The Tsem Tulku Organization runs wwwdorjeshugdencom, they are also the ones dropping DS pamphlets all over Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia. People who leave the organization or otherwise find out their secret are subject to abuse and death threats. Kechara House is a dangerous cult that has betrayed His Holiness the Dalai Lama, the Tibetan Community, and most of all, Gaden Shartse Monastery. Please circulate this information far and wide.
Hi, does anybody know what His Eminence is saying about this much debated Dorje Shugden topic? No English subtitles in this clip... hope to understand his views on this topic.
Not to disrespect anyone's culturally valued practices, but in your Heart of Hearts, in the core of the jewel of Bodhichitta, does calling upon any entity or divine manifestation outside of yourself truly constitute the middle path of compassionate action? What use are these manifestations to the common sense practice of opening our Hearts to one another?
The truth is that this very Sakya Trizin owes his birth to Dorje Shugden and his parents have always been very thankful to him. Dorje Shugden practice has always been an integral part of the Sakya tradition and the beautiful Sakya Kangso refers to him as a manifestation of Chenresig and the protector of all the three vehicles.
Sakya Trizin says that while some in his lineage made offerings to DS, he was always regarded as a MUNDANE PROTECTOR on the lowest level of the pantheon.
What I am saying is certainly not a lie. It can be proven by various sources such as the Sakya Kangso od Dorje Shugden wich was recited regularely in many Sakya monasteries until 1996 including the most prominent in Tibet. If you are truly interested I can see if i can get a copy and show it to you. The story about Sakya Trizins father asking Dorje Shugden for help when he couldnt get a child is well known in tibetan society, you can ask any elderly Sakya they will confirm.
I´m not interested in old "stories". I was repeating Sakya Trizin´s words. DS is a lower dharmapala of Tibetan background. It´s not correct to call DS "a manifestation of Chenresig", you are misleading people.
What you are saying doesnt make any sense. Everything I said is nothing but a formal matter of fact, not necessarily reflecting my own opinion. The Sakya kangso refers to Dorje Shugden as manifestation of Chenresig. Anyone can choose what to believe anway.
To be honest there is not so much logic in your reply. Are you saying that technically Chenresig can have only one manifestation? All I was saying was that in the Sakya tradition Dorje Shugden was regarded as manifestation of Chenresig prior to the ban and many Sakyapa do so up to this day. Wich I can prove to you easily. This has nothing to do with Mahakala whatsoever.
Sakya Trizin says that while some in his lineage made offerings to DS, DS was ALWAYS regarded as "A MUNDANE PROTECTOR ON THE LOWEST LEVEL OF THE PANTHEON".
May I remind you that not all Shugden practitioners think of him as a Buddha.
Dorje Shugden centres are mushrooming everywhere. HH Gaden Trisur, the 101th ex throne holder of Lama Tsongkhapa, who is the head of all Gelugpas defects to Shar Gaden and will soon turn the wheel of Dharma by giving a teaching. What wonderful admirable example that gives strength and faith to DS practitioners worldwide. Amazing how despite all the Bad thing they say abt DS and DS practitioners, we are still moving on and moving up!
Dorje Shugden centres are mushrooming everywhere. HH Gaden Trisur, the 101th ex throne holder of Lama Tsongkhapa, who is the head of all Gelugpas defects to Shar Gaden and will soon turn the wheel of Dharma by giving a teaching. What wonderful admirable example that gives strength and faith to DS practitioners worldwide. Amazing how despite all the Bad thing they say abt DS and DS practitioners, we are still moving on and moving up!
@cIoserelative They should recall that in teaching spiritual truths the Buddha always uses these concepts and ideas in the way that a raft is used to cross a river. Once the river has been crossed over, the raft is of no more use, and should be discarded.
Instead of talking so much about Dorje Shugden is bad or evil, perhaps the focus can be inward looking at what they can do to improve in their education system, skills, community activities, promote their culture without having to always depend on the Dalai Lama's name and start standing on their own two feet.
@dragonthunder2010 it is a big question: what is going to happen after the dalai lama passes away? Who will the tibetans listen to then? And then what happens to all the "decrees" he has made such as about Dorje Shugden?
I believe then people will start looking to the lamas who r benefiting the world through dharma, not merely through politics like the TGIE. Dorje Shugden's practice will arise again not by politics but by the example of all the wonderful lamas' actions & work for others.
The monastic communities are against this practice as you know. This will not
change.
Right now the Chinese rulers are using Shugden as a means to subjucate the Tibetan people. Tibetan monks in Tibet have no choice but to accept. If they don´t they are seen as "members of the "unpatriotic Dalai clique", they risk imprisonment.
Shugden worship is promoted by China only, no other nation is promoting it.
Unlike dorjeshugden (dot) com where there is constant news being updated even from the monasteries themselves, like shar gaden, serpom monastery, and others too. Its the current affairs for the DS issue if your interested.
I have been to antishugden website, if you look closely its just another propaganda site with no substance, even the forum has no members posting anything to support anti shugden sentiment
@wangchub hahahaha this anti-shugden website is really rubbish. I've seen it too. It's so inflammatory, childish and not backed up by facts at all. I feel quite sad actually that this is how they reflect the Dalai Lama. They promote and defend HHDL by being malicious and aggressive towards DS and DS practitioners. What kind of spiritual leader are they trying to represent? Shame.
@TheRedNiece Thats quite a funny way of looking at someones Dharma practce? the people who set up the site anti shugden, to the people who promote down with DS practitioners, down with DS. This is Dharma practice is it? Leaving out WSS what about all the DS practitioners who practice in htis way, just what are they practicing? compassion, wisdom, love, understanding, peace, harmony.
Yes ive been to the anti shugden website and it's quite dead. I guess they don't care enough or are committed enough to their cause, which happens to suit me just fine. :)
On the contrary, to Western audiences the Dalai Lama repeatedly says that he issued this ban In order to save this pure and profound Tibetan Buddhism from degenerating into spirit worship. And This ban is applied in order to promote peace and harmony between the four Tibetan Buddhist traditions.
Wow! SOunds to me two different goals. So which one is it???
If the Dalai Lama used such stern and harsh speech to coerced people from voting, then it is no wonder so many were in a dilemma and probably did it out of fear of being ostracized or kicked out from the monasteries. Hence the voting system is a fraud, no?
We hope that they will one day find the courage to stand up to what they know is true in their heart!
@dragonthunder2010 There's actually information on the dorjeshugden ( do t) com website and also discussions on the forum that look at how the ban of DS is actually not in line with the code of the vinaya... i.e. the ban itself is not really "legal" in the monastic context... do have a read. Very interesting to understand the context that this practice was "de-legalised"
The justification given to the Tibetan public, which destroyed the entire harmony of the Tibetan community, is: Worshipping this evil deity is a danger for my life and for the freedom of Tibet. If you Tibetans want me to be dammed and dont care at all about the cause of Tibet, then go ahead with the worship of this deity.
The Shugden groups are destroying Buddhism in the West.
They support each other.
Shugden people are running after money.
Money from China.
The triple murder is still unsolved. The suspected murderers have Chinese protection. They came from China/Tibet and they went back. China keeps sending Shugden monks to India to destabilize the Tibetan community.
Those monks are portrayed as victims in tashidelek17´s propaganda videos....
isn't it highly ironic that there is so much accusation against Gelugpas and DS practitioners that they are sectarian??
In fact, the whole basis of Gelugpa teachings is the synthesis of teachings from the three other schools of Buddhism. So actually all of Gelugpa teachings includes and is taken from nyingma, sakya and kagyu! So how can that be sectarian??
Dorje Shugden has traditionally been invoked by orthodox Gelugpas in the past and fundamentalists in our days in open antagonism against the other Tibetan schools.
You guys got to read about what they say on dorjeshugden's website forum. They found a website that displayed a Sakya thangka of Dorje Shugden that was enthroned on a lion-throne, much like how we would depict a fully-enlightened Buddha. It must be pervasive in the Sakya tradition to worship Dorje Shugden as such.
DS is completely represented by WSS. No one talked about DS in the west until WSS did.
NKT is WSS, from conception through today.
This new attempt to portray NKT as suddenly Dalai Lama-friendly comes too late, unfortunately.
If NKT has had a change of policy and heart, it will have to spend as many years (or more) counteracting its original propaganda as it did generating it.
It is also essential that the 1.3 billion Chinese people have free access to information about their own country and elsewhere, as well as freedom of expression and the rule of law. >>>So can there please be freedom for Dorje Shuden practice and it being expressed OPENLY??? As rule and law of any democratic society, I believe it CAN BE SO!
I find it so sad when I see how this cross-fertilisation of Eastern spiritual knowledge with our Western understanding of material matters, has produced this child of such promise, (the NKT),... only to see that child now grown into adulthood as a slick, slippery-tongued used car sales man whose golden dream is to have a chain of his used car lots in every major city of the world.
In H.E. Choyang Duldzin's autobio, he also mentioned that during his tenure as Secretary of the Co-operative Society, he worked very hard to obtained the funds for the monks quarters, not only for Ganden but also for Drepung, and the Nyingma and Sakya monks as well (that doesnt sound very sectarian does it?)
@thepurpleaster Thanks for sharing this nice info about Kuten Lama. It's true what you have said about these lamas being true reflections of DS practitioners - they uphold the Dharma with such great strength throughout their lives and show the real essence of Dorje Shugden which is compassion, tenacity and genuine kindness for others, which is what keeps them going in the face of so much adversity
You can read all about this humble nomadic boy's story on how he became an Oracle Lama, (which is a high position in the Tibetan hierarchy). How he served his people. This is a true story and an inspiration for everyone. His qualities are what a real Dorje Shugden practitioner should aspire to have.
It on the Biographies section on dorje shuden (dot) com
His Eminence Choyang Duldzin Kuten Lama (1917-2002) served as an oracle of Dorje Shugden. And in Phagri Monastery, one of the earlier monastery he was at studying, He as an oracle of Dorje Shugden use to give help and advices to many people in that area all from different traditions in fact! So that doesn't sound very sectarian to me. I guess if he really was not a protector, then why should he help?
Unless this great big fuss is driven by politics, ego, insecurities on who takes over, who has more power and more control over their people??? For whatever the reasons, the world ain't that blind to see, so before it's too late - lets stop the nonsense of this BAN!
Why are we so worried about Dorje Shugden practice and practitioners? I mean if DS practice is really that "BAD", I am sure karma will catch up and they will not be able to go one practicing because they would have taken rebirth in the 3 lower realms based on the logic of cause and effect - correct? So let their karma take care of them, what's the big fuss?
Lmao, look at the change in language style of the Jan 11 Clique; the westerner that was hired to be the "Jan. 11 voice" has been back-burnered, as she's out of her depth now. The wmd have taken over temporarily, due to the upcoming sensitive date.
If you study the texts & prayers of Dorje shugden, his main aim is to help practitioners to achieve attainments in Dharma: bodhicitta & wisdom. DS Lamas & practitioners have always advised n taught that DS helps anyone who prays and practices sincerely. Its not about what sect you are from, but whether you are sincerely practicing Dharma. That is what DS wants most. After all, at the end of the day, when ur enlightened, who cares if u got there by being sakya, gelug, nyingma etc!!
when we talk of the question of sectarianism, it isn't that the practice is sectarian (how can a Buddha be sectarian?!). Sectarianism and schism occurs when PEOPLE speak or act in wrong and harmful ways. The Buddhist practices themselves never set out to harm or cause any sort of damage.
when Kalu Rinpoche toured the mother monastery of Sakya, a temple caretaker took Kalu Rinpoche for a tour to the different chapels in the sacred space.
Upon reaching the chapel of the Great King Dorje Shugden, the caretaker took of his shoes before entering and made obeisance to DS telling Kalu Rinpoche that DS is ONE WITH THE THREE JEWELS!
The Sakya school has always been particularly close with Dorje Shugden. Although, Dorje Shugden was not the main protector but it enjoy a period of prominence due to one of the deity's previous incarnation - Sakya Pandita. Hence, the Sakya's were the first to propitiate Dorje Shugden.
The head of Sakya tradition says that DS was regarded as a mundane protector, although some Sakya made offerings to him. ("A mundane protector on the lowest level of the pantheon.")
HHDL has no karma to be harmed if he hasn't done anything wrong but enlightened Beings do at many times do the 'wrong' thing in order to help the bigger picture.
when the buddha was a bodhisattva in a ship full of people and was attacked by a pirate. the Bodhisattva had to kill the pirate in order to save the ship load of people. the bodhisattva has to go thru mild retribution for the action but he saved many lives by killing one.
Many high lamas like Sakya Gongma Rinpoche and lay people have relied on Dorje Shugden for generations after generations, so how can these high lamas be wrong? They have taken rebirth again and again and they are still doing this practice, until the recent ban.
I think this is another attempt to show that high lama supports the ban of Dorje Shugden. So it's funny that you asked those who practice it to say negative things about their protector that they have relied on for so long. It's just a cover up due to political pressure.
This is funny! The previous life of Sakya Trizin recognise Dorje Shugden. In fact, Dorje Shugden was recognised by the Sakyas first before it became a so-called "Gelugpa" Protector. What's more interesting, I have seen Dorje Shugden thangkas with Guru Rinpoche above him and that means there were even Nyingmas who practice Dorje Shugden. You guys should check out dorjeshugden(dot)com...
by the way - for a good balance of views without all the nastiness, check out websites like dorjeshugden (dot) com and wisdombuddhadorjeshugden dot (com) which has a good range of articles and good credible resources. And presented in a fair, mature manner that allows readers to form their own opinion. there's a good forum on the first site too which encourages sharing of views.
Comments on various videos have grown nasty. These comments have turned into vulgarities and nothing else. This should stop. Let both sides have their say, without having to use profanities. Please do not mess up the Forum.
@zamzam24388 bravo! It's sad that people have become so nasty in the name of defending their religion / their Lamas.
Study what is always said in Dalai Lama's teachings and/or Dorje Shugden's sadhana - there is nothing nasty in it and they promote nothing but peace and kindness... something which is not being practised here at all! :(
@pathseeker9 I think it is illogical that this practice can harm the dalai Lama.
We believe that Dalai Lama is Avalokiteshvara who is an enlightened being... so how can Avalokiteshvara be harmed by a spirit? That is so illogical! That's saying that a spirit has more power than a Buddha???
@pathseeker9 oh yah i wanted to add... that after all we do, and at the end of the day, every individual faces his or her own karma. no matter how harmful DS is supposed to be, if someone does not have the karma to be harmed, they will not be harmed. If we believe that Dalai Lama is an enlightened being, he doesn't have a karma to be harmed.
Look, let's think about it. After all the conflict between 多杰雄登 [Duo Jie Xiong Deng, dorjeshugden] and Dalai, only one thing is clear: the Banchan lama [Panchen], 班禅喇嘛 is the only true Teacher. Thank goodness he is now old enough to lead, in our time of confusion and trouble!
Notice how, the anti-Dalai Lama videos, many of the people who first "stopped by the video," their accounts are closed now. That because when the video began, YouTube was open in China but soon after it close, their acct was closed also.
Tibetheart: Just because someone practises Dorje Shugden, it doesn't mean they work for the Chinese government! There is no correlation whatsoever.
Believe it or not, there are some people who just sincerely love this protector and just want to do his practice because they have seen and experienced the benefit that can be gained by this practice, especially in their spiritual path. I don't even know anyone in China!!!!
ALSO some of you are friend with Maohammet, on of the most vile anti-Tibetan hateful talkers on YouTube. This shows, you are working for the Chinese government. It's quite easy to see. Just follow the links.
If you were strong in your view, you don't have to creat 15-20 fake youtube Identities.
Please I petition all you holy Lamas to not continue to confuse us human beings any further. There is great hope in everyone's spiritual well being. I pray that with each and our individual ways, we will be able to follow our Guru's advice, receive our Yidam's blessings and be protected by our assigned Dharmapala.
His Holi Shit the Dalai Lama has never acted like a Human being in his whole life. In fact everything this low life animal does is only to benefit all western anti China mother fuckers.
Truth is have you talked to a dharmsala tbeg that has brains ?
Truth is a tbeg with brains has not been born yet !
Truth is a tbeg that is not a crawling animal has not been born yet !
Truth is a non lying tbeg has not been born yet !
Truth is a non cock sucking tbeg has not been born yet !
Don't let this one video of Sakya Tenzin's comments let you down. There are many, many great lamas out there who are sincere and ardent Dorje Shugden practitioners. the dorjeshugden website has many beautiful writeups and old photos of their history, lineage and deep connection with DS check it all out on dorjeshugden (dot) com
Sectarianism is the basis of all buddhist schools of thought! Why? because the Buddha taught 84000 ways to enlightenment that each school can practise their own path to enlightenment and it would still be just as correct as the other schools. keeping them pure is nothing new, they have been separate from Buddhas time up until now, and each school has had attained masters as a result of the different paths, thervada, mahayana, vajrayana.
Dalai lama wants a democratic system for Tibetans.
Yet what democratic leader would say that a certain group may not join his public talks due to their religious orientation?
Imagine if Obama said all jews cannot attend his public talks because they don't accept Christ? That could never happen.
So If Dalai lama wishes to emulate G-7 democratic leadership, he has to stop ostracizing anyone even if they practice Dorje Shugden. Ghost or not..simple.
This is crazy! The Sakyas are probably the first people to worship the great Dorje Shugden in their own Sakya Monastery!!!
Therefore DS is definitely not sectarian!
We see that the protector upholds the sacred Dharma of Je Tsongkhapa, that's why he has a sword on top of his regalia and even the sole of Guru Rinpoche's shoes too!
Yes, the Sakyas propitiate Dorje Shugden and even the Nyingmas must have too. There are old antique thangkas of Dorje Shugden with Guru Rinpoche above him.
Yes, the claim that dorje shugden is "sectarian" is totally incorrect because the Sakyapas did (still do?) propitiate Dorje Shugden and has had a very long history with him.
Dorje Shugden is an emanation of Manjushri, a Buddha. How can a Buddha be sectarian?! It doesn't make sense! yes, he helps to protect Tsongkhapa's lineage, but that DOESN'T MEAN he is against the other lineages!
It's like we protect & defend our own parents, but it doesn't mean we are against & hate other pple's parents!
Isn't Dorje Shugden Sakya Pandita before in a previous life? He is intimately connected to the Sakya lineage and probably why the Sakya initially recognised him as a Protector.
The call to ban Dorje Shugden practice has escalated into the most talked about Buddhist campaign. Having guided the practioners all this while has not caused any trouble. HH Gaden Trisur is continuing his practice with his household now in Shar Gaden.
Dorje Shugden first arose among the Sakyas who propitiated Him as a supermundane Enlightened Dharma Protector. One proof of this is a Praise of the Protector Dorje Shugden composed by the great Sakyapa master, Kunkhyen Ngawang Kunga Lodroe. (Sachen Kunga Lodro is the forefather of the current Sakya Trizin!!!)
Read it in the forum section of the antishugden [dot] com site
HH the Sakya Trizin just said this out of convenience, Dorje Shugden was first enthroned in a Sakya Monastery, why did't the Sakya Trizin then say something? Why wait till now? Sakya Trizin is a great being, like Dalai Lama, but it is the Tibetan government that makes an ugly scene out of this for their own political gain.
I wonder how it will be like after HH the Dalai Lama passes, sorry to say? Wouldnt Dorje Shugden practice spread like wild fire all over the world, to Tibetans and non Tibetans? It seems like NOW its just a beginning of a promo campaign that looks like HHDL is the bad DS cop. Hmmmm
There must be a bigger reason behind all this controversial Publicity created. By HHDL saying NO to DS He is in fact is asking people to really choose either Guru Devotion / Samsara Politics. Perhaps real Dharma is put to the test?
HHDL has created a situation on DS so big knowing people will react on both sides, but on another level he is so kind as to sacrifice his reputation for the sake of preserving DS practice for the next generation.
If Dorje Shugden is a 'spirit' and is not Buddhist to pratice worshiping spirit then why does Tibetan Govt relies on Nechung; whos a 'spirit'? In this case, they shld not rely on Nechung at all, no?
Now HH Gaden Trisur's is openly saying he IS PRACTISING DORJE SHUGDEN hence defect to Shar Gaden. Hes no ordinary monk but a high Lama, the obvious is understood; Shugden is not a spirit!!!
Many high Lamas till this day does DS practice n I'm sure more will stand up for what is true soon.
how kind the lamas are, using all these many skiful methods. The Dalai "risks" his reputation, gets his name dragged thru the mud, faces protests, goes to court...
The Gaden Tripa & other high lamas "risk" being ostracised or attacked by their own tibetan community...
By all this, DS is actually becoming bigger & bigger, more widespread and many more people are practising.
perhaps this is exactly what Dalai Lama wants - by this ban, SO MANY HIGH LAMAS are making DS known by their actions. E.g. Trijang Rinpoche and Gaden Trisul's move to Shar Gaden. Perhaps the high lamas and all the enlightened beings are all in cahoots - playing good cop, bad cop so that ultimately, DS now becomes the most TALKED ABOUT PRACTICE IN THE WORLD!
great news huh about Gaden Trisul... it is amazing to see the courage that the Lamas have for their practice... they would sacrifice "everything" (their reputation, any support from tibt govt etc) for the sake of their practice and great devotion to DS
101th Gaden Tripa has just retired. HH Gaden Trisur Rinpoche (title given after retirement)and his ladrang has left Gaden Shartse Monastery and JOINED SHAR GADEN.
The Sakyas have a long history of reliance on Dorje Shugden because one of the earlier incarnations of Dorje Shugden was Sakya Pandita. If you want to know which eminent Lamas have relied on him, do a google search on 'Dorje Shugden History' and check out the first result which is a brilliant site by Trinley Kalsang giving scholarly information about the Sakya's relationship with Shugden. Sakya Trizin's father used to practise Shugden too!
Pity this was only in tibetan... but it was interesting to read the comments below. Close relative - i didnt realise that Dorje SHugden was also practised by the Sakyas... that's why i got curious when i saw the video in the list.. then found it's in tibetan..argh! haha.. anyway, Red Niece.. yes core of Tibetan Buddhism is Guru devotion, And i agree with you. I follow what my Guru says.. doesnt matter what others say. I;ve checked him out and he's right for me and has a valid lineage. the end.
Didn't the Sakyas also practice Dorje Shugdan in the past because his previous incarnations include lineage masters like Sakya Pandita and the mahasiddha Virupa?
The heart of Buddhist practice (especially in the Tibetan tradition) is Guru devotion, Guru yoga.
Do we choose to believe what our own kind Lamas have advised us to do? Or listen to other Lamas with a big title? ALL these Lamas are holy, they contribute towards the growth of Dharma. But if we hop around everywhere and are selective in what we choose to listen to and believe, then we will never get anywhere in our practice, and we put down and demote our own Gurus.
Read Trijang Rinpoche's incredible commentary in one full volume that he wrote in the late 70's. It is all about Shugden and his lineage/practice/etc.
Go to the website dorjeshugden (dot) com and print out the commentary for free.
Incredible piece of work by the Tutor of HH the 14th Dalai Lama.
The commentary wasn't written for just high lamas, It is for everyone.
The state protector Nechung is unable to help the Dalai Lama gain autonomy or freedom for Tibet.
The Tibetan Govt should invoke the Dorje Shugden protector, apologize and ask his help and seek his advice.
Dorje Shugden is a very powerful being that can be a great ally, friend and help to the Dalai Lama. Dalai Lama needs all the friends he can get both human and non-human.
His Eminence Sakya Trinzin, above, is no longer an ordained monk, but has a wife and children. He is the head of one of the four Tibetan schools of Buddhism known as the Sakyas or Sakyapa. In many of the Tibetan schools of Buddhism the heads of a linage of buddhist teachings wear robes. Not all wearing robes are ordained monks or nuns, but have many great realizations none-the-less,and vast knowledge to go with it to teach others. In the Tibetan government also wear certain earings.
Put earring or not, put a shirt or not, regardless of someone is a monk, a lama, Sanyasi, we should all respect every human. Not respecting anyone contradict Buddhism Teaching itself.
we respect you and we would like you to respect our protector as well. DO NOT CALL OUR PROTECTOR IN DEROGATIVE NAME. WE SHOULD STRIVE TO UNITE ALL FOUR SECT IN HARMONOUS ENVIRONMENT.
Tibetans must know how they have gone wrong in accepting Joe Hamilton as their protector for the Free Tibet movement. He is not Nangpa. He made death-threats against me and hung death-tokens on my door. He is Lokta; LokYem; Tak Tsung Nang Trel Chak Cheu; Mutekpa. Furthermore, this trash insults Kalachakra, which he calls KALAWAKA. Tibetans don't realize they're associating with an enemy of Tibet, of Tibetans and of Tibetan Tantric Buddhism, the world's highest culture
Indian High court in New Delhi is summoning Dalai Lama to court due to his unconstitutional ban on the ancient practice of Dorje Shugden on his own people.
In India where there are so many religions and their subsects, it is unheard of that a secular/religious leader can issue such a ban.
It has shocked the Indian psyche.
Preliminary hearings have began.
Aljazeera news has a special report. It is posted on the youtube.
lhagyalo, I have difficulty believing you are not tibetan or buddhist...first off, if you aren't buddhist then why do you believe in a buddhist deity? second, you behave like most other tibetans i've met - posting hateful attacks in crude english that is! either way it doesn't matter. keep on posting, all ur doing is showing yourself how ignorant and hateful an individual you are. i can't believe you are telling me to 'do something good' when YOU are the psycho who can't stop slandering people
oh yea chinese and those who hates tibet are using such a good words!!! if u think i will say like that then it is a HEIGHT OF JOKE...
it is ppl like u who always attack in real, hey man u really need to change urslef, they is no harm in being a good person....nways i should have never touch the SHIT...
No democratic leader in the world today would condemn or stop any form of religious worship.
Even the Pope dare not speak against other religions anymore.
Today's world leaders must show acceptance and tolerance of all forms of worship even the worship of Dorje Shugden.
The Dharamsala Tibetan Govt only has a few years left and they are on the decline. Their existence depends on Dalai Lama. Once he passes,THEY ARE FINISHED.
I advise them to stop all this anti shugden rhetoric.
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After the Dalai Lama passes away Kalon Tripa act until they find the reincarnation of the 15th dalai lama.
MrChemayshola 6 months ago
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The Tsem Tulku Organization runs wwwdorjeshugdencom, they are also the ones dropping DS pamphlets all over Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia. People who leave the organization or otherwise find out their secret are subject to abuse and death threats. Kechara House is a dangerous cult that has betrayed His Holiness the Dalai Lama, the Tibetan Community, and most of all, Gaden Shartse Monastery. Please circulate this information far and wide.
ivivism 9 months ago
It could be mentioned that this talk is in Tibetan with no translation. I don't know after watching it if he was even for or against the practice.
11abraxas11 10 months ago
"A worldly protector on the lowest level of the pantheon."
Varavaken 1 year ago
Hi, does anybody know what His Eminence is saying about this much debated Dorje Shugden topic? No English subtitles in this clip... hope to understand his views on this topic.
edenstrauss2008 1 year ago
請你尊重護法多杰雄丹和薩迦前輩們.........................
Asks you to respect protects dorje shugden outstanding male Dan and the Sa'gya seniors ...........................
snowlandtulku 1 year ago
請你尊重護法多杰雄丹和薩迦前輩們...........................
snowlandtulku 1 year ago
the UNMISTAKEN INCARNATION of Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsen is back!!
see dorjeshugden ( dot) com for the full story of how this is shaking up the foundations of the spiritual world!
Looks like there is just NO STOPPING the Bodhisattvas from returning to help the world over and over again
TheRedNiece 1 year ago
@TheRedNiece
Since 2005 the Chinese Government has the authority to select "living Buddhas"
in Tibet.
It´s China politics. They want control.
Varavaken 1 year ago
@TheRedNiece WE are the ones we've been waiting for. There is no saviour but yourself!
dojonane 1 year ago
Not to disrespect anyone's culturally valued practices, but in your Heart of Hearts, in the core of the jewel of Bodhichitta, does calling upon any entity or divine manifestation outside of yourself truly constitute the middle path of compassionate action? What use are these manifestations to the common sense practice of opening our Hearts to one another?
"Your serried squadrons, which the world
With all its gods cannot defeat,
I shall now break with wisdom
As with a stone a clay pot."
dojonane 1 year ago
I would like a translation of Sakya Trizin´s words!
Varavaken 1 year ago
The truth is that this very Sakya Trizin owes his birth to Dorje Shugden and his parents have always been very thankful to him. Dorje Shugden practice has always been an integral part of the Sakya tradition and the beautiful Sakya Kangso refers to him as a manifestation of Chenresig and the protector of all the three vehicles.
dulwadzinpa 1 year ago
@dulwadzinpa
Sakya Trizin says that while some in his lineage made offerings to DS, he was always regarded as a MUNDANE PROTECTOR on the lowest level of the pantheon.
Stop spreading LIES!
Varavaken 1 year ago
@Varavaken
What I am saying is certainly not a lie. It can be proven by various sources such as the Sakya Kangso od Dorje Shugden wich was recited regularely in many Sakya monasteries until 1996 including the most prominent in Tibet. If you are truly interested I can see if i can get a copy and show it to you. The story about Sakya Trizins father asking Dorje Shugden for help when he couldnt get a child is well known in tibetan society, you can ask any elderly Sakya they will confirm.
dulwadzinpa 1 year ago
@dulwadzinpa
I´m not interested in old "stories". I was repeating Sakya Trizin´s words. DS is a lower dharmapala of Tibetan background. It´s not correct to call DS "a manifestation of Chenresig", you are misleading people.
Varavaken 1 year ago
@Varavaken
What you are saying doesnt make any sense. Everything I said is nothing but a formal matter of fact, not necessarily reflecting my own opinion. The Sakya kangso refers to Dorje Shugden as manifestation of Chenresig. Anyone can choose what to believe anway.
dulwadzinpa 1 year ago
@dulwadzinpa
Mahakala...
Varavaken 1 year ago
@dulwadzinpa
Tibetan Buddhists see MAHAKALA as the wrathful form of CHENREZIG.
Don´t confuse MAHAKALA (an undisputed Dharmaprotector) with dorje shugden.
Varavaken 1 year ago
@Varavaken
To be honest there is not so much logic in your reply. Are you saying that technically Chenresig can have only one manifestation? All I was saying was that in the Sakya tradition Dorje Shugden was regarded as manifestation of Chenresig prior to the ban and many Sakyapa do so up to this day. Wich I can prove to you easily. This has nothing to do with Mahakala whatsoever.
dulwadzinpa 1 year ago
@dulwadzinpa
Stop misleading people!
Read Sakya Trizin´s words, it is a quote:
Sakya Trizin says that while some in his lineage made offerings to DS, DS was ALWAYS regarded as "A MUNDANE PROTECTOR ON THE LOWEST LEVEL OF THE PANTHEON".
May I remind you that not all Shugden practitioners think of him as a Buddha.
Varavaken 1 year ago
Go to "Tibetan Buddhism goes West"
or "Western Shugden Society - unlocked" for real information!
Varavaken 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Dorje Shugden centres are mushrooming everywhere. HH Gaden Trisur, the 101th ex throne holder of Lama Tsongkhapa, who is the head of all Gelugpas defects to Shar Gaden and will soon turn the wheel of Dharma by giving a teaching. What wonderful admirable example that gives strength and faith to DS practitioners worldwide. Amazing how despite all the Bad thing they say abt DS and DS practitioners, we are still moving on and moving up!
dragonthunder2010 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Dorje Shugden centres are mushrooming everywhere. HH Gaden Trisur, the 101th ex throne holder of Lama Tsongkhapa, who is the head of all Gelugpas defects to Shar Gaden and will soon turn the wheel of Dharma by giving a teaching. What wonderful admirable example that gives strength and faith to DS practitioners worldwide. Amazing how despite all the Bad thing they say abt DS and DS practitioners, we are still moving on and moving up!
dragonthunder2010 1 year ago
I agree totally, closerelative.
vinayahoIder 1 year ago
Shugden/WSS/NKT is just a business. It benefits several top "leaders" (translation: business partners) and acts as the lapdog for the CCP.
Sadly, it tricks regular people into thinking they are being benefitted, only to discover the foundation is built on a spiritual pyramid plan.
Beware This Cult. There is a world of true Dharma available, which does NOT require the cult-like subservience so inherent in NKT.
cIoserelative 1 year ago 13
@cIoserelative
I agree, closerelative
Varavaken 1 year ago
Comment removed
cpvu1991 1 year ago
@cIoserelative They should recall that in teaching spiritual truths the Buddha always uses these concepts and ideas in the way that a raft is used to cross a river. Once the river has been crossed over, the raft is of no more use, and should be discarded.
- the diamond sutra
100% with you my friend
cpvu1991 1 year ago
Instead of talking so much about Dorje Shugden is bad or evil, perhaps the focus can be inward looking at what they can do to improve in their education system, skills, community activities, promote their culture without having to always depend on the Dalai Lama's name and start standing on their own two feet.
dragonthunder2010 1 year ago
@dragonthunder2010 it is a big question: what is going to happen after the dalai lama passes away? Who will the tibetans listen to then? And then what happens to all the "decrees" he has made such as about Dorje Shugden?
I believe then people will start looking to the lamas who r benefiting the world through dharma, not merely through politics like the TGIE. Dorje Shugden's practice will arise again not by politics but by the example of all the wonderful lamas' actions & work for others.
TheRedNiece 1 year ago 5
@TheRedNiece
He will find a successor.
Varavaken 1 year ago
@TheRedNiece Shugden lamas are very loyal to the Chinese Communist Party.
Not political? What a joke...
Varavaken 1 year ago
@TheRedNiece
The monastic communities are against this practice as you know. This will not
change.
Right now the Chinese rulers are using Shugden as a means to subjucate the Tibetan people. Tibetan monks in Tibet have no choice but to accept. If they don´t they are seen as "members of the "unpatriotic Dalai clique", they risk imprisonment.
Shugden worship is promoted by China only, no other nation is promoting it.
But the CCP WILL NOT LAST FOREVER.
Keep that in mind.
Varavaken 1 year ago
@dragonthunder2010
So you want to help the Tibetans promote their culture, do you? How sweet.
Do you want to give them re-education?
Varavaken 1 year ago
Yes I have also seen the anti Shugden website and yes I totally agree it is quite filled with superstitious rubbish!
Most of facts claim has no supporting evidence and all there is is hot air bursting without proper facts.
Makes you wonder are these the type of non-violent people following the Dalai Lama and a Buddhist nation? Quite sad.
dragonthunder2010 1 year ago
Unlike dorjeshugden (dot) com where there is constant news being updated even from the monasteries themselves, like shar gaden, serpom monastery, and others too. Its the current affairs for the DS issue if your interested.
wangchub 1 year ago
I have been to antishugden website, if you look closely its just another propaganda site with no substance, even the forum has no members posting anything to support anti shugden sentiment
wangchub 1 year ago
@wangchub hahahaha this anti-shugden website is really rubbish. I've seen it too. It's so inflammatory, childish and not backed up by facts at all. I feel quite sad actually that this is how they reflect the Dalai Lama. They promote and defend HHDL by being malicious and aggressive towards DS and DS practitioners. What kind of spiritual leader are they trying to represent? Shame.
TheRedNiece 1 year ago
@TheRedNiece Thats quite a funny way of looking at someones Dharma practce? the people who set up the site anti shugden, to the people who promote down with DS practitioners, down with DS. This is Dharma practice is it? Leaving out WSS what about all the DS practitioners who practice in htis way, just what are they practicing? compassion, wisdom, love, understanding, peace, harmony.
wangchub 1 year ago
Yes ive been to the anti shugden website and it's quite dead. I guess they don't care enough or are committed enough to their cause, which happens to suit me just fine. :)
wisdombeing 1 year ago 2
What is the reality behind these statements?
TheDharmaKnight 1 year ago
On the contrary, to Western audiences the Dalai Lama repeatedly says that he issued this ban In order to save this pure and profound Tibetan Buddhism from degenerating into spirit worship. And This ban is applied in order to promote peace and harmony between the four Tibetan Buddhist traditions.
TheDharmaKnight 1 year ago
@TheDharmaKnight
Wow! SOunds to me two different goals. So which one is it???
If the Dalai Lama used such stern and harsh speech to coerced people from voting, then it is no wonder so many were in a dilemma and probably did it out of fear of being ostracized or kicked out from the monasteries. Hence the voting system is a fraud, no?
We hope that they will one day find the courage to stand up to what they know is true in their heart!
dragonthunder2010 1 year ago
@dragonthunder2010 There's actually information on the dorjeshugden ( do t) com website and also discussions on the forum that look at how the ban of DS is actually not in line with the code of the vinaya... i.e. the ban itself is not really "legal" in the monastic context... do have a read. Very interesting to understand the context that this practice was "de-legalised"
TheRedNiece 1 year ago
The justification given to the Tibetan public, which destroyed the entire harmony of the Tibetan community, is: Worshipping this evil deity is a danger for my life and for the freedom of Tibet. If you Tibetans want me to be dammed and dont care at all about the cause of Tibet, then go ahead with the worship of this deity.
TheDharmaKnight 1 year ago
China is destroying Buddhism in Tibet
The Shugden groups are destroying Buddhism in the West.
They support each other.
Shugden people are running after money.
Money from China.
The triple murder is still unsolved. The suspected murderers have Chinese protection. They came from China/Tibet and they went back. China keeps sending Shugden monks to India to destabilize the Tibetan community.
Those monks are portrayed as victims in tashidelek17´s propaganda videos....
Varavaken 1 year ago
isn't it highly ironic that there is so much accusation against Gelugpas and DS practitioners that they are sectarian??
In fact, the whole basis of Gelugpa teachings is the synthesis of teachings from the three other schools of Buddhism. So actually all of Gelugpa teachings includes and is taken from nyingma, sakya and kagyu! So how can that be sectarian??
TheRedNiece 1 year ago
"I stand with the monks of Burma
I stand with the monks of Lhasa
I stand with the students of Tiananmen"
Good mantra, thepurpleaster..
Varavaken 1 year ago
The below is a beautiful Sakyapa prayer to Dorje Shugden, composed by the great Sakyapa master Kunkhyen Ngawang Kunga Lodroe
(an excerpt from the Dorje Shugden prayer called duelzin choe ki gyalpo choepai choka phuentsog doe gu yong khil she jawa)
You can get this prayer at Dorje Shugden (dot) com's forum post on: Is this Dorje Shugden from Sakya tradition?
dragonthunder2010 1 year ago
Thus by the power of venerating you with this ocean of melodious praise,
through generating delight, compassion, and benevolent force of your mind,
please fulfil the activity for increasing of virtues, pacifying of disfavourable interferences,
and accomplishment of all the purposes in accordance to Dharma.
dragonthunder2010 1 year ago
The great protector of all the Buddhas of this fortunate aeon,
who is the eliminator of all the forces of unsuitable Mara,
some day through showing full enlightenment as Samyaksambuddha,
you will fulfil the deed of a Tathagata, to you I prostrate.
In short, in all three times, uninterruptedly,
with your infinite secrets of body speech and mind,
all those beings who are wandering in the ocean of the cycle,
you give them the perfect state of liberation, to you I prostrate.
dragonthunder2010 1 year ago
What is happening here?
Varavaken 1 year ago
Dorje Shugden has traditionally been invoked by orthodox Gelugpas in the past and fundamentalists in our days in open antagonism against the other Tibetan schools.
Varavaken 1 year ago
You guys got to read about what they say on dorjeshugden's website forum. They found a website that displayed a Sakya thangka of Dorje Shugden that was enthroned on a lion-throne, much like how we would depict a fully-enlightened Buddha. It must be pervasive in the Sakya tradition to worship Dorje Shugden as such.
closerelative 1 year ago
I stand with the monks of Burma
I stand with the monks of Lhasa
I stand with the students of Tiananmen
I stand against oppression everywhere.
Hu Jintao: Step down and stop sending the people's money to your son's bank account!
thepurpIeaster 1 year ago
I support fully the New People's Democracy Party
thepurpIeaster 1 year ago
I support Charter 08
thepurpIeaster 1 year ago
I denounce the CCP
I denounce Hu Jintao
I denounce Wen Jiabao
thepurpIeaster 1 year ago
NEWS FLASH!!! Check out all the other Gelug schools with Dorje Shugden practice still alive and well and flourishing
# Serpom Thösam Norling Monastery, Bylakuppe, India (even got a website)
# Dorje Shugden Monastery in Chakzamka, Riwoche, Tibet Kham Area
# Phelgyeling Monastery
# Denma Gonsa Rinpoches Monastery
# Shar Gaden Monastery, India and the list goes on and doesn't end there!
thepurpleaster 1 year ago
The Gelug school has cut the bond with D.S.
Varavaken 1 year ago
@Varavaken
And STOP hacking in to people's account. That is against the Law or did you learn this from your Govt.?? Bad representation man!!! Get a life!
thepurpleaster 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
It's not hacked.
DS is completely represented by WSS. No one talked about DS in the west until WSS did.
NKT is WSS, from conception through today.
This new attempt to portray NKT as suddenly Dalai Lama-friendly comes too late, unfortunately.
If NKT has had a change of policy and heart, it will have to spend as many years (or more) counteracting its original propaganda as it did generating it.
vinayahoIder 1 year ago
At any rate, you of all people have no business complaining about hacking, lol.
vinayahoIder 1 year ago
thepurpleaster
Hacking accounts? I don´t know what you´re talking about. I wouldn´t know how.
Varavaken 1 year ago
Quote from HHDL: Statement of His Holiness the Dalai Lama on the 51st Anniversary of the Tibetan National Uprising Day
Wed, March 10 2010 @ 08:34 am UTC
It is also essential that the 1.3 billion Chinese people have free access to information about their own country and elsewhere, as well as freedom of expression and the rule of law. >>>So can there please be freedom for Dorje Shuden practice and it being expressed OPENLY??? As rule and law of any democratic society, I believe it CAN BE SO!
dragonthunder2010 1 year ago
I agree with your last remark, thepurpleaster. "The child of such promise..."
Varavaken 1 year ago
I find it so sad when I see how this cross-fertilisation of Eastern spiritual knowledge with our Western understanding of material matters, has produced this child of such promise, (the NKT),... only to see that child now grown into adulthood as a slick, slippery-tongued used car sales man whose golden dream is to have a chain of his used car lots in every major city of the world.
thepurpIeaster 1 year ago
In H.E. Choyang Duldzin's autobio, he also mentioned that during his tenure as Secretary of the Co-operative Society, he worked very hard to obtained the funds for the monks quarters, not only for Ganden but also for Drepung, and the Nyingma and Sakya monks as well (that doesnt sound very sectarian does it?)
thepurpleaster 1 year ago
@thepurpleaster Thanks for sharing this nice info about Kuten Lama. It's true what you have said about these lamas being true reflections of DS practitioners - they uphold the Dharma with such great strength throughout their lives and show the real essence of Dorje Shugden which is compassion, tenacity and genuine kindness for others, which is what keeps them going in the face of so much adversity
TheRedNiece 1 year ago
You can read all about this humble nomadic boy's story on how he became an Oracle Lama, (which is a high position in the Tibetan hierarchy). How he served his people. This is a true story and an inspiration for everyone. His qualities are what a real Dorje Shugden practitioner should aspire to have.
It on the Biographies section on dorje shuden (dot) com
thepurpleaster 1 year ago
His Eminence Choyang Duldzin Kuten Lama (1917-2002) served as an oracle of Dorje Shugden. And in Phagri Monastery, one of the earlier monastery he was at studying, He as an oracle of Dorje Shugden use to give help and advices to many people in that area all from different traditions in fact! So that doesn't sound very sectarian to me. I guess if he really was not a protector, then why should he help?
thepurpleaster 1 year ago
There are many records of Dorje shugden being propitiated by the Sakya school and high sakya lamas.
For example, Mochen Kunga Lhundrup was known for writing many praises to Sakya, read about on the dorjeshugdenhistory (dot ) org website
So what's up with the sudden change in mind? Does that mean all the lamas who practised DS before were all wrong???
TheRedNiece 1 year ago
The Ban on Dorje Shugden: What is happening?
To read more on the effects of the ban on the practice of Dorje Shugden, the summary can be found at dorjeshugden(dot)com/wp/?p=2200
thepurpleaster 1 year ago
Unless this great big fuss is driven by politics, ego, insecurities on who takes over, who has more power and more control over their people??? For whatever the reasons, the world ain't that blind to see, so before it's too late - lets stop the nonsense of this BAN!
thepurpleaster 1 year ago
Why are we so worried about Dorje Shugden practice and practitioners? I mean if DS practice is really that "BAD", I am sure karma will catch up and they will not be able to go one practicing because they would have taken rebirth in the 3 lower realms based on the logic of cause and effect - correct? So let their karma take care of them, what's the big fuss?
thepurpleaster 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
If DS is a mundane protector on the lowest level of the pantheon, why is it that the highest of the Lamas can't banish and destroy him?
Why don't the assembly of Buddhas and Bodhisattvas gather to subdue him?
Why don't the host of Dharmapalas remove his heart crystal?
Wouldn't it be easier to eliminate one instead of having to remove us all?
harrynephew 1 year ago
Lmao, look at the change in language style of the Jan 11 Clique; the westerner that was hired to be the "Jan. 11 voice" has been back-burnered, as she's out of her depth now. The wmd have taken over temporarily, due to the upcoming sensitive date.
vinayahoIder 1 year ago
Oh how wonderful harrynephew!
It is wonderful that Dorje Shugden is worshipped in other sects and other schools of Buddhism too. It means he's a protector of Buddhism.
I don't understand why people are accusing him of sectarianism
jayasina 1 year ago
If you study the texts & prayers of Dorje shugden, his main aim is to help practitioners to achieve attainments in Dharma: bodhicitta & wisdom. DS Lamas & practitioners have always advised n taught that DS helps anyone who prays and practices sincerely. Its not about what sect you are from, but whether you are sincerely practicing Dharma. That is what DS wants most. After all, at the end of the day, when ur enlightened, who cares if u got there by being sakya, gelug, nyingma etc!!
TheRedNiece 1 year ago
when we talk of the question of sectarianism, it isn't that the practice is sectarian (how can a Buddha be sectarian?!). Sectarianism and schism occurs when PEOPLE speak or act in wrong and harmful ways. The Buddhist practices themselves never set out to harm or cause any sort of damage.
TheRedNiece 1 year ago
when Kalu Rinpoche toured the mother monastery of Sakya, a temple caretaker took Kalu Rinpoche for a tour to the different chapels in the sacred space.
Upon reaching the chapel of the Great King Dorje Shugden, the caretaker took of his shoes before entering and made obeisance to DS telling Kalu Rinpoche that DS is ONE WITH THE THREE JEWELS!
harrynephew 1 year ago
The Sakya school has always been particularly close with Dorje Shugden. Although, Dorje Shugden was not the main protector but it enjoy a period of prominence due to one of the deity's previous incarnation - Sakya Pandita. Hence, the Sakya's were the first to propitiate Dorje Shugden.
closerelative 1 year ago
closerelative
Propitiate is one thing.
But refuge....
The head of Sakya tradition says that DS was regarded as a mundane protector, although some Sakya made offerings to him. ("A mundane protector on the lowest level of the pantheon.")
Varavaken 1 year ago
If DS is a mundane protector on the lowest level of the pantheon, why is it that the highest of the Lamas can't banish and destroy him?
Why don't the assembly of Buddhas and Bodhisattvas gather to subdue him?
Why don't the host of Dharmapalas remove his heart crystal?
Wouldn't it be easier to eliminate one instead of having to remove us all?
harrynephew 1 year ago
If DS is a mundane protector on the lowest level of the pantheon, why is it that the highest of the Lamas can't banish and destroy him?
Why don't the assembly of Buddhas and Bodhisattvas gather to subdue him?
Why don't the host of Dharmapalas remove his heart crystal?
Wouldn't it be easier to eliminate one instead of having to remove us all?
harrynephew 1 year ago
yes i definitely agree with u red niece,
HHDL has no karma to be harmed if he hasn't done anything wrong but enlightened Beings do at many times do the 'wrong' thing in order to help the bigger picture.
when the buddha was a bodhisattva in a ship full of people and was attacked by a pirate. the Bodhisattva had to kill the pirate in order to save the ship load of people. the bodhisattva has to go thru mild retribution for the action but he saved many lives by killing one.
harrynephew 1 year ago
Many high lamas like Sakya Gongma Rinpoche and lay people have relied on Dorje Shugden for generations after generations, so how can these high lamas be wrong? They have taken rebirth again and again and they are still doing this practice, until the recent ban.
pathseeker9 1 year ago
I think this is another attempt to show that high lama supports the ban of Dorje Shugden. So it's funny that you asked those who practice it to say negative things about their protector that they have relied on for so long. It's just a cover up due to political pressure.
Sunny62Day 1 year ago
This is funny! The previous life of Sakya Trizin recognise Dorje Shugden. In fact, Dorje Shugden was recognised by the Sakyas first before it became a so-called "Gelugpa" Protector. What's more interesting, I have seen Dorje Shugden thangkas with Guru Rinpoche above him and that means there were even Nyingmas who practice Dorje Shugden. You guys should check out dorjeshugden(dot)com...
closerelative 1 year ago
by the way - for a good balance of views without all the nastiness, check out websites like dorjeshugden (dot) com and wisdombuddhadorjeshugden dot (com) which has a good range of articles and good credible resources. And presented in a fair, mature manner that allows readers to form their own opinion. there's a good forum on the first site too which encourages sharing of views.
TheRedNiece 1 year ago
Comments on various videos have grown nasty. These comments have turned into vulgarities and nothing else. This should stop. Let both sides have their say, without having to use profanities. Please do not mess up the Forum.
zamzam24388 1 year ago
@zamzam24388 bravo! It's sad that people have become so nasty in the name of defending their religion / their Lamas.
Study what is always said in Dalai Lama's teachings and/or Dorje Shugden's sadhana - there is nothing nasty in it and they promote nothing but peace and kindness... something which is not being practised here at all! :(
TheRedNiece 1 year ago
@TheRedNiece I agree with you. I wonder why people keep thinking that the practice will harm Tibetan or Dalai Lama.
There are many different prayers online which I found at dorjeshugden[dot]com under the prayer section.
pathseeker9 1 year ago
I found a prayer there composed by the current Dalai Lama (the 14th Dalai Lama) with the title: Melody of the Unceasing Vajra.
Now, why is it that Dalai Lama recognise Dorje Shugden as a Buddha and then later said he was wrong and that his Gurus was wrong?
Sunny62Day 1 year ago
@pathseeker9 I think it is illogical that this practice can harm the dalai Lama.
We believe that Dalai Lama is Avalokiteshvara who is an enlightened being... so how can Avalokiteshvara be harmed by a spirit? That is so illogical! That's saying that a spirit has more power than a Buddha???
TheRedNiece 1 year ago
@pathseeker9 oh yah i wanted to add... that after all we do, and at the end of the day, every individual faces his or her own karma. no matter how harmful DS is supposed to be, if someone does not have the karma to be harmed, they will not be harmed. If we believe that Dalai Lama is an enlightened being, he doesn't have a karma to be harmed.
TheRedNiece 1 year ago
kokoliam59
The Chinese puppet Panchen Lama will never be a religious leader for the Tibetan people. And that you know.
"We have to pray more, do more good things... and listen to the Chinese Communist Party."
WHAT HAPPENED TO THE PANCHEN LAMA WHO DISSAPPEARED???? I´d like to know...
Varavaken 1 year ago
Comment removed
Varavaken 1 year ago
Look, let's think about it. After all the conflict between 多杰雄登 [Duo Jie Xiong Deng, dorjeshugden] and Dalai, only one thing is clear: the Banchan lama [Panchen], 班禅喇嘛 is the only true Teacher. Thank goodness he is now old enough to lead, in our time of confusion and trouble!
kokoIiam59 1 year ago
You mean he is now enough brainwashed by CCP !
Ganeschar 1 year ago
Notice how, the anti-Dalai Lama videos, many of the people who first "stopped by the video," their accounts are closed now. That because when the video began, YouTube was open in China but soon after it close, their acct was closed also.
TibetHeart 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
TibetHeart 1 year ago
also many links to strong anti-Tibetan behaviors on youtube
look at Dale157, and his minions
TibetHeart 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
TibetHeart 1 year ago
Tibetheart: Just because someone practises Dorje Shugden, it doesn't mean they work for the Chinese government! There is no correlation whatsoever.
Believe it or not, there are some people who just sincerely love this protector and just want to do his practice because they have seen and experienced the benefit that can be gained by this practice, especially in their spiritual path. I don't even know anyone in China!!!!
TheRedNiece 1 year ago
theredass, fuck you chinese stray dogs, bitch ass pussy shukden....shukden sucks huji tao's dick
Tibsoccerguy8 1 year ago
ALSO some of you are friend with Maohammet, on of the most vile anti-Tibetan hateful talkers on YouTube. This shows, you are working for the Chinese government. It's quite easy to see. Just follow the links.
If you were strong in your view, you don't have to creat 15-20 fake youtube Identities.
TibetHeart 1 year ago
he is a 50 cent agent
Ganeschar 1 year ago
harrynephew
why you and DharmaDefender, TheRedNiece, ton of others, all join the same day, Jan 11, 2010?
TibetHeart 1 year ago
"No man from outside can make you free, nor can organized worship."
(Krishnamurti)
Varavaken 1 year ago
Please I petition all you holy Lamas to not continue to confuse us human beings any further. There is great hope in everyone's spiritual well being. I pray that with each and our individual ways, we will be able to follow our Guru's advice, receive our Yidam's blessings and be protected by our assigned Dharmapala.
This is the only right way.
harrynephew 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
His Holi Shit the Dalai Lama has never acted like a Human being in his whole life. In fact everything this low life animal does is only to benefit all western anti China mother fuckers.
Truth is have you talked to a dharmsala tbeg that has brains ?
Truth is a tbeg with brains has not been born yet !
Truth is a tbeg that is not a crawling animal has not been born yet !
Truth is a non lying tbeg has not been born yet !
Truth is a non cock sucking tbeg has not been born yet !
lol.........
DogshitIama 1 year ago
Since Pabongkha, D.S. is exclusevily associated with Gelug sectarianism.
A Dharma protector for the "magical suppression of the other schools".
Varavaken 1 year ago
Don't let this one video of Sakya Tenzin's comments let you down. There are many, many great lamas out there who are sincere and ardent Dorje Shugden practitioners. the dorjeshugden website has many beautiful writeups and old photos of their history, lineage and deep connection with DS check it all out on dorjeshugden (dot) com
dharmadolly 1 year ago
Sectarianism is the basis of all buddhist schools of thought! Why? because the Buddha taught 84000 ways to enlightenment that each school can practise their own path to enlightenment and it would still be just as correct as the other schools. keeping them pure is nothing new, they have been separate from Buddhas time up until now, and each school has had attained masters as a result of the different paths, thervada, mahayana, vajrayana.
nostra120 1 year ago
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Dalai lama wants a democratic system for Tibetans.
Yet what democratic leader would say that a certain group may not join his public talks due to their religious orientation?
Imagine if Obama said all jews cannot attend his public talks because they don't accept Christ? That could never happen.
So If Dalai lama wishes to emulate G-7 democratic leadership, he has to stop ostracizing anyone even if they practice Dorje Shugden. Ghost or not..simple.
Democracy for all!
truth1888 2 years ago
harrynephew, You are right!
truth1888 2 years ago
OMG!!!
This is crazy! The Sakyas are probably the first people to worship the great Dorje Shugden in their own Sakya Monastery!!!
Therefore DS is definitely not sectarian!
We see that the protector upholds the sacred Dharma of Je Tsongkhapa, that's why he has a sword on top of his regalia and even the sole of Guru Rinpoche's shoes too!
How can DS be sectarian. He cares for all!
harrynephew 2 years ago
He does not care for Nyinmapa ! Explore more and listening to him and face with new reality !
We have no good !
Ganeschar 1 year ago
Yes, the Sakyas propitiate Dorje Shugden and even the Nyingmas must have too. There are old antique thangkas of Dorje Shugden with Guru Rinpoche above him.
closerelative 2 years ago
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How can any leader say don't attend my talks because you don't share my same spiritual beliefs?
If you are the Dalai lama, you are the secular and religious leader of all tibetans, hence you must respect all religioius faiths within your country.
Imagine if Obama says, all jews cannot attend his talk. Or all Shugden ppl cannot attend his public speeches.
That would be outrageous.
That is what Dalai lama is saying, if your Dorje Shugden ppl, don't come to my talks!
truth1888 2 years ago
Yes, the claim that dorje shugden is "sectarian" is totally incorrect because the Sakyapas did (still do?) propitiate Dorje Shugden and has had a very long history with him.
Dorje Shugden is an emanation of Manjushri, a Buddha. How can a Buddha be sectarian?! It doesn't make sense! yes, he helps to protect Tsongkhapa's lineage, but that DOESN'T MEAN he is against the other lineages!
It's like we protect & defend our own parents, but it doesn't mean we are against & hate other pple's parents!
TheRedNiece 2 years ago
Isn't Dorje Shugden Sakya Pandita before in a previous life? He is intimately connected to the Sakya lineage and probably why the Sakya initially recognised him as a Protector.
closerelative 2 years ago
The call to ban Dorje Shugden practice has escalated into the most talked about Buddhist campaign. Having guided the practioners all this while has not caused any trouble. HH Gaden Trisur is continuing his practice with his household now in Shar Gaden.
zamzam24388 2 years ago
Dorje Shugden first arose among the Sakyas who propitiated Him as a supermundane Enlightened Dharma Protector. One proof of this is a Praise of the Protector Dorje Shugden composed by the great Sakyapa master, Kunkhyen Ngawang Kunga Lodroe. (Sachen Kunga Lodro is the forefather of the current Sakya Trizin!!!)
Read it in the forum section of the antishugden [dot] com site
vinayaholder 2 years ago
HH the Sakya Trizin just said this out of convenience, Dorje Shugden was first enthroned in a Sakya Monastery, why did't the Sakya Trizin then say something? Why wait till now? Sakya Trizin is a great being, like Dalai Lama, but it is the Tibetan government that makes an ugly scene out of this for their own political gain.
lincong1 2 years ago
I wonder how it will be like after HH the Dalai Lama passes, sorry to say? Wouldnt Dorje Shugden practice spread like wild fire all over the world, to Tibetans and non Tibetans? It seems like NOW its just a beginning of a promo campaign that looks like HHDL is the bad DS cop. Hmmmm
thepurpleaster 2 years ago
There must be a bigger reason behind all this controversial Publicity created. By HHDL saying NO to DS He is in fact is asking people to really choose either Guru Devotion / Samsara Politics. Perhaps real Dharma is put to the test?
HHDL has created a situation on DS so big knowing people will react on both sides, but on another level he is so kind as to sacrifice his reputation for the sake of preserving DS practice for the next generation.
thepurpleaster 2 years ago
If Dorje Shugden is a 'spirit' and is not Buddhist to pratice worshiping spirit then why does Tibetan Govt relies on Nechung; whos a 'spirit'? In this case, they shld not rely on Nechung at all, no?
Now HH Gaden Trisur's is openly saying he IS PRACTISING DORJE SHUGDEN hence defect to Shar Gaden. Hes no ordinary monk but a high Lama, the obvious is understood; Shugden is not a spirit!!!
Many high Lamas till this day does DS practice n I'm sure more will stand up for what is true soon.
thepurpleaster 2 years ago
how kind the lamas are, using all these many skiful methods. The Dalai "risks" his reputation, gets his name dragged thru the mud, faces protests, goes to court...
The Gaden Tripa & other high lamas "risk" being ostracised or attacked by their own tibetan community...
By all this, DS is actually becoming bigger & bigger, more widespread and many more people are practising.
The lamas really are so kind
TheRedNiece 2 years ago
@ TheRedNiece
Why don't you say something about what you believe in or support on your channel ???
ChinaKillsTibetans 2 years ago
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perhaps this is exactly what Dalai Lama wants - by this ban, SO MANY HIGH LAMAS are making DS known by their actions. E.g. Trijang Rinpoche and Gaden Trisul's move to Shar Gaden. Perhaps the high lamas and all the enlightened beings are all in cahoots - playing good cop, bad cop so that ultimately, DS now becomes the most TALKED ABOUT PRACTICE IN THE WORLD!
TheRedNiece 2 years ago
great news huh about Gaden Trisul... it is amazing to see the courage that the Lamas have for their practice... they would sacrifice "everything" (their reputation, any support from tibt govt etc) for the sake of their practice and great devotion to DS
TheRedNiece 2 years ago
101th Gaden Tripa has just retired. HH Gaden Trisur Rinpoche (title given after retirement)and his ladrang has left Gaden Shartse Monastery and JOINED SHAR GADEN.
Read it in the forum at dorjeshugden(dot)com
TheDharmaKnight 2 years ago
truth1888
No matter how much China encourages Shugden practice in Tibet, it´s still not spreading....
Varavaken 2 years ago
No matter how much the Tibetan govt has done rituals, ceremonies and pujas to destroy, bind, or kill Dorje Shugden they are not able to.
It is amazing how many times they have tried. They have called high lamas from all Schools of Buddhism to eradicate Dorje Shugden yet they cannot.
What does that tell you, that they don't have enough power combined together against one Dorje Shugden?
Simple. Dorje Shugden is a Buddha and cannot be destroyed.
truth1888 2 years ago
You can hear him talk if you watch the documentary "The Spirit and the Controversy". English translation.
Varavaken 2 years ago
The Sakyas have a long history of reliance on Dorje Shugden because one of the earlier incarnations of Dorje Shugden was Sakya Pandita. If you want to know which eminent Lamas have relied on him, do a google search on 'Dorje Shugden History' and check out the first result which is a brilliant site by Trinley Kalsang giving scholarly information about the Sakya's relationship with Shugden. Sakya Trizin's father used to practise Shugden too!
Lineageholder 2 years ago
Pity this was only in tibetan... but it was interesting to read the comments below. Close relative - i didnt realise that Dorje SHugden was also practised by the Sakyas... that's why i got curious when i saw the video in the list.. then found it's in tibetan..argh! haha.. anyway, Red Niece.. yes core of Tibetan Buddhism is Guru devotion, And i agree with you. I follow what my Guru says.. doesnt matter what others say. I;ve checked him out and he's right for me and has a valid lineage. the end.
wisdombeing 2 years ago
Didn't the Sakyas also practice Dorje Shugdan in the past because his previous incarnations include lineage masters like Sakya Pandita and the mahasiddha Virupa?
closerelative 2 years ago
The heart of Buddhist practice (especially in the Tibetan tradition) is Guru devotion, Guru yoga.
Do we choose to believe what our own kind Lamas have advised us to do? Or listen to other Lamas with a big title? ALL these Lamas are holy, they contribute towards the growth of Dharma. But if we hop around everywhere and are selective in what we choose to listen to and believe, then we will never get anywhere in our practice, and we put down and demote our own Gurus.
TheRedNiece 2 years ago
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Read Trijang Rinpoche's incredible commentary in one full volume that he wrote in the late 70's. It is all about Shugden and his lineage/practice/etc.
Go to the website dorjeshugden (dot) com and print out the commentary for free.
Incredible piece of work by the Tutor of HH the 14th Dalai Lama.
The commentary wasn't written for just high lamas, It is for everyone.
It is for everyone to practice Dorje Shugden.
truth1888 2 years ago
All high lamas of various traditions are attained beings on their own right, and are considered buddhas by tradition and by their students.
If the dalai lama says his gurus are wrong to practice dorje shugden, doesnt that mean he can be wrong too? doesnt that mean ALL gurus can be wrong?
vinayaholder 2 years ago
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The state protector Nechung is unable to help the Dalai Lama gain autonomy or freedom for Tibet.
The Tibetan Govt should invoke the Dorje Shugden protector, apologize and ask his help and seek his advice.
Dorje Shugden is a very powerful being that can be a great ally, friend and help to the Dalai Lama. Dalai Lama needs all the friends he can get both human and non-human.
truth1888 2 years ago
SAKYA GONGMA you are a disgrace for your ancistors! stop likin dalai lamas ass..and start sukin my dick you will surely get more publicity!!
lobgelek 2 years ago
Fundamentalisten, Extremisten und heftig wie Dorge shugdenden Gruppen haben keinen Platz in der tibetischen Gesellschaft.
Turfan369 2 years ago 4
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I use to respect Sakya Trizin, after seeing this video, I feel very sad that he starts becoming political by putting down Dorje Shugden.
Shugden arose from the sakyas originally.
The previous Sakya Trizins has practiced, worshipped and composed prayers to Dorje Shugden.
So it is very sad. I wish Sakya Trizin wouldn't get involved with Tibetan politically motivated so called religious advice.
truth1888 2 years ago
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If Nechung has so much power, then Tibet would be Free by now.
If Nechung is so powerful, then Tibet would have never lost Tibet to China in the first place.
Since Nechung is the state protector of Tibet and it's govt, he didn't do a good job to protect Tibet at all.
Dalai lama is already in his 70's and there is no sign of Tibetan Freedom.
We Tibetan youths are tired of waiting and do not believe in Nechung and his supposed power.
After Dalai Lama dies, bye bye to Tibet.
truth1888 2 years ago
Have a english translation
thanlee 2 years ago
om vajer veki meta na yi so ha
i from hong kong
顶礼 大王大力金刚多杰雄殿，
snowlandtulku 2 years ago
Please go + take a teaching ...
w/ HH Sakya Trenzin he + his sister
Jestunla have authentic bloodline
from the Buddha Sakyamuni.
They're transmission is a radiating, wisdom mind...
mindcontrolsalsa 2 years ago
His Eminence Sakya Trinzin, above, is no longer an ordained monk, but has a wife and children. He is the head of one of the four Tibetan schools of Buddhism known as the Sakyas or Sakyapa. In many of the Tibetan schools of Buddhism the heads of a linage of buddhist teachings wear robes. Not all wearing robes are ordained monks or nuns, but have many great realizations none-the-less,and vast knowledge to go with it to teach others. In the Tibetan government also wear certain earings.
karmacamelion13 2 years ago
most of the sakya masters where shugden pratictioner.
shantidewa 2 years ago
Put earring or not, put a shirt or not, regardless of someone is a monk, a lama, Sanyasi, we should all respect every human. Not respecting anyone contradict Buddhism Teaching itself.
superbabi 2 years ago
Putting on earrings ? No, thanks, that is not my choice. I am not a woman.
According to the Vinaya rules it is prohibited for monks to adorn themselves.
But I forgot, Lamaism is not real Buddhism, so they can do whatever they like.
He is His Holiness but not mine. So why should I respect him?
And who gave him this title? Did he become so holy because he dressed up as a monk and did not work his whole life? Not my choice either, thanks.
ruzickaw 2 years ago
dude, you seem pretty angry
I doubt that this is what "real Buddhism" teaches you.
Erbrecher 2 years ago
why does this man wear earrings? Does he follow Buddha¨s example? Sould we all wear them also?
ruzickaw 2 years ago
try not to worry about outer things so much, earings or no earings it doesn't matter, its your choice maybe?
Also its very nice to respect high lamas and instead fo calling him this man perhaps His Holiness would be appropriate. your choice again
best wishes
hearer87 2 years ago
Thank You Rinpochen for your clarification. Long live.
Please Stop propagating Western dorjee shugden society.
SAVE THE BUDDHISM FROM DEGENERATING.
dokpabhu 2 years ago 2
Rinpoche,
we respect you and we would like you to respect our protector as well. DO NOT CALL OUR PROTECTOR IN DEROGATIVE NAME. WE SHOULD STRIVE TO UNITE ALL FOUR SECT IN HARMONOUS ENVIRONMENT.
DRAKPALA 2 years ago
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More and more Dorje Shugden Monasteries are springing up around the world. It is a very interesting phenomena.
Dalai Lama is making this practice grow by leaps and bounds by bringing Dorje Shugden into the spotlight. Fantastic!
Shar Gaden is only one of the many monasteries that enshrine Dorje Shugden as it's main protector throughout the world and in Tibet.
Go to the official website and read up more. Very interesting updates!!
truth1888 2 years ago
Obama carries the MARKS OF THE BEAST.
This video will change your life and also the world soon.
See it at my page's video.
EndOfTimesApocalypse 2 years ago
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Tibetans must know how they have gone wrong in accepting Joe Hamilton as their protector for the Free Tibet movement. He is not Nangpa. He made death-threats against me and hung death-tokens on my door. He is Lokta; LokYem; Tak Tsung Nang Trel Chak Cheu; Mutekpa. Furthermore, this trash insults Kalachakra, which he calls KALAWAKA. Tibetans don't realize they're associating with an enemy of Tibet, of Tibetans and of Tibetan Tantric Buddhism, the world's highest culture
Reject him or go to hell !
BeastObrahma 2 years ago
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Dorje shugden is a ghost or not is NOT THE POINT.
The point is that Dalai Lama MAY NOT BAN ANY FORM OF WORSHIP IN A FREE AND DEMOCRATIC INDIA.
Because of this ban, Dalai Lama is going to court. He has been summoned by the High Court in Delhi to plead his case.
By the Dalai lama going to court is a huge message that WHAT HE IS DOING IS WRONG.
United Nations have sent representatives to investigate the ban from Dalai lama as it is not what a democratic leader should do.
truth1888 2 years ago
THE DALAI LAMA IS GOING TO COURT!!
Indian High court in New Delhi is summoning Dalai Lama to court due to his unconstitutional ban on the ancient practice of Dorje Shugden on his own people.
In India where there are so many religions and their subsects, it is unheard of that a secular/religious leader can issue such a ban.
It has shocked the Indian psyche.
Preliminary hearings have began.
Aljazeera news has a special report. It is posted on the youtube.
Get Updated!
truth1888 2 years ago
I LOVE TIBET...FREE TIBET..
lhagyalo 2 years ago
lhagyalo, I have difficulty believing you are not tibetan or buddhist...first off, if you aren't buddhist then why do you believe in a buddhist deity? second, you behave like most other tibetans i've met - posting hateful attacks in crude english that is! either way it doesn't matter. keep on posting, all ur doing is showing yourself how ignorant and hateful an individual you are. i can't believe you are telling me to 'do something good' when YOU are the psycho who can't stop slandering people
jaymo108 2 years ago
oh yea chinese and those who hates tibet are using such a good words!!! if u think i will say like that then it is a HEIGHT OF JOKE...
it is ppl like u who always attack in real, hey man u really need to change urslef, they is no harm in being a good person....nways i should have never touch the SHIT...
lhagyalo 2 years ago
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No democratic leader in the world today would condemn or stop any form of religious worship.
Even the Pope dare not speak against other religions anymore.
Today's world leaders must show acceptance and tolerance of all forms of worship even the worship of Dorje Shugden.
The Dharamsala Tibetan Govt only has a few years left and they are on the decline. Their existence depends on Dalai Lama. Once he passes,THEY ARE FINISHED.
I advise them to stop all this anti shugden rhetoric.
iwannaberich2007 2 years ago