Christopher Hitchens: The Moral Necessity of Atheism (3/8)

[iliveon]

This is vote botted

[wotg]

Mr. Hitchens passed away today, age 62. The world have lost a great thinker.

My condolances to the Hitchens family.

[Reip187]

Who brings a baby to this? LOL

Go out in the hall.

[dwbryant3]

@Reip187 Credit, however, should be given to the parent for bringing their baby to this instead of to some evangelical church service with the hope that the child might become a free-thinker!

[Nobullporfavor]

Great talk by the Hitch as usual.

[thefancydanhimself]

Divorce is Legal in Ireland...

Dunno if it's still technically in the constitution. Doubt it though

Just thought that was important

[rabbitwho]

@thefancydanhimself I know, it's really really strange. I assumed when he said it that the video was very old. We voted divorce in.. 1996? I think? I get it mixed up with the date of the decriminalization of homosexuality.

Our country is already backward and behind enough as it is without someone claiming we're even worse than we are!

[kingpharaohtsar]

@thefancydanhimself eires are sassanach laws so thay matter not anyway the brehon sud tell us law no 1 else saor gaelic domhan

[debrick2490]

I like the fact that his previous clip in act 2 that he mentions the "kind" the kind leader who would be the real evil and that is so true TONY BLAIR is that man!

[bersa888]

There are literally tens of millions of religious people who are closet atheists. I've never heard of an atheist who's a closet believer ;-)

[aguteempasil]

wtf is a baby doing there??

[dredawg1981]

I like his John Wayne joke.

[KdotJdot]

someone shut that baby up

[patrickledford420]

yep, teresa and most other religious people are evil bigots

[xSolraccarloSx]

@patrickledford420 Teresa turned out to be an Atheist (obviously with a shitload of Theistic influence on her)... doesn't change how sick what she did was.

[patrickledford420]

@xSolraccarloSx yes

[fetalbetal]

the votebots gain power as the clips continue, that is the true evil

[thegreatestbak]

im entranced. my hero

[Nexius8]

All elements other than H were created in supernova. So life exists because it containts parts of dead stars. Far more awe inspiring than some old busy body waving his hand.

I find it odd that chrisians and the like never use that as an explenation for why the rest of the universe exists

[redteamdarkspear]

if you want to get technical, 25% of the helium that exists was created in the big bang, and a tiny bit of lithium was made too. But your point still stands

[wv05]

@Nexius8 Helium is also formed without supernovas.

[Nexius8]

I'm no expert and I will be the first to admit that. However the heaver elements definatly were so my point still stands.

However more accurate info is always welcome.

[drfoxcourt]

Based on current astrophysical understanding, all elements with atomic # < iron (26) can be formed within standard suns.

Higher numbered elements require supernovae.

Nonetheless I appreciate your point: Knowing its a magic trick does nothing, seeing the trick unfold is valuable, learning how the trick is done is the most valuable.

Jesus didn't die that we might live, billions of suns did!

[wilfredthebold]

The "gay christian sadomasochistic niche market" is enormous, as it turns out. It took 370 million at the box office, best ever for a snuff film.

[kadene2]

I like the fact that some of us are willing to challenge the crap that has been force-fed to mankind for centuries. Hitchens is correct when he asks why should all of Ireland be subject to the laws of the RC church concerning marriage and divorce. Indeed if I am Irish and not catholic, why should I have to observe their laws? Or any other religious dogma, for that matter?

[ananiasacts]

"why should I have to observe their laws? Or any other religious dogma, for that matter?"

Because there is no such thing as religion. There is mythology, and there is politics. Religion is just what we call mythologically based politics. What would be the point of having a book of rules if no one tries to enforce them? They are defining what it means to be a legitimate citizen of god's world. You can't get much more political than that.

[Kirkoification]

Religion IS politics.

[blaziermissy]

Hitchens speaking of the wealthy religious power hierarchy:

teaching abstinence, misery, guilt, shame and revenge to the poor- this is something to which I do not believe moral neutrality is possible. It is a false claim of power in the secular world based upon a false claim of knowledge about an an atheorial world beyond. No one who is subject to this thinking is in my opinion, intellectually or mentally free.

Well said. Poor people are oppressed in more ways than one by the powerful.

[markjones8913]

"The gay sado-masochistic niche market" LOLOLOLOLOOLOLOLO

[ThePissedOffAtheist]

The gay sado-masochistic CHRISTIAN niche market

[tuxguys]

Carl Sagan, atheist: "We are made of star stuff: We are the physical manifestation of the Universe, trying to understand itself." Watch 6:30-8:00 of this segment in light of that: I love Hitchens, and I am in no way an atheist, but I wonder if he realizes how spiritual he is being here? Put (Judeo) Christianity aside ( I have): God, if extant, has, by definition, no limitations on what God chooses to do, or how God chooses to do it.

[Tapecutter59]

I am an atheist, what Sagan said is a self evident physical fact. It applies not only to humans but to any self aware animal.

Google "I am a strange loop".

[tuxguys]

"In the end, we self-perceiving, self-inventing, locked-in mirages are little miracles of self-reference."

I also love Hofstadter, and I love this quote... but while I agree with it, it can mean anything one chooses for it to mean. Without "God," the concept of "miracles" is meaningless. And if we are as described in the quote, that doesn't obviate the existence of God. We could be that way because God made us that way. You pays your money and you takes your chances...

[Tapecutter59]

It would be a far better world if belivers could define their god as well as you can. I can't refute the god you describe and nor would I want to because I think we are basically describing the same thing.

Looking at the thumbs down your Sagan comment recived I'd say there are more than a few atheists that haven't looked deeply enough into our self aware universe.

[tuxguys]

Shows you how oblivious I am... I didn't know there were any thumbs down until you told me.

[Iwuffpantera]

How freaking stupid are you? Seriously... "star stuff" is a literal reference to the material that composes stars; you're reading in spirituality, he means it literally not religiously...

[tuxguys]

My very point: He was referring to the chemical composition of stars and of humans being comprised of the same basic elements. The magic is in the second sentence, the "physical manifestation" sentence. Change "the Universe" to "Universe" as Bucky Fuller used to refer to it, and you may begin to get the implications of this statement.

And this is a civil discussion, you intellectual pygmy, you neuron-challenged cretin...

...why the name-calling?

[modramafoyomama]

"i dont myself recognize the house of windsor" hahahahah

[omyxtom]

Was fuer ein kluger Mann!

[Saerain]

6:50 Ribonucleic DNA? Come on, Hitch, you're sharper than that.

[johnclavis]

Yeah, that bugged me, too. I guess that's not water in that cup he's drinking from!

[forza599]

hahahha yeah he's a notorious raging alcoholic I'd be surprised if it WAS water

[senorsquiid]

It's never water with the Hitch.

[supruzr]

He didn't mean to say "ribonucleic DNA", he was going to say "ribonucleic acid" and thought better of it and replaced it with "DNA".

So it should be better read as "ribonucleic (wait no) DNA".

[johnclavis]

Fair enough.

[Isabella8466]

Tender story of Hawkings and Galileo's trial transcript.

[ashburnhouse]

I almost cried.

[thecritterguy]

To follow up what beebobox said...I'd like to quote the late Douglas Adams:

"I'd take the awe of understanding over the awe of ignorance any day."

[mpolzkill]

False dilemma. Why can't you be in awe of both?

[A4SheetProductions]

good video, who the fuck keeps screeching in the background! sounds like a cat being fucking strangled!

[bkishar]

Some idiot brought a baby to the proceedings. Either someone too ignorant to know babies shouldn't be in such gatherings, or a really enthusiastic philosophy professor trying to "educate" their children as early as possible.

[TheMorbidAtheist]

lolz

[StevoDog21]

Hey! I was that baby!

My mom thought Hitchens was the original boy from the Winnie the Pooh books.

[AledoCasizzle]

Hey, pay the kid some respect. That baby happens to be the most atheistic entity in the entire room.

[zeldagoblin]

As a person who was dragged relentlessly to church as a kid, and thrashed when I insisted on making a sound, as were many other kids there, I know which public assembly I would rather have been taken to by my parents.

[Ieatbabies8]

Wow...

[voyzovrezon]

Interesting bit about the hypocrisy of Mother Teresa.

[EndCredulity]

"Interesting bit about the hypocrisy of Mother Teresa."

voyzovrezon, for more specifics, you might want to check out a documentary Hitchens made and hosted called "Hell's Angel." User athesistmedia has it uploaded, along with a couple of other people.

[voyzovrezon]

Yep, I've seen it. Ironically we learn just recently that she even doubted her own faith and felt abandoned by god according to letters she wrote. Perhaps if she had lived more for truth and justice and not dogma she may have found that peace of mind she longed for.

[undersolo]

The piece on Mother Teresa is also in Hitchens' "Love, Poverty, and War: Journeys and Essays". Opened my eyes to a lot about her and other figures that I did not know.

[Vedaseran]

He makes a thoroughly accurate and scathing attack on man's religion and I agree with him on that count. However, I still care a lot about people. The universe does not care, though a benevolent God would care. To me, a human can be far more magnificent than what the Hubble Telescope shows us. Of course, that is just me.

[beebobox]

and he's not claiming that what you see if you use the hubble telescope is something more magnificent then humans.

but something that gives us awe, more so then the fool's awe imagined through reading a fiction written about thing that happened 2 thousand years ago.

[ExaggeratedElegy]

This is ironically Hitchen's point: the very fact that we are capable of creating the technology to see phenomena through the Hubble Telescope and to appreciate the natural beauty of said phenomena without reference to some artificial supernatural or religious context is an immense testament to the innate "divinity" if you like of mankind as a critical, free-thinking species.

[Questfortruth86]

hmm, our innovations show our god-like divinity, i see; we can now see what was already explained thousands of years ago by the ancient civilizations. We have recently uncovered the truths of the ancient vedic scriptures and myan astrology, this is undeniable proof of our infinite capabilities. When good is done we praise ourselves, when evil is done we blame god and demand an explanation!

[whirlpoolzend]

Not just a free thinker but a clear one too...

[kat1989]

jeezusmaryanjoeseph!....this man just wins, where does he speak from, cause i want to get there

[deloford]

education

[lexaling]

@kat1989 Read, read, read, read. Incidentally, this is Hitchens' recommended authors: Voltaire, Lucretius, Einstein, Galileo, Spinoza, Bertrand Russell, Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Huxley

Enjoy!

[agryson]

His statement there of the Irish ban on divorce is very astute. The same could be said of condoms, homosexuals and the "special position of the catholic church" which was in our constitution! Thankfully all of the above has been amended as Ireland has become more secular. Interestingly, peace in Northern Ireland coincided with increased Irish secularism too. Funny that.

[StealthWarrior1988]

Yes, the 'us' and 'them' mentality is wearing as common sense increases.

[chbrules]

I would have to consider my position of authority over others. Power is tempting. Would you use religion to your benefit or would you simply cast it asside completely in an authoritative position of governmet?

[ealindh]

Just to point out that the Catholic church was on the losing side in divorce referendum in the Republic of Ireland in 1995. Not even that Albanian nun could save them.

[mrjdr]

Can anyone tell me what he meant when he said that it would be worse if a god existed, supervising us all and is benign? Maybe I'm just a bit slow, but I don't get it. Thanks!

[irishmauddib]

It has a lot to do with the concept that most dictatorships and totalianarism starts with "This is for your own good my people".

[RayNinblood]

God would be omnipresent (all seeing), so would in effect be watching you as an individual all the time. If you strayed in thought or deed you will be cast to hell when you die. Aside from the ridiculousness of gods and religions, we would be far better off without one don't you think.

[captainzero1969]

Because it would make our captivity benign. We would willingly accept our bondage. That's how I took it, at any rate.

[katiekamera]

Well the 'horror' of the benign he means is that a god that loves would do to you what it does because it loves you. Foucault and critical sociology look at that a lot.

Ironically, this is how his civil society theory works at the moment. Youth culture and cynicism also work through benign force.

[TheBannedAtheist]

Sorry for repeating myself, but I love that comment! I can't believe the audience didn't laugh more.

[TheBannedAtheist]

The Passion: a sadomasochistic, homoerotic snuff film. Can anyone here put it better?

[lollygager3664]

Nope

[ReligionIsACrutch]

"unsupported word of Stone Age peasants"

Haha, I love this guy!

[CAndiron]

What Hitchens said about Mother Teresa, and her stance on marriage and statements about Diana's divorce: If true, I agree it was repulsive of Mother Teresa to do that, but all Hitchens has done is prove she is a hypocrite. He hasn't shown the principle is wrong. It's irrational to say Christianity is wrong because of hypocrites. Medicine isn't wrong just becuase of corporate shill md's who'd say high fructose corn syrup is healthy.

[irishmauddib]

he is not just saying its wrong, but that it should be part of the constitution is horribly wrong. Fine if catholics want to put themselves through that, fine. But to make it the law of the land is sick, to the highest degree.

[TheBannedAtheist]

The Passion as a pornographic, homoerotic snuff film - brilliant! Only Hitchens could be so lucide and honest on such an issue.

[lupinnoctem]

he full of bull

[PiroNiro]

You wrong

[ncgogamecocks]

...because?

[TheLordValarath]

@lupinnoctem

And I will ask, in what way is he wrong.

[uscjd2004]

@lupinnoctem You mad?!

[jkgillett]

Is this pre-1995 or has CH never heard of the 15th amendment to the Irish constitution? (genuine question)

[hzh27]

Hitchens was referring to what Mother Teresa did to oppose the referendum/amendment in 1995, so your question is odd to say the least (i.e. he would have known about it to talk about it, and it can't be pre-1995 unless you think he can see into the future.)

[jkgillett]

It is an odd question - I wrote it as I was watching it and failed to realise that he was talking about it from the past. While the point he was trying to make was about Teresa and not the Irish constitution I think it'd would've been decent of him to note that the referendum was passed - purely because somebody who doesn't know about it could easily listen to him and assume divorce is still banned in Ireland (especially as he's using the present text even though it's from a past perspective).

[hzh27]

True, although it would be hard to understand it as the present because Mother Teresa died in 1997. Hitchens however made an error I think in the date - he wrote that the referendum was in 1996 in his book. He made similar error here when he said the Diana got divorced in the same year as the 1995 referendum (the divorce was concluded in 1996).

[bratfink74]

I love C.H.'s feminist views. Religion is the WORST thing ever to happen to women and girls.

[sivatmin]

who in the world would bring a hollering baby to a lecture of this magnitude??? great posting, regardless!!! thanks!

[muslimfast]

A stupid feminist who attends University lectures that is who. She was probably breast feeding at the same time!

[sun2515]

were are the other parts???

[PiroNiro]

All of the videos in this series are linked through replies.

[closedmouth]

My god (sorry), this man is amazing

[devourerofbabies]

Stone age peasants? Let's be fair. Bronze age peasants.