I can tell you that EVERY person I have talked to that has been in a Union has said they DO NOT want the Unions to negotiate for them ... they are GROWN UPS and can get their own jobs and negotiate their own salary with the companies they are seeking to work for!
If you actually read this far congratulations! There may be some hope for you as an educable, thinking individual yet! The rest? Go about you business of killing zombies on X-Box.
Unionism and entitlement thinking. I am in the autumn of my life and realize that the U.S. citizen has generally become a generation of much stupider, dull witted, short attention spanned ignoramuses that can be led about by the nose of the narrow self interests but really? Do the math. This kind of thinking will never add up. It attracts the lowest of human nature and denies the higher levels of thought and consideration that keeps it all spinning. Good luck with that people! (end part 3)
I know that by and large students of the past 30 or 40 years are no longer taught any real history and that this current generation can be played like a cheap fiddle as a result but I ask any person that cares about America look into the history of the latter half of the 20th century. What took the greatest industrial nation in the world into the state it is currently in? (end part 2)
At 1:04 Gerard makes the point that America has the lowest rate of unionization etc. Could it be that most Americans don't trust organized labor and what it has done in America? We compete in a world market. If the price of American steel is too high then alternative sources are available. It was the United Steel Workers that priced themselves out of the market and shrunk the need for American steel. It was his union that single handily created the rust belt. (end part 1)
Any one that wants to participate in the wealth needs to earn some money and invest it. Start a business and generate wealth. Wealth is generated not shared. Where does this logic come from that states " we the workers deserve some of the wealth we made for the employer" You deserve the wage you agreed to when hired, EVERYTHING else they give you is gravy. By the way you didn't make the wealth the employer enjoys..his investment did. Part of his investment was your wage and benefits. Detroit HA.
You've accepted the propaganda fed to you all your life without looking at the facts for yourself. Union's have created great benefits for all wage earners. Business fears unions and they've infected your mind.
yea, the choice between one dictatorship(employer) or another. The wealth of CEO's is made on the backs of underpaid workers. Workers are forced to sign unfair labor contracts or starve in the streets! Is that what human beings deserve? And yes workers MAKE the wealth employers enjoy, they MAKE the capital used to invest, bosses just consume and manage(often poorly). Workers could easily manage themselves with just a little more knowledge and bring more profits and growth!
My opinion is this guy has no clue what day it is much less income disparity. Being a free country any one has the oppurtunity to take or refuse a job. I f it doesn't pay enough don't take ignorant lazy people take anything they are offered then squeal about how bad they have it and demand intervention. Emancipation for all was proclaimed over One Hundred Fifty years ago.
Guess what the employeer HAS the right to do what ever they want, they pay the bills . Socialist pig
Then maybe you'd like to go back to working 12 hours a day with no health care and no vacation pay. Cuz that's what the socialist pigs won for you. If you believe your own words, relinquish your benefits and try to get them back on your own.
I have never worked for a union and had health, vacation, retirement,and no crooked mafia bred union hierarchy to support. This moron in the video is talking lie and fantasy. America has the greatest wealth slope ever in the history of the world. Why should an employeer owe his employees anything more than the wage agreed upon. You want to participate in the wealth earn some money and start a business. This guy says we don't have to fight for unions in Detroit, cause Detroits broke. wise up dup
Where do you think you got your benefits from? Read your history and find out who struggled for workers rights. They weren't created out of the goodness of wall street financiers.
Stealing money? Is that your interpretation of what Unions do? Nevermind they've raised the standard of living for all American's, but as the unions are disappearing, our non-union jobs are suffering as a result. You're obviously on the side of Business. Why? What has Business done for you lately?
My business is 4 retail stores & a small wholesale business established in 1989. I have employed many people throughout the years but had many problems expanding because of excessive taxation & regulations. This has hurt me, my possible employes I never ended up hiring, my suppliers, etc.
It is government that has destroyed Western business. (I sincerely mean this, and would be glad to PM you a brief reason why.)
The too big to fail theory is a myth? What about too big to be allowed to fail?
Where were you last year when the bailout of the "too big to be allowed to fail" AIG & others sparked the biggest shift of public wealth into private hands (aka grand theft in broad daylight with millions of witnesses) in history?
Are you going to argue that the corporations who's incompetence, greed & excesses which threatened to kill them & take the whole economy down with them doesn't, in fact, prove my point?
Why is America the only major industrial democracy without a labour party? We only have one party, the business party, split into two factions. I would love some answers.
The labour party that is forming in america is communist. I hate to sound like conservative for saying that but they are declared communists. I actually am leaning toward Bernie Sanders politics. He is a democratic socialist
This is true, sadly. I personally find social democracy more suitable than a democratic socialist stance; however, I also consider democratic socialism far more preferable than much of the mainstream politics jammed down our throats these days in the USA.
yeah,Obama is really just so pro business its almost sickening,huh? Who do you people want to work for, the government ? Do you know any history at all? You might ought to check out what fascism and communism is and what it leads to before jumping on this bandwagon to hell.
@BoStevoD No matter what management system instituted, corrupt integrity is prevelant in all. In spain, victim of fascism in the extreme, labor is instituted by ownership. Co-ops are the dominate labor force factor in spain. Still with workers ownership of shares. The muscle of management that goes against members wishes is unreformable and masterfully instituted. labor is corrup-table
@BoStevoD It was not always like that, the media-o-poly have brainwashed americans for about 3 decades .. There ARE other candidates, Nader have been running for years but gets no coverage in the mainstream..
In a democracy information/transparency is hard-currency! How else would one make sound decisions?
Unions are bad for business very bad they are the union members are greedy they dont understand they are LUCKY TO HAVE A JOB fuck unions. they are bad for business. You work you get your pay check thats it no vacation pay no healthcare benefits none of that bullshit those cost hurt business workers be lucky you have a job.
No actually. Either a business can hold the power or the employee if the employee is a skilled laborer with specifically required qualifications. In the event that the business has too much power and tramples on the rights of employees unions are formed to protect workers. If employees have too much power they often sign contracts to tie themselves to a company. Both can be manipulated but are equally essential in equitable businesses. Get your head out of the ground.
Economic issues aside, there is NO justification for anti-union laws in a free, democratic society.
By restricting union activities, all they've done is allow the business elite to fix the price of labor.
And if a union contract DOES drive an employer into bankruptcy, then that's the union's fault, and by extension, the fault of the workers. Everyone loses. Even with fair labor laws, there is no escaping market forces.
Congrats, you are supporting the rich elite who have bankrupted this country. Are you a rich elite yourself? Probably not. You're probably a plebe, who is so brainwashed, he probably doesn't even know what's good for him.
Sooner or later you will like unions, guaranteed. Either it's today, or it's when you are in the soup line with newspaper for shoes. Until you see their necessary role, you are misinformed.
Renegen1: you're right. As business unions (aka behemoth corporations) have worked relentlessly (and often fraudulently) to buy legislation which secures rights and limited liability for themselves (and, consequently, independent employers), so should workers have unions standing up-- like David to Goliath-- to behemoth corporations who will always place profits before the health and well being of individual workers.
It is necessary that business make profits. To say that they make money by exploiting their employees is not only disingenuous it's an out right lie. Profits are what enables business to remain in business and are the reward for producing something that consumers want. If you dont like you're job, quit and open your own business. Most successful employers treat their employees very well. Employees determine a businesses success, so we want the best we can afford. Thats how most business operate
So if I take the risk and start a business, work my ass off for years, and grow the business to 300 employees, this guy thinks that my employees shoud have more rights to make decisions about my business than I do? What logical person would agree with any unions at all? Unions are nothing more than thugs that use mafia tactics to get what they want, always at the detriment of the company.
I started my business in 1988 and, like you, used my life savings and also mortgaged my home. I didn't expend any blood but certainly sacrificed a lot of free time I otherwise would have had as an employee of another company. I actually don't have a union in my company but I pay them better than union wages plus better benefits. Yes, I took the initial risk but my guys have taken on my "dream" and have helped make it a reality. I get very well rewarded and so do they, as they deserve.
That's exactly as it should be. You said it all when you said you pay higher than union wages and your employees have taken over your dream. Businesses don't need unions to do the right thing for employees and you and I are testament to that Businesses are in competition with one another for the best employees, so we pay more than our competitors to attract the best because we know that our employees make or break us and they're expensive to replace
Well said, though I'd hope that by "most people" (who don't understand this) you mean businessmen as well.
Unfortunately, although one builds his own company from scratch, his successor might feel differently about the workers, not having the needed connection to the firm.
The question might then also be: does a new CEO or even a new owner have the right to freely dispose of people that based their lives on the business and maybe sacrificed for its sake too.
There are douche bags in every facet of life, including business. If a new CEO were to come in and do something like the scenario you wrote, they would end up losing the best and brightest in the company and wouldn't be the CEO for long, and not because of unions, Just look at the once massive industries that unions have ruined in this country, steel auto. Unions track record sucks. Maybe at one time they had their place, but that time has long since passed.
jjrglobal: it wasn't labor unions that "ruined" industry in this country, it was the corporate business model which mandates-- by law-- that executives do whatever it takes to increase profits for themselves & investors. Eventually, if the business venture is successful, there will be an unbalancing shift of wealth from the bottom where production & labor costs have stagnated to satisfy the demands for profit at the top, & as we saw last year, the business bubble will burst, catastrophically.
So it's just a coincidence that the non union auto plants in the south are doing much better than their northern counterparts in Detroit? The unnecessary business cycle is created through monetary policy and interest rate manipulation by the Federal Reserve and other central banks that follow that economic model. Since when did production and labor costs stagnate? Production and labor costs have skyrocketed for businesses.
For the record, I dont agree with anyone buying politicians to sway legislation. We should pass a law against any public official accepting more than $100 from any individual. If caught, try them for treason, if found guilty, hang em. It is treason to put personal gain before the good of the country and nothing will change until we decide to address this problem
jjrglobal, your wrote: "For the record, I dont agree with anyone buying politicians to sway legislation. . . and nothing will change until we decide to address this problem."
AMEN.
It's going to be important for average citizens to set aside feelings of "team" affiliation & loyalty so that all corrupt politicians are delete with appropriately. Things will get interesting when everyone begins to realize that it's us, the working class, against them, the power elite & their tools in government.
AGREED People need to realize that this left right paradigm is nothing but a tool used to divide us. It is amazing how most people have a negative sentiment towards all business. Thats what I don't get
It's not business per say that's the problem. Small businesses (what's left of them) are the life blood of our communities. It's the behemoth multinational corporate conglomerates which gobble up small businesses & their worker force like hors d'oeuvres in order to squash competition & achieve controlling monopolies. The average citizen with a small business who still thinks the Corporate Party worries about them & their small business, & creates legislation accordingly, is deluding themselves.
Business is business whether small or large. Every small business owner would like to expand and eventually become a bigger business. Where do you draw the line on business expansion? When is a business too big?I agree that some big business don't do whats right, but sometimes neither do small businesses. I just dont see how anyone can draw a line between the two. Business can only grow if the consumers make it grow
A business is too big when it's grown so large that it becomes a Corporate State given its own seat at the U.N.; and a business is too big when its business interests are allowed to supersede the health and well being of the general population; and a business is too big if its wealth and power so exceeds that of its host country that it begins to threatens sovereignty & national security; and a business is too big when it's demise and fall would pull down the entire economy.
I don't know, jjrglobal. All I know is behemoth corporations are becoming-- in terms of wealth & power-- greater than most sovereign nations; and they're being allowed to influence legislation in ways that are great for the corporate agenda & those that is serves, but harmful to the rest of us.
I believe the fascism that most fear is taking over our lives isn't coming from a legitimate government but from the United Corporate States which stands behind the government pulling the puppet strings.
None of this power that has been achieved by these massive corporations could have happened without the help of the government. Government is the problem not the answer.
jjrglobal, your wrote "Government is the problem not the answer."
The government has been infiltrated by an army of corporate tools, passing themselves off as the people's representatives, whose mission it is to manipulate laws which slowly but surely chip away at the protections of the Constitution & Bill of Rights so that, eventually, we'll no longer have a representative republic but a fascist corporate state. If they're successful we'll be employees with only a "right to work," nothing more
The Constitution & Bill of Rights are not dead, yet. They may be in intensive care in critical condition, but they're not dead.
The solution will come when citizens actually stand up for their rights by demanding that the rule of law which protects their rights be upheld.
We need to be impeaching, recalling, & voting out congressmen who consistently author bills, co-sign the bills of others, and vote in laws which favor the corporate agenda over the health & well being of the rest of us.
Well, the scenario i describe is quite a common sight these days and the CEOs do not get usually fired: what do you think is the transfer of labor to the third world? Skilled workers in the west are being replaced by cheap labor in China and India.
The west can't keep its living standard if it's shoveling money away and the market logic leads to levelling of standards around the world. Maybe that's good in the long term, but countries like the US have few intruments to ease the impact now.
Oh, I forgot about the unions. They are one of the few powers that can actually slow down the process and, if widespread, they can effect policies to alleviate the social impact: the unions were possibly the main reason of social policies (healthcare, unemployment benefits etc) in the West.
hehe, even my pro-union friends laugh about the "Card Check" provision. It basically allows union leaders/members to go around and potentially bully people into voting for the union. There are reasons we have secret ballots in the country.
Organized crime and Unions....both rely on force and people are surprised that the two always seem to co-mingle.
THE EMPLOYEE FREE CHOICE ACT ALLOWS BOTH CARD CHECK AND SECRET BALLOT YOU STUPID FUCKING GORILLA, YOU FUCKING BRAINWASHED RETARDED SIMPLETON. IT ALLOWS BOTH. IT ALLOWS BOTH. enjoy being poor you stupid fuck, this country doesn't deserve prosperity with so many stupid fuckwits.
I appreciate that this is an emotional issue. The EFC in theory allows for both, in practice the "choice" as to whether or not to allow a secret ballot, is not made in secret. The same reasons to have secret ballots apply to having a secret ballot regarding the choice of ballot methodologies.
I understand that the legislation can be confusing.
You rushed to judge this legislation just as you rushed to judge me. Legal clauses do not lend themselves to hasty judgement.
I can tell you that EVERY person I have talked to that has been in a Union has said they DO NOT want the Unions to negotiate for them ... they are GROWN UPS and can get their own jobs and negotiate their own salary with the companies they are seeking to work for!
cwhunbun 2 months ago
If you actually read this far congratulations! There may be some hope for you as an educable, thinking individual yet! The rest? Go about you business of killing zombies on X-Box.
DVLBP 2 months ago
Unionism and entitlement thinking. I am in the autumn of my life and realize that the U.S. citizen has generally become a generation of much stupider, dull witted, short attention spanned ignoramuses that can be led about by the nose of the narrow self interests but really? Do the math. This kind of thinking will never add up. It attracts the lowest of human nature and denies the higher levels of thought and consideration that keeps it all spinning. Good luck with that people! (end part 3)
DVLBP 2 months ago
I know that by and large students of the past 30 or 40 years are no longer taught any real history and that this current generation can be played like a cheap fiddle as a result but I ask any person that cares about America look into the history of the latter half of the 20th century. What took the greatest industrial nation in the world into the state it is currently in? (end part 2)
DVLBP 2 months ago
At 1:04 Gerard makes the point that America has the lowest rate of unionization etc. Could it be that most Americans don't trust organized labor and what it has done in America? We compete in a world market. If the price of American steel is too high then alternative sources are available. It was the United Steel Workers that priced themselves out of the market and shrunk the need for American steel. It was his union that single handily created the rust belt. (end part 1)
DVLBP 2 months ago
Any one that wants to participate in the wealth needs to earn some money and invest it. Start a business and generate wealth. Wealth is generated not shared. Where does this logic come from that states " we the workers deserve some of the wealth we made for the employer" You deserve the wage you agreed to when hired, EVERYTHING else they give you is gravy. By the way you didn't make the wealth the employer enjoys..his investment did. Part of his investment was your wage and benefits. Detroit HA.
jerdeb4evr 2 years ago
You've accepted the propaganda fed to you all your life without looking at the facts for yourself. Union's have created great benefits for all wage earners. Business fears unions and they've infected your mind.
ElwynMaximus 2 years ago
What you say is true. Unions have done lots of good things. So have businesses. Businesses have also done lots of bad things. So have unions.
Unions under the Wagner Act drove American car makers.out of business.
I favor collective bargaining. I just think businesses should also have such an ability.
TenseAlcyoneus 2 years ago
yea, the choice between one dictatorship(employer) or another. The wealth of CEO's is made on the backs of underpaid workers. Workers are forced to sign unfair labor contracts or starve in the streets! Is that what human beings deserve? And yes workers MAKE the wealth employers enjoy, they MAKE the capital used to invest, bosses just consume and manage(often poorly). Workers could easily manage themselves with just a little more knowledge and bring more profits and growth!
talonmccloud 2 years ago
My opinion is this guy has no clue what day it is much less income disparity. Being a free country any one has the oppurtunity to take or refuse a job. I f it doesn't pay enough don't take ignorant lazy people take anything they are offered then squeal about how bad they have it and demand intervention. Emancipation for all was proclaimed over One Hundred Fifty years ago.
Guess what the employeer HAS the right to do what ever they want, they pay the bills . Socialist pig
jerdeb4evr 2 years ago
Then maybe you'd like to go back to working 12 hours a day with no health care and no vacation pay. Cuz that's what the socialist pigs won for you. If you believe your own words, relinquish your benefits and try to get them back on your own.
ElwynMaximus 2 years ago
I have never worked for a union and had health, vacation, retirement,and no crooked mafia bred union hierarchy to support. This moron in the video is talking lie and fantasy. America has the greatest wealth slope ever in the history of the world. Why should an employeer owe his employees anything more than the wage agreed upon. You want to participate in the wealth earn some money and start a business. This guy says we don't have to fight for unions in Detroit, cause Detroits broke. wise up dup
jerdeb4evr 2 years ago
Where do you think you got your benefits from? Read your history and find out who struggled for workers rights. They weren't created out of the goodness of wall street financiers.
ElwynMaximus 2 years ago
unions? This guy is a parasite.
Gov't backed unions, Excessive taxation & corporate regulations are what killed US manufacturing.
Stealing money that was once used for Research & Development giving us a 25 year technological lead over the rest of the world.
I swear to god this guy is either completey talking out of his ass becauase he profits from it, or he's an economic retard.
luckyvet 2 years ago
Stealing money? Is that your interpretation of what Unions do? Nevermind they've raised the standard of living for all American's, but as the unions are disappearing, our non-union jobs are suffering as a result. You're obviously on the side of Business. Why? What has Business done for you lately?
ElwynMaximus 2 years ago
My business is 4 retail stores & a small wholesale business established in 1989. I have employed many people throughout the years but had many problems expanding because of excessive taxation & regulations. This has hurt me, my possible employes I never ended up hiring, my suppliers, etc.
It is government that has destroyed Western business. (I sincerely mean this, and would be glad to PM you a brief reason why.)
luckyvet 2 years ago
The too big too fail theory is a nonsensical myth
jjrglobal 2 years ago
The too big to fail theory is a myth? What about too big to be allowed to fail?
Where were you last year when the bailout of the "too big to be allowed to fail" AIG & others sparked the biggest shift of public wealth into private hands (aka grand theft in broad daylight with millions of witnesses) in history?
Are you going to argue that the corporations who's incompetence, greed & excesses which threatened to kill them & take the whole economy down with them doesn't, in fact, prove my point?
FriedDaisy 2 years ago
Anyone that votes based on party lines instead of merit is a traitor as far as I'm concerned. That goes for legislation or candidates
jjrglobal 2 years ago
Why is America the only major industrial democracy without a labour party? We only have one party, the business party, split into two factions. I would love some answers.
BoStevoD 2 years ago 4
The labour party that is forming in america is communist. I hate to sound like conservative for saying that but they are declared communists. I actually am leaning toward Bernie Sanders politics. He is a democratic socialist
captcrais101 2 years ago
This is true, sadly. I personally find social democracy more suitable than a democratic socialist stance; however, I also consider democratic socialism far more preferable than much of the mainstream politics jammed down our throats these days in the USA.
BoStevoD 2 years ago
@BostevoD
yeah,Obama is really just so pro business its almost sickening,huh? Who do you people want to work for, the government ? Do you know any history at all? You might ought to check out what fascism and communism is and what it leads to before jumping on this bandwagon to hell.
jjrglobal 2 years ago
Sorry, I did not understand your comment.
BoStevoD 2 years ago
@BoStevoD No matter what management system instituted, corrupt integrity is prevelant in all. In spain, victim of fascism in the extreme, labor is instituted by ownership. Co-ops are the dominate labor force factor in spain. Still with workers ownership of shares. The muscle of management that goes against members wishes is unreformable and masterfully instituted. labor is corrup-table
msam1970 1 year ago
@BoStevoD It was not always like that, the media-o-poly have brainwashed americans for about 3 decades .. There ARE other candidates, Nader have been running for years but gets no coverage in the mainstream..
In a democracy information/transparency is hard-currency! How else would one make sound decisions?
5iF3R 1 year ago
Unions are bad for business very bad they are the union members are greedy they dont understand they are LUCKY TO HAVE A JOB fuck unions. they are bad for business. You work you get your pay check thats it no vacation pay no healthcare benefits none of that bullshit those cost hurt business workers be lucky you have a job.
iratetruth 2 years ago
No actually. Either a business can hold the power or the employee if the employee is a skilled laborer with specifically required qualifications. In the event that the business has too much power and tramples on the rights of employees unions are formed to protect workers. If employees have too much power they often sign contracts to tie themselves to a company. Both can be manipulated but are equally essential in equitable businesses. Get your head out of the ground.
Sardonac 2 years ago
Economic issues aside, there is NO justification for anti-union laws in a free, democratic society.
By restricting union activities, all they've done is allow the business elite to fix the price of labor.
And if a union contract DOES drive an employer into bankruptcy, then that's the union's fault, and by extension, the fault of the workers. Everyone loses. Even with fair labor laws, there is no escaping market forces.
psychoholicmike 2 years ago 7
HaHa! Force Both parties to an Agreement. Piece of shit.
Rle8752 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Here's a fun challenge:
Let's list the heavily unionized industries...
Auto Industry, Airline Industry, Public School System, ....
Now let's identify, what characteristic do each of these industries have in common...besides the fact that they are heavily unionized?
They are all in complete and utter ruin.
observer855 2 years ago
Congrats, you are supporting the rich elite who have bankrupted this country. Are you a rich elite yourself? Probably not. You're probably a plebe, who is so brainwashed, he probably doesn't even know what's good for him.
Sooner or later you will like unions, guaranteed. Either it's today, or it's when you are in the soup line with newspaper for shoes. Until you see their necessary role, you are misinformed.
Renegen1 2 years ago 2
Renegen1: you're right. As business unions (aka behemoth corporations) have worked relentlessly (and often fraudulently) to buy legislation which secures rights and limited liability for themselves (and, consequently, independent employers), so should workers have unions standing up-- like David to Goliath-- to behemoth corporations who will always place profits before the health and well being of individual workers.
FriedDaisy 2 years ago
It is necessary that business make profits. To say that they make money by exploiting their employees is not only disingenuous it's an out right lie. Profits are what enables business to remain in business and are the reward for producing something that consumers want. If you dont like you're job, quit and open your own business. Most successful employers treat their employees very well. Employees determine a businesses success, so we want the best we can afford. Thats how most business operate
jjrglobal 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
More propaganda posing as real news. Crap.
bbburton 2 years ago
So if I take the risk and start a business, work my ass off for years, and grow the business to 300 employees, this guy thinks that my employees shoud have more rights to make decisions about my business than I do? What logical person would agree with any unions at all? Unions are nothing more than thugs that use mafia tactics to get what they want, always at the detriment of the company.
jjrglobal 2 years ago
"More rights"? You're an idiot.
psychoholicmike 2 years ago
Are you Joe the Plumber? Have you bought that plumbing business yet?
1140Cecile 2 years ago
@1140Cecile
Nope, I'm Jim the oilman. I started my business in 2001 using my life savings and a hell of a lot of blood sweat and sacrifice. And you?
jjrglobal 2 years ago
I started my business in 1988 and, like you, used my life savings and also mortgaged my home. I didn't expend any blood but certainly sacrificed a lot of free time I otherwise would have had as an employee of another company. I actually don't have a union in my company but I pay them better than union wages plus better benefits. Yes, I took the initial risk but my guys have taken on my "dream" and have helped make it a reality. I get very well rewarded and so do they, as they deserve.
1140Cecile 2 years ago 3
That's exactly as it should be. You said it all when you said you pay higher than union wages and your employees have taken over your dream. Businesses don't need unions to do the right thing for employees and you and I are testament to that Businesses are in competition with one another for the best employees, so we pay more than our competitors to attract the best because we know that our employees make or break us and they're expensive to replace
. Sad that most people don't understand this.
jjrglobal 2 years ago 2
Well said, though I'd hope that by "most people" (who don't understand this) you mean businessmen as well.
Unfortunately, although one builds his own company from scratch, his successor might feel differently about the workers, not having the needed connection to the firm.
The question might then also be: does a new CEO or even a new owner have the right to freely dispose of people that based their lives on the business and maybe sacrificed for its sake too.
Polytical 2 years ago
There are douche bags in every facet of life, including business. If a new CEO were to come in and do something like the scenario you wrote, they would end up losing the best and brightest in the company and wouldn't be the CEO for long, and not because of unions, Just look at the once massive industries that unions have ruined in this country, steel auto. Unions track record sucks. Maybe at one time they had their place, but that time has long since passed.
jjrglobal 2 years ago
jjrglobal: it wasn't labor unions that "ruined" industry in this country, it was the corporate business model which mandates-- by law-- that executives do whatever it takes to increase profits for themselves & investors. Eventually, if the business venture is successful, there will be an unbalancing shift of wealth from the bottom where production & labor costs have stagnated to satisfy the demands for profit at the top, & as we saw last year, the business bubble will burst, catastrophically.
FriedDaisy 2 years ago
So it's just a coincidence that the non union auto plants in the south are doing much better than their northern counterparts in Detroit? The unnecessary business cycle is created through monetary policy and interest rate manipulation by the Federal Reserve and other central banks that follow that economic model. Since when did production and labor costs stagnate? Production and labor costs have skyrocketed for businesses.
jjrglobal 2 years ago
No, it isn't coincidence, it is because the non union plants don't have the costs of health care and legacy costs of retirees.
It is because the plants in the south pay less.
gmfutube 2 years ago
For the record, I dont agree with anyone buying politicians to sway legislation. We should pass a law against any public official accepting more than $100 from any individual. If caught, try them for treason, if found guilty, hang em. It is treason to put personal gain before the good of the country and nothing will change until we decide to address this problem
jjrglobal 2 years ago 2
jjrglobal, your wrote: "For the record, I dont agree with anyone buying politicians to sway legislation. . . and nothing will change until we decide to address this problem."
AMEN.
It's going to be important for average citizens to set aside feelings of "team" affiliation & loyalty so that all corrupt politicians are delete with appropriately. Things will get interesting when everyone begins to realize that it's us, the working class, against them, the power elite & their tools in government.
FriedDaisy 2 years ago
AGREED People need to realize that this left right paradigm is nothing but a tool used to divide us. It is amazing how most people have a negative sentiment towards all business. Thats what I don't get
jjrglobal 2 years ago
It's not business per say that's the problem. Small businesses (what's left of them) are the life blood of our communities. It's the behemoth multinational corporate conglomerates which gobble up small businesses & their worker force like hors d'oeuvres in order to squash competition & achieve controlling monopolies. The average citizen with a small business who still thinks the Corporate Party worries about them & their small business, & creates legislation accordingly, is deluding themselves.
FriedDaisy 2 years ago
Business is business whether small or large. Every small business owner would like to expand and eventually become a bigger business. Where do you draw the line on business expansion? When is a business too big?I agree that some big business don't do whats right, but sometimes neither do small businesses. I just dont see how anyone can draw a line between the two. Business can only grow if the consumers make it grow
jjrglobal 2 years ago
A business is too big when it's grown so large that it becomes a Corporate State given its own seat at the U.N.; and a business is too big when its business interests are allowed to supersede the health and well being of the general population; and a business is too big if its wealth and power so exceeds that of its host country that it begins to threatens sovereignty & national security; and a business is too big when it's demise and fall would pull down the entire economy.
FriedDaisy 2 years ago
And who determines if a business has met these undefined parameters?
jjrglobal 2 years ago
I don't know, jjrglobal. All I know is behemoth corporations are becoming-- in terms of wealth & power-- greater than most sovereign nations; and they're being allowed to influence legislation in ways that are great for the corporate agenda & those that is serves, but harmful to the rest of us.
I believe the fascism that most fear is taking over our lives isn't coming from a legitimate government but from the United Corporate States which stands behind the government pulling the puppet strings.
FriedDaisy 2 years ago
None of this power that has been achieved by these massive corporations could have happened without the help of the government. Government is the problem not the answer.
jjrglobal 2 years ago
jjrglobal, your wrote "Government is the problem not the answer."
The government has been infiltrated by an army of corporate tools, passing themselves off as the people's representatives, whose mission it is to manipulate laws which slowly but surely chip away at the protections of the Constitution & Bill of Rights so that, eventually, we'll no longer have a representative republic but a fascist corporate state. If they're successful we'll be employees with only a "right to work," nothing more
FriedDaisy 2 years ago
I agree with you. We need to hold those in government that are doing this accountable. But do you think that will ever happen?If so how?
jjrglobal 2 years ago
i replied but my reply didn't post.
FriedDaisy 2 years ago
The Constitution & Bill of Rights are not dead, yet. They may be in intensive care in critical condition, but they're not dead.
The solution will come when citizens actually stand up for their rights by demanding that the rule of law which protects their rights be upheld.
We need to be impeaching, recalling, & voting out congressmen who consistently author bills, co-sign the bills of others, and vote in laws which favor the corporate agenda over the health & well being of the rest of us.
FriedDaisy 2 years ago
Well, the scenario i describe is quite a common sight these days and the CEOs do not get usually fired: what do you think is the transfer of labor to the third world? Skilled workers in the west are being replaced by cheap labor in China and India.
The west can't keep its living standard if it's shoveling money away and the market logic leads to levelling of standards around the world. Maybe that's good in the long term, but countries like the US have few intruments to ease the impact now.
Polytical 2 years ago
Oh, I forgot about the unions. They are one of the few powers that can actually slow down the process and, if widespread, they can effect policies to alleviate the social impact: the unions were possibly the main reason of social policies (healthcare, unemployment benefits etc) in the West.
Polytical 2 years ago
hehe, even my pro-union friends laugh about the "Card Check" provision. It basically allows union leaders/members to go around and potentially bully people into voting for the union. There are reasons we have secret ballots in the country.
Organized crime and Unions....both rely on force and people are surprised that the two always seem to co-mingle.
observer855 2 years ago
I don't think you have friends. Enjoy your paranoia and seclusion.
egolayer13 2 years ago
Ego, I appreciate that it is easier (and maybe more fun?) to send baseless flames, but really isn't a good use of your time.
observer855 2 years ago
THE EMPLOYEE FREE CHOICE ACT ALLOWS BOTH CARD CHECK AND SECRET BALLOT YOU STUPID FUCKING GORILLA, YOU FUCKING BRAINWASHED RETARDED SIMPLETON. IT ALLOWS BOTH. IT ALLOWS BOTH. enjoy being poor you stupid fuck, this country doesn't deserve prosperity with so many stupid fuckwits.
Renegen1 2 years ago 2
Best comment I've seen in a while!
KruZer7 2 years ago
Renegen,
I appreciate that this is an emotional issue. The EFC in theory allows for both, in practice the "choice" as to whether or not to allow a secret ballot, is not made in secret. The same reasons to have secret ballots apply to having a secret ballot regarding the choice of ballot methodologies.
I understand that the legislation can be confusing.
You rushed to judge this legislation just as you rushed to judge me. Legal clauses do not lend themselves to hasty judgement.
observer855 2 years ago