it is condridictions and you just take what the verse says ,and tell us thats not what it ment. it clearly states"the end of the WORLD would come in the lifetime of his contemporaries" not jeruselum. dont change what it says,just to suit your needs.
The bible is false and corrupted but this does not in any way pound the ass of Christianity? Erm.. yes it does. I really does, because about the only thing Christians HAVE is their damn bible! And no, you can't twist the Other Cheek into the Golden Rule; 2 different things. And yes, there does appear to be a problem with infinite "penalization" for finite "crimes".
Utter rubbish.... how can an intelligent person such as yourself avoid the obvious? Take just one quick rational look at your belief system which for some reason you have accepted as fact without any form of evidense.... it's a complete fairy tale!
I'm curious, as an atheist who used to believe, how the ideas of infinite punishment or paying a penalty via being burned alive or God slaying his own son on a 2x4 just to be able to forgive others' wrongs or alleged wrongs when there's probably a more reasonable way to go about doing that, doesn't seem to strike you Christians as being "sick and barbaric"?
waste of time, next time dont bother, he said he was in context you never demonstrated he wasn't.
You seem bright, why do you still believe in this obvious fabrication? The bible falls apart historically, scientifically, and on morality as well. To argue a book that got the first chapters wrong as an authority on anything is delusional.
@Gilbertus1986 atheists argue with Christians for the same reasons that Christians argue with atheists. We both think that ideas are important because they influence behavior and society. What you are asserting by inference is a privileged status for Christians to argue about god and religion and you are also asserting that atheist observation on the topic are illegitimate. Both these assertions are false.
@Gilbertus1986 You are right. Atheist don't go to "Elvis Lives" websites and spout off......That's because they don't mess with government policy! No Elvis fans are trying to make it so only Elvis music is allowed in band. Also they aren't trying to make listening to the Beatles against the law, and make sure you have to live in hiding with no rights if you only like the Beatles. They also don't say if you do not believe that Elvis is alive you will suffer for eternity. Get it?
@InteGrayting2 So you think its ok for evolutionists to do the same?
You do realise that schools indoctrinate children into the belief of evolution, (the worldview of naturalism). That is exactly the same a indoctrination of a Religious worldview.
I am an advocate of teaching neither, but equipping children with the critical thinking analytical skills in order to MAKE UP THEIR OWN MIND.
Conformism is not scientific, forcing children to conform is plain wrong.
@Gilbertus1986 There are no evolutionists. There are just people who comprehend it, and those who don't. Strange how it almost is always someone from a religious standpoint who doesn't get it. Maybe there is something wrong with religion if most of it's followers are not able to digest such a brilliantly simple concept. Teaching a kid how gravity works isn't indoctrinating them, and there is no difference between evolution, and gravity. Both are correct theories. It's called education.
I am AGNOSTIC and I do not believe in evolution from a scientific standpoint, I am currently studying Biology at university and have found that the "evidence" of evolution fails to meet the criteria of empirical as per the scientific method.
Hence you are TOTALLY incorrect, evolution is nothing like gravity since gravity and its effects are directly observable. Have you observed the ancestor of apes and humans "evolve" into a human? If not then it is not empircal
@Gilbertus1986 Biology and evolutionary biology are related, but are not the same fields. A dentist who specializes in bridges, and fillings, is not the same in expertise of an orthodontist. You in your studies are privy to knowledge that an evolutionary biologist isn't and vice versa.
Jesus will send us to a Hell of eternal torment that HE created, because it's our fault that Adam and Eve disobeyed God...by eating an apple??? That sounds fair.
Jesus="escape hatch". More like scapegoat. Nobody can take responsibility for your actions. That's an immoral teaching. If God wanted to forgive us, he could have done it without the human sacrifice; he's God, after all. Do you see how silly the Bible sounds when you look at it with just a little bit of logic?
God has about the same morality as Nature. He (it) kills people randomly and equally, regardless of age or religious beliefs. So why pray to him or care what he does?
On Jesus, he said that he is not here to abolish the old law, but to uphold it. So he condones slavery, stoning people for eating shell fish, killing babies, raping our enemies' women, etc?
@demoskunk if You mean opposite when you say there the same then I would agree.
nature = unaware =/= god = aware . Yahweh has a history in blood when he was just a warrior god in a polytheistic religion. He has always demanded human sacrifices of his children to prove their love. Yahweh also is spiteful and jealous, and ordered genocide and murder to make him feel better. No the non existent morality of nature far exceeds the Amorality of God.
The problem with putting scripture into a larger context is by what criterion do you judge the larger context to be right? It's like using a book on Chinesse to order Egg Foo Young...how do you know the book is accurate?
Why does God need the assistance of a human to interpret His word and why don't you let others know what the Bible really means, since God is so hard to understand? Mr. Tarte's interpretation is only one of probably billions of other interpretations.
It must be nice to have an answer for every question. Even if it is the old "god works in mysterious ways". Challenge yourselves a bit more people! If a book gives you all the answers you could probably bet it is a bit too "good to be true".
What Christians call "context" is nothing but quoting a passage of the bible that contradicts another.
Truth is that the bible is full of contradictions, and to say 2 different things doesn't make it even.
But that's all irrelevant anyway, the bible could be a perfect book regarding morality or whatever, I would not care about it anyway, its nature is still the one of a book, just a book.
So there are no premises to take seriously both this video and the one its responding to.
observe the ways of the ant and be wise which having no chief officer or ruler prepares her food in the summer and gathers her provisions in the harvest.
Umm ants have queens that rule over the colony... fail
I've wondered for a long time if the people who never in their lives hear anything about Jesus will be condemned to hell. Like, for example, the Native Indians who lived in U. S. territory before the Europeans arrived with Christianity.
Why don't you just say that you have the freedom to interpret things any way you like and it's really a matter of faith since we don't really know anything about the origin of the gospels? Just admit you believe a load of utter nonsense purely on faith.
You could make this video much shorter by simply saying "You took that out of context" and being done with it. Most of us have heard this before, being well spoken and nice doesnt make it change how we feel about it. Fact of the matter is there are many more things I take issue with in the Bible. But I know how the song ends, so to speak.
the real problem that he didn't touch on is the problem of omniscience and hell. if both exist then god is willfully damning people to hell because omniscience and free will cannot actually exist simultaneously and since the creator set up the system (he knew the fall would happen before it occurred) and gave a correction he knew not all people could accept he is willfully punishing people for something they have (or had) no control over.
@satanisthetruegod666 by the way i hate to have to do this but i hope you're not the type of christian to simply judge by my username, i am not a satanist and have not been for years but when i was i started this channel and to take it down and start over would be more of a pain than it's worth especially since many of my videos would be irretrievable.
sorry to have to waste your time if you're not one but i've been coming across them with increasing frequency recently.
Isn't it interesting that a god does not have the ability to clearly communicate with humans? One would think that a deity would know that revealing his word to man through illiterate nomads might not be the best way. The thing is god could have been more direct and concise if he would have called on the Chinese who at the time had a civilization light years ahead of the desert dwellers.
@mojo1517 Perhaps mojo it was the way that God knew was best. I mean really, if there is a God then is it not interesting that a mere creature such as you or me would sit and second guess why he did something this way or that?
@bzel333 I appreciate the time you took to answer my comment. Words such as perhaps, if, and mere don't belong in a discussion about reality. I have to say that your response was weak and rhetorical at best. You may be a mere creature, but I don't believe you should throw all humans into that category.
I do have a question. What solid, provable, substantial, and verifiable proof do you have that indicates there is a god? The Bible does not qualify here.
@mojo1517 Oh, I see. Micheal Shermer can say "perhaps there are multi-verses out there" when talking about reality of the universe, but when it comes to God, I can't? I don't get that. I answered you using conjecture which seemed fair in light of your disbelief in God. As you know I cannot prove God empirically. My point was that "if" a God really does exist then 1. you and I are mere creatures and 2. he gets to choose how he wants to reveal himself.
@bzel333 Jeez, I'm reading some of the other comments. Some are not so good. I believe everyone deserves a second chance. So, I think it is time to ask your god to show himself and end this whole debate.
Lets just take all the "perhaps", "ifs", "ands", or "buts" out of the conversation. So, what do you have left?
You dont have any tolerance or respect for this tart person or anyone else who does not believe as you do. fucking little child. keep spreading your lies . There is no personal god that demands worship. God is the Big Electron. grow up christians. when I was six I thought my toys could talk, because I belived in Toy Story
@stalkingcat123 Hey dude, would you do me a big favor? Tell me your definition of the word tolerance, OK? I can't believe how worked up you atheists are getting about a book you don't even think is true.
@bzel333 hey dude you want explain to me your definition of an athiest, Okay? (by the way that is how OK is spelled) I can't belive how stupid christians are where did I say I was an athiest? I Worship kris. Perhaps ditch your personal god in favor of reading comprehension? At least my religion does not attempt to force itself upon the whole of society whether they agree or not. At least my religion does not condone and instruct the murder of innocents. We dont need a book lame wads lol
@stalkingcat123 I'm betting you are under 20, yes? You failed to answer a simple question. You accused me of intolerance towards anyone who does not believe what I do. Please, I ask you again, explain what you mean by that. Tell me about your god called kris as well.
@bzel333 so, you also failed to answer a simple question :) Kris is not a god nor is it a human Kris is both a man and a woman. Kris is also 50% more effective at answering prayers then your "personal god". Kris will embarce all who embrace Kris. Kris has created an extra dimensional portal that our souls may enter when we die, so that our souls may service him/her in the after life. Kris does not demand worship, Kris does not punish Kris only rewards believers and ignores infedels!!!!
@stalkingcat123 I will be happy to give you my definition of an atheist if you will first define the word tolerant, which you accused me of not being. Now let's see, kris is not a god nor is it human, but it's and man and a woman??? My first thought is that If "kris" is not a god then why do you worship it? The God I worship revealed himself in human history. You may not like the historical evidence but it's there none the less. Where has your "kris" revealed itself?
@bzel333 Kris is man and woman at the same time across multiple consecutive timeline universes and has crossed over to reveal the secrets of the time and space. Only Kris is capable of doing this at will. That is my reason for worship, all followers of Kris have thier own unique reason for following. My definition of tolerance comes from Kris's teachings of joy and blight. Kris believes tolerance is condending.
@stalkingcat123 Well, I'm not sure what "condending" is but kris would be wrong. Tolerance is respecting the person while at the same time disagreeing with the person's point of view. That is what I did with Mr. Tarte. As for your hermaphrodite time/space traveler, still waiting for some outside your own head revelation. As for an atheist, it's a person who contends that there is no acceptable evidence for God.
@bzel333 "Condesending" is what you did by having poor reading comprehension. Tolerance according to Kris is not good. Kris says its like "okay" *pat on the head* "and your wrong." Kris says you must accept that others believe differently. Kris understands us all because Kris are us all. Kris is not a hermaphrodite. What part of existing in multiple consecutive timelines do you not comprehend?. You make no attempt to understand anything outside your church. Kris understands you I don't
@bzel333 Not really correct on this final point an Athiest is someone who rejects the concept of GOD no matter what evidence you produce.
Agnostic is more a person who contends there is not acceptable evidence and could be swayed should you give them indefinite proof.
Either way im an athiest not because the evidence god exists is weak to no existent its because the evidence he doesnt exist is so compelling but as with most god freaks i guess that he left this all here to test us our faith
@stellpoons Actually you're both wrong. An atheist is someone who lacks belief in gods. That's the only practical definition, and the only one that makes sense. A="without," Theism = "belief in god(s)," therefore atheism = "without belief in god(s)."
An agnostic is someone who doesn't claim to know whether there is a god. A = "without," gnosis = "knowledge."
@stellpoons your outlook on atheism is troubling. "the evidence he doesn't exist is so compelling"
There is a lot of fallacies here. First off atheism is no belief in any god, yet you focus on a singular deity. Second there is no such thing as evidence to somethings non existence. It is literally impossible to prove anything doesn't exist.
If you think you have evidence to prove there isn't a deity you are looking at atheism the wrong way my friend. Atheists have nothing to prove
@youbetzler Well done on sounding so intelligent yet just wrong, i guess your a god freak so i can understand how you put 2 and 2 together and came out with 5
Im from the UK mostly christian country so my affinity with the single diety is the one i have had forced on me.
Yes there are many belief structures but, they are all as stupid as each other so why i would waste more comment space mentioning more religions that are all just Lies with a venir of truth to give credibility
@stellpoons see this is why i said your outlook on atheism is troubling, you assume because i disagree with your outlook i mush be a "god freak"
I'm an atheist. So you are completely off base here, perhaps you should have taken more time to read my comment and comprehend it better. If you look at science you would understand that proving somethings non existence is scientifically impossible. Lol at the god freak reference when just below i rip on a bible passage
@youbetzler I know you seem to think because ive said "the evidence he doesnt exist" means you think my athieism is all defined by me just not believing in "god" therefore validating his existance because the only person i dont believe in.... But thats just you hanging on to your fallacies.... If you look at science logic falls down alot so come back to me when you got something stronger than a logical fallacie to base your argument on.
When i think about christianity i always wonder why god would keep himself in hiding if he was really there. Dosnt seem to be the way he did things back in the days.
Your video is evidence that the bible = the big book of pick your own personal interpretation. Pretty meaningless when you haven't even provided evidence that your particular god version even exists.
@BastEternal I'm sorry but that is a dumb comment. the documents in the Bible were meant to be understood by its readers. It's like saying that what you wrote can mean anything I want it to: so I interpret it as you saying that you are in fact really frightened of the historical evidence that does exist for Jesus and so you refuse to examine it closely and remain in a state of ignorance. Is that what you meant?
"A man or a woman who acts as a medium or fortuneteller shall be put to death by stoning; they have no one but themselves to blame for their death. (Leviticus 20:27 NAB)". This is pretty hard to get contextually wrong? It's quite specific.
Why does it matter what is in the bible? Its not like Yaweh is a God... at least not what I would call a God. It is so tiny compared to what I would call a God ;3 More like a petty little monster that convinced humans it had power ^_^ Humans are so quick to worship things... I don't understand the compulsion to grovel. I lack that particular flaw ;3
At 2:03,All You Did Was Point Out 1 Of The Many Contradictions In The Bible,Because Matt 6:34 Says,Tomorrow Will Worry About Itself..But As You Pointed Out With The Ant,They're Clearly Preparing 4 The Future.
At 2:32,You Gave An Interpretation Of A Verse That You Picked Out Yourself,Rather Than Deal With The Verse (Matt 23:36) In Question...You Clearly Ducked That 1.
At 3:15,You Said In Your Own Sly Fox Words,You Said That You Dont Know Who Wrote The Book Of Mark..Smh!
Sigh a lot of what jesus supposedly said was speaking out against false prophets,baal , pagan,shamans, temples(synagogues) forcing you pay coin in order to wipe out your sins.He was speaking out against corruption,immoral disgusting acts being mirrored in todays churchs ,he says go home and pray only your creator can judge you.Its not do unto others ect, its the old indian+chinese saying of *to have no enemys, make them all your friends*Same meaning in a sense but easy to lose in translation.
@bzel333 congratulations, I am impressed. While I agree with a few of your arguments within the context of the bible, some of this video shows impressive mental acrobatics.
I will grant you the same respect you offered to Edward Tarte. But...
3:05 I have a huge issue with following a book that is obviously and admittedly in error. This to me argues against its validity and reliability. If the book is in error then it is either the errant work of man or god. Either way, it should not be used as ultimate authority when determining moral behaviors, laws, and with social or personal disciplines.
7:03 you don't like it because it is immoral; eternal torture that is.
In 2004, the mothers of those children in Russia who prayed for two days for gods help were not asking for a BMW 5 series , they were asking for god to stop terrorists blowing up a school gynnasium..anyway , 2 days of prayer was rewarded with over 150 of their precious loved ones being slaughtered..shame on you bzel33 , shame on you.
@grumpyguts1967 I know, that was horrible as are disasters and tragedies that happen every day. God's will and soverign purposes in the midst of a fallen and corrupt creation is indeed a mysterious thing. It is God's will to allow children to die? It appears sometimes he does and the answer to the prayer to save them is no. Sometimes however the answer is yes and children are saved. What do you have? Only that shit happens and sometimes kids get in the way, whatever.
@bzel333 your arguments and claims are based in assertions and assumptions. Simple as that. You use bible as if its a legitimate source of historical or otherwise empirical information, you philosophize and speculate and nowhere do you present a real solid case. GIGO!
@bzel333 "God's will and soverign purposes in the midst of a fallen and corrupt creation is indeed a mysterious thing. It is God's will to allow children to die? It appears sometimes he does and the answer to the prayer to save them is no."
@bzel333 You mean your god is so clever and powerful, that he has made his will perfectly mimic the kind of results we would expect from chance? If 50 kids die in an orphanage fire and 1 lives, that's a miracle? That's your god being "mysterious"? How wonderfully fucking convenient for you to live with a worldview where you get to call any and all possible outcomes as proof of your god, because it was "part of god's perfect will." My disgust cannot be adequately expressed in 250 characters.
@bzel333 Also, yes, we do realize that shit sometimes happens, and sometimes it happens to kids. The difference between you and me, though, is that I don't pretend that tragedies are really the machinations of some evil tyrant who ultimately has my best interest in mind, and that killing children was the best way for him to give me that message. That would be totally psychotic. I, and other atheists, realize that it is up to me to do what I can to prevent future catastrophes, because...
@bzel333 ...no god is going to show up to lend a hand (or at least in your view, he might, but it would be completely fucking unidentifiable to the point that he may as well not have done anything at all). We care about making the world better, you want god to do it for you. Shame on you for implying that that anyone here thinks it's "whatever" when kids die, simply because we don't believe in your god. It is because we don't believe that we can fully appreciate the scope of such tragedy.
@bzel333 "Sometimes however the answer is yes and children are saved."
Try praying to a jug of milk. Sometimes it will say yes, sometimes it will say no, and sometimes it will say wait. Just like God. Almost like God doesn't even exist
@GBart Please show me where a jug of milk claimed to be God, performed millraces in the presence of eye witnesses and was executed in history by a Roman Prefect. Skepticism is easy, It's Christianity that requires some thought.
@bzel333 lol also, even if being skeptical of Christianity is easier than believing it, I bet it would require a LOT more thought and effort to convince myself that monkeys are flying out of my butt.
I stopped listenting at the "variants" excuse. Scholars believe the Jesus story itself was adapted from older messiah myths, so if you're going to dismiss parts of the Gospels because scholars doubt that they're "true" representations of the life of Jesus, you don't have anything left.
Mr Tarte points out each bad saying that the Jesus Evil said and then you pick out a quote that someone else said and that quote makes what Jesus Evil said ok. Of course, Jesus Evil said a few nice things, but Evil says them to try and hid it's real self. The above comments is for you addressing you from your veiw point. The truth is that Jesus was a Jew and he came for his people who wanted a messiah to fight the Romans.
I can't believe were even arguing the point of all this. Its almost embarrassing for grown mature adults to believe al this..(fairy tale. tooth fairly, santa ) its all the same
Wed be colonizing the solar system by now and might even have a cure for death from researching stem cells if this bull sht wasn't around and it would most likely solve the bias/ prejudice with race/homosexuals/ etc issue along with education and critical thinking.
I had an interesting discussion with my son. We were in a parking lot and there was a stray kitten that had some injuries. My son said, "How could anyone leave the kitten there. It is going to die. How can anyone be so mean?"... rewind 2 months when I spoke to my ex-pastor. I asked him... "How can god let thousands of people starve to death every year?"
His answer "I don't know but there are some questions that we just can't answer."
Well.. why bother reading the book if your just gonna make up new distorted meanings for every sentence to fit your prefered definition & world view?
"A fundamental rule of hermeneutics [...] is to understand a passage in light of its larger context. For the Bible this means that Scripture interprets Scripture (the clear passages giving light on the more difficult ones)"
@SmallGreenPlanetoid and if you put them in cages with wild animals they will be unharmed, no wonder the romans loved doing that so much, it makes for a great show them standing there like tools expecting their imaginary friend to save them
Believers are quick to bleat about verses being quoted out of context whenever non-believers point out contradictions, yet many bible bashing bigots are quite happy to quote verses such as Leviticus 18 out of context whenever it suits them.
Speaking of context. Tell us in what context it's ok for god to order the slaughter of innocent children.
For pete's sake can we not now move on from the flipping Bible? Jehovah belongs to 2000 years ago . "He" has absolutely no relevance in the 21st century. The true creator of the universe has no bloodlust, no jealousy, no hate or anger- only Love pure and simple. Christianity is all about punishment. Underneath the sugar-coating the message is clear:
"Jesus is coming again" believers say. I believed this myself when I was brainwashed, sorry I mean a Christian. Well what strikes me as odd [never mind that folk were expecting his imminent return 1000 years ago] is why wait for pity's sake?! It doesn't make sense. "God doesn't want anyone to perish, so he's biding his time" believers say. Well why the hell is God STILL creating human beings to populate the earth including more and more unbelievers destined for hell? It's totally absurd.
"Scripture endorses...," "Scripture clearly teaches..." blah blah blah. I'll never understand why people take "scripture" so seriously. I mean it's ancient. It's full of contradictions. It's full of absurdities; translated and retranslated countless times over thousands of years...yet there are people who still insist it's the holy and inspired Word of The Lord.
It's a myth, people. If you can't see that then you're completely deluded.
30 to 40 years? How many conversations can you remember CORRECTLY that you had thirty or forty years ago? If you could and others were involved, their versions would most probably be totally different from every other account. The word gospel has been misused over the centuries - there's no such thing as gospel truth.
ok ok ok sir i agree the points of the individual are ill stated at best i have no problem with religious people having private beliefs in reference to a god or gods etc... as soon as those beliefs come into the public square and especially into legislation i have a problem i have many personal issues with supernatural belief in general for i believe it interfers with any real search for real truth i know this does not relate to the topic but i was compelled to comment so yeah
@THEARBITER1236 "What if God, desiring to show his wrath and to make known his power, has endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction, in order to make known the riches of his glory for vessels of mercy, which he has prepared beforehand for glory— even us whom he has called, not from the Jews only but also from the Gentiles?" Romans 9
@bzel333 how do you know the biblbe was ment to be abstract and not literal? Provide evidence to support this belief and you might have an arguement. I believe if something sounds malevolent, evil, and stupid it most likely is malevolent, evil, and stupid
(Judges 21:10-24 NLT) "So they sent twelve thousand warriors to Jabesh-gilead with orders to kill everyone there, including women and children. "This is what you are to do," they said. "Completely destroy all the males and every woman who is not a virgin." Among the residents of Jabesh-gilead they found four hundred young virgins who had never slept with a man, and they brought them to the camp at Shiloh in the land of Canaan."
@bzel333 Excuses like that are why more people are realizing how ridiculous a "God" is. If you can't logically answer THEARBITER1236's quote, then you are little more then a broken record player.
And by the way: You're talking about justice... but having somebody torture forever for a crime that their ancestors did is not justice. Now, you can say, everybody is a siner... and while that might be possible, I know nobody, who is that bad, that he deserves eternal torture. Open your eyes: Eternal torture is in no way just! And if your god doesn't see that, than I'm more moral than he is! Luckely, I don't believe in your god, otherwise I would be very pissed at him! ;-)
Sorry, but as much as I think you are rationalising much better, than most of the christians I know, you simply demonstrate one thing very clearly: You can make the bibel say whatever you want! You're interpreting the heck out of it, to make it sound good... so, all the christians who see certain parts different than you are getting it wrong? So they are no real christians?
So the bottomline... Big Bang, Evolution, Fossil record now too complete to argue against = The bible is fiction.
If u ever learn something about this universe u will reaslise how small, insignificant and random ur lifetime is and u wouldnt think u were some Gods special someone, u would also not need this if u were a confident and secure person.
Does this guy care what his religion means to anyone other than him and his congregation. Religion robs people of their freedom and with such vague scriptures, less educated people are bound to interpret it differently. There's nothing obvious about the bible- and you can't change it in any way. Religion is incongruent with modern scientific understanding and it is shameful that is still exists (because of people like this)
Your fundamental flaw is "hermeneutics" - which is only given credence by theologians and believers as a means of justifying a document by referring to the document itself. No other academic discipline is this circular in its reasoning.
@mnkittel Are you high on mushrooms? Hermeneutics is the discipline of understanding linguistics, biblical or otherwise. It goes back to ancient Greek philosophy.
her·me·neu·tics [hur-muh-noo-tiks, -nyoo-] noun ( used with a singular verb )
1. the science of interpretation, especially of the Scriptures.
2.the branch of theology that deals with the principles of Biblical exegesis.
Even hermeneutic means simply, "skilled in interpreting, to make clear." They say nothing at all about language, so you're just wrong. Hermeneutics is chiefly used in reference to BIBLE interpretation, not language interpretation.
When you realize that each persons is really just arguing "Who read the bible the most" then both of their arguments become void. They're arguing over pointless literature.
"I read the bible!"
"No, I read the bible!"
Here's a tip, neither of you are reading the bible. You're reading the translation of a translation of hearsay of hearsay... you might as well be reading Dr. Seuss.
Get to the core ideas of the bible that were not lost in translation and the debate will be much more interesting.
The Bible is one of my favorite books of all time. I keep it on a shelf next to Harry Potter, Lord of the Rings, Chronicles of Narnia and other great, classical works of fiction.
Ok STOP. You have just revealed that even you dont know the original context of the Bible. Nobody does. What we have today are copies among copies among translations among translations. And even if they were still pure in context, they are all eyewitness testimonies written years after the events occurred. This is a very crude, flimsy and most of all unreliable way of communication.
Justifying an untruth with other untruths - IT'S ONLY A BOOK! and written by Iron Age men NOT any GOD person. Reasoning with a book itself is unreasonable, any other book can be interpreted in many ways so stop quoting the Bible as perfect truth - IT'S ONLY A BOOK!
Wow,people still warship fairytales? Get a grip people. The bible was written by man.And is all hearsay with no evidence.And thats a fact!When you hear that the bible is the word of god,Its a lie!FACT.And by the way,The christian god is a Dick.
Wow,people still warship fairytales? Get a grip people. The bible was written by man.And is all hearsay with no evidence.And thats a fact!When you hear that the bible is the word of god,Its a lie!FACT.
I try not to comment on YouTube videos because I don't want to start or participate in arguments. I am not commenting on your views on the Bible or religion.
I just want to say, on the off chance you (bzel333), happen to see this, I appreciate that you are calmly, rationally and respectfully discussing the points raised by another user.
Thank you for being calm and reasonable rather than emotional and relying on your personal experience.
Yes, OR ALL religion is made up by men. All of it and every one of them The bible is written by men. Not God, not Jesus and not even the illiterate disciples. It was written between 50 and 310 years after the "death of Jesus" and assembled by Constantine to create a State religion. Why would anyone give the Bible any more credence than any other book of mythology? Just silly.
Infinite punishment for a finite crime is not just, and yes, I know that is that from the Atheist Experience. You make good points, however you fail to address the main argument ... those are not good teachings by default. Some are, some aren't. I do give you credit for approaching the issue with far more respect that the majority of Youtube Christians.
Saying that proof of the bible's reliability is the bible itself, because it's the "word of god", is irrational. Logical redundancy. The bible is a tell-tale, second hand, and that is not a criterium for historical reliability, not for normal history, not for the bible, not for anything. Anyone with a bible and some time to read it can NOT read it cover to cover and stay a christian... You can believe in god as an ultimate creator of the universe(s), but belief in the bible is simply irrational
At 6:24 dismissing the part about the power of prayer with the MBW is unfair. All over the world their are christians praying for their loved ones to get cured from illness. Praying for their loved ones not to die.
Can there be a more just or deserving cause than this?
So if even something like this can't be prayed about by a true believer with the certainty of it being, what good is prayer then? If God denies us even that which we find most pressing and urgent what is the point of praying?
I am an Atheist. I don't believe in any of this, and know there ARE contractions in the bible. However, I have little issue with what has been said. Tarte seems to have plucked out some rather archaic references in his video. It is true, most of them were out of context. I don't believe the bible has any real significance aside from a story book. Still, take the fables in context, or don't even bother.
The fact that so much of the bible is open to so many different interpretations simply indicates to me that God is a bit of a crap communicator. Can he not just say what he means? Of course, anyone with any sense knows that 'people' wrote all this ambiguous, contradictory, morally corrupt, irrational and untrue nonsense.
Context is a concern for you? Great! I agree. Demonstrate that your god exists. Then we can ask he/her/them/it and clarify what the context should be. Ready? Good. Go!
Waiting.........still no god......still no god.......still no god.....been like this for millenia.......still no god....please don't take your time, hurry up.........
This video was brought to video was this brought by this a video brought to this a fucking video brought was this to you idiot this video was brought to you by a fucking idiot. Nice intro you fucking idiot.
The Bible is the Big Book pf Multiple Choice. It can say whatever you want it to. Which makes it completely worthless as a guide to life.
TheThunderduck 4 days ago
what an ignorant fuck
FR0STY0115 1 week ago
but this guy wears glasses? if you eyesight is less than perfect you cant take commune
so how can he be christian? (its in the bible most "Christians never read"
mastodonseven 1 week ago
it is condridictions and you just take what the verse says ,and tell us thats not what it ment. it clearly states"the end of the WORLD would come in the lifetime of his contemporaries" not jeruselum. dont change what it says,just to suit your needs.
mandrillx 3 weeks ago
@mandrillx None are so blind as those who refuse not to see,
bzel333 3 weeks ago
@bzel333 Very true, that is why I despise indoctrination. Religious and Evolutionary.
Children should be taught how to think for themselves, not what to think
Gilbertus1986 2 weeks ago
@Gilbertus1986 Evolution is not an "indoctrination" anymore than gravity is an "indoctrination". Get your facts straight.
TomFynn 2 weeks ago
@bzel333 but even blind men can speak of that which they can not see.
elijahsama 2 weeks ago
The bible is false and corrupted but this does not in any way pound the ass of Christianity? Erm.. yes it does. I really does, because about the only thing Christians HAVE is their damn bible! And no, you can't twist the Other Cheek into the Golden Rule; 2 different things. And yes, there does appear to be a problem with infinite "penalization" for finite "crimes".
bigglyguy 1 month ago
Zzzzz. Way to unsuccessfully rationalise Christianity.
MzHellinahandbasket 1 month ago
Utter rubbish.... how can an intelligent person such as yourself avoid the obvious? Take just one quick rational look at your belief system which for some reason you have accepted as fact without any form of evidense.... it's a complete fairy tale!
55chh 1 month ago
So if you find a passage that is totally unbelievable you just claim that it was written by someone else?
55chh 1 month ago
I'm curious, as an atheist who used to believe, how the ideas of infinite punishment or paying a penalty via being burned alive or God slaying his own son on a 2x4 just to be able to forgive others' wrongs or alleged wrongs when there's probably a more reasonable way to go about doing that, doesn't seem to strike you Christians as being "sick and barbaric"?
RandomBS88 1 month ago
waste of time, next time dont bother, he said he was in context you never demonstrated he wasn't.
You seem bright, why do you still believe in this obvious fabrication? The bible falls apart historically, scientifically, and on morality as well. To argue a book that got the first chapters wrong as an authority on anything is delusional.
pandorachild 1 month ago
If you don't believe in God then why are you spouting your own propaganda in something you don't believe in??
I mean, I am sure you don't go onto websites claiming Elvis still lives and spout your hate at them?
So I wonder why you do it solely for this?..... Hmmmmm...
Gilbertus1986 1 month ago
@Gilbertus1986 atheists argue with Christians for the same reasons that Christians argue with atheists. We both think that ideas are important because they influence behavior and society. What you are asserting by inference is a privileged status for Christians to argue about god and religion and you are also asserting that atheist observation on the topic are illegitimate. Both these assertions are false.
SamWiseGingy 1 month ago
@Gilbertus1986 You are right. Atheist don't go to "Elvis Lives" websites and spout off......That's because they don't mess with government policy! No Elvis fans are trying to make it so only Elvis music is allowed in band. Also they aren't trying to make listening to the Beatles against the law, and make sure you have to live in hiding with no rights if you only like the Beatles. They also don't say if you do not believe that Elvis is alive you will suffer for eternity. Get it?
InteGrayting2 1 month ago
@InteGrayting2 So you think its ok for evolutionists to do the same?
You do realise that schools indoctrinate children into the belief of evolution, (the worldview of naturalism). That is exactly the same a indoctrination of a Religious worldview.
I am an advocate of teaching neither, but equipping children with the critical thinking analytical skills in order to MAKE UP THEIR OWN MIND.
Conformism is not scientific, forcing children to conform is plain wrong.
Gilbertus1986 3 weeks ago
@Gilbertus1986 There are no evolutionists. There are just people who comprehend it, and those who don't. Strange how it almost is always someone from a religious standpoint who doesn't get it. Maybe there is something wrong with religion if most of it's followers are not able to digest such a brilliantly simple concept. Teaching a kid how gravity works isn't indoctrinating them, and there is no difference between evolution, and gravity. Both are correct theories. It's called education.
InteGrayting2 3 weeks ago
@InteGrayting2
I am AGNOSTIC and I do not believe in evolution from a scientific standpoint, I am currently studying Biology at university and have found that the "evidence" of evolution fails to meet the criteria of empirical as per the scientific method.
Hence you are TOTALLY incorrect, evolution is nothing like gravity since gravity and its effects are directly observable. Have you observed the ancestor of apes and humans "evolve" into a human? If not then it is not empircal
Gilbertus1986 2 weeks ago
@Gilbertus1986 Biology and evolutionary biology are related, but are not the same fields. A dentist who specializes in bridges, and fillings, is not the same in expertise of an orthodontist. You in your studies are privy to knowledge that an evolutionary biologist isn't and vice versa.
InteGrayting2 2 weeks ago
@InteGrayting2
An education is being taught HOW to think not what to think.. So in this you are gravely in error yet again.
Gilbertus1986 2 weeks ago
Jesus will send us to a Hell of eternal torment that HE created, because it's our fault that Adam and Eve disobeyed God...by eating an apple??? That sounds fair.
Jesus="escape hatch". More like scapegoat. Nobody can take responsibility for your actions. That's an immoral teaching. If God wanted to forgive us, he could have done it without the human sacrifice; he's God, after all. Do you see how silly the Bible sounds when you look at it with just a little bit of logic?
demoskunk 1 month ago
God has about the same morality as Nature. He (it) kills people randomly and equally, regardless of age or religious beliefs. So why pray to him or care what he does?
On Jesus, he said that he is not here to abolish the old law, but to uphold it. So he condones slavery, stoning people for eating shell fish, killing babies, raping our enemies' women, etc?
demoskunk 1 month ago
@demoskunk if You mean opposite when you say there the same then I would agree.
nature = unaware =/= god = aware . Yahweh has a history in blood when he was just a warrior god in a polytheistic religion. He has always demanded human sacrifices of his children to prove their love. Yahweh also is spiteful and jealous, and ordered genocide and murder to make him feel better. No the non existent morality of nature far exceeds the Amorality of God.
pandorachild 1 month ago
The problem with putting scripture into a larger context is by what criterion do you judge the larger context to be right? It's like using a book on Chinesse to order Egg Foo Young...how do you know the book is accurate?
BTW...everything boils down to luck!
chefshitpiece 1 month ago
Why does God need the assistance of a human to interpret His word and why don't you let others know what the Bible really means, since God is so hard to understand? Mr. Tarte's interpretation is only one of probably billions of other interpretations.
lc237 1 month ago
It must be nice to have an answer for every question. Even if it is the old "god works in mysterious ways". Challenge yourselves a bit more people! If a book gives you all the answers you could probably bet it is a bit too "good to be true".
storbajsarn 1 month ago
so what is not out of context in the bible.....is the ten commandments out of context? it sounds like cherry picking to me
tavogp 1 month ago
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What Christians call "context" is nothing but quoting a passage of the bible that contradicts another.
Truth is that the bible is full of contradictions, and to say 2 different things doesn't make it even.
But that's all irrelevant anyway, the bible could be a perfect book regarding morality or whatever, I would not care about it anyway, its nature is still the one of a book, just a book.
So there are no premises to take seriously both this video and the one its responding to.
ChristianIce 2 months ago
observe the ways of the ant and be wise which having no chief officer or ruler prepares her food in the summer and gathers her provisions in the harvest.
Umm ants have queens that rule over the colony... fail
youbetzler 2 months ago
I've wondered for a long time if the people who never in their lives hear anything about Jesus will be condemned to hell. Like, for example, the Native Indians who lived in U. S. territory before the Europeans arrived with Christianity.
joseg1787 2 months ago
Why don't you just say that you have the freedom to interpret things any way you like and it's really a matter of faith since we don't really know anything about the origin of the gospels? Just admit you believe a load of utter nonsense purely on faith.
topperheartramada 2 months ago
You could make this video much shorter by simply saying "You took that out of context" and being done with it. Most of us have heard this before, being well spoken and nice doesnt make it change how we feel about it. Fact of the matter is there are many more things I take issue with in the Bible. But I know how the song ends, so to speak.
Tiptoetherat 2 months ago
Re: John 3:16
Of what great strife is it, therefore giving evidence of such love, the act of sacrificing himself to himself?
recalibration 2 months ago
the real problem that he didn't touch on is the problem of omniscience and hell. if both exist then god is willfully damning people to hell because omniscience and free will cannot actually exist simultaneously and since the creator set up the system (he knew the fall would happen before it occurred) and gave a correction he knew not all people could accept he is willfully punishing people for something they have (or had) no control over.
satanisthetruegod666 2 months ago
@satanisthetruegod666 by the way i hate to have to do this but i hope you're not the type of christian to simply judge by my username, i am not a satanist and have not been for years but when i was i started this channel and to take it down and start over would be more of a pain than it's worth especially since many of my videos would be irretrievable.
sorry to have to waste your time if you're not one but i've been coming across them with increasing frequency recently.
satanisthetruegod666 2 months ago
wow... this is proof religion is stupid
lento99 2 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Faith is confidence or trust in a person or thing, or a belief that is not a fact.! google faith lol
flexbrat 2 months ago
Isn't it interesting that a god does not have the ability to clearly communicate with humans? One would think that a deity would know that revealing his word to man through illiterate nomads might not be the best way. The thing is god could have been more direct and concise if he would have called on the Chinese who at the time had a civilization light years ahead of the desert dwellers.
mojo1517 2 months ago
@mojo1517 Perhaps mojo it was the way that God knew was best. I mean really, if there is a God then is it not interesting that a mere creature such as you or me would sit and second guess why he did something this way or that?
bzel333 2 months ago
@bzel333 I appreciate the time you took to answer my comment. Words such as perhaps, if, and mere don't belong in a discussion about reality. I have to say that your response was weak and rhetorical at best. You may be a mere creature, but I don't believe you should throw all humans into that category.
I do have a question. What solid, provable, substantial, and verifiable proof do you have that indicates there is a god? The Bible does not qualify here.
mojo1517 2 months ago
@mojo1517 Oh, I see. Micheal Shermer can say "perhaps there are multi-verses out there" when talking about reality of the universe, but when it comes to God, I can't? I don't get that. I answered you using conjecture which seemed fair in light of your disbelief in God. As you know I cannot prove God empirically. My point was that "if" a God really does exist then 1. you and I are mere creatures and 2. he gets to choose how he wants to reveal himself.
bzel333 2 months ago
@bzel333 Jeez, I'm reading some of the other comments. Some are not so good. I believe everyone deserves a second chance. So, I think it is time to ask your god to show himself and end this whole debate.
Lets just take all the "perhaps", "ifs", "ands", or "buts" out of the conversation. So, what do you have left?
mojo1517 2 months ago
You dont have any tolerance or respect for this tart person or anyone else who does not believe as you do. fucking little child. keep spreading your lies . There is no personal god that demands worship. God is the Big Electron. grow up christians. when I was six I thought my toys could talk, because I belived in Toy Story
stalkingcat123 2 months ago
@stalkingcat123 Hey dude, would you do me a big favor? Tell me your definition of the word tolerance, OK? I can't believe how worked up you atheists are getting about a book you don't even think is true.
bzel333 2 months ago
@bzel333 hey dude you want explain to me your definition of an athiest, Okay? (by the way that is how OK is spelled) I can't belive how stupid christians are where did I say I was an athiest? I Worship kris. Perhaps ditch your personal god in favor of reading comprehension? At least my religion does not attempt to force itself upon the whole of society whether they agree or not. At least my religion does not condone and instruct the murder of innocents. We dont need a book lame wads lol
stalkingcat123 2 months ago
@stalkingcat123 I'm betting you are under 20, yes? You failed to answer a simple question. You accused me of intolerance towards anyone who does not believe what I do. Please, I ask you again, explain what you mean by that. Tell me about your god called kris as well.
bzel333 2 months ago
@bzel333 so, you also failed to answer a simple question :) Kris is not a god nor is it a human Kris is both a man and a woman. Kris is also 50% more effective at answering prayers then your "personal god". Kris will embarce all who embrace Kris. Kris has created an extra dimensional portal that our souls may enter when we die, so that our souls may service him/her in the after life. Kris does not demand worship, Kris does not punish Kris only rewards believers and ignores infedels!!!!
stalkingcat123 2 months ago
@stalkingcat123 I will be happy to give you my definition of an atheist if you will first define the word tolerant, which you accused me of not being. Now let's see, kris is not a god nor is it human, but it's and man and a woman??? My first thought is that If "kris" is not a god then why do you worship it? The God I worship revealed himself in human history. You may not like the historical evidence but it's there none the less. Where has your "kris" revealed itself?
bzel333 2 months ago
@bzel333 Kris is man and woman at the same time across multiple consecutive timeline universes and has crossed over to reveal the secrets of the time and space. Only Kris is capable of doing this at will. That is my reason for worship, all followers of Kris have thier own unique reason for following. My definition of tolerance comes from Kris's teachings of joy and blight. Kris believes tolerance is condending.
stalkingcat123 2 months ago
@stalkingcat123 Well, I'm not sure what "condending" is but kris would be wrong. Tolerance is respecting the person while at the same time disagreeing with the person's point of view. That is what I did with Mr. Tarte. As for your hermaphrodite time/space traveler, still waiting for some outside your own head revelation. As for an atheist, it's a person who contends that there is no acceptable evidence for God.
bzel333 2 months ago
@bzel333 "Condesending" is what you did by having poor reading comprehension. Tolerance according to Kris is not good. Kris says its like "okay" *pat on the head* "and your wrong." Kris says you must accept that others believe differently. Kris understands us all because Kris are us all. Kris is not a hermaphrodite. What part of existing in multiple consecutive timelines do you not comprehend?. You make no attempt to understand anything outside your church. Kris understands you I don't
stalkingcat123 2 months ago
@bzel333 Not really correct on this final point an Athiest is someone who rejects the concept of GOD no matter what evidence you produce.
Agnostic is more a person who contends there is not acceptable evidence and could be swayed should you give them indefinite proof.
Either way im an athiest not because the evidence god exists is weak to no existent its because the evidence he doesnt exist is so compelling but as with most god freaks i guess that he left this all here to test us our faith
stellpoons 2 months ago
@stellpoons Actually you're both wrong. An atheist is someone who lacks belief in gods. That's the only practical definition, and the only one that makes sense. A="without," Theism = "belief in god(s)," therefore atheism = "without belief in god(s)."
An agnostic is someone who doesn't claim to know whether there is a god. A = "without," gnosis = "knowledge."
Most atheists and many theists are also agnostic.
JustinHampel 2 months ago
@stellpoons your outlook on atheism is troubling. "the evidence he doesn't exist is so compelling"
There is a lot of fallacies here. First off atheism is no belief in any god, yet you focus on a singular deity. Second there is no such thing as evidence to somethings non existence. It is literally impossible to prove anything doesn't exist.
If you think you have evidence to prove there isn't a deity you are looking at atheism the wrong way my friend. Atheists have nothing to prove
youbetzler 2 months ago
@youbetzler Well done on sounding so intelligent yet just wrong, i guess your a god freak so i can understand how you put 2 and 2 together and came out with 5
Im from the UK mostly christian country so my affinity with the single diety is the one i have had forced on me.
Yes there are many belief structures but, they are all as stupid as each other so why i would waste more comment space mentioning more religions that are all just Lies with a venir of truth to give credibility
stellpoons 2 months ago
@stellpoons see this is why i said your outlook on atheism is troubling, you assume because i disagree with your outlook i mush be a "god freak"
I'm an atheist. So you are completely off base here, perhaps you should have taken more time to read my comment and comprehend it better. If you look at science you would understand that proving somethings non existence is scientifically impossible. Lol at the god freak reference when just below i rip on a bible passage
youbetzler 2 months ago
@stellpoons He's right, you know.
You're too eager to make assumptions about the person you're talking about.
Who else does that?
Hmm, I wonder...
Ebvardh 2 months ago
@youbetzler I know you seem to think because ive said "the evidence he doesnt exist" means you think my athieism is all defined by me just not believing in "god" therefore validating his existance because the only person i dont believe in.... But thats just you hanging on to your fallacies.... If you look at science logic falls down alot so come back to me when you got something stronger than a logical fallacie to base your argument on.
stellpoons 2 months ago
Don't watch this video. You will be wasting 9 minutes & 7 seconds of Your life.
tranquility4all 2 months ago
When i think about christianity i always wonder why god would keep himself in hiding if he was really there. Dosnt seem to be the way he did things back in the days.
DiogenesForPresident 2 months ago
Your video is evidence that the bible = the big book of pick your own personal interpretation. Pretty meaningless when you haven't even provided evidence that your particular god version even exists.
Next!
BastEternal 2 months ago
@BastEternal I'm sorry but that is a dumb comment. the documents in the Bible were meant to be understood by its readers. It's like saying that what you wrote can mean anything I want it to: so I interpret it as you saying that you are in fact really frightened of the historical evidence that does exist for Jesus and so you refuse to examine it closely and remain in a state of ignorance. Is that what you meant?
bzel333 2 months ago
@bzel333 Now you think you can determine what I "refuse" to do, what I "remain" in"? According to YOU, I'm "in fact really frightened"?
You are in no position to make ANY assumptions about me, because I haven't given you anything to go on.
YOU are the one who posted a video with your own bible interpretations. OWN IT.
You make assumptions about what I've examined or my state of awareness, and you call ME ignorant?
Resorting to strawmen discredits you.
Good bye.
BastEternal 2 months ago
@BastEternal Kinda missed the whole point of my comment my dear. Oh well, I tried.
bzel333 2 months ago
@bzel333 " It's like saying that what you wrote can mean anything I want it to"
That is exactly what the Bible is. Can you not think of any other book from which people draw different interpretations?
GBart 2 months ago
test to see if user blocks comments
MrLittletomdj 2 months ago
JESUS IS DEAD FOR 2011 YEARS,MAIBY MORE,LIVE THAT MAN ALONE
luka7646 2 months ago
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@luka7646 Jesus is alive in heaven
elibeth121 2 months ago
Hmm..typical apologetics. Nothing new here.
MrFungus420 2 months ago
Eternal punishment for thought crime "only seems just"? What kind of monster believes such things?
frabjous79 2 months ago
The fact that you have to "interpret" what is supposed to be the direct word of your god tells me all I need to know about your god.
TomVodkaCollins 2 months ago
"A man or a woman who acts as a medium or fortuneteller shall be put to death by stoning; they have no one but themselves to blame for their death. (Leviticus 20:27 NAB)". This is pretty hard to get contextually wrong? It's quite specific.
jamesvolunteer 2 months ago
Love God more than my family? What a load of nonsense.
FistOfTheNorthStar82 2 months ago
how can you possibly justify infinite punishment?? what is wrong with you!!
beercanyum 2 months ago 2
Sad to see such intellect wasted.
TheBlueManChoo 2 months ago
Why does it matter what is in the bible? Its not like Yaweh is a God... at least not what I would call a God. It is so tiny compared to what I would call a God ;3 More like a petty little monster that convinced humans it had power ^_^ Humans are so quick to worship things... I don't understand the compulsion to grovel. I lack that particular flaw ;3
PinkProgram 2 months ago
The bible is real because the bible says so. That is all...
theknowbeing 2 months ago
At 2:03,All You Did Was Point Out 1 Of The Many Contradictions In The Bible,Because Matt 6:34 Says,Tomorrow Will Worry About Itself..But As You Pointed Out With The Ant,They're Clearly Preparing 4 The Future.
At 2:32,You Gave An Interpretation Of A Verse That You Picked Out Yourself,Rather Than Deal With The Verse (Matt 23:36) In Question...You Clearly Ducked That 1.
At 3:15,You Said In Your Own Sly Fox Words,You Said That You Dont Know Who Wrote The Book Of Mark..Smh!
You Owned Yourself Here!
MrHead1972 2 months ago
If You Had To Lie To Refute This Guy,Then You Really Should Ask Yourself What You Really Believe In, And Why?
MrHead1972 2 months ago
If we are all children of god then what's so special about jesus?
Hedcase71 2 months ago
This guy is the face of the apologetic, he covers his religion's arse like a boss
dgracey01 3 months ago
Sigh a lot of what jesus supposedly said was speaking out against false prophets,baal , pagan,shamans, temples(synagogues) forcing you pay coin in order to wipe out your sins.He was speaking out against corruption,immoral disgusting acts being mirrored in todays churchs ,he says go home and pray only your creator can judge you.Its not do unto others ect, its the old indian+chinese saying of *to have no enemys, make them all your friends*Same meaning in a sense but easy to lose in translation.
Thelondonbadger 3 months ago
@bzel333 congratulations, I am impressed. While I agree with a few of your arguments within the context of the bible, some of this video shows impressive mental acrobatics.
ug333 3 months ago
I will grant you the same respect you offered to Edward Tarte. But...
3:05 I have a huge issue with following a book that is obviously and admittedly in error. This to me argues against its validity and reliability. If the book is in error then it is either the errant work of man or god. Either way, it should not be used as ultimate authority when determining moral behaviors, laws, and with social or personal disciplines.
7:03 you don't like it because it is immoral; eternal torture that is.
stvnblmr1 3 months ago
In 2004, the mothers of those children in Russia who prayed for two days for gods help were not asking for a BMW 5 series , they were asking for god to stop terrorists blowing up a school gynnasium..anyway , 2 days of prayer was rewarded with over 150 of their precious loved ones being slaughtered..shame on you bzel33 , shame on you.
grumpyguts1967 3 months ago
@grumpyguts1967 I know, that was horrible as are disasters and tragedies that happen every day. God's will and soverign purposes in the midst of a fallen and corrupt creation is indeed a mysterious thing. It is God's will to allow children to die? It appears sometimes he does and the answer to the prayer to save them is no. Sometimes however the answer is yes and children are saved. What do you have? Only that shit happens and sometimes kids get in the way, whatever.
bzel333 3 months ago
@bzel333 your arguments and claims are based in assertions and assumptions. Simple as that. You use bible as if its a legitimate source of historical or otherwise empirical information, you philosophize and speculate and nowhere do you present a real solid case. GIGO!
eleminatus 3 months ago
@bzel333 "God's will and soverign purposes in the midst of a fallen and corrupt creation is indeed a mysterious thing. It is God's will to allow children to die? It appears sometimes he does and the answer to the prayer to save them is no."
Translation: Prayer is utterly useless.
fdasherv 2 months ago
@bzel333 I don't see that being any worse then your god letting it happen.
TeToa 2 months ago
@bzel333 You mean your god is so clever and powerful, that he has made his will perfectly mimic the kind of results we would expect from chance? If 50 kids die in an orphanage fire and 1 lives, that's a miracle? That's your god being "mysterious"? How wonderfully fucking convenient for you to live with a worldview where you get to call any and all possible outcomes as proof of your god, because it was "part of god's perfect will." My disgust cannot be adequately expressed in 250 characters.
skapunk1776 2 months ago
@bzel333 Also, yes, we do realize that shit sometimes happens, and sometimes it happens to kids. The difference between you and me, though, is that I don't pretend that tragedies are really the machinations of some evil tyrant who ultimately has my best interest in mind, and that killing children was the best way for him to give me that message. That would be totally psychotic. I, and other atheists, realize that it is up to me to do what I can to prevent future catastrophes, because...
skapunk1776 2 months ago
@bzel333 ...no god is going to show up to lend a hand (or at least in your view, he might, but it would be completely fucking unidentifiable to the point that he may as well not have done anything at all). We care about making the world better, you want god to do it for you. Shame on you for implying that that anyone here thinks it's "whatever" when kids die, simply because we don't believe in your god. It is because we don't believe that we can fully appreciate the scope of such tragedy.
skapunk1776 2 months ago
@bzel333 "Sometimes however the answer is yes and children are saved."
Try praying to a jug of milk. Sometimes it will say yes, sometimes it will say no, and sometimes it will say wait. Just like God. Almost like God doesn't even exist
GBart 2 months ago
@GBart Please show me where a jug of milk claimed to be God, performed millraces in the presence of eye witnesses and was executed in history by a Roman Prefect. Skepticism is easy, It's Christianity that requires some thought.
bzel333 2 months ago
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@bzel333 I don't know what millraces are, but what you're describing is the plot of a book.
"Skepticism is easy, It's Christianity that requires some thought. "
That is hilarious.
GBart 2 months ago
@bzel333 lol also, even if being skeptical of Christianity is easier than believing it, I bet it would require a LOT more thought and effort to convince myself that monkeys are flying out of my butt.
GBart 2 months ago
I stopped listenting at the "variants" excuse. Scholars believe the Jesus story itself was adapted from older messiah myths, so if you're going to dismiss parts of the Gospels because scholars doubt that they're "true" representations of the life of Jesus, you don't have anything left.
greenAbbot 3 months ago
OH MY Spaghetti Monster
Mr Tarte points out each bad saying that the Jesus Evil said and then you pick out a quote that someone else said and that quote makes what Jesus Evil said ok. Of course, Jesus Evil said a few nice things, but Evil says them to try and hid it's real self. The above comments is for you addressing you from your veiw point. The truth is that Jesus was a Jew and he came for his people who wanted a messiah to fight the Romans.
Zackindy0846 3 months ago
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I can't believe were even arguing the point of all this. Its almost embarrassing for grown mature adults to believe al this..(fairy tale. tooth fairly, santa ) its all the same
Wed be colonizing the solar system by now and might even have a cure for death from researching stem cells if this bull sht wasn't around and it would most likely solve the bias/ prejudice with race/homosexuals/ etc issue along with education and critical thinking.
screat 3 months ago
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screat 3 months ago
this guy's rationalizations are pathetic...
no substance here.
shockoflogic 3 months ago
I had an interesting discussion with my son. We were in a parking lot and there was a stray kitten that had some injuries. My son said, "How could anyone leave the kitten there. It is going to die. How can anyone be so mean?"... rewind 2 months when I spoke to my ex-pastor. I asked him... "How can god let thousands of people starve to death every year?"
His answer "I don't know but there are some questions that we just can't answer."
Ironic isn't it?
johnthomas1968 3 months ago
You're a stupid fundie. Nuff said.
Vim281 3 months ago
Everything you said only echoe your fantasies.
KemAMP 3 months ago
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Well.. why bother reading the book if your just gonna make up new distorted meanings for every sentence to fit your prefered definition & world view?
MrLittletomdj 3 months ago
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MrLittletomdj 3 months ago
"A fundamental rule of hermeneutics [...] is to understand a passage in light of its larger context. For the Bible this means that Scripture interprets Scripture (the clear passages giving light on the more difficult ones)"
OMG... this is sooooo FUNNY!!! Pure SOUTH PARK!!!
Did you hear that in heaven, George Carlin??
Sexycosy 3 months ago
I pray you hurry to your maker.
BigDwarren 3 months ago
Sooooo Christians can drink poison with no effects? You completely glossed over that.
SmallGreenPlanetoid 3 months ago
@SmallGreenPlanetoid and if you put them in cages with wild animals they will be unharmed, no wonder the romans loved doing that so much, it makes for a great show them standing there like tools expecting their imaginary friend to save them
deathman1021 3 months ago
@deathman1021 That thought occurred to me too. I didn't expect him to dodge the question so obviously, though.
SmallGreenPlanetoid 3 months ago
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Believers are quick to bleat about verses being quoted out of context whenever non-believers point out contradictions, yet many bible bashing bigots are quite happy to quote verses such as Leviticus 18 out of context whenever it suits them.
WeTheStrange 3 months ago
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WeTheStrange 3 months ago
Speaking of context. Tell us in what context it's ok for god to order the slaughter of innocent children.
For pete's sake can we not now move on from the flipping Bible? Jehovah belongs to 2000 years ago . "He" has absolutely no relevance in the 21st century. The true creator of the universe has no bloodlust, no jealousy, no hate or anger- only Love pure and simple. Christianity is all about punishment. Underneath the sugar-coating the message is clear:
Believe or burn forever."
WeTheStrange 3 months ago
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WeTheStrange 3 months ago
"Jesus is coming again" believers say. I believed this myself when I was brainwashed, sorry I mean a Christian. Well what strikes me as odd [never mind that folk were expecting his imminent return 1000 years ago] is why wait for pity's sake?! It doesn't make sense. "God doesn't want anyone to perish, so he's biding his time" believers say. Well why the hell is God STILL creating human beings to populate the earth including more and more unbelievers destined for hell? It's totally absurd.
WeTheStrange 3 months ago
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WeTheStrange 3 months ago
"Scripture endorses...," "Scripture clearly teaches..." blah blah blah. I'll never understand why people take "scripture" so seriously. I mean it's ancient. It's full of contradictions. It's full of absurdities; translated and retranslated countless times over thousands of years...yet there are people who still insist it's the holy and inspired Word of The Lord.
It's a myth, people. If you can't see that then you're completely deluded.
WeTheStrange 3 months ago
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WeTheStrange 3 months ago
30 to 40 years? How many conversations can you remember CORRECTLY that you had thirty or forty years ago? If you could and others were involved, their versions would most probably be totally different from every other account. The word gospel has been misused over the centuries - there's no such thing as gospel truth.
dutchinforres 3 months ago
"Infinite punishment seems only just"...? LOL
Religion makes you stupid, folks.
NavajoJoe66 3 months ago
I can't help but feel the need to comment on this video.
pumpstations 3 months ago
Wow, you helped me see the light, I'm going to church Sunday ...
paulypooper2 3 months ago
another one trying to explain the insanity of the bible....crap.
LowresTV 3 months ago
ok ok ok sir i agree the points of the individual are ill stated at best i have no problem with religious people having private beliefs in reference to a god or gods etc... as soon as those beliefs come into the public square and especially into legislation i have a problem i have many personal issues with supernatural belief in general for i believe it interfers with any real search for real truth i know this does not relate to the topic but i was compelled to comment so yeah
TheDevindevine 3 months ago
Shorter this video:
Atheist: Why is god such an asshole?
Christian: Because he's mysterious.
Atheist: A mysterious asshole.
Christian: Who loves you!
Atheist: Whatever.
scarshapedstar 3 months ago
“Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing?
Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing?
Then why call him God?”
Epicurus – Greek philosopher, BC 341-270
Ill leave you to think about that.
THEARBITER1236 3 months ago 24
@THEARBITER1236 "What if God, desiring to show his wrath and to make known his power, has endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction, in order to make known the riches of his glory for vessels of mercy, which he has prepared beforehand for glory— even us whom he has called, not from the Jews only but also from the Gentiles?" Romans 9
bzel333 3 months ago
@bzel333 then your god is malevolent.
THEARBITER1236 3 months ago
@bzel333 how do you know the biblbe was ment to be abstract and not literal? Provide evidence to support this belief and you might have an arguement. I believe if something sounds malevolent, evil, and stupid it most likely is malevolent, evil, and stupid
msbrandonking 3 months ago
@bzel333 Really? thats your best responce to Epicurus? lol
itchygonads 3 months ago
@bzel333 heres one for ya
(Judges 21:10-24 NLT) "So they sent twelve thousand warriors to Jabesh-gilead with orders to kill everyone there, including women and children. "This is what you are to do," they said. "Completely destroy all the males and every woman who is not a virgin." Among the residents of Jabesh-gilead they found four hundred young virgins who had never slept with a man, and they brought them to the camp at Shiloh in the land of Canaan."
krypekeeper 3 months ago
@bzel333 Excuses like that are why more people are realizing how ridiculous a "God" is. If you can't logically answer THEARBITER1236's quote, then you are little more then a broken record player.
handsup48 2 months ago
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@THEARBITER1236 God can prevent evil but not when it comes to a person making a decision that is called free will. Evil is from the fall of mankind.
elibeth121 2 months ago
What's an "up and coming" Athiest. I hope it isn't anything dirty.
OhNonottheNWO 4 months ago
What a cool light saber you have at the top of your page.
Oh, my bad.... thats the dislikes bar.
pchtermino1 4 months ago 26
And by the way: You're talking about justice... but having somebody torture forever for a crime that their ancestors did is not justice. Now, you can say, everybody is a siner... and while that might be possible, I know nobody, who is that bad, that he deserves eternal torture. Open your eyes: Eternal torture is in no way just! And if your god doesn't see that, than I'm more moral than he is! Luckely, I don't believe in your god, otherwise I would be very pissed at him! ;-)
TheTruggsess 4 months ago
Sorry, but as much as I think you are rationalising much better, than most of the christians I know, you simply demonstrate one thing very clearly: You can make the bibel say whatever you want! You're interpreting the heck out of it, to make it sound good... so, all the christians who see certain parts different than you are getting it wrong? So they are no real christians?
TheTruggsess 4 months ago
So the bottomline... Big Bang, Evolution, Fossil record now too complete to argue against = The bible is fiction.
If u ever learn something about this universe u will reaslise how small, insignificant and random ur lifetime is and u wouldnt think u were some Gods special someone, u would also not need this if u were a confident and secure person.
OnlinePokerCowboy 4 months ago
Does this guy care what his religion means to anyone other than him and his congregation. Religion robs people of their freedom and with such vague scriptures, less educated people are bound to interpret it differently. There's nothing obvious about the bible- and you can't change it in any way. Religion is incongruent with modern scientific understanding and it is shameful that is still exists (because of people like this)
endxofxeternity 4 months ago
Your fundamental flaw is "hermeneutics" - which is only given credence by theologians and believers as a means of justifying a document by referring to the document itself. No other academic discipline is this circular in its reasoning.
mnkittel 4 months ago 3
@mnkittel Are you high on mushrooms? Hermeneutics is the discipline of understanding linguistics, biblical or otherwise. It goes back to ancient Greek philosophy.
bzel333 4 months ago
@bzel333 go read plato's republic and learn how to think logically. It's philosophy for beginners. I'm sure even you could understand it.
ColossusShade 4 months ago
@bzel333 Yeah...not really.
her·me·neu·tics [hur-muh-noo-tiks, -nyoo-] noun ( used with a singular verb )
1. the science of interpretation, especially of the Scriptures.
2.the branch of theology that deals with the principles of Biblical exegesis.
Even hermeneutic means simply, "skilled in interpreting, to make clear." They say nothing at all about language, so you're just wrong. Hermeneutics is chiefly used in reference to BIBLE interpretation, not language interpretation.
TomVodkaCollins 2 months ago
When you realize that each persons is really just arguing "Who read the bible the most" then both of their arguments become void. They're arguing over pointless literature.
"I read the bible!"
"No, I read the bible!"
Here's a tip, neither of you are reading the bible. You're reading the translation of a translation of hearsay of hearsay... you might as well be reading Dr. Seuss.
Get to the core ideas of the bible that were not lost in translation and the debate will be much more interesting.
koolanator 4 months ago
The Bible is one of my favorite books of all time. I keep it on a shelf next to Harry Potter, Lord of the Rings, Chronicles of Narnia and other great, classical works of fiction.
bigredphenom 4 months ago
"most likely written..."
Ok STOP. You have just revealed that even you dont know the original context of the Bible. Nobody does. What we have today are copies among copies among translations among translations. And even if they were still pure in context, they are all eyewitness testimonies written years after the events occurred. This is a very crude, flimsy and most of all unreliable way of communication.
bigredphenom 4 months ago
PATHETIC!!
Andersxman 4 months ago
Justifying an untruth with other untruths - IT'S ONLY A BOOK! and written by Iron Age men NOT any GOD person. Reasoning with a book itself is unreasonable, any other book can be interpreted in many ways so stop quoting the Bible as perfect truth - IT'S ONLY A BOOK!
dutchinforres 4 months ago
Wow,people still warship fairytales? Get a grip people. The bible was written by man.And is all hearsay with no evidence.And thats a fact!When you hear that the bible is the word of god,Its a lie!FACT.And by the way,The christian god is a Dick.
semiLivedj 4 months ago
Wow,people still warship fairytales? Get a grip people. The bible was written by man.And is all hearsay with no evidence.And thats a fact!When you hear that the bible is the word of god,Its a lie!FACT.
semiLivedj 4 months ago
I try not to comment on YouTube videos because I don't want to start or participate in arguments. I am not commenting on your views on the Bible or religion.
I just want to say, on the off chance you (bzel333), happen to see this, I appreciate that you are calmly, rationally and respectfully discussing the points raised by another user.
Thank you for being calm and reasonable rather than emotional and relying on your personal experience.
SithLordDumbledore 4 months ago
Yes, OR ALL religion is made up by men. All of it and every one of them The bible is written by men. Not God, not Jesus and not even the illiterate disciples. It was written between 50 and 310 years after the "death of Jesus" and assembled by Constantine to create a State religion. Why would anyone give the Bible any more credence than any other book of mythology? Just silly.
coolgreyoneabby 4 months ago
Infinite punishment for a finite crime is not just, and yes, I know that is that from the Atheist Experience. You make good points, however you fail to address the main argument ... those are not good teachings by default. Some are, some aren't. I do give you credit for approaching the issue with far more respect that the majority of Youtube Christians.
darththeo 4 months ago
@biblicalreality Do you believe in the Kingof thepinkpixies? No? Well, we should call you what you really are... a Kingofthepinkpixies hater.
keyfax123 4 months ago
Saying that proof of the bible's reliability is the bible itself, because it's the "word of god", is irrational. Logical redundancy. The bible is a tell-tale, second hand, and that is not a criterium for historical reliability, not for normal history, not for the bible, not for anything. Anyone with a bible and some time to read it can NOT read it cover to cover and stay a christian... You can believe in god as an ultimate creator of the universe(s), but belief in the bible is simply irrational
MarlosZappa 4 months ago
At 6:24 dismissing the part about the power of prayer with the MBW is unfair. All over the world their are christians praying for their loved ones to get cured from illness. Praying for their loved ones not to die.
Can there be a more just or deserving cause than this?
So if even something like this can't be prayed about by a true believer with the certainty of it being, what good is prayer then? If God denies us even that which we find most pressing and urgent what is the point of praying?
itsjustameme 4 months ago
I am an Atheist. I don't believe in any of this, and know there ARE contractions in the bible. However, I have little issue with what has been said. Tarte seems to have plucked out some rather archaic references in his video. It is true, most of them were out of context. I don't believe the bible has any real significance aside from a story book. Still, take the fables in context, or don't even bother.
skywize 4 months ago
The fact that so much of the bible is open to so many different interpretations simply indicates to me that God is a bit of a crap communicator. Can he not just say what he means? Of course, anyone with any sense knows that 'people' wrote all this ambiguous, contradictory, morally corrupt, irrational and untrue nonsense.
keyfax123 5 months ago
...so, for the sins committed in a finite life leads to torture for forever?
kamath234 5 months ago
Context is a concern for you? Great! I agree. Demonstrate that your god exists. Then we can ask he/her/them/it and clarify what the context should be. Ready? Good. Go!
Waiting.........still no god......still no god.......still no god.....been like this for millenia.......still no god....please don't take your time, hurry up.........
rohanwotan2 5 months ago
This video was brought to video was this brought by this a video brought to this a fucking video brought was this to you idiot this video was brought to you by a fucking idiot. Nice intro you fucking idiot.
keeper253x 5 months ago