Low End Computers (1985)

[TookMe20min2findThis]

Thanks Leonard for your inputs, that was very informative!

[suggarin]

WOW AMERICAN COMPUTERS BUILT BY AMERICANS !!

[conradojavier]

Give Us the Damn Sword.

[MrCumstein]

@conradojavier LMAO

[cuttock]

did idiii ahhhrgh

[bazfanv2]

The Amiga was and still to this day - A FUCKING BEAST OF A MACHINE. It had it all.

PC's are generic, the Amiga is unique.

[pantarej777]

He is from Poland...

[thines01a]

OMG -- I'm feeling nostalgic.

[16mmDJ]

OH MY GOD. IT'S JACK TRAMIEL.

the god of personal home computers

[cryinglion]

Interesting. The "Japanese" company called....Nintendo....actually approached Atari to market the NES under the Atari label. And Atari said...No. And there you are. Bye Bye to Atari's hold on the U.S. market.

[rjp443]

@cryinglion They made it clear that they were talking about personal computers and NOT toys like the NES/Famicom. While it is true the Japanese penetrated and completely dominated the home video game market after 1985, conversely, they never even got their foot in the door in U.S. or world home computing markets. Didn't even get to see the door. Hell, they weren't even allowed to enter the building!

Ever use MSX? PC98? FM Towns? No? Because they were all Japanese exclusives. They didn't even try

[cryinglion]

@rjp443 I suppose Nintendo would not have done well in the computing market in the U.S. anyway. It's interesting that this guy used to be head of Commodore, and in my opinion (and probably many others), the Commodore 64 outdid in overall popularity than comparable Atari computers (even though Atari computers are actually pretty good).

[rjp443]

@cryinglion

I just found this. youtube com / watch?v=Vzm_L000PhM&

I didn't even know about it until now. This further strengthens the argument that Japanese dominance in this area was never going to happen, back then or in the future. I feel this is because deep-seated cultural differences which dictate their approaches to goals encumbers them from ever tapping the pool of Silicon Valley.

And besides its all about software now, not hardware. The platforms have been engineered to a plateau.

[bazfanv2]

@rjp443 The msx was released in the uk, my freind had one and we used to play Manic Minor on it. So yes to the Msx, no to the others.

[rjp443]

@bazfanv2 If you are familiar with how home computers or video games were marketed, UK or Europe was treated very differently than U.S.

This particular episode of CC was talking about US vs Japan. I mean, can one seriously compare UK's software and hardware (Acorn and ?) companies to Silicon Valley at this time period? (Side note: BBC Micro was attempted in US and failed)

MSX may have been able to penetrate the UK market because it also wasn't faced with such fierce competition.

[dunebasher1971]

@rjp443 the MSX only achieved minor sales success in the UK. It arrived too close to the end of the home micro boom. I only ever saw them in shops at the time, I didn't know anyone who actually owned one.

[MysticArksRevenge]

@rjp443 And that makes me very angry. Japan OBIVIOUSLY has the better hardware, better software AND the better music processor in their computers.

[rjp443]

@MysticArksRevenge Music processor, yes, though the SID chip during the 8-bit era was hard to top in flexibility. Hardware was better, if not proprietary or exotic.

The software on Japanese platforms were SERIOUSLY lacking. I'm not talking about games. I'm talking where the REAL money is: office productivity, OS, and utility software, which was hyper-localized to Japan.

It could not compete with western offerings, which also became multi-regional. Japan ended up making great peripherals though.

[conradojavier]

@cryinglion Warner Bros should have sold Atari back to Bushnell instead of a Commodore Founder.

[conradojavier]

@cryinglion in Hindsight Nintendo give a Bird to Atari(Under Tramiel).

[haloman977]

lol hes talking about the Japanese! LOLOL Toshiba Has been around since 1875. I think they know what they are doing.

[crazysingingchick]

Cool vid!! It's so funny... when I was in 4th grade, I remember when my mom and dad brought home a new apple II e - with a printer! I thought they had won the lottery. My dad recently told me that the whole system cost $2000+ back then. We were NOT upper class, but my parents save money well and then occasionally use what they've saved for cool stuff like that. God bless them. On the other hand, we were the LAST family to own a VHS player during the 80's - never had a Beta. LOL.

[FreeStuffLawl]

it plays crysis @ 1920x1080 max settings @ 200 fps, bet you wish you had one

[danwat1234]

This show is the shit. Seriously i love this vintage show

[mrbollocks1979]

jack has some substantial neck hair happening.

[MalkavianMadness]

Funny How Jack Tramiel talks about keeping the Japanese off the market in this interview while in the end he got burried by Nintendo.

[mikechicago]

Where is the factory located that they were making those C64s toward the end of the video?

[Commodorian]

@mikechicago It is most probably the West Chester plant.

[1990chrism]

what about Sinclair computers? they're the ones who brought the cheap computer to the home. Typical Americans ignoring any innovation outside of their own country.

[bazfanv2]

@1990chrism I agree, i was thinking where the hells clives computers. Most people hate Jack and i dont know why. He brought the st to the masses while other computers were way out the range of jo public. Fast forward to 2010 and becos of JT we have cheap computers becos apple couldnt manipulate and monopolise the market, if they had, i estimate that the cheapest pc to buy in 2010, £5000 plus Vat.

[Commodorian]

@1990chrism The first Sinclair was just a hobby computer, you had to build it yourself. That is what made the ZX80 so cheap. They did not manufacture and design their own chips like Commodore did, this is what made computers like the C64 and the Atari 800 so special.

[roberthurstrius]

For those of us that were adults in 1985, this was a good informational program, for less than 10-minutes, that probably got inserted in-between other Sunday PBS programs. It was an uncertain time for the 'home computer' as it became the 'personal computer' market. Video games had run their course, and the 'masses' (the other 85%) were looking to do something more with a computer. It was cool to hear 'multimedia' and 'online banking' mentioned as "what;s coming next", and of course, it had.

[bazfanv2]

it was a toy and it failed, old jack lad dont mince is words, he tells it how it is with a smile on his face.

[dreaddog]

Bet jack wishes he hadn't talked like that mentioning about 8-bit and saying he's 'keeping those poeple out' OMG how rasist, Well Nintendo got last laugh when they released their Game Boy out selling the Lynx due to Atari only managing limited distribution even tho being the world's first handheld electronic game in colour no less. But the Game Boy being 60% cheaper and also smaller and Nintendo havd no problems supplying retailers, it didn't have a colour screen and elaborate custom chips.

[MegaGumbo]

@dreaddog: I don't think that holocaust survivor Jack Tramiel is a racist. Also, Commodore hat their own offices in Japan during the 1980s, with japanese Employees working on the final designs of CBMs computers. So next time you try to be "politically correct", you better check twice before accuing someone of something that isn't true.

[dreaddog]

TBH MegaGunbo being holocaust survivor does not stop someone being rasist just makes them more closed minded. i made before comment after having knowing an incredibal amount about Jack, Atari, Commodore and the whole 80's home computer war, also jack left Commodore due to disagreaments in management. This is just 1 quote from Magazine inverview "Japanese can only be successful if there are no more people like me" take from Early History of Jack Tramiel's Commodore. so NO need for me tobe "PC".

[dreaddog]

close minded coz of being rasist not becuase of being a holocaust survivor just want to make that straight from before post.

[MegaGumbo]

Well, I see it the "business" way: Mr. Tramiel (or "Jack") is / had been known for his tough way of doing business. And to some extend, that made him a winner for some time. So I think that back then he didn't want to make a racist statement rather than make clear that he (Tramiel) is "the one reason" the japanese didn't have the success on the global market. To me, this is more a matter of "over-ego". And that would fit perfectly to him (this is what I think about all that, at least).

[MegaGumbo]

I apologize for the "PCness" part of my previous posting but still am not convinced that Tramiel is or had been a racist.

[dreaddog]

Ye i'd say the same tbh i think my choice of words was abit harsh i actually have alot of respect for Jack reading alot about his background. i probably should of said that Jack was alittle 'unPC' but i suppose its to be expected of the time '80's America'. i would also say that your totaly right with Tramiel Ego/Over-Ego & idd he's not rasist just non-pc. i retract the origional statment or at least its wording and also apologize.

[rovercrew]

Jack did keep the japs out of the computer industry pretty well. May I remind you that Nintendo make games consoles, not computers, and the whole topic of discussion was computers. Your making a stupid comparison. When jack took over Atari, he was focused on computers not making games consoles. By the way, if your going to rip your information off of Wikiepdia about the lynx (without quoting your source), at least put down the correct facts - it was 58% cheaper

[dreaddog]

OMG call me a lier for 2% rovercrew you fail in life...

[rovercrew]

yeah nice one, of all the things I said, you contend the point I dropped in at the end and thats it? This is as far as your wealth of knowledge goes on the matter is it? Obviously there isn't a specific enough wikipedia article for you to leach from now, so all you have to say are crappy one liners. So somehow, I've failed in life because your too incompetent to follow the topic in a youtube video and quote from wikipedia properly? I didn't even call you a 'lier' - Learn to read and spell!

[dreaddog]

OMG YOU ARE SO SAD GET A LIFE.... spelling haha whatever mate

[dreaddog]

AND btw lier was a euphemism and i don't read wiki cause anyone is allowed to edit it, reference could be Zero magazine from sometime during the 90's sorry for not remembering or keeping the issue to remind me...

[rovercrew]

yeah spelling, HAHAHAHA whatever indeed, it just shows what an illiterate dumb fuck you are. And I see your a liar now as well. Had your original post just mentioned the one point about it being 58 or 60% cheaper, then fair enough, I could believe you read that ages ago in a mag. But you actually ripped off an entire paragraph off a section in Wikipedia with regards to the Atari Lynx. It follows the same flow, picks up on all the same points, and the way they're put forward.

[rovercrew]

And why would using 'lier' as a euphemism even be in context to what you said? Bearing in mind you can't even spell racist, and you've just lied about not copying from wikipedia. I think its safe to say your lying again. Its ok, just go back to playing with your toys, give your gameboy a big hug :) That nasty Jack can't hurt you now with his 'rasist' comments

[dreaddog]

if i simply copied it, it would of been exactly the same... whoever wrote the wiki article obviously had reverence from somewhere else, and the fact that you jumped on the band wagon of some comments that where over months ago and that i'd apologised for my silly wording, have fun searching the net for spelling mistakes and other shit that noone really cares about anyway.

[rovercrew]

yeah its so obvious isn't it? you know, how you can remember so many points from a mag published last decade, that you don't even own, and you can't even remember the name of it. Yet lo and behold, this wikipedia article sums up all the points you mentioned on the same two lines. What other people care about is of no concern to me as I'm picking up on your stupidity alone, and you obviously care enough to be able to reply to every single post I make on here.

[sirpryde]

thanx for the upload this is the shit what he says is spot on pitty guys like this werent still around

[ruud2000tube]

excellent upload....thx!

[dreamcastII]

thanks for posting this Sir !

[wvoutlaw2002]

Leonard Tramiel looks like a Sasquatch/Bigfoot. :)