someone says "the President is in the Whitehouse". Someone says, "how do you know thats true?". The guy then says "well go and look for yourself".
You have to "look into" the Whitehouse to see if that claim is true. The Bible, apart from the many fulfilled prophecies within it, is self attesting ---
God promises that IF a man, after seeing himself and his total depravity in light of God's holy law, REPENTS (confesses and forsakes his sins) and trusts in Christ for salvation, God will "manifest" Himself to that man (John 14:21) and will give him a new heart with new desires (EZEK 36:26-27), along with eyes that can see spiritual truth, ears that that can hear and a mind that can fully understand the things of God (Psalm 119:18/Ephesians 1:18)
@doctorh2005 I.D. was shown in the Dover trail to be religion masquerading as science. Nobody claims science can account for everything. Science does not do proof or truth, only falsification and probability. Science uses evidence, testability, and falsification not philosophy. Scientists do not presuppose their claims and then find evidence to back it up ,that's your department.
@doctorh2005 I suppose it's no surprise you feel the way you do about science because your God is a mind reader and if you don't tow the line it's hell for you.
I thought maybe you would have some understanding of what science is and what it isn't, but you don't. Whoever you are getting your information from about science is either completely misinformed or is a liar.
No need to tell me about evolution, I already know your answer and it'll be completely wrong.
Science is not a belief in the same way a religious faith is -why is religion so threatened?Science doesn't go out of its way to prove religion wrong. A true scientist wouldn't say God definitely doesn't exist; only that not enough current testable evidence has emerged to hold it up as fact. Sciene would never be so arrogant to say that science can account for everything, not yet at least! Religion does, however, have this unrelenting, unmoving arrogance that it is correct because it says it is.
And a point about the Creationism vs. Evolution argument, I've heard so many times from Christians that 'evolution is just a theory.' A theory does not mean just a guess. The THEORY of gravity, for example, is based on testable evidence, and it is the best theory we have until something new comes along (which, regarding gravity, I'm not sure it will.)
I understand the need to hold fast to the belief in creation. If creationism is wrong, the rest of the bible should be considered not to be 100% fact. Science, by contrast, is ever evolving and adapting, much in the way that we are.
Apologies for the lengthy comments, would be interested to hear your thoughts.
WHAT? You can't be this dense can you? Please tell me humans aren't this dense. Science is true because the evidence backs it up. If the evidence does not back science it is discarded.
that science cant prove anything.. Because it is solving a lot of mysteries.. Its not like pan cake, there are a lot of research that has to be done. Im sure if there was ever a designer, he'd understand
Excellent presentation, doctorh2005. You're point about science being a slave to philosophy was particularly on the mark.
Unfortunately, evolutionists are unable to grasp the simple truth that they, like Christians, bring their own presuppositions into their scientific observations, and thus the validity of their scientific conclusions are intricately reliant upon the very philosophical presuppositions on which said scientific conclusions are based.
WRONG. Science is NOT open to interpretation because it is FACT. Testable, irrefutable fact. Would you like to argue that the earth is flat? Science KNOWS the world is round because we have seen the earth from space. The Bible is open to huge interpretation. E.g. WHY are there different denominations? Because they believe DIFFERENT things about the Bible. Does science have demonimations? NO. It is ever growing and self-correcting. Unlike religion.
"Science is NOT open to interpretation because it is FACT"
How do you know this? Can you scientifically prove this? Facts, in mist cases and especially in science, are not independent propositional truths but are instead predetermined by a person's presuppositions, "Science KNOWS the world is round because we have seen the earth from space."
Are you saying we can only know things through sensory input, i.e. what we can see, taste, smell, feel?
Are you seriously saying scientists don't disagree with each other?
"It is ever growing and self-correcting."
Yes, science is always on the lookout for truth, but it can never quite find it. It's always "self-correcting" because it's based on the fallacy of inductive reasoning. What's "proven" today is "unproven" tomorrow, ad infinitum.
Science only deals with literal things that can either be detected (such as a stone) or its effects (gravity), maths, god and love are all 'not of this world', none of them being physical objects or effects (note I'm not saying god doesn't exist, just he can't be detected with science).
The reason intelligent design is not science, is simply because we cannot understand God as he is 'out of this world', or is God subject to the laws of logic (omnipotence paradox)
Very famous actually, surprised you haven't heard os it, anyway, its the idea that can an all-powerful being create an object too heavy for it to lift, if it cannot lift the object, it is not omnipotent, if it can, it is not omnipotent. The only answer is that God is 'outside the laws of logic', while not a very good one, the answer does prevent you saying we should 'understand God'. (I know you didn't say that, but that was the gist of it)
"can an all-powerful being create an object too heavy for it to lift, if it cannot lift the object, it is not omnipotent, if it can, it is not omnipotent."
Excellent message, the message of the truth of the nature of good science! The evidence is all around us, aswell as in us. Its just a matter of perceiving the undeniable truths of natural complexity - the degree to witch science can barely understand at some levels, whether this realm or the next. Science is just a way for the atheist to lie to himself.
lots of good arguments here thanks for the vid
ferdnerkel 2 years ago
What you also have to remember is that there are beautifully adapted evolutionary reasons for morality. Morality stems from evolution, not philosophy.
E.g. Not killing another human stems from when we lived tribally, so killing a member of your tribe would be detrimental to the tribe numbers.
Chachboon1 2 years ago
@Chachboon1 a very interesting supposition
ferdnerkel 2 years ago
The scientific method discovers what it believes to be the truth based on current testable evidence, until new research/evidence emerges. I.e. Science is ever growing and changing as we learn more.
Chachboon1 2 years ago
So, then, when you said that science KNOWS the earth is round, you weren't telling the truth. As you admit, science can never know any ultimate truth because it is ever-changing and adapting. So you really, you don't know anything.
ATLpirate 2 years ago
Religion by stark contrast clings to its traditions and archaic beliefs with less and less success as science pushes forward. (I dare say you may have in your lifetime feasted on some of the animals that Leviticus states, quite clearly, are forbidden? To give an example...if you can eat prawns, why is homosexual intercourse wrong?)
Chachboon1 2 years ago
You shot yourself in the foot with your 'circular reasoning' comment. How did you first hear about Jesus? From the Bible. How do you know that's correct? You don't. So the bible is correct because the bible says it is?
Chachboon1 2 years ago
"So the bible is correct because the bible says it is?"
Well consider this, someone says "the President is in the Whitehouse". Someone says, "how do you know thats true?". The guy then says "well go and look for yourself".
You have to "look into" the Whitehouse to see if that claim is true. The Bible, apart from the many fulfilled prophecies within it, is self attesting ---
doctorh2005 2 years ago
However, 1 Cor.2:14 says that the natural man cannot understand the things of God, as they will seem folly to him.
It's like saying to a blind man "wow what a lovely blue sky dont ya think?"-----
doctorh2005 2 years ago
However
God promises that IF a man, after seeing himself and his total depravity in light of God's holy law, REPENTS (confesses and forsakes his sins) and trusts in Christ for salvation, God will "manifest" Himself to that man (John 14:21) and will give him a new heart with new desires (EZEK 36:26-27), along with eyes that can see spiritual truth, ears that that can hear and a mind that can fully understand the things of God (Psalm 119:18/Ephesians 1:18)
Remember
REPENT and TRUST--Mark 1:15
doctorh2005 2 years ago
@doctorh2005 I.D. was shown in the Dover trail to be religion masquerading as science. Nobody claims science can account for everything. Science does not do proof or truth, only falsification and probability. Science uses evidence, testability, and falsification not philosophy. Scientists do not presuppose their claims and then find evidence to back it up ,that's your department.
You have no understanding of what science is.
metalsusa1 8 months ago
@doctorh2005 I suppose it's no surprise you feel the way you do about science because your God is a mind reader and if you don't tow the line it's hell for you.
I thought maybe you would have some understanding of what science is and what it isn't, but you don't. Whoever you are getting your information from about science is either completely misinformed or is a liar.
No need to tell me about evolution, I already know your answer and it'll be completely wrong.
Sorry to bother you. Goodbye.
metalsusa1 8 months ago
Science is not a belief in the same way a religious faith is -why is religion so threatened?Science doesn't go out of its way to prove religion wrong. A true scientist wouldn't say God definitely doesn't exist; only that not enough current testable evidence has emerged to hold it up as fact. Sciene would never be so arrogant to say that science can account for everything, not yet at least! Religion does, however, have this unrelenting, unmoving arrogance that it is correct because it says it is.
Chachboon1 2 years ago
And a point about the Creationism vs. Evolution argument, I've heard so many times from Christians that 'evolution is just a theory.' A theory does not mean just a guess. The THEORY of gravity, for example, is based on testable evidence, and it is the best theory we have until something new comes along (which, regarding gravity, I'm not sure it will.)
Chachboon1 2 years ago
I understand the need to hold fast to the belief in creation. If creationism is wrong, the rest of the bible should be considered not to be 100% fact. Science, by contrast, is ever evolving and adapting, much in the way that we are.
Apologies for the lengthy comments, would be interested to hear your thoughts.
C.
Chachboon1 2 years ago
Please die
Xiskinho 2 years ago
WHAT? You can't be this dense can you? Please tell me humans aren't this dense. Science is true because the evidence backs it up. If the evidence does not back science it is discarded.
PinkProgram 2 years ago
Is this a poe?
quammski 2 years ago
lol your right about other things, but your point is soooo wrong...
Nades129 3 years ago
"but your point is soooo wrong... "
What point is that? :)
doctorh2005 3 years ago
that science cant prove anything.. Because it is solving a lot of mysteries.. Its not like pan cake, there are a lot of research that has to be done. Im sure if there was ever a designer, he'd understand
Nades129 3 years ago
"that science cant prove anything"
Where did I state that?
doctorh2005 3 years ago
Excellent presentation, doctorh2005. You're point about science being a slave to philosophy was particularly on the mark.
Unfortunately, evolutionists are unable to grasp the simple truth that they, like Christians, bring their own presuppositions into their scientific observations, and thus the validity of their scientific conclusions are intricately reliant upon the very philosophical presuppositions on which said scientific conclusions are based.
ATLpirate 3 years ago
And, of course, if the philosophy is bad, so is the "science" that flows from it.
ATLpirate 3 years ago
WRONG. Science is NOT open to interpretation because it is FACT. Testable, irrefutable fact. Would you like to argue that the earth is flat? Science KNOWS the world is round because we have seen the earth from space. The Bible is open to huge interpretation. E.g. WHY are there different denominations? Because they believe DIFFERENT things about the Bible. Does science have demonimations? NO. It is ever growing and self-correcting. Unlike religion.
Chachboon1 2 years ago
This comment was intended as a reply to 'ATLpirate,' it has posted here by mistake, it also reads rather more agressive than I intended!
Chachboon1 2 years ago
"Science is NOT open to interpretation because it is FACT"
How do you know this? Can you scientifically prove this? Facts, in mist cases and especially in science, are not independent propositional truths but are instead predetermined by a person's presuppositions, "Science KNOWS the world is round because we have seen the earth from space."
Are you saying we can only know things through sensory input, i.e. what we can see, taste, smell, feel?
ATLpirate 2 years ago
"Does science have demonimations? NO."
Are you seriously saying scientists don't disagree with each other?
"It is ever growing and self-correcting."
Yes, science is always on the lookout for truth, but it can never quite find it. It's always "self-correcting" because it's based on the fallacy of inductive reasoning. What's "proven" today is "unproven" tomorrow, ad infinitum.
ATLpirate 2 years ago
Science only deals with literal things that can either be detected (such as a stone) or its effects (gravity), maths, god and love are all 'not of this world', none of them being physical objects or effects (note I'm not saying god doesn't exist, just he can't be detected with science).
The reason intelligent design is not science, is simply because we cannot understand God as he is 'out of this world', or is God subject to the laws of logic (omnipotence paradox)
SaviorOfLogic 3 years ago
"God subject to the laws of logic (omnipotence paradox)"
Please enlighten us...
doctorh2005 3 years ago
Very famous actually, surprised you haven't heard os it, anyway, its the idea that can an all-powerful being create an object too heavy for it to lift, if it cannot lift the object, it is not omnipotent, if it can, it is not omnipotent. The only answer is that God is 'outside the laws of logic', while not a very good one, the answer does prevent you saying we should 'understand God'. (I know you didn't say that, but that was the gist of it)
SaviorOfLogic 3 years ago
"can an all-powerful being create an object too heavy for it to lift, if it cannot lift the object, it is not omnipotent, if it can, it is not omnipotent."
I'll do a video on this...
Regard,
DoctorH
doctorh2005 3 years ago
I really appreciate your intelligent and powerful work. Beautiful.
IntelligentiPauca 3 years ago
Excellent message, the message of the truth of the nature of good science! The evidence is all around us, aswell as in us. Its just a matter of perceiving the undeniable truths of natural complexity - the degree to witch science can barely understand at some levels, whether this realm or the next. Science is just a way for the atheist to lie to himself.
slugfriend 3 years ago
how'd you get so smarrrrrrrt :P
where you been?
Stay in touch God Bless!
parymich777 3 years ago
God Bless
Great Vid!!!!
AmazingAtheism 3 years ago
WOW! That was awesome! Praise God! xxx
gangiangie 3 years ago
Great video. Fav'd.
TheEdge012 3 years ago