JUDO vs JJ Submission Grappling TEAM FINAL

[luchador1764]

can we stop pretending that Judo is on the same level as BJJ please? thanks, -The Grappling Community.

[chchjudoschool]

@luchador1764

What are you saying??? If you are implying that one martial art is less or more worthy than the other it is a misconception. Of course BJJ is new, and not anywhere near as popular as judo in the world, but it is growing. The olympics is hard to get into. Both martial arts stand in the rule sets. They are as good as their students.

[ccrcountry]

@luchador1764

Well, actually judo and BJJ are very similars.

Judo includes ground techniques named newaza.

I think that depends of the fighter skills.

Of course i dont use that fancy throws as a judoka, i prefer some effective feet sweeps.

Judo and BJJ are very fine.

[OVERCAPITALIZE]

The less patched guy is Judoka, (Blue gi with one patch on the back)

[franciscoreatas11]

So you brazilian gay jitsu lovers, can you please tell me what is brazilian gay jitsu? I have not seen a single technique that is not from Judo. just because you choose to spread your ass cheeks when you lay on your back like a fag, instead of protecting your rectum, it does not mean that the dishonorable gracies invent it.

[ericmhanks]

Yeah not a heel hook at all. Just a simple straight ankle lock

[ericmhanks]

The guard pull at 1:10 was really sloppy.

[asquadbjj]

with the highest paying tournaments and sponsors its only going to grow. if your still not convinced go watch ufc 1,2,3,4 .

In short judos a cool sport with some wicked hip throws, but thats about it- i use to train judo but i got to feed up with the spoet side of things- as in real life sparring its useless. rules of the tourney where fine just becuase they didnt stand them up after 5 secs.

Your rebuttle Mr Spinks?...

[asquadbjj]

Which is actually how bjj came about, yes helio was taught judo and got all of his concepts from Watching his brothers- but because he was a fragile man only 5'7 he could not part take in judo (over-rated) so he and his brothers over time developed technique based on leverage and technique which long story short became the most dominate martial art in modern day- bought life back into martial arts crowded by mcdojos and is by far the fasest growing martial art in the world.

[asquadbjj]

far out quick to respond.

bjj is judo, yet completely different, mainly in the set ups . judo plays heavily on strength and takedowns (most only effective in sport judo) . bjj concentrates heavily on technique and leverage and most importantly the ground aspect.

Bjj means the smaller man can still win whilst using technique . judo is so strength reliant almost always the larger man wins.

[asquadbjj]

this kinda demonstrates how superior bjj over judo is, bunch of judo black belts unable to beat white blue, and purple belts in bjj.... its pretty funny how the judoka goes for a heel hook... and every bjjer in the place laughs at his technique.

thank helio for bjj!!

[chchjudoschool]

@asquadbjj

BJJ is judo.

Rule set is different, but its almost the same sport.

Common teaching. The coach makes the difference& training environment.

Grading systems are very different This contest had weird rules for judoka to enter a BJJ contest under their rule set is an immediate disadvantage. Especially when they are not focussed on that rule set, but compete for fun and good spirit of shared lineage, your comment is disturbing.

Helio was taught judo, he didn't create a unique system.

[PandawdyBob]

@chchjudoschool BJJ makes the ground techniques found in Judo far more effective.

[chchjudoschool]

@PandawdyBob

Kosen Judo is the basis of BJJ

If you study from that school; you can specialize in groundwork, & be more competent at Judo newaza. Most judo clubs give equal or more status to standing fighting because it is more combat effective in our Martial Art.

Its not smart for self defence to do ground work as your head will likely get kicked in. As a sport we acknowledge this fact, need to get up quick. BJJ has sport following,Am impressed thats great. There are good&bad judo dojo.

[lzrdsixsix6]

@asquadbjj

Were you watching the same video? the Judoka almost always had better positioning even if they couldn't finish it. look i dont think anyone can say either is better but you have to remember that on the street being on top is better than the bottom.

and btw that wasn't a heel hook.

[franciscoreatas11]

@asquadbjj Please tell me which of the following techniques belong to the gracies youtube.com/watch?v=Y1pZkv1trE­I

[OVERCAPITALIZE]

@asquadbjj <- Ignorant.

[makikomi]

@asquadbjj So you're alleging that BJJ is superior on the basis of three draws and two wins at a relatively low level of competition? Bear in mind that the two wins were obtained with Dojime techniques which do not actually form part of Kodokan Judo.

Your logic is so flawed as to be laughable.

[wo0oo1]

@asquadbjj ur an idiot and u dont know shit

[wo0oo1]

@asquadbjj oh and yeah look at bjj's superior takedown attempt at 1:06

[chchjudoschool]

Has anyone experienced bleeding urine after dojime or organ damage?? It's not something many will freely admit??!

[84justincase]

3:41 Grappling vs. lil' kid

[happymlk]

Very exciting!

[thatkindofguy234]

kind of annoying because I can't tell who is judo and who is BJJ

[grahamhg]

@thatkindofguy234 Thats coz they're the same thing ;) the jitz guys have patches on their gis

[Bilalos]

@thatkindofguy234 The guys that always end up on the ground on their backs are the BJJ guys, Judo guys rarely end up on their back, they're taught to turtle up or lay flat on their tummy. it's good to learn both arts, Judo will give great throws to take it to the ground and end up in a superior position and BJJ to learn how to fight off your back.

[wolfhammer2010]

I love the sport of submission grappling....

[djfoca]

dojime is a prohibited in judo because its damage internal organs

[billysue2]

@djfoca it certainly doesnt damage any internal organs,the thing I notice about it is that its very easy to hyperextend the spine and i have a few times tapped to an unintentional spine lock.Most times its just hard to breathe.Organ damage is bollox.

[chchjudoschool]

@billysue2

Hi Billysue2;

That's not a scientific appraisal.

I felt extreme internal pressure from the lock and believe in the possibility that there is organ damage in some people from a well placed triangle.

I had slight blood in urine. It is damaging for sure. Just maybe your dojo apply it slightly different or are sized different in relation to you.

[NZSambo]

By the way - I do respect kano as good and smart administrator, meneger - not as coach or combat expoert.

As coach he was useless….



[NZSambo]

About Randori – it is not free fighting, it is free wrestling.

No one punch or kick in Judo , so Judo can't be called  fighting by English language definition.

About Kano - Great statement - some one (kano) who never perform himself invented lot of new technique…. Not wonder you people so great in Olympic Judo with kano innovation…...

[NZSambo]

It is not spine lock. “Boston crab” it is, but it would never work in skill full athletes.

You people like your teacher Jigaro – try to prohibited every thing you cant teach or defence from:

- no fireman

- no head and arm

- no leg attack

- ankle pick

- no over back

I surprise suplex not prohibited yet, but I have feeling you would do it shortly.

[frostymourne]

@NZSambo Kano used the fireman throw back in the old days.

[NZSambo]

Jason K rules – as you call it – was design as GI submission wrestling challenge – what is part of Judo and BJJ or any other GI submission wrestling style. it works.

[chchjudoschool]

@NZSambo

They were OK rules, no problem (I would prefer excluding can-opener spinelocks)

[NZSambo]

IJF rules – Olympic Judo rules.

Time to learn deference between Olympic Judo and other Judos(including Kodokan one)

1. New Zealand have own Judo Rules which is not IJF (for kids).

2. You can make own Judo Contest rules – no one would oppose.

3. Technically speaking BJJ – is Judo, or Judo - is BJJ, Brazilians just refuse to change name when Kano change it. And kano did it for marketing and commercial purpose not performance. Hi was good administrator and useless combat expert and coach.

[chchjudoschool]

@NZSambo

Kano Sensei was a jujitsu master, a leader in many areas. He proved himself in combat many times.

IJF rules are similar to All JapanJF rules in most areas.

Club coaches risk negligence, disciplinary action when accidents occur if they modify the Judo NZ rules set.

Rules are carefully considered, their consequences discussed at committee & coaches then modified by consensus.

This tournament is outside normal rules set, Jason K rules.

IJF ruleset is at senior Judo NZ tournaments.

[NZSambo]

@chchjudoschool Kano was not JJ master nether combat expert. I knew such people a lot. Most of them cant perform nor teach, but use other to promote themselves. Kano was one of them - international combat fraud with great governmental power behind him.

Contest Rules metter of change and it is hard to define what is “normal”.

There is Olympic Judo rules – I respect, rest is local interpretation mostly fraud and speculation.

[chchjudoschool]

@NZSambo

Kano was great because he designed randori or free fighting.

He introduced a high performance young team to judo and swept away opposition. He introduced a time limit and a combat space.

He invented a lot of techniques, created a rule set, excluded a lot of inefficient techniques, fought to prove his combat effectiveness, developed his club, developed a winning team, networked and created schools judo,

[chchjudoschool]

@sagaciousknight

Hi; some were judoka on Jujitsu team vs Judo team; so partly correct, however rule set falls outside judo rules so not judo....by definition from IJF referees commission, not a judo contest. no ans reqd.

[todd1400]

i think kerry is scarry cos hes a ugly bastard

[Erae007]

0:12 on the right hand side.. on the matris 2kids...wtf is going on ther... lol

[chchjudoschool]

@Erae007

just some judo kids filling in time

[1Mafioso4]

@Erae007 LMAO!!

[chchjudoschool]

NZ Sambo

Dear Demitri; Please note OLYMPICS are 2012 in London for Judo...

NOT 2010. That was the Winter Olympics we just had...???

Olympics are by selection through Oceania and Worlds points ranking...

Oceania has 10 slots for 14 weights,

notwithstanding someones right earnt by success at top 10 World ranking right of entry.

[obywonn]

IM in uk and a judo guy and think your site is the best...great vids and real grappling...

[chchjudoschool]

thanks,

if you like please rate and favourite them, it gives us more featured video, assists the spread of judo.

[NZSambo]

You mean spread your version of judo.  So what you did to send team to Olympics 2010 and spread judo?

[chchjudoschool]

2012 London

[NZSambo]

Olympics are not this year?????

It is exactly I am talking about ignorance.

We for 4 years share that news and try to encourage NZ Judo something about to send team there and you still do not know about. Highly professional sport development. Even do not know about major Judo event of 2010.. not surprise me at all

[chchjudoschool]

2012

[NZSambo]

NZOWU start run submission events to pleased FILA, but look like it would came to felure. I have rocomends board to aloud avery one wrestle submission wrestling for free just to pay entry fee. But people ignore it same as for 4 years every one ignor my proposition about Youth Olympic Game preparation. How many Judokas going to Olympic this year?

[chchjudoschool]

@NZSambo

Olympics are not this year.

London 2012

Only 10 spots for 14 categories for Oceania based on world and Oceania rankings, and maximum of 1 entrant per country. Or by world ranking right of top 10? entrants qualifying by their top 10 status.

[NZSambo]

It is most pathetic if some one who has no idea about science but make statement about scientific research.

It is called speculation.

Only idiots use sand as foundation for skyscraper. People cant make basic biomechanical definition but flashing with scintific resurch. Sound odd.

[chchjudoschool]

@NZSambo

From your lofty scientific skyscraper us pathetic judo coaches look very small. Please go write your theories on some other site. You have had your say now, I dont want to block you, please do not ramble or become offensive and I can value your comments.

[NZSambo]

Judo Books:

I not sure what kind book you talk about.

There is lot of them. Modern Russia is not USSR and I would not surprise if there some uneducated Japanese lovers penetrate in Judo. Russia with 150 mil population have no more champions than Georgia with 3 mil, or Mongolia(3 mil) make me wounder where russure going?

There is sport science every one have chose study it and use it , or not. Japanese Judo(kodokan) despite science.

Most New Zealander copy Japanese Judo.

[chchjudoschool]

I have seen some excellent scientific Japanese judo studies. they are available online at Kodokan website.

[NZSambo]

About style:

There is no such thing as classical style. Classical is speculation.

If some poor quality work it is indication that opponent is useless or tied, injure or drunk.

There is correct teaching and incorrect teaching. If class have 100 students who wrestle each other every day in hard challenge, you may teach any bullshit or teach nothing but still some one would develop good skill for reason constant challenge.

[NZSambo]

If any one value challenge than we should accept proposition at leas ones or twice a month open mat. Around the world people get together every week for training matches and every one may wrestle 3-5 competition style bouts. I not talking about randori but competition format with about 15-20 min rest for athletes. In eastern Europe we do it every week and often twice.

[NZSambo]

About cross training:

More correctly I would say cross event participation, for technique is same.

All USSR wrestlers in first Judo Olympisc and world chams was 100% sambists.

Example: David Rudman FIAS president is Judo World champ medallist and European Judo champion.

Cross event participation have high value for development, specially in New Zealand if number and quality are low.

For years approaching all combat organisations (NSO) cooperate together. It would benefit every one

[NZSambo]

About technique:

Over back throw is over back throw, armbar is armbar no matter Sambo, Judo, BJJ etc.

Rules is more about tactical not technical.

Lot of friends of my included world champions in Judo and Sambo prefer wrestle Judo not Sambo, for Judo rules give you greater chance go get domination.

In Judo athletes get more reward and support then Sambo participation for reason Judo is an Olympic sport and Sambo not.

But drill technique and names - same for any GI wrestling style

[NZSambo]

So bottom line it is not appropriate to call JJ v Judo event. It not make any good for Judo. Why just not put Spinks team v Weber team?

[NZSambo]

I just hope one day such organisation as NZJUDO, NZOWU turn towards BJJ and other kind of wrestling to share events and allowed cross participation, otherwise we would never develop combatitive sport evern close to world High performance level.

[chchjudoschool]

Agree;

As you know membership of groups is paying the money.

The question we need to ask is if someone is already a member of one group. how much money would federations accept as a 2nd membership discount,

Judo is 12 months Wrestling is seasonal...

[NZSambo]

Olympic Judo just offer far more development opportunity then any other GI wrestling style for simple reason IT IS ON OLYMPIC. But no one care about performance development. Lot of people (not all) lock themselves in own gym and happy with there fake self-esteem and martial art fantasy.

[NZSambo]

There is no such thing as russian judo.

There is just two deferent Judo:

1 Olympic Judo - GI wrestling governed by IJF.

2 Kodokan Judo - Kano fantasy world.

Olympic Judo wrestling have no thing to do with Japan same as Greco-roman have no thing to do with Greek or Romans.

[chchjudoschool]

I see specific stylistic differences between Judoka from Japan, and USSR in the past. However recently I trained with some Russian Judoka who are current World medallists. Their style was typical and generic to current World trends.

However the Mongols who won gold last Olympic & team mates have a clearly different judo...under the IJF ruleset. Japanese Judo to some

[chchjudoschool]

I have 2 books on Russian Judo;

they show trends from Russian judoka that were influential on World Judo trends and stylistically unique from USSR

[NZSambo]

Just to drop lights on matters.

Judo, BJJ, Sambo is GI wrestling. Deferent only valuation of performance.

Any one who teach deferent than that just speculation and deceives others.

Deferent Rules just dictate you to chose correct tactics, but technique would still be same.

There is not such thing as Judo technique or BJJ technique or Sambo technique.

There is only right technique and wrong one.

If it wrong it is wrong no matter what rules you wrestling by: Judo, BJJ or Sambo.

[chchjudoschool]

Many techniques not done along classic style can still work in contest but be poor quality.

One persons wrong is anothers right...

Rules of grappling sport lead trends for athletes.

That creates style differences that are notable.

Important when comparing athletes cross training&competing.

[SFNZMMA]

Actually it's just Strikeforce Ju Jitsu and not Strikeforce BJJ. While we do have elements of BJJ in our syllabus I don't want to be labeled or limited by the whole BJJ concept. We also incorporate elements from Japanese Ju Jitsu, Judo, Western Wrestling and any Submission art we can pirate techniques from. We are very lucky to have guys like Jason, Gareth and Demetri who all share their incredible knowledge at the gym. And we really appreciate good competition in any format.

Karl Webber

[chchjudoschool]

Thanks Karl

Gareth had some amazing Judo coaches... he has nice judo...

Jason's current NZ champ mens open...

Demitri well, he's also a competent wrestling/russian judo coach. Great team, looking forward to awesome club developing

[SFNZMMA]

@chchjudoschool

Ju Jitsu is not known for it's throwing prowess and I don't want to known as just another ground fighting school so having Jason and Gareth to teach this element is a total asset for the club. We still have a long way to go but at least we reognize the value of good throwing techniques. Thanks for changing the title too mate.

[chchjudoschool]

classical jujitsu has many schools that throw but judo really developed this aspect by removing many strikes from contest.

Many of Judo's throws came from Kito Ryu Jujitsu, many were developed by Kano Sensei and students as a practicality from the new study of Randori or free fighting which characterized judo apart from jujitsu. BJJ shares this aspect and is very close to judo, more so than classical jujitsu because of this. was there 4 BJJ teams in the tournament?

[SFNZMMA]

@chchjudoschool

Yeah out of the 9 teams entered there were 4 BJJ Teams 2 from the Academy of Combat, 1 from Dunedin BJJ and 1 from Groundworx BJJ- Then we had 3 teams from Strikeforce Ju Jitsu and 2 from Judo.

[NZSambo]

Not many strikes but all of them.

[chchjudoschool]

Who are the first two competitors from your team? I can name them in annotations

[SFNZMMA]

@chchjudoschool

Paul Earthorne was 1st up and Simon Jones was our 2nd competitor.

[juliustetevano]

Awesome video graeme, i'm still currently deciding if i should join your school because i love judo takedowns or start training with carl because we share the same gym.

[chchjudoschool]

choices choices choices...

I think that the feel of a judo class is a lot different to a takedown and groundwork class.

While we are far from Olympic level for most judoka we aspire to elevate our skills towards elite performance...

It's a significantly different headspace (way) to BJJ emphasis or MMA.

[TheJutsu14]

Awesome tournament! This is a pretty cool idea; everybody loves to watch a Judo vs BJJ match. Your judo team has very good newaza! Y'all should definitely focus on guard passing a lot more for next time since the BJJ guys kept pulling guard. Perhaps next time to reduce the number of draws you could use some sort of point system? The BJJ system makes a lot of sense. Keep these videos coming!

[chchjudoschool]

Thanks. I like BJJ but prefer submission,because people adapt to become points fighters, rather than taking a victory. Judo is a prime example of that and has improved now we wiped the koka from scoring

A fighter that won by Ippons (KO victory) on one side of a draw compare another that competed not to lose on the other, koka small point , not risking attack, just countering. truly great fighters have a big attack capability and take risks towards success.