Also, this was not an act of God. It was an act of nature. Note Luke 13:4 and the Tower of Siloam. To attribute acts of nature to God's divine intervention (though actually quite funny) is really just superstition. Not that God can't act in those ways but if we, as Christians, are reading lines in the rock as though the Word of God then we are no better than the pagans and are putting ourselves back under the law of sin just like the ELCA.
This is the ELCA. It would be wrong to say that Lutheranism endorses homosexual and femal pastors. Actuall Lutheranism does no such thing. Note the LCMS (of which I am a member). Just a little fyi because Lutheranism hold to sound Biblical doctrine and I wouldn't want anyone thinking otherwise. God bless.
The next time there will be no building standing ... Jer. 23:19>Behold, a whirlwind of the LORD is gone forth in fury, even a “grievous” (category 4) whirlwind: it shall fall grievously upon the head of the wicked. 20>The anger of the LORD shall not return, until he have executed, and till he have performed the thoughts of his heart: in the latter days ye shall consider it perfectly.
@dreamclutch The "next time" has long come and gone. My church, ECUSA, proudly ordains gay clergy and many priests bless same sex unions. But the weather here is delightfully temperate and sunny. Meanwhile, in Rick Perry land the plains are burning. Does that mean that God is mad at the Tea Party?
Natural disasters are God's way of allowing Satan to have his way with a people who have made a decision to have them as his leader. Repent and Change! God never created a man to be with a man and neither a woman with a woman. There will be more natural disasters as men continue to decide to look to Satan for their leadership.
I figure that being pridefully sinful is a risk intelligent Christians should be unwilling to take. Maybe you won't go to Hell for having gay sex, being a theif, harming a child, committing adultery, enjoying bestiality or being a murderer. It may be true that God's grace saves even prideful sinners, but I'm not willing to take the risk.
@ebonics4everyone The prideful sinner here is you. You self-righteously condemn others when the one you should pronounce judgement on is yourself. Don't be so sure you will squeak into the Pearly Gates.
@Tzedaqyal Yes, unfortunately both it and the ignorance that spawned are still alive and well, unfortunately. On the plus side, it is waning. More and more young Christians are realizing they've been lied to by their elders who created the Religious Right.
Wow, to think I've always believed that doctors and nurses are doing a noble work. Someone should tell those rotten sinners that every time they heal a sick person they're spitting in God's face.
I certainly hope that if you have kids you haven't let them get vaccinations or given them sinful things like antibiotics or cold medicine. I guess i should stop supporting evil institutions like St. Jude's Hospital for Children. Thanks, Cindy!
Of course, if you still insist on saying that the verse in Leviticus is valid, then I must ask: have you obeyed it? Have you put gay people to death, as it commands? If not, then why do you defy God's word?
@docslarn Leviticus was only for the ancient Hebrews under the Mosaic Covenant. We do not use Leviticus to argue against homosexuality. The New Testament is crystal clear. Look at 1 Corinthians 6:9 and Romans chapter 1. It is against the creation order and everyone knows it is wrong even without the Bible. If this behavior was universally adopted then the human race would cease to exist in 1 generation. Its obviously wrong.
@LogosApologia 1. Since I was replying to the person who did use Leviticus, obviously some do use it. 2. The verse does not refer to monogamous homosexuals, but only promiscuous ones.
You know that not all verses are not to be interpreted literally; else we would all be walking around one-eyed and one-handed; 3. There are all sorts of behavior that, if universally adopted, would lead to the end of humanity, such as staying single. That doesn't make them wrong.
@docslarn 2. The verse refers to any homosexuality. Rom 1 describes the acts them self as "contrary to nature" ...you skipped the main argument. It is against the creation order. It is obvious that men and women are desinged to work together. God's first commandment was to be fruitful and multiply. Sexuality has a purpose more than selfish personal pleasure. Homosexuality is a perversion of God's design.
Re: "contrary to nature," no, it's not. Homosexuality is an inborn tendency that people, as well as members of lower species, are born with. For them it's perfectly "natural." The verse refers to the debauched orgies the Romans engaged in, not an expression of love between two persons. In fact, a loving act between two persons is a perfectly natural behavior for creations of a God who is Himself love.
So you're admitting that your argument that "If this behavior was universally adopted then the human race would cease to exist in 1 generation. Its obviously wrong" holds no water?
I can't help but laugh when I see Christians using verses from Leviticus to say homosexuality is forbidden, but somehow overlook the dietary restrictions, clothing requirements, etc. listed in the same book!
You can't squirm out of what the Bible teaches Sodom's sin was: lack of social justice. it even specifically says that God was upset about the unequal distribution of wealth. Some were overfed while others were hungry.
@docslarn It seems that you don't like the truth, Most people don't because it doesn't fit into their lifestyle. It certainly didn't fit into mine at first. I didn't like the idea that I had to give up things that I liked. What are these things if you don't have God's approval and they are just temporary for the world. One has to be willing to give back what was given and Jesus paid it all. Sin is sin no matter how you count it. Its not just homosexuality, it's sexuality.
Respond to this video... sexuality was meant to be between man and woman to fill the earth and nothing can be more contrary to it's purpose than to be opposite what was intended. God will save those who repent but I don't think he will forgive those that repent and continue to sin. It is sort of like slapping Jesus in the face when we know we're not supposed to sin and yet we do it anyway. We can justify or make excuses for them but in the end it is still sin and sin is death. God bless
@docslarn sexuality was meant to be between man and woman to fill the earth and nothing can be more contrary to it's purpose than to be opposite what was intended. God will save those who repent but I don't think he will forgive those that repent and continue to sin. It is sort of like slapping Jesus in the face when we know we're not supposed to sin and yet we do it anyway. We can justify or make excuses for them but in the end it is still sin and sin is death. it doesnt matter what sin it is.
@cindyoung13 "sexuality was meant to be between man and woman to fill the earth." If that's true then it is sinful for men or women who cannot reproduce to ever have sex. Also, a logical corollary of your claim is that all forms of birth control are sinful.
Sex is for more than having babies. It's meant for intimacy and pleasure among all monogamous couples. Your efforts to deny that to God's gay and lesbian children is what truly slaps Jesus in the face.
@321freethinker Your absolutely right about contraception being a sin. All medication is sinful not to mention something that keeps you from doing the will of God. Think about it, Man likes to pervert everything because Satan says it's ok. If we are truly Gods children, then we can abstain from what we think is pleasurable here on the earth because we are not from here and should not participate in the worldly things. We are only to obey God.
Please don't think all Christians are this stupid; they're not. for an intelligent, thoughtful alternative to this sort of nonsense, I invite you to check out
News flash, fundies: the Bible names Sodom's sin as lack of social justice, NOT homosexuality:
"'Now this was the sin of your sister Sodom: She and her daughters were arrogant, overfed and unconcerned; they did not help the poor and needy.-Ezekiel. 16:19
This is the real reason the church has become a joke. So-called Christians are anxious to distort God into a caricature of themselves:: hateful, intolerant, and irrational. It's not liberalism that's your enemy, it's your own vicious natures.
@docslarn you mean 16:49 right? You're right it does say that. But read the next verse "And they were haughty, and committed abomination before me: therefore I took them away as I saw good." Ezekiel 16:50. And God calls homosexuality an abomination "Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is an abomination." Leviticus 18:23 "If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death;..." Leviticus 20:13
Wow, God sure is a wimp. The Lutherans defy his will and all he can do is cause a little property damage? He's also inconsistent. My church actually elected a gay bishop, yet the Almighty didn't have the cajones to even send a shower! What a p*ssy!
Joplin is nearby the gambling dens of Oklahoma and the sin city known as Branson, Missouri. Branson is filled w/ faggots like Yoshi and Yackoff Smirtnoff.
I actually heard a homosexual say that God is gay, because he procreated w/ himself and the world was His defecation. It's satanic blasphemies like this and so called "churches" that sanction gay nuptuals that cause God to smite places like Joplin, Missouri, w/ deadly bullfrogs, locusts, hail and heavenly twisters that suck up Homo Depot and other ungodly places.
@ebonics4everyone Wow, the nuts are really coming out of the woodwork now. I had no idea that Joplin MO had been assailed by bull frogs, locusts and hail. I guess God doesn't care for tacky tourist towns and bad karaoke.
To view a terrific refutation of the bigoted, moronic nonsense in this video, take a look at the YouTube video "Lutherans, Tornadoes, and Gays! Oh my!" by ProfMTH.
Hey, EternalLucifer! We don't care what the bible says! We don't care what your god says! Obviously deep down you don't either! Only those with doubt need to preach their dogma to people that don't want to hear it. You are GAY. Come out!
@KnowJesusKnowPeace I was thinking the same thing when I saw that inverted cross. Isn't it amazing how God makes Himself seen by everyone who is willing to look and listen!!
This is right up there with Pat Robertson blaming the Haitians making a pact with the devil for the hurricane that struck Haiti, or Jerry Falwell's blaming pagans, abortionists, feminists, gays, lesbians and anyone pursuing an alternative lifestyle of which he disapproved for the attack on America on 9-11.
This, of course, ignores the facts that hurricanes happen in the Caribbean, nowhere in America is immune to tornadoes, and Al-Qaeda attacked the World Trade Centre. It is, also, nauseous.
God did say like he put via Jesus that that thing he hates is the deeds of the Nicolatains read it in the first few chapters in the book of Revelation.
Also he was sore displeased with the money changers in the temple and dove traders.
If I were one of the ELCA members who were in favor of this, I could turn it around on you and say that since Joplin, Missouri, Oklahoma City, Oklahoma, Tuscaloosa, Alabama, and other cities recently hit by tornados didn't endorse homosexuality they were being punished, but that would about as theologically specious as your argument.
Frankly, two wrongs do not make a right. It is wrong for the Lutheran church to have gay clergy, but it is also wrong to say that this tornado was God's wrath for their vote.
To my knowledge, Joplin, Missouri, Oklahoma City, Oklahoma, Tuscaloosa, Alabama, and other cities recently hit by tornados have not endorsed homosexuality. However San Francisco, the modern equivalent of Sodom, according to dispensationalists like yourself has not been hit by any natural disaster lately.
To the creator of this video: Nice use of dispensationalism to make your point.. (sarcasm)
Frankly, while I do disagree with the decision of the Lutherans to allow gay clergy, I do also disagree with your message. Coming from the perspective of a former Christian social conservative turned Christian social libertarian, I believe you are more apt to win souls with honey than you are with vinegar.
1) You must be a latent homosexual; its been proven that the only people that try to stop others from being gay are gay. 2) Most of the people who have HIV are black mothers, you uneducated hate-monger. 3) Homosexuality is NOT a perversion but perfectly natural, found in approximately 10% of all mammals.
4) You are taking the Romans passage out of context. Paul makes a list of supposed sinners, which you quote, but its a set up, for he turns around and calls his readers HYPOCRITES. THAT'S YOU!
im gay and really good at calling out who is gay and isnt. those people who are anti gay, about 99.2% of them are more gay then an asian dude singing the golden girls theme song in a bathtub. in Alabama.
wow i thought the middle ages finished like 500 years ago... i can't believe that someone really thinks that "god" sends disasters for punishing gays. uh no wait not for punishing but for making people understand that they are wrong which is even more unlogical and hypocritical.you know then sun revolves around the earth... let's burn some gays, maybe tornadoes will stop!
you think your god would talk to you then? what would he say to you? be honest. he wouldnt say shit but for attention or material things you would make some shit up just for selfworth.remember you are the sheep who do you fukin think is the wolf. and i think theres more gay sheep than wolfs haha that last part was my joke put that in your bible.and dont bring your bitch ass to the northside beahch.
bible, The old testament the new testament king james version Do you know why? think ... someone in power decided to write a version that better suits thier needs or wants. that is the total answer to religion. think about it.if you werre the first person on earth and there was no religion and after you lived 20 years what would you believe?
@smurfboywv God hates sin but loves the sinner. Homosexuality is a sin -it's not the only sin, but none the less, it's disapproved of by God. But God & His true followers would or should love you- just not your sin of homosexuality. If you want to go to Heaven, repent ( turn from it) , ask Jesus forgiveness & let Him really be your Lord!
The message on this video is completely right. God does send natural disasters as a judgment against sin. How could they be so blind? I grew up in the Missouri-Synod Lutheran Church, which is much more conservative than the Evangelical branch. Hopefully they will never decide to approve of homosexuality. Although God loves homosexuals, they are not living according to His plan . But they can be forgiven if they acknowledge their sin & ask Jesus to save them!
@smurfboywv Yes God does hate sin. Why do you think He destroyed the city of Sodom & Gomorrah in the Old Testament. It was for the sin of homosexuality. Don't be blinded by your sin. It's not worth spending eternity in Hell. God will forgive you. But if you don't repent & accept Jesusyou will spend eternity paying for your own sin in Hell.
@smurfboywv Being a homosexual is denying God & His righteousness by your lifestyle."No you not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the Kingdom of God." 1 Corinthians 6: 9& 10
@smurfboywv If God destroyed all those who aren't "worthy of being saved" then all of us are in trouble. "It is by grace you are saved through faith."
@Eternallightbearer Wrong; according to Ezekiel 16:49 it was for their lack of concern about the poor. Funny how ignorant "Bible believing Christians" are of what the book actually says.
@docslarn Romans 1:25 & 27 " Instead of believing what they knew was the truth about God, they deliberately chose to believe lies... men instead of having normal sexual relationships with women, burned with lust for each other.Men did shameful things with other men and, as a result, suffered within themselves the penalty they so richly deserved."
That's plain idiotic. And it shows everyone what true believers are like deep down. You don't even know your own history; you truly are just a sheep being blindly led down a path of hypocrisy. You don't even know how to read the bible, because you are so tied to the mistranslated english versions. Did you know the FIRST COUPLES to be married by the Xtian church were gay couples?! LOOK IT UP YOU IDIOT!!!
@Soressi1 Regardless of the translation of the true Bible- Homosexuality is a perversion of God's original design for men & women! When people live that way without feeling guilty, it's because God has given them over to reprobate minds! ( see Romans 1). But God's judgment is coming upon those who are gay- either in this life ( through HIV & natural disasters) or in life eternal by being tormented 4ever in Hell. Christians don't hate gay people -just their disgusting sin of homosexuality.Repent
@swordmaster800 Love isn't a sin -its how you're expressing it that makes it sinful ( assuming your gay).It's against nature & how God created us to be." ...And in the same way also men abandoned the natural function of their women &burned in their desire toward one another, men with men committing indecent acts & receiving in their own persons the due penalty of their error." Romans 1:27 Repent & turn to Jesus! He loves you & will forgive you. God has a better plan 4 your life!
@Eternallightbearer According to the bible (and you), people would deliberately choose to be attracted to their own gender, knowing that it will lead to prejudice, ridicule, hate, sometimes even violence. 1) Why would people want that? and 2) I would love to know how people can choose their own gender when they fall in love.
@swordmaster800 Men & women will have differences they need to work out, & with God on their side, those differences can be worked out peaceably. It's far better than burning in Hell for all Eternity because you chose to live a homosexual life-style on Earth. If you ask Jesus to come into your heart, you will know longer be attracted to your own sex. Jesus can set you free from that bondage!
@Eternallightbearer Homosexuality isn't a choice. If it is, then I want you to imagine kissing someone of the same gender as you. Could you do it? Why or why not?
@swordmaster800 You may not feel as though you had a choice right now, because you're in bondage to the sin of homosexuality. But if you invite Jesus to come into your heart, He will set you free from it. You weren't born that way. It's a stronghold of sin in your life. Other people have other strong holds- such as a bad temper, or over eating- maybe even lieing or stealing. But what ever it is- Jesus is the answer. He can set you free from it!
@Eternallightbearer Do you seriously believe that having an affection towards another human being is in the same league as being bad-tempered, stealing or lying? If you do, then get a clue. Gays DO NOT damage society in any way, shape or form. Even the Bible can't explain why it's wrong.
@swordmaster800 Even though you're not breaking society's rules by being gay, you're breaking God's. It's contrary to the way God made you to be. If you love your sin more than God, & don't repent of it, you will go to hell.In Hell, there are homosexuals paying for their sins by being crucified on crosses for all eternity ( see Mary Baxter's "Journey through Hell" tapes via my channel). Don't take a chance. A little pleasure now is not worth the price of your eternal soul!
@Eternallightbearer In my book, love has no boundaries but you obviously think that there is. So, I'm just going to say this: I'm going to keep my bride and take my chances because there is no greater feeling to be in love and not even the Devil himself will take that away from me.
@swordmaster800 It may feel o'kay now, but it won't feel good after this life. And don't think you'll just feel nothing after you die. There will be constant pain in Hell. Those who led you t believe it was o'kay to live a homosexual lifestyle will be tormented all the more.
@Eternallightbearer Your views are so discriminative. If you believe god created men and women to be together, then why do homosexuals even exist?? Why would God create individuals that would not follow His plan on men & women couples? Also, why condemn an individual who is as much as a creation of God as yourself. Do you not believe we are all equal? Sexuality isn't a choice so why judge someone for something they have no control over?
@swordmaster800 Homosexuals exist because sin exists. Since we are born with a sinful nature, we have a bent towards sinful choices. Homosexuality is a sinful choice ( see Romans 118-28). People have a reason for making their sinful choices, but they are still wrong & there will eventually be consequences. God loves the sinner, but hates the sin- & that goes for other sins as well!Saying sexuality isn't a choice is a lie from the pits of Hell ( & the devil). Don't listen to it! Repent!!!!
@Eternallightbearer You keep saying that being gay is bad but your not saying why? Considering that you strongly believe in your religion, I do believe your common sense is being blinded. If I were to remove any scripture you could make and if you truly believe homosexuality to be wrong, TELL ME WHY! Do not just make nonsensical remarks
@swordmaster800 Homosexuality is not the way God made us to be.But even though this is true, you still won't listen. Whether this country approves of it & allows gay marriages , it's wrong . God does not approve! Those who don't repent of their sins ( homosexuality included) will face God's judgment!
@Eternallightbearer Only the 10 commenments are the Word of God. The rest are guidelines invented by mortal human beings. If He truly had a problem with it, he would have said so.
@swordmaster800 God speaks throughout the Bible through his Servants! 2 Timothy 3:16 says, " All Scripture is inspired by God & profitable for teaching,for correction, & for training in righteousness, so that the man of God may be adequate, & equipped for every good work. You want your sin more than God, & that's why you refuse to listen to parts of the Bible that speak against homosexuality!
@Eternallightbearer You say it's a sin yet you can't even explain what's wrong with it. Until you do, I'm going to continue to side with science's version of homosexuality. You know, the side that actually explains why it's not a choice instead of just saying it's not.
@swordmaster800 Homosexuality is a sin because it's a perversion of God's plan. God wants men & women to get together to have children & take care of their families. If He had wanted same sexes to get together , why are they unable to have children in the natural way?
@Eternallightbearer Considering that you just said that God has a plan, I must go back and ask: Why would God create individuals that would not follow His plan on men & women couples? Also, why would an all-loving God only have love for straight couples?
@swordmaster800 It all boils down to the the fact of free will. God wanted people who would willing choose to love & serve Him, not do so because they had to.
@Eternallightbearer When someone has free will, they're choices and thoughts are completely their own and is not influenced by physical or divine forces. I mean, is it really free will if someone were told how to act and think since an early age and you were to continue through that path?
@swordmaster800 It is free will if a person of their own volition chooses to go on the same path they were taught as a child is the right one. They would be wisely choosing to go on it themselves, since they could discern it was the right way to go!
@Eternallightbearer I disagree with that because if a person chooses the path they were taught to go as a kid, then when the kid is an adult, the path have already been set for them without any real life experience.
@swordmaster800 If you were brought up in the church, & now you're a homosexual to prove you can be independent, then you have been deceived! God has a good plan for your life ( Jeremiah 29:11) where you can find the unique gifts He's given you & use them in a fulfilling way that will glorify God.You will still feel independent going God's way- even if you were brought up by Christian parents who took you to church & Sunday School.. But 1st- ask Jesus to forgive you & save you!
@Eternallightbearer I consider myself an agnostic but if I had a choice of religion, I'd probably gravitate towards Buddhism because it involves finding peace within oneself, and I think that is a very positive thing.
@Eternallightbearer Why not starting indoctrinating people when they can discern between what is possible and what is not, what is fiction and what is not. ? It is the same reason why children are circumcised and not adults. because most adults would n`t fall for this nonsense.
@Eternallightbearer One more thing, why would a benevolent God create people with the complete knwoledge that he is creating people who are doomed for hell? There is absolutely no sense in this!
@swordmaster800 God created people even though He knew that sadly, there would be those who go to hell, because He also knew there would be those who would want a relationship with Him, & end up going to Heaven. It was worth creating humans for the sake of those who would end up getting saved!!!
@Eternallightbearer I do think that your God, in some ways, has a satanic personality to create homosexuals only to send them to hell because they're gay. Isn't Jesus and therefore Christianity meant to promote peace and understanding?
@Eternallightbearer Your comments are delusional. Read ALL of Romans - that passage is a set up to call those who think that HYPOCRITES. You must be a latent homosexual yourself; it has been proven that only those who have repressed their own gayness try to stop others from being gay. FYI, HIV attacks mostly black women. Oh, and do you know how to say Light Bearer in biblical greek? LUCIFER! Luci= light, Fer= bearer. What uneducated LUNACY!
@Soressi1 Homosexuals are going to Hell. God loves you, but hates your sin. Repent before it's too late . Call on Jesus name! He will deliver you & sanctify you. Don't be stubborn. The government says it'sok to be gay- God doe not!!!!!!!!!
@smurfboywv Read Revelation chapter 6 & onward in the Bible. You will see that God's judgments also come in the form of cataclysmic natural events. It would be wise to repent of sin & turn to Jesus now while you still have the opportunity!
@Eternallightbearer What part of "God created man in his image" don't you get? Hitler killed the Jews, and now christians want to kill the gays and take away their rights. This is a test of God's people to see if they really love God, and the Catholics have failed miserably. Jesus will save all gay men and women who call upon his name.
@smurfboywv God loves us, but hates our sins. And yes, He tells us in His word that homosexuality is a sin. Those who live that kind of life-style will not inherit the Kingdom ( 1 Corinthians 6:9). God has a better way for you to live! Repent & turn to Jesus. Don't go on playing the victim.God loves you too much to let you stay in your present condition.He has a much better plan for your life!!!
@Eternallightbearer Tell me where you see homosexuals go to hell please. 1 Corinthians 6:9-10 9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, 10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
@smurfboywv In the New american Standard version, it substitutes the word "homosexual" for abusers of themselves with mankind. Why do you think God destroyed Sodom & Gommorah in Genesis 19? Because He was pleased with their lifestyle? I don't think so! Also, look at Romans1 :27 & 28. When people refuse to listen to God, He goves them over to a reprobate mind.That means their consciences become seared & they can't tell right from wrong. Repent before it's too late for you!
@Eternallightbe Did God also plan for my parents to divorce and put me in welfare's care when I was 5 and to be moved from one home to another, to be beaten, abuse, neglected, and to be put in mental hospitals for trying to commit suicide? Did God ever once mention in the Bible that if 2 men or 2 women loved each other and upheld the commandments, and to love your lord with your heart and soul, and to love your neighbors and your enemy, does he say if gays follow the rules they still go to hell?
@smurfboywv I'm very sorry for what happened to you when you were growing up! I see why you're weary of marriages, & perhaps afraid you may end up divorcing- hurting yourself & your children ( as you were hurt when your parents divorced).Foster care is not a good system, but it's the only one "the world" has. People have free will, which causes them to sometimes do right things & other times they choose the wrong.None of us are good enough to enter Heaven by our own good deeds.
@smurfboywv Ask Jesus to be your personal Savior. Only by trusting in Jesus & believing He's God's Son who died for your sins, can you be forgiven. He will heal you're hurting heart, & help you forgive those who have done you wrong, so you can live a victorious life here & now. And you will also be assured of a home in Heaven in hereafter!
@moloko5 In the case that someone is making a terrible mistake, the most loving to do is to get their attention so that they may turn from their error. The situation here was to get the attention of a church leadership, it was not directed at a person. Also note that no one was injured. There's a difference between hating what someone does and hating the person. Jesus came to save sinners.
@LogosApologia You want to use one verse and only one verse from the old testament. Lets look at it. Exodus 21:7 says we can sell our daughters into slavery, what is a good price for her? Lev. 15:19-24 You are not allowed to have sex with your wife during her uncleanliness menstrual cycle. Lev. 25:44 states that I may possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighbouring nations. Exodus 35:2 clearly states working on the sabbath can get you stoned to death. :-)
@LogosApologia Lev. 11:10 eating shellfish is an abomination, Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. Most of my friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is forbidden by Lev.19:27, How should they die? Lev. 19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field is an abomination. 'Keep my decrees. "'Do not mate different kinds of animals. 'Do not wear clothing woven of two kinds of material.
@smurfboywv Levitcus only applied to ancient Hebrews, the NT condemns homosexuality very clearly in 1 Cor. 6:9 And Romans chapter 1. It's a violation of the created order - an unfortunate disorder of sinful man.
@LogosApologia Leviticus only applies to ancient Hebrews? Then why do people use it to condemn gays today, and why not also use those other verses I posted? Lets look at 1 Cor 9: 9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, 10Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God. Nothing gay.
@LogosApol Romans 7 To all that be in Rome, beloved of God, called to be saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ. Christ is speaking to the people of rome in this chapter. 23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things. 24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves
@smurfboywv Leviticus only applied to the ancient Hebrews. But the New Testament is crystal clear: " Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality," (1 Cor 6:9)
@dowejustexist Agreed. My father-in-law beat his children every day of their lives. He beat his wife daily as well. As his kids aged, he stalked them, trashed their vehicles and made threatening phone calls.Yet, he was buried with military honors and with honor by those same children he so horrifically abused. My father-in-law was a strict and devout Catholic to the core. He was honored in a Catholic church and buried in a Catholic cemetery. How can such wicked acts by a man go unpunished?
@cocopelli34 God knows our hearts. he records our actions, thoughts and words. A true follower of Jesus Christ lives He did. Every knee will bow, yours, mine, our families, the President, Prime Minister, Bank President, Janitor...
@cocopelli34 They won't go ultimately unpunished. The Word teaches us that God looks on the inside while man looks on the outside. God knows the hidden things of that man's heart and he will be judged according to God's knowledge of him through Christ.
Interesting how religious people are all agog over saving babies but are more than willing to damn homosexuals to hell. I guess life isn't life after all, is it?
the world need to hear the truth. people can try to justify these events as coincidents but, its not. the lord will let His children know when they are doing something like a loving father He is, He will do something to let us know that it is nothing but God
I am very upset about this ruling. I was all set to rejoin my families old Lutheran church and have been attending several hourly classes previous to my joining the church. Now the pastor has told me that our church is in the ELCA and updated me on the newly adopted rules and methods. Should I go and find a Missouri Synod Lutheran Church? This upsets me as I had hoped to rejoin the church I attended with my parents as a child. What the heck!
@tinyflyonthewall I'm sorry to hear that. I would suggest finding a church that believes the Bible and preaches the Gospel, denomination is not as important as sound doctrine.
ITS SO LUDACRIS THAT PEOPLE ACTUALLY THINK THAT OUR PERFECT GOD ALMIGHTY HAS THE HUMAN FRAILTY OF PETINESS AND VENGEFUL ANGER TO SEND A WRATH OF TORNADOS TO CONDEM PEOPLE. GOD ISNT HUMAN PEOPLE. WAKE UP. STOP THINKING LIKE THE NEANDERTHALS WITHOUT COMPLEX MINDS. NATURE HAPPENS.
Allowing Catholic priest to marry and a church abandoning bibical Christianity to mainstream teaching gay as correct and right are two different and unrelated matters.
@speakoutbrad The relationship is obvious: both matters hinge upon whether you think imposed celibacy can work. Dr. Luther taught that human beings were not designed for celibate life: "It is not good for man to be alone." He saw some ugly consequences of not allowing priests or monks to marry. Not allowing gays to marry undoubtedly has some similar ugly consequences. Luther would undoubtedly see the same common sense solution: Let them marry.
@speakoutbrad If by "slanted to one side" you mean inspired by Dr. Luther's own practical insights, then yes, my view is slanted. If by "main stream" you mean you ignore what Luther himself taught, then why call yourself Lutheran or comment on Lutheran matters?
boriato can stay in his ELCA church for the next 15 years. Then they will have no money and be forced to fold. As for me, we left the ELCA. Proudly. Not because of homosexuality, but because they changed the bible to fit there needs. LCMC.
@blhfan11 Actually I'll be surprised if either ELCA or LCMC will last another 15 years. The ELCA is in a tailspin for reasons that go way beyond any one social issue, and LCMC exists only as a rebellion against the ELCA; it's against something & for nothing, so no one with an ounce of sense would join it. If either one does last 15 years, what it will look like remains to be seen (probably not pretty). Missouri Synod has its problems too, but try there if you want a more conservative church.
The other aspect of this video that needs clarification is: when there's a tornado, or any other destructive natural phenomenon, is it really a sign of God's anger, which we can interpret? If you accept that there are plenty of sinners around, and that you & I are among them, then sure every victim will deserve God's anger in some sense. But in this case, why were nude dance bars & purveyors of porn a few blocks away unaffected by the tornado? Were these institutions more blessed by God???
@boriato Boriato, this church will now teach millions of children perversion is normal. The nude bars are frequented by Adults who made a choice to go there. The Children have no choice. They are being set up to be victims to gay sexual predators. I can hear it know, it's okay, the church says it's okay, it will feel good, I won't tell anyone! This will bring carnege to young lives. The Tornado, Christ is natures God, To those with faith no explaination is needed. You lack in faith man.
@speakoutbrad If you want gay sexual predators, try forcing gays to be celibate. Martin Luther himself was the Augustinian monk who dared to go public about the "horrible acts" committed by priests & monks the church forced into celibacy against their nature. Luther's solution: LET THEM MARRY! The only sad thing is that it is taking his own church centuries to learn that lesson.
@boriato I never said gays be should celebate. Gays are a small minority in america. And what they're doing endangers them. Most of the Gay friends I had in the past would never endorse this intrusion into straight society and it's values, most of which they shared. They lived quietly enjoying their life and allowing others to do the same. If they went to church they're faith and worship was between them and God. None of these men would have ever thought to undermine our shared values.
@speakoutbrad Then why the fuss over recognizing gay marriage? Why label it as perverted? We should agree that it is a step in a good direction, and does not undermine shared values. Indeed, it seems to promote family values and responsible sexual behavior. There's no perfect solution, since we live in a messy world. But it's an improvement. I think Martin Luther would recognize this.
@speakoutbrad BTW, the "straight" sex industry IS teaching children that perversion is normal. When your child asks: "If nude bars & pornography are so bad, why do we allow them, and why can I find them so easily?" how will you answer???
Why are conservatives (& some liberals too) so silent about the sex industry, which does corrupt many, though they mouth off about same sex marriage, which doesn't undermine anyone's values?
@speakoutbrad You don't think that as long as we tolerate the sex industry, kids won't be messed up by it??? They have more direct access than you think, to both internet and printed porn. They also know that our society thinks it's okay. How is that not teaching perversion to our youth??? Also, even if we restrict the issue to adults, is porn less harmful to adults OR children than committed same-sex relationships that harm no one???
@speakoutbrad So stripper bars and pornshops do have God's blessing, because somehow turning 18 or 21 makes these perversions okay in God's eyes??? That seems to be what you're suggesting here. Is that a conservative Lutheran view???
The answer to the truth of the bible's and God's existence lies in the answering of one simple question,'DOES THE RAIN HAVE A FATHER?"
WE NEED TO BE HYDRATED its as simple as that and according to the bible this is not just a natural phenomenon nor did climate change end with Noah hence the words from Job---- the bibles meteorologist!!!...
"He brings the clouds to punish men or to water his earth and show his love.” {Job 37:5-13} more interesting though is the connection to crop circles. WOW!!!
To Rustyzipper's Reply: I don't even know why I bother....But here it goes... I can't believe you actually CITED examples where the bible exhibits a vengeful God. You are NO DIFFERENT than the extremist foreigners America hates so much. You take a BOOOK. A man-made book (a GREAT book, but a book nonetheless) and you take it LITERALLY because you lack the moral perspective necessary to read it...digest it...and come up with your OWN truths. You are SCARY dude!!!!!
@ArraTonks The argument is futile. a man convinced against his will is of he same opinion still. It is unatural for a man not to have a woman. Men are visual creatures and very different from woman who are emotional. Men restrained long enough or without an outlet for sex will evantually jump anything that moves. What depends on their values. Did I write that. Well soap my fingers.
Consider what Luther wrote about forced celibacy back in the 16th century - that it was a terrible thing. Is it any less bad now? Then why would Lutherans (or anyone) force gays to be celibate???? And if you could force gays to be celibate, why not go back to clerical celibacy for heteros as well? IT DOESN'T WORK! At least, the ELCA recognizes this - it's a small step toward sanity, though they have a long way to go, and will never make it.
That's right, God loves everyone but hates sins. I do believe this was a signal. A pretty improbable tornado just when they're approving the homosexuality, with a 66,6% of the votes, and what happened to the cross makes you think.
Wow god must've been really pissed! He knocked over some chairs and bushes. You are ignorant. Get some perspective.
JBronx39 3 months ago
Also, this was not an act of God. It was an act of nature. Note Luke 13:4 and the Tower of Siloam. To attribute acts of nature to God's divine intervention (though actually quite funny) is really just superstition. Not that God can't act in those ways but if we, as Christians, are reading lines in the rock as though the Word of God then we are no better than the pagans and are putting ourselves back under the law of sin just like the ELCA.
spectersparten 4 months ago
This is the ELCA. It would be wrong to say that Lutheranism endorses homosexual and femal pastors. Actuall Lutheranism does no such thing. Note the LCMS (of which I am a member). Just a little fyi because Lutheranism hold to sound Biblical doctrine and I wouldn't want anyone thinking otherwise. God bless.
spectersparten 4 months ago
The next time there will be no building standing ... Jer. 23:19>Behold, a whirlwind of the LORD is gone forth in fury, even a “grievous” (category 4) whirlwind: it shall fall grievously upon the head of the wicked. 20>The anger of the LORD shall not return, until he have executed, and till he have performed the thoughts of his heart: in the latter days ye shall consider it perfectly.
dreamclutch 6 months ago
@dreamclutch The "next time" has long come and gone. My church, ECUSA, proudly ordains gay clergy and many priests bless same sex unions. But the weather here is delightfully temperate and sunny. Meanwhile, in Rick Perry land the plains are burning. Does that mean that God is mad at the Tea Party?
321freethinker 6 months ago
Natural disasters are God's way of allowing Satan to have his way with a people who have made a decision to have them as his leader. Repent and Change! God never created a man to be with a man and neither a woman with a woman. There will be more natural disasters as men continue to decide to look to Satan for their leadership.
martt70 6 months ago
I figure that being pridefully sinful is a risk intelligent Christians should be unwilling to take. Maybe you won't go to Hell for having gay sex, being a theif, harming a child, committing adultery, enjoying bestiality or being a murderer. It may be true that God's grace saves even prideful sinners, but I'm not willing to take the risk.
ebonics4everyone 6 months ago
@ebonics4everyone The prideful sinner here is you. You self-righteously condemn others when the one you should pronounce judgement on is yourself. Don't be so sure you will squeak into the Pearly Gates.
321freethinker 6 months ago
Eh, is this vid still here? The tornado appeared in a tornado valley in high bseason!
Tzedaqyal 6 months ago
@Tzedaqyal Yes, unfortunately both it and the ignorance that spawned are still alive and well, unfortunately. On the plus side, it is waning. More and more young Christians are realizing they've been lied to by their elders who created the Religious Right.
321freethinker 6 months ago
"All medication is sinful." - Cindy Young
Wow, to think I've always believed that doctors and nurses are doing a noble work. Someone should tell those rotten sinners that every time they heal a sick person they're spitting in God's face.
I certainly hope that if you have kids you haven't let them get vaccinations or given them sinful things like antibiotics or cold medicine. I guess i should stop supporting evil institutions like St. Jude's Hospital for Children. Thanks, Cindy!
docslarn 6 months ago
Of course, if you still insist on saying that the verse in Leviticus is valid, then I must ask: have you obeyed it? Have you put gay people to death, as it commands? If not, then why do you defy God's word?
docslarn 6 months ago
@docslarn Leviticus was only for the ancient Hebrews under the Mosaic Covenant. We do not use Leviticus to argue against homosexuality. The New Testament is crystal clear. Look at 1 Corinthians 6:9 and Romans chapter 1. It is against the creation order and everyone knows it is wrong even without the Bible. If this behavior was universally adopted then the human race would cease to exist in 1 generation. Its obviously wrong.
LogosApologia 6 months ago
@LogosApologia 1. Since I was replying to the person who did use Leviticus, obviously some do use it. 2. The verse does not refer to monogamous homosexuals, but only promiscuous ones.
You know that not all verses are not to be interpreted literally; else we would all be walking around one-eyed and one-handed; 3. There are all sorts of behavior that, if universally adopted, would lead to the end of humanity, such as staying single. That doesn't make them wrong.
Strike 1,2 ,3, you're out.
docslarn 6 months ago
@docslarn 2. The verse refers to any homosexuality. Rom 1 describes the acts them self as "contrary to nature" ...you skipped the main argument. It is against the creation order. It is obvious that men and women are desinged to work together. God's first commandment was to be fruitful and multiply. Sexuality has a purpose more than selfish personal pleasure. Homosexuality is a perversion of God's design.
LogosApologia 6 months ago
@LogosApologia if so then why is the so much Homosexual in the 148 Species. and Descrimination in one
CodeBlaze 1 week ago
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docslarn 6 months ago
Re: "contrary to nature," no, it's not. Homosexuality is an inborn tendency that people, as well as members of lower species, are born with. For them it's perfectly "natural." The verse refers to the debauched orgies the Romans engaged in, not an expression of love between two persons. In fact, a loving act between two persons is a perfectly natural behavior for creations of a God who is Himself love.
docslarn 6 months ago
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So you're admitting that your argument that "If this behavior was universally adopted then the human race would cease to exist in 1 generation. Its obviously wrong" holds no water?
docslarn 6 months ago
I can't help but laugh when I see Christians using verses from Leviticus to say homosexuality is forbidden, but somehow overlook the dietary restrictions, clothing requirements, etc. listed in the same book!
You can't squirm out of what the Bible teaches Sodom's sin was: lack of social justice. it even specifically says that God was upset about the unequal distribution of wealth. Some were overfed while others were hungry.
docslarn 6 months ago
@docslarn It seems that you don't like the truth, Most people don't because it doesn't fit into their lifestyle. It certainly didn't fit into mine at first. I didn't like the idea that I had to give up things that I liked. What are these things if you don't have God's approval and they are just temporary for the world. One has to be willing to give back what was given and Jesus paid it all. Sin is sin no matter how you count it. Its not just homosexuality, it's sexuality.
cindyoung13 6 months ago
Respond to this video... sexuality was meant to be between man and woman to fill the earth and nothing can be more contrary to it's purpose than to be opposite what was intended. God will save those who repent but I don't think he will forgive those that repent and continue to sin. It is sort of like slapping Jesus in the face when we know we're not supposed to sin and yet we do it anyway. We can justify or make excuses for them but in the end it is still sin and sin is death. God bless
cindyoung13 6 months ago
@docslarn sexuality was meant to be between man and woman to fill the earth and nothing can be more contrary to it's purpose than to be opposite what was intended. God will save those who repent but I don't think he will forgive those that repent and continue to sin. It is sort of like slapping Jesus in the face when we know we're not supposed to sin and yet we do it anyway. We can justify or make excuses for them but in the end it is still sin and sin is death. it doesnt matter what sin it is.
cindyoung13 6 months ago
@cindyoung13 "sexuality was meant to be between man and woman to fill the earth." If that's true then it is sinful for men or women who cannot reproduce to ever have sex. Also, a logical corollary of your claim is that all forms of birth control are sinful.
Sex is for more than having babies. It's meant for intimacy and pleasure among all monogamous couples. Your efforts to deny that to God's gay and lesbian children is what truly slaps Jesus in the face.
321freethinker 6 months ago
@321freethinker Your absolutely right about contraception being a sin. All medication is sinful not to mention something that keeps you from doing the will of God. Think about it, Man likes to pervert everything because Satan says it's ok. If we are truly Gods children, then we can abstain from what we think is pleasurable here on the earth because we are not from here and should not participate in the worldly things. We are only to obey God.
cindyoung13 6 months ago
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Please don't think all Christians are this stupid; they're not. for an intelligent, thoughtful alternative to this sort of nonsense, I invite you to check out
christandplato.blogspot.com
docslarn 6 months ago
News flash, fundies: the Bible names Sodom's sin as lack of social justice, NOT homosexuality:
"'Now this was the sin of your sister Sodom: She and her daughters were arrogant, overfed and unconcerned; they did not help the poor and needy.-Ezekiel. 16:19
This is the real reason the church has become a joke. So-called Christians are anxious to distort God into a caricature of themselves:: hateful, intolerant, and irrational. It's not liberalism that's your enemy, it's your own vicious natures.
docslarn 6 months ago
@docslarn you mean 16:49 right? You're right it does say that. But read the next verse "And they were haughty, and committed abomination before me: therefore I took them away as I saw good." Ezekiel 16:50. And God calls homosexuality an abomination "Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is an abomination." Leviticus 18:23 "If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death;..." Leviticus 20:13
DisneyFangirl09 6 months ago
Wow, God sure is a wimp. The Lutherans defy his will and all he can do is cause a little property damage? He's also inconsistent. My church actually elected a gay bishop, yet the Almighty didn't have the cajones to even send a shower! What a p*ssy!
docslarn 6 months ago
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Joplin is nearby the gambling dens of Oklahoma and the sin city known as Branson, Missouri. Branson is filled w/ faggots like Yoshi and Yackoff Smirtnoff.
ebonics4everyone 6 months ago
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I actually heard a homosexual say that God is gay, because he procreated w/ himself and the world was His defecation. It's satanic blasphemies like this and so called "churches" that sanction gay nuptuals that cause God to smite places like Joplin, Missouri, w/ deadly bullfrogs, locusts, hail and heavenly twisters that suck up Homo Depot and other ungodly places.
ebonics4everyone 6 months ago
@ebonics4everyone Wow, the nuts are really coming out of the woodwork now. I had no idea that Joplin MO had been assailed by bull frogs, locusts and hail. I guess God doesn't care for tacky tourist towns and bad karaoke.
docslarn 6 months ago
To view a terrific refutation of the bigoted, moronic nonsense in this video, take a look at the YouTube video "Lutherans, Tornadoes, and Gays! Oh my!" by ProfMTH.
RCSVirginia 7 months ago
Hey, EternalLucifer! We don't care what the bible says! We don't care what your god says! Obviously deep down you don't either! Only those with doubt need to preach their dogma to people that don't want to hear it. You are GAY. Come out!
Soressi1 7 months ago
Notice that if the cross were removed, it would be like saying the redemption nature of the cross is removed.
What happened here is worse: An inverted cross is the symbol used by those who serve Satan.
KnowJesusKnowPeace 8 months ago
@KnowJesusKnowPeace I was thinking the same thing when I saw that inverted cross. Isn't it amazing how God makes Himself seen by everyone who is willing to look and listen!!
Wivanunu 7 months ago
This is right up there with Pat Robertson blaming the Haitians making a pact with the devil for the hurricane that struck Haiti, or Jerry Falwell's blaming pagans, abortionists, feminists, gays, lesbians and anyone pursuing an alternative lifestyle of which he disapproved for the attack on America on 9-11.
This, of course, ignores the facts that hurricanes happen in the Caribbean, nowhere in America is immune to tornadoes, and Al-Qaeda attacked the World Trade Centre. It is, also, nauseous.
RCSVirginia 8 months ago
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@iprazhm Judge not lest you yourself will be judged...
Crash8437 8 months ago
God did say like he put via Jesus that that thing he hates is the deeds of the Nicolatains read it in the first few chapters in the book of Revelation.
Also he was sore displeased with the money changers in the temple and dove traders.
Zouscarlett 8 months ago in playlist Homosexuality & the Church
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BrentJ277 9 months ago
If I were one of the ELCA members who were in favor of this, I could turn it around on you and say that since Joplin, Missouri, Oklahoma City, Oklahoma, Tuscaloosa, Alabama, and other cities recently hit by tornados didn't endorse homosexuality they were being punished, but that would about as theologically specious as your argument.
BrentJ277 9 months ago
@BrentJ277 Excellent point!
docslarn 6 months ago
Frankly, two wrongs do not make a right. It is wrong for the Lutheran church to have gay clergy, but it is also wrong to say that this tornado was God's wrath for their vote.
To my knowledge, Joplin, Missouri, Oklahoma City, Oklahoma, Tuscaloosa, Alabama, and other cities recently hit by tornados have not endorsed homosexuality. However San Francisco, the modern equivalent of Sodom, according to dispensationalists like yourself has not been hit by any natural disaster lately.
BrentJ277 9 months ago
To the creator of this video: Nice use of dispensationalism to make your point.. (sarcasm)
Frankly, while I do disagree with the decision of the Lutherans to allow gay clergy, I do also disagree with your message. Coming from the perspective of a former Christian social conservative turned Christian social libertarian, I believe you are more apt to win souls with honey than you are with vinegar.
BrentJ277 9 months ago
You religous whackjobs are funny
MrThrunobulax 9 months ago
1) You must be a latent homosexual; its been proven that the only people that try to stop others from being gay are gay. 2) Most of the people who have HIV are black mothers, you uneducated hate-monger. 3) Homosexuality is NOT a perversion but perfectly natural, found in approximately 10% of all mammals.
4) You are taking the Romans passage out of context. Paul makes a list of supposed sinners, which you quote, but its a set up, for he turns around and calls his readers HYPOCRITES. THAT'S YOU!
Soressi1 9 months ago
I thought God sent the tornado cuz two of da anti gay deacons was caught in the center bathroom a fuggin each udder.
woody5551 9 months ago
god is testing your faith. you said repent repent. you lose.
hep2jive 9 months ago
im gay and really good at calling out who is gay and isnt. those people who are anti gay, about 99.2% of them are more gay then an asian dude singing the golden girls theme song in a bathtub. in Alabama.
hep2jive 9 months ago
wow i thought the middle ages finished like 500 years ago... i can't believe that someone really thinks that "god" sends disasters for punishing gays. uh no wait not for punishing but for making people understand that they are wrong which is even more unlogical and hypocritical.you know then sun revolves around the earth... let's burn some gays, maybe tornadoes will stop!
cippaification1 9 months ago 3
Obviously you are uneducated. Go learn some more, prove it right, then come back. God is love, he does not judge. Understand that.
ISaWHAT89 9 months ago
you think your god would talk to you then? what would he say to you? be honest. he wouldnt say shit but for attention or material things you would make some shit up just for selfworth.remember you are the sheep who do you fukin think is the wolf. and i think theres more gay sheep than wolfs haha that last part was my joke put that in your bible.and dont bring your bitch ass to the northside beahch.
northsidebeahch 9 months ago
bible, The old testament the new testament king james version Do you know why? think ... someone in power decided to write a version that better suits thier needs or wants. that is the total answer to religion. think about it.if you werre the first person on earth and there was no religion and after you lived 20 years what would you believe?
northsidebeahch 9 months ago
Is this a Joke hahah lol if god hated gays he would have attacked up-town not north Minneapolis you fuck retard hahah you're fucking dumb
dskar016 9 months ago
Judge not, lest ye be judged, christians are spreading HATE and will burn in hell for it.
smurfboywv 9 months ago in playlist Homosexuality & the Church
@smurfboywv God hates sin but loves the sinner. Homosexuality is a sin -it's not the only sin, but none the less, it's disapproved of by God. But God & His true followers would or should love you- just not your sin of homosexuality. If you want to go to Heaven, repent ( turn from it) , ask Jesus forgiveness & let Him really be your Lord!
Eternallightbearer 9 months ago
so let me get this straight your saying that because of one vote god just decided to kill them?
you realize tornadoes happen right and i know plenty of gays who have not been hit by a tornado lol
cjshadow0 9 months ago in playlist Homosexuality & the Church
The message on this video is completely right. God does send natural disasters as a judgment against sin. How could they be so blind? I grew up in the Missouri-Synod Lutheran Church, which is much more conservative than the Evangelical branch. Hopefully they will never decide to approve of homosexuality. Although God loves homosexuals, they are not living according to His plan . But they can be forgiven if they acknowledge their sin & ask Jesus to save them!
Eternallightbearer 9 months ago in playlist Homosexuality & the Church
@Eternallightbearer Thanks!
LogosApologia 9 months ago
@Eternallightbearer Natural disasters aren't punishment from God, but this video and everyone who agree with it are sinners for spreading hatred.
smurfboywv 9 months ago in playlist Homosexuality & the Church
@smurfboywv Yes God does hate sin. Why do you think He destroyed the city of Sodom & Gomorrah in the Old Testament. It was for the sin of homosexuality. Don't be blinded by your sin. It's not worth spending eternity in Hell. God will forgive you. But if you don't repent & accept Jesusyou will spend eternity paying for your own sin in Hell.
Eternallightbearer 9 months ago
@Eternallightbearer He destroyed those towns because none were worthy of being saved. They all denied the word of God and his righteousness.
smurfboywv 9 months ago
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@smurfboywv Being a homosexual is denying God & His righteousness by your lifestyle."No you not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the Kingdom of God." 1 Corinthians 6: 9& 10
Eternallightbearer 9 months ago
@smurfboywv If God destroyed all those who aren't "worthy of being saved" then all of us are in trouble. "It is by grace you are saved through faith."
docslarn 6 months ago
@Eternallightbearer Wrong; according to Ezekiel 16:49 it was for their lack of concern about the poor. Funny how ignorant "Bible believing Christians" are of what the book actually says.
docslarn 6 months ago
@docslarn Romans 1:25 & 27 " Instead of believing what they knew was the truth about God, they deliberately chose to believe lies... men instead of having normal sexual relationships with women, burned with lust for each other.Men did shameful things with other men and, as a result, suffered within themselves the penalty they so richly deserved."
Eternallightbearer 6 months ago
@Eternallightbearer
That's plain idiotic. And it shows everyone what true believers are like deep down. You don't even know your own history; you truly are just a sheep being blindly led down a path of hypocrisy. You don't even know how to read the bible, because you are so tied to the mistranslated english versions. Did you know the FIRST COUPLES to be married by the Xtian church were gay couples?! LOOK IT UP YOU IDIOT!!!
Soressi1 9 months ago
@Soressi1 Regardless of the translation of the true Bible- Homosexuality is a perversion of God's original design for men & women! When people live that way without feeling guilty, it's because God has given them over to reprobate minds! ( see Romans 1). But God's judgment is coming upon those who are gay- either in this life ( through HIV & natural disasters) or in life eternal by being tormented 4ever in Hell. Christians don't hate gay people -just their disgusting sin of homosexuality.Repent
Eternallightbearer 9 months ago
@Eternallightbearer Care to explain to me why love is a sin?
swordmaster800 9 months ago
@swordmaster800 Love isn't a sin -its how you're expressing it that makes it sinful ( assuming your gay).It's against nature & how God created us to be." ...And in the same way also men abandoned the natural function of their women &burned in their desire toward one another, men with men committing indecent acts & receiving in their own persons the due penalty of their error." Romans 1:27 Repent & turn to Jesus! He loves you & will forgive you. God has a better plan 4 your life!
Eternallightbearer 9 months ago
@Eternallightbearer According to the bible (and you), people would deliberately choose to be attracted to their own gender, knowing that it will lead to prejudice, ridicule, hate, sometimes even violence. 1) Why would people want that? and 2) I would love to know how people can choose their own gender when they fall in love.
swordmaster800 9 months ago
@swordmaster800 Men & women will have differences they need to work out, & with God on their side, those differences can be worked out peaceably. It's far better than burning in Hell for all Eternity because you chose to live a homosexual life-style on Earth. If you ask Jesus to come into your heart, you will know longer be attracted to your own sex. Jesus can set you free from that bondage!
Eternallightbearer 9 months ago
@Eternallightbearer Homosexuality isn't a choice. If it is, then I want you to imagine kissing someone of the same gender as you. Could you do it? Why or why not?
swordmaster800 9 months ago
@swordmaster800 You may not feel as though you had a choice right now, because you're in bondage to the sin of homosexuality. But if you invite Jesus to come into your heart, He will set you free from it. You weren't born that way. It's a stronghold of sin in your life. Other people have other strong holds- such as a bad temper, or over eating- maybe even lieing or stealing. But what ever it is- Jesus is the answer. He can set you free from it!
Eternallightbearer 9 months ago
@Eternallightbearer Do you seriously believe that having an affection towards another human being is in the same league as being bad-tempered, stealing or lying? If you do, then get a clue. Gays DO NOT damage society in any way, shape or form. Even the Bible can't explain why it's wrong.
swordmaster800 9 months ago
@swordmaster800 Even though you're not breaking society's rules by being gay, you're breaking God's. It's contrary to the way God made you to be. If you love your sin more than God, & don't repent of it, you will go to hell.In Hell, there are homosexuals paying for their sins by being crucified on crosses for all eternity ( see Mary Baxter's "Journey through Hell" tapes via my channel). Don't take a chance. A little pleasure now is not worth the price of your eternal soul!
Eternallightbearer 9 months ago
@Eternallightbearer In my book, love has no boundaries but you obviously think that there is. So, I'm just going to say this: I'm going to keep my bride and take my chances because there is no greater feeling to be in love and not even the Devil himself will take that away from me.
swordmaster800 9 months ago
@swordmaster800 It may feel o'kay now, but it won't feel good after this life. And don't think you'll just feel nothing after you die. There will be constant pain in Hell. Those who led you t believe it was o'kay to live a homosexual lifestyle will be tormented all the more.
Eternallightbearer 9 months ago
@Eternallightbearer Your views are so discriminative. If you believe god created men and women to be together, then why do homosexuals even exist?? Why would God create individuals that would not follow His plan on men & women couples? Also, why condemn an individual who is as much as a creation of God as yourself. Do you not believe we are all equal? Sexuality isn't a choice so why judge someone for something they have no control over?
swordmaster800 8 months ago
@swordmaster800 Homosexuals exist because sin exists. Since we are born with a sinful nature, we have a bent towards sinful choices. Homosexuality is a sinful choice ( see Romans 118-28). People have a reason for making their sinful choices, but they are still wrong & there will eventually be consequences. God loves the sinner, but hates the sin- & that goes for other sins as well!Saying sexuality isn't a choice is a lie from the pits of Hell ( & the devil). Don't listen to it! Repent!!!!
Eternallightbearer 8 months ago
@Eternallightbearer You keep saying that being gay is bad but your not saying why? Considering that you strongly believe in your religion, I do believe your common sense is being blinded. If I were to remove any scripture you could make and if you truly believe homosexuality to be wrong, TELL ME WHY! Do not just make nonsensical remarks
swordmaster800 8 months ago
@swordmaster800 Homosexuality is not the way God made us to be.But even though this is true, you still won't listen. Whether this country approves of it & allows gay marriages , it's wrong . God does not approve! Those who don't repent of their sins ( homosexuality included) will face God's judgment!
Eternallightbearer 8 months ago
@Eternallightbearer Only the 10 commenments are the Word of God. The rest are guidelines invented by mortal human beings. If He truly had a problem with it, he would have said so.
swordmaster800 8 months ago
@swordmaster800 God speaks throughout the Bible through his Servants! 2 Timothy 3:16 says, " All Scripture is inspired by God & profitable for teaching,for correction, & for training in righteousness, so that the man of God may be adequate, & equipped for every good work. You want your sin more than God, & that's why you refuse to listen to parts of the Bible that speak against homosexuality!
Eternallightbearer 8 months ago
@Eternallightbearer You say it's a sin yet you can't even explain what's wrong with it. Until you do, I'm going to continue to side with science's version of homosexuality. You know, the side that actually explains why it's not a choice instead of just saying it's not.
swordmaster800 8 months ago
@swordmaster800 Homosexuality is a sin because it's a perversion of God's plan. God wants men & women to get together to have children & take care of their families. If He had wanted same sexes to get together , why are they unable to have children in the natural way?
Eternallightbearer 8 months ago
@Eternallightbearer Considering that you just said that God has a plan, I must go back and ask: Why would God create individuals that would not follow His plan on men & women couples? Also, why would an all-loving God only have love for straight couples?
swordmaster800 8 months ago
@swordmaster800 It all boils down to the the fact of free will. God wanted people who would willing choose to love & serve Him, not do so because they had to.
Eternallightbearer 8 months ago
@Eternallightbearer When someone has free will, they're choices and thoughts are completely their own and is not influenced by physical or divine forces. I mean, is it really free will if someone were told how to act and think since an early age and you were to continue through that path?
swordmaster800 8 months ago
@swordmaster800 It is free will if a person of their own volition chooses to go on the same path they were taught as a child is the right one. They would be wisely choosing to go on it themselves, since they could discern it was the right way to go!
Eternallightbearer 8 months ago
@Eternallightbearer I disagree with that because if a person chooses the path they were taught to go as a kid, then when the kid is an adult, the path have already been set for them without any real life experience.
swordmaster800 8 months ago
@swordmaster800 If you were brought up in the church, & now you're a homosexual to prove you can be independent, then you have been deceived! God has a good plan for your life ( Jeremiah 29:11) where you can find the unique gifts He's given you & use them in a fulfilling way that will glorify God.You will still feel independent going God's way- even if you were brought up by Christian parents who took you to church & Sunday School.. But 1st- ask Jesus to forgive you & save you!
Eternallightbearer 8 months ago
@Eternallightbearer I consider myself an agnostic but if I had a choice of religion, I'd probably gravitate towards Buddhism because it involves finding peace within oneself, and I think that is a very positive thing.
swordmaster800 8 months ago
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@swordmaster800 Buddhism won't get you to Heaven.
Eternallightbearer 8 months ago
@Eternallightbearer Why not starting indoctrinating people when they can discern between what is possible and what is not, what is fiction and what is not. ? It is the same reason why children are circumcised and not adults. because most adults would n`t fall for this nonsense.
tallliza 8 months ago
@tallliza Christianity sounds like foolishness to the world, but it is true!
Eternallightbearer 8 months ago
@Eternallightbearer One more thing, why would a benevolent God create people with the complete knwoledge that he is creating people who are doomed for hell? There is absolutely no sense in this!
swordmaster800 8 months ago
@swordmaster800 God created people even though He knew that sadly, there would be those who go to hell, because He also knew there would be those who would want a relationship with Him, & end up going to Heaven. It was worth creating humans for the sake of those who would end up getting saved!!!
Eternallightbearer 8 months ago
@Eternallightbearer I do think that your God, in some ways, has a satanic personality to create homosexuals only to send them to hell because they're gay. Isn't Jesus and therefore Christianity meant to promote peace and understanding?
swordmaster800 8 months ago
@swordmaster800 God did not create you as gay! You have been blinded by the devil to think this!
Eternallightbearer 8 months ago
@Eternallightbearer Your comments are delusional. Read ALL of Romans - that passage is a set up to call those who think that HYPOCRITES. You must be a latent homosexual yourself; it has been proven that only those who have repressed their own gayness try to stop others from being gay. FYI, HIV attacks mostly black women. Oh, and do you know how to say Light Bearer in biblical greek? LUCIFER! Luci= light, Fer= bearer. What uneducated LUNACY!
Soressi1 7 months ago
@Soressi1 Homosexuals are going to Hell. God loves you, but hates your sin. Repent before it's too late . Call on Jesus name! He will deliver you & sanctify you. Don't be stubborn. The government says it'sok to be gay- God doe not!!!!!!!!!
Eternallightbearer 7 months ago
@Eternallightbearer WRONG weather is caused by heating and cooling of the earth.
smurfboywv 7 months ago in playlist Homosexuality & the Church
@smurfboywv Read Revelation chapter 6 & onward in the Bible. You will see that God's judgments also come in the form of cataclysmic natural events. It would be wise to repent of sin & turn to Jesus now while you still have the opportunity!
Eternallightbearer 7 months ago
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@Eternallightbearer What part of "God created man in his image" don't you get? Hitler killed the Jews, and now christians want to kill the gays and take away their rights. This is a test of God's people to see if they really love God, and the Catholics have failed miserably. Jesus will save all gay men and women who call upon his name.
smurfboywv 7 months ago
@Eternallightbearer God made me gay and he loves me just the way I am. I'm not changing for anyone, or to make christians happy.
smurfboywv 7 months ago in playlist Homosexuality & the Church
@Eternallightbearer Another excuse to hate gays, pathetic.
smurfboywv 7 months ago in playlist Homosexuality & the Church
@smurfboywv God loves us, but hates our sins. And yes, He tells us in His word that homosexuality is a sin. Those who live that kind of life-style will not inherit the Kingdom ( 1 Corinthians 6:9). God has a better way for you to live! Repent & turn to Jesus. Don't go on playing the victim.God loves you too much to let you stay in your present condition.He has a much better plan for your life!!!
Eternallightbearer 7 months ago
@Eternallightbearer Tell me where you see homosexuals go to hell please. 1 Corinthians 6:9-10 9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, 10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
smurfboywv 7 months ago
@smurfboywv In the New american Standard version, it substitutes the word "homosexual" for abusers of themselves with mankind. Why do you think God destroyed Sodom & Gommorah in Genesis 19? Because He was pleased with their lifestyle? I don't think so! Also, look at Romans1 :27 & 28. When people refuse to listen to God, He goves them over to a reprobate mind.That means their consciences become seared & they can't tell right from wrong. Repent before it's too late for you!
Eternallightbearer 7 months ago
@Eternallightbe Did God also plan for my parents to divorce and put me in welfare's care when I was 5 and to be moved from one home to another, to be beaten, abuse, neglected, and to be put in mental hospitals for trying to commit suicide? Did God ever once mention in the Bible that if 2 men or 2 women loved each other and upheld the commandments, and to love your lord with your heart and soul, and to love your neighbors and your enemy, does he say if gays follow the rules they still go to hell?
smurfboywv 7 months ago
@smurfboywv I'm very sorry for what happened to you when you were growing up! I see why you're weary of marriages, & perhaps afraid you may end up divorcing- hurting yourself & your children ( as you were hurt when your parents divorced).Foster care is not a good system, but it's the only one "the world" has. People have free will, which causes them to sometimes do right things & other times they choose the wrong.None of us are good enough to enter Heaven by our own good deeds.
Eternallightbearer 7 months ago
@smurfboywv Ask Jesus to be your personal Savior. Only by trusting in Jesus & believing He's God's Son who died for your sins, can you be forgiven. He will heal you're hurting heart, & help you forgive those who have done you wrong, so you can live a victorious life here & now. And you will also be assured of a home in Heaven in hereafter!
Eternallightbearer 7 months ago
This video is really, very well made. I'm so impressed.
sheshelamb 10 months ago
@moloko5 In the case that someone is making a terrible mistake, the most loving to do is to get their attention so that they may turn from their error. The situation here was to get the attention of a church leadership, it was not directed at a person. Also note that no one was injured. There's a difference between hating what someone does and hating the person. Jesus came to save sinners.
LogosApologia 10 months ago
@LogosApologia You want to use one verse and only one verse from the old testament. Lets look at it. Exodus 21:7 says we can sell our daughters into slavery, what is a good price for her? Lev. 15:19-24 You are not allowed to have sex with your wife during her uncleanliness menstrual cycle. Lev. 25:44 states that I may possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are purchased from neighbouring nations. Exodus 35:2 clearly states working on the sabbath can get you stoned to death. :-)
smurfboywv 7 months ago in playlist Homosexuality & the Church
@LogosApologia Lev. 11:10 eating shellfish is an abomination, Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. Most of my friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is forbidden by Lev.19:27, How should they die? Lev. 19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field is an abomination. 'Keep my decrees. "'Do not mate different kinds of animals. 'Do not wear clothing woven of two kinds of material.
smurfboywv 7 months ago in playlist Homosexuality & the Church
@smurfboywv Levitcus only applied to ancient Hebrews, the NT condemns homosexuality very clearly in 1 Cor. 6:9 And Romans chapter 1. It's a violation of the created order - an unfortunate disorder of sinful man.
LogosApologia 7 months ago
@LogosApologia Leviticus only applies to ancient Hebrews? Then why do people use it to condemn gays today, and why not also use those other verses I posted? Lets look at 1 Cor 9: 9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, 10Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God. Nothing gay.
smurfboywv 7 months ago
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@LogosApol Romans 7 To all that be in Rome, beloved of God, called to be saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ. Christ is speaking to the people of rome in this chapter. 23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things. 24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves
smurfboywv 7 months ago
@LogosApologia So I say by you using leviticus, you've also committed a slew of abominations against God. You shall die.
smurfboywv 7 months ago in playlist Homosexuality & the Church
@smurfboywv Leviticus only applied to the ancient Hebrews. But the New Testament is crystal clear: " Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality," (1 Cor 6:9)
LogosApologia 7 months ago
So when the tornado hits your stupid trailer park, does that mean God hates all rednecks?
moloko5 11 months ago 6
@moloko5 Who said God hated anyone?
LogosApologia 10 months ago
@moloko5 Guess
so
dancesinggirl6 8 months ago
@dowejustexist Agreed. My father-in-law beat his children every day of their lives. He beat his wife daily as well. As his kids aged, he stalked them, trashed their vehicles and made threatening phone calls.Yet, he was buried with military honors and with honor by those same children he so horrifically abused. My father-in-law was a strict and devout Catholic to the core. He was honored in a Catholic church and buried in a Catholic cemetery. How can such wicked acts by a man go unpunished?
cocopelli34 11 months ago
@cocopelli34 God knows our hearts. he records our actions, thoughts and words. A true follower of Jesus Christ lives He did. Every knee will bow, yours, mine, our families, the President, Prime Minister, Bank President, Janitor...
Brucev7 10 months ago
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dowejustexist 8 months ago
@cocopelli34 They won't go ultimately unpunished. The Word teaches us that God looks on the inside while man looks on the outside. God knows the hidden things of that man's heart and he will be judged according to God's knowledge of him through Christ.
dowejustexist 8 months ago
Interesting how religious people are all agog over saving babies but are more than willing to damn homosexuals to hell. I guess life isn't life after all, is it?
htc6600 1 year ago
@htc6600 Do you really think that Christians believe that they can damn people to hell? No Christian believes they have that power...
LogosApologia 11 months ago
@LogosApologia But think they can make their way to heaven - in fact all religioin believe that
rolingpingu 10 months ago
the world need to hear the truth. people can try to justify these events as coincidents but, its not. the lord will let His children know when they are doing something like a loving father He is, He will do something to let us know that it is nothing but God
shevonne876 1 year ago
I am very upset about this ruling. I was all set to rejoin my families old Lutheran church and have been attending several hourly classes previous to my joining the church. Now the pastor has told me that our church is in the ELCA and updated me on the newly adopted rules and methods. Should I go and find a Missouri Synod Lutheran Church? This upsets me as I had hoped to rejoin the church I attended with my parents as a child. What the heck!
tinyflyonthewall 1 year ago
@tinyflyonthewall I'm sorry to hear that. I would suggest finding a church that believes the Bible and preaches the Gospel, denomination is not as important as sound doctrine.
LogosApologia 11 months ago
ITS SO LUDACRIS THAT PEOPLE ACTUALLY THINK THAT OUR PERFECT GOD ALMIGHTY HAS THE HUMAN FRAILTY OF PETINESS AND VENGEFUL ANGER TO SEND A WRATH OF TORNADOS TO CONDEM PEOPLE. GOD ISNT HUMAN PEOPLE. WAKE UP. STOP THINKING LIKE THE NEANDERTHALS WITHOUT COMPLEX MINDS. NATURE HAPPENS.
dorianstark 1 year ago
Allowing Catholic priest to marry and a church abandoning bibical Christianity to mainstream teaching gay as correct and right are two different and unrelated matters.
speakoutbrad 1 year ago
@speakoutbrad The relationship is obvious: both matters hinge upon whether you think imposed celibacy can work. Dr. Luther taught that human beings were not designed for celibate life: "It is not good for man to be alone." He saw some ugly consequences of not allowing priests or monks to marry. Not allowing gays to marry undoubtedly has some similar ugly consequences. Luther would undoubtedly see the same common sense solution: Let them marry.
boriato 1 year ago
@boriato We will never agree. Your view is slanted to one side and mine is main stream. There is no reason to talk of this further. Have a good life.
speakoutbrad 1 year ago
@speakoutbrad If by "slanted to one side" you mean inspired by Dr. Luther's own practical insights, then yes, my view is slanted. If by "main stream" you mean you ignore what Luther himself taught, then why call yourself Lutheran or comment on Lutheran matters?
boriato 1 year ago
boriato can stay in his ELCA church for the next 15 years. Then they will have no money and be forced to fold. As for me, we left the ELCA. Proudly. Not because of homosexuality, but because they changed the bible to fit there needs. LCMC.
blhfan11 1 year ago
@blhfan11 Bravo, wish I would have said that!
speakoutbrad 1 year ago
@blhfan11 Actually I'll be surprised if either ELCA or LCMC will last another 15 years. The ELCA is in a tailspin for reasons that go way beyond any one social issue, and LCMC exists only as a rebellion against the ELCA; it's against something & for nothing, so no one with an ounce of sense would join it. If either one does last 15 years, what it will look like remains to be seen (probably not pretty). Missouri Synod has its problems too, but try there if you want a more conservative church.
boriato 1 year ago
Coincidence? I don't think so.
lcr1955 1 year ago
The other aspect of this video that needs clarification is: when there's a tornado, or any other destructive natural phenomenon, is it really a sign of God's anger, which we can interpret? If you accept that there are plenty of sinners around, and that you & I are among them, then sure every victim will deserve God's anger in some sense. But in this case, why were nude dance bars & purveyors of porn a few blocks away unaffected by the tornado? Were these institutions more blessed by God???
boriato 1 year ago
@boriato Boriato, this church will now teach millions of children perversion is normal. The nude bars are frequented by Adults who made a choice to go there. The Children have no choice. They are being set up to be victims to gay sexual predators. I can hear it know, it's okay, the church says it's okay, it will feel good, I won't tell anyone! This will bring carnege to young lives. The Tornado, Christ is natures God, To those with faith no explaination is needed. You lack in faith man.
speakoutbrad 1 year ago
@speakoutbrad If you want gay sexual predators, try forcing gays to be celibate. Martin Luther himself was the Augustinian monk who dared to go public about the "horrible acts" committed by priests & monks the church forced into celibacy against their nature. Luther's solution: LET THEM MARRY! The only sad thing is that it is taking his own church centuries to learn that lesson.
boriato 1 year ago
@boriato I never said gays be should celebate. Gays are a small minority in america. And what they're doing endangers them. Most of the Gay friends I had in the past would never endorse this intrusion into straight society and it's values, most of which they shared. They lived quietly enjoying their life and allowing others to do the same. If they went to church they're faith and worship was between them and God. None of these men would have ever thought to undermine our shared values.
speakoutbrad 1 year ago
@speakoutbrad Then why the fuss over recognizing gay marriage? Why label it as perverted? We should agree that it is a step in a good direction, and does not undermine shared values. Indeed, it seems to promote family values and responsible sexual behavior. There's no perfect solution, since we live in a messy world. But it's an improvement. I think Martin Luther would recognize this.
boriato 1 year ago
@speakoutbrad BTW, the "straight" sex industry IS teaching children that perversion is normal. When your child asks: "If nude bars & pornography are so bad, why do we allow them, and why can I find them so easily?" how will you answer???
Why are conservatives (& some liberals too) so silent about the sex industry, which does corrupt many, though they mouth off about same sex marriage, which doesn't undermine anyone's values?
boriato 1 year ago
@boriato You can't seem to catch on. You have to be 18 or 21 to get into a bar or pornoshop. You can go into this corrupted church at birth.
speakoutbrad 1 year ago
@speakoutbrad You don't think that as long as we tolerate the sex industry, kids won't be messed up by it??? They have more direct access than you think, to both internet and printed porn. They also know that our society thinks it's okay. How is that not teaching perversion to our youth??? Also, even if we restrict the issue to adults, is porn less harmful to adults OR children than committed same-sex relationships that harm no one???
boriato 1 year ago
@speakoutbrad So stripper bars and pornshops do have God's blessing, because somehow turning 18 or 21 makes these perversions okay in God's eyes??? That seems to be what you're suggesting here. Is that a conservative Lutheran view???
boriato 1 year ago
The answer to the truth of the bible's and God's existence lies in the answering of one simple question,'DOES THE RAIN HAVE A FATHER?"
WE NEED TO BE HYDRATED its as simple as that and according to the bible this is not just a natural phenomenon nor did climate change end with Noah hence the words from Job---- the bibles meteorologist!!!...
"He brings the clouds to punish men or to water his earth and show his love.” {Job 37:5-13} more interesting though is the connection to crop circles. WOW!!!
cloudyheavens 1 year ago
To Rustyzipper's Reply: I don't even know why I bother....But here it goes... I can't believe you actually CITED examples where the bible exhibits a vengeful God. You are NO DIFFERENT than the extremist foreigners America hates so much. You take a BOOOK. A man-made book (a GREAT book, but a book nonetheless) and you take it LITERALLY because you lack the moral perspective necessary to read it...digest it...and come up with your OWN truths. You are SCARY dude!!!!!
perfectrhythm 1 year ago
People, you gain nothing by fighting here. Do something useful and pray not fight.
I can't believe that after this, there are still people that deny God's existence.
God bless you
ArraTonks 1 year ago 2
@ArraTonks The argument is futile. a man convinced against his will is of he same opinion still. It is unatural for a man not to have a woman. Men are visual creatures and very different from woman who are emotional. Men restrained long enough or without an outlet for sex will evantually jump anything that moves. What depends on their values. Did I write that. Well soap my fingers.
speakoutbrad 1 year ago
Consider what Luther wrote about forced celibacy back in the 16th century - that it was a terrible thing. Is it any less bad now? Then why would Lutherans (or anyone) force gays to be celibate???? And if you could force gays to be celibate, why not go back to clerical celibacy for heteros as well? IT DOESN'T WORK! At least, the ELCA recognizes this - it's a small step toward sanity, though they have a long way to go, and will never make it.
boriato 1 year ago
@boriato so, prophet or random wackjob?
sdrennan 1 year ago
@sdrennan I do not understand your question.
boriato 1 year ago
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That's right, God loves everyone but hates sins. I do believe this was a signal. A pretty improbable tornado just when they're approving the homosexuality, with a 66,6% of the votes, and what happened to the cross makes you think.
7Minish 1 year ago