@gjc82071 makes a good point. My teenage daughters who are definitely not into mountain music or bluegrass or country and western both enjoy the movie and are happy to sit with me for the replays !! This upload introduced me to the movie, but, I had to purchase a copy as the DVD was not available for rent - in Australia. So thanks for the upload, great movie and Iris is a wonderful singer.
Is this set near the Appalachian Trail ? Im from England, but in 3 years i will go walk that trail, got a few other things im going to do before that though. Ive done a lot of Hiking in Britain, walked half of Scotland, But i imagine ill die a happy person once ive Hiked the Appalachian trail. It would be one hell of an adventure. Sure would be nice to meet the American country people and see thier culture. :)
@MrForrest1991 This is from the movie Songcatcher, which was set in western North Carolina in 1907, so the locale would definitely be in the vicinity of where the Appalachian trail is now. Unfortunately, I don't know how much authentic mountain music you willl hear nowadays; the airwaves are filled with synthetic "country" music that's a fair distance from these roots. But I hope you enjoy your visit and that everything works out for you.
Holy crap. I've seen this movie several times, and though I just discovered Iris due to her being on the True Grit soundtrack, I never realized it was her in this movie. Then again, how could I if I just discovered her 3 days ago? Anyway, she has a very unique voice. She was a good choice for & played this role very well (her being a "real" singer & all). BTW, this movie was excellent. 4 star all the way. Unfortunately it was obscure/underrated. I recommend it to any true music lover
If you like mountain music, the Irish-Scottish-British influences behind them, and how it all morphed into bluegrass here (due largely to African-American influence), you just cannot miss this film. I agree with you totally--it was largely missed the first time around, but I'm always surprised to find out how many people have rented it, often repeatedly.
i'd like to ask for a special request for all the singers in this movie to record a cd that ppl could buy n enjoy! some characters n this film are really talented singers
@sweetilikethat There is a CD. It's the soundtrack... which is sooooo good. Love it. Bonus there are several songs on the CD that aren't in the movie performed by some fabulous stars or performing songs that are mentioned through the movie but were never hears like Two Sisters and Moonshiner. Also Emmy Rossum, the young girl in this movie, sings an original duet with Dolly Parton who wrote it after seeing some daily clip of her singing.
i love this song . im from sothern california , a city boy . i dont know what a song like this says to mt. culture but when i hear it i think of the pioneers who came to this nation and carved out a living with 2 hands and a back bone i love this song i know i already said it but it deserved to be said twice lol
Thes songs are part of my every day life. I am from the heart of Appalachia, southwest Virginia. These songs come from many diffrent cultures,Scots,Irish, English,Whales,Cherokee, and German, but when the came to the mountains they were reborn in a new light, with a new sound. They people of the mountains added the fiddle to the old style ballad songs,later to be accompanied by the African banjo,and the spanish guitar. In this melting pot of culture this new music evolve to be simply Appalachian
@moominpic Yes the fiddle did come over initially, but a lot of the old ballads were just solo vocal parts. still to this day we are just adding the insturmental to some old ballads, and a lot did have triditional scots irish sounds but to later to be changed to the appalachian sounds that we know now.
Yes there is some yodelling in appalachian music, but not so much in my area of swva more so in westren N.C. and yes it did come from the swiss. appalachia is a melting pot of culture. thank you
when i first come to this country in 1849 i saw many fair lovyer but nerver saw mine i view it all rouind me saw was quite alone me a poor stranger and a long way from home Fair the well to ol' mother, fair the well to father too I'm going for to ramble this wide world all through when I get weary, I'll sit down and cry think of my Saro, pretty Saro, my bride
@KatwalkKutie I Totally agree this also is my Fav part of this wonderfully made movie.I've seen Iris perform twice now & both times I was front & center of her stage.
She Absolutely takes my Breath away when I hear her sing this song & makes my Heart Beat Faster & Slower @ the same time when she's playing her piano while singing.She brought tears to my eyes when I saw her perform in Santa Cruz,Cali a few years ago.I keep hoping she'll come back Real REAL soon to San Jose,Cali.
This movie is great and so is this song. I love ballads. "Pretty Saro" and " Raglin Road" always work to put my niece and nephew to sleep when I sing to them. There is just something so great about these ballads that even after all these years they still evoke something in people. I especially love the fiddle music in this song.
One of our favorite scenes from this monumental film. How my heart pines for those mountains now destroyed for the coal they bore... Reminds me of my Daddy's Mama's side of the family and makes me proud.
many of these traditional songs were actually lost in the european lands they were born in, shunted aside by popular music of the day or changed beyond recognition from the original forms. but the scotch/english/welsh/irish settlers in the hills had preserved these songs close to their original formats. when the musicologists discovered this they took to the hills to record these for posterity. that's my understanding on it
@Sshelly34213 The Irish version was impacted by many more non-Irish cultures. It has certainly changed much more than the Appalachian version. The reason it sounds "very Appalachian" is because the songs are preserved in something closer to the original state.
If you listen to old Scottish, Irish, English folk songs, probably around where the original Pretty Saro originated, they don't sound anything like Appalachian folk music.
Appalachian folk music has a very distinct sound from that of old Irish, Scots, English version. The one known in Ireland today is most likely the closest version you're going to here in modern day.
Check out some songs like Nottamun Town, Banks or Moy.
@melarry Just the English style of singing is different from that of Appalachia. The distinct culture that developed in Appalachia due to hundreds of years of isolation from their original country.
Think of it as a "Galapagos Island" of folk culture. Sure it has things in common with Scots-Irish and English, but at the same time it is wholly unique.
I think it's highly unlikely that any original version of a folk song even exists there.
@melarry I'm not trying to be rude, I think this version is great too.
Most folk songs from Appalachia are vastly different than the folk songs that originated in Europe. I think this song is actually a perfect example of what I'm trying to say.
@Sshelly34213 It's a matter of what you call "Irish." If you insist on attaching it to the real estate, it's not. If you accept that the people own the term, no matter where they are, well ... Regardless, I really don't care. I'm just rather tired of Europhiles needing to belittle mountain music in terms of historical value. Yes, even those hillbillies are worthy.
@melarry Can you grow up and stop acting like you're a victim of racism? I live in the US genius. Do you really have to be that immature?
They're both Scots-Irish songs, when did I say they weren't? I never did and you're making that up. I simply stated that it is most likely that this version and many other Appalachian folk songs are more different from their original versions than similar. Why? because Appalachian developed its own separate culture from both the Brit Isles and the US.
@Sshelly34213 I'm not being "immature." I'm simply responding to your utterly indefensible post with a bit of whimsy and sarcasm. I'm a cultural anthropologist. I know something about culture dispersion patterns. There are no independent cultures. I also know arrogant quasi-academics when I encounter them on the Web. Go ahead and have the last word you will HAVE to have. This will be my last post to this now silly thread.
@melarry Oh and when did I ever belittle "mountain music?" You're being unnecessarily overly dramatic and hostile for no reason. Can you tell me why? People are constantly debating the origins of folk music, you have no clue where this song originated anymore than I do. It was written hundreds of years ago.
Interesting that you call it that considering the fact that Scotland, Ireland, and England all have mountainous regions. Now which "mountain music" are you referring to in particular?
@melarry The truth of the matter is that folk songs are, for the most part, anonymous. It is unsure where the original version of this song came about, it may not even be Irish/English/Scottish originally.
It is likely though, that if these immigrants came from Ireland with that song, that it probably came from their country of origin.
@Sshelly34213 Isn't there also the point that songs often had several tunes? Robert Burns wrote most of his songs to already existing tunes and it is not uncommon to find a song sung to a different tune. Also, many of the British/Irish ballads underwent 'clean-up' during collection.
@moominpic Of course they have several variants, but I was just wondering how the original version from Ireland itself sounded like. This is very Appalachian, holding out long notes, whereas in Ireland people would have been more lyrical, I can suggest some folk tunes to listen to if that doesn't make any sense. Type in Banks of Moy by Colm O Donnell and you'll see what I'm talking about. This is most likely a descendant of the song, which has other variants, rather than the original.
@Sshelly34213 I think the problem with looking at old songs is that many of them had different variants even before they were written down (Barbara Allen being 1 example). Plus, I'm not wholly sure about Ireland, but many traditions in Europe underwent a kind of "sanitation" during late 19th/early 20th C, when trad singers were encouraged to sing in a more "genteel" way for the urban middle classes. As I understand "Pretty saro" was an English song (but would have been in Ireland too)...
I'm interested in learning more about the features of Appalachian music. This long holding of the notes might be compared to Scottish (Gaelic) slow airs and laments and could be where it developed from. Do we know if the Scots settlers in Appalachians came from any particular area of Scotland specifically?
@moominpic Many of the traditional Scottish settlers of the Appalachians are Ulster Scots, also known as Scotch-Irish. Ulster is a region in Ireland which many Scots settled in. Appalachian music is a good mix of Scottish, Irish, and, never forget, Senegambian African heritage.
@DissidentDescendant Thanks. I studied in Scotland and Belfast, so interesting to know there were Ulster Scots in Appalachians. Of course, a lot of the "Irish songs" like "Peggy Gordon" were Scots songs originally.
@moominpic My ancestors first came from the Scottish highlands the Clan of McLoad, from there they went to the shores of Ireland to become ulster Scots, or Scots Irish, From there they came to America making their way into the wilderness of Southwest Virginia. The hard life lived here was made in blood, sweat, and tears, later to be conveyed into the music with such emotion. Check out my playlist Appalachia on my channel there should be a good variety of Appalachian ballads and tunes.
@appalachianbanjer The English were afraid to move into the hills, away from the protection of their navy. So they went to the scariest people they knew: the Scots-Irish, my ancestors.
"So," they said to our chief, "there's good bits and bad. You will have all the land to farm you want, and can pass it on to your children. But there will be no law there, except for what you can fight for. You will get no help from the crown. What do you say?"
@ImperialistRunningDo The English Wouldn't have been much help anyway, Patrick Ferguson proved that at Kings Mountain. His Prophecy came true, even god himself couldn't remove him from Kings Mountain, He is still buried there. You Can not fight Guerrilla warfare With Napoleonic Tactics.
@Sshelly34213 An example of a slow air/lament could be Barbara Dickson - MacCrimmon's Lament or Karen Matheson - My Father Sent Me to the House of Sorrow
@moominpic Barbara Dickson is lovely, I love her version of Skye Boat Song and Fine Flowers in the Valley. I think I've heard her version of MacCrimmon's lament, athough I am unfamiliar with Karen Matheson as well as the song My Father Sent Me to the House of Sorrow. Thanks for the suggestions.
@Sshelly34213 You're welcome. Both those tunes are on YT. Matheson is singer with a Scottish Gaelic band called Capercaille, as well as being a solo artist.
@moominpic Yea, her version is fantastic. There is quite a difference between traditional folk singing in the British Isles and traditional folk singing in the US. I wonder when exactly the two diverged in history.
@Sshelly34213 It's a great question. My wife works with traditional Polish singing and there is a clear line at some point where changes can be traced to when the urban intellectuals began teaching the village singers to sing more in a "western" style of singing to make it more acceptable to "educated" ears. I guess the Scots and Irish styles may have had similar processes, especially when writers like Moore began using folk motifs etc. I guess it never happened in the Appalachians too much.
This is true country music, music of the people from the woods. Not what people call country today and we wonder why we have lost our roots. This music truly speaks to your soul
wouldn't it be more correct to call it "Americana" music ? It has it's roots in the Scots and Irish traditions, but this is a unique style of it's own.
Yea, but that could be just a part of what Americana would encompass (yes/no). Any way, I'm just speculating here, I'm not an expert on this, just enjoy it. Cheers
That is because the Scots-Irish came to America and lived in the Appalachian mountains. They maintained the classic songs within the families and after generations of seclusion this is what was born. This beautiful music.
@st3ven83 Actually I think the seculusion allowed them to develop their own versions over time, if you listen to the Irish version by Danny Doyle, for example, it sounds absolutely nothing like this.
You appear to contradict yourself as you acknowlege that this music has roots; it can't be 'pure' and derive from older music at the same time. Whilst 'Bluegrass' and 'Country' are undeniably American musical forms, without the centuries old ballads and broadsides brought to the 'new world' from the 'old'....none of it would exist.
The people of the mountains deeply revered their ancestors. To insult the roots of the music would have been to insult their kin. The music has its roots in England and Ireland. It was definitely given its own character here but that tradition belongs as much to the mountain people as it does to the people of those lands. They are English and Scots-Irish people still --- as well as Americans.
@melarry lets not forget about Scotland. The music has it's roots in England,Scotland,Ireland, and for that matter you could add in Wales. I have spent the last 7 years traveling to the most remote regions of my home in the Appalachian Mntns. after watching Songcatcher.....the people i meet and the songs i hear strike me to the bone, they just dont make music like this nemore....
@AppalachiaPrincess I don't know how I forgot Scotland, seeing as how part of my family came from here. lol What a wonderful trip to take. I'm sure it was an amazing experience.
nice playing! were you playing it from memory or off a sheet? i've been trying to find a sheet for this piece that sounds like the one you're playing here but none of them do. i'm not a particularly good fiddle player (unless you count the bull fiddle) but i'd love to be able to play this
Really? Since that's Bruce Molsky in the scene why didn't he play the fiddle? I mean after all he's only known as one of the best old time fiddlers on the planet.
there are no words to describe the beauty of this, or what I feel when I listen to it. You and Iris gave the world a true gift with your participation in this amazing film. As the film says, "the ballads are a precious musical legacy", and I thank God that people like you recognize their stunning beauty and are willing to keep them alive. This is where American country music began, and people should always remember that. I love this film, and the soundtrack. Bravo!!!!
I've been a huge Iris DeMent fan for years and think that this was nicely done, but it seems that the time constraints of the movie forced the song to be shortened to the point of being unrecognizable as the same "Pretty Saro" that I grew up hearing my granny sing.
The song is about a man lamenting that his social class prevents him from having his true love...Saro won't have him because he's not a land-owning "free-holder"
Also, most versions I've heard say "1749", not "1849".
Mmm . . . might be poetic licence . . . 1849 (the potatoe famine in Ireland) would resonate with a modern audience more than 1749 (the aftermath of the Scottish rebellion of '45)
Now that was some type-casting there...:) All they had to do was throw some old dirty clothes on Iris....and "wahlah!!!!".......Inbred hillbilly with the cryptic voice of a swamp angel.....:)
The guy holding the fiddle is NOT a fiddle player but an actor playing along to a recording. Maybe the movie credits will mention who the "real" fiddler is
@gjc82071 makes a good point. My teenage daughters who are definitely not into mountain music or bluegrass or country and western both enjoy the movie and are happy to sit with me for the replays !! This upload introduced me to the movie, but, I had to purchase a copy as the DVD was not available for rent - in Australia. So thanks for the upload, great movie and Iris is a wonderful singer.
leighton1949 2 weeks ago
From one of my all-time favourite movies, "The Songcatcher". Beautiful, beautiful,
Gaff8132 3 weeks ago
I saw this movie twice but did not realize that was Iris.
xenaphile815 1 month ago
Is this set near the Appalachian Trail ? Im from England, but in 3 years i will go walk that trail, got a few other things im going to do before that though. Ive done a lot of Hiking in Britain, walked half of Scotland, But i imagine ill die a happy person once ive Hiked the Appalachian trail. It would be one hell of an adventure. Sure would be nice to meet the American country people and see thier culture. :)
MrForrest1991 3 months ago
@MrForrest1991 This is from the movie Songcatcher, which was set in western North Carolina in 1907, so the locale would definitely be in the vicinity of where the Appalachian trail is now. Unfortunately, I don't know how much authentic mountain music you willl hear nowadays; the airwaves are filled with synthetic "country" music that's a fair distance from these roots. But I hope you enjoy your visit and that everything works out for you.
neckronn99 2 months ago
Love it! This is the sort of Mountain Music that truly sends chills up your spine!!
Rwehappy2day 3 months ago
that was stunning...as iris always is! thanks for posting!!
TheWhatev33 4 months ago
Holy crap. I've seen this movie several times, and though I just discovered Iris due to her being on the True Grit soundtrack, I never realized it was her in this movie. Then again, how could I if I just discovered her 3 days ago? Anyway, she has a very unique voice. She was a good choice for & played this role very well (her being a "real" singer & all). BTW, this movie was excellent. 4 star all the way. Unfortunately it was obscure/underrated. I recommend it to any true music lover
gjc82071 4 months ago
@gjc82071
If you like mountain music, the Irish-Scottish-British influences behind them, and how it all morphed into bluegrass here (due largely to African-American influence), you just cannot miss this film. I agree with you totally--it was largely missed the first time around, but I'm always surprised to find out how many people have rented it, often repeatedly.
emncaity 3 months ago
The way they look at eachother at the end
KatwalkKutie 5 months ago
@KatwalkKutie
You can see the love for each other and the acceptance of their fate. They have sold out and are moving down the mountain.
fmlytracer 5 months ago
my sister was named after this song(:
SuperSonicSourD 6 months ago
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What an amazing movie!
shortdogginc 6 months ago
Love that old time sound..
muddyforkband 6 months ago
i'd like to ask for a special request for all the singers in this movie to record a cd that ppl could buy n enjoy! some characters n this film are really talented singers
sweetilikethat 6 months ago
@sweetilikethat There is a CD. It's the soundtrack... which is sooooo good. Love it. Bonus there are several songs on the CD that aren't in the movie performed by some fabulous stars or performing songs that are mentioned through the movie but were never hears like Two Sisters and Moonshiner. Also Emmy Rossum, the young girl in this movie, sings an original duet with Dolly Parton who wrote it after seeing some daily clip of her singing.
Gargess 6 months ago
we still sit and play lots of these songs here in sw va mountains.
MsCrazyhorselady 6 months ago 2
Anyone know what key this is in? is the bass string tuned up to an a
pit032 8 months ago
Iris DeMent is totally awesome!
dtruell 8 months ago 2
does anyone know the tuning for this song?
TheAustx 8 months ago
ive always loved this song
katievhoneychurch 9 months ago
Stunning.
flutterbyx79 10 months ago
Iris Dement is one of our greatest musical talents and one of the most under appreciated. Thank you Iris!
mevanhouten 11 months ago 7
i love this song . im from sothern california , a city boy . i dont know what a song like this says to mt. culture but when i hear it i think of the pioneers who came to this nation and carved out a living with 2 hands and a back bone i love this song i know i already said it but it deserved to be said twice lol
akillerofklngs 11 months ago
I play this tune. Beautiful.
crawfordviolin 1 year ago 5
@crawfordviolin i've been looking for a sheet for this for some time...any idea where i can find one for this version?
ShinGouki86 11 months ago 3
@ShinGouki86
I just learned it by ear. Its a very simple tune. Hum it first. Starts as a on the G string. Key of A minor. Second part is in G major, I believe.
crawfordviolin 11 months ago
@ShinGouki86 I think the intro bar is G#, A#, C#,G#,A#,C#,D#
im trying to learn it myself, this sounds right so far
FayeFaye30 6 months ago
How come this isn't a musical?
RapRnB4u 1 year ago
Thes songs are part of my every day life. I am from the heart of Appalachia, southwest Virginia. These songs come from many diffrent cultures,Scots,Irish, English,Whales,Cherokee, and German, but when the came to the mountains they were reborn in a new light, with a new sound. They people of the mountains added the fiddle to the old style ballad songs,later to be accompanied by the African banjo,and the spanish guitar. In this melting pot of culture this new music evolve to be simply Appalachian
appalachianbanjer 1 year ago
@appalachianbanjer Interesting. But didn't the fiddle come with the Scots/Irish initially?
Does yodelling happen in Appalachian music? I heard it was from Swiss migrants.
moominpic 11 months ago
@moominpic Yes the fiddle did come over initially, but a lot of the old ballads were just solo vocal parts. still to this day we are just adding the insturmental to some old ballads, and a lot did have triditional scots irish sounds but to later to be changed to the appalachian sounds that we know now.
Yes there is some yodelling in appalachian music, but not so much in my area of swva more so in westren N.C. and yes it did come from the swiss. appalachia is a melting pot of culture. thank you
appalachianbanjer 10 months ago
@appalachianbanjer Thank YOU! That's very interesting.
moominpic 10 months ago
we didnt get this film circulating in UK - why not? how odd?
I know the song from singing of SARA GREY
contemporary transatlantic ethnomusicologist, & musician (tutor/ mentor) from New Hampshire (living in scotland)
Breizh07 1 year ago
Love this song
kytrader007 1 year ago
Her voice, her environment, and her pride despite it, make this woman beautiful to behold in this scene.
roonalwazlib 1 year ago
Folk singing doesn't get any better than this.
Frailer46 1 year ago
Oh, isn't she dead on sexy?! Not to mention being a great singer and one of the best songwriters of our time.
daver852 1 year ago
And there in her lilywhite arms I'd lay there all night
and watch through them little wind'ers
for the dawning of day
lyssalovebugg 1 year ago 2
lyrics =D
when i first come to this country in 1849 i saw many fair lovyer but nerver saw mine i view it all rouind me saw was quite alone me a poor stranger and a long way from home Fair the well to ol' mother, fair the well to father too I'm going for to ramble this wide world all through when I get weary, I'll sit down and cry think of my Saro, pretty Saro, my bride
Well, I wished I was a turtle dove
Had wings and could fly
Far away to my lover's lodgings
Tonight I'd drawn the line
lyssalovebugg 1 year ago 6
@lyssalovebugg ...it's "far away to my lover's lodgings, Tonight i'd draw 'nigh" (aka near)-otherwise, you got the rest right!
rainharper62 1 year ago
@lyssalovebugg tonight I draw nigh? maybe
planiglukh 4 days ago
I wish they had put the second verse in this song
Well, my true love she won't have me and it's this I understand
For she wants some free holder and I have no land
I couldn't maintain her on silver and gold
but all of the other fine things that my love's house could hold
CerridwenFlyhieght 1 year ago
doing a horrible job faking playing the violin
BenCMusician 1 year ago
This is my fav part of this movie ;-) love her voice
KatwalkKutie 1 year ago
@KatwalkKutie I Totally agree this also is my Fav part of this wonderfully made movie.I've seen Iris perform twice now & both times I was front & center of her stage.
She Absolutely takes my Breath away when I hear her sing this song & makes my Heart Beat Faster & Slower @ the same time when she's playing her piano while singing.She brought tears to my eyes when I saw her perform in Santa Cruz,Cali a few years ago.I keep hoping she'll come back Real REAL soon to San Jose,Cali.
Tam Tam
Tamai64 1 year ago
can't people tell when someone is "acting" like they play an instrument?!?! its so distracting.
jumpoffmountaineers 1 year ago
This is my absolute favorite song from the movie and the reason I came to YouTube searching.
TheCoelho3 1 year ago
beautiful song
raisetheflag88 1 year ago
Good Hill peeplez..the best of the best...
BigWaveDav1 1 year ago
That's my man Muse Watson playing just like he's always played it!
fuzzbert1999 1 year ago
This movie is great and so is this song. I love ballads. "Pretty Saro" and " Raglin Road" always work to put my niece and nephew to sleep when I sing to them. There is just something so great about these ballads that even after all these years they still evoke something in people. I especially love the fiddle music in this song.
sweetsong5685 1 year ago
Five minutes ago I was waching this film. It is very best english song that I ever hear.
SzablaPL 1 year ago
One of our favorite scenes from this monumental film. How my heart pines for those mountains now destroyed for the coal they bore... Reminds me of my Daddy's Mama's side of the family and makes me proud.
MadDogtheFirst 1 year ago
god it gives me goosebumps i love it
NothingED 1 year ago 4
@NothingED All the singing in this film was mesmerizing. What a treat to find it on Youtube. Who needs a instrument.
scrabjan1 4 months ago
@scrabjan1
You are _so_ right, on all three statements.
emncaity 3 months ago
many of these traditional songs were actually lost in the european lands they were born in, shunted aside by popular music of the day or changed beyond recognition from the original forms. but the scotch/english/welsh/irish settlers in the hills had preserved these songs close to their original formats. when the musicologists discovered this they took to the hills to record these for posterity. that's my understanding on it
troonorth 1 year ago 2
@troonorth It sounds nothing like the English version though.
Sshelly34213 1 year ago
@Sshelly34213 This one is probably closer to the original version.
melarry 1 year ago
@melarry I doubt it, the original song is Irish and has a completely different melody.
This sounds very "Appalachian" whereas the original Irish version has a distinct melody.
Sshelly34213 1 year ago
@Sshelly34213 The Irish version was impacted by many more non-Irish cultures. It has certainly changed much more than the Appalachian version. The reason it sounds "very Appalachian" is because the songs are preserved in something closer to the original state.
melarry 1 year ago
@melarry I disagree.
If you listen to old Scottish, Irish, English folk songs, probably around where the original Pretty Saro originated, they don't sound anything like Appalachian folk music.
Appalachian folk music has a very distinct sound from that of old Irish, Scots, English version. The one known in Ireland today is most likely the closest version you're going to here in modern day.
Check out some songs like Nottamun Town, Banks or Moy.
Sshelly34213 1 year ago
@melarry Just the English style of singing is different from that of Appalachia. The distinct culture that developed in Appalachia due to hundreds of years of isolation from their original country.
Think of it as a "Galapagos Island" of folk culture. Sure it has things in common with Scots-Irish and English, but at the same time it is wholly unique.
I think it's highly unlikely that any original version of a folk song even exists there.
Sshelly34213 1 year ago
@melarry I'm not trying to be rude, I think this version is great too.
Most folk songs from Appalachia are vastly different than the folk songs that originated in Europe. I think this song is actually a perfect example of what I'm trying to say.
Sshelly34213 1 year ago
@Sshelly34213 It's a matter of what you call "Irish." If you insist on attaching it to the real estate, it's not. If you accept that the people own the term, no matter where they are, well ... Regardless, I really don't care. I'm just rather tired of Europhiles needing to belittle mountain music in terms of historical value. Yes, even those hillbillies are worthy.
melarry 1 year ago
@melarry Can you grow up and stop acting like you're a victim of racism? I live in the US genius. Do you really have to be that immature?
They're both Scots-Irish songs, when did I say they weren't? I never did and you're making that up. I simply stated that it is most likely that this version and many other Appalachian folk songs are more different from their original versions than similar. Why? because Appalachian developed its own separate culture from both the Brit Isles and the US.
Sshelly34213 1 year ago
@Sshelly34213 I'm not being "immature." I'm simply responding to your utterly indefensible post with a bit of whimsy and sarcasm. I'm a cultural anthropologist. I know something about culture dispersion patterns. There are no independent cultures. I also know arrogant quasi-academics when I encounter them on the Web. Go ahead and have the last word you will HAVE to have. This will be my last post to this now silly thread.
melarry 1 year ago
@melarry There is nothing wrong with my comment, I made a perfectly good point. You're just being nasty about it for no reason.
And how do you know that I don't know anything about culture? Or history? How arrogant is that?
Sshelly34213 1 year ago
@melarry Oh and when did I ever belittle "mountain music?" You're being unnecessarily overly dramatic and hostile for no reason. Can you tell me why? People are constantly debating the origins of folk music, you have no clue where this song originated anymore than I do. It was written hundreds of years ago.
Interesting that you call it that considering the fact that Scotland, Ireland, and England all have mountainous regions. Now which "mountain music" are you referring to in particular?
Sshelly34213 1 year ago
@melarry The truth of the matter is that folk songs are, for the most part, anonymous. It is unsure where the original version of this song came about, it may not even be Irish/English/Scottish originally.
It is likely though, that if these immigrants came from Ireland with that song, that it probably came from their country of origin.
Sshelly34213 1 year ago
@Sshelly34213 Isn't there also the point that songs often had several tunes? Robert Burns wrote most of his songs to already existing tunes and it is not uncommon to find a song sung to a different tune. Also, many of the British/Irish ballads underwent 'clean-up' during collection.
moominpic 10 months ago
@moominpic Of course they have several variants, but I was just wondering how the original version from Ireland itself sounded like. This is very Appalachian, holding out long notes, whereas in Ireland people would have been more lyrical, I can suggest some folk tunes to listen to if that doesn't make any sense. Type in Banks of Moy by Colm O Donnell and you'll see what I'm talking about. This is most likely a descendant of the song, which has other variants, rather than the original.
Sshelly34213 10 months ago
@Sshelly34213 I think the problem with looking at old songs is that many of them had different variants even before they were written down (Barbara Allen being 1 example). Plus, I'm not wholly sure about Ireland, but many traditions in Europe underwent a kind of "sanitation" during late 19th/early 20th C, when trad singers were encouraged to sing in a more "genteel" way for the urban middle classes. As I understand "Pretty saro" was an English song (but would have been in Ireland too)...
moominpic 10 months ago
I'm interested in learning more about the features of Appalachian music. This long holding of the notes might be compared to Scottish (Gaelic) slow airs and laments and could be where it developed from. Do we know if the Scots settlers in Appalachians came from any particular area of Scotland specifically?
moominpic 10 months ago
@moominpic Many of the traditional Scottish settlers of the Appalachians are Ulster Scots, also known as Scotch-Irish. Ulster is a region in Ireland which many Scots settled in. Appalachian music is a good mix of Scottish, Irish, and, never forget, Senegambian African heritage.
DissidentDescendant 9 months ago
@DissidentDescendant Thanks. I studied in Scotland and Belfast, so interesting to know there were Ulster Scots in Appalachians. Of course, a lot of the "Irish songs" like "Peggy Gordon" were Scots songs originally.
moominpic 9 months ago
@moominpic My ancestors first came from the Scottish highlands the Clan of McLoad, from there they went to the shores of Ireland to become ulster Scots, or Scots Irish, From there they came to America making their way into the wilderness of Southwest Virginia. The hard life lived here was made in blood, sweat, and tears, later to be conveyed into the music with such emotion. Check out my playlist Appalachia on my channel there should be a good variety of Appalachian ballads and tunes.
appalachianbanjer 7 months ago
@appalachianbanjer thanks, I will do.
moominpic 7 months ago
@appalachianbanjer You sure our families weren't on the same boat?
beaverwithachainsaw 7 months ago
@beaverwithachainsaw It is hard to tell, they very well could have. Give me a yell sometime
appalachianbanjer 7 months ago
@appalachianbanjer The English were afraid to move into the hills, away from the protection of their navy. So they went to the scariest people they knew: the Scots-Irish, my ancestors.
"So," they said to our chief, "there's good bits and bad. You will have all the land to farm you want, and can pass it on to your children. But there will be no law there, except for what you can fight for. You will get no help from the crown. What do you say?"
There was silence.
"Well?"
"And what's the bad bits?"
ImperialistRunningDo 7 months ago 2
@ImperialistRunningDo The English Wouldn't have been much help anyway, Patrick Ferguson proved that at Kings Mountain. His Prophecy came true, even god himself couldn't remove him from Kings Mountain, He is still buried there. You Can not fight Guerrilla warfare With Napoleonic Tactics.
appalachianbanjer 7 months ago
@Sshelly34213 An example of a slow air/lament could be Barbara Dickson - MacCrimmon's Lament or Karen Matheson - My Father Sent Me to the House of Sorrow
moominpic 10 months ago
@moominpic Barbara Dickson is lovely, I love her version of Skye Boat Song and Fine Flowers in the Valley. I think I've heard her version of MacCrimmon's lament, athough I am unfamiliar with Karen Matheson as well as the song My Father Sent Me to the House of Sorrow. Thanks for the suggestions.
Sshelly34213 10 months ago
@Sshelly34213 You're welcome. Both those tunes are on YT. Matheson is singer with a Scottish Gaelic band called Capercaille, as well as being a solo artist.
moominpic 10 months ago
@Sshelly34213 Check out Jean Redpath doing Sir Patrick Spence. It's a fine example of an old ballad done in an old style from Scotland.
moominpic 10 months ago
@moominpic Yea, her version is fantastic. There is quite a difference between traditional folk singing in the British Isles and traditional folk singing in the US. I wonder when exactly the two diverged in history.
Sshelly34213 10 months ago
@Sshelly34213 It's a great question. My wife works with traditional Polish singing and there is a clear line at some point where changes can be traced to when the urban intellectuals began teaching the village singers to sing more in a "western" style of singing to make it more acceptable to "educated" ears. I guess the Scots and Irish styles may have had similar processes, especially when writers like Moore began using folk motifs etc. I guess it never happened in the Appalachians too much.
moominpic 10 months ago
@moominpic Wow that makes a lot of sense.
Sshelly34213 10 months ago
Anybody know who the fiddle player is? His playing adds a haunting character to the song, just as much as Iris's singing.
carollizc 1 year ago
the end credits say Iris' (Rose Gentry's) husband Parley is played by Muse Watson, an actor orginally from Louisiana.
troonorth 1 year ago
my daughter is named Iris partly after this singer. Gorgeous
JoBrownMusic 1 year ago
awesome love this , great voice
loyalistdawg 1 year ago 2
One of my favorite movies ever! Thank you so much for putting up the video! :)
NardaLee 1 year ago 2
this gives me chills. her voice is incredible, beautiful song, beautiful movie
nem106 2 years ago 4
I first seen this movie in my women and writing lit class, and fell head over heels in love with the music. Beautiful!
mrsthompson86 2 years ago 4
good music crosses oceans spans deserts and climbs mountains..........
jimbo9580 2 years ago 34
Such a beautiful song and a great movie.
Thank you for sharing it....
melodyl52 2 years ago 3
wish they would've had a real fiddle player it looks so fake when he bows
jojothebanjoman 2 years ago
Yeah Muse Watson said he learned just enough about the fiddle to fake it. But he looked like a real mountain man. I love the song.
jamesojld 2 years ago 4
I could watch & listen to Iris all day N Nite long,never tiring of her.
Tamai64 2 years ago 7
me too
uncoloredraynebow 2 years ago
this is more blugrass and folk then country but your right with saying this music speaksto your soul.
chetrow1405 2 years ago 5
this is not bluegrass. but it is what later was called hillbilly then country music.
44jakey 2 years ago
This is true country music, music of the people from the woods. Not what people call country today and we wonder why we have lost our roots. This music truly speaks to your soul
pauladevaraux 2 years ago 4
wouldn't it be more correct to call it "Americana" music ? It has it's roots in the Scots and Irish traditions, but this is a unique style of it's own.
IC2720 2 years ago 8
I think the style is actually referred to as Appalachian Folk, from the Appalachian mountains
Davetate 2 years ago
Yea, but that could be just a part of what Americana would encompass (yes/no). Any way, I'm just speculating here, I'm not an expert on this, just enjoy it. Cheers
IC2720 2 years ago
Some parts were from Scots and Irish tradition but others originated in the Mountains.
lindsay480799 1 year ago
That is because the Scots-Irish came to America and lived in the Appalachian mountains. They maintained the classic songs within the families and after generations of seclusion this is what was born. This beautiful music.
st3ven83 1 year ago
@st3ven83 Actually I think the seculusion allowed them to develop their own versions over time, if you listen to the Irish version by Danny Doyle, for example, it sounds absolutely nothing like this.
Sshelly34213 1 year ago
I usually listen to rap and r&b, but music like this is beautiful!
thisxdamnxgood 2 years ago 5
great song. reminds me of my grandma. wish theyed sang the whole song instead of part of it.
eskimo8282 2 years ago
I was lucky enought to catch Iris with John Prine a while back. I had heard a little of Iris before, mainly with John.
The second she started singing she pulled me in and gave me a feeling I can't say I have experience from many others singers.
I will be a fan for life!
dlstillinger 2 years ago 2
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fawcett1999 2 years ago 5
You appear to contradict yourself as you acknowlege that this music has roots; it can't be 'pure' and derive from older music at the same time. Whilst 'Bluegrass' and 'Country' are undeniably American musical forms, without the centuries old ballads and broadsides brought to the 'new world' from the 'old'....none of it would exist.
clean3 2 years ago 3
The people of the mountains deeply revered their ancestors. To insult the roots of the music would have been to insult their kin. The music has its roots in England and Ireland. It was definitely given its own character here but that tradition belongs as much to the mountain people as it does to the people of those lands. They are English and Scots-Irish people still --- as well as Americans.
melarry 2 years ago 43
@melarry lets not forget about Scotland. The music has it's roots in England,Scotland,Ireland, and for that matter you could add in Wales. I have spent the last 7 years traveling to the most remote regions of my home in the Appalachian Mntns. after watching Songcatcher.....the people i meet and the songs i hear strike me to the bone, they just dont make music like this nemore....
AppalachiaPrincess 1 year ago
@AppalachiaPrincess I don't know how I forgot Scotland, seeing as how part of my family came from here. lol What a wonderful trip to take. I'm sure it was an amazing experience.
melarry 1 year ago
@melarry Hallelujah Amen!
jjkcharlie 1 year ago
@melarry What do you call and Irishman from New York?
doesn't matter where he's from, you call him an irishman.
ricketydoodah 8 months ago
@melarry well said melarry
thelastamericandude 7 months ago
Beautiful
catndryer 2 years ago
Well golly! That was beautiful! :)
Everseeker23 2 years ago
i love this song
raisetheflag88 2 years ago
one of the best versions of Pretty Saro..
WhiskeyTangoHell 2 years ago 4
love this ballad but it drives me CRAZY when its so stupidly obvious that the person is not playing the instrument and has no clue how no less.
fiddler317 2 years ago
SO WHAT
dragonriderjt 2 years ago
Yeah, I noticed that too. He's not a very good faker.
FantasmaLuna 2 years ago
REAL........ Very real, Can anyone post Iris singing "acres of corn"???
eaks52 2 years ago
So lovely.
RiverBirch1967 2 years ago
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SoggyDogMedia 2 years ago
Somebody asked who's playing fiddle- it's me. I was just off-camera and Muse Watkins was pantomiming live.
smashprod 2 years ago 5
nice playing! were you playing it from memory or off a sheet? i've been trying to find a sheet for this piece that sounds like the one you're playing here but none of them do. i'm not a particularly good fiddle player (unless you count the bull fiddle) but i'd love to be able to play this
ShinGouki86 2 years ago
Really? Since that's Bruce Molsky in the scene why didn't he play the fiddle? I mean after all he's only known as one of the best old time fiddlers on the planet.
8strnger 2 years ago
Look Muse up on IMDB. Bruce wasn't involved with Songcatcher.
smashprod 2 years ago
That's obviously an actor playing the fiddle. Just look at his left hand ... there is obviously no real playing happening on camera.
Iris Dement is sure singing for real, though.
milnoid 2 years ago
maybe because it's more about the song and not how great the fiddle player is.
anilegna 2 years ago
It's Muse Watson, not Watkins.
milnoid 2 years ago
there are no words to describe the beauty of this, or what I feel when I listen to it. You and Iris gave the world a true gift with your participation in this amazing film. As the film says, "the ballads are a precious musical legacy", and I thank God that people like you recognize their stunning beauty and are willing to keep them alive. This is where American country music began, and people should always remember that. I love this film, and the soundtrack. Bravo!!!!
captainsmith1 2 years ago 2
@smashprod nice pacing. gives it real feeling to me
coffeescup 1 year ago
@ShinGouki86
It's not Muse Watkins, BUT MUSE WATSON!!! :D
nathkst35 1 year ago
@nathkst35
i never said it was Muse Watkins...that was smashprod. i'm sure it was an innocent mistake
ShinGouki86 1 year ago
@ShinGouki86
i wanted to write to smashprod.
SMASHPROD THIS IS NOT MUSE WATKINS BUT Muse Watson :D!!!!!
nathkst35 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@ShinGouki86
i wanted to write to smashprod.
SMASHPROD THIS IS NOT MUSE WATKINS BUT Muse Watson :D!!!!!
nathkst35 1 year ago
@nathkst35
nathkst35 1 year ago
Why all the negativity? If you don't like it, don't watch it! It's just that simple. This is great music, don't judge, just listen.
EllieMaeSC 2 years ago 2
her voice causes the hairs on the back of my neck to rise....you have perfect voice iris....stay out of politics....its messing with your head....
sarge2906 2 years ago 3
i love this movie and the music...i wish i could find it lol the music i mean i already have the movie
deaddolls88 2 years ago
down home mountain folk music.This is a deritive of Irish music the immigrants brought with them in the 17 and 1800's
wrappindude 2 years ago
This is Folk music ....music of mountain Folk.
jbjumpback 2 years ago
what's the deal with these negative comment vibes, people?
mrblisterfist 2 years ago
I've been a huge Iris DeMent fan for years and think that this was nicely done, but it seems that the time constraints of the movie forced the song to be shortened to the point of being unrecognizable as the same "Pretty Saro" that I grew up hearing my granny sing.
The song is about a man lamenting that his social class prevents him from having his true love...Saro won't have him because he's not a land-owning "free-holder"
Also, most versions I've heard say "1749", not "1849".
Just sayin'.
blueridgekeith 3 years ago
I have heard that 1749 one to. the song itself is beautiful and sad
sierralucas617 2 years ago
Mmm . . . might be poetic licence . . . 1849 (the potatoe famine in Ireland) would resonate with a modern audience more than 1749 (the aftermath of the Scottish rebellion of '45)
thrupnybit 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Now this part is good as opposed to that shit-faced Emmy Rossum and her shitty voice.
stillwaterguy04 3 years ago
great movie and sound track...love iris
blondekaylee22 3 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Now that was some type-casting there...:) All they had to do was throw some old dirty clothes on Iris....and "wahlah!!!!".......Inbred hillbilly with the cryptic voice of a swamp angel.....:)
catndryer 3 years ago
you're a evil soul thats going to hell
blondekaylee22 3 years ago
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AntarAakash 3 years ago
favorite movie!!! ever!!!!!!!
chan721 3 years ago
The guy holding the fiddle is NOT a fiddle player but an actor playing along to a recording. Maybe the movie credits will mention who the "real" fiddler is
stevecajun 3 years ago
who is the fiddle player!!! please someone tell me!
ElflandsWorkshop 3 years ago
i've played the violin for almost 10 eyars now, and after i saw this ovie i had to learn the song(:
magdalen46 3 years ago
could you transcribe it? i've been playing violin for about a year and i'd love to learn to play it :)
ShinGouki86 3 years ago
same here, i´m not that great yet, but i need new songs to learn and this fellow plays some chords a bit confusing to me.
I MUST learn this song.
ElflandsWorkshop 3 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
I want to hear "When the Mountains Cry!" Emmy Rossum really detracts from this movie for me - I can't stand her.
stillwaterguy04 3 years ago
This is true americana. Behold and beloved.
annara 3 years ago 6
I treasure Hedy West singing this. I seem to remember she said she learned it from her grandmother and was trying to reproduce how it was sung.
johnorford1931 3 years ago