The issue is NOT abortion. Women abort babies all the time quite innocently & spontanteously; something goes wrong. The issue is MURDER of a baby, a human being while in the womb. If a baby has to be removed from the womb to protect its own life & that of the mother, the baby must be kept alive if at all possible. Murder in the womb is the same as murder outside the womb. Being a mother gives u no right to hire a hit man to kill your children.
The force is force to protect the baby from the surgeon's knife & garbage disposal. If a woman has a baby, she had best be forced not to murder the baby. Stopping cruelty to animals like dogs and cruelty to babies must employ force if necessary.
Really you would force a girl to have her father child? Thats SICK! Period. I believe in protecting women but when we can't protect them and the damage is done i beleive thay STILL HAVE A CHOICE
What dishonest verbage "pro-choice." Pro-choice of what? Pro-choice to murder! Shame on you. Will you grant a doctor with a machete the right to choose whether or not you should be cut up?
There are innumerable "forest fire" ethical issues like baby-murder. Instead of going around & trying to stamp them all out individually a massive fire-extinguisher is useful. Romans is such an extinguisher.
"the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness,"
Baby-murder philosophy is just one of many such suppressions of truth.
"the wrath of God is revealed..against all..unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth.. becs that which is known about God is evident w/in them; for God made it evident to them."
In Him we live & move & have our being; thus His existence is self-evident & to be affirmed. Since He has given us His word, we are not left to grope in blindness over moral issues. 1st, we are told to love neighbor as self. What is more neighbor that the baby?
To fail to call the unborn baby a baby suppresses truth. John the Baptist is called a baby or infant while inside his mother.
"that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them. For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse."
BEING WILLING TO MURDER BABIES MAY BE ENDORSED BY FUTILE SPECULATIONS & A DARKENED HEART
"without excuse. For even though they knew God, they did not honor Him as God or give thanks, but they became futile in their speculations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing to be wise, they became fools"
"God gave them over in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, so that their bodies would be dishonored among them. For they exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen. For this reason God gave them over to degrading passions"
"just as they did not see fit to acknowledge God any longer, God gave them over to a depraved mind, to do those things which are not proper"
TO CALL BABY-MURDER "NOT PROPER" IS AN UNDERSTATEMENT
being filled with all unrighteousness, wickedness, greed, evil; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, malice; they are gossips, slanderers, haters of God, insolent, arrogant, boastful, INVENTORS OF EVIL"
full of envy, murder [EVEN OF BABIES] strife, deceit, malice; they are gossips, slanderers, haters of God, insolent, arrogant, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents, w/out understanding
[witness their arguments for baby-murder], untrustworthy, unloving, unmerciful"
They are willing to slice up babies, vacuum them to shreds, peel off their skin w/ corrosive fluids, stick implements into the brain to jank it out of the skull.
WHO WOULD PAT AN AGENT OF MURDER ON THE BACK "altho they know the ordinance of God, that those who practice such things are worthy of death, they not only do the same, but also give hearty approval to those who practice them."
If he was conceived by an underage woman of age 17 who was raped by a man of 24 (statuatory rape at least), should his mama have murdered him in the womb?
No, you showed no evidence of a spirit. You showed quotations from a book. Good job *sigh*. I already mentioned I am an atheist - I don't believe in god!
I don't think a child could live outside the womb without a fully formed CNS. And it certainly couldn't sustain itself at the first trimester and rarely ever in the second.
I not only gave you evidence, I gave you absolute proof from God's Word.
What is the proof that no human being exists until it has a developed CNS?
What is the proof that self-sustaining is required to be a human being?
Who of us is self-sustaining; only YHWH is self-sustaining. We depend upon the gracious provision of oxygen. Can u picture us all as in this huge womb, this earth system, which we never created? Even outside the womb, how many children are self-sustaining?
"I not only gave you evidence, I gave you absolute proof from God's Word."
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*giggle* YOUR OPINION. I need evidence that can be observed, tested, something! The same way I need evidence to believe any claim.
How about this for a change; Why don't you stop asking questions and actually answer what I have provided, or what others have asked you and what they have told you?
In order to establish rational, logical, accurate thought, the human requires a new birth; otherwise the mind is employed towards selfish ends; special pleading is inevitable.
The heart is deceitful above all things & desparately evil, who can know it?
The mental darkness of the natural man is expounded at length in Rom 1
Nothing can be proven merely by giving reasons, bec proof of the reasons can always be required. To ultimately prove something logically requires axioms, one must show that the moral ethic is based upon self-evident truths, truths so immediately obvious that no further proof is required. Examples of axioms: I exist. If A = B, then A+C = B+C.
I might give u reasons to prove that I exist, but I wud be more sure that I existed than of the reasons I gave.
Given those 2 axioms, u can prove a lot. Without them, what can u do but fly by the seat of your pants & say, "Well, this is the way it seems to me."
The burden of affirming those 2 obvious truths is upon each person. You yourself either affirm or deny that you immediately know that God is present. You yourself have to read the Bible & either hear or fail to hear Him.
It is not so long ago in history that murdering babies was against the law. The forceful removal of a baby from the womb was a crime when one had no reasonable expectation that the baby would survive the removal & when one would make no attempt to keep the baby alive, but rather have the determined purpose of killing the baby. -- all this when the life of the mother was not an issue.
NOW HOW CAN U BE SO SURE THAT THE FORMER GENERATIONS WERE NOT CORRECT?
that the present generation is morally correct & that former generations (who abominated killing of unborn babies) were not correct? What makes the current generation so sure that it has now discovered the moral truth that was lost the the lame-brains of previous generations?
There are many opinions on many subjects. The question arises, how does one KNOW something, particularly, how does one know what is right, what should or should not be done, what is sin and what is righteousness?
I put it to you that whatever you baby-killers use for your "proof," it goes back to something you really have no sufficient basis for knowing that it is correct. Ur reason is probably: "That's the way I want it to be."
AFter conception it is not just a clump, but a human being. The fact that man is implicated in Adam's sin indicates that spirit as well as body is derived from parents & that from conception a human being exists, body & spirit. It is murder at any time of development to kil the baby.
NoRightsForGays = a registered gay hate bash channel who uses God for hate.Pls don't react on any of his comments and register this channel to You Tube. How to register? See our channel for help
Fuck, I was raped but lucky that I didn't get pregnant. If I did get pregnant I wouldn't give second thought on having an abortion. Why punish the woman for something she couldn't help? How is that fair?
@Thunkful2 Forcing a woman to carry a child she didn't want and had no choice because she was is a punishment. Why should the woman be punished? Why should she have to carry the baby? The answer is that she shouldn't and any woman who has been raped would understand.
@Thunkful2 It's not murdering if it's not developed. Once you become raped and become a female you can have a say on it, until then stfu. A woman should not have to be punished by carrying a child of her rapist peroid.
It is murder to kill a baby in the womb, just as it is outside the womb. The baby is a human being. You would take a human life away. It is not punishment to fulfill an obligation to care for one's baby. Once a person becomes a mother, she has an obligation to love & care for her child. She may well do this by giving it up for adoption. But the baby is innocent of the rape.
@Thunkful2 A WOMAN WHO WAS RAPED? YOU'RE SAYING THAT'S HER OBLIGATION?! HELL NO! WTF PLANET ARE YOU FROM TO THINK A WOMAN SHOULD BE FORCED. THAT IS ANOTHER PUNISHMENT FOR HER. I know how the human body developes since my mom is a teacher on the subject. There is a time in the development that abortion is ok to do. Once, you grow a vagina you can have some say, but until then STFU.
The mother's obligation is to her baby, regardless of how she came to have the baby. The baby is innocent. THOU SHALT NOT KILL. The Lord does not have the anatomical part to which you refer, but He tells us all what's what.
@Thunkful2 Fine, if god sends a woman to hell for having an abortion after she was raped that just proves that hell is the good place. Being punished for something that happened to her, that's bull shit
What is BS is your thinking that the mama is better off if she murders her baby, as if that had no bad effect on her. The wicked are like the troubled sea, when it cannot rest, whose waters cast up mire & dirt. There is no rest . . . to the wicked.
What is this "god" business? You think Zeus or Thor cares?
@Thunkful2 Please grow a vagina and get your ass raped. A woman shouldn't be forced to carry a baby that was concieved in a rape. It's just punishing her. She is being vicimized twice, get that through your microscopic brain of yours.
When a woman murders her baby she suffers by becoming a murderer. When she loves the innocent baby, she rightly receives honor, instead of a guilty conscience or seared conscience. To facilitate a woman or encourage a woman to kill her baby does the woman harm.
Get it thru ur head that your are mistreating a woman by facilitating the murder of her baby.
@Thunkful2 Get it through your head. I was raped. I know what it feels like to be raped. I know how if feels how to wait and find out if i was pregnant or not. It isn't murder, I know how the human body developes. You haven't been in my situation so you are WRONG. Get it through your head, you won't be right ever. Go fuck yourself and burn in hell.
It is illogical to say that a person cannot know what is right or wrong treatment for a victim of a crime unless that person himself was identically victimized. I have never been beat up repeatedly by a spouse, but I know that such a victim is not justified in packing her kids in a car & driving off into a Lake to drown everyone.
The issue is not what a woman can do to her body, but what she can do to her baby's body. Even if I had no children, I would still be responsible to oppose child-abuse. Murder is ultimate chid-abuse. Pregnancy is no license to murder. Thou shalt not murder. No murderer has eternal life. Imagine facing your chld at the Great White Throne judment: "Mommy, why did you murder me? What did I ever do wrong to you?"
@Thunkful2 Until you have been forced to have sex, until you have had no choice but to take it you can have a say, until you've been in that situation you can shut the fuck up because I've been through that and let me tell you that it's terrifying not knowing whether you are going to be killed or not. Being forced to carry a rape baby is a punishment and I'd rather die then go through with it.
The topic is not me; the topic is baby-murder. I have never been murdered or murdered anyone; but that does not disqualify me from asserting truth related to it. Should I tell you that until you have been sliced up by a knife, don't tell me anything promoting baby-murder? There comes the knife; the baby doesn't know if it is to be killed or not; but killed it is, heartless brutality, merciless monstrous wickedness.
@Thunkful2 It isn't murder. Go grow a vagina, get raped and then get pregnant, then you can say shit, until then your argument is invalid, go fuck yourself.
Get it through ur head that having been raped does not give you the moral authority to decree what is right or wrong with regard to killing or loving babies. The Lord has told us "Thou shalt not kill" (murder).
How does my not having been in your situtation nullify God's Word? How wud u like ur mother to slice u up with a knife?
@Thunkful2 Get it through your head It's my fucking body and if I'm dammed for it fuck god because I wouldn't follow a god who damns a victim to hell. Fuck you. Go get raped!
Get it through your head that the subject is THE BABY & MURDERING IT. The subject is not you or me. You are hung up on ME, ME, ME, your selfish desire to do what pleases yourself. I have news for you: it is not merely YOUR body; the earth is the Lord's & the fulness thereof, the world & they who dwell therein.
If you go to the Lake of Fire it will be because of your sins of which you have plenty -- just as I do.
Fortunately, God commends His own love towards us in that while we were yet sinners Christ died for us. Whenever you get sick & tired of making yourself your own god and want transformation, a new birth is available.
"For whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord [Jesus = YHWH] shall be saved."
@Thunkful2 I need transformation? As a raped woman; a victim I need transormation? Firstly I'm a Satanist and I've chosen Satan to guide me on the way. A woman should have a right to choose. There is nothing wrong with it.
satanist? that explains it all. but he will do you no good, only harm. When you get desperate, turn to the Son of God who has defeated satan and made provision for your eternal bliss.
For whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord [Jesus = YHWH] shall be saved.
Well bored board readers; we see that a satanist believes in killing babies. Believing in killing babies is appropriate for one who hates mankind. And adopting a plank in his platform may lead to full fledged loyalty to the Enemy. his destiny is the Lake of Fire & all his minions.
You may have been born a descendant of Jacob, but you were not born Jewish. You cannot be a true Jew unless you trust your Messiah the Lord Jesus as Savior.
"For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision which is outward in the flesh: but he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God."
@Thunkful2 You don't know shit about Jews. Jews DON'T accept Jesus as the Savior. Just like you are misimformed about Satanisim you are misimformed about Judisim. But keep talking, you making an idiot of yourself is amusing me.
I was sprinkled as a child in a "church," but that did not make me a Christian. I was dunked in the water by persons who believed in immersion when I was an older child, but that also didn't make me a Christian. Trusting Christ as my savior secured a new birth & made me a Christian.
your belief in baby-killing, satanism, & living for self all go together nicely. The Tanach says to love your neighbor as yourself (Leviticus). Your baby is your neighbor.
How does the fact that the baby was conceived by a rapist make the baby not your neighbor? It is hard to be more neighbor than by being a baby in your womb. It takes a miracle to be delivered from innate selfishness & made a person who actually can love neighbor as self. That miracle is the new birth. You must be born again.
@gothicslytherinchic so you'll happily deny a child the right to live even when adoption is an option? I mean, Sarah Palin is dumb but not everyone who believes in Pro- Life is Sarah fucking Palin!
@gothicslytherinchic I don't how punishment got in there? I was just talking about what I believe is right and wrong. If a woman is raped, wouldn't the worst situation be to take the life of an innocent child as well? Is it the child's fault that the woman was raped? Does it deserve to die because of it?
@gothicslytherinchic my wife was born from a result of a rape, i am grateful her mom kept her, i would not change my wife, for any woman that had a normal conception or all the $ on earth, my wife is a live example of a human being. today my wife can encourage others who are thinking of abortion to take care of the baby or give for adoption, never kill. also my mother in law, the raped person is one of the most amazing woman i even knew, an example of courage & love for life
@gothicslytherinchic my wife was born from a result of a rape, i am grateful her mom kept her, i would not change my wife, for any woman that had a normal conception or all the $ on earth, my wife is a live example of a human being. today my wife can encourage others that are thinking of abortion to take care of the baby or give for adoption, never kill. my mother in law, the raped person is one of the most amazing woman i even knew, an example of courage & love for life
@Thunkful2 so a woman not only has 2 deal with being raped, but then has 2 carry round the outcome of it 4 9 months. then she may have 2 relive what she went thru over & over agains, every time she looks that child in the eye?
& wat if the child is mentally/physically disabled, the mother is broke, or the mother was possibly going to die as a result of childbirth?
it's so sad how religion can brainwash people to the point they cant even think for themselves & form their own perspective.
In addition to reliving a rape, would you burden someone with the guilt of having murdered a baby?
Why have you let religion brainwash you so that you can't think straight? Imagine yourself enjoying something in your home, when suddenly your mother breaks down the door along side of a big brute with a machete. "Daughter, you are the result of a rape!" Go get her: Whack, slice cut, dismember! Remains go in garbage disposal. Whir, whir, chunk, chunk, whir.
@Thunkful2 no, y wud i burden some1 with the guilt of murdering a baby? the choice is there 4 them & they can choose freely. a zygote or a foetus in its early stages isn't a baby, in the same way a seed is not a tree.
& chances r the potential child wouldn't b enjoying itself at home if they r unwanted, neglected, living in poverty, born addicted 2 drugs/disabled or subject 2 abuse.
funny how all these pro-life ppl give a shit about ppl until they r born, then couldnt care less.
Of course people can choose to do evil. How does the fact that they can choose evil justify the choice of evil? You may choose to do evil, but you cannot altogether choose whether or not to feel guilty & experience the torment of a guilty conscience. The only escape from the guilty conscience is by trusting Christ as Savior.
@Thunkful2 they don't see it as evil. i now realise i can't have any sort of stimulating argument with you because it seems your view is dictated for you by a (very very) ancient text.
i'm so thankful that there is a separate church & state! AMEN! :)
@gothicslytherinchic my wife was born from a result of a rape, i am grateful her mom kept her, i would not change my wife, for any woman that had a normal conception or all the $ on earth, my wife is a live example of a human being. today my wife can encourage others that are thinking of abortion to take care of the baby or give for adoption, never kill. also my mother in law, the raped person is one of the most amazing woman i even knew,an example of courage & love for life
@Thunkful2 when they abort it its actually a clump of cell nothing more so its not murder.are you actually that sick to think a woman or girl should be made carry something she did not want .The world really is fucked up
How do u know it is a clump & not a human being? Are you actually that sick not to realize that a woman who kills her baby does not reap tragic consequences?
That is simply a lie. Babies in the womb are murdered at all stages of development, even when in process of being birthed. How would you like your parents to murder you because they didn't want you? So they knock on your door one day: "By the way, we never wanted you." Then they feed you into wood-chipping machine.
You can't settle the issue by using exculpatory language, no more than you can excuse fornication by calling it "being sexually active." Don't you know that fetus is simply the Latin word for infant, baby? The unborn baby John the Baptist is referred to as a brephos = baby, infant, in his mother's womb in Luke. Pregnant women commonly call their babies babies.
I'm sorry if I hurt your feelings, but it still isn't a baby. That's just the definition of an infant. And if you missed it, I am an atheist. You are actually calling a zygote, or as it was already pointed out, a clump of cells, a human being. It is inhumane to punish a woman this way for the rest of her life, even more inhumane than stopping a human life before it even begins.
You try to sugarcoat things by calling a POTENTIAL human being a "baby".
You can't define your way out of the responsibility to love babies & not murder them. No, I never called anything a zygote. Once the baby exists, it must be cared for & loved. How it came into existence is irrelevant. Caring for a baby is not a punishment, but a privilege. Focusing on self is a self-punishment. Inhumane? When did man become the standard of good? Murder is "humane," a human behavior. Hating comes nature ot men. The baby is not a potential but a real baby.
What is your proof that babys don't have pain sensors until 12 weeks? And what leads u to suppose that if a person can't feel pain, he can then be murdered OK?
"Why do you want to punish the mama by helping her commit murder?"
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*facepalm*
"How do you know that the baby cannot think? What is your proof that babys don't have pain sensors until 12 weeks?"
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Because they don't have a nervous system. Which develops in the 2nd/3rd trimester.
It's not murder because it has almost no characteristics of a human being for it to be murder. It's not a humane procedure just because it cannot feel pain, it is a humane procedure because it's not human.
What is your proof that baby's don't have pain sensors until 12 weeks & don't have nervous systems until the 2nd/3rd trimester? Your saying it is no proof. Anyone can post anything.
How do you know that thought is physical instead of a characteristic of a spirit? How do u know that a baby can't think by virtue of its spirit?
How do u know that the baby has almost no characteristics of a human being?
I don't know if youtube allows me to post link, but here:
webspace.ship.edu/cgboer/genpsyfetaldev.html
It actually says that the central nervous system develops during the 25th - 28th week.
"How do you know that thought is physical instead of a characteristic of a spirit?"
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Because there is no evidence of the existence of a spirit. At least any that I have seen. If you believe that, that's your opinion and in no way a reason to pass law.
Your web site has the central nervous system starting development in the 3rd week, as indicated by its graphical chart. And how do you know that the CNS doesn't start even before that? Do you believe things just because some internet site says so?
How do you know that there is no evidence of the existence of a spirit?
How do u know that spirit is just my opinion & not a reason to pass law?
How do u know that CNS development defines existence of a human being not to be murdered?
How do you know that there is no evidence of a spirit? Do you have self-awareness? From what does that come? If you have no evidence of a spirit, how does that prove that thought is physical?
Have you changed from 1-2 now to 12? What is your proof that it cannot think until 12 weeks. Do you believe it is right to murder someone when they are not thinking? So you are asleep & not thinking; would you like a doctor to take a scalpel or a machete to you?
You are a potential Human Being. Right now you seem to be a dead human being, an offspring of the sinner Adam. But you are a potential true human being, a potential child of God. All it takes is a new birth. Call on the Lord Jesus to transform and save you. For whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord, shall be saved. This Lord is the risen God-the-Son, the Lord Jesus.
On a different note, I hope you understand that delegalization of abortion actually forces women into making unhealthy choices for themselves, and increases death or trauma after an unauthorized abortion is performed. Remember the "back alley abortions".
The Word of God calls (not "it," but "him") a baby. Re unborn John the Baptist:
"And she cried out with a loud voice and said, “Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb! “And how has it happened to me, that the mother of my Lord would come to me? “For behold, when the sound of your greeting reached my ears, the baby leaped in my womb for joy. "
I hope u are not part of a generation which knows not the Christmas story.
It's still an embryo, not a baby. Religion and faith have no place in discussions about abortions. Either use facts, or admit that it's just your personal opinion.
You can't make laws based on your own religion. That's at best arrogant, at worst, oppressive. Make laws based on what's best for society.
A "baby", as you prefer to call it, in its mother's tummy, is unthinking and unfeeling for the first 1-2 months. It has more in common with a lump of cells than with a human being.
If you say that abortion is murder, then I guess miscarriage is divine judgment?
In a democracy people can make laws on whatever they wish; you cannot cancel out votes based on why u think they voted. It seems arrogant to claim the right to analyze reasons for voting & then nullify votes on that basis.
But I advise you to stop trying to make laws based on your religion.
Those who believe in baby-murder (like you) typically do not stop at 1-2 months. Notice ur vague hypen. Is it 1 or is it 2? U don't seem to know. But u still are dogmatic.
What is your proof that babies of 2 months don't think? Wud u object if someone came after you with a knife & cut you up when you were in an unthinking mode? Suppose you are asleep & unthinking. Is it OK to pour corrosive liquid on your skin that peels it off?
Death is something we all face. It is appointed to man once to die but after that the judgment. Adam's race stands under judgment.
@gothicslytherinchic does aborting a child unrape a woman? Can the poor baby help the fact that it's mother raped? How is it fair that the child should lose it's life?
@MrRyanSams How is it fair that she should be forced to give up 9 months of her life? She's victimized and you would be victimizing her even further to force her to carry a child she didn't want with a man she didn't want. You are a guy so you don't know how it is to carry a baby. You should have no say whether abortion should be legal or not in the first place.
@gothicslytherinchic oh, what a sacrifice. 9 months? You're willing take away a child's whole life for nine months? The baby does not belong to you! Sure i have no idea what carrying a child is like but I've heard it's not that bad - it certainly can't be as bad as killing a child, I mean have you even stopped to think about the child. If you kill a chid outside the womb that'd be wrong wouldn't it? You talk about carrying a child for nine months, what about taking care of a child for 18 years?
@MrRyanSams I'm not carrying the child of my rapists period. You asking a woman to do that makes you just as bad or possibly even worse than the rapist.
@gothicslytherinchic you evil little woman - listen to yourself! What you just said is that someone who wants to save a baby's life is worst than a rapist. You disgusting person, you make me sick.
my wife was born from a result of a rape, i am grateful her mom kept her, i would not change my wife, with any woman that had a normal conception or all the $ on earth, my wife is a live example of a human being. today my wife can encourage others that are thinking of abortion to take care of the baby or give for adoption, never kill. also my mother in law, the raped person is one of the most amazing woman i even knew, an example of courage & love for life ,
@gothicslytherinchic I'm a man and I 100% agree with your outlook. Until they are raped or victimized,they have no right to put down someone's decision for abortion. An obligation being forced upon someone is wrong.
The question is, when is it proper to murder a baby? Is the fact that the baby was created by a rape grounds to kill a baby? It wasn't the baby's fault,.
@Thunkful2 if something cannot survive outside the womb it's not a baby. Why should a woman or girl go through the absolute horror of carrying the spawn of her rapist for 9 months...get a grip
@ChicanoLA Being raped doesn't justify murdering a baby. It is a baby. John the Baptist was called a baby in his mother's womb. Ability to independently survive does not determine whether someone is a human or a person. None of us can independently survive. If they Lord cut off our oxygen, we would quickly die.
How did we get to the place where women would murder their own babies? Why shud anyone hate an innocent baby? You don't have to keep it after being born. Adoption is available.
@Thunkful2 A raped woman being forced to carry a child that was concieved during a rape is a punishment. You mine as well be saying that it's her fault.
since the Baby is not at fault, how can you murder the baby? How can you take a knife & cut the baby up into pieces? If you were the product of a rape, should you be sliced up & put down a garbage disposal?
@Thunkful2 I have been raped twice in my sort lifetime. The first time I was 12, the second time I was 14. And I more then likely would have had an abortion, though I am very against it in other situations. No, it wasn't the FETUS' fault, but it was not the womens' fault either. If you have ever been raped you would understand. Though, I sure hope it never happens to you, or anyone for that matter. No women she ever be expected to carry her rapists child.
@Thunkful2 I can understand where you are coming from, but if I was the product of rape, I would have rather of been aborted then know I was only alive because my bio dad raped my bio mom.
So you say that if you were today informed that you were the product of a rape (the guy u thot was ur father was really not), you would happily volunteer for death by scapel?
Then suppose u are the baby: Which death would you gladly accept? 1) a knife cutting you apart piece by piece, 2) a power vaccum sucking you & pulling your body apart, 3) a corrosive fluid injected into the amniotic fluid, which wud make your skin all come off & cause you die in excruciating pain???
@Thunkful2 You cannot compare the murder of a person to a fetus inside of a womb. Like I have said I only agree with abortion if the mother is raped and conceives or if she could die from the pregnancy. As much a I disagree with abortion besides those exception it is still a fetus until it is born. It would be beyond cruel and unusual punishment to except a women who was raped to have to carry her rapists' child and have to be reminded of the horror she went through every day.
im from Australia and stumbled upon this by accident, i am shocked and disturbed by what she just said and im sorry if anyone takes this the wrong way but... is DEMENTED my god she does she have any idea the mental state in which the girl would be in NO she is not a doctor, last i checked she wasnt.
O.K off topic question but my friend is from wasilla, Alaska and when i asked what Wasilla was like she said its like walking into a meth lab, can someone explain?
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Don't feed the troll.
breemystic 4 months ago
The issue is NOT abortion. Women abort babies all the time quite innocently & spontanteously; something goes wrong. The issue is MURDER of a baby, a human being while in the womb. If a baby has to be removed from the womb to protect its own life & that of the mother, the baby must be kept alive if at all possible. Murder in the womb is the same as murder outside the womb. Being a mother gives u no right to hire a hit man to kill your children.
Thunkful2 4 months ago
The force is force to protect the baby from the surgeon's knife & garbage disposal. If a woman has a baby, she had best be forced not to murder the baby. Stopping cruelty to animals like dogs and cruelty to babies must employ force if necessary.
Thunkful2 4 months ago
Really you would force a girl to have her father child? Thats SICK! Period. I believe in protecting women but when we can't protect them and the damage is done i beleive thay STILL HAVE A CHOICE
yankee82090 9 months ago
I'm Pro-Choice without apology.
breemystic 9 months ago
@breemystic
What dishonest verbage "pro-choice." Pro-choice of what? Pro-choice to murder! Shame on you. Will you grant a doctor with a machete the right to choose whether or not you should be cut up?
Thunkful2 4 months ago
There are innumerable "forest fire" ethical issues like baby-murder. Instead of going around & trying to stamp them all out individually a massive fire-extinguisher is useful. Romans is such an extinguisher.
"the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness,"
Baby-murder philosophy is just one of many such suppressions of truth.
Thunkful2 10 months ago
Promoting Baby-Murder is a suppression of truth
"the wrath of God is revealed..against all..unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth.. becs that which is known about God is evident w/in them; for God made it evident to them."
In Him we live & move & have our being; thus His existence is self-evident & to be affirmed. Since He has given us His word, we are not left to grope in blindness over moral issues. 1st, we are told to love neighbor as self. What is more neighbor that the baby?
Thunkful2 10 months ago
To fail to call the unborn baby a baby suppresses truth. John the Baptist is called a baby or infant while inside his mother.
"that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them. For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse."
Thunkful2 10 months ago
BEING WILLING TO MURDER BABIES MAY BE ENDORSED BY FUTILE SPECULATIONS & A DARKENED HEART
"without excuse. For even though they knew God, they did not honor Him as God or give thanks, but they became futile in their speculations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing to be wise, they became fools"
Thunkful2 10 months ago
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IS BABY-MURDER NEEDED TO FACILITATE FORNICATION?
"God gave them over in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, so that their bodies would be dishonored among them. For they exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen. For this reason God gave them over to degrading passions"
Thunkful2 10 months ago
BABY-MURDER COMES FROM DEPRAVED MINDS
"just as they did not see fit to acknowledge God any longer, God gave them over to a depraved mind, to do those things which are not proper"
TO CALL BABY-MURDER "NOT PROPER" IS AN UNDERSTATEMENT
being filled with all unrighteousness, wickedness, greed, evil; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, malice; they are gossips, slanderers, haters of God, insolent, arrogant, boastful, INVENTORS OF EVIL"
Imagine making baby-murder tools.
Thunkful2 10 months ago
NO MERCY FOR BABIES
full of envy, murder [EVEN OF BABIES] strife, deceit, malice; they are gossips, slanderers, haters of God, insolent, arrogant, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents, w/out understanding
[witness their arguments for baby-murder], untrustworthy, unloving, unmerciful"
They are willing to slice up babies, vacuum them to shreds, peel off their skin w/ corrosive fluids, stick implements into the brain to jank it out of the skull.
Thunkful2 10 months ago
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WHO WOULD PAT AN AGENT OF MURDER ON THE BACK "altho they know the ordinance of God, that those who practice such things are worthy of death, they not only do the same, but also give hearty approval to those who practice them."
Thunkful2 10 months ago
SHOULD OBAMA HAVE BEEN KILLED IN THE WOMB?
If he was conceived by an underage woman of age 17 who was raped by a man of 24 (statuatory rape at least), should his mama have murdered him in the womb?
Thunkful2 9 months ago
@Thunkful2
No, you showed no evidence of a spirit. You showed quotations from a book. Good job *sigh*. I already mentioned I am an atheist - I don't believe in god!
I don't think a child could live outside the womb without a fully formed CNS. And it certainly couldn't sustain itself at the first trimester and rarely ever in the second.
justforflag2 10 months ago
JUST:
I not only gave you evidence, I gave you absolute proof from God's Word.
What is the proof that no human being exists until it has a developed CNS?
What is the proof that self-sustaining is required to be a human being?
Who of us is self-sustaining; only YHWH is self-sustaining. We depend upon the gracious provision of oxygen. Can u picture us all as in this huge womb, this earth system, which we never created? Even outside the womb, how many children are self-sustaining?
Thunkful2 10 months ago
@Thunkful2
"I not only gave you evidence, I gave you absolute proof from God's Word."
-
*giggle* YOUR OPINION. I need evidence that can be observed, tested, something! The same way I need evidence to believe any claim.
How about this for a change; Why don't you stop asking questions and actually answer what I have provided, or what others have asked you and what they have told you?
justforflag2 10 months ago
@justforflag2
Why don't you stop making unfounded assertions & asking questions, and give some proof for your spoof?
Thunkful2 4 months ago
In order to establish rational, logical, accurate thought, the human requires a new birth; otherwise the mind is employed towards selfish ends; special pleading is inevitable.
The heart is deceitful above all things & desparately evil, who can know it?
The mental darkness of the natural man is expounded at length in Rom 1
Thunkful2 10 months ago
S'pose the pro-baby killer says
A: The human life inside the mother is not a baby & it's morally right to kill that human life becs of reason B.
Rejoinder: How do u know that Reason B is correct?
Killer: Reason B is correct because of C.
Rejoinder: How do u know that C is correct?
Killer: C is true becs of D.
Rejoinder: How do u know that D is true?
U can see that no proof for A can ever be finally made this way becs a reason for the reason can always be demanded, leading to an infinite series.
Thunkful2 10 months ago
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Thunkful2 10 months ago
LOGIC PROOF
Nothing can be proven merely by giving reasons, bec proof of the reasons can always be required. To ultimately prove something logically requires axioms, one must show that the moral ethic is based upon self-evident truths, truths so immediately obvious that no further proof is required. Examples of axioms: I exist. If A = B, then A+C = B+C.
I might give u reasons to prove that I exist, but I wud be more sure that I existed than of the reasons I gave.
Thunkful2 10 months ago
AXIOMS RELATIVE TO ETHICS
1) Self-evident 1: The God of the Bible exists.
2) Self-evident 2: The Bible is the Word of God.
Given those 2 axioms, u can prove a lot. Without them, what can u do but fly by the seat of your pants & say, "Well, this is the way it seems to me."
The burden of affirming those 2 obvious truths is upon each person. You yourself either affirm or deny that you immediately know that God is present. You yourself have to read the Bible & either hear or fail to hear Him.
Thunkful2 10 months ago
It is not so long ago in history that murdering babies was against the law. The forceful removal of a baby from the womb was a crime when one had no reasonable expectation that the baby would survive the removal & when one would make no attempt to keep the baby alive, but rather have the determined purpose of killing the baby. -- all this when the life of the mother was not an issue.
NOW HOW CAN U BE SO SURE THAT THE FORMER GENERATIONS WERE NOT CORRECT?
Thunkful2 10 months ago
HOW DO U KNOW
that the present generation is morally correct & that former generations (who abominated killing of unborn babies) were not correct? What makes the current generation so sure that it has now discovered the moral truth that was lost the the lame-brains of previous generations?
Thunkful2 10 months ago
HOW DO U KNOW U ARE RIGHT?
There are many opinions on many subjects. The question arises, how does one KNOW something, particularly, how does one know what is right, what should or should not be done, what is sin and what is righteousness?
I put it to you that whatever you baby-killers use for your "proof," it goes back to something you really have no sufficient basis for knowing that it is correct. Ur reason is probably: "That's the way I want it to be."
Thunkful2 10 months ago
and embryo or a fetus is not a baby the same way a bowl of batter is not a cake. this is pretty simple to understand
unit023 10 months ago
@unit023
Lets check out the blazing logic:
Given: a Bowl of batter is not a cake.
Ergo: It is correct to call unborn babies embryos & fetuses.
Ergo: It is all right to murder babies.
QED
My, what blazing logic!
Thunkful2 10 months ago
WHY PUNISH THE LADY?
Indeed, why punish the lady by taking a knife to her baby & cutting it up?
Why punish the lady by sticking a vaccum up her & sucking out the baby, tearing it into pieces?
Why cause the lady to be tormented the rest of her life by guilt over having murdered her own child?
Baby-murder leaves scars on the mama.
Thunkful2 10 months ago
1 out of about 1000 rapes even result in an abortion. Google it, the statistics are there.
LavaEagle 10 months ago
AFter conception it is not just a clump, but a human being. The fact that man is implicated in Adam's sin indicates that spirit as well as body is derived from parents & that from conception a human being exists, body & spirit. It is murder at any time of development to kil the baby.
Thunkful2 10 months ago
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thestopgayhatelist 1 year ago
Fuck, I was raped but lucky that I didn't get pregnant. If I did get pregnant I wouldn't give second thought on having an abortion. Why punish the woman for something she couldn't help? How is that fair?
gothicslytherinchic 1 year ago
@gothicslytherinchic
why punish the baby?
Thunkful2 11 months ago
@Thunkful2 Forcing a woman to carry a child she didn't want and had no choice because she was is a punishment. Why should the woman be punished? Why should she have to carry the baby? The answer is that she shouldn't and any woman who has been raped would understand.
gothicslytherinchic 11 months ago
@gothicslytherinchic
Why should be baby be murdered?
Thunkful2 11 months ago
@Thunkful2 It's not murdering if it's not developed. Once you become raped and become a female you can have a say on it, until then stfu. A woman should not have to be punished by carrying a child of her rapist peroid.
gothicslytherinchic 11 months ago
@gothicslytherinchic
It is murder to kill a baby in the womb, just as it is outside the womb. The baby is a human being. You would take a human life away. It is not punishment to fulfill an obligation to care for one's baby. Once a person becomes a mother, she has an obligation to love & care for her child. She may well do this by giving it up for adoption. But the baby is innocent of the rape.
"Thou shalt not murder."
Thunkful2 11 months ago
@Thunkful2 A WOMAN WHO WAS RAPED? YOU'RE SAYING THAT'S HER OBLIGATION?! HELL NO! WTF PLANET ARE YOU FROM TO THINK A WOMAN SHOULD BE FORCED. THAT IS ANOTHER PUNISHMENT FOR HER. I know how the human body developes since my mom is a teacher on the subject. There is a time in the development that abortion is ok to do. Once, you grow a vagina you can have some say, but until then STFU.
gothicslytherinchic 11 months ago 2
@gothicslytherinchic
The mother's obligation is to her baby, regardless of how she came to have the baby. The baby is innocent. THOU SHALT NOT KILL. The Lord does not have the anatomical part to which you refer, but He tells us all what's what.
Thunkful2 10 months ago
@Thunkful2 Fine, if god sends a woman to hell for having an abortion after she was raped that just proves that hell is the good place. Being punished for something that happened to her, that's bull shit
gothicslytherinchic 10 months ago
@gothicslytherinchic
What is BS is your thinking that the mama is better off if she murders her baby, as if that had no bad effect on her. The wicked are like the troubled sea, when it cannot rest, whose waters cast up mire & dirt. There is no rest . . . to the wicked.
What is this "god" business? You think Zeus or Thor cares?
Thunkful2 10 months ago
@Thunkful2 Please grow a vagina and get your ass raped. A woman shouldn't be forced to carry a baby that was concieved in a rape. It's just punishing her. She is being vicimized twice, get that through your microscopic brain of yours.
gothicslytherinchic 10 months ago
@gothicslytherinchic
The vicitimizations come as follows:
1) when the woman is raped,
2) when the woman murders her baby.
When a woman murders her baby she suffers by becoming a murderer. When she loves the innocent baby, she rightly receives honor, instead of a guilty conscience or seared conscience. To facilitate a woman or encourage a woman to kill her baby does the woman harm.
Get it thru ur head that your are mistreating a woman by facilitating the murder of her baby.
Thunkful2 10 months ago
@Thunkful2 Get it through your head. I was raped. I know what it feels like to be raped. I know how if feels how to wait and find out if i was pregnant or not. It isn't murder, I know how the human body developes. You haven't been in my situation so you are WRONG. Get it through your head, you won't be right ever. Go fuck yourself and burn in hell.
gothicslytherinchic 10 months ago
@gothics
It is simply illogical to say
1) A person was raped,
2) Therefore her baby may be murdered.
It is illogical to say that a person cannot know what is right or wrong treatment for a victim of a crime unless that person himself was identically victimized. I have never been beat up repeatedly by a spouse, but I know that such a victim is not justified in packing her kids in a car & driving off into a Lake to drown everyone.
Thunkful2 10 months ago
@Thunkful2
1. Why should a woman put 9 months of her life on hold to carry a rapists child?
2. Spousal abuse and rape are two diffferent subjects.
It's a womans choice. No one should force her into carrying a child that she doesn't want, let alone a child concieved in a rape. It's a punishment.
gothicslytherinchic 10 months ago
@gothics
Why should a mama murder her baby?
Why should a woman bring life-long grief on herself by murdering her baby?
Thunkful2 9 months ago
@Thunkful2 She didn't want it in the first place. I have a question, are you a troll or are you just naturally this stupid and ignorant?
gothicslytherinchic 9 months ago
@gothicslytherinchic
How does not wanting a child justify murdering it?
Thunkful2 9 months ago
@Thunkful2 *sigh* Once you are able to become pregnant then you can have some say what a woman can do to her body, until then piss off.
gothicslytherinchic 9 months ago
@gothicslytherinchic
The issue is not what a woman can do to her body, but what she can do to her baby's body. Even if I had no children, I would still be responsible to oppose child-abuse. Murder is ultimate chid-abuse. Pregnancy is no license to murder. Thou shalt not murder. No murderer has eternal life. Imagine facing your chld at the Great White Throne judment: "Mommy, why did you murder me? What did I ever do wrong to you?"
Thunkful2 9 months ago
@Thunkful2 Until you have been forced to have sex, until you have had no choice but to take it you can have a say, until you've been in that situation you can shut the fuck up because I've been through that and let me tell you that it's terrifying not knowing whether you are going to be killed or not. Being forced to carry a rape baby is a punishment and I'd rather die then go through with it.
gothicslytherinchic 9 months ago
@gothics "until you have been"
The topic is not me; the topic is baby-murder. I have never been murdered or murdered anyone; but that does not disqualify me from asserting truth related to it. Should I tell you that until you have been sliced up by a knife, don't tell me anything promoting baby-murder? There comes the knife; the baby doesn't know if it is to be killed or not; but killed it is, heartless brutality, merciless monstrous wickedness.
Thunkful2 9 months ago
@Thunkful2 It isn't murder. Go grow a vagina, get raped and then get pregnant, then you can say shit, until then your argument is invalid, go fuck yourself.
gothicslytherinchic 9 months ago
@gothics
Get it through ur head that having been raped does not give you the moral authority to decree what is right or wrong with regard to killing or loving babies. The Lord has told us "Thou shalt not kill" (murder).
How does my not having been in your situtation nullify God's Word? How wud u like ur mother to slice u up with a knife?
Thunkful2 9 months ago
@Thunkful2 Get it through your head It's my fucking body and if I'm dammed for it fuck god because I wouldn't follow a god who damns a victim to hell. Fuck you. Go get raped!
gothicslytherinchic 9 months ago
@gothicslytherinchic
Get it through your head that the subject is THE BABY & MURDERING IT. The subject is not you or me. You are hung up on ME, ME, ME, your selfish desire to do what pleases yourself. I have news for you: it is not merely YOUR body; the earth is the Lord's & the fulness thereof, the world & they who dwell therein.
Thunkful2 9 months ago
@gothics
If you go to the Lake of Fire it will be because of your sins of which you have plenty -- just as I do.
Fortunately, God commends His own love towards us in that while we were yet sinners Christ died for us. Whenever you get sick & tired of making yourself your own god and want transformation, a new birth is available.
"For whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord [Jesus = YHWH] shall be saved."
Thunkful2 9 months ago
@Thunkful2 I can't wait to go to hell.
gothicslytherinchic 9 months ago
@gothics
Can u stop arguing long enough to see your need of a transformation & eternal life? Can u muster up enough faith to pray:
"Lord Jesus; I am a sinner; I ask you to please change me, & give me eternal life; please save me now; I trust you as my Savior"
"whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved."
"Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, & you shall be saved."
Thunkful2 9 months ago
@Thunkful2 I need transformation? As a raped woman; a victim I need transormation? Firstly I'm a Satanist and I've chosen Satan to guide me on the way. A woman should have a right to choose. There is nothing wrong with it.
gothicslytherinchic 9 months ago
@gothicslytherinchic
satanist? that explains it all. but he will do you no good, only harm. When you get desperate, turn to the Son of God who has defeated satan and made provision for your eternal bliss.
For whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord [Jesus = YHWH] shall be saved.
Thunkful2 9 months ago
@Thunkful2 1. I believed in abortion before i becamse a satanist 2. fuck jesus 3. fuck you
gothicslytherinchic 9 months ago
Well bored board readers; we see that a satanist believes in killing babies. Believing in killing babies is appropriate for one who hates mankind. And adopting a plank in his platform may lead to full fledged loyalty to the Enemy. his destiny is the Lake of Fire & all his minions.
Thunkful2 9 months ago
@Thunkful2 First off I was born Jewish and i believed in abortion before that. Secondly Satanisim is living for yourself. Thirdly your a dumbfuck
gothicslytherinchic 9 months ago
@gothic
You may have been born a descendant of Jacob, but you were not born Jewish. You cannot be a true Jew unless you trust your Messiah the Lord Jesus as Savior.
"For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision which is outward in the flesh: but he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God."
Thanks for sharing ur background.
Thunkful2 9 months ago
@Thunkful2 You don't know shit about Jews. Jews DON'T accept Jesus as the Savior. Just like you are misimformed about Satanisim you are misimformed about Judisim. But keep talking, you making an idiot of yourself is amusing me.
gothicslytherinchic 9 months ago
@gothic
I was sprinkled as a child in a "church," but that did not make me a Christian. I was dunked in the water by persons who believed in immersion when I was an older child, but that also didn't make me a Christian. Trusting Christ as my savior secured a new birth & made me a Christian.
your belief in baby-killing, satanism, & living for self all go together nicely. The Tanach says to love your neighbor as yourself (Leviticus). Your baby is your neighbor.
Thunkful2 9 months ago
@Thunkful2 Not if it came from a rape, If it comes from rape it's dead. Like I said before I was for abortion before I was a satinist.
gothicslytherinchic 9 months ago
@gothicslytherinchic
How does the fact that the baby was conceived by a rapist make the baby not your neighbor? It is hard to be more neighbor than by being a baby in your womb. It takes a miracle to be delivered from innate selfishness & made a person who actually can love neighbor as self. That miracle is the new birth. You must be born again.
Thunkful2 4 months ago
@Thunkful2 I shouldn't have to give birth to a child that I was forced to concieve you dumb mother fucker.
gothicslytherinchic 4 months ago
@gothicslytherinchic so you'll happily deny a child the right to live even when adoption is an option? I mean, Sarah Palin is dumb but not everyone who believes in Pro- Life is Sarah fucking Palin!
MrRyanSams 3 months ago
@MrRyanSams SO you'd punish me more by forcing me to carry my rapists child?
gothicslytherinchic 3 months ago
@gothicslytherinchic I don't how punishment got in there? I was just talking about what I believe is right and wrong. If a woman is raped, wouldn't the worst situation be to take the life of an innocent child as well? Is it the child's fault that the woman was raped? Does it deserve to die because of it?
MrRyanSams 3 months ago
@gothicslytherinchic my wife was born from a result of a rape, i am grateful her mom kept her, i would not change my wife, for any woman that had a normal conception or all the $ on earth, my wife is a live example of a human being. today my wife can encourage others who are thinking of abortion to take care of the baby or give for adoption, never kill. also my mother in law, the raped person is one of the most amazing woman i even knew, an example of courage & love for life
funkeiromiami 1 month ago
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@gothicslytherinchic my wife was born from a result of a rape, i am grateful her mom kept her, i would not change my wife, for any woman that had a normal conception or all the $ on earth, my wife is a live example of a human being. today my wife can encourage others that are thinking of abortion to take care of the baby or give for adoption, never kill. my mother in law, the raped person is one of the most amazing woman i even knew, an example of courage & love for life
funkeiromiami 1 month ago
@Thunkful2 so a woman not only has 2 deal with being raped, but then has 2 carry round the outcome of it 4 9 months. then she may have 2 relive what she went thru over & over agains, every time she looks that child in the eye?
& wat if the child is mentally/physically disabled, the mother is broke, or the mother was possibly going to die as a result of childbirth?
it's so sad how religion can brainwash people to the point they cant even think for themselves & form their own perspective.
TheBgoz 4 months ago
@TheBgoz
In addition to reliving a rape, would you burden someone with the guilt of having murdered a baby?
Why have you let religion brainwash you so that you can't think straight? Imagine yourself enjoying something in your home, when suddenly your mother breaks down the door along side of a big brute with a machete. "Daughter, you are the result of a rape!" Go get her: Whack, slice cut, dismember! Remains go in garbage disposal. Whir, whir, chunk, chunk, whir.
Thunkful2 4 months ago
@Thunkful2 no, y wud i burden some1 with the guilt of murdering a baby? the choice is there 4 them & they can choose freely. a zygote or a foetus in its early stages isn't a baby, in the same way a seed is not a tree.
& chances r the potential child wouldn't b enjoying itself at home if they r unwanted, neglected, living in poverty, born addicted 2 drugs/disabled or subject 2 abuse.
funny how all these pro-life ppl give a shit about ppl until they r born, then couldnt care less.
TheBgoz 4 months ago
@TheBgoz
Of course people can choose to do evil. How does the fact that they can choose evil justify the choice of evil? You may choose to do evil, but you cannot altogether choose whether or not to feel guilty & experience the torment of a guilty conscience. The only escape from the guilty conscience is by trusting Christ as Savior.
Thunkful2 4 months ago
@Thunkful2 they don't see it as evil. i now realise i can't have any sort of stimulating argument with you because it seems your view is dictated for you by a (very very) ancient text.
i'm so thankful that there is a separate church & state! AMEN! :)
TheBgoz 4 months ago
@TheBgoz
I only wish our state were separate from the religion of secular humanism instead of establishing it.
Thunkful2 3 months ago
@Thunkful2 ok.
TheBgoz 3 months ago
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@gothicslytherinchic my wife was born from a result of a rape, i am grateful her mom kept her, i would not change my wife, for any woman that had a normal conception or all the $ on earth, my wife is a live example of a human being. today my wife can encourage others that are thinking of abortion to take care of the baby or give for adoption, never kill. also my mother in law, the raped person is one of the most amazing woman i even knew,an example of courage & love for life
funkeiromiami 1 month ago
@Thunkful2 when they abort it its actually a clump of cell nothing more so its not murder.are you actually that sick to think a woman or girl should be made carry something she did not want .The world really is fucked up
mir2k9 10 months ago
@mir2k9
How do u know it is a clump & not a human being? Are you actually that sick not to realize that a woman who kills her baby does not reap tragic consequences?
Thunkful2 10 months ago
@mir2k9
That is simply a lie. Babies in the womb are murdered at all stages of development, even when in process of being birthed. How would you like your parents to murder you because they didn't want you? So they knock on your door one day: "By the way, we never wanted you." Then they feed you into wood-chipping machine.
Thunkful2 4 months ago
@Thunkful2
That's called an embryo, and later on in development it is called a fetus. Not a baby or infant.
justforflag2 10 months ago
@justforflag2
You can't settle the issue by using exculpatory language, no more than you can excuse fornication by calling it "being sexually active." Don't you know that fetus is simply the Latin word for infant, baby? The unborn baby John the Baptist is referred to as a brephos = baby, infant, in his mother's womb in Luke. Pregnant women commonly call their babies babies.
Thunkful2 10 months ago
@Thunkful2
I'm sorry if I hurt your feelings, but it still isn't a baby. That's just the definition of an infant. And if you missed it, I am an atheist. You are actually calling a zygote, or as it was already pointed out, a clump of cells, a human being. It is inhumane to punish a woman this way for the rest of her life, even more inhumane than stopping a human life before it even begins.
You try to sugarcoat things by calling a POTENTIAL human being a "baby".
justforflag2 10 months ago
@justforflag2
You can't define your way out of the responsibility to love babies & not murder them. No, I never called anything a zygote. Once the baby exists, it must be cared for & loved. How it came into existence is irrelevant. Caring for a baby is not a punishment, but a privilege. Focusing on self is a self-punishment. Inhumane? When did man become the standard of good? Murder is "humane," a human behavior. Hating comes nature ot men. The baby is not a potential but a real baby.
Thunkful2 10 months ago
@Thunkful2
"Once the baby exists, it must be cared for & loved."
-
According to you, if a woman makes a mistake or is even raped, she MUST love her child... Right.
You called a "baby" something that should be called a zygote.
"Caring for a baby is not a punishment, but a privilege."
-
I wonder how that works in circumstances of rape or health risks, Thunkful2.
The fetus, embryo or zygote is a potential human. The "baby" cannot think, it cannot feel until about 12 weeks into the pregnancy.
justforflag2 10 months ago
@justforflag2
Why do you want to punish the mama by helping her commit murder? What makes you think that the Mama doesn't suffer?
How do you know that the baby cannot think?
Thunkful2 10 months ago
@justforflag2
What is your proof that babys don't have pain sensors until 12 weeks? And what leads u to suppose that if a person can't feel pain, he can then be murdered OK?
Thunkful2 10 months ago
@Thunkful2
"Why do you want to punish the mama by helping her commit murder?"
-
*facepalm*
"How do you know that the baby cannot think? What is your proof that babys don't have pain sensors until 12 weeks?"
-
Because they don't have a nervous system. Which develops in the 2nd/3rd trimester.
It's not murder because it has almost no characteristics of a human being for it to be murder. It's not a humane procedure just because it cannot feel pain, it is a humane procedure because it's not human.
justforflag2 10 months ago
@justforflag2
What is your proof that baby's don't have pain sensors until 12 weeks & don't have nervous systems until the 2nd/3rd trimester? Your saying it is no proof. Anyone can post anything.
How do you know that thought is physical instead of a characteristic of a spirit? How do u know that a baby can't think by virtue of its spirit?
How do u know that the baby has almost no characteristics of a human being?
What leads you to think that "humane" means good?
Thunkful2 10 months ago
@Thunkful2
I don't know if youtube allows me to post link, but here:
webspace.ship.edu/cgboer/genpsyfetaldev.html
It actually says that the central nervous system develops during the 25th - 28th week.
"How do you know that thought is physical instead of a characteristic of a spirit?"
-
Because there is no evidence of the existence of a spirit. At least any that I have seen. If you believe that, that's your opinion and in no way a reason to pass law.
justforflag2 10 months ago
@justforflag2
Your web site has the central nervous system starting development in the 3rd week, as indicated by its graphical chart. And how do you know that the CNS doesn't start even before that? Do you believe things just because some internet site says so?
How do you know that there is no evidence of the existence of a spirit?
How do u know that spirit is just my opinion & not a reason to pass law?
How do u know that CNS development defines existence of a human being not to be murdered?
Thunkful2 10 months ago
@Thunkful2
The CNS "starting" to develop and "being" developed are two different things, you know that, don't you?
Oh, you only ask questions. I said I have seen no evidence for a spirit. PROVIDE EVIDENCE THEN. Until then it's your opinion.
It's not murder, as others have pointed it out. I am not going to repeat myself or what others said, thank you.
justforflag2 10 months ago
"It's not murder." How do u know its not murder?
Thunkful2 10 months ago
Evidence for spirit:
Gen 7:20 "all in whose nostrils was the breath of the spirit of life, of all that was on the dry land, died."
< Gen 41: "Pharaoh awoke, and, behold, it was a dream. And it came to pass in the morning that his spirit was troubled"
< Dan 7: "my spirit was grieved in the midst of my body,"
1 Cor 7: "the woman that is unmarried and the virgin is careful for the things of the Lord, that she may be holy both in body and in spirit:"
Thunkful2 10 months ago
just evidence spirit
< James 2: "THE BODY APART FROM THE SPIRIT IS DEAD"
Thus there is strong evidence that a living human body has a spirit.
Such being the case, the state of development of the CNS is not the determinative issue.
Thunkful2 10 months ago
@just Now what is THE PROOF
that a developing human body inside the mother is not a living human being unless it has a developed CNS?
Thunkful2 10 months ago
@justforflag2
How do you know that there is no evidence of a spirit? Do you have self-awareness? From what does that come? If you have no evidence of a spirit, how does that prove that thought is physical?
Thunkful2 4 months ago
@Thunkful2
Will you stop asking questions and start answering mine!?
Your religion is irrelevant in law. Now, give me evidence that an embryo is closer to a human being than to a lump of cells.
justforflag2 4 months ago
@justforflag2
Have you changed from 1-2 now to 12? What is your proof that it cannot think until 12 weeks. Do you believe it is right to murder someone when they are not thinking? So you are asleep & not thinking; would you like a doctor to take a scalpel or a machete to you?
Thunkful2 4 months ago
@justforflag2
You are the sugarcoater, trying to call a human being a clump of cells so you can murder him. What are you yourself besides a clump of cells?
Thunkful2 4 months ago
@justforflag2
You are a potential Human Being. Right now you seem to be a dead human being, an offspring of the sinner Adam. But you are a potential true human being, a potential child of God. All it takes is a new birth. Call on the Lord Jesus to transform and save you. For whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord, shall be saved. This Lord is the risen God-the-Son, the Lord Jesus.
Thunkful2 4 months ago
@Thunkful2
On a different note, I hope you understand that delegalization of abortion actually forces women into making unhealthy choices for themselves, and increases death or trauma after an unauthorized abortion is performed. Remember the "back alley abortions".
justforflag2 10 months ago
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@justforflag2
How do you know that
1) forbidding abortion forces women into making unhealthy choices?
2) increases death? (are you counting baby deaths as deaths?)
3) increases trauma?
4) necessitates an illegal abortion?
5) necessitates abortions in alleys?
Does forbidding toddler-killing force women to lock the car doors & drive into a Lake?
Thunkful2 10 months ago
@justforflag2
"It's called" many things by different persons.
Latin Dictionary: "Found 8 results. Showing page 1 of 1
fetus, fetus, n
declension: 4, gender: M
1. brood/litter
2. children (of a parent)
3. offspring/young (animals)
Thunkful2 4 months ago
@justforflag2
The Word of God calls (not "it," but "him") a baby. Re unborn John the Baptist:
"And she cried out with a loud voice and said, “Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb! “And how has it happened to me, that the mother of my Lord would come to me? “For behold, when the sound of your greeting reached my ears, the baby leaped in my womb for joy. "
I hope u are not part of a generation which knows not the Christmas story.
Thunkful2 4 months ago
@Thunkful2
It's still an embryo, not a baby. Religion and faith have no place in discussions about abortions. Either use facts, or admit that it's just your personal opinion.
justforflag2 4 months ago
@justforflag2 Maybe YOU weren't human when you were in your mother, but I know I was.
Leave it to a Liberal to turn a Rape into a Murder and when the Mom dies, Double-Murder.
pewtoobe 4 months ago
@pewtoobe
I'll be serious with you mate, I have no idea what you are talking about.
justforflag2 4 months ago
@justforflag2
What is your proof that it is not a baby? What is your proof that religion and faith have no place in discussions?
What makes you think that you can establish morality by employing a word other than "baby"? Just admit you are giving unfounded personal opinion.
Thy word is a lamp to my feet and a light to my path.
It is not "religion," but the Lord Jesus and His Word.
What right do u have to make up your own morality?
Thunkful2 4 months ago
@Thunkful2
You can't make laws based on your own religion. That's at best arrogant, at worst, oppressive. Make laws based on what's best for society.
A "baby", as you prefer to call it, in its mother's tummy, is unthinking and unfeeling for the first 1-2 months. It has more in common with a lump of cells than with a human being.
If you say that abortion is murder, then I guess miscarriage is divine judgment?
justforflag2 4 months ago
In a democracy people can make laws on whatever they wish; you cannot cancel out votes based on why u think they voted. It seems arrogant to claim the right to analyze reasons for voting & then nullify votes on that basis.
But I advise you to stop trying to make laws based on your religion.
Those who believe in baby-murder (like you) typically do not stop at 1-2 months. Notice ur vague hypen. Is it 1 or is it 2? U don't seem to know. But u still are dogmatic.
Thunkful2 4 months ago
@justforflag2
What is your proof that babies of 2 months don't think? Wud u object if someone came after you with a knife & cut you up when you were in an unthinking mode? Suppose you are asleep & unthinking. Is it OK to pour corrosive liquid on your skin that peels it off?
Death is something we all face. It is appointed to man once to die but after that the judgment. Adam's race stands under judgment.
Thunkful2 4 months ago
@justforflag2
If you reject God's word, what do you have left ot base anything on but your personal opinion?
In those days there was no king in Israel, every man did what was good in his own eyes (end of book of Judges)
Thunkful2 4 months ago
@Thunkful2 We should punish you for being ignorant as hell.
screamolover17 11 months ago
@screamolover17
How do u know that I am ignorant?
What is ignorant about the Lake of Fire?
What makes u think that the Lake of Fire won't be filled with smart-asses?
Thunkful2 11 months ago
@gothicslytherinchic same thing happened to me. i wouldn't have thought twice about terminating it.
TheBgoz 4 months ago
@gothicslytherinchic does aborting a child unrape a woman? Can the poor baby help the fact that it's mother raped? How is it fair that the child should lose it's life?
MrRyanSams 3 months ago
@MrRyanSams How is it fair that she should be forced to give up 9 months of her life? She's victimized and you would be victimizing her even further to force her to carry a child she didn't want with a man she didn't want. You are a guy so you don't know how it is to carry a baby. You should have no say whether abortion should be legal or not in the first place.
gothicslytherinchic 3 months ago
@gothicslytherinchic oh, what a sacrifice. 9 months? You're willing take away a child's whole life for nine months? The baby does not belong to you! Sure i have no idea what carrying a child is like but I've heard it's not that bad - it certainly can't be as bad as killing a child, I mean have you even stopped to think about the child. If you kill a chid outside the womb that'd be wrong wouldn't it? You talk about carrying a child for nine months, what about taking care of a child for 18 years?
MrRyanSams 3 months ago
@MrRyanSams I'm not carrying the child of my rapists period. You asking a woman to do that makes you just as bad or possibly even worse than the rapist.
gothicslytherinchic 3 months ago
@gothicslytherinchic you evil little woman - listen to yourself! What you just said is that someone who wants to save a baby's life is worst than a rapist. You disgusting person, you make me sick.
MrRyanSams 3 months ago
@gothicslytherinchic check out the national network of abortion funds. they help raise money for low income women to obtain abortion care
leiapeison 1 month ago
my wife was born from a result of a rape, i am grateful her mom kept her, i would not change my wife, with any woman that had a normal conception or all the $ on earth, my wife is a live example of a human being. today my wife can encourage others that are thinking of abortion to take care of the baby or give for adoption, never kill. also my mother in law, the raped person is one of the most amazing woman i even knew, an example of courage & love for life ,
funkeiromiami 1 month ago
@gothicslytherinchic I'm a man and I 100% agree with your outlook. Until they are raped or victimized,they have no right to put down someone's decision for abortion. An obligation being forced upon someone is wrong.
WarlockRabbit 1 month ago
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tinishawalckbvh 1 year ago
The question is, when is it proper to murder a baby? Is the fact that the baby was created by a rape grounds to kill a baby? It wasn't the baby's fault,.
Thunkful2 1 year ago
@Thunkful2 if something cannot survive outside the womb it's not a baby. Why should a woman or girl go through the absolute horror of carrying the spawn of her rapist for 9 months...get a grip
unit023 1 year ago
@unit023
How do you know it is not a baby? It is common for pregnant women to call their baby a baby. John the Baptist is called a baby while in the womb.
Thunkful2 11 months ago
@unit023
How do u know that if a baby cannot survive outside the womb it's not a baby?
If you can't survive outside the earth's atomosphere, does that mean you are not a person?
How do u know it is absolute horror to care for a baby if the baby is the child of a rapist?
If a child is the child of a rapist, should that not make you have even more compassion for the baby?
How do u know that the mother won't suffer guilt for killing her baby?
Thunkful2 10 months ago
@Thunkful2 So what? it was the girls fault she was raped?
ChicanoLA 1 year ago
@ChicanoLA Being raped doesn't justify murdering a baby. It is a baby. John the Baptist was called a baby in his mother's womb. Ability to independently survive does not determine whether someone is a human or a person. None of us can independently survive. If they Lord cut off our oxygen, we would quickly die.
How did we get to the place where women would murder their own babies? Why shud anyone hate an innocent baby? You don't have to keep it after being born. Adoption is available.
Thunkful2 1 year ago
@Thunkful2 A raped woman being forced to carry a child that was concieved during a rape is a punishment. You mine as well be saying that it's her fault.
gothicslytherinchic 11 months ago
@ChicanoLA
Was it the baby's fault?
Thunkful2 11 months ago
@Thunkful2
was it the womans? NO.
screamolover17 11 months ago
@screamolover17
Who said it was the woman's fault?
since the Baby is not at fault, how can you murder the baby? How can you take a knife & cut the baby up into pieces? If you were the product of a rape, should you be sliced up & put down a garbage disposal?
Thunkful2 11 months ago
@ChicanoLA
What is the baby's fault that he should be murdered?
Thunkful2 11 months ago
@Thunkful2 I have been raped twice in my sort lifetime. The first time I was 12, the second time I was 14. And I more then likely would have had an abortion, though I am very against it in other situations. No, it wasn't the FETUS' fault, but it was not the womens' fault either. If you have ever been raped you would understand. Though, I sure hope it never happens to you, or anyone for that matter. No women she ever be expected to carry her rapists child.
sillygabbyx 11 months ago
@sillygabbyx
Well, my heart goes out to you. I can't say I ever suffered anything as bad as a rape.
However, a baby should never be murdered. A child should not be executed for the sin of its father.
Thunkful2 11 months ago
@Thunkful2 I can understand where you are coming from, but if I was the product of rape, I would have rather of been aborted then know I was only alive because my bio dad raped my bio mom.
sillygabbyx 11 months ago
@sillygabbyx
So you say that if you were today informed that you were the product of a rape (the guy u thot was ur father was really not), you would happily volunteer for death by scapel?
Then suppose u are the baby: Which death would you gladly accept? 1) a knife cutting you apart piece by piece, 2) a power vaccum sucking you & pulling your body apart, 3) a corrosive fluid injected into the amniotic fluid, which wud make your skin all come off & cause you die in excruciating pain???
Thunkful2 11 months ago
@Thunkful2 You cannot compare the murder of a person to a fetus inside of a womb. Like I have said I only agree with abortion if the mother is raped and conceives or if she could die from the pregnancy. As much a I disagree with abortion besides those exception it is still a fetus until it is born. It would be beyond cruel and unusual punishment to except a women who was raped to have to carry her rapists' child and have to be reminded of the horror she went through every day.
sillygabbyx 11 months ago
@Thunkful2 It doesn't matter what you say, my opinion will not change.
sillygabbyx 11 months ago
@sillygabbyx
How do you know that no woman can be expected to care for her child on the grounds that she was impregnated by a rapist?
Thunkful2 11 months ago
I absolutely hate this woman....
willowmarian 1 year ago
im from Australia and stumbled upon this by accident, i am shocked and disturbed by what she just said and im sorry if anyone takes this the wrong way but... is DEMENTED my god she does she have any idea the mental state in which the girl would be in NO she is not a doctor, last i checked she wasnt.
O.K off topic question but my friend is from wasilla, Alaska and when i asked what Wasilla was like she said its like walking into a meth lab, can someone explain?
jayneemma101 1 year ago
No. Fuck Sarah Palin...
JordanaBanana16 1 year ago
someone please take that milf for a casting session she's only good bareback
ADOPTmeBITCH 1 year ago
Why did they clip the ever lovin h*ll out of this video. I'd kinda like to see her full response, un-edited!
dennilane 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Why did they clip the ever lovin h*ll out of this video. I'd kinda like to see her full response, un-edited!
dennilane 1 year ago
Why did they clip the ever lovin h*ll out of this video. I'd kinda like to see her full response, un-edited!
dennilane 1 year ago
abortion is murder
MrRedsetter 1 year ago
Church called u forgot yr penis AGAIN
ADOPTmeBITCH 1 year ago
abortion is murder... in all cases. If you look at an ultrasound it is a human
MrRedsetter 1 year ago