David Miliband answers a question on education at the Davos Debates

[josiahBLOGS]

There's unjustified hype generated about those charming Milibands without there being a shred of evidence either politicking sibling is appropriate as Labour leader. Have you noticed how the right wing media is inveigling us all toward the bruvs with patronising blurb? Because, right wingers would hate that strong independent characters with potent socialist fight in their guts of the ilk of bullish Ed Balls or huntress Diane Abbott were voted instead over them ikky 'gemini Milibands'.

[TheDustpile]

NEW LABOUR SOCIALISM:

How can it possibly be Tolerant or Inclusive for the police to marshal good anarchist riotors, or for Britain to be so demographically racist?

For some good Leftist insights, click my username and view UNITE AGAINST [PUBLIC] FASCISM! (THE BNP IS JUST THE TIP OF THE WHITE RACIST ICEBERG!)

[pwnoftheages]

I like this answer, but could he have any less of a personality?

[jimholbein]

you talk of racism etc when the realy important issue has been ignored. sovereignty has been abolished and britain with it when the queen signed it away in Jan 2009. This clown is pulling the wool over all our eyes. when you all going to wake up.

[pondman27]

Look at the prospectus of your local infant school. Throughout the UK, the sovereignty of parents is being removed & the state has begun to harvest children within the darkness of secretive family courts. A system that regards each child as a resource, the posession of the state, just as the state, has become the posession of the central & global banking cartels.

The slavery & dog eat dog (aka human eat human) world of busy-ness has enabled fictional entities called corporations to enslave.

[bladesharks]

why does this guy remind me of the g-man of half-life for?

[TopGearrules]

David Miliband would make a brilliant PM!

[gimli2511]

cidseven, it sounds like you are talking about eugenics. If that's the case, on what evidence are you basing your statement that societies that have embraced have prospered?

[Crapulency]

In about twenty years time, he may just have become sufficiently mature to properly evaluate the mantra he has learned so well to regurgitate.

[RepublicOfVietnam]

Transport me back to 1900 when I could of been at least proud and patriotic of this countrys achievements in world affairs.

[TheSmiterer]

This man is as creepy is hell. Its just a shame that he'll be british prime minister in 8-10 years.

[dannybergson]

what a typical waffle

no real content

[NOBBYSNUTS6]

David Miliband Gordon Browns rent little rend boy

[telemetry9]

Once you get education in the UK sorted then maybe you can start helping other countries.

Oh you can't - because you're not really interested in actual problem solving simply in bolstering yourself and your own career. Like every other westminster user.

[leap2jump]

wot a load of waffle

[mogenim]

David Miliband is pretty attractive

[DrunkAtheist]

Do you never go back and read your comments and realise how silly you sound?

[adrianallan]

How about educating people that we're only in afghanistan for oil and to support the state-sponsored flow of opium that props up wall street ?

If we educate more people in these matters we may de-select slimy politicians like this man and bring some form of working democracy to the UK.

For that reason he prefers mass ignorance over education any day.

[TheMrbollox]

wow, alot of nutjob comments on youtube

[saperlol]

This guy gives me the creeps

He's an incurable liar. His PC soundbites are all about raising his profile for eventual leadership of the party.

[danJS90]

when are british MP's going to stop taking such an interest in other people's countries and start taking more in ours fix ours before you fix theirs!

[britbabe1]

this man is out for himself. I'd never trust him as leader of the Labour Party. or any political movement.

[RifledBarrel]

PS

to the o/p............get yourself a life on approuval - you loser

[Onsotobi]

GMAN!

[davemiller24]

This guy is so monotonous. Unfortunately he's the only decent replacement for Gordon "Ego the size of a planet" Brown

[CRMHFC]

What's Tim Henman doing?

[dufflepod]

What an uninspiring plum

[darkendank]

Milliband says that education will help prevent terrorism then says it is particularly important to target it at girls who are not usually the terrorists. He talks of Pakistan making good progress but I saw a programme saying girls alreadyt get better educated than boys in Pakistan because boys are set to work from young. He wants to sound pro female because it wins votes, not because the policies make sense. Fair policy would care about both sexes equally.

[welshmuzhik]

if this guy becomes PM i'm leaving the UK

[supersonicprices]

lol he looks like phoenix wright

[paddy6062]

Waffle waffle waffle!!! labour at its bullshiting best

Finds more ways to take our money than any other government gives it away to other overseas then while we are on our knees still takes our money and gives it away..sooner this shower are kicked out the better for us all

[UmmahTube]

9/11 + 7/7 + madrid bombing and anyother flas flag ops are just black ops used to instill fear within the masses and control them and justify war crimes and the removal of civil libertys. Overall israel feels more and more secure with americans invading more arab countrys. Have fun dying for israelis.

[JusticeSeeker1000]

My vote will go to the party who puts a stop to the mass immigration levels to the UK, it needs to be cut massively, why do we let in so many useless, sponging, violent, lazy morons from Africa and Asia?

I'll vote for the party who puts the boot up the yobs in this country, the lazy, welfare reliant dossers, who have 5 kids, who are just as thick, lazy and ignorant. It's time we make these people work for their money.

Lastly, I want the laws to favour the victims and not the criminals.

[NoriokoTheMagicSkunk]

Ooh look its Hillarys boyfriend.

[Reqrezentin]

9/11 was an INSIDE JOB!

[PlavOciZena]

He looks like he just swallowed some pills

[penutbutterjellymw]

He seems so adorably awkward :D

[chickensandwhich252]

I find David Miliband quite unsettling.

[lumberjackconnor]

Cidseven, I don't beleive anyone asked for your obviously right winged opinions. Go vote BNP, or even worse conservative...

[pigsbishop99]

Some people have been writing a load of rubbish here. They are biased because it is Miliband and the 2.5 stars is absurd.

What I see is a five star video showing Miliband talking complete sense for once. Education is the key.

[azazel637]

politicians retain reptilian genes making them cold blooded and prone to infanticide. I would love to try to balance on this mans head whilst seeing how many potatoes i could carry until his head popped.

[capricious71]

I wonder if he finished painting that ceiling. :)

[spankthereasoner]

The comments which I mostly don't agree with are the ones which are closed argument.

Seems like some aren't being constructive, adding to the debate with points on communism and 9/11 inside jobs. The thought read a book comes into mind, before you spread your misinformed rubbish.

[G4wdL1k3]

David Miliband is untrustworthy in my opinion. Just look at him. And he has a name of a lizard.. Boris Johnstone FTW!

[poldhuahoy]

David Milliband does not seem to understand that the Afghani people just don't want us there....all we and the Americans have brought is instability to the whole region and no security. Let these people sort their own priorities out....it is simply non of our business. Most of the 9/11 terrorists were Saudis.

[liamuk08]

David Miliband couldn't care less about anyone else, he is just another spineles Labour Party member trying to climb the ladder.

[2QBUFF]

Stealing from peter to pay paul seems to be the way forward always has been always will be ..but at least a few people are waking up to this absolute BS ...ITs not even left or right wing anymore its just a shambles

[unlimitedpower7]

david miliband= new world order agent

[gisanotherpint]

We need another pearl harbour, who sai that prior to 9/11?

[shklm0]

I need a shower now after listening to that

[msh1582]

He speaks like Mr.Bean

[JonThm]

This gur failed all his science O levels

[hodgiee]

i've never been so bored!!!!!

[nothernlassie]

New World Order, One world Government Scum.

They want to destroy all countries and bring them under the control of a one world government.

This is why all western countries have mass immigration. The immigrant are being used by big business, banking and oligarchical families to break down the nation state.

[bkscdw]

i think you can be godless and a good person... you dont have to be nice to someone just because of the threat of hell and the promise of heaven.. you can have empathy for them?

[PrettyRecords]

You and your party are bad history getting worse. England's downfall has always been the Labour party, and current times of what you have led as into are just an example of your shameful behaviour.

You disgust me, and I find your "politics" offensive. Even Blair saw an avalanche coming, and was too cowardly to see the job through, all your party members make me sick! INCLUDING YOU!

[csykes23]

Why is he only talking about Pakistan??

[gotz777]

maybe you should spend more time making your own country better. wasting time and money sticking your beak into other countries affairs

[REDCAER]

Inspiring- every word sets me trembling with anticipation!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!­!!!!!!!!;D

Would you like to see my collection of used bus tickets?

[TheSpiaire]

I remember when he was mouthing off to Putin, I'd like to see them both settle it in a back alley and see who is still mouthing off lol.

[broonpie]

9/11 was a inside job

[pondman27]

@broonpie

ORCHESTRATED BY THOSE THAT MAKE TOO MUCH NOIZ

[BritishHeroGuy]

I like David Miliband :)

[Frankyre1972]

actions speak louder than words ,sadly all goverments all over the world ,promise, but dont deliver, world leaders are in it for the wealth only,and preserve there lifestyles through wars,down to earth people suffer , .life is short ,look for God .

[kingb18]

He's starting to sound like William Hauge

[cidseven]

Continued.

Picture this...

You voice a valid criticism of humanistic philosophy and social determinism and you dare to use genetic evidence to suggest that some personality disorders are genetic, and will manifest regardless of parenting. You also prove that some families have more of some than others.

The government destroys your lab and arrests you on the grounds of being a hate criminal.

You have no place of your own to practice your beliefs legally.

Does that sound nice?

[matthew220891]

That's never going to happen. There are plenty of people out to try and prove it! They are wrong and pretty much every scientist agrees they are wrong, but they aren't arrested, their results aren't destroyed! We live in a democracy. And anyway a hate crime requires you to act upon your beliefs to the deprivation of another, exercising your freedom of speech isn't a hate crime. Anyway, how can you on the one hand defend their unthreatened rights whilst attacking those of ethnic minorities?

[cidseven]

That's never going to happen? It has happened. Infact, it happened in the soviet union. Genetic researched was banned by Trofim Lysenko because it conflicted with Communist theory.

Science has proven that mental disorders are biological, often genetic and often run in families.

Human behaviour is primarily rooted in biology, there is no scientific evidence to prove social determinism.

Societies that embrace this fact have historically prospered.

[luckylass456]

this is the nature/nurture debate sociologists are arguing over

yes human behaviour is learned from our families and care givers bu there is also outside influences human behaviour is larned from a variety of factors and people behave in different ways depending who they are company to for example I wll not swear in front of my parents but have been known to cuss like a sailor wen wih frends

[cidseven]

Nationalist parties would only be a "threat" in the eyes of internationalists because they would be openly demanding independence for their nations.

That is they would be demanding the right to live by their lives the way they want to and answering to no one bar themselves.

Conflict is more likely to occur if you force people into close proximity, not giving them breathing space than by allowing them to just do their own thing.

Maintaining peace can often be more brutal than war.

[Sparkanoid1]

Most right wingers in the UK have barely seen a hard day in their lives, that is why the have the moronic, heartless views that they have

[WinstonSmith46]

Wrong

[chocolatebicycle]

I'v heard Miliband is a Gimp

[Sparkanoid1]

cidseven is one of those right wing pricks who are obsessed with communism.

Give me a communist over a right wing conservtive any day of the week. It doesn't matter which country you are from.

Republians/right wing represent everything wrong wth humanity

[WinstonSmith46]

The only thing communism has managed to achieve is make everyone poorer if they weren't murdered first.

[chrisjoneschrisjones]

another slimeball that cant speak staight and just say what he thinks

[cidseven]

"International Development". Don't you think you're aiming your sights a little high there when the UK is experiencing social decline and rampant crime under a Labour government?

If you can't solve your own countries problms, why act like you have a valid day on "international development" strategies?

Just another brainless crypo-communist.

[matthew220891]

Don't you think "communist" is a strong word. There's nothing wrong with socialism it's just that Labour has done two things:

They've taken it too fair; and

They've done it all wrong, giving money and support to people who don't need it.

Socialism done right could be good, but Labour got it wrong.

[awesomewelles90]

lol Labour aren't socialist! They used to be but now there is no real difference between them and the conservatives!

[cidseven]

@matthew220891

No, I don't think "communist" is a strong word to describe him considering the fact that, he, like his father and the party he belongs to are Marxists.

Remove Marxist philosophy from new labour and you have a totally different party.

The reason these people are pro-multiculturalim, pro-immigration and focussed on the "global" community, rather than the british community is because of their marxist anti-nation state attitude.

"socialism" is ambigious.

[cymraeg81]

Out of interest. How exactly are Labour Marxist? What are their marxist policies? As they have now been in power since '97, do we now live in a marxist state? Please explain, thats all a bit baffling.

[cidseven]

If you are baffled it is likely because you do not have much of an understanding of the marx, the history of marxism and european history.(for example you think there is such as thing as a 'marxist state', and you don't seem to be aware of self admitted trotskyists in the party nor of Neil Kinnock)

I advise you to go marxists . net and look up the book 'cultural marxism in post-war britain'. That should give you a rough understanding of the issue.

Cont-

[cidseven]

If you investigate this, you will find that the labour parties philosophy is clearly rooted in Marxist thought in their historical view, their support for social deterministic dialetical materialism, their opposition to nationalism, their adherence to the view of historical class conflict and their internationalist moral consciousness.

Labour promote class collaboration as a means to achieve equality, whereas traditionally marxists support the violent revolutionary struggle of the proletariat

[matthew220891]

I agree socialism is ambigious, as is communism and marxism. Also, globalisation is a very capitalist trait which we cannot hold off. We must be part of the global community or perish. They are centre-left anyway, they haven't nationalised all property, abolished the classes, etc. Indeed they have actively encouraged capitalist growth to the extent where it has destroyed the economy. Not very communist traits. We still have a free market too, would communists have allowed that? I think not.

[cidseven]

Marxism is absolutely not ambigious. On the contrary, it is extremely straight forwards, childishly straight forwards even.

I do not agree that globalism is 'very' capitalist, globalization can occur through capitalism, however, extensive trading and access to all world markets does not require immigration, and social integration.

Globalization actually is more of a communist thing than a capitalist thing as pure communism would be a globalist society.

[matthew220891]

Well yes that's true. But the point I was making is that firstly Labour isn't Marxist, and secondly they aren't ruining the country through socialism, they're ruining it through bad management, they aren't being good socialists at all!

Globalisation is going to happen anyway, we had better get involved or risk being left WAY behind. And social integration is a must if we are to avoid a perceived threat from a seperate culture, and a racist backlash.

[cidseven]

Labour aren't marxist... they just happen to be anti-nationalist, pro EU-bloc, class conflict theory believing, egalitarianist, social deterministic, internationalist, pro-state intervention, pro-multiculturalists with self admitted trotskyists and marxists in the party who call each other 'comrades' at party meetings.

Globalization is not an inevitability, for example, ethnic segregation and protectionism can still occur and is popular.

'Racist' btw, is a marxist term.

[matthew220891]

No no no, Labour aren't Marxist I would never argue that! And I think you'll find they have only recently been talking about class war issues (e.g. the comment about Cameron's plan being "dreampt up on the playing fields of Eton) because they're going for the election trying to please the working classes (and paradoxically after that comment the middle classes too). Globalisation is inevitable, and racial segregation simply must not happen, it'll hold us back and not be British. And it's wrong.

[cidseven]

As I said, while marxist, they do not promote class war, they promote class collaboration, but this is seen as a remedy for the class conflict. They believe that there IS a class conflict.

Why should racial segregation not happen? it has proven more succesful than racial integration.

By whos moral standards is it 'wrong'

How not British? have you ever heard of the genius Cecil Rhodes?

The empire was not built on egalitarian humanism ya know...

[matthew220891]

I am going to concentrate on race here because I tackled the others earlier.

Racial segregation encourages whites to think they are different from others, and consequently by virtue of cash better! It's less successful, the Nazis tried it and were crushed by righteous world horror, for example. Cecil Rhodes' plan led to Robert Mugabe. The Empire was not built on egalitarianism, but as it collapsed it realised the error of it's ways and tried to enforce it in what came after it's colonies.

[cidseven]

I am sorry matthew but I am going to have to stop you there.

Racial segregation is not something exclusive to Whites, many races have implemented racial segregation.

White people ARE different, as people ARE different. That is a biological fact.

Furthermore White people are not the only people historically who have felt they are the best, the Chinese, Jews, Japanese, Arabs, Blacks to name a few, have all thought themselves to be better, and some still do.

Continued-

[cidseven]

Continued.

The Nazis were not viewed as a threat due to their racial views, as similar things such as eugenics and racial segregation existed in numerous countries such as Britain, Switzerland, America etc.

Communism was actually seen as the bigger threat and the Nazis were actually praised by other countries for standing up to Communists.

Cecil Rhodes founded one of the most successful countries in Africa. Mugabe, a Communist, destroyed it...

[cidseven]

Continued.

An interesting note, whethere you choose to believe it or not.

A friend of mine, a South Afircan, was telling me about his time in Rhodesia and mentioned, that there was a period where Blacks and Whites lived in relative harmony, though they were segregated.

I was surprised at first, but this ceased as I thought about the common accounts which came from the racially segregated confederate south and the black confederate soldiers.

He said communism is what destroyed it.

[matthew220891]

It is not British to be racist. We were the first nation ever to abolish slavery, and fought wars to stop it. Simple horror at the Nazis made the Nuremburg Trials happen. We are far more accepting than France, or the USA, which is why the right-wing, whilst unfortunately getting some increased popularity, has generally been laughed at by the British, and why such as the BNP has such a low support base.

[cidseven]

Like I said, 'racist' is a marxist word.

The British, traditionally, not only believed White people to be intellectually superior to other races, (this view seemed to be validated by their easy conquest of other races during their imperial expansion) but they also regarded other White nations in Europe to be inferior.

Where are you getting this idea from? British are traditionally elitist, militaristic and pro-venture capitalist.

It is basic history...

[matthew220891]

My main worry is that Tories lie. They are going to cut the things we need to shreds (i.e. Navy, NHS, welfare). And whilst some parts of the welfare state could be cut back, the Tories are going to smash them out of distrust for them, which is why Cameron keeps his mouth shut about the NHS, because he knows a lot of his party distrusts it.

[cidseven]

You won't find me disagreeing with this really.

David Cameron is a lying spineless loser and the Tory party are complete sellouts. Their party have essentially fundimentally changed dancing to the beat of a red socialist drum.

That said, I would be really happy if the tories did smash the welfare state, but something tells me those total morons wont.

[matthew220891]

I think it would be better to fix the welfare state than smash it. I for one am quite proud the US is only just beginning to form one, 50 years after us. To me it's a matter of national pride we are so far ahead. But we should fix it. People who don't work are getting benefits, whilst those who might not be bright but would work if they could sit and beg. And the NHS gives out free face-lifts when it should charge for them to pay for life-saving and health-related treatment to be free to all.

[cidseven]

The welfare state, in my opinion, is the political manifestation of the natural tendancy towards 'family care'.

It has always existed in Europe in some form or another, even in ancient times.

However, the modern welfare state is built on an enforced moral obligation upon all people to support strangers, enemies and foreigners and that is really the root of the problem...people being ordered to pay money to a moral cause they may not agree with.

It is state enforced moral tyranny.

[matthew220891]

I think you'll find that most people agree with it, just not to the extent where those who don't deserve it get it. You cannot ban foreigners from British welfare aid, but you can ban those who don't work to earn it. Foreigners have died for Britain, would you ban them from it? Could you honestly say to Johnson Beharry: "You can't have this financial support, you are a foreigner and you are black."? I couldn't.

[cidseven]

But thats just it... who deserves it? and says who? and what happens to those who don't?

The difference between red welfare and nsdap welfare is that the latter is selective...

It is completely within the nation states right, as a nation state, to deny a foreigner aid if it so chooses, regardless of the reasons.

Foreigners have died for britain, often because they were forced to by their British Imperial masters.

This fact is often overlooked on this particular issue.

[cidseven]

Continued.

You ask a good question, would communists allow the free market to continue? yes and no.

Western Marxists after ww1, moved away from the idea that industrial capitalism stands in the way of 'progress' towards their communist utopia and began to focus on society and culture.

Hence class collaboration and the abuse of kynesian economic theory and 'diversity' promotion.

Their all desire the same thing, a classless, stateless, world utopia.

Globalism.

[matthew220891]

Yes but they want globalisation through active work towards it, whereas what Labour is doing is quite sensible, which is getting us involved in the inevitable rise of globalisation which is going to happen like it or not thanks to capitalism seeking new markets and opening them up.

[cidseven]

As a historian, I can honestly advise you to avoid using the word "inevitable" when it comes to the rise of a socio-economic status which shows the world fully merged into one single social, cultural, economic, political & ethnic entity.

Similar things have been attempted in history and they typically backfire, even when many adhere to an ideology which promotes it.

Marx believed class consciousness had replaced national consciousness & that revolution was inevitable.

The WW1 happened.

[matthew220891]

Globalisation doesn't necesarily entail the world becoming one, to shorten what you said. It just means far closer and more linked, which is inevitable.

Now then that doesn't mean it will be permanent. I'll detail my prediction in the next comment lol.

[cidseven]

A closer and more linked world really isn't really inevitable, like I said, protectionism... there is also the issue of countries potentially having no interesting markets and little if anything of value to offer to trade.

"Now then that doesn't mean it will be permanent." This is what is worrying however.

There is a very strong possibility that ww3 will be nation states breaking away from globalization and mega-union blocs to escape their tyranny.

[matthew220891]

Every country will have something to offer, and will be soaked up into either a market or a resource. Indeed it not being permanent is worrying, so the answer is not to try and stop it, because it's going to happen. The answer is to deal with those elements that will try and drag the world in a path that will lead to conflict. By that I mean stop reactionist elements like UKIP and the BNP and equivalents in other countries.

[cidseven]

How will every country have something to offer? What will happen if a particular country or group of countries develope an almost late medieval idealist attitude and start focussing on becoming as economically, technologically and culturally self contained as possible? Historically this has worked very well...

So your way to avoid conflict is to "stop" people who do not want to lose their right to national self determination?

Isn't that sorta... bullying?

[matthew220891]

But in doing this we must retain our sovereignty, which we can do whilst embracing globalisation and the fruits of being able to evenly spread education and money to all. That is something worth fighting for.

[cidseven]

How do we retain or sovereignty if we cannot say "no" to the number of foreigners moving to the country, if we cannot make ethnic distinctions, and when we play second fiddle to a quasi-imperial EU parliament?

Furthermore, Why, under such circumstances, should sovereignty even matter?

"being able to evenly spread education and money to all."

But didn't you say that this welfare system had to be selective?

"That is something worth fighting for. "

But I thought you wanted peace?

[cymraeg81]

No country is perfect as human nature is imperfect. Everything is relative and we here in the UK have it bloody good compared to most countries.

Every country has a right to a say on international development. Those that have the means to make a financial contribution to aid have a moral obligation to do so and should be applauded for this.

[cidseven]

It would be an error to attribute a universal failure of the human species to a few flawed members of it.

Some humans are better than others, they are not all "equally flawed".

Britain has it better than most countries because most countries are third world countries.

Throwing money at "problems" won't make problems go away, and "problems" are a subjective issue.

If he is preoccupied with "international development" then he shouldn't be a statesman, but he is a marxist so...

[cymraeg81]

All humans are flawed. All systems of governance are flawed. Of course we in Britain have it better than most countries, that is exactly the point I am making, things are not as bad as your initial comment made out. I personally feel priviliaged to live here despite the faults that exist. The challenges we face are nothing compared to those of people in most countries.

We should be greatful.

[cidseven]

All humans are flawed, but they are not equally flawed and the problems facing Britain are not the cause of humanity, but of a few particularly stupid humans who subscribe to a dangerous form of red socialism and internationalism.

If you compare Britain to the third world then yes... obviously it isn't THAT bad, but that isn't because of the labour party, that is because of the achievements of certain European people, often wealthy, imperialistic ones.

[cymraeg81]

For the record. I dont see how poverty, hunger, lack of medical care etc are subjective problems. If you were unfortunate enough to experience these problems then i'm sure you wuld agree with me.

[cidseven]

Poverty is an ambigious subject, money does not equate high quality of life (india for example is very wealthy yet has a terrible quality of life for the most part)

A lack of medical care is not quite the same as a lack of state funded medical care.

I feel the problem with your outlook is that you view these 'problems' as the causes of certain countries misery as opposed to symptoms of a countries incompetence.

eg: economic collapse due to forcing farmers off their land violently.

[matthew220891]

Lol, I like the subtle hint of a communist failure with the comment on farms. I agree it is incompetence. But a more left-wing government in India would spread money more evenly, provided they were competent and didn't just give into the free market like Labour did...

[cidseven]

I feel that for a country like indea, major wealth distribution & welfare would be a disaster. It would put entitlement to housing, medical care and money in the hands of a population of people who are often illiterate and some living in straw huts.

A welfare class of urbanite criminal has been produced in a country as advanced as britain, just think about what damage would be done to a country like india.

Cont-

[matthew220891]

So your solution to the problem of some scamming the system is to not let anyone have access to it? Even those who are in such an unfair situation, whereby their chances of making a fair and decent living is nil? The answer is not to stop welfare, but to make sure only those who need it get it, those who deserve it. You're justifying keeping a huge rich/poor divide, which will ONLY benefit the rich!

Continued.

[cidseven]

No. As I said, welfare is the political manifestation of the family nurture tendancy.

The problem is problematic individuals, not the system itself.

What will be the criteria for who 'deserves' welfare? and what happens to those who don't? (there will likely be very many).

Furthermore what is wrong with a rich poor divide? surely the economc status of the rich and poor is not always rooted in foul play.

Selective egalitarianism is an oxymoron and life isn't fair.

[matthew220891]

"It would put entitlement to housing, medical care and money in the hands of a population of people who are often illiterate and some living in straw huts."

Erm... That's a good thing! You cannot justify forcing them to stay like that because a few will scam the system! You need to put measures in place to make sure they don't instead, not justify the state keeping them down! The job of the state is to look after it's people, you are justifying looking after ONLY the rich.

[cidseven]

Ah, and see, there is the problem.

You assume that their woes are all the result of someone else keeping them down and that if this oppression were to stop, they would surely prosper like the most successful people.

I know for a fact however that even if you were to destroy their deeply rooted caste system(which would probably require their population to fight a very bloody war) and level the playing field, there would still be inequality, because people...aren't...equal.

[cidseven]

But furthermore, the Indian economy, really couldn't cope with it, not only would it push the often antagonistic cultures and castes of india into conflict, but, it would give their cheap labour the option of making the same amount of money by simply signing off or claiming incapacity benefit.

Now while some people may find it odd that someone would happily choose to parasite off the state, they would be surprised to learn just how many people are completely content to do this...

Cont.

[cidseven]

Another major problem however is that, the welfare state has within itself the capacity to inflict a very special kind of wound upon people, that being the wound of humilation & depression.

While some are happy to parasite, others are often emotionally damaged by being fitted by a financial diaper which makes them the laughing stock of every professional person in their society.

They can always sign off but if they are illiterate...

I could really go on and on on this issue...

[matthew220891]

So what you're saying is we shouldn't give people welfare benefits because they'd be embarrassed by them? That's a bizarre thing to say.

[cidseven]

No. You are starting to put words in my mouth.

I am saying that the welfare system also contains within itself the problem to fully demoralize decent people in the way it deals with them.

Consider it something like this. A parent sees a child fall so they carry the child around on them and does everything for them.

The child becomes an adult which has never learned to really walk & run, and has severely underdeveloped muscles and little to no self respect.

[cidseven]

Cont-

The leftists in the UK, have often wondered why the proliteriat so often do not vote/act within relation to what they believe to be their 'class interests' in trying to get state funded freebies.

I will tell you why.

Because the British proliteriat traditionally have SELF RESPECT.

They want to EARN what they get, they don't want handouts, they dont want pitty and they don't want to be spoon fed.

They believe in EARNING what they get.

Cont-

[matthew220891]

Then explain why the British voted out Winston Churchill in 1945 to bring in the man who promised a "Country fit for heroes."? And why the major issue being fought over in this campaign is who will protect the budget on things like the NHS from cuts? The people want fairness. Most of those who vote for the BNP and UKIP don't realise the threat there is to the NHS, or are too rich to care. Why would Cameron keep his party's opinions against the NHS quiet if he didn't think people wanted an NHS?

[cidseven]

Continued.

The reason this idea so often goes over the head of the leftists, especially the marxists is because the top marxists and leftist politicians and 'intellectuals' IRONICALLY almost never even come from the working classes themselves.

They patronisingly extend the hand of "help" to the proletariat and in doing so indirectly mock them completely by implying that their lifestyle is so amazingly bad that it could (in their imaginations) only be the work of profound exploitation.

[cidseven]

Continued.

The reality however is much more straight forward.

People flocked to cities for their goods and attractions. City living is tough, stuff is expensive and housing is usually smaller.

Not everyone wants to be super rich, some people are actually quite content with what they have and what they do. Furthermore they are quite happy for other people to do what they do.

They had a strong work ethic, they were patriotic and had self respect.

This class is now gone in the uk.

[Yehbytheway]

Pee Wee  Hermans evil twin.

[LilacTreat]

he looks like tim henman and rowan atkinson had a baby

[geilo1968]

Slimeball

[ijanderson977]

go on Miliband!

[johnathome]

what an absolute banana that bloke is!

[Malthus0]

Ridicule is not just for the proles. It seems to me that if you want an intelligent debate the first thing you do is stay as far away from the vapid nonsense that emanates from of politicians as possible. Heckling is all their worth. And I have a degree(PPE), so sod you.

[kidarrowz]

Ah but lemonlorry, you cannot even spell doctorate correctly. Of course they should be entitled to the same vote, they are merely expressing opinions, in this case very valid, about the ignorant, repeptitive, over indulgent pompous men, laden with ulterior motives, which unfortunately govern our country. The extent to which the governing bodies are so out of touch with the true desires and needs of the people is so disturbing it's almost humorous

[boldertits]

Future PM not on my shift sir.

[MadAsABoxaFrogs]

Yeah. Totally believable.

[2012advisor]

tony blair lied everyone knows that the americans did 911 not the iraqis...uk did 7/7 and saddam had no weopons of mass destruction...i like how they lie in the face of so much evidence against them its better than a comedy show...traitors one and all who sent innocent soldiers to their deaths...

[ryanc4992]

no david, im david miliband and im a complete and utter wankpot.

[MrPaulanthony2007]

I don't know but want to know who is his father?

[Yehbytheway]

He looks like a cross between Mr Bean and a paedophile.

[davidcufc]

He doesn't sound as if he beleives it.

[MrPaulanthony2007]

Mr David Milband is the only person left in Labour party with insight into solving the problem of Afhanistan and Pakistan. He knows that by winning people is to educate them not to killin them. He will bring a real change. They all saw Tony Blair brought to the dock.

[Malthus0]

Whey! Its the Banana man!

[boogaloo80]

Do you like marxism Milliband? What's it like being another puppet to bankers like the Rothschilds? Do you like Common Purpose? Education will vastly improve when those intent on dumbing the public down and indoctrinating them are no longer in charge of it.

[Malthus0]

'Do you like marxism Milliband?'

LOL you do know who his father is don't you?

[boogaloo80]

I was asking those questions out of humour.

[agent5000000]

Mr Bean!!!

[getjiggy21]

Your global government didn't happen - and your global warming fraud is in sheds.

Your new world order is falling apart Millicunt.

[oicub2]

6.7billion people,&

75% hate eachother.

massive growth in war & intelligence, smart bombs, nukes bio, chem, micro radio wave, physiological & psychological, industry, finance. not to mention garbage.. who ever invented garbage must have had a lot of money ..

Take a Cup, Call it Earth

Put some water in it, call that the ocean.

nuke it, call that Global warming.

Now take that cup of hot water and splash it right in someones face, call that the public education system.

Wow that Burns.. !