I think out of all ideologies, confucianism is the most peaceful, humanist and secular of all ideologies in the ancient world, there was never a war fought in the name of "confucianism", and rather than going out "preaching" confucianism, people from outside i.e. Japan and Korea, even Western Jesuits, come to learn it instead.
The word 'religion' makes most people defensive. Christianity is not about being ‘religious’ but about allowing the Lord Jesus to free us from the bondage of the world and to follow His footsteps which lead to salvation of our souls; to be ‘born again. John 3:3. There are so many religions and Christianity should not be mistaken with the confusion that religions generate.
I disagree with Mr. Prothero when he says that "no there is not a God," in Confucianism. They do have a God, but, not in the same way as Christianity or Sikhism do. More on the same way that a Deist views Him.
I can surely tell you guys that confucianism is not a religion, there is no god or spirit in Confucianism. it is a mix of philosophy and ethics like Taoism.
Who said that people have to always be obedient in confucianism?! confucianism says that a husband and a wife respect each other like guests, how is that hierarchical and un-egalitarian?
Un-American?....well maybe if we only talk about American culture (ideology, habits, traditions, beliefs) and Confucianism comparing how americans/westerns (some) just care for their ego and, since confucianism teaches you how to behave in society in a non egotistic manner must be anti american? or un american?. I disagree because Confucianism teaches you how man kind posses the ability to transform/evolve into a much greater human being despite what place on earth you find yourself such USA
@zoticus1 sorta true but sorta not true. over the long history of confucian philosophy it has come to be an imprtant element of traditionial chinese religion, just like daoism, so much so that for many chinese it is hard confucian philosophy sperated from chinese religion. still you are right in that confucian philosophy is not a religion in its own right and can be adopted, and modified to fit into many cultures and religions.
@baimeng1 if Confucius wanted a religion he would have done so, but in his wisdom he knew it was to become an institutional item and therefore a partisan notion, that which his teachings go against.
If one was to read what he was saying they would understand his words were absolutes, without personal interpretation and therefore without dogma.
@zoticus1 yes, but the absorption of other beliefs or rather the absorption of confucian ideals in to other beliefs held by the chinese came early on with confucianism becoming the state philosophy/ religion. which created what you can call popular confucianism, with heavens, hells, gods, ect. all for the masses and had gone on for many centuries in china & east asia, thats why confucianism is such a big part of chinese religion and religion of all east asian cultuers.
@zoticus1 It is a religion. There are books that are to confucianism as the Bile to the christians. There are temples of confucianism. There are series of rituals of confucianism. There is the cult of ancestors. There is the belief in the Mandate of Heaven. And confucianism is more than just a religion. It is also a philosophy, and a ethical system. I think that Xinzhong Yao perfectly describes that phenomen in his book's and lectures.
@TheMalar i don't think calling confucianism a religion is correct, rather we should say that it is a facet of traditional chinese religion much like daoism is. what i mean is that for us chinese confucianism, daoism, buddhism are all major asspects of chinese culture and spirituality and aside from buddhism neither daoism nor confucianism colud stand on thiere own as religions with out the use of older chinese religious beliefs.
@baimeng1 Yes, but we still call christianity or judaism a religion, not a facet of Middle East religions. They also are based on older beliefs like the cult of Amon or zoroastrianism.
@TheMalar yes, but they can stand on their own as sperate religions, something that confucianism and daoism can't with out the support of traditional chinese beliefs, values, ect. if we take away these beliefs then neither confucianism nor daoism would be relgions just philosophies. you have to keep in mind that confucianism wasn't a religion at all untill much later on when the cult of kong fusi became state mandate, and the rise of neo-confucianism came about.
@baimeng1 But even when Confucius was still alive he talked about the cult of the ancestors, the sacrifices for the ancestors, the confucianism had it's books of worship- like the "Yijing", "Shu" or "Li". Of corse it was based on the earlier beliefs, but is Islam not based on christianity and christianity on judaism? Can christianity exist without the Old Testament?
@TheMalar this wasn't in my inbox, so sorry for the late reply.
anecestor cults, the classics, and the tradtion of bulding altars and shrines to great figures all predated confucianism, and confucian thinkers supported these tradtions since honoring the past was seen as very important. it wasn't long before they became bound to each like platonism and judhaism, and much later with christianity.
@baimeng1 I presonally agree with the definition that a religion is a ethical system built upon a list o virtues, fostered by a series of rituals that combines the followers of thouse virtues in a community. And I personally think that this definition fits confucianism and many more asian religions.
@TheMalar true, but confucianism and daoism are not seen as religions on theire own by chinese peoples for the most part, they are parts of a whole that togther form chinese religion.
If Any one searching a way of life , GOD and heaven. Confucius is the best, it is simply non-violent way of understanding compare to Muslim, Jews, and Christian.
about 禮 Li, the meaning "rituel' is not original meaning of this word. In the age of confucius, it meant a systeme of normes about politics, ethic etc.
This is way too analising.. How can you say Confucianism is un-American? What constitutes as "American"? White, middle class, well educated?
Confucianism isn't perfect but it's a hell of a lot better then Christianity and Islam, where their followers sometimes force their religion upon others and go on religious wars (Jihad/Crusades).
@chinesemusicDJ Confucianism is so un-American, go take a basic worlds religions class. America is all about sense of ones self. Being American out of ignorance is following christianity. Confucianism is not.
@Secyrb well i agree with you in that western societies do value the individual more so than the community, even more then family to an extent, but confucian ethics can help bulid stronger social and family bonds even with in the frame work of christianity just as it has helped to shape buddhism, shinto, ect, in east asia.
@chinesemusicDJ Very true, all the world's religions just essentially teach the same morals, morals that should be taught even with a lack of religion
I understand that the crusades and Jihads have killed millions, what else is there to understand? Are you talking in a general sense or are you directing that whole tirade of being a fool at me?
@chinesemusicDJ I'm not sure if you heard the interview in the right context but when he says Confucianism is un-American, he's criticizing American individualism and praising Confucianism. I'm also not for religions that force their beliefs on others but whether as a philosophy or religion, Confucianism, particularly neo-Confucianism, is also guilty of religious persecution, particularly of rooting out Buddhism, Taoism, and animism from society.
Doesn't it bother you that the first 500 years of so of Islamic Imperialism is one continuous piece of evidence demonstrating that you are wrong? Including Mohammed's own practices and how the ideal of martyrdom is pushed in the Qur'an?
I mean, it's obvious that you have no clue what you're talking about, I'm just wondering how it's possible to live with that kind of cognitive dissonance.
@Gnomefro It's self evidenct your a numerous amount of things. A ego maniac. an online troll, A victim of bullying,someone who loves to redundantly use wikipedia and thesaurusdotcom , and suggests herself be a genious, where as in the real world Your undereducated and inbred. Jihad means struggle, Not what ever osama bin laden says it means. This can also be bred into a vareity of arguments, Argueing that the bible , the qur'an is actually a parable , and not supposed to be taken literal
@Gnomefro but for the moral standard. I mean its obvious your mundane and highly stupid , I'm just wondering how it's possible that you can read a coupple of articles online and run around thinking your a doctor of philosophy in theology. It's pretty obvious that anyone who really knows what there talking about like a Dr. in theology , Could easily dimiinish your whole little argument. Please don't comment on my spelling , I don't feel obligated, If i felt you were worth the time i would
@chinesemusicDJ He's not talking about American religion. He's talking about the general Western zeitgeist that implies that everyone is equal, and have the same opportunities.
@sevenknots you are right "Li" actually means "zhou Li" (周礼). It is a form of political inequality (天子， 诸侯， 大夫， 庶民, 奴隶). During Western Zhou there were very strict political caste system.
I believe that "chaos", or in term of the state, the lack of central authority, actually leads to order is itself.
PacifistPigeon 3 weeks ago
I think out of all ideologies, confucianism is the most peaceful, humanist and secular of all ideologies in the ancient world, there was never a war fought in the name of "confucianism", and rather than going out "preaching" confucianism, people from outside i.e. Japan and Korea, even Western Jesuits, come to learn it instead.
dumdidolabumbuladido 1 month ago
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The word 'religion' makes most people defensive. Christianity is not about being ‘religious’ but about allowing the Lord Jesus to free us from the bondage of the world and to follow His footsteps which lead to salvation of our souls; to be ‘born again. John 3:3. There are so many religions and Christianity should not be mistaken with the confusion that religions generate.
KingdomSeeker2012 1 month ago
For anyone seeking the truth, please check out the scribd website that is listed on my channel.
DreamsofMajesty 1 month ago
whatever "-ism" or "-ity" or "-m", power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely.
礼 (li3) can also be translated "etiquette, courtesy, manners"
Heissenburger 2 months ago
I like the chinese way of you're a daoist, buddhist, and a confucist.
guitarmessiah95 2 months ago
I disagree with Mr. Prothero when he says that "no there is not a God," in Confucianism. They do have a God, but, not in the same way as Christianity or Sikhism do. More on the same way that a Deist views Him.
splashenful 2 months ago
I can surely tell you guys that confucianism is not a religion, there is no god or spirit in Confucianism. it is a mix of philosophy and ethics like Taoism.
joylaval 3 months ago
@joylaval i agree but there are two types of confucianism and taoism; philosophical and religious.
baimeng1 3 months ago
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336muslim 3 months ago
Who said that people have to always be obedient in confucianism?! confucianism says that a husband and a wife respect each other like guests, how is that hierarchical and un-egalitarian?
casphui 3 months ago
this is a good reviwe of confucianism, i wish more of the world had taken to confucian ideals.
baimeng1 3 months ago
Un-American?....well maybe if we only talk about American culture (ideology, habits, traditions, beliefs) and Confucianism comparing how americans/westerns (some) just care for their ego and, since confucianism teaches you how to behave in society in a non egotistic manner must be anti american? or un american?. I disagree because Confucianism teaches you how man kind posses the ability to transform/evolve into a much greater human being despite what place on earth you find yourself such USA
garcia0137 3 months ago
Confucianism is not religion, its a living philosophy, get your shit straight.
zoticus1 4 months ago
@zoticus1 sorta true but sorta not true. over the long history of confucian philosophy it has come to be an imprtant element of traditionial chinese religion, just like daoism, so much so that for many chinese it is hard confucian philosophy sperated from chinese religion. still you are right in that confucian philosophy is not a religion in its own right and can be adopted, and modified to fit into many cultures and religions.
baimeng1 4 months ago
@baimeng1 if Confucius wanted a religion he would have done so, but in his wisdom he knew it was to become an institutional item and therefore a partisan notion, that which his teachings go against.
If one was to read what he was saying they would understand his words were absolutes, without personal interpretation and therefore without dogma.
zoticus1 3 months ago
@zoticus1 yes, but the absorption of other beliefs or rather the absorption of confucian ideals in to other beliefs held by the chinese came early on with confucianism becoming the state philosophy/ religion. which created what you can call popular confucianism, with heavens, hells, gods, ect. all for the masses and had gone on for many centuries in china & east asia, thats why confucianism is such a big part of chinese religion and religion of all east asian cultuers.
baimeng1 3 months ago
@zoticus1 It is a religion. There are books that are to confucianism as the Bile to the christians. There are temples of confucianism. There are series of rituals of confucianism. There is the cult of ancestors. There is the belief in the Mandate of Heaven. And confucianism is more than just a religion. It is also a philosophy, and a ethical system. I think that Xinzhong Yao perfectly describes that phenomen in his book's and lectures.
TheMalar 3 months ago
@TheMalar i don't think calling confucianism a religion is correct, rather we should say that it is a facet of traditional chinese religion much like daoism is. what i mean is that for us chinese confucianism, daoism, buddhism are all major asspects of chinese culture and spirituality and aside from buddhism neither daoism nor confucianism colud stand on thiere own as religions with out the use of older chinese religious beliefs.
baimeng1 3 months ago
@baimeng1 Yes, but we still call christianity or judaism a religion, not a facet of Middle East religions. They also are based on older beliefs like the cult of Amon or zoroastrianism.
TheMalar 3 months ago
@TheMalar yes, but they can stand on their own as sperate religions, something that confucianism and daoism can't with out the support of traditional chinese beliefs, values, ect. if we take away these beliefs then neither confucianism nor daoism would be relgions just philosophies. you have to keep in mind that confucianism wasn't a religion at all untill much later on when the cult of kong fusi became state mandate, and the rise of neo-confucianism came about.
baimeng1 3 months ago
@baimeng1 But even when Confucius was still alive he talked about the cult of the ancestors, the sacrifices for the ancestors, the confucianism had it's books of worship- like the "Yijing", "Shu" or "Li". Of corse it was based on the earlier beliefs, but is Islam not based on christianity and christianity on judaism? Can christianity exist without the Old Testament?
TheMalar 3 months ago
@TheMalar this wasn't in my inbox, so sorry for the late reply.
anecestor cults, the classics, and the tradtion of bulding altars and shrines to great figures all predated confucianism, and confucian thinkers supported these tradtions since honoring the past was seen as very important. it wasn't long before they became bound to each like platonism and judhaism, and much later with christianity.
baimeng1 3 months ago
@baimeng1 I presonally agree with the definition that a religion is a ethical system built upon a list o virtues, fostered by a series of rituals that combines the followers of thouse virtues in a community. And I personally think that this definition fits confucianism and many more asian religions.
TheMalar 3 months ago
@TheMalar true, but confucianism and daoism are not seen as religions on theire own by chinese peoples for the most part, they are parts of a whole that togther form chinese religion.
baimeng1 3 months ago
@baimeng1 That I can not confront because I don't know the view of chinese people.
TheMalar 3 months ago
ANYTHING that trigger violent is evil. Confucius i think the only understanding that against it.
moistfaucet 4 months ago
If Any one searching a way of life , GOD and heaven. Confucius is the best, it is simply non-violent way of understanding compare to Muslim, Jews, and Christian.
moistfaucet 4 months ago
about 禮 Li, the meaning "rituel' is not original meaning of this word. In the age of confucius, it meant a systeme of normes about politics, ethic etc.
AKDGsonic 4 months ago
the confucianisme is not a reglion at all. what a basical mistake!
AKDGsonic 4 months ago
@AKDGsonic I know, then again this is analyzed just trough western culture (USA).
garcia0137 3 months ago
@garcia0137 so do correct this false view of USA culture is the job should be done
AKDGsonic 3 months ago
This is way too analising.. How can you say Confucianism is un-American? What constitutes as "American"? White, middle class, well educated?
Confucianism isn't perfect but it's a hell of a lot better then Christianity and Islam, where their followers sometimes force their religion upon others and go on religious wars (Jihad/Crusades).
chinesemusicDJ 9 months ago 12
@chinesemusicDJ he was refering that western societies are individualists, and confusionism is colectivists
msalazarx 6 months ago
@chinesemusicDJ lol the us is corrupt as fuck and ur living ur life blind. open your mind b4 u speak
newelvestr 5 months ago
@newelvestr
Which part of what I said has pissed you off? Saying that Christianity and Islam is rubbish?
chinesemusicDJ 5 months ago
Comment removed
newelvestr 5 months ago
@chinesemusicDJ Confucianism is so un-American, go take a basic worlds religions class. America is all about sense of ones self. Being American out of ignorance is following christianity. Confucianism is not.
Secyrb 4 months ago
@Secyrb well i agree with you in that western societies do value the individual more so than the community, even more then family to an extent, but confucian ethics can help bulid stronger social and family bonds even with in the frame work of christianity just as it has helped to shape buddhism, shinto, ect, in east asia.
baimeng1 4 months ago
@chinesemusicDJ Very true, all the world's religions just essentially teach the same morals, morals that should be taught even with a lack of religion
caboose176545 4 months ago
@chinesemusicDJ
Jihad is not religious. it is "a personal struggle".
The crusade is nothing more than history being written by the victor.
In the west people have spoken words that do not directly translate and they slant and demonize cultures they do not understand.
It would be beneficial to understand that in which you speak,lest you make a fool of yourself.
zoticus1 3 months ago
@zoticus1
I understand that the crusades and Jihads have killed millions, what else is there to understand? Are you talking in a general sense or are you directing that whole tirade of being a fool at me?
chinesemusicDJ 3 months ago
@chinesemusicDJ I'm not sure if you heard the interview in the right context but when he says Confucianism is un-American, he's criticizing American individualism and praising Confucianism. I'm also not for religions that force their beliefs on others but whether as a philosophy or religion, Confucianism, particularly neo-Confucianism, is also guilty of religious persecution, particularly of rooting out Buddhism, Taoism, and animism from society.
krnbeasty 2 months ago
@chinesemusicDJ since when has america been described as white? lol don't make me lough!
Nightberrii 1 month ago
@chinesemusicDJ That was kind of the point he was making.
mgsbtardis 1 month ago
@chinesemusicDJ
well educated? have you seen ANY reports of what those American schools are pumping out these days.
MrDexxtah 1 month ago
@chinesemusicDJ "American" =/= well educated :D or =/= well informed
majmunko23 1 month ago
@chinesemusicDJ Jihad is not holy war
MastaMattv2 1 month ago
@MastaMattv2 hahah you know whats up from Mr.Watson
dfaiola18 1 month ago
@dfaiola18 what the fuck domn haha
MastaMattv2 1 month ago
@MastaMattv2 what the problem?
dfaiola18 1 month ago
@MastaMattv2 "Jihad is not holy war "
Doesn't it bother you that the first 500 years of so of Islamic Imperialism is one continuous piece of evidence demonstrating that you are wrong? Including Mohammed's own practices and how the ideal of martyrdom is pushed in the Qur'an?
I mean, it's obvious that you have no clue what you're talking about, I'm just wondering how it's possible to live with that kind of cognitive dissonance.
Gnomefro 1 month ago
@Gnomefro It's self evidenct your a numerous amount of things. A ego maniac. an online troll, A victim of bullying,someone who loves to redundantly use wikipedia and thesaurusdotcom , and suggests herself be a genious, where as in the real world Your undereducated and inbred. Jihad means struggle, Not what ever osama bin laden says it means. This can also be bred into a vareity of arguments, Argueing that the bible , the qur'an is actually a parable , and not supposed to be taken literal
MastaMattv2 1 month ago
@Gnomefro but for the moral standard. I mean its obvious your mundane and highly stupid , I'm just wondering how it's possible that you can read a coupple of articles online and run around thinking your a doctor of philosophy in theology. It's pretty obvious that anyone who really knows what there talking about like a Dr. in theology , Could easily dimiinish your whole little argument. Please don't comment on my spelling , I don't feel obligated, If i felt you were worth the time i would
MastaMattv2 1 month ago
@chinesemusicDJ He's not talking about American religion. He's talking about the general Western zeitgeist that implies that everyone is equal, and have the same opportunities.
sinbysin666 2 weeks ago
Thank god the lady commentator asked the last question!
He shouldn't translate "Li" （禮） as ritual.
.
sevenknots 9 months ago
@sevenknots you are right "Li" actually means "zhou Li" (周礼). It is a form of political inequality (天子， 诸侯， 大夫， 庶民, 奴隶). During Western Zhou there were very strict political caste system.
在西周时规定了森严的等级制度,天子为最高一层,下面依次为诸侯,卿大夫和士,士是统治阶级里最低的一层.士下面就是平民,平民下面是广大的奴隶
HanChinese1 8 months ago
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For anyone who desires the truth, please check out the scribd website that is listed on my channel.
DreamsofMajesty 10 months ago
Very insightful...
MrWhatsthatyousaid 10 months ago 4
Thank you so much for posting. I really enjoyed this! :)
UsedNeedles 1 year ago