@gamerunknown geuss it is hell for you then buddy.. 24/4/1922 Ross, Colin Campbell exacuted in Old mebourne goal (Melbourne Victoria). pardoned by Governor David de Kretser on 27 May 2008.
Does Natasha know how much it costs a year for each Prisoner? And to say we should just keep the murderers there for the rest of their lives would cost a fortune. It's cheaper to put them to death!
As a British citizen I am concerned that a lethal drugs that are illegal in Britain are being sold to America which, as the death penalty doesn't exist here and is disapproved of would make America a pariah state in this situation. As far as I know Britain would not sell guns to the Taliban, or there certainly would be trouble if so.
@Steinerrite : Thiopental is not a letha drug, regardless of all the jokes in its favor in this video. Wikipedia says: "Sodium thiopental ..., is a rapid-onset short-acting barbiturate general anaesthetic. Thiopental is a core medicine in the World Health Organization's "Essential Drugs List", which is a list of minimum medical needs for a basic healthcare system.[3] It is also usually the first of three drugs administered during most lethal injections in the United States.
It is designed to relax the prisoner before injecting potassium to stop the heart. It's the moral equivalent (look! another joke!) of the last cigarette before the firing squad.
As a British citizen I am concerned that a lethal drugs that are illegal in Britain are being sold to America which, as the death penalty doesn't exist here and is disapproved of would make America a pariah state in this situation. As far as I know Britain would not sell guns to the Taliban, or there certainly would be trouble if so.
easily solved. just inject those child raping, murdering scumbags with cheap bleach or place a 1cent walmart plastic bag over their heads and watch those shitbags try and gasp one last breath as they suffocate like kittens tied up in a sack in a river
Life working in a prison is a billion times better than the death penalty. If evidence proves innocence after the death penalty you just murdered an innocent person...
I agree, we should not spend millions to execute these scumbags, but we shouldnt have to have mass murderers and serial rapists live off our tax dollars either. we should just pump a couple bullets in thier skulls and then call it a day.
Your segment only demonstrates that the use of sodium theopental is rife with problems. There are many other mechanical means to execute criminals. Just change the method to a more cost effective one and your argument is null.
@terrenord: ...and you don't even know what you're talking about. Thiopental is a general anesthetic; it's used to relax the prisoner before injecting the real stuff. Injecting thiopental has no problems, except without it the relatives could sue California for cruel and unusual punishment afterwards.
It costs U.S. Millions of Dollar to put a guy in Death Penalty. Where as it costs one bullet, only one bullet to put a guy in Death Penalty in Asian countries. What do we learn from here? We learn that U.S. Government ripping their people off by Taxing them to support their inmates.
@2011TOMCAT: Stupid comparison, guy. The costs are associated with making sure a mistake is not made in a final, irreparable act (and, as it turns out, is made rather too often anyway). It wouldn't make any difference how much the penalty cost; even if it were free there would still be that "irreparable" associated with it that makes the other costs necessary. How many millions does it take to keep a lifer, on the average? I've not seen anyone talk about that here.
a kurdish intellectual wrote recently on the debates in turkey whether to re institute the death penalty, "in this country, when the table of drops are set, there is no guarantee that the oily rope will only be wrapped around the necks of the people you want to be executed.", perfectly sums up the death penalty in a sentence.
Why is it costing California so much, Governor Rick Perry of Texas approves executions at a rate of one a month. If Texas paid as much per person for their executions as California they would be broke by now, oh that's right they are broke.
OF COURSE THEY NEED THE DEATH PENALTY! If you honestly believe that a psychopath deserves to live then you are a terrible person. A sadistic person capable of murder never has any potential to redeem themselves. (read " sociopath next door" for additional info) ps sociopaths are NOT the same as psychopaths.
@Dersabom I'm a terrible person because I believe life in prison is a better choice than execution? I think you're way too emotionally invested in this argument and I'd suggest exploring the idea that people can disagree you and not be totally and completely wrong in every way. You might want to try and see the other side of arguments. PS: Stop suggesting that execution is the only choice of punishment. Life in prison works just as well and it's cheaper.
@Dersabom Let's look at the facts regarding the death penalty. 1) There's no evidence it reduces criminality. Some studies in fact suggest the opposite. 2) There's no evidence it helps people cope with their pain and suffering. 3) You don't see a lot of white collar people on death row do you. 4) There are countless of cases where people have been wrongly executed. 5) It's more expensive... But yes, if you think that primitive revenge is more important than reason then by all means!
@Dersabom I used to be in favor of the death penalty but changed my mind. If we execute just one innocent person then we become murderers ourselves. I do believe that life in prision should be LIFE in prison though.
I miss the old chain gangs. Organized crime may make an issue out of it (bringing dangerous criminals out into the open before their terms are up can come with a multitude of risks) but otherwise, it might be nice to actually have criminals give back to the community for awhile even if many are just going to be going back to crime after they leave.
If they want to institute the death penalty, why not just let them die by harvesting their organs? the drugs they use in lethal injections ruin the entire organ system. If you simply harvest their organs, you're essentially killing two birds with one stone: The condemned, and the organ waiting list.
Or are the opponents to this the same people who believed the movies where those who recieved criminal organs became criminals themselves?
@bigbengamer: I remember a short SF story on that theme by Larry Niven. Talks about an attempt at jail break by a third-timer facing the organ banks for speeding. Just like police confiscations of property used in a crime, allowing someone to make a profit off of crime becomes an excuse to find the crime everywhere; pretty soon the penalty becomes a way of life for the justice system
@bigbengamer: So sorry. I didn't know your comment would age so.
The profit comes in after you make it possible to reap one. You make the death penalty profitable to those needing or supplying organs for the purest of motives, the rest follows.
Firing Line, Guillotine or Hanging. Criminals on Death Row don't deserve a peaceful death anyways, so just do that and save time and money. Yes, I understand it's brutal but who really cares?
just tax the rich more, that's five billion more dollars into their budget. and anyone advocating against the tax increase would be sentenced to prison for five years. I don't care what republicans think, damn them all.
I think the person who takes away another life needs to be put to death regardless of how much it cost to put him away. Just be glad California isn't using $0.35 .223's.
@Parasome Yes, but no ;-) The problem is that no licensed physician will take part in executions since they all swear the hippocratic oath to save lives. Hence, the ones administering the drugs aren't actually physicians or health professionals but prison guards with some "extra" training.
@Parasome doctors dont perform the injection, technicians do(this is because the Hippocratic oath prevents them from"doing harm") it one of the reasons its so often botched as technicians are not medically trained.
@Parasome 2. as i understand. many who perform the injections aren't even physicians, some of the doctors who participate are there only to be present as the law says and confirm that the person is dead...
@Parasome Saving lives can also come from taking lives. Take one life to save a few. I do not believe in taking a life in anyway, but if it has to be done I would rather it be 1 person as opposed to 5-20.
@Parasome I agree with the second point, but not with the first one. The alcohol desinfection is practiced for safety of execution personal at first. The alcohol is also applied even for safety of that inmate, if the execution is for some reason canceled in last while.
@Parasome The needle is steralised beforehand due to the chance the execution could be called off. Its to prevent an infection if It was or is posponed or canceled.
I suppose in the end, it's a question of whether or not you feel that the price tag that accompanies the death penalty is worth it, specifically after considering where else that money could be spent.
still awaiting the final end of the appeal process, and as such, we can't just kill them off, to do so would mean ignoring our own laws with regards to the appeal process. And that appeals process is necessary because we make a lot of mistakes, there have been six people freed from CA's DR because of substantial evidence showing their innocence, and only 13 executed since 1977. That's a rate of 33% innocence... and it's unacceptable.
will likely be reversed later. This puts an even more increased burden on the prosecution to overcome these much larger obstacles, and to provide a more persuasive argument than they normally would have to, all of which starts pushing the costs higher and higher. But perhaps the biggest problem, above all else, is the years of appeals that follow a D-P trial, the years that the inmate spends on Death Row, before he can finally be executed. The reason people are on death row is because they are
In order to avoid mistakes, the money, time, and effort expended is enormous, much larger than is spent on a non-death penalty case. It is to the point where death-penalty cases place significant strain on our justice system, and force us to reduce focus in other areas in order to follow through on those DP cases. For example, D-P cases require, by law, twice the usual staffing for defense (in order to avoid bias and mistakes) along with higher standards for that defense, or else the case
The folIowing comments are directed at anyone who has suggested that the problem can be solved by just killing the people on death row. I honestly have no moral issues with the death penalty. When you commit a crime on the magnitude of murder or rape, you forfeit your right to live. Even if you eventually come to regret what you've done, it doesn't change the fact that you've done it or that you must pay the price for your actions.
However, we do not live in a perfect society, mistakes are made.
well, if we kill people don't we save money? It costs somewhere like 60K a year to keep someone in jail. So theoretically, were saving money by killing people. and honestly sometimes when i hear of the acts some criminals do, i do want to personally kill them so honestly, i think the death penalty is fine ONLY when its almost guarenteed 100% that the person convicted did actually commit the crime. this means an insane amount of evidence lots of impartial witnesses and possibly even a confession.
1) However death penalty cases cost so much to get as close to 100% as possible that it outweighs the costs of life imprisonment without the possibility of parole.
2) The process also takes so long that many prisoners on death roe die of natural causes before execution, even if you don't care if we can and have executed innocent people the death penalty is far more expensive than life imprisonment in both the short and the long term.
@wybo2 Although technically those are two different situations. I'm not saying I support lethal injection or not, but someone who is administered it -has- been found guilty of a crime, and then it's decided that that crime deserves the death penalty. Whether or not they deserve it, people have decided that what they've done deserves such a consequence.
I don't know if either one should be allowed, but they are different circumstances and should be taken into consideration separately.
@wybo2 The death penalty is the characteristic of an uncivilized society. I don't understand how people can do that job. It,s even more crazy when you think that a number of people have been innocent victims of the death penalty. I would feel like shit for the rest of my life thinking that I killed an innocent man.
@MrG0TH1ER Yes. That is one of the truly terrifying aspects of capital punishment: Killing an innocent person makes the whole process a horrible irony.
Canada last executed a man in 1962 and a woman in 1953. Since then we have had several high profile cases where people have been convicted of murder but later found to innocent. Gulp!
Most of the cost isn't in the execution, it's mostly in the additional safeguards in place to determine guilt and innocence, your bullet doesn't do anything in this regard.
Please clarify your math. The Death Penalty as an entity may cost 1 billion dollars to maintain, but those prisoners are not going away if the DP is abolished. Are you saying that CA will save a billion dollars minus the cost of maintaining former DR inmates? The housing will need to still be used and maintained. Not meaning to sound callous here but the only thing that will change is the sentence. How does removing the DP equate to a savings of that magnitude?
Read why it costs more to maintain the death penalty, additional facilities and huge costs in additional staffing and appeals that are exclusive to death penalty cases, because you know, we really don't want to kill innocent people. The process is so long that many death roe inmates die of natural causes during the process and many people have been found to be innocent after being previously pronounced guilty.
The thing fucked up about this is that The uk was allowed to supply a drug that is used in capital punishment. As far as i know we don't support capital punishment and it seems to me if we are against killing our own for crimes then how is this ok.
Of course they shouldn't pay 5 billion $'s. Instead they should practice an alternating execution method other than lethal injection. Just think about the way executions were made one or two centuries ago and how much they cost. A firing weapon or a sword would work fine and it would cost anybody 5 billion $'s!!!
@Triocon9 but what if you are innocent, every minute of breath you have you would be spending on getting free, you might want to die but most people do actually not mind living... even if they are in prison, i mean you can go ahead and kill yourself in prison thats fine, but the state should not be murdering you...
Those resources spent attempting to find the drug would be spent whether police officer / teachers jobs are cut or not. The people responsible for keeping these drugs on hand have a job to do. You cant just lay off these people and put more officers / teachers to work without voting first. Our government is a democracy, not a communist state.
@JONNYBLAZE1272 We're for killing babies? why are you against stem cell research of a 3 day old "baby"? It is nothing but a collaboration of cells. Yes it could become a child, but every time you scratch your nose you're committing genocide on possible children. You're also looking past that not even a week into pregnancy the "baby" can split into two different people which later combine again. 45% of all pregnancy are aborted by the body or by miscarriage. You were saying?
MrLatta is correct in all aspectts and THIS.... THISSSSSS video is one of many reasons why this channel is so amazing in spreading truth. The only thing i wish people would do is stop giving a general direction as to who is to blame these days and get specific!
So can we indenture people for the rest of their lives (infinite debt) instead of killing them? We wouldn't need to bother with minimum wage so we could have state businesses with extremely high turnover to pay down the national debt. I just solved two problems!
It's already been proven time and time again by many studies that solitary confinement, the death penalty, and multiple life sentences without parole has never been a deterrent to human criminal behavior. Human criminal behavior today is always based on one thing survival So long as we continue to let corporations and the governments local and federally to force scarcity upon us thus threatening our survival there will continue to be crime. more scarcity = more crime.
@failtolawl No, in free market fascism poor and unemployed would go to jail so social unrest would be impossible. Free market fascism is more stable than libertarianism therefore greater than sign is justified
@freemarketfascist in that case, libertarianism would lead to free market fascism, which is not a good thing, seeing as it hasn't worked ever. I don't see your point in typijng that comment anyways.
1. "...in ways outside the established laws...". Don't ask stupid questions please.
2. "..very little effect on reducing crime.." Is that the only reason you punish someone? Well.. that may be your goal. Mine is to punish the worm eating the apple.
3. Why.. so court is not required for locking them up in jail?
Humans really aren't this difficult to kill... one hand on the jaw, the other hand on the back of the head and a quick turn... Its a waste of resources to frantically try to scavenge lethal drugs. Spending so much money and effort negates any resources that would be conserved by eliminating the convict. May as well teach him to sew shoes and put him on an assembly line as cheap labor.
@PinkProgram i think you'll find snaping in a neck in the manner you described is a) firstly not that easy to do and makes a gross underestimation of the strength of the spinal chord and surrounding muscle and b) not certain to induce death but possibly paralysis or various other problems and pains. It is possible though but not really an effective killer. I also do not condone the reckless spending by the government in an seemingly feeble yet zealous and adamantine atempt to kill.
Personally I am against the death penalty, and life in prisonment where justified is a better alternative. I believe prisons should be producers and turn this waste of time and labor into business where prisoners work and the prison turn a profit. tax payers invest into the prisons and the profits are then dispursed into programs that benefit the tax payer.
The argument against the death penalty is really bad. It doesn't even work, keeping someone in jail for life is really expensive. Killing them is still going to be cheaper.
But even more importantly, is this the argument the ACLU wants to have? The death penalty is a moral issue and should be argued for or against on moral grounds. Reducing it to an economic argument is utterly missing the point.
but all the literature on the death penalty indicates that the short term costs of the death penalty is far more expensive than life imprisonment as a whole. Not to mention a large percentage of people on death roe don't even make it to execution while still having the very large up front costs. That's not even mentioning the problems of possibly executing innocent people.
@garith21 when I say "the argument" I mean the one the ACLU gave in the video (cost). f.e. would you go from opposing the death penalty to supporting it if lawmakers sped up the process making it really cheap and quick to kill people? Hopefully no-one would because it's a /terrible basis to form an opinion over this/.
Of course there are very good /moral/ arguments against exectutions, the one you give about mistakes is excellent.
most people in the public seem to respond to costs, it's kind of unfortunate but rare that many people will stop to think if a person is innocent or not after being convicted. Tell them it will cost a lot more money to keep it around and they may stop to think about it which I think was more the aim. You should see the responses of most of the people supporting the death penalty on this forum, they don't even want to read the literature, they just want the people dead sooner.
For those of u asking "isnt that cruel?" Yah it is but i dont give a fuck. I dont approve of the death penalty for a lot of cases but in certain ones i wouldnt mind shooting the fuckers in the head. Some ppl deserve to get shot in the head point fucking blank.
@MJPKENT Happiness does not come from without, it can only come from within.
Don't worry about what others think, be free and be happy from within yourself! Who cares what they think, this is not there world nor will it ever be.. God bless my friend, may peace be upon you.
This is coming from a Christian/Muslim for I have been united as all of us should be once again in time.
@LiberalViewer This clip is disingenuous. Separate the issues! Either the death penalty is more EXPENSIVE than life without parole. Or it isn't. You show evidence of some bungling, but don't ever mention costs. Sounds like you are trying to argue that the mere evidence of some bungling is grounds for touting the moral high-ground. I'm not in favour of the death-penality because of poor evidence on crime reduction. But here you make a poor argument.
Uh....he includes links about how and why the death penalty is more expensive, the "bungling" seems to be more of some humor in regards to the lengths that is gone to in order to continue with the death penalty.
Honestly, I'm against the death penalty for a variety of reasons, cost, no evidence of crime reduction, the risk of killing innocents and not much seems attainable via the death penalty that can't be attained with life without the possibility of parole.
Its probably less painful than lethal ejection with ejection u take a shot with a gun its 1 bullet reaches brain in less than a second and ur dead and theres no slowly going into a sleep and knowing u will never wake up again its just bam! ur dead its probably even arguably more humane than lethal ejection.
my god just invest in a fucking ballet cops shoot bad guys all the time why not just do the same for death penalties its almost looks as dumb as when theres a bag guy in a movie that builds a tank with sharks with lasers attached to their heads on a slowly descending platform into the tank to kill the hero or good guy when he could just pull out a gun and shoot him for half the trouble and price. and not to mention blowing someones brains out is not painful just like lethal ejection.
I think the death penalty is justified. Why give killers a chance to get back on the streets with "good behavior" where they'll probably just commit crimes again? How is a killer ever entitled to be free because he behaved well in jail? What the hell else is he/she supposed to do?
If it's not sure if the person is guilty or not, by all means, hold off. and keep them around until the results of their case are definite. But really, why risk it? They're probably happy to sit in jail till they die.
1) many do stay in jail till they die of natural causes at a higher expense for being on death roe.
2) there were many cases where it was beyond a shadow of a doubt and they were later exonerated by new evidence and techniques sometimes hours before being executed.
3) Life without the possibility of parole means they don't get to go back out on good behavior
1) Isn't that basically why jails are overpopulated? Why would they want to spend extra money housing, feeding, clothing and sheltering convicted murderers?
2) Yes, before DNA technology and other advanced criminal technology had been developed. Then, once it was developed, they could go back and review the case using it. Now, they have it to use any time.
3) Yes, but not all killers get that. Look it up on google; so many cases where killers get out because of behavior and kill again
1) Actually no, the main reason why jails are overpopulated is because we have non violent crimes that hurt no one else like using/selling weed as a jail able offense, I'm sure the 600 some odd dead roe inmates wouldn't break the bank in that regard.
2) You obviously haven't been reading conversations where people were put on death roe when evidence for their innocence was readily available...like they were in jail for another crime while the murder was in progress.
3) Then why not fight for life imprisonment w/o the possibility of parole rather than x year sentences or in your case the death penalty. Completely ignoring the different degrees of murder there are. This comment seems to indicate that it's not whether it's the death penalty or not as much as wanting them out of society for the rest of their lives, long or short.
@garith21 The degree of murder and the crime does definitely play a huge role in it. I'm not saying all murderers should be condemned to death, or even life without parole for that matter, but in most cases that is what should happen. If a person murders, quite frankly I do not believe they should be given a second chance in society. If you feel differently, fine, but I do not. Murder is not a two or three strikes and you're out sort of thing. It's murder.
1) Second degree murder is doing an intentional act that would likely result in harm, but death is not necessarily intended. Murder isn't always murder with malice.
2) Unlike you I don't assume that everyone that is pronounced guilty is always guilty, much of the cost is in both safeguards, proper representation, and appeals. Many people have been found innocent after being pronounced guilty.
3) having served on a jury before I'm quite aware how fallible a jury can be.
4) You contradict yourself, one case you say all murder shouldn't be treated the same, the next you're saying "murder is murder" and doesn't deserve a second chance. Also my argument is that life is more preferable because if the person is innocent at least there's always chances for it to be fixed, when the person's dead, that's it, at least from an ethical stand point and completely ignoring that it's also more cost effective under our current system.
@garith21 Yes, but 3rd degree murderers i.e. people who conspire to perform a murder but don't actually do it are considered murderers. If a person performs a murder, they should not be given another chance in society. If a person is not a 1s or 2nd degree murderer, they should be given another chance in society...rarely. Hope I cleared up any misunderstandings. Just like it's possible for someone to be innocent, it's possible that if someone is released they'll kill again. It's all hypothetical
Right, but everyone should have an opportunity to prove their innocence, dead people can't do that. Also none of your argument seems to really do indicate anything that the death penalty can accomplish better than life without the possibility of parole could do for much less cost to society. All your argument seems to indicate is you want more permanent punishments for convicted murderers which life without the possibility of parole could accomplish
Why don't we just shoot them or go even more extreme: hang them? Is it really necessary to buy expensive lethal injection because it seems more a civilized way of killing a human? Of course, the government doesn't want to look uncivilized with there ways of handling these kinds of situations.
Most of the cost goes to making sure they're not innocent, how they're killed is in fact a very small margin of the resources that go to keeping the death penalty around. That's why he gives links to resources you can look up in regards to where expenditures for the death penalty come from.
Although im liberal on most issues i personally support the death penalty, studies about it are mixed but most do show that it acts a bit of a deterence and saves lives.
Also usually (but not always) it is a just thing to avoid distress, however if there is a choice in the matter i would rather distress be taken away from the victims and put onto the aggressor rather than the other way around.
Plus many western nations may not have it but many do have majorities which support it, such as mine.
I think that the death penalty is the easy way out. If I did some thing despicable knowing that I would either be killed or spend life in prison... I would absolutely hope for death. First of all because I am not strictly religious and would not believe I need to repent before the afterlife.... and second because the guilt would be much worse over a life sentence.
Again we can think the democrats for this, i mean there plenty of fine chairs around and firing squads, but no its "inhumaine" for a punishment to fit a crime, so now we find a "safe pain free" way to deal with mass murderers and evil sob's.
1) Try reading why it generally costs so much for the death penalty
2) Try reading on the circumstances where the death penalty can be applied.
3) Would you not be satisfied unless it was just as brutal as the crimes the criminal was accused of? I'm not sure everyone would agree with lowering ourselves to the level of those that we punish.
4) Technically sodium thiopental has it's own issues when not administered properly and can result in a rather gruesome death.
@garith21 yeah i know, have you read about the laws that make the process so slow and finacially consuming? the fact is that if your 30 years old and a mass murderer it would be alot cheaper to flip a switch then to feed, clothe,gaurd,provide medical,dental, and psychiatric therapy to you. Have you seen that death penilty states have lower crime rates per capita? the fact is it works.
And yes im a big fan of hannirubis law, and the fact is that the further we get away from the worse it is.
1) So all the innocent people that would have been murdered by the state in your name with your "justice" is just fine?
2) Actually most states with the death penalty have higher crime rates per capita, same with countries that endorse the death penalty, I'm not sure where you get your facts from.
3) even if it were true, you may as well make anything punishable by death as a deterrent
4) yeah, then we can all jump in the river and determine if we're guilty or not, brilliant.
Technicly Japan has both the death penalty and very low murder rate (0,44 per 100 000) but on the other hand it has overall very low crime rate and draconian gun politics.The island has similar murder rate and the last execution had place in 1830;-)
Thus the term "Most" as in generally and not always. Obviously it's not as simple as "death penalty = more/less crime" the point was to state that in most cases his assertion that "the death penalty prevents crime" is at bare minimum a wrong statement or at least not indicated by the evidence.
Most cases it seems to have more to do with how well the general public is taken care of and educated.
Kill by date ^_^
Yoni617 1 month ago
Just get rid of the stupid ass DP.
mikeyrobins022585 1 month ago
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Faith is confidence or trust in a person or thing, or a belief that is not a fact.! google faith lol
flexbrat 2 months ago
I swear by the cross on my neck that there's never been a case of wrongful execution.
gamerunknown 2 months ago
@gamerunknown geuss it is hell for you then buddy.. 24/4/1922 Ross, Colin Campbell exacuted in Old mebourne goal (Melbourne Victoria). pardoned by Governor David de Kretser on 27 May 2008.
offeyy101 2 months ago
@offeyy101 *Gaol*
offeyy101 2 months ago
@gamerunknown *gaol*
offeyy101 2 months ago
Does Natasha know how much it costs a year for each Prisoner? And to say we should just keep the murderers there for the rest of their lives would cost a fortune. It's cheaper to put them to death!
tinaw1969 3 months ago
@tinaw1969: Perhaps it is her job to know that. Perhaps it's her hobby. Do you know? Perhaps she needs to ask you, eh?
puncheex 2 months ago
As a British citizen I am concerned that a lethal drugs that are illegal in Britain are being sold to America which, as the death penalty doesn't exist here and is disapproved of would make America a pariah state in this situation. As far as I know Britain would not sell guns to the Taliban, or there certainly would be trouble if so.
Steinerrite 5 months ago
@Steinerrite : Thiopental is not a letha drug, regardless of all the jokes in its favor in this video. Wikipedia says: "Sodium thiopental ..., is a rapid-onset short-acting barbiturate general anaesthetic. Thiopental is a core medicine in the World Health Organization's "Essential Drugs List", which is a list of minimum medical needs for a basic healthcare system.[3] It is also usually the first of three drugs administered during most lethal injections in the United States.
puncheex 2 months ago
It is designed to relax the prisoner before injecting potassium to stop the heart. It's the moral equivalent (look! another joke!) of the last cigarette before the firing squad.
puncheex 2 months ago
As a British citizen I am concerned that a lethal drugs that are illegal in Britain are being sold to America which, as the death penalty doesn't exist here and is disapproved of would make America a pariah state in this situation. As far as I know Britain would not sell guns to the Taliban, or there certainly would be trouble if so.
Steinerrite 5 months ago
It is such a waste of resources & the guy who said "lifesaver" needs a hit so it can save his life.
JTurner427 5 months ago
I agree with the death penalty for some crimes, but I don't agree with a medical participation on the executions.
Ondrus21 6 months ago
No doctors are employed to perform the execution, they are prison staff who are trained to use needles.
sbro8650 6 months ago
@sbro8650: Actually, trained like a phlebotomist to administer IVs.
puncheex 2 months ago
no
546klo546 6 months ago
Oh The Irony
ssohood2011 6 months ago
putting them to work to restitute the victims/victim families seems the best policy
BVargas78 6 months ago
I can think of a host of other lethal shit we could inject them with. Morphine, insulin, bleach, aspirin, snake venom....
Turtleman7007 7 months ago
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easily solved. just inject those child raping, murdering scumbags with cheap bleach or place a 1cent walmart plastic bag over their heads and watch those shitbags try and gasp one last breath as they suffocate like kittens tied up in a sack in a river
aIteredbeast 7 months ago
Life working in a prison is a billion times better than the death penalty. If evidence proves innocence after the death penalty you just murdered an innocent person...
Working also helps out the state and communities.
viiScorp 8 months ago
just shoot the guy in the head
CrazyBrah21 8 months ago
Hitler would be proud.
Mikkhailov 9 months ago
What the fuck are the UK doing selling death-drugs?
OttOunderground 9 months ago
@OttOunderground: It's a general anesthetic. A little research can go a long way toward preventing foot-in-mouth.
puncheex 2 months ago
Most hospitals have heroin, mix that with a powerful sedative and that'll kill someone.
Why is it execution in most nations costs 4 cents(a bullet) and it takes millions in the US?
Can't trust the US with the death penalty due to rampant corruption.
HWGuyEG 9 months ago
@HWGuyEG: What nations? Other than the US, the only major bloc with the death penalty are the Moslem countries, and they use swords.
puncheex 2 months ago
I agree, we should not spend millions to execute these scumbags, but we shouldnt have to have mass murderers and serial rapists live off our tax dollars either. we should just pump a couple bullets in thier skulls and then call it a day.
Mrbayrat1 9 months ago
@Mrbayrat1 yeah because those prisons are really huge hotels for the killers right? lol...
the death penalty is already moraly bankrupt when you've succeeded executing innocent citizens...
Darusdei 9 months ago
Your segment only demonstrates that the use of sodium theopental is rife with problems. There are many other mechanical means to execute criminals. Just change the method to a more cost effective one and your argument is null.
terrenord 10 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@terrenord not very bright are you?
Darusdei 9 months ago
@terrenord: ...and you don't even know what you're talking about. Thiopental is a general anesthetic; it's used to relax the prisoner before injecting the real stuff. Injecting thiopental has no problems, except without it the relatives could sue California for cruel and unusual punishment afterwards.
puncheex 2 months ago
pure oxygen can kill people, gas them with that. its painless and 100% effective.
1qaz6yhn5tgb 10 months ago
@1qaz6yhn5tgb ur thinking of pure nitrogen Jackass
TCHill19 9 months ago
It costs U.S. Millions of Dollar to put a guy in Death Penalty. Where as it costs one bullet, only one bullet to put a guy in Death Penalty in Asian countries. What do we learn from here? We learn that U.S. Government ripping their people off by Taxing them to support their inmates.
2011TOMCAT 10 months ago
@2011TOMCAT: Stupid comparison, guy. The costs are associated with making sure a mistake is not made in a final, irreparable act (and, as it turns out, is made rather too often anyway). It wouldn't make any difference how much the penalty cost; even if it were free there would still be that "irreparable" associated with it that makes the other costs necessary. How many millions does it take to keep a lifer, on the average? I've not seen anyone talk about that here.
puncheex 2 months ago
death penalty SHOULD be used a lot more then it is.
YariuxD 10 months ago
a kurdish intellectual wrote recently on the debates in turkey whether to re institute the death penalty, "in this country, when the table of drops are set, there is no guarantee that the oily rope will only be wrapped around the necks of the people you want to be executed.", perfectly sums up the death penalty in a sentence.
ufster81 10 months ago
Why is it costing California so much, Governor Rick Perry of Texas approves executions at a rate of one a month. If Texas paid as much per person for their executions as California they would be broke by now, oh that's right they are broke.
Zyworski 11 months ago
There's a War!!! give them the choice to Die by injection or by bullet or bomb.
1ike3 11 months ago
Actually, sodium theopentol is what puts inmates to sleep so the state can do the execution in the first place.
LegallyBlindGamer 11 months ago
thank you for high quality videos and information!
LilTom895 11 months ago
OF COURSE THEY NEED THE DEATH PENALTY! If you honestly believe that a psychopath deserves to live then you are a terrible person. A sadistic person capable of murder never has any potential to redeem themselves. (read " sociopath next door" for additional info) ps sociopaths are NOT the same as psychopaths.
Dersabom 11 months ago
@Dersabom I'm a terrible person because I believe life in prison is a better choice than execution? I think you're way too emotionally invested in this argument and I'd suggest exploring the idea that people can disagree you and not be totally and completely wrong in every way. You might want to try and see the other side of arguments. PS: Stop suggesting that execution is the only choice of punishment. Life in prison works just as well and it's cheaper.
CanadaDan1971 11 months ago
@Dersabom Let's look at the facts regarding the death penalty. 1) There's no evidence it reduces criminality. Some studies in fact suggest the opposite. 2) There's no evidence it helps people cope with their pain and suffering. 3) You don't see a lot of white collar people on death row do you. 4) There are countless of cases where people have been wrongly executed. 5) It's more expensive... But yes, if you think that primitive revenge is more important than reason then by all means!
buugiman78 11 months ago
@Dersabom I used to be in favor of the death penalty but changed my mind. If we execute just one innocent person then we become murderers ourselves. I do believe that life in prision should be LIFE in prison though.
Ian7570 11 months ago
Jshowa2, they would work it off with honest labor, such as farming and mineing.
Eman6881 11 months ago
I miss the old chain gangs. Organized crime may make an issue out of it (bringing dangerous criminals out into the open before their terms are up can come with a multitude of risks) but otherwise, it might be nice to actually have criminals give back to the community for awhile even if many are just going to be going back to crime after they leave.
manic2man 1 year ago
lol kill by date, lmao
Adriangrosvenor 1 year ago
If they want to institute the death penalty, why not just let them die by harvesting their organs? the drugs they use in lethal injections ruin the entire organ system. If you simply harvest their organs, you're essentially killing two birds with one stone: The condemned, and the organ waiting list.
Or are the opponents to this the same people who believed the movies where those who recieved criminal organs became criminals themselves?
bigbengamer 1 year ago 2
@bigbengamer: I remember a short SF story on that theme by Larry Niven. Talks about an attempt at jail break by a third-timer facing the organ banks for speeding. Just like police confiscations of property used in a crime, allowing someone to make a profit off of crime becomes an excuse to find the crime everywhere; pretty soon the penalty becomes a way of life for the justice system
puncheex 2 months ago
@puncheex First of all, my statement was nine months ago. Secondly, Who said anything about profit? I sure didn't.
bigbengamer 2 months ago
@bigbengamer: So sorry. I didn't know your comment would age so.
The profit comes in after you make it possible to reap one. You make the death penalty profitable to those needing or supplying organs for the purest of motives, the rest follows.
puncheex 2 months ago
@puncheex LMAO who are you? Why are you drawing me into a conversation I had nearly a year ago. I've moved on man, you should too.
bigbengamer 2 months ago
Firing Line, Guillotine or Hanging. Criminals on Death Row don't deserve a peaceful death anyways, so just do that and save time and money. Yes, I understand it's brutal but who really cares?
grimmlock808 1 year ago
just tax the rich more, that's five billion more dollars into their budget. and anyone advocating against the tax increase would be sentenced to prison for five years. I don't care what republicans think, damn them all.
Zeldagigafan90210 1 year ago
I think the person who takes away another life needs to be put to death regardless of how much it cost to put him away. Just be glad California isn't using $0.35 .223's.
Parasome 1 year ago
LiberalViewer:
You know what else is ironic?
1. The doctor cleans the hypodermic needle with alcohol when the place it in the prisoner.
2. Doctors swear under oath to save lives, even the doctor that performs the lethal injection.
Parasome 1 year ago 54
@Parasome doctors don't actually perform the injection or participate in the process.
lianghaochen 11 months ago
@Parasome Yes, but no ;-) The problem is that no licensed physician will take part in executions since they all swear the hippocratic oath to save lives. Hence, the ones administering the drugs aren't actually physicians or health professionals but prison guards with some "extra" training.
buugiman78 11 months ago
@Parasome doctors dont perform the injection, technicians do(this is because the Hippocratic oath prevents them from"doing harm") it one of the reasons its so often botched as technicians are not medically trained.
1qaz6yhn5tgb 10 months ago
@Parasome 2. as i understand. many who perform the injections aren't even physicians, some of the doctors who participate are there only to be present as the law says and confirm that the person is dead...
Darusdei 8 months ago
@Parasome Saving lives can also come from taking lives. Take one life to save a few. I do not believe in taking a life in anyway, but if it has to be done I would rather it be 1 person as opposed to 5-20.
getblunted4life 7 months ago
@getblunted4life isn't that sort of like assuming someone is guilty before the crime is commited?
hausy 6 months ago
@Parasome Doctors aren't required to take that oath.
Mlanding1 7 months ago
@Parasome I agree with the second point, but not with the first one. The alcohol desinfection is practiced for safety of execution personal at first. The alcohol is also applied even for safety of that inmate, if the execution is for some reason canceled in last while.
Ondrus21 6 months ago
@Parasome
Lol, you think it's a doctor sitting there injecting people? It's a 3 step machine and it's usually performed by a prison employee.
itcanbecheezcaketime 6 months ago
@Parasome: Doctor's don't do that, Ace. the IV is placed by a prison medic. The buttons are pushed by a machine.
puncheex 2 months ago
@Parasome The needle is steralised beforehand due to the chance the execution could be called off. Its to prevent an infection if It was or is posponed or canceled.
DeathbyDusk 1 month ago
needle goes in, needle comes out, no miscommunication
AboyNAmEDsued 1 year ago
I suppose in the end, it's a question of whether or not you feel that the price tag that accompanies the death penalty is worth it, specifically after considering where else that money could be spent.
TheMasalaBalla 1 year ago
still awaiting the final end of the appeal process, and as such, we can't just kill them off, to do so would mean ignoring our own laws with regards to the appeal process. And that appeals process is necessary because we make a lot of mistakes, there have been six people freed from CA's DR because of substantial evidence showing their innocence, and only 13 executed since 1977. That's a rate of 33% innocence... and it's unacceptable.
TheMasalaBalla 1 year ago
will likely be reversed later. This puts an even more increased burden on the prosecution to overcome these much larger obstacles, and to provide a more persuasive argument than they normally would have to, all of which starts pushing the costs higher and higher. But perhaps the biggest problem, above all else, is the years of appeals that follow a D-P trial, the years that the inmate spends on Death Row, before he can finally be executed. The reason people are on death row is because they are
TheMasalaBalla 1 year ago
In order to avoid mistakes, the money, time, and effort expended is enormous, much larger than is spent on a non-death penalty case. It is to the point where death-penalty cases place significant strain on our justice system, and force us to reduce focus in other areas in order to follow through on those DP cases. For example, D-P cases require, by law, twice the usual staffing for defense (in order to avoid bias and mistakes) along with higher standards for that defense, or else the case
TheMasalaBalla 1 year ago
The folIowing comments are directed at anyone who has suggested that the problem can be solved by just killing the people on death row. I honestly have no moral issues with the death penalty. When you commit a crime on the magnitude of murder or rape, you forfeit your right to live. Even if you eventually come to regret what you've done, it doesn't change the fact that you've done it or that you must pay the price for your actions.
However, we do not live in a perfect society, mistakes are made.
TheMasalaBalla 1 year ago
well, if we kill people don't we save money? It costs somewhere like 60K a year to keep someone in jail. So theoretically, were saving money by killing people. and honestly sometimes when i hear of the acts some criminals do, i do want to personally kill them so honestly, i think the death penalty is fine ONLY when its almost guarenteed 100% that the person convicted did actually commit the crime. this means an insane amount of evidence lots of impartial witnesses and possibly even a confession.
TheAce1082 1 year ago
@TheAce1082
1) However death penalty cases cost so much to get as close to 100% as possible that it outweighs the costs of life imprisonment without the possibility of parole.
2) The process also takes so long that many prisoners on death roe die of natural causes before execution, even if you don't care if we can and have executed innocent people the death penalty is far more expensive than life imprisonment in both the short and the long term.
garith21 1 year ago
USA doesn't allow Euthanasie but it does use death penalty......
Am i the only one finding this extreemly hypocritical.
wybo2 1 year ago 55
@wybo2 Although technically those are two different situations. I'm not saying I support lethal injection or not, but someone who is administered it -has- been found guilty of a crime, and then it's decided that that crime deserves the death penalty. Whether or not they deserve it, people have decided that what they've done deserves such a consequence.
I don't know if either one should be allowed, but they are different circumstances and should be taken into consideration separately.
DezTurkisch 11 months ago
@wybo2 Actually, here in Oregon, euthanasia is legal. Well, technically, it's "Physician-Assisted Suicide" but the practice is allowed.
ZachariasCatIV 10 months ago
@wybo2 The death penalty is the characteristic of an uncivilized society. I don't understand how people can do that job. It,s even more crazy when you think that a number of people have been innocent victims of the death penalty. I would feel like shit for the rest of my life thinking that I killed an innocent man.
MrG0TH1ER 8 months ago
@MrG0TH1ER Yes. That is one of the truly terrifying aspects of capital punishment: Killing an innocent person makes the whole process a horrible irony.
Canada last executed a man in 1962 and a woman in 1953. Since then we have had several high profile cases where people have been convicted of murder but later found to innocent. Gulp!
Trund27 8 months ago
@wybo2
Nope, you aren't.
klootzakisme 6 months ago
want to know a cheeper way to keep death row going. it only costs a total of about 40C per person, a single bullet....
sum41Rck 1 year ago
@sum41Rck
Most of the cost isn't in the execution, it's mostly in the additional safeguards in place to determine guilt and innocence, your bullet doesn't do anything in this regard.
garith21 1 year ago
When is California just going to float off into the Pacific? With the ACLU.
rightfrontseat 1 year ago
Please clarify your math. The Death Penalty as an entity may cost 1 billion dollars to maintain, but those prisoners are not going away if the DP is abolished. Are you saying that CA will save a billion dollars minus the cost of maintaining former DR inmates? The housing will need to still be used and maintained. Not meaning to sound callous here but the only thing that will change is the sentence. How does removing the DP equate to a savings of that magnitude?
illmciq 1 year ago
@illmciq
Read why it costs more to maintain the death penalty, additional facilities and huge costs in additional staffing and appeals that are exclusive to death penalty cases, because you know, we really don't want to kill innocent people. The process is so long that many death roe inmates die of natural causes during the process and many people have been found to be innocent after being previously pronounced guilty.
garith21 1 year ago
The thing fucked up about this is that The uk was allowed to supply a drug that is used in capital punishment. As far as i know we don't support capital punishment and it seems to me if we are against killing our own for crimes then how is this ok.
gabrielcrimson 1 year ago
Of course they shouldn't pay 5 billion $'s. Instead they should practice an alternating execution method other than lethal injection. Just think about the way executions were made one or two centuries ago and how much they cost. A firing weapon or a sword would work fine and it would cost anybody 5 billion $'s!!!
Bara2Orabi 1 year ago
@Bara2Orabi it's $1B not $5B
I remember watching this Colbert's sketch
akhooooya!
Tamimorabi 1 year ago
Yeah but would you rather die, or be in prison for the rest of your life never to breath fresh air again? I think I'd rather die.
Triocon9 1 year ago
@Triocon9 but what if you are innocent, every minute of breath you have you would be spending on getting free, you might want to die but most people do actually not mind living... even if they are in prison, i mean you can go ahead and kill yourself in prison thats fine, but the state should not be murdering you...
phoboskitty 1 year ago
Those resources spent attempting to find the drug would be spent whether police officer / teachers jobs are cut or not. The people responsible for keeping these drugs on hand have a job to do. You cant just lay off these people and put more officers / teachers to work without voting first. Our government is a democracy, not a communist state.
narcjoe 1 year ago
i agree that they should not have spent so much resources on getting the drugs when we have pleanty of BULLETS on hand.
JPB7032 1 year ago
@JPB7032
Yep bullets are much cheaper, Funny how these Liberals are against killing rapist, and murderers, but are all for killing innocent babies.
JONNYBLAZE1272 1 year ago
@JONNYBLAZE1272 We're for killing babies? why are you against stem cell research of a 3 day old "baby"? It is nothing but a collaboration of cells. Yes it could become a child, but every time you scratch your nose you're committing genocide on possible children. You're also looking past that not even a week into pregnancy the "baby" can split into two different people which later combine again. 45% of all pregnancy are aborted by the body or by miscarriage. You were saying?
Beopenthinkfree 1 year ago
@JONNYBLAZE1272 Are you being intentionally retarded?
federicofrasisti 1 year ago
MrLatta is correct in all aspectts and THIS.... THISSSSSS video is one of many reasons why this channel is so amazing in spreading truth. The only thing i wish people would do is stop giving a general direction as to who is to blame these days and get specific!
Linda Lye FThotnessW!
Fyrewyrd 1 year ago
All seriousness aside, I have to say, Linda Lye is smokin' hot!!!
MrLatta 1 year ago
So can we indenture people for the rest of their lives (infinite debt) instead of killing them? We wouldn't need to bother with minimum wage so we could have state businesses with extremely high turnover to pay down the national debt. I just solved two problems!
3wsgabav3 1 year ago
death penalty, not a diterant, look at the stats.
T0pcatFilms 1 year ago
It's already been proven time and time again by many studies that solitary confinement, the death penalty, and multiple life sentences without parole has never been a deterrent to human criminal behavior. Human criminal behavior today is always based on one thing survival So long as we continue to let corporations and the governments local and federally to force scarcity upon us thus threatening our survival there will continue to be crime. more scarcity = more crime.
the1tigglet 1 year ago
whys shit blacked out?
ThaDopist 1 year ago
Apparently very attractive women work for the ACLU.
hawanja 1 year ago
Of course not and no, that's incredibly irrational. Also, what's that annoying squealing at the end of your videos?
DenziCloud 1 year ago
@DenziCloud
That's a clip of his daughter laughing, taken about 5 years ago.
forrenz 1 year ago
Free Market Fascism > Libertarianism
freemarketfascist 1 year ago
@freemarketfascist I think you should replace the greated than sign with an equal sign.
failtolawl 1 year ago
@failtolawl No, in free market fascism poor and unemployed would go to jail so social unrest would be impossible. Free market fascism is more stable than libertarianism therefore greater than sign is justified
freemarketfascist 1 year ago
@freemarketfascist in that case, libertarianism would lead to free market fascism, which is not a good thing, seeing as it hasn't worked ever. I don't see your point in typijng that comment anyways.
failtolawl 1 year ago
@failtolawl Free Market Fascism is a good thing.
freemarketfascist 1 year ago
@freemarketfascist free market fascism is an oxymoron.
failtolawl 1 year ago
@freemarketfascist
Yeah... "free market fascism" makes no sense... Those words literally can't fit together.
forrenz 1 year ago
@forrenz Actually it kind of dose.
If you believe in the Free market and you use it as a tool to Oppress and harass people that don't agree with you you are a fascist.
Waage83 1 year ago
The irony would be to abolish the death penalty on the grounds of its cost. What if the State gets wealthy again?
Monkeyshouts 1 year ago
Emotion is the enemy of reason.
MrShoop24 1 year ago
@edheldude
1. "...in ways outside the established laws...". Don't ask stupid questions please.
2. "..very little effect on reducing crime.." Is that the only reason you punish someone? Well.. that may be your goal. Mine is to punish the worm eating the apple.
3. Why.. so court is not required for locking them up in jail?
BestestMoron 1 year ago
Humans really aren't this difficult to kill... one hand on the jaw, the other hand on the back of the head and a quick turn... Its a waste of resources to frantically try to scavenge lethal drugs. Spending so much money and effort negates any resources that would be conserved by eliminating the convict. May as well teach him to sew shoes and put him on an assembly line as cheap labor.
PinkProgram 1 year ago
@PinkProgram i think you'll find snaping in a neck in the manner you described is a) firstly not that easy to do and makes a gross underestimation of the strength of the spinal chord and surrounding muscle and b) not certain to induce death but possibly paralysis or various other problems and pains. It is possible though but not really an effective killer. I also do not condone the reckless spending by the government in an seemingly feeble yet zealous and adamantine atempt to kill.
awesome399 1 year ago
Personally I am against the death penalty, and life in prisonment where justified is a better alternative. I believe prisons should be producers and turn this waste of time and labor into business where prisoners work and the prison turn a profit. tax payers invest into the prisons and the profits are then dispursed into programs that benefit the tax payer.
Kordazone510 1 year ago
@Kordazone510 too true. Then they would really be 'paying' for their crimes
awesome399 1 year ago
The argument against the death penalty is really bad. It doesn't even work, keeping someone in jail for life is really expensive. Killing them is still going to be cheaper.
But even more importantly, is this the argument the ACLU wants to have? The death penalty is a moral issue and should be argued for or against on moral grounds. Reducing it to an economic argument is utterly missing the point.
korona3103 1 year ago
@korona3103
but all the literature on the death penalty indicates that the short term costs of the death penalty is far more expensive than life imprisonment as a whole. Not to mention a large percentage of people on death roe don't even make it to execution while still having the very large up front costs. That's not even mentioning the problems of possibly executing innocent people.
garith21 1 year ago
@garith21 when I say "the argument" I mean the one the ACLU gave in the video (cost). f.e. would you go from opposing the death penalty to supporting it if lawmakers sped up the process making it really cheap and quick to kill people? Hopefully no-one would because it's a /terrible basis to form an opinion over this/.
Of course there are very good /moral/ arguments against exectutions, the one you give about mistakes is excellent.
korona3103 1 year ago
@korona3103
most people in the public seem to respond to costs, it's kind of unfortunate but rare that many people will stop to think if a person is innocent or not after being convicted. Tell them it will cost a lot more money to keep it around and they may stop to think about it which I think was more the aim. You should see the responses of most of the people supporting the death penalty on this forum, they don't even want to read the literature, they just want the people dead sooner.
garith21 1 year ago
One bullet per prisoner. Problem solved!
For those of u asking "isnt that cruel?" Yah it is but i dont give a fuck. I dont approve of the death penalty for a lot of cases but in certain ones i wouldnt mind shooting the fuckers in the head. Some ppl deserve to get shot in the head point fucking blank.
bravojonny73 1 year ago
@MJPKENT Happiness does not come from without, it can only come from within.
Don't worry about what others think, be free and be happy from within yourself! Who cares what they think, this is not there world nor will it ever be.. God bless my friend, may peace be upon you.
This is coming from a Christian/Muslim for I have been united as all of us should be once again in time.
Budvb 1 year ago
Hey, does that ACLU representative have a partially used bottle of Smirnoff vodka on his desk in the back corner? LOL
aaronsande 1 year ago
Did they check on ebay? Or ubid? I was sure I saw some the other day...
aaronsande 1 year ago
@LiberalViewer This clip is disingenuous. Separate the issues! Either the death penalty is more EXPENSIVE than life without parole. Or it isn't. You show evidence of some bungling, but don't ever mention costs. Sounds like you are trying to argue that the mere evidence of some bungling is grounds for touting the moral high-ground. I'm not in favour of the death-penality because of poor evidence on crime reduction. But here you make a poor argument.
dmg46664 1 year ago
@dmg46664
Uh....he includes links about how and why the death penalty is more expensive, the "bungling" seems to be more of some humor in regards to the lengths that is gone to in order to continue with the death penalty.
Honestly, I'm against the death penalty for a variety of reasons, cost, no evidence of crime reduction, the risk of killing innocents and not much seems attainable via the death penalty that can't be attained with life without the possibility of parole.
garith21 1 year ago
Its probably less painful than lethal ejection with ejection u take a shot with a gun its 1 bullet reaches brain in less than a second and ur dead and theres no slowly going into a sleep and knowing u will never wake up again its just bam! ur dead its probably even arguably more humane than lethal ejection.
Shane6 1 year ago
my god just invest in a fucking ballet cops shoot bad guys all the time why not just do the same for death penalties its almost looks as dumb as when theres a bag guy in a movie that builds a tank with sharks with lasers attached to their heads on a slowly descending platform into the tank to kill the hero or good guy when he could just pull out a gun and shoot him for half the trouble and price. and not to mention blowing someones brains out is not painful just like lethal ejection.
Shane6 1 year ago
Last time I checked, rope didn't cost that much.
BeatsByeJ 1 year ago
gotta give them props for the"hey, it's only wrong if we get caught" defense.
BeatsByeJ 1 year ago
California - that's one of those liberal states, isn't it?
PurushaDesa 1 year ago
I think the death penalty is justified. Why give killers a chance to get back on the streets with "good behavior" where they'll probably just commit crimes again? How is a killer ever entitled to be free because he behaved well in jail? What the hell else is he/she supposed to do?
If it's not sure if the person is guilty or not, by all means, hold off. and keep them around until the results of their case are definite. But really, why risk it? They're probably happy to sit in jail till they die.
MSMRU 1 year ago
@MSMRU
1) many do stay in jail till they die of natural causes at a higher expense for being on death roe.
2) there were many cases where it was beyond a shadow of a doubt and they were later exonerated by new evidence and techniques sometimes hours before being executed.
3) Life without the possibility of parole means they don't get to go back out on good behavior
garith21 1 year ago
@garith21
1) Isn't that basically why jails are overpopulated? Why would they want to spend extra money housing, feeding, clothing and sheltering convicted murderers?
2) Yes, before DNA technology and other advanced criminal technology had been developed. Then, once it was developed, they could go back and review the case using it. Now, they have it to use any time.
3) Yes, but not all killers get that. Look it up on google; so many cases where killers get out because of behavior and kill again
MSMRU 1 year ago
@MSMRU
1) Actually no, the main reason why jails are overpopulated is because we have non violent crimes that hurt no one else like using/selling weed as a jail able offense, I'm sure the 600 some odd dead roe inmates wouldn't break the bank in that regard.
2) You obviously haven't been reading conversations where people were put on death roe when evidence for their innocence was readily available...like they were in jail for another crime while the murder was in progress.
garith21 1 year ago
@MSMRU
3) Then why not fight for life imprisonment w/o the possibility of parole rather than x year sentences or in your case the death penalty. Completely ignoring the different degrees of murder there are. This comment seems to indicate that it's not whether it's the death penalty or not as much as wanting them out of society for the rest of their lives, long or short.
garith21 1 year ago
@garith21 The degree of murder and the crime does definitely play a huge role in it. I'm not saying all murderers should be condemned to death, or even life without parole for that matter, but in most cases that is what should happen. If a person murders, quite frankly I do not believe they should be given a second chance in society. If you feel differently, fine, but I do not. Murder is not a two or three strikes and you're out sort of thing. It's murder.
MSMRU 1 year ago
@MSMRU
1) Second degree murder is doing an intentional act that would likely result in harm, but death is not necessarily intended. Murder isn't always murder with malice.
2) Unlike you I don't assume that everyone that is pronounced guilty is always guilty, much of the cost is in both safeguards, proper representation, and appeals. Many people have been found innocent after being pronounced guilty.
3) having served on a jury before I'm quite aware how fallible a jury can be.
garith21 1 year ago
@MSMRU
4) You contradict yourself, one case you say all murder shouldn't be treated the same, the next you're saying "murder is murder" and doesn't deserve a second chance. Also my argument is that life is more preferable because if the person is innocent at least there's always chances for it to be fixed, when the person's dead, that's it, at least from an ethical stand point and completely ignoring that it's also more cost effective under our current system.
garith21 1 year ago
@garith21 Yes, but 3rd degree murderers i.e. people who conspire to perform a murder but don't actually do it are considered murderers. If a person performs a murder, they should not be given another chance in society. If a person is not a 1s or 2nd degree murderer, they should be given another chance in society...rarely. Hope I cleared up any misunderstandings. Just like it's possible for someone to be innocent, it's possible that if someone is released they'll kill again. It's all hypothetical
MSMRU 1 year ago
@MSMRU
Right, but everyone should have an opportunity to prove their innocence, dead people can't do that. Also none of your argument seems to really do indicate anything that the death penalty can accomplish better than life without the possibility of parole could do for much less cost to society. All your argument seems to indicate is you want more permanent punishments for convicted murderers which life without the possibility of parole could accomplish
garith21 1 year ago
Why don't we just shoot them or go even more extreme: hang them? Is it really necessary to buy expensive lethal injection because it seems more a civilized way of killing a human? Of course, the government doesn't want to look uncivilized with there ways of handling these kinds of situations.
Idiocracy!
flubberdubber 1 year ago
@flubberdubber
Most of the cost goes to making sure they're not innocent, how they're killed is in fact a very small margin of the resources that go to keeping the death penalty around. That's why he gives links to resources you can look up in regards to where expenditures for the death penalty come from.
garith21 1 year ago
Cmon you don't need sodium thiopental a 9mm works just as well
nycwiseguy91 1 year ago
WTF!
n987 1 year ago
Although im liberal on most issues i personally support the death penalty, studies about it are mixed but most do show that it acts a bit of a deterence and saves lives.
Also usually (but not always) it is a just thing to avoid distress, however if there is a choice in the matter i would rather distress be taken away from the victims and put onto the aggressor rather than the other way around.
Plus many western nations may not have it but many do have majorities which support it, such as mine.
dmolmalowski 1 year ago
just use a bullet or a noose much cheaper
GodAthie 1 year ago
I think that the death penalty is the easy way out. If I did some thing despicable knowing that I would either be killed or spend life in prison... I would absolutely hope for death. First of all because I am not strictly religious and would not believe I need to repent before the afterlife.... and second because the guilt would be much worse over a life sentence.
Orangebike666 1 year ago
@MJPKENT yay! Civility!
XTheOverseer 1 year ago
you've enhanced your opinion journalism greatly here. keep it up; the interviews are great!
crectenw 1 year ago
Easy Fix: State of California Buys a Knife, and a knife sharpener - Price= $15 Problem Solved
You're Welcome
490412345 1 year ago
Again we can think the democrats for this, i mean there plenty of fine chairs around and firing squads, but no its "inhumaine" for a punishment to fit a crime, so now we find a "safe pain free" way to deal with mass murderers and evil sob's.
dragons2k100 1 year ago
@dragons2k100
1) Try reading why it generally costs so much for the death penalty
2) Try reading on the circumstances where the death penalty can be applied.
3) Would you not be satisfied unless it was just as brutal as the crimes the criminal was accused of? I'm not sure everyone would agree with lowering ourselves to the level of those that we punish.
4) Technically sodium thiopental has it's own issues when not administered properly and can result in a rather gruesome death.
garith21 1 year ago
@garith21 yeah i know, have you read about the laws that make the process so slow and finacially consuming? the fact is that if your 30 years old and a mass murderer it would be alot cheaper to flip a switch then to feed, clothe,gaurd,provide medical,dental, and psychiatric therapy to you. Have you seen that death penilty states have lower crime rates per capita? the fact is it works.
And yes im a big fan of hannirubis law, and the fact is that the further we get away from the worse it is.
dragons2k100 1 year ago
@dragons2k100
1) So all the innocent people that would have been murdered by the state in your name with your "justice" is just fine?
2) Actually most states with the death penalty have higher crime rates per capita, same with countries that endorse the death penalty, I'm not sure where you get your facts from.
3) even if it were true, you may as well make anything punishable by death as a deterrent
4) yeah, then we can all jump in the river and determine if we're guilty or not, brilliant.
garith21 1 year ago
@garith21
Technicly Japan has both the death penalty and very low murder rate (0,44 per 100 000) but on the other hand it has overall very low crime rate and draconian gun politics.The island has similar murder rate and the last execution had place in 1830;-)
Kharmazov 1 year ago
@Kharmazov
Thus the term "Most" as in generally and not always. Obviously it's not as simple as "death penalty = more/less crime" the point was to state that in most cases his assertion that "the death penalty prevents crime" is at bare minimum a wrong statement or at least not indicated by the evidence.
Most cases it seems to have more to do with how well the general public is taken care of and educated.
garith21 1 year ago
@garith21
More likely it is tied to an overall crime rate and sense of security ( or lack of it) the general society posesses.
Kharmazov 1 year ago
@Kharmazov