The Creation: Science v Religion; Documentary (3 of 4)

[DrMontague]

I have.It's a good analysis of abiogenesis .

[creativeprojects720]

I don't think I believe in the big bang. The universe was already there. There may have been many small bangs adding matter, but the universe was already there. You don't get something form nothing. I think stars and galaxies are always being formed, and others always are being destroyed.

[creativeprojects720]

a lot of scientists are christians, and are deeply religious. They just want to know the "secrets of god"

[DrMontague]

@creativeprojects720 I will let you into a secret about god, he's an evil and sadistic twat!

[creativeprojects720]

@DrMontague how is that?

[DrMontague]

@creativeprojects720 I take it your talking about how god is evil. Well according to the OT he drowned babies and children in his flood, he wanted to see them scream and begging for their lives. Many other must have starved to death as they would have been on their own small boats weeks. Now a god who wants to watch life suffer can only be evil. A loving and forgiving god would not have exterminated his creation in such a barbaric way.

[creativeprojects720]

@DrMontague ok..... so I take it you are anti-god?

[DrMontague]

@creativeprojects720 I don't believe in the gods!

[Pin8yelchavodel8]

Well, as you said, we can only go as far as the Big Bang. Everything else is mere speculation. God is love. Take everything that is good in life and put it altogether in one person. That's God.

[DrMontague]

@Pin8yelchavodel8 But let us a simple but logical question. Why would an intelligent designer design us to have to shit out filthy stinking turds? If there is no god then the question disappears i.e. it just the way things are, it's the laws of physics. But if a god gave the laws of physics why would he make them so we have to shit? Therefore god created shit.

[Pin8yelchavodel8]

This is bullshit. The First Law of Thermodinamics asserts that energy cannot be created. Hence, physics can’t explain the creation of the universe (remember that matter is nothing but another form of energy). The Second Law of Thermodynamics asserts that the total amount of entropy in the universe cannot be decreased. Thence, how did the Big Bang take place from a state of minimal entropy (the primitive atom)? What decreased the entropy of the universe before the existence of the primitive atom?

[DrMontague]

@Pin8yelchavodel8 The first law states that energy can be transformed, i.e. changed from one form to another, but cannot be created nor destroyed. This is only true when we experience energy within the the universe we know and in our everyday lives. This would be called classical physics. How the universe came into being we can only go far back as the big bang. However if you are insinuating a god then where did god come from? What's more please explain why he is evil and stupid?

[Allovertheplace84]

Superman mixed with Stephen king in this vid lol

[AegeanKing]

This isn't a documentary, its propaganda.

[DrMontague]

@AegeanKing Propaganda: information, ideas, or rumors deliberately spread widely to help or harm a person, group, movement, institution, nation, etc. (online dictionary) No you are wrong it is not propaganda as it gives both view points. It is not one sided.

[mystisme]

no conflict between science and religion ???come one stop lying to your self you know there is,theire is a conflict between intellectual and our emotion,science is to our intellect and realistic and our emontion is to our spirituality.Our intellect capacity is faster than our psycholgical devellopement is, and the guilty one whose breaking itis the graps of religion on our psycological state

[userwl2850]

the scientists in this series are ace. the vicar is just another idiot, how old is this series? are these guys still around?

[DrMontague]

@userwl2850 Yep they are still around. The Creation:Documentary: by Everyman 1985

John Polkinghorne (The Priest born October 16, 1930)

Peter William Atkins (The militant atheist born August 10, 1940)

Paul Davies ( theoretical physicist, cosmologist, astrobiologist, born in London in 1946)

[MadeinTaiwan100]

this kind of propanda is the reason religion should be looked at with suspicion, only a lie we will generate a documentary like this, This is so pathetic an effort to mislead, virgin Mary,son of God, all that crap is comming next.

[Embikay]

2. ...compassion, etc. Religion is NOT an intellectual formulation. However, the concept of God has been misused by denominated religions by fictions, or otherwise facts too vandalised successively by propagandists with vested interests. It has done more harm than good. Religion has to be discouraged in favour of spirituality which directly extracts love, kindness, nobility and so forth.

[Embikay]

Science fills the intellectual curiosity of man to know what appears like a mystery about the universe including himself and fellow beings and organic life, plus the cosmos. Religion satisfies the emotional needs love, kindness,

[DrMontague]

Bollocks. You don't have to be religious to understand love and kindness. Secular humanists feel love and compassion. Organized religion would dearly love to control the education system and fully indoctrinate children in to their supernatural belief system. Ask any faith based school if they are prepared to let atheist teachers give their view point on religion! If they will not allow this then they are indoctrinators not educators.

[adamlinks]

and... ART !!!

[greebo68]

Science flies you to the moon.

Religion flies you into buildings.

[creativeprojects720]

@greebo68 well, you can also say that science builds you atomic bombs, while religion builds you a nice little house to live in.

[DrMontague]

@creativeprojects720 You implying that there have been no religious wars where theists haven't torched each others houses?! Have you seen the film Gandhi? How Nuclear power is used depends whose hands the technology is in.Nuclear power can give us power stations, treat cancer, or give us bombs.

[creativeprojects720]

@DrMontague yeah I know, it all depends on your ideology. And religious fanatics will do almost anything even kill people over their religion.

[Mudbikerz]

youtube(dot)com/watch?v=3SUwMb­yNQz8

[polopain]

ok - not going to make any friends here, but I'll say it anyway. i was an atheist for a large part of my life but, through thinking scientifically, I realised there must be, for want of better words, a god or trigger. Now - before you atheists start frowning and you religious types start patting me on the back (I told you this wouldn't make me popular) consider this hypothesis...

[polopain]

this trigger or god if you like , caused the start of the universe. To this day, scientists only guess about it- they admit (even Mr. Hawkin.) that their own laws break down close to the big bang. So say there was a trigger. But - be open-minded, he/she/it couldn't care less about us. No Christianity/Islam etc. This Trigger/god will forever be outside of our comprehension in my opinion. No attempt to explain this existence will succeed. If there is a god then that's exactly what it should be.

[DrMontague]

But hang on none of the religious text talk about the big bang. They talk about the universe as if it is made by hand, a bit like a potter at his wheel i.e god created this and then god created that. The people who wrote the texts obviously created god/s in their own image. As Atkins points out in this vid, you have a psychological yearning for wanting to believe in a god.

[polopain]

Yes - I agree. All I'm saying is that if there is a need for some kind of creator then why does it have to be anything like the compassionate gods of our conventional religions. Why can't it be something that's ignorant or indifferent to our existence. In short, if there has to be a creator, why does it have to even care about its creation? To presume it does, like you've said above, is to place human values on something thats nature can never be truly known - if it does exist at all.

[Somatostatin]

BullShit with a capital B. there is no need for a creator. the world is a large machinery. but primitive people don't understand this. now i no what you said but think about it for some 5 more min. we're still ignorant as to [why] how it a;; happened. we DONT NO! and it makes sense too. just look back to what we've done in terms of explaining the age of the universe. see how Galileo did... then after Newton who came up with his simple laws of physics then we get to quantum physics

[Somatostatin]

then the theory of expansion or the inflation theory. science goes along as it corrects itself. this is a process that religion or god can't do. they never correct themselves, they have dogmas and shit and some of them wanna talk scientifically about it.. it's not going to happen pal cause god is imaginary and man made.

[balumuthu]

From what one makes out of (one of) the greatest living legends of science STEPHEN HAWKING'S views,the atheist,or non-believer of a universal consciousness responding to human prayers with discipline[not necessarily a personified God]plays a -ve and restrictive role in the pursuit of happiness for man: everything can NOT be explained by mere counting and measuring and rational interpretation.Emotions/feelin­gs like fellowship,kindness,love,...ca­n NEVER BE FULLY'decoded' or interpreted by science.

[DrMontague]

Subjective opinions are indeed difficult prove. However science has given us unmistakable clues to our place in the universe e.g. the earth and planets orbit the sun. The universe is expanding and accelerating. The ancient texts got the creation wrong, there is no mention of a big bang. Therefore the whole notion of god/s must simply be the figment of the human imagination. However does appear that many people have a psychological yearning to need god/s because they fear death and non being.

[SuperKingdarius]

@DrMontague You are an idiot. Sorry to say that. I beg your pardon. But the this is a ture fact. Please forget the Bible and know the true history of the worlds religion. Just knocking on someones dooor doesnt mean that you are welcome. I hope you will get this clear once and for all.

Seek for the truth within your own self first and get your doubts clear. You should study the base of all religions first and i.e. Zoroastrinism. The only prophet who whose all theories are proved so far.

[DrMontague]

@SuperKingdarius  I'm a militant atheist. Zoroastrianism is just another pile of crock!

[SuperKingdarius]

@DrMontague No matter who you are its none of my concern. Since you have init this tone then I must tell you who am I. I am not just what you think, no matter what you think or not - I simply dont care. Becase I believe that there are many races and people in this world who are differnt in there beliefs and in there cultures. What I know is that its always the first impression that tells you every thing about someone. My wife is an Athest but she 100% agrees to zoroastrian True knowledge. ???

[DrMontague]

@SuperKingdarius Is there something wrong with you?! Your wife cannot be an atheist and at the same time be zoroastrian. Because Zoroastrianism: There is one universal and transcendental God, Ahura Mazda, the one uncreated Creator to whom all worship is ultimately directed

[SuperKingdarius]

@DrMontague - I think you didnt understand my friend. There are many vegetarians in the world but that doesnt mean that they dont like to eat meat or fish or chicken etc. To be on the same lines - There are also many atheists, or disbelievers in the world who can also accept these true realities and true facts of life.

If you cant see or feel or touch your brains that doesnt mean that the brain doesnt exist. Same goes for the Almighty. The only time you can see is when you find the right way.

[DrMontague]

@SuperKingdarius We have proof that brains exists. We have X-rays and other imaging techniques that show us brains actually working. Anatomy also shows human brains. There is no proof for the gods. Why not claim an invisible bunny rabbit created the universe?! Just because you cannot detect this invisible bunny rabbit with the 5 senses doesn't mean it doesn't exist!

[SuperKingdarius]

@DrMontague You are right. Why do you keep on forgetting that analyzing God is exactly the same way you analyze the Brain (X-rays or by whatever methord) or any thing else in the world.

My friend to analyze any thing you first need to find means and tools. Which so far science has been able to find a technique to proove that the brain exist.

But my freiend there is also a way to prove that God exists but its certainly not as simple as you think thats why science has become mad so far.

[DrMontague]

@SuperKingdarius you are a crank! bye

[SuperKingdarius]

@DrMontague To make sure like how you want (Proof for every thing). Let me ask you today. You Love your wife of your Parents or any one else in this world - Can you prove it mathematically or even close to analatically. NO the answer is No. Science talks about many things but cant even understand a single thought. lol.

God is not a science which you scientists can prove any day you better be sure about it, else he wouldnt be called as God Almighty.

[SuperKingdarius]

@DrMontague

Please combine the below link together and watch. Understand the link else it doest allow me to put here.

Dont forget to remove the spaces b/w the characters. w w w . v i d o o s h . t v "back slash comes here" p l a y . p h p "question mark comes here" v i d = 4 4 8 9

[SuperKingdarius]

@DrMontague I am not allowed to write more then 250 words so am limited.

But if you feel that you and your science is every thing then I dont have that energy and Mind to put in vain.

As I said - To see the future you should first see your past. And the past is every one knows for sure if based on knowledge and justice.

I feel proud of my ancestors True knowledge and Culture as a Persian. And Truth will one day overcome darkness, lie and disbelif. Long live Righteousness and theTruth.

[gadget133]

Yes, it can be rationalised.

[ofssk]

I agree until questions Ex Nihilo ? conciousness ? self awereness ? fine tuning ? Emotions such as love can be explained I'll remain equitable to any belief or non belief system

[1n354a]

The problem, that I see it, is that there is no proof for this hypothesis. There is no way to test it or evaluate it...so you can not consider it a scientific approach. You are more than welcome to have a faith-based belief system in which some magical creator exists as the father of all - billions of people around the world have these kinds of beliefs. No matter how strong the belief is, this does not equate to fact or reality. It is a religious belief...and only that.

[humanist7117]

When the discussion of science versus a careator occurs, ther is always a concentration on the physical whereas if there is a creator that creator has to create the abstract also. He, she ,it has to create

love and also hate, morality and sinfulness, war and peace, altruism and selfishness, compassion and murder. (You make your own pairings.)Anyone could create a better world!

[DrMontague]

There is no creator. God/s or supernatural being are a figment of the human imagination. We are a product of a evolutionary universe brought about by natural causes. If there is a problem with human behaviour there has been a tendency to attribute it to a supernatural cause. Light v Dark, Goodness v Evil, God v devil etc. This is where the notion of a scapegoat comes about. All sins etc are put in to the animal and it is then sacrificed.

[humanist7117]

Exactly! But you miss the point of my statement.

[konachai1]

How many animals were on Noah's arc anyway? Can someone answer this question?

[RobDeManc]

I heard that there was 1403,167,344. But then I read that there were only about 7,000,000. People will argue over that one until the next flood happens and we have to fill the arc again. If you find out will you let me know too? I have sleepless nights.

[konachai1]

Actually i heard there was 1403,167,345. So if you find out let me know, as i haven't slept good since birth.

[RobDeManc]

Really what was this extra animal??? It could be a whole new species. I wonder if David Attenborough knows?

[konachai1]

It is the spiney pigeon toed walrus, but I think noah ate it so that's why they are extinct, hahahahahhaha!!!!

[19995700]

Thats a fucking big boat! And considering no boat could possibly be built that big without steel and float (in the bronze age) - I'd say Noah was fucked!

Apart from the fact that there is no geological evidence whatsover for a global flood OR that there are uninterrupted recorded histories of ancient people of the time (who didn't drown) - Noah seems like another biblical fairytale.

[DrMontague]

What amazes me that nobody tried to get on the Ark when they realized they were all going to drown. I would have knifed Noah and his sons and would taken the Ark off him. The must have all stood around with a British upper lip and said 'Well it is his Ark, he built it, he warned us, now let us repect his right to private property!'

[19995700]

AHAHAHAHA!!! Yep. It was them sinners who died proudly who started chivalry. AHAHA! I'm with you - if gods gonna drown me the fuck you Noah! I know what your gonna do to them sheep! Your 950 years old anyway (Genesis 5:27) how much longer you got?

Amen

[DrMontague]

innocentman1. Cite your source as it is not talked about in this video.

[jouc12]

Mad science, this is soooo funny if this guys are telling the truth then you can compress the entire universe to something smaller than a cell. This video proves just how desperate atheist people are that they believe this bull.

[DrMontague]

jouc12. You haven't grasped the argument because you are acreationist retard. Now fuck off and die.

[DanDavM]

Lol exactly... they are so desperate to validate something that has no solid proof or evidence of ever happeing... atheists just dont want to believe the truth... they'd rather believe a lie SOMEONE made up. Darwin extrapulated his data, he assumed animals "evolved." And thus assumed we do too... lol so weird. I'd rather be created by God who is INTELLIGENT, then evolve from a stupid ape!

[av1611truth]

The code for each protein is contained IN the DNA/RNA system. However, proteins are REQUIRED in order to manufacture DNA. So which came first: proteins or DNA?

[DrMontague]

Ask an expert in evolution theory, I'm a layman but have a reasonable grasp of evolutionary theory. Try putting the question on Dawkins official website or similar.

[memoryofakiss]

the proteins likely came from tholins. which likely came from various gasses being exposed to energy , either heat light or lightning.

[Erech01]

that ould be abiogenesis, not evolution, however the first protien atom woul be within amino acid

[Silent33091]

@av1611truth

I recommend  you this

watch?v=t2Wk9pfAyC4

[DrMontague]

@Silent33091 Dumb assed creationist wants to read the label on his soup where he will find that the soup contain preservatives (artificial or natural) in order to stop microorganism being able to live.

[Silent33091]

@DrMontague

watch it till the end :D

[SefSufi]

plz google: Scientific miracles of the Quran, 1300 year old verses explaining with extreme detail: the Big Bang, human evolution, Astronomy n planetary orbits, as well as revealing superhuman mathematical codes. Also check : Mathematical miracles of the Quran!

[DrMontague]

SefSufi. private message me the address please.

[Erech01]

is this geuine?? please link:) this sounds actually interesting that modern science theories are in a religios text

[av1611truth]

By denying the Bible you are Fulfilling the Bible, "Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts" 2nd Peter 3:3

[DrMontague]

Anyone can come out with quotes. It does not mean they are true. These were written by men who didn't have the benefit of advanced science. The bible is wrong all religious ancient texts about the creation are wrong. Science has shown beyond doubt the the creation as described by the bible does not correspond in any way to scientific discovery. Where does it say in the bible that there was a huge explosion?

[memoryofakiss]

or perhaps this line was placed in the bible because the people writing it understood that a lot of it was pretty far fetched to say the least.

its like writing down "you wont believe me" before lying to someone then showing it to them after the lie and trying to use it to suggest that you are credible.

[DanDavM]

Exactly! There is plenty of proof that God exists! There are no such things as atheists in foxholes!

[DrMontague]

DanDavM . You are thick and haven't understood the arguments in this excellent video.

[humanist7117]

I am an atheist and I have been in worse places that foxholes. It didn't change me one bit.

The no atheists in foxwholes bit is an urban myth!

[rossler123]

As Stephen Hawkins once said in an interview on Richard and Jude in the United Kingdom in reply to the question "What happened before the big bang", he compared it to asking "What lies North of the North Pole" stating that the question is meaningless.

[dennisneo]

Atkins is really a bigot.

[DrMontague]

Made in the UK by Everyman. See End credits on the video (4 of 4)

[Chaffinch4]

Interesting.  When was this film made? By whom?

[Tomar17]

as glorius as the laws of physics are... where did they come from? It is the athiest's religion that they are just there, while a religious person says God created them, this is a dispute the scientific method cannot solve, but the simple magnificence of the universe cannot have been "jut there"

[DrMontague]

If you want to debate this in more depth I recommend visting the Richard Dawkins official website. There is a limit of 500 character that can be typed in these comment boxes. So it's not useful for a full debate.I go by the name of Luke Sanderson on the Dawkins website

[LothairLorraine]

Dawkins is the Prophet of Atheism. Its a religion.

[DrMontague]

According to dictionary dot com. 'Religion. a set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe, esp. when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies, usually involving devotional and ritual observances, and often containing a moral code governing the conduct of human affairs. You're blocked you creationist cretin.

[Lockmanship]

Science and Religion and Syncretism

Science- systematic knowledge of the physical or material world gained through observation and experimentation.

Religion- the practice of religious beliefs; ritual observance of faith.

Syncretism- the merging of two or more originally different inflectional forms.

[podimala]

Why does the laws of physics have to 'come from somewhere'?.If everything has to come from somewhere,the old 'first cause argument' then where did God come from??

[Tomar17]

God, by definition, is infinite, therefore he cannot be comprehended by our mere minds. But if there is no God, and everything should be explained by pure logic, the first cause becomes something that, by definition, we cannot answer.

[doomaflatchie]

No, it's just something we can't answer yet.

[DrMontague]

All ancient texts on the creation do not correspond with science's investigated cause of the creation. For example Genesis does not mention 'the bang' therefore we must conclude the bible is wrong and therefore the figment of human imagination.

[thsmdrnlv]

intellectual excrement! that's brilliant.