"We dismiss a bunch of Gods because they are not believable, we accept one because he is" You can't see that all believers think that exact thought about their particular God/Gods? Because that's the crux of the argument...
@STRvideos You're fighting a losing battle my friend. Your faith is the superstition of 1st century illiterates. As people become more educated, and learn how to think critically, they're realizing how ridiculous your arguments are.
Where do you stand on the Old Testament? Do you believe it to be the word of your god? Or do you believe that the New Testament pretty much wiped out the Old Testament? If not, you do understand that there's many things in the Old Testament that were not truthful or was a lie? Do you have plenty of excuses for the Old Testament? Read KJV Genesis 2:17 and 3:3 and tell me that it wasn't a lie.
Atheist's dismiss all the thousands of gods man has imagined, just as you dismiss the other 99.9%. It's just that simple. There is no empirical evidence any gods have ever existed. If you're in possession of empirical evidence that supports the existence of any god/s, I suggest you present said evidence to the scientific community for per review.
@cosmos11 Wait a minute you crazy atheist you. Atheists are looking for a way to dismiss God once and for all, and to that end they employ scientific findings and incorporate their own interpretations, which can easily be refuted. The empirical evidence is that there is a God, not the other way around.
@MrItchyElbow For the moment I will ignore your character attack and ask the obvious question. Can you state your empirical (testable) evidence and cite your sources? It seems clear to me that you lack the understanding of empirical evidence, so before you make a total ass of yourself, check the definition. The theist has also rejected every god, save one. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours....
@cosmos11 Empirical evidence, the universe exists, life exists. Science beyond fiction has no other evidence to presuppose the existence for either. Probability factors provide evidence against the mutation of cells past to the point of intelligent beings (us). All genetic studies include probability into their conclusions. The very fact that a cell/virus came into existence with all of the abilities to reproduce is beyond sciences ability to reproduce.
@MrItchyElbow Because they exist is not empirical evidence that your god does. Are you so narrow minded that your only explanation for these to exist is your imaginary god? This is what's called the god of the gaps fallacy. Understanding the scientific method may help you. And though you theists love to change points, lets work on one fallacy at a time. If you had empirical evidence for your deity, theology would not be considered metaphysics, and would make the point of this video mute.
@cosmos11 I'm sorry, but what explanation do you have? I've heard your big fantastic accident that keeps improving itself, hogwash. You have no explanation for the existence of everything, that's what atheists are looking for that fantastical theory that does not involve God, but is completely provable. I hate to be another of those endless people to tell you, but here it is, that theory does not exist. And you yourself by insulting him claim his existence. Find another line of work.
@MrItchyElbow I'm okay with not having all the answers, but saying 'god did it' explains nothing? It's a shrug of the shoulders, an 'I dunno' dressed up in spirituality and ritual. If someone credits something to his god, generally what it means is that they haven't a clue, so they're attributing it to an unreachable, unknowable sky-fairy outside of nature. What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the wish to find out, which is the exact opposite.
@cosmos11 Then why do you assume that God does not exist? You don't have all the answers. You can't rule out God, you just do without any logic at all. Where's your intellectual honesty?
@MrItchyElbow Belief is not knowledge. You don't believe because you know, rather because you have a deep seated need to believe. The difference is that you think you know but have no empirical evidence, and I'm comfortable with not having all the answers. Where is your honesty? You assume other gods don't exist, save one, and I go one god further, get it? Understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, and you'll understand why I dismiss yours. Don't be a hypocrite.
@cosmos11 Narrow minded - that is not me. The fact is that I have looked at your useless theories and have found all of them wanting. If I missed something please enlighten me, where's the empirical evidence that God does not exist? Or are you basing your belief on your faith that you will find some? Here, I'll get you started, the universe exists because ..., now fill in the blank. Life exists because.... fill in the blank. Easy, get to it.
@MrItchyElbow To say you have considered science and found it wanting but find the writings of a two thousand year old book by ignorant goat herders supplies you all the answers, defines being narrow minded! Where is your evidence that all other gods don't exist? Why do you dismiss all other possible gods if you can't disprove them? Let me explain again, I'm comfortable with not having all the answers! Get It? It's theists' who think they have answers, but don't. Belief is not knowledge.
@evensgrey I'm sorry, where's your evidence? You already have mine, or do you not believe that the universe exists? I hear you guys sayin' how simple it is to come up with theories about how it all began. "Yup, we atheists can tell you for certain that we don't know how it happened but it was most definitely an accident without a cause that just keeps improving itself." Isn't that right? Hahahaha
@MrItchyElbow So you freely admit that your previous claims of having and presenting evidence that the blood-soaked demon you worship actually exists were nothing more than intentional fraud.
@MrItchyElbow You forgot to use the word 'evidence' in a manner in any way connected with the evidence you demand that you have but repeatedly refuse to make any actually statement of. So far, your complete 'evidence' consists of lying about sane people.
@evensgrey What failure, the failure to see the answers that you provide about how things began. Apparently, how things began doesn't rate highly in atheist books. The how did everything begin has to be more complicated than "In the beginning God..." Well, by examining creation, science finds out much about how creation works, and is put together, not simple. Science, though, cannot tell you how it all began. Science is incomplete and by the looks of things, running out of time. Tick tock.
@MrItchyElbow You forgot to specify what you mean by 'begin', for the obvious reason of wanting to always be able to move the goal posts somewhere else when you get the explanation of any specific beginning.
What are you hallucinating that causes you to randomly assume that there's any indication of the universe coming to an end in the near future?
@evensgrey What are you hallucinating that causes you to randomly assume that there's any indication of the universe coming to an end in the near future?
Perhaps you are burying your head in the sand. The world that we live in is not exactly holding up to well. What with pollution and global warming our species is going to find itself fighting even harder than it ever has in the past to survive. Tick Tock
@evensgrey This one: You forgot to use the word 'evidence' in a manner in any way connected with the evidence you demand that you have but repeatedly refuse to make any actually statement of.
@MrItchyElbow did you write it in invisible ink? And I have not made any claims so how do you suggest I provide evidence, and what am I providing it for, are you on drugs?
@TheTomtompiper Oh yeah, maybe you should read the other comments. As far as your claims, I guess you didn't, you just pumped yourself into the dialog. I'm assuming you agree with evensgrey, but since it is an assumption why don't you enlighten me about your stance on this topic. If you say you don't care if there is a god? That's catching among the atheist community. It's a form of retreat and let's see what they do if we taunt them enough kind of maneuver.
@MrItchyElbow Personally I'm agnostic as to the chance that their may be a God, but Atheist to your God as there is not one shred of evidence for him. You claim to have presented some, but I have looked and cannot find one jot, one iota, so maybe you can elucidate, enlighten me. I await your citations and links with baited breath, yours faithfully TheTomtompiper.
-the reason I reject all of these other gods... is because I have no good reason to believe any of those gods exist but I do have good reason to believe the God of the Bible exists.-
Please tell me your ‘good reason’for the God of the Bible’s existence and how does that evidence prove superior to a similar type of evidence for the existence of any other God or gods. For instance, Holy Book 1 is just as good evidence as Holy Book 2. So, ‘good reason’ is not that I accept 1 and reject 2.
sigh...... I do not know why I was not able to come with something as clear and powerful as a response like that!.... Love you clear think Brother!.... Keep up the good work.... can't wait for your next Radio STR podcast!
‘One less God’ is an appeal to consistency. Most Christians (well, everyone including non-Christians really) don't apply the same standard to their own de jure beliefs as they do to other beliefs. By pointing out the double standard, we can perhaps get people to consider whether their beliefs are really justified where they might otherwise not. It isn't a valid argument against God, of course, but it's not meant to be (not that atheists don't use it that way, just that they shouldn't).
@sashavboyd "....Most Christians (well, everyone including non-Christians really) don't apply the same standard to their own de jure beliefs as they do to other beliefs...." the same goes for atheists. So how does one less god apply to inconsistancy?
@girtkaz I said that it applies to atheists, so I'm not sure why you pointed that out... The inconsistency is in being credulous and rationalizing problems in favored possibilities versus dismissing other possibilities based on similar flaws (i.e., confirmation bias). As I said, I don't consider ‘one less God’ an argument, but a pre-rational appeal to consistency: ‘Apply the same standard to your own religion as you do to others’.
@sashavboyd then why should it be supposed that christianity fails the test. actually argument of one less god is inacurate as teists are reformists(correcting flaws not denying) of other deities so it is not believing in one less God it is about what do you believe about God. So i see inconsitancy on atheist part with this argument.
@girtkaz Fails what test? I didn't mention a test. And I said that I don't consider it an argument, twice, so I get the feeling that you're just trying to pick a fight here rather than make any genuine points. You can do that if you think it's the right thing to do, but whatever reality happens to be true, you'll never know if you never seriously challenge the things you assume.
As for inconsistency, yes, atheists are inconsistent. So are theists. And deists. And all humans. Go figure.
@sashavboyd fight is not my intent. I stated that - one less God argument is demonstration of atheist hipocrisy not the teist inconsitancy. The test is of measuring every worldview with the same measure - I find Christianity superior by results of the test not by my personal feelings.
@sashavboyd "As for inconsistency, yes, atheists are inconsistent. So are theists. And deists. And all humans. Go figure." that is the point I do not agree with you.
The thing is there is no more evidence to support your god then any other.
Now if you think you have evidence and good reason to believe, then fine show me. I am willing to listen, but so far all the evidence any religious person have given me have not been convincing in the slightest. It all boils down to logical fallacies, hearsay, personal experience or in some cases even outright lies.
According to you, atheists "don't address the evidence." Well... Fork it over. You fork over some evidence, we'll address it. Good luck :-) Your predecessors have failed to give evidence for 2000 years (jesus) and 5000 years (god of the jews).
@indignant99 "....Your predecessors have failed to give evidence for 2000 years (jesus)..." just a question - why does it took more than 1700 years for someone to come up with the idea that Jesus never existed? ".... and 5000 years (god of the jews)." where did you get that number?
Darkwing, that is what I wanted to hear. Talk about the proof and evidence you have when you are claiming that a god exists. Otherwise your claim cannot be proven, either for or against.
There's no good reason your god is any more real then all the other gods out there. Your evidence is no better than their evidence YET......you deem yours is correct. It's rather funny to get the responses from varies religions, they all say the same thing....their god is true and all others are false. I bet if you were born in the Mideast your god would be a different god than the one you have now and you'd be defending Allah instead. Think about it...it's all about your up-bringing.
@Yesica1993 How thoroughly have you examined the claims of Islam, Hinduism, Budism, Judaism, Sikhism, Juche, Spiritism, Baha'i, Jainism, Shinto, Cao Dai, Zoroastrianism, Tenrikyo, Paganism and Scientology?
1:49 "the god of the Jews" Not quite. The Jews seem to disagree on the Jesus thing. And if we lax the standards to allow Christians to claim ' the god of the Jews', we must also allow the Muslims and the Mormons, who have similar claims, not to mention the Israelites.
Is this pertinent? I think so. Religions recycle arguments & Ive heard the same claims used to defend different gods. They are unconvincing to both of us for most gods. I also find them unconvincing for yours.
It's not a question, but a response to Christians asking why we don't believe in any god. The Muslims, Hindus, people of many other religions have "evidence" for their Gods, they believe in them as much as you, but you are able to evaluate that evidence and say "no, that doesn't hold up." That's exactly how we feel about all Gods. It's an attempt to show you how we see your belief.
EVIDENCE??? You've been smoking a crack pipe. There is as much evidence for Zeus, Apollo, and any other god you can name, as there is for the god of the bible.
It makes a difference because if you're silly enough to believe in one imaginary sky fairy then you're silly enough to believe in them all!!!.
It's not a matter of "getting anything out of (the) admission", it's a statement to open your eyes and you aware that notions of god are of a multitude throughout history (and probably prehistory). Your version is just another. When viewed in perspective there's really nothing special about your god except that you've been indoctrinated to believe in it, as millions were indoctrinated to believe in their gods in the past. And their gods were just as real to them as yours is to you.
While I wouldn't use that exact argument, the reasoning behind it is that there are people claiming their reasoning and evidence to believe their gods exist is correct. There's the same depth to the arguments for all gods, yet Christians choose Yahweh.
AFAIK, every religion and theistic belief stands on the ground of faith. Any religion would need some outside support besides faith to raise it above all other religions. What would this support be for one particular denomination of Christianity?
You've stated that you have no reason to believe in any other gods but you DO have a reason to believe in the Christian god. However, you failed to state what that reason is! One would think that at that point, you would have taken the opportunity to strengthen your comment by giving the reason for your conviction.
We say it because we have looked at all the gods put forth by man and see no reason to believe in your god as any of the others. Can I ask why you do not believe that odin exists? But remember, any answer that you give can be applied to your god.
They are trying to say we are all atheists with regards to these other gods. An atheist at my school tried to make this claim in rhetoric class. There are two reasons, I think, they use this. One is to make people more open to the idea of atheism, and secondly because they have this misconception that God is basically just another god in the class of all other gods and that we should reject God for the same reason we reject all others. It's really a lazy argument presented by ignorant atheists.
@owchywawa These little sound bites of atheists are ridiculous indeed. It doesn't make one atheists with regards to other deities, it just means we are only monotheists, and not polytheists.
@1tmoch The idea that a stance of non-belief against a god, even if its by believers in a different god, is referred to as atheism harkens back to the early Christianities, where they were 'atheoi' because they didnt believe in the pantheon. Novel concept its not.
I think the phrase is often misused though. In fact, most theists don't disbelieve in other gods for the same reason as me, but because theyve committed to a dogma that shuns dissent and demonizes (literally!) opposing claims.
@owchywawa A good way to reply to this claim I think would be to ask someone if they believe in God period -regardless of religious ideologies and whatnot. Just use natural theology and the like to show them that the universe screams out for a creator. Then, once they're a theist (the underlying point of contention here), the rest is easy pickings. The hard part though is getting them to switch sides, especially if they think they've caught on to what you're doing lol.
haha, exactly that's the same thing i thought. i paused the video and gave myself a chance to answer the question. i said "umm, ok! you're just stating your beliefs." they're making a positive assertion ( i believe in) about a negative position (one less (0) god). it's supposed to sound short and wise but really falls apart when subjected to even casual scrutiny.
"We dismiss a bunch of Gods because they are not believable, we accept one because he is" You can't see that all believers think that exact thought about their particular God/Gods? Because that's the crux of the argument...
ransomdave 1 month ago
@STRvideos You're fighting a losing battle my friend. Your faith is the superstition of 1st century illiterates. As people become more educated, and learn how to think critically, they're realizing how ridiculous your arguments are.
WestonPDX100 3 months ago
you have no good reason for believing in your god. just because you DO believe... doesn't mean you have a good reason for doing so.
fukkensully 4 months ago
Greg is (in my opinion) the wisest, smartest thinker out there. Keep listening to his logic. It is very clear and compelling.
byroner 4 months ago
Where do you stand on the Old Testament? Do you believe it to be the word of your god? Or do you believe that the New Testament pretty much wiped out the Old Testament? If not, you do understand that there's many things in the Old Testament that were not truthful or was a lie? Do you have plenty of excuses for the Old Testament? Read KJV Genesis 2:17 and 3:3 and tell me that it wasn't a lie.
Atheistfor35yrs 4 months ago
Atheist's dismiss all the thousands of gods man has imagined, just as you dismiss the other 99.9%. It's just that simple. There is no empirical evidence any gods have ever existed. If you're in possession of empirical evidence that supports the existence of any god/s, I suggest you present said evidence to the scientific community for per review.
cosmos11 4 months ago
@cosmos11 I'm not sure why we should listen to what scientists have to say regarding the metaphysical.
2ceBorn 4 months ago
@2ceBorn You mean, "I'm not sure why we should listen to what scientists have to say regarding empirical evidence."
Or did you change the subject on purpose?
ghbacch 4 months ago
@cosmos11 Wait a minute you crazy atheist you. Atheists are looking for a way to dismiss God once and for all, and to that end they employ scientific findings and incorporate their own interpretations, which can easily be refuted. The empirical evidence is that there is a God, not the other way around.
MrItchyElbow 4 months ago
@MrItchyElbow For the moment I will ignore your character attack and ask the obvious question. Can you state your empirical (testable) evidence and cite your sources? It seems clear to me that you lack the understanding of empirical evidence, so before you make a total ass of yourself, check the definition. The theist has also rejected every god, save one. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours....
cosmos11 4 months ago
@cosmos11 Empirical evidence, the universe exists, life exists. Science beyond fiction has no other evidence to presuppose the existence for either. Probability factors provide evidence against the mutation of cells past to the point of intelligent beings (us). All genetic studies include probability into their conclusions. The very fact that a cell/virus came into existence with all of the abilities to reproduce is beyond sciences ability to reproduce.
Atheism even theoretically fails.
MrItchyElbow 4 months ago
@MrItchyElbow Because they exist is not empirical evidence that your god does. Are you so narrow minded that your only explanation for these to exist is your imaginary god? This is what's called the god of the gaps fallacy. Understanding the scientific method may help you. And though you theists love to change points, lets work on one fallacy at a time. If you had empirical evidence for your deity, theology would not be considered metaphysics, and would make the point of this video mute.
cosmos11 4 months ago
@cosmos11 I'm sorry, but what explanation do you have? I've heard your big fantastic accident that keeps improving itself, hogwash. You have no explanation for the existence of everything, that's what atheists are looking for that fantastical theory that does not involve God, but is completely provable. I hate to be another of those endless people to tell you, but here it is, that theory does not exist. And you yourself by insulting him claim his existence. Find another line of work.
MrItchyElbow 4 months ago
@MrItchyElbow I'm okay with not having all the answers, but saying 'god did it' explains nothing? It's a shrug of the shoulders, an 'I dunno' dressed up in spirituality and ritual. If someone credits something to his god, generally what it means is that they haven't a clue, so they're attributing it to an unreachable, unknowable sky-fairy outside of nature. What is wanted is not the will to believe, but the wish to find out, which is the exact opposite.
cosmos11 4 months ago
@cosmos11 Then why do you assume that God does not exist? You don't have all the answers. You can't rule out God, you just do without any logic at all. Where's your intellectual honesty?
MrItchyElbow 4 months ago
@MrItchyElbow Belief is not knowledge. You don't believe because you know, rather because you have a deep seated need to believe. The difference is that you think you know but have no empirical evidence, and I'm comfortable with not having all the answers. Where is your honesty? You assume other gods don't exist, save one, and I go one god further, get it? Understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, and you'll understand why I dismiss yours. Don't be a hypocrite.
cosmos11 4 months ago
@cosmos11 Narrow minded - that is not me. The fact is that I have looked at your useless theories and have found all of them wanting. If I missed something please enlighten me, where's the empirical evidence that God does not exist? Or are you basing your belief on your faith that you will find some? Here, I'll get you started, the universe exists because ..., now fill in the blank. Life exists because.... fill in the blank. Easy, get to it.
MrItchyElbow 4 months ago
@MrItchyElbow To say you have considered science and found it wanting but find the writings of a two thousand year old book by ignorant goat herders supplies you all the answers, defines being narrow minded! Where is your evidence that all other gods don't exist? Why do you dismiss all other possible gods if you can't disprove them? Let me explain again, I'm comfortable with not having all the answers! Get It? It's theists' who think they have answers, but don't. Belief is not knowledge.
cosmos11 4 months ago
@MrItchyElbow You forgot to provide evidence that your blood-soaked genocidal demon exists.
evensgrey 4 months ago 2
@evensgrey No, I didn't, you just don't accept it.
MrItchyElbow 4 months ago
@MrItchyElbow When did you hallucinate presenting evidence and what drug caused that hallucination?
evensgrey 4 months ago
@evensgrey I'm sorry, where's your evidence? You already have mine, or do you not believe that the universe exists? I hear you guys sayin' how simple it is to come up with theories about how it all began. "Yup, we atheists can tell you for certain that we don't know how it happened but it was most definitely an accident without a cause that just keeps improving itself." Isn't that right? Hahahaha
MrItchyElbow 4 months ago
@MrItchyElbow So you freely admit that your previous claims of having and presenting evidence that the blood-soaked demon you worship actually exists were nothing more than intentional fraud.
evensgrey 4 months ago
@evensgrey I freely admit that you don't accept my evidence.
MrItchyElbow 4 months ago
@MrItchyElbow You forgot to use the word 'evidence' in a manner in any way connected with the evidence you demand that you have but repeatedly refuse to make any actually statement of. So far, your complete 'evidence' consists of lying about sane people.
evensgrey 4 months ago
@evensgrey You get what you give.
MrItchyElbow 4 months ago
@MrItchyElbow That explains why you only get your failure shown to you.
evensgrey 4 months ago
@evensgrey What failure, the failure to see the answers that you provide about how things began. Apparently, how things began doesn't rate highly in atheist books. The how did everything begin has to be more complicated than "In the beginning God..." Well, by examining creation, science finds out much about how creation works, and is put together, not simple. Science, though, cannot tell you how it all began. Science is incomplete and by the looks of things, running out of time. Tick tock.
MrItchyElbow 4 months ago
@MrItchyElbow You forgot to specify what you mean by 'begin', for the obvious reason of wanting to always be able to move the goal posts somewhere else when you get the explanation of any specific beginning.
What are you hallucinating that causes you to randomly assume that there's any indication of the universe coming to an end in the near future?
evensgrey 4 months ago
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@evensgrey What are you hallucinating that causes you to randomly assume that there's any indication of the universe coming to an end in the near future?
Perhaps you are burying your head in the sand. The world that we live in is not exactly holding up to well. What with pollution and global warming our species is going to find itself fighting even harder than it ever has in the past to survive. Tick Tock
MrItchyElbow 4 months ago
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Respond to this video... In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
MrItchyElbow 4 months ago
@evensgrey What? That doesn't make sense.
MrItchyElbow 4 months ago
@MrItchyElbow Which of my very simple, clear statements were you unable to understand?
evensgrey 4 months ago
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@evensgrey This one: You forgot to use the word 'evidence' in a manner in any way connected with the evidence you demand that you have but repeatedly refuse to make any actually statement of.
Oh, you mean 'evidence' not evidence. What?
MrItchyElbow 4 months ago
Can you state your Evidence, and cite sources?
TheTomtompiper 4 months ago
@TheTomtompiper Already did that, where's yours.
MrItchyElbow 4 months ago
@MrItchyElbow did you write it in invisible ink? And I have not made any claims so how do you suggest I provide evidence, and what am I providing it for, are you on drugs?
TheTomtompiper 4 months ago
@TheTomtompiper Oh yeah, maybe you should read the other comments. As far as your claims, I guess you didn't, you just pumped yourself into the dialog. I'm assuming you agree with evensgrey, but since it is an assumption why don't you enlighten me about your stance on this topic. If you say you don't care if there is a god? That's catching among the atheist community. It's a form of retreat and let's see what they do if we taunt them enough kind of maneuver.
MrItchyElbow 4 months ago
@MrItchyElbow Personally I'm agnostic as to the chance that their may be a God, but Atheist to your God as there is not one shred of evidence for him. You claim to have presented some, but I have looked and cannot find one jot, one iota, so maybe you can elucidate, enlighten me. I await your citations and links with baited breath, yours faithfully TheTomtompiper.
TheTomtompiper 4 months ago
-the reason I reject all of these other gods... is because I have no good reason to believe any of those gods exist but I do have good reason to believe the God of the Bible exists.-
Please tell me your ‘good reason’for the God of the Bible’s existence and how does that evidence prove superior to a similar type of evidence for the existence of any other God or gods. For instance, Holy Book 1 is just as good evidence as Holy Book 2. So, ‘good reason’ is not that I accept 1 and reject 2.
apeek7 4 months ago
sigh...... I do not know why I was not able to come with something as clear and powerful as a response like that!.... Love you clear think Brother!.... Keep up the good work.... can't wait for your next Radio STR podcast!
hamy72 4 months ago
‘One less God’ is an appeal to consistency. Most Christians (well, everyone including non-Christians really) don't apply the same standard to their own de jure beliefs as they do to other beliefs. By pointing out the double standard, we can perhaps get people to consider whether their beliefs are really justified where they might otherwise not. It isn't a valid argument against God, of course, but it's not meant to be (not that atheists don't use it that way, just that they shouldn't).
sashavboyd 4 months ago
@sashavboyd "....Most Christians (well, everyone including non-Christians really) don't apply the same standard to their own de jure beliefs as they do to other beliefs...." the same goes for atheists. So how does one less god apply to inconsistancy?
girtkaz 4 months ago
@girtkaz "the same goes for atheists."
In what way?
DarkEmergence 4 months ago
@DarkEmergence The most atheists don't apply the same standart to their own de jure beliefs as they do to other beliefs.
girtkaz 4 months ago
@girtkaz Yes, but "why do you think that?" is what I was trying to ask.
DarkEmergence 4 months ago
@girtkaz I said that it applies to atheists, so I'm not sure why you pointed that out... The inconsistency is in being credulous and rationalizing problems in favored possibilities versus dismissing other possibilities based on similar flaws (i.e., confirmation bias). As I said, I don't consider ‘one less God’ an argument, but a pre-rational appeal to consistency: ‘Apply the same standard to your own religion as you do to others’.
sashavboyd 4 months ago
@sashavboyd then why should it be supposed that christianity fails the test. actually argument of one less god is inacurate as teists are reformists(correcting flaws not denying) of other deities so it is not believing in one less God it is about what do you believe about God. So i see inconsitancy on atheist part with this argument.
girtkaz 4 months ago
@girtkaz Fails what test? I didn't mention a test. And I said that I don't consider it an argument, twice, so I get the feeling that you're just trying to pick a fight here rather than make any genuine points. You can do that if you think it's the right thing to do, but whatever reality happens to be true, you'll never know if you never seriously challenge the things you assume.
As for inconsistency, yes, atheists are inconsistent. So are theists. And deists. And all humans. Go figure.
sashavboyd 4 months ago
@sashavboyd fight is not my intent. I stated that - one less God argument is demonstration of atheist hipocrisy not the teist inconsitancy. The test is of measuring every worldview with the same measure - I find Christianity superior by results of the test not by my personal feelings.
girtkaz 4 months ago
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@sashavboyd "As for inconsistency, yes, atheists are inconsistent. So are theists. And deists. And all humans. Go figure." that is the point I do not agree with you.
girtkaz 4 months ago
The thing is there is no more evidence to support your god then any other.
Now if you think you have evidence and good reason to believe, then fine show me. I am willing to listen, but so far all the evidence any religious person have given me have not been convincing in the slightest. It all boils down to logical fallacies, hearsay, personal experience or in some cases even outright lies.
ybra 4 months ago
According to you, atheists "don't address the evidence." Well... Fork it over. You fork over some evidence, we'll address it. Good luck :-) Your predecessors have failed to give evidence for 2000 years (jesus) and 5000 years (god of the jews).
indignant99 4 months ago
@indignant99 "....Your predecessors have failed to give evidence for 2000 years (jesus)..." just a question - why does it took more than 1700 years for someone to come up with the idea that Jesus never existed? ".... and 5000 years (god of the jews)." where did you get that number?
girtkaz 4 months ago
Darkwing, that is what I wanted to hear. Talk about the proof and evidence you have when you are claiming that a god exists. Otherwise your claim cannot be proven, either for or against.
Hobagification 4 months ago
There's no good reason your god is any more real then all the other gods out there. Your evidence is no better than their evidence YET......you deem yours is correct. It's rather funny to get the responses from varies religions, they all say the same thing....their god is true and all others are false. I bet if you were born in the Mideast your god would be a different god than the one you have now and you'd be defending Allah instead. Think about it...it's all about your up-bringing.
Atheistfor35yrs 4 months ago
@Atheistfor35yrs How thoroughly have you examined the claims of Christ and the Bible?
Yesica1993 4 months ago
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@Yesica1993 How thoroughly have you examined the claims of Islam, Hinduism, Budism, Judaism, Sikhism, Juche, Spiritism, Baha'i, Jainism, Shinto, Cao Dai, Zoroastrianism, Tenrikyo, Paganism and Scientology?
ybra 4 months ago
@Atheistfor35yrs Christians, Jews and Muslims all believe in the same god. Only their doctines are different.
AtheistEutopia 4 months ago
1:49 "the god of the Jews" Not quite. The Jews seem to disagree on the Jesus thing. And if we lax the standards to allow Christians to claim ' the god of the Jews', we must also allow the Muslims and the Mormons, who have similar claims, not to mention the Israelites.
Is this pertinent? I think so. Religions recycle arguments & Ive heard the same claims used to defend different gods. They are unconvincing to both of us for most gods. I also find them unconvincing for yours.
Cafeeine 4 months ago
It's not a question, but a response to Christians asking why we don't believe in any god. The Muslims, Hindus, people of many other religions have "evidence" for their Gods, they believe in them as much as you, but you are able to evaluate that evidence and say "no, that doesn't hold up." That's exactly how we feel about all Gods. It's an attempt to show you how we see your belief.
DarkEmergence 4 months ago
EVIDENCE??? You've been smoking a crack pipe. There is as much evidence for Zeus, Apollo, and any other god you can name, as there is for the god of the bible.
It makes a difference because if you're silly enough to believe in one imaginary sky fairy then you're silly enough to believe in them all!!!.
AtheistEutopia 4 months ago
It's not a matter of "getting anything out of (the) admission", it's a statement to open your eyes and you aware that notions of god are of a multitude throughout history (and probably prehistory). Your version is just another. When viewed in perspective there's really nothing special about your god except that you've been indoctrinated to believe in it, as millions were indoctrinated to believe in their gods in the past. And their gods were just as real to them as yours is to you.
AtheistEutopia 4 months ago
While I wouldn't use that exact argument, the reasoning behind it is that there are people claiming their reasoning and evidence to believe their gods exist is correct. There's the same depth to the arguments for all gods, yet Christians choose Yahweh.
AFAIK, every religion and theistic belief stands on the ground of faith. Any religion would need some outside support besides faith to raise it above all other religions. What would this support be for one particular denomination of Christianity?
MrNoepoe 4 months ago
You've stated that you have no reason to believe in any other gods but you DO have a reason to believe in the Christian god. However, you failed to state what that reason is! One would think that at that point, you would have taken the opportunity to strengthen your comment by giving the reason for your conviction.
darkwingvideos 4 months ago
We say it because we have looked at all the gods put forth by man and see no reason to believe in your god as any of the others. Can I ask why you do not believe that odin exists? But remember, any answer that you give can be applied to your god.
Hobagification 4 months ago
They are trying to say we are all atheists with regards to these other gods. An atheist at my school tried to make this claim in rhetoric class. There are two reasons, I think, they use this. One is to make people more open to the idea of atheism, and secondly because they have this misconception that God is basically just another god in the class of all other gods and that we should reject God for the same reason we reject all others. It's really a lazy argument presented by ignorant atheists.
owchywawa 4 months ago
@owchywawa These little sound bites of atheists are ridiculous indeed. It doesn't make one atheists with regards to other deities, it just means we are only monotheists, and not polytheists.
1tmoch 4 months ago
@1tmoch The idea that a stance of non-belief against a god, even if its by believers in a different god, is referred to as atheism harkens back to the early Christianities, where they were 'atheoi' because they didnt believe in the pantheon. Novel concept its not.
I think the phrase is often misused though. In fact, most theists don't disbelieve in other gods for the same reason as me, but because theyve committed to a dogma that shuns dissent and demonizes (literally!) opposing claims.
Cafeeine 4 months ago
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@owchywawa A good way to reply to this claim I think would be to ask someone if they believe in God period -regardless of religious ideologies and whatnot. Just use natural theology and the like to show them that the universe screams out for a creator. Then, once they're a theist (the underlying point of contention here), the rest is easy pickings. The hard part though is getting them to switch sides, especially if they think they've caught on to what you're doing lol.
M3PanoS 4 months ago
haha, exactly that's the same thing i thought. i paused the video and gave myself a chance to answer the question. i said "umm, ok! you're just stating your beliefs." they're making a positive assertion ( i believe in) about a negative position (one less (0) god). it's supposed to sound short and wise but really falls apart when subjected to even casual scrutiny.
wirechair 4 months ago