Men, Women, Mars, Venus & Story Swap

[EndTimeDelusion1]

You need Jesus. Badly.

[blackchimp99]

Men are from Mars - Women are from Venus

Mars - The Roman god of war

Venus - The Roman goddess of love

And that's where that comes from.

[allymetoo]

Fucking Idiot

[blackchimp99]

Care to elaborate?

[Projoiner1]

Good video...

Ugly divorce in North America (Canada) can have a sobering effect on ones feelings of "equal".

I'm sure there are many stories going his way or her way, the trick is to remain as open as possible to the various situations people find themselves in and not box a gender in because of one's personal experiance.

This can be very difficult, but is worth the effort to keep oneself from becoming a bitter cynical fucker.

Thanks for the video

[Anonymous00230]

I find you to be a very charming and entertaining lady, all that hate and backwards thinking feedback you are getting likely comes from confused teenage boys who still don't know what quite feel about women and their unknown ideas.

But don't be discouraged, speech is free and opinions are the salt of the conversation. Besides your opinions are interesting, and sweet in their own overthinked ways.

People just seem to misunderstand anything that's not clearly set in the black and white view.

[fartbreath666]

Your just pounding away on this feminazi bullshit to get attention from inmendham. Why don't you just fuck him and be done with it?

[Brianswers]

I'll PM a story to you :)

[RationalEmotive]

I have not read John Gray's book, but his basic premise is the set of recommendations and easy constructed solutions to overcome communication difficulties. IMHO this only adds to the misunderstanding and does not resolve it, as you envision.

He is NOT the one you want to add to your influences here.

watch?v=Mpx67lgCYeo#t=8m30s :)

I agree with the exchanging experiences point-of-view but remain skeptical regarding the practicability of the undertaking.

[kel2corkey]

Men and women have the right to believe in anything they like weather that's feminism or anything as long as it doesn't hurt anybody else.

[TheraminTrees]

I find the premise difficult on this one — aren't men's and women's rights of equal importance: human rights? On a psych course once, we were divided into men and women and told to 'celebrate our sex' — no not that kind! ;8) We were invited to say what was so good about being a man/woman. I saw it as pointless. Nothing was exclusive to one group — even on the physical front, men/women is a false dichotomy because it skips transgender.

[slobomotion]

True, but being a man and a woman does agree in society, with all its baggage.

I've contributed a story, and I hope you hear it and you comment.

[TheraminTrees]

'True, but being a man and a woman does agree in society, with all its baggage.'

—I didn't understand this sentence at all — could you rephrase/clarify?

[slobomotion]

Oh, yes, sorry, I meant to say "exist," not "agree." Thanks for pointing out my error.

[TheraminTrees]

'True, but being a man and a woman does exist in society'

—I still don't understand what this is saying: it doesn't make sense.

[slobomotion]

There are men, and there are women. There are others, too, transgenders, and others. A lot of the world sees things in terms of two sexes. A lot of the world does not recognize transgender. It isn't right, of course.

[TheraminTrees]

Yes — I find the rejection of transgendered folks fascinating — I think it relates to a lot of taboos that exist around ambiguities. Like bisexuality, people of mixed race.

[slobomotion]

Yes, definitely. Ambiguity is disturbing to many people. It drives scientists nuts, too, I am sure.

[2bsirius]

@slobomotion

Got your story..It's great...I'll be posting it to the story swap soon...I don't think the blog will fly. There hasn't been enough interest, but your story will make a great first story.

Thanks!

[Alastair]

I feel that the word "feminism" is quite loaded, and many people associate it with the idea of a powerful woman demanding rights and powers over men. In reality, I can't see why anyone would be antagonistic towards the idea of a woman having equal rights to men. I do believe that someone needs to point out inconsistencies when it comes to men's rights, however. Much of this societal baggage needs to be overcome.  A man who has lost his job is more likely to be left by his partner.

[Ke2Kelly]

Hey Woman shouldn't you be in the kitchen not making a video?

[2bsirius]

@Ke2Kelly

OMG never heard that funny line before!

Btw if ignorance is bliss, you must be orgasmic.

[Nykytyne2]

2bsirius gets vicious comments???

She is probably the least deserving of such comments of anyone I can think of. Talk about someone who is calm, open-minded, non-confrontational, sober.... I guess everyone gets them.

[antaresrichard]

Listen window and you too bookshelf! Nobody's talkin' past anybody here!

;-)

[Israe5l]

I will first start by saying the difference between sex and gender. Sex is physical (meaning male and female; but then there are exceptions like sex-change). Gender is psychological, so it can be masculine or feminine. We can have a male with feminine psychological make up. Sex and Gender is interdependent but also can be free.

[Israe5l]

Probably the divide between Sex and Gender happens because of the division between body and brain.

[2bsirius]

Yes, valid point...and to complicate the problem there's also gender identification...

[Israe5l]

There is at least 3 reason why the feminist (all the spectrum between eco-feminism and radical feminism) will disagree with me.

Reason1: Feminists don't like dichotomies. Reason2: Feminist will not agree that Gender and brain (thinking) are connected so closely. Reason3, related to 2, feminists are holistic, therefore, there are no distinction between Sex and Gender.

[2bsirius]

What you say is true of some feminists and not of others...I agree with some of your points, but I think some of them are unproven...Yes, there has been some research that seems to support that gender totally determines thinking...but the findings of many more studies have uncovered only tenuous gender/brain correlates.

[Israe5l]

you are right. Apart from the sex/gender division, everything is speculation (a good one tho.) But for the hate of dichotomies, feminists will challenge the sex/gender division, too. (That will be interesting to see.)

As far as feminism goes the spectrum, radical feminist to eco-feminist, is a good one. They seems to be simple opposites.

[Israe5l]

You miss understand me. Because gender and brain has close connection gender is more free. Which is not the case if gender is connected to the body.

the distinction is follows: sex/gender and body/brain. (maybe I am misleading because I make a distiction between body and brain.)

[EpifanesEuergetes]

The story swap is a great idea.

The "are you a feminist" quiz is indeed bollocks. About a third of the questions or more are for women only.

I see you yourself still have a lot to do in deprogramming yourself since you buy into this "men are from Mars, women are from Venus" horseshit.

I'm (a male) from Venus, though I enjoy visiting Mars from time to time.

[2bsirius]

It's difficult to know who I am...For example, living in here as I do, it doesn't feel as if I buy into stereotypes...Sometimes it's difficult not to use short hand...and you're right lots of men are from Venus and women are from Mars.

Guess I'm just saying that a little more intergalactic travel between the warring planet makes sense...

[EpifanesEuergetes]

Yes, and I followed your lead in using the shorthand and that more and less destroyed my point, which is: Venus & Mars mostly only exist in our minds, we are all from Tellus so no interplanetary travel is needed.

[2bsirius]

If you're talking about the Tellus Institute?...Yes, it's an interesting group

[EpifanesEuergetes]

Never heard of the Tellus Institute. I was talking about Earth, but I considered it appropriate to use the Latin term as Mars and Venus are also Latin.

[2bsirius]

Yes, should have figured that out.

[EpifanesEuergetes]

I hope you have also figured out that I really appreciate your videos, it's just that when I agree with everything you state I just five star them and remain silent because celebrating the extent of our agreement makes for very boring conversation (and is rife enough in the uutuubs).

Keep it up, now I'm off to see your new production.

[alacazam]

"we don't know how to talk to each other."

IMHO, so true... on so many levels.

[cehbeach]

Mens' Rights Movement="The bitch had a better lawyer than me and now I have to pay all my moneez for child support and alimony, only get to see my kids once a month, and live in a studio apartment eating a can of frank and beans. At least that's been my experience in dealing with them.

BTW, Warez Mah chicken pot pah, woman! Hey, why you gripping that frying pan with both hands? :)

[Superi0rMind]

You just forgot the part where you find out her new rich boyfriend you didn't know about, paid for the lawyer.

[appybuddha]

"14. Feminists are desperately anxious to prove that women are as strong as capable as men. Clearly they are nagged by a fear that women may NOT be as strong and as capable as men."

FEELINGS OF INFERIORITY - The Unibomber Manifesto

A very interesting read.

[Superi0rMind]

I'm all for feminism where it ensures maternal leave, equal treatment/pay, abortion rights, equal opportunity, shelter, equal etc..

There are premeditated games played with the legal system that can produce an unfair situation for men which some women have skillfully exploited -- which is why father's rights movement emerges -- so I can relate to any movement for equality.

[Rybot9000]

Feminism?

watch?v=rozZqScUiyE

[joesub007]

Education and technology can solve problems. Nothing else can do it. Evil does not exist, but simply is resistance for which good can find solutions to resolve it. It's like Madonna's kaballa philosophy. For any bad situation do a mind experiment to make it even worse then find a solution to it.

Human beings are finite and biologically limited. We have not reached the end of history.

[Rybot9000]

Re: Stories

Honestly, I have no problem communicating with down-to-earth women. We don't talk passed each other, even on issues of rape, pedophilia and abortion. We understand each other perfectly and tend to agree with each other. But I'm talking about women (and men) who have a solid grasp of their own minds which are few and far between.

I can't expect anyone to understand anyone else who clings so strongly to emotionally invested concepts.

[Rybot9000]

That is why I say "Femininity is from Venus" because "Femininity" is traditionally aligned with emotional investments, clinging, insecurity, vanity, and so forth. All of this stuff will just keep a person in a mental box. Thinking dualistically and egoistically.

Lets look at the brain, where are you in there? Ah, nowhere. Seems you don't exist outside of your physical existence which is intimately tied up in its environment. What do you identify with? What can you identify with?

[Rybot9000]

The only appropriate identification is to say that you are a figment of "The All"'s imagination. Nothing you say or do is freely chosen, its all ordained by causation (co-dependant origination). You belong to the universe and have no individuality (in reality). But the mind, particularly "Feminism" can't stand not being independant, so it fabricates dualities and such to identify with.

[Rybot9000]

Here you separate men and women into a false dichotomy, saying there are men who dislike feminism and women who like feminism. But surely there are men who like feminism and women who dislike it too. I bet its much nicer if all women are feminists and all men are masculinists, that makes the Male vs Female cosmic battle worth watching, it makes it entertaining. But when its the difference between ignorance and knowledge, well that's just kind of depressing.

[Rybot9000]

In your voice, there is always a air of desperation, of insecurity and fragility, of seeking comfort and self-esteem. Its the soft-spoken demeaner, sighs and cries to be understood that give it away. A wise man told me the other day "A sigh is often a sign of insecurity" (or maybe contempt).

Its just the general demeaner that I notice. Needing to be part of something, to have identity and that is acquired through disidentification and demonization with an opposing concept.

[Rybot9000]

In that vain, Catholicism or perhaps Islam might be right for you. It deals in dichotomous Good vs Evil paradigms. Here is a line from the soundtrack to the movie Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles.

"Good vs Evil equals confrontation"

Feminism vs Male Dominant Patriarchy also equals confrontation. And obviously its not a male dominant patriarchy, that's just an excuse to feel like a victim and be apathetic.

[St37One]

its way off topic

but there is really no incompatibility between intricate and determinate chains and patterns of causation on the one hand, and free will/responsibility on the other hand.

Free will and choice are very real, it is only the absurd notion of a pure or absolute freedom that can not exist (it would be nothing more than a chaotic patternlessness).

[Rybot9000]

Its not off topic and no the two aren't compatible. What you've done is equivocated the term "Freedom" with something which is fully deterministic (A la Dan Dennett's Freedom Evolves).

[St37One]

Yes

Just as Dennett has, I am using the term "freedom" to refer to actions that are free in a relative sense.

People dont usually argue for freewill except in an attempt to prove that blame and praise are rational responses. So I dont think that I am equivocating anything.

Do you think that it ever makes sense to blame or praise people for thier actions?

[Rybot9000]

It only makes sense if there is a causally necessary dynamic involved in it. If reinforcement punishment and praise are effective means of adapting an individual to the social heirarchy then I'd say relative to the social heirarchy it is "Good" or "Makes Sense" but again, this is only as it relates to the status quo, which itself could be utterly insane. If punitive measure don't serve a consequentialist end, then its just for exacting selfish vengeance and nothing more

[Rybot9000]

Generally "Free-Will" refers to a magical ability to make decisions outside of causation and this justifies retribution or vengeance to many, but without the causal dynamic the only purposes are selfish, if punishment cannot effect (cause) a person to adapt then its utterly pointless outside of the sick selfishness of the people dishing out the punishment.

I think you give society at large far more intellectual credit than they deserve.

[St37One]

punishment and reward make sense because these are the E=MC2 of human behavior.

You self administer punishment and reward as you learn and develope in the form of neurotransmitters and other signals.

reward and punishment exist because behavior is adaptive. Humans can exploit this for thier collective interest, or for petty self interest.

The function of our concept of freewill is to discriminate between fruitful applications of blame and praise, vs wasteful or useless ones.

[St37One]

you could say the same thing about praise and reward.

It can be noble or petty, and these are also relative.

reciprocal punishment creates conflict and drives people apart.

And when you study a conflict from only one side, you can end up with an ideological artifact such as the "duluth power wheel"

[Rybot9000]

I know women who dislike "Feminism".

FYI Venus was called Lucifer in some ancient traditions. Light-Bringer, Morning Star. Which was transmuted into Satan in NT scripture. It all tells a story about the human mind.

Femininity is from Venus ; )

[St37One]

This project is too post modern to accomplish anything.

oh sorry, was that an ideological statement?

I didnt mean to suggest that there was any value in objective truth.

:P

[2bsirius]

Yes, it probably won't work...But if it isn't tried then it has no chance...So it goes.

[2bsirius]

Yes, objective truth has value...BUT the value of personal experience can't be completely ignored...especially when it results in this level of mindless hostility, insult and cruelty...If you think that feminists are [objectively] some subhuman form of life then you are an ideologists so don't bother even thinking about any of this because you're right it won't make on sense to you.

Good luck hating feminists...or anyone who else who disagrees...It makes you a real man I guess...

[St37One]

Do you think that I have been mindlessly hostile?

The truth can often seem cruel, and like an insult.

I never gave you a reason to think that I see feminists as a subhuman form of life, or that such an opinion is an example of objectivity.

Wouldnt you at least grant it to me that I do know the meaning of the word objective?

You appear to wish that my opinions are based on my identity as a male, and that I hate everyone who disagrees.

Being objective means that you just dont go there.

[St37One]

I think that we should all look through the mirror instead of into the mirror, past our ego relfection to see our true self.

The life line is divided into the postive and negative emotions.

Fear is on the negative end of the energy spectrum, and Love is on the positive end.

I think that we should try to have less fear and more love, and more smiles.

smiles make the world go round.

its that simple

those are my true thoughts.

[2bsirius]

Yup ¦:¬]

[gratex]

what exactly is "the feminist position"?

[2bsirius]

I'm not sure, but I'm fairly certain it has nothing to do with missionaries.

[Elaina43]

This is an excellent idea regardless of the topic! Swapping stories re: any issue could help people hear each other and that might lead to better understanding. Good luck with your project.

[2bsirius]

Yes, maybe I should have made it broader...Might bring the idea back in a later vid with a more open focus...It could just be a blog of interesting stories which incite opposing points of view...

I actually thought of this because I was thinking about the ideas of Norman Rosenberg who specializes in nonviolent communication...

The first problem is to get both sides to listen to each and not talk past each with lots of repeated ideological rhetoric. Story dialogs can do that sometimes.

[iamjackscolin]

men don't have rights, women don't have rights, people made up the idea that rights must also exist because we do

but perhaps I have a story that will be in line with your request

[2bsirius]

Iamjackscolin...PLEASE send me a story!

[GalaxySmith18]

Um...FEmales now these days play cruel games and I was in on one. Ever since then it chaneg me a lot. Don't really want to tell my personal story about females and other stuff...

[BGBurch]

Let's make it clear - none of us had a choice of who are parents are or of what sex we were born. I'm learning to live with this fact. Women and men are different - such is life. I guess it gets down to treating each other kindly and with respect. Some functions just can't be replaced though roles in everyday life can from time to time or day to day.

I also think that our education systems need to be revamped - a lot of learning takes place in the first several years - like a sponge are we.

[deathseekerinurmom]

feminists are strange because they go with and against themselves at the same time and dont know what they want. they need to agree on what they wanted or they are not going to go that far.

[Loreleila]

To me feminism is parallel to chauvinism, both are divisive. Men and women are different in all sorts of ways and I see no reason why we shouldn't celebrate that or seek to understand one anothers perspectives. So I'm sort of with you and totally not here, if you see what I mean. I share this because I don't have an opposing from expected view or story. To me we are all individuals.

[TWITfromURANUS]

Yes. Men are from Earth, women are from Earth...

(apart from me of course)

[Loreleila]

And me, but that's something else altogether. :P

[2bsirius]

It's so true that we are all individuals, but the same social pressures are at work on lots of us in similar ways...

So you might rightly disagree on the labels of feminists and men's rights advocates, but the pervasive sense that what happens to us happens at times BECAUSE we're men or women can't be avoided...When we decide we won't look at the complexity of those situations because we're individuals, we aren't in touch with reality any more than we are when thinking in gender stereotypes.

[Loreleila]

'what happens to us happens at times BECAUSE we're men or women can't be avoided'

Well yes, but more often it happens because of preconceptions about what being a man or woman means, as much from ourselves as others. I wouldn't for a moment suggest we shouldn't look at these complexities, but would emphasise they are as much to do with attitude or expectations as with any reality of our differences, which naturally work well in tandem, whether within the individual or between genders.

[2bsirius]

You really seem to be saying that we should stop thinking so much in stereotypes... and it's exactly that point which is the the focus of this video :P

[Loreleila]

lol Yes I know. Sometimes pointing out an issue helps and sometimes it entrenches the problem further. I do realise you were seeking to achieve the former here.

[2bsirius]

Yup I was...but the whole thing is kinda boring really when you really look into the whole thing...

[IceysMoment]

what kind of story did you want?from men,woman?

i missed that part what you meant.good video,i felt sorry for you,seem so sad,way you got treated,importnant hing IS,you know,you dont dislike criss or so..take care/Bella

[2bsirius]

See the sidebar for the rules of the game story swap...

I'm not really sad btw...This is YouTube...I've been treated like this here before...If you say what you think, you can be fair game on YouTube...

I just take the insults and hate in stride pretty much now

But thanks for your nice comment!

[hume12345]

'. to my mind there are few crimes more heinous. for desiree to make light of it sent the wrong signals and seemed to assuage tyson of his supposed crime.

[amhemsley]

The type of reaction your last video got is actually one of the reasons I feel so passionately about feminism. In the last 24 hours I've read comments saying wife beating is a myth, women who report rape are all liars and that there is a feminist conspiracy to enslave men. It would appear misogyny rules on this site.

[2bsirius]

Thanks...I want to avoid blanket ideologies like the ones you refer to that "wife beating is a myth, women who report rape are liars, etc..." I'm HOPING that men who say that will be willing to read a firsthand story & make a video for a woman who has been beaten by her husband or who has been raped...Or from the other side, that a feminist will read the account of a man denied a job because someone who happened to be female was given the position to reach quota, etc.

[Geodge]

You don't want "our" story, you want us to find somebody else's story with a conclusion that we don't agree with and write it as if it were ours from the other's point of view?

[2bsirius]

You'll take a story from the blog I'll use to as a collection point for the various stories...A link is posted in the sidebar..If you're a feminist, for example, you'd look for a story that was about men's rights and why they are disrespected. Then you'd make a video of that story...Using it's words and trying to feel what the person who wrote the story must have felt...

We'll see how it goes. Rules of the game are in the sidebar...

[hume12345]

I dislike when we try and respect opinion that are fallacious. men have no right to be anti feminist. feminism exists to bring about equality between the sexes. it's not necessarily about empowering one sex over the other. having said this a story that always sticks in my craw is the rape conviction of mike tyson in the desiree washington trial. ms washington gave an interview after tyson was sentenced where she smiled and laughed and said 'if tyson had apologised i wouldn't have pressed charges

[2bsirius]

That's why I want stories ONLY...Not ideologies...Yes, I agree that women's rights need to be respected, as do the rights of men...

[hume12345]

this is a story, albeit from an impersonal source.

[2bsirius]

Good story...But I need longer and personal stories...

[silassays]

Men have every right to be anti-feminist.

When a women has the "right" to kill my child, and I am powerless to stop her, I have every right to be angry.

If a man said, "I feared for my life as I shot her in the head as she slept because she slapped me around ten years ago" do you think he'd get off? Women do and often.

[hume12345]

@silassays, i'm sorry i don't understand your post. maybe because i don't speak rubbish!

[silassays]

I don't speak rubbish either. My comment is true in the USA where I live.

In the USA women are considered a minority. As such they have many advantages men do not have. The law is always in their favor.

Less pay for equal work is a hoax in my experience.

You may disagree with me, but insulting me is rude and childish.

[hume12345]

@silassays. google 'lubna ahmed al hussein' and then come back to me and say this isn't a common occurrence around the globe. to be blunt i find your thinking absurd.

[silassays]

Notice that I said "In the USA where I live." I'm not talking about some backward Islamic country where women allow themselves to be abused.

In the USA feminism= Me first.

You don't live in the USA and you don't know what you're talking about as it relates to the USA.

I worked in a factory where men were immediately fired for a sexual harrassment claim. Women knew this and used it to their advantage. If you didn't do their bidding you were fired.

My thinking is absurd. Grow up.