Racial Issues / Racial Policies From a Debate between Dennis Prager and David Sirota

[jkiene]

Somewhere in the Liberals life they came to realize that life is unfair. Competition smacked them right in the face. The then came to the belief that restricting others through regulation and taking money from those who earn it and giving it to those that don't is what's best for YOU!. They know best, not YOU. They will tell you how much is too much, not YOU!.

Life, liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. More like Life unless we abort you, Liberty, unless we tell you to do something, SAD.

[philipclock]

I have no idea what Sirota's talking about. His "facts" are cherry-picked and out of context, he doesn't define his terms (what is "race", etc.), and like "progressives" today, their "reality" is a diatribe against people and their choices, "progressives" see a crisis of monumental proportion in their perceived outcomes of our choices, that must be addressed IMMEDIATELY, because it's so.....UNFAIR! On their terms, of course. Just like my son when he was a toddler. Reality, what a concept.

[darwinkilledgod]

Sirota's facts were not very honest. For one, he left out Asians and Jews on all his stats because they actually do better economically than whites. That undercuts his argument that America favors whites and that's why they're ahead. Two, he left out Hispanic life expectancy when talking about blacks dying from lack of healthcare. This is because Hispanics outlive whites in America, and it probably has nothing to do with healthcare.

Also, Medicare wastes 33% on fraud!

[gtiprod]

@darwinkilledgod Lets see, I am Jewish and I am "White"/Caucasian. I never knew Jews

were considered anything else for the most part. As to Medicare, for EVERY $ paid into the system it cost 4 cents where as before Obamacare, the Medical Insurance Cos. were taking 25 - 35+ cents out of every dollar. Do the math.....

[darwinkilledgod]

@gtiprod You're confusing "profit" with "taking". By your economically-illiterate logic, we could socialize the entire economy and then no one would be "taking" cents out of every dollar. Imagine how productive that would be!

Also, if you think Jews aren't discriminated in the US, make that argument. If not, then my point stands... Jews are discriminated and YET make more money than Christians. That undercuts his point. And yours.

[shieldsff]

The deficiency in Dennis's view is that it leads to benign (i.e., color blind) forms of racial benign neglect which debunks and disregard the long history of racial oppression& inequality (unequal opportunities stemming from past injustices) His views obscure the harsh, brutal american reality that exists for the poor & 10 million+ black slave descendants in this country . I know that is not a comfortable statement for many people, but it's the truth & MR. Prager is incorrect on this topic.

[lovellespice]

Tagalog? Excuse me. English IS an official language in the Philippines. Although most Filipinos don't speak English like native speakers do, they do have adequate understanding and proficiency to be able to function in an English language dominated society.

[lovellespice]

color of skin no. size of shoe? YES. it matters. =)

[jenneudy]

@lovellespice seriously?

[rushlimbang]

Dennis is doing a crossword puzzle while the liberal speaks. He is not even breaking a sweat.

[jkiene]

@BarthBunzel Your threads here have a consistent theme...insults and no substance. The fact is Liberals unfortunately for Conservatives want more control over the lives of individuals and their freedoms. The liberal is emotional hence the common (and you're no exception) and predictable insults. I can give you many examples of Liberal control and redistribution of wealth if you like. Forgive me if I'm wrong but I can also predict you don't have a very close relationship with your father?

[gtiprod]

@jkiene It's not the Liberal who wants to tell a woman what to do with her body and it's not the Liberal who says Marriage should be between and Man and a Woman. When I hear what Prager and the others have to say, they are projecting the things they say about

Liberals/the Left to themselves. What I am saying is, the talking about themselves and they sad thing is they know it.

[jkiene]

@gtiprod Actually, telling a woman what to do with her body is not a libertarian or in my opinion, a Conservative belief or position. Religious people are who want to restrict a woman from killing her child. Marriage is between a man and and a woman. If you want to call a man married to a man then call it a gay union or some other name... I just want liberals to leave me alone. Let me make my own decisions for myself, not big government, agree?

[jkiene]

@gtiprod Curious, why is the left against the death penalty but not abortion? Why does the liberal let rapist and murderers out of jail? Why is our society worse off today than years past when government is at its largest and most restrictive? Why are there no more high dives at the swimming pool? Why cant I roll down my back seat car window all the way? Why do all hotels not have a window you can open? Why do liberals want to protect me from myself? Why do only 46% of popul. pay and tax?

[jkiene]

@BarthBunzel Really! Liberals are unhappy people for the most part.  Why else do you think liberal talk radio is a complete failure. The only liberal shows that are on are either in San Fran or like city or supported by some rich lib.

[JohnGaudio]

@BarthBunzel Again, both here an in several of your other comments, you clearly identify yourself as rude, crude, and unwilling to address real issues in your comments. Like many who have no valid argument, you resort to bigotry, name calling and vulgarity. I'm leaving your posts up as fine examples of the sort of mindless opposition people like Dennis deal with every day. BTW, what is it about Governor Palin that scares you so much? She must have something really good going for her. :-)

[ThoughtGazeCarlos]

@JohnGaudio I read your comment and I couldn't have said it better! Thumbs up for your comment.

[JohnGaudio]

@BarthBunzel Again, both here an in several of your other comments, you clearly identify yourself as rude, crude, and unwilling to address any real issue in your comments. Like many who have no valid argument, you resort to bigotry, name calling and vulgarity. I'm leaving your posts up as fine examples of the sort of mindless opposition people like Dennis deal with every day. BTW, what is it about Governor Palin that scares you so much? She must have something really good going for her. :-)

[jenneudy]

@JohnGaudio Palin having something good going for her??? Are you kidding? This woman makes a complete fool of herself every time she opens her mouth. Actually, I lose intelligence if I bother to allow the words out of her mouth to make it to my ears. That isn't bigoted, vulgar, or name calling, just so you're aware.

[IronfistAmerican]

All I heard from David Siorta is poor me.

[jkiene]

You sum up this debate by realizing the Liberal is the pessimist and the conservative is the optimist. Forcing equality. The liberal doesn't realize what he's got, he only focuses on what he doesn't have like a 5 year old child....

[XKBdeathbunny]

voting doesn't mean you control the gov't. It's the people you vote into office. some candidates advocate for tax cuts and less gov't control and intervention, and others opposite

[XKBdeathbunny]

No one should be "controlling" the government. It should be involved as little as possible in our lives so that we can so that we will be able to become as successful as the amount of work we put into becoming successful

[XKBdeathbunny]

first, I didn't see him make any such comments comparing socialism to inequality (inequality of what?) and second, I don't understand why you are talking about defeating and controlling the government

[ebeatworld]

Prager said he very very briefly thought about the idea of running for president. He needs to freaking run! i would vote for him in a second. We would finally have a Republican candidate that could actually articulate his ideals.

[XKBdeathbunny]

yeah so I think you're basically on the same page as Prager. He's saying that there are many, especially the poorer people, who wan t the rich taxed heavily. Most rich people did not become rich overnight. Many were very poor to start off with. There are external as well as internal factors at work, and money doesn't solve these things, but it would be nice to receive free money wouldn't it?

[XKBdeathbunny]

well you said many different things so I can't respond to all.  I'llI just say a few brief things to hopefully clarify this video. Mr. Prager does not believe in equality of wealth, but equal opportunity to earn what you work for, which goes along with what you said "job...college...judge me on my competency period". Unethical businesses should be stopped, and they will, because people and the news expose them, which hurt the business and they end up going bankrupt

[XKBdeathbunny]

you almost had an argument going, but didn't really respond to what Prager said. Plus you added that he is a pile of pus, which gives me and other people reason to disregard your opinions

[bulletsarona]

Dennis prager clearly won this debate again. Without having to use statistics which he could have easily done he defeated this mans statistical dilema, and he is purley paying his dues to socialism. All his points and supposed counter points are socialism.

[yurriah]

How many times have liberals changed their names? They were liberals, leftest, now progressives. what's next nuance party?

[yurriah]

Prager wins again

[cvmarii]

David Sirota is right i agree with him and the other guy with his racist views can go to hell.

[JohnGaudio]

Given the definition of racism - discrimination or prejudice based on race

Dennis Prager's contention that race is unimportant is far from racist. Racists make decisions, award jobs, scholarships, & contracts, and choose candidates because of race, be it Black, White, Hispanic, Asian, Indian, etc.

Your implication that judging people on merit, rather than race, is racist, shows a lack of understanding of the term racist.

Your statement that he "can go to hell." shows intolerance.

[thestudent09]

thumbs up

[yurriah]

wow i just read that rebuttal and... +1 you sir!!!

[edro9494]

Prager wiped the floor with this guy.

[darwinkilledgod]

Sirota just listed a bunch of boring straw men! Nobody said race didn't exist. Nobody said inequality didn't exist.

And for those who know statistics, you'll note he didn't say black men make less than white men, or black women make less than white women. He said black "families" make less than white "families." Because white families are much more likely to have 2 working adults and fewer children, they are obviously going to make more. Thomas Sowell writes about this very eloquently.

[kennny732]

there is a huge difference between a religious minded or spiritually minded person and a religious conservative. religious conservatives do not practice the teachings of jesus, they substitute belief (belief is from the old english word 'lief' which is a wish) verses faith.piety, humility, serviance, charity do not occure to the religious conservative. to them its "do what i want, say i love jesus' and thats all there is...

[hammerofuglytruth]

Ahhh Mr. Prager. It 's your fellow Jews in the media and with their influence on our polticians that continue to shove multiculturalism and political correctness down our throats.

[JohnGaudio]

What makes you assume Dennis' "fellow Jews" are the culprits. While there are certainly liberal Jews in the media, they do not make up or control the media as a whole.

[hammerofuglytruth]

Jews control most of the mainstream media. Multiculturalism(then known as cultural Marxism) and political correctness are ideologies brought into being by Jews at the Frankfurt school in Germany in the 1930's before Hitler. Jews in the media helped promote the idea of multiculturalism through the years. Jews have also been the biggest financial backers of many left wing causes. They maybe on the left but I'm sure Dennis agrees with them on many issues. And they are his fellow Jews.

[Phillyguy0202]

take your thinly veiled anti-semitic crap elsewhere.

[123curling321]

Dennis is not one of those Jews, placing him in the same category with them is totally inaccurate.

[hammerofuglytruth]

If he is not one of them then he should criticizing them for their hypocrisy on multiculturalism. It's good for us here in America but it's bad for Jews in Israel where segregation between Jews and non-Jews is the norm. Jews here want to go on about the segregation of the past(ad-nausium) between blacks and whites but don't say anything about their fellow Jew's use of it in Israel today.

[123curling321]

Jews are a very small faction of the multicultural crowd. Why would he focus on them? Besides, most Jews are already included by the term 'leftist.' Therefore when he comments on hypocrisy of the left on multiculturalism he is commenting on most Jews as well.

[hammerofuglytruth]

That is because liberal Jews comprise a cultural elite in this country. Jews comprise less than 2% of the US population but have great influence politically by finciancal contributions to politicians, socially and culturally with their positions and holdings in the mainstream media. These Jews do not take issue with Israel's use of laws that are designed to keep Israel Jewish. Dennis does not criticize them for their hypocrisy because he is one of them.

[hammerofuglytruth]

My point is: These Jews are on the left but they are Prager's co-ethics and they are united in support of this hypocrisy.

[strykersux]

He doesn't deny that...

[kennny732]

there are 3 types of conservatives...xenophobes, greedheads and religionists...prager is a religionist type conservative

[123curling321]

i like religionists. attack ideas, not people.

[kennny732]

religionist type conservatives suffer from the deadly sin of pride...spiritual pride. they substitute belief for faith. since they 'know' whats best for others, they seek to use state power to impose their will on others.

[123curling321]

But this is true of virtually every single political philosophy! (The exception being anarchism). Even secular extremists seek to impose their values upon others. EVERYONE has a right to vote their values, secular and religious alike. Would it be more accurate to say that you have no problem with them seeking to impose their values, yet you do not approve of what their values are?

[kennny732]

you need to understand the deadly sin of pride. pride seeks power, power for its own sake, not for the betterment of others or society. "let me help you" said the monkey to the fish, as he tucked him gently into the branch of a tree, "so you will not drowned"

[JohnGaudio]

I am a Catholic and a conservative.

Except for the protection of the weak and innocent, I have no desire to impose my will on others. Laws against theft, rape, and murder are necessary and appropriate in a society.

These include laws prohibiting the murder of the weakest among us, our unborn children. There can be no "right to choose" without our most basic right, our "right to life."

No man or woman who is denied our God given right to life, can exercise any right to choose.

[123curling321]

But those are still values. I was merely attacking the premise that "religionists" seek to impose their values on others. Any person who votes is imposing their values (or lack there of) on others, it's so simple.

As for Kenny, I have no idea what you're trying to say. That is not what pride means. I think you're talking about something else.

[kennny732]

i cannot imagine what kind of cognitive dissonace it must cause to proclaim one-self both Catholic AND conservative

[strykersux]

Why?

[JohnGaudio]

No cognitive dissonance at all. :-)

[thestudent09]

Thumbs up!

[ArgusEyes]

Kenny, you appear to have some bigotry issues. Comments like this that you can chop and change a large group of people or that "they" are all this way or that "they" can only be bad are quintessentially bigoted. I suggest you think how it would sound if a white would say similar things. Also, I clicked on your profile expecting to see your age as 14 or something like that. For a 50 year old man your views should embarass you.

[kennny732]

i'm not quite sure which comment you refer to, but i can say, in all honesty, there is no bigotry.

what one can do, however, is catagorize the drives and motivations of a group to explain their actions.

as a result, i do not use 'good' or 'bad' as a value judgement

[ArgusEyes]

"there are 3 types of conservatives...xenophobes, greedheads and religionists..."

[kennny732]

yes...it is a fact, and they can be differentiated by which deadly sin each predominantly practices.

your xenophobe type conservative practices wrath, he's a hater

your greedhead type conservative practices avarice

your religionist type conservative practices pride

[ArgusEyes]

So you define "them" (conservatives in this instance) as belonging to three types. Each type charaterised by a bad trait. So in the context of how you have spoken conservatives are only bad.

Yeah you're not a bigot at all...

B.T.W. You missed my type. The atheist libertarian who believes that smaller government leads to a better society. Oh wait, I *want* a better society so that makes me greedy right?

[kennny732]

libertarian type conservatives are greedhead type conservatives.

their motto is 'I got mine, to hell with anyone else" the greedhead type conservative convieniantly chooses to ignore endemic social problems. this type is most likely to cheat on taxes, then blame widows, orphans and cripples for the taxes he cannot avoid. this type has no problem bellying up to the public trough however, to get as much as he can

[ArgusEyes]

You disgust me. You're evil.

[thestudent09]

oh shit! im sorry man i didnt see this post untill after i posted that last comment! thumbs up!

[thestudent09]

thumbs down man...i hate to do that but conservitism is the closest thing to libertarianism we can get and is a major political power...at least here in america

[bigredlance]

One of Dennis' greatest quotes in "I believe in clarity over agreement."

Well, this was very clarifying, as Sirota is DEAD WRONG on basically everything he said.

The 7th was an awesome quote.

[losamfr17]

Notice the part when Dennis talks about having been raised believing that "race is as important as shoe size." After the debate, David Sirota later wrote on his blog that "Dennis said that race in American is as important as shoe size." Notice the major discrepancy and the intent to portray Dennis as a denier and potential racist.

[katoanga]

There is a filter in the mind of David Sirota, that is the only explanation.

I love Prager's 7th airplane response hahahaha, he's good!