Origins of Norms: The Place of Value in a World of Nature

[pawsoned]

Very interesting discussion indeed. I really enjoyed it very much in spite of the clumsy beginning. For those who want to skip the boring part, the ball starts rolling ca. 30 minutes onwards. In fact the panel gets so involved that they forget opening up the floor for the audience, which Akeel does just 30 minutes before the end. Anyway, it was great.

[anwaya]

7:53: "If something like this is right, then what it would show is that there are elements in the world which wouldn't necessarily be elements that so much as interest science. Why is that? Because it is not the business of science to - if as I define science, it is a detached understanding of the world - well, this isn't a detached, it's an engagement with the world, of a quite different kind than scientific study of it."

Mr. Bilgrami hates science. He doesn't want science to access any truth.

[kobe88124]

watching that first guy talk for so god damn long it's hilarious seeing edelman checking his watch a few times and giving this guy a look that basically says: "dude, you're boring as fuck! hurry up w/ the mike and shut the fuck up!" that guy make no sense! he just rambles throwing words together but those words have no content of actual value other than to tingle your eardrum and make you wish you were unconscious.

[anwaya]

@kobe88124 - yes: I can imagine Edelman thought that he was going to be involved in a real discussion of the place of value in a world of nature based on the models he's developed at the NSI of how innate values lead to learned behavior, but instead these nimrods are talking about nothing that he can relate to. I can only imagine how he felt.

[kobe88124]

watching that first guy talk for so god damn long it's hilarious seeing edelman checking his watch a few times and giving this guy a look that basically says: "dude, you're boring as fuck! hurry up w/ the mike and shut the fuck up!" that guy make no sense! he just rambles throwing words together but those words have no content of actual value other than to tingle your eardrum and make you wish you were unconscious.

[InfectedDaemon]

This is the same round table as the Spinoza one, just renamed!

[iPlantChannel]

this is one of the best videos on youtube

[wilthiswork]

The exchange between Akeel Bilgrami and Lorraine Daston was interesting. I side with Akeel Bilgrami; the question he was getting at is important. His question also seemed to me to be what the whole conversation was about, at least according to the title of the video, and according to his introduction of the conversation.

I couldn't see how all that stuff about psycho-analysis got at this central question.

[MasterMicklewhite]

I find the discussion between Lorraine Daston and Akeel Bilgrami in every case interesting, too.

But i do not agree with him discretionary. I think Lorraine Daston argue better for her mind.

But all in all i liked watching it.

[tarnopol]

I think the PA angle was that the analyst must act objectively, about the doctor-patient relationship, and subjectively, about himself (with reference to countertransference), at the same time. Furthermore, the point of PA is some kind of progressive disenchantment of reality, as the illusions often cause ill effects.

[iPlantChannel]

what?? this debate is amazing

[psique17]

it's amazing how some people can talk for 100+ minutes without actually saying anything.

[tarnopol]

They said so much that a lot of the discussion was necessarily compressed, almost in a telegraphic form. These are some of the most pitched, important, and deep issues in human thought, so, on the whole, I think they all had a lot to say.